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	<title>Comments on: James North: How to Think About Darfur, Part 1</title>
	<atom:link href="http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html</link>
	<description>The War of Ideas in the Middle East</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 28 May 2012 03:33:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Ryan Morrison</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56008</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan Morrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56008</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Mr. Weiss,&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Thanks. Looking forward to the Darfur articles. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;As it happens, just this morning I had a discussion with a pro-intervention liberal friend of mine, who said we must &quot;save them from themselves.&quot; While trying to argue against intervention, I realized that I know absolutely nothing about the situation, so I just kept changing the subject to Iraq. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;-Ryan&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Weiss,</p>
<p>Thanks. Looking forward to the Darfur articles. </p>
<p>As it happens, just this morning I had a discussion with a pro-intervention liberal friend of mine, who said we must &quot;save them from themselves.&quot; While trying to argue against intervention, I realized that I know absolutely nothing about the situation, so I just kept changing the subject to Iraq. </p>
<p>-Ryan</p>
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		<title>By: wnt4</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56009</link>
		<dc:creator>wnt4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56009</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thank you for this interesting post. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;There are several data points which don&#039;t square well with the mainstream American media&#039;s impression of Darfur (that it&#039;s an on-going genocide demanding urgent humanitarian intervention). I&#039;d be interested to hear your thoughts on this.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;1. Many of the principal backers of action against Sudan are Jewish Zionists or evangelical Christian Zionists - in fact, there is a broad overlap between the Jewish groups who supported war against Iraq and those who now want sanctions or intervention in Darfur. For example, the &#039;Save Darfur&#039;, group described by the Jerusalem Post: &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&quot;Little known, however, is that the coalition, which has presented itself as &#039;an alliance of over 130 diverse faith-based, humanitarian, and human rights organization&#039; was actually begun exclusively as an initiative of the American Jewish community. And even now, days before the rally, that coalition is heavily weighted with a politically and religiously diverse collection of local and national Jewish groups. [...] Besides the Jewish origins and character of the rally - a fact the organizers consistently played down in conversations with The Jerusalem Post - the other striking aspect of the coalition is the noted absence of major African-American groups like the NAACP or the larger Africa lobby groups like Africa Action.&quot; [see Xymphora&#039;s blog for more]&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Why is this?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;2. The US-backed Kenyan invasion of Somalia, in the Horn, has caused an immense humanitarian crisis second only to Iraq, according to Oxfam. The US also sporadically bombs Somalia. What exactly is the mechanism that ensures we don&#039;t hear much about this in the United States, compared to the (apparently not US-sponsored) troubles in Darfur?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;3. China is the major business partner and oil client of Sudan, and Zimbabwe for that matter. To what extent is US support for intervention or sanctions in Sudan, about confronting and blocking China&#039;s growing influence in Africa? Is the same true of Zimbabwe, where China relies on for chromium, platinum, and the trans-Angola pipeline? &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;This would be the &#039;Chomsky thesis&#039; for why the US seems to be on the side of intervention, as compared to the &#039;Walt/Mearsheimer Thesis&#039; of (1.) What weighting should we give these different motives?&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for this interesting post. </p>
<p>There are several data points which don&#39;t square well with the mainstream American media&#39;s impression of Darfur (that it&#39;s an on-going genocide demanding urgent humanitarian intervention). I&#39;d be interested to hear your thoughts on this.</p>
<p>1. Many of the principal backers of action against Sudan are Jewish Zionists or evangelical Christian Zionists &#8211; in fact, there is a broad overlap between the Jewish groups who supported war against Iraq and those who now want sanctions or intervention in Darfur. For example, the &#39;Save Darfur&#39;, group described by the Jerusalem Post: </p>
<p>&quot;Little known, however, is that the coalition, which has presented itself as &#39;an alliance of over 130 diverse faith-based, humanitarian, and human rights organization&#39; was actually begun exclusively as an initiative of the American Jewish community. And even now, days before the rally, that coalition is heavily weighted with a politically and religiously diverse collection of local and national Jewish groups. [...] Besides the Jewish origins and character of the rally &#8211; a fact the organizers consistently played down in conversations with The Jerusalem Post &#8211; the other striking aspect of the coalition is the noted absence of major African-American groups like the NAACP or the larger Africa lobby groups like Africa Action.&quot; [see Xymphora&#39;s blog for more]</p>
<p>Why is this?</p>
<p>2. The US-backed Kenyan invasion of Somalia, in the Horn, has caused an immense humanitarian crisis second only to Iraq, according to Oxfam. The US also sporadically bombs Somalia. What exactly is the mechanism that ensures we don&#39;t hear much about this in the United States, compared to the (apparently not US-sponsored) troubles in Darfur?</p>
<p>3. China is the major business partner and oil client of Sudan, and Zimbabwe for that matter. To what extent is US support for intervention or sanctions in Sudan, about confronting and blocking China&#39;s growing influence in Africa? Is the same true of Zimbabwe, where China relies on for chromium, platinum, and the trans-Angola pipeline? </p>
<p>This would be the &#39;Chomsky thesis&#39; for why the US seems to be on the side of intervention, as compared to the &#39;Walt/Mearsheimer Thesis&#39; of (1.) What weighting should we give these different motives?</p>
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		<title>By: the Sword of Gideon</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56010</link>
		<dc:creator>the Sword of Gideon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56010</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Good to know that it&#039;s all a Jewish plot. &lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good to know that it&#39;s all a Jewish plot. </p>
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		<title>By: El Sogo</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56011</link>
		<dc:creator>El Sogo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56011</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I refuse to believe a word about them darkies unless written by a whitey.  I propose sending SOG on a fact finding mission to darkest Darfur for this blog.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Soggy, bring me back ten of the blackest Darfurites you can find.  I need hood ornaments.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I refuse to believe a word about them darkies unless written by a whitey.  I propose sending SOG on a fact finding mission to darkest Darfur for this blog.</p>
<p>Soggy, bring me back ten of the blackest Darfurites you can find.  I need hood ornaments.</p>
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		<title>By: sword of gideon</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56012</link>
		<dc:creator>sword of gideon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56012</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Got enough hood ornaments, maybe some lawn jockeys though. Sreiously though, since the Palestinians are living under the most oppressive regime there over was or ever will be. And they are undergoing the worst oppression in the history of recorded time. Worse than anything hat there has evern been then ahow about exchanging them form the black sudanese. They really don&#039;t have any problems after all. Surely there would be a stampede out of Nablus, wouldn&#039;t there?&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Got enough hood ornaments, maybe some lawn jockeys though. Sreiously though, since the Palestinians are living under the most oppressive regime there over was or ever will be. And they are undergoing the worst oppression in the history of recorded time. Worse than anything hat there has evern been then ahow about exchanging them form the black sudanese. They really don&#39;t have any problems after all. Surely there would be a stampede out of Nablus, wouldn&#39;t there?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: sword of gideon</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56013</link>
		<dc:creator>sword of gideon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56013</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;bad spelling. Since the Phil Weiss fan base is of such high intellect I apologize.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bad spelling. Since the Phil Weiss fan base is of such high intellect I apologize.</p>
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		<title>By: Jewish Goyim</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56014</link>
		<dc:creator>Jewish Goyim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56014</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I have noticed before that some in the &quot;save Darfur&quot; crowd had some unsavory background and very likely an hidden agenda. Yet, I have always been in disbelief at the idea that this story was only a ploy to divert attention from Iraq and to massage public opinion towards interventionism in general. If only because it seemed marginally efficient. Possible after all, it&#039;s not like we haven&#039;t seen worse in the past few years.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Anyway, I hope Mr North will help me clarify my ideas on that point.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have noticed before that some in the &quot;save Darfur&quot; crowd had some unsavory background and very likely an hidden agenda. Yet, I have always been in disbelief at the idea that this story was only a ploy to divert attention from Iraq and to massage public opinion towards interventionism in general. If only because it seemed marginally efficient. Possible after all, it&#39;s not like we haven&#39;t seen worse in the past few years.</p>
<p>Anyway, I hope Mr North will help me clarify my ideas on that point.</p>
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		<title>By: Jewish Goyim</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56015</link>
		<dc:creator>Jewish Goyim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56015</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I have noticed before that some in the &quot;save Darfur&quot; crowd had some unsavory background and very likely an hidden agenda. Yet, I have always been in disbelief at the idea that this story was only a ploy to divert attention from Iraq and to massage public opinion towards interventionism in general. If only because it seemed marginally efficient. Possible after all, it&#039;s not like we haven&#039;t seen worse in the past few years.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Anyway, I hope Mr North will help me clarify my ideas on that point.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have noticed before that some in the &quot;save Darfur&quot; crowd had some unsavory background and very likely an hidden agenda. Yet, I have always been in disbelief at the idea that this story was only a ploy to divert attention from Iraq and to massage public opinion towards interventionism in general. If only because it seemed marginally efficient. Possible after all, it&#39;s not like we haven&#39;t seen worse in the past few years.</p>
<p>Anyway, I hope Mr North will help me clarify my ideas on that point.</p>
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		<title>By: syvanen</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56016</link>
		<dc:creator>syvanen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56016</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The official claim that genocide was going on in Darfur came from the Holocaust Museum in Washington.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;SOG is right, it is another Zionist campaign.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The official claim that genocide was going on in Darfur came from the Holocaust Museum in Washington.</p>
<p>SOG is right, it is another Zionist campaign.</p>
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		<title>By: virginia1630</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html/comment-page-1#comment-56017</link>
		<dc:creator>virginia1630</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/21/james-north-on-darfur-does-complicated-mean-we-should-sit-on-our-hands.html#comment-56017</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Everything you need to know, in one concise, precise post by Joachim&#039;s compatriot, the succinct Ms. Karin Friedemann:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;http://karinfriedemann.blogspot.com/2007/04/who-is-charles-jacobs.html&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everything you need to know, in one concise, precise post by Joachim&#39;s compatriot, the succinct Ms. Karin Friedemann:</p>
<p>http://karinfriedemann.blogspot.com/2007/04/who-is-charles-jacobs.html</p>
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