Comments on: Yes, There Is a Guerrilla War Against Zionism in the U.S. What Should Jewish Institutions Do? http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html The War of Ideas in the Middle East Mon, 28 May 2012 00:39:42 +0000 hourly 1 By: Richard Witty http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64268 Richard Witty Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64268 <p>"The rage out there is not antisemitism."</p> <p>Some of it is. Thats if you are sincere in wanting to address it honestly.</p> <p>If you've been around Jewish communities for decades, participating, you would have seen the kind of open inquiry widely conducted, that you claim doesn't happen.</p> <p>Annually, in my shul, we discuss politics. Our community spans a very wide of political spectrum, including those that are overtly anti-Zionist, a few that are religiously anti-Zionist. The majority, the vast majority, are pro-peace, and very cognizant and sympathetic with the history of Palestinians and current situation.</p> <p>Contempt is not the answer.</p> <p>I can understand the feeling of newbies, whether adults new to the discussion, or young adults that have not seen congregations and communities argue and agonize over the internal moral conflicts.</p> <p>But, in most, its happened. And, in most, there were many that didn't want to be bothered with the confusion of a good action (Zionism), having negative consequences to others, that need to be resolved fairly.</p> <p>But, most Jews now accept that Palestinians are a people, and deserve to self-govern, and in a manner and scale that is viable and sovereign.</p> "The rage out there is not antisemitism."

Some of it is. Thats if you are sincere in wanting to address it honestly.

If you've been around Jewish communities for decades, participating, you would have seen the kind of open inquiry widely conducted, that you claim doesn't happen.

Annually, in my shul, we discuss politics. Our community spans a very wide of political spectrum, including those that are overtly anti-Zionist, a few that are religiously anti-Zionist. The majority, the vast majority, are pro-peace, and very cognizant and sympathetic with the history of Palestinians and current situation.

Contempt is not the answer.

I can understand the feeling of newbies, whether adults new to the discussion, or young adults that have not seen congregations and communities argue and agonize over the internal moral conflicts.

But, in most, its happened. And, in most, there were many that didn't want to be bothered with the confusion of a good action (Zionism), having negative consequences to others, that need to be resolved fairly.

But, most Jews now accept that Palestinians are a people, and deserve to self-govern, and in a manner and scale that is viable and sovereign.

]]> By: Richard Witty http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64269 Richard Witty Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64269 <p>What should Jewish institutions do?</p> <p>They/we should encourage our representatives and those Israelis that we have contact with to take up the offer of reconciliation that the Arab League suggested.</p> <p>Israel should not drag its feet on those many actions that it can confidently and safely take unilaterally.</p> <p>And, we should communicate convincingly and often of the need for the US to actively participate, particularly in holding bi-lateral and multi-lateral parties accountable to agreements that they've made.</p> <p>In the case that the US and Europe can hold Israel accountable, and the Arab League can hold the PA and Hamas accountable, reconciliation is possible.</p> <p>The tragedy is that the US is administered by an incompetent. </p> <p>As galling as it is, it is better to wait until a more competent leader is available.</p> What should Jewish institutions do?

They/we should encourage our representatives and those Israelis that we have contact with to take up the offer of reconciliation that the Arab League suggested.

Israel should not drag its feet on those many actions that it can confidently and safely take unilaterally.

And, we should communicate convincingly and often of the need for the US to actively participate, particularly in holding bi-lateral and multi-lateral parties accountable to agreements that they've made.

In the case that the US and Europe can hold Israel accountable, and the Arab League can hold the PA and Hamas accountable, reconciliation is possible.

The tragedy is that the US is administered by an incompetent.

As galling as it is, it is better to wait until a more competent leader is available.

]]> By: Val http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64270 Val Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64270 <p>oh come off it, Phil. This is about Jewish control IN America NOT Israel per se. This is about isolation, but it's elitist Jewish isolation not the rest of the countries. The fiscal control, the media control and so forth.<br /> Israel is the focus to an extent but the real problem cannot be diluted by using Israel as a whipping boy. Like if Israel dissolved tomorrow the'd be no problem in America? The problem is the people involved, not ALL Jews and not Irseal per se.</p> oh come off it, Phil. This is about Jewish control IN America NOT Israel per se. This is about isolation, but it's elitist Jewish isolation not the rest of the countries. The fiscal control, the media control and so forth.
Israel is the focus to an extent but the real problem cannot be diluted by using Israel as a whipping boy. Like if Israel dissolved tomorrow the'd be no problem in America? The problem is the people involved, not ALL Jews and not Irseal per se.

]]> By: D. http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64271 D. Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64271 <p>"But, most Jews now accept that Palestinians are a people, and deserve to self-govern."</p> <p>What did they think before?</p> "But, most Jews now accept that Palestinians are a people, and deserve to self-govern."

What did they think before?

]]> By: peters http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64272 peters Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64272 <p>FINALLY!!!!!!! YES!!!!! THERE IS RAGE!!!!!<br /> Thank you, thank you, thank you for this post. Of course there is rage. We have been prevented from speaking, information has been suppressed, and that is CONTROL. Freedom has not been allowed, which is experienced as a form of abuse. It is highly painful, especially for people who care about our country, our society. It is exactly the same as any family system- if there is a big fat problem and no one is allowed to talk about it, there is disfunction, rage, and acting out. No wonder little explosions of anti-semitic verbal abuse are bursting out. It is not right, just as the teenager of the family stealing cars isn't right, but it's not without its etiology. <br /> I believe Phillip is dead on about the cure as well. <br /> I am very grateful for this post. This blog is the most important blog in America. </p> FINALLY!!!!!!! YES!!!!! THERE IS RAGE!!!!!
Thank you, thank you, thank you for this post. Of course there is rage. We have been prevented from speaking, information has been suppressed, and that is CONTROL. Freedom has not been allowed, which is experienced as a form of abuse. It is highly painful, especially for people who care about our country, our society. It is exactly the same as any family system- if there is a big fat problem and no one is allowed to talk about it, there is disfunction, rage, and acting out. No wonder little explosions of anti-semitic verbal abuse are bursting out. It is not right, just as the teenager of the family stealing cars isn't right, but it's not without its etiology.
I believe Phillip is dead on about the cure as well.
I am very grateful for this post. This blog is the most important blog in America.

]]> By: peters http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64273 peters Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64273 <p>FINALLY!!!!!!! YES!!!!! THERE IS RAGE!!!!!<br /> Thank you, thank you, thank you for this post. Of course there is rage. We have been prevented from speaking, information has been suppressed, and that is CONTROL. Freedom has not been allowed, which is experienced as a form of abuse. It is highly painful, especially for people who care about our country, our society. It is exactly the same as any family system- if there is a big fat problem and no one is allowed to talk about it, there is disfunction, rage, and acting out. No wonder little explosions of anti-semitic verbal abuse are bursting out. It is not right, just as the teenager of the family stealing cars isn't right, but it's not without its etiology. <br /> I believe Phillip is dead on about the cure as well. <br /> I am very grateful for this post. This blog is the most important blog in America. </p> FINALLY!!!!!!! YES!!!!! THERE IS RAGE!!!!!
Thank you, thank you, thank you for this post. Of course there is rage. We have been prevented from speaking, information has been suppressed, and that is CONTROL. Freedom has not been allowed, which is experienced as a form of abuse. It is highly painful, especially for people who care about our country, our society. It is exactly the same as any family system- if there is a big fat problem and no one is allowed to talk about it, there is disfunction, rage, and acting out. No wonder little explosions of anti-semitic verbal abuse are bursting out. It is not right, just as the teenager of the family stealing cars isn't right, but it's not without its etiology.
I believe Phillip is dead on about the cure as well.
I am very grateful for this post. This blog is the most important blog in America.

]]> By: Shlomo #5 http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64274 Shlomo #5 Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64274 <p>"This blog is the most important blog in America."</p> <p>I think you may be right.</p> "This blog is the most important blog in America."

I think you may be right.

]]> By: uk http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64275 uk Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64275 <p>Richard:</p> <p>Zionism is " a good action"? To use the money power of the Rothschilds (to whom was the Balfour declaration addressed to, Richard?) and the military and political power of the British empire (and then the US) to create a colony for people of one race/religion at the expense of the native people in Palestine through ethnic cleansing induced by terrorist gangs (Irgun, Stern, etc.) and then by the Israeli government. To flaunt all international law and standards of human rights and keep the region (and now the US) perpetually at or on the verge of war. </p> <p>If this is a "good action" one has to wonder what a "bad action" might be.</p> Richard:

Zionism is " a good action"? To use the money power of the Rothschilds (to whom was the Balfour declaration addressed to, Richard?) and the military and political power of the British empire (and then the US) to create a colony for people of one race/religion at the expense of the native people in Palestine through ethnic cleansing induced by terrorist gangs (Irgun, Stern, etc.) and then by the Israeli government. To flaunt all international law and standards of human rights and keep the region (and now the US) perpetually at or on the verge of war.

If this is a "good action" one has to wonder what a "bad action" might be.

]]> By: Gene http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64276 Gene Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64276 <p>Witty: "Annually, in my shul, we discuss politics. Our community spans a very wide of political spectrum, including those that are overtly anti-Zionist, a few that are religiously anti-Zionist. The majority, the vast majority, are pro-peace, and very cognizant and sympathetic with the history of Palestinians and current situation."</p> <p>All this is well and good. What isn't so good is that the people who schedule public forums are terrified of holding such discussions and, on the rare occasions when they do, the mainstream media is terrified of covering them (or their editors don't want to cover anything where a disparaging word might be heard about Israel).</p> Witty: "Annually, in my shul, we discuss politics. Our community spans a very wide of political spectrum, including those that are overtly anti-Zionist, a few that are religiously anti-Zionist. The majority, the vast majority, are pro-peace, and very cognizant and sympathetic with the history of Palestinians and current situation."

All this is well and good. What isn't so good is that the people who schedule public forums are terrified of holding such discussions and, on the rare occasions when they do, the mainstream media is terrified of covering them (or their editors don't want to cover anything where a disparaging word might be heard about Israel).

]]> By: Jaffr http://mondoweiss.net/2008/02/portrait-of-a-h.html/comment-page-1#comment-64277 Jaffr Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/02/22/portrait-of-a-h.html#comment-64277 <p>Phil and all: </p> <p>A bit of realism (but some wishful thinking also) on the possibility of a new discourse on Palestine/Israel in a fine article in the current Al-Ahram:<br /> THE LIMIT OF OBAMA'S IMAGINATION<br /> http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/2008/885/op111.htm </p> <p>"At a time when Obama's moral voice was most needed, the reach of his wings proved to be cautiously perforated on an AIPAC line, writes HAMID DABASHI...</p> <p>"Israel," Senator Obama has assured his AIPAC audience in a speech on 3 March 2007, is "our strongest ally in the region and its only established democracy. . . We must preserve our total commitment to our unique defense relationship with Israel by fully funding military assistance and continuing work on the Arrow and related missile defense programs...</p> <p>"Obama has had to renounce his connections not just with the Palestinian cause but also even to the pastor of a church he faithfully attended because he is a liberation theologian. How many of his wings will the Illinois Senator have to cut short before he can fly, and if he ever gets actually to fly how far can he soar, how deep will he fall? The thing that he has failed to understand is that he can never out-Hillary in appealing to, satisfying, and securing the endorsement of the pro-Israeli lobby. Every corner that he comes to cross and sell a bigger part of his soul to AIPAC, Hillary Clinton has already been there and done that. If he only had the courage of his convictions, if he only believed in the spectacular hope that he has generated in millions of young and idealist Americans -- including (and in fact particularly) young and idealist Jewish Americans."</p> <p>And much more!<br /> </p> Phil and all:

A bit of realism (but some wishful thinking also) on the possibility of a new discourse on Palestine/Israel in a fine article in the current Al-Ahram:
THE LIMIT OF OBAMA'S IMAGINATION
link to weekly.ahram.org.eg

"At a time when Obama's moral voice was most needed, the reach of his wings proved to be cautiously perforated on an AIPAC line, writes HAMID DABASHI…

"Israel," Senator Obama has assured his AIPAC audience in a speech on 3 March 2007, is "our strongest ally in the region and its only established democracy. . . We must preserve our total commitment to our unique defense relationship with Israel by fully funding military assistance and continuing work on the Arrow and related missile defense programs…

"Obama has had to renounce his connections not just with the Palestinian cause but also even to the pastor of a church he faithfully attended because he is a liberation theologian. How many of his wings will the Illinois Senator have to cut short before he can fly, and if he ever gets actually to fly how far can he soar, how deep will he fall? The thing that he has failed to understand is that he can never out-Hillary in appealing to, satisfying, and securing the endorsement of the pro-Israeli lobby. Every corner that he comes to cross and sell a bigger part of his soul to AIPAC, Hillary Clinton has already been there and done that. If he only had the courage of his convictions, if he only believed in the spectacular hope that he has generated in millions of young and idealist Americans — including (and in fact particularly) young and idealist Jewish Americans."

And much more!

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