Comments on: At a Privileged Resort, an Arab Intellectual Urges Americans to ‘Be Themselves’ in the Mid East: Be Fair http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html The War of Ideas in the Middle East Mon, 28 May 2012 03:33:00 +0000 hourly 1 By: charles Keating http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55600 charles Keating Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55600 <p>Jesse Jackson (Mister Civil Rights) whispered that Obama was "talking down" to his people. That struck me as similar to the way black teens say "don't act white, nigger" to some lone peer who is striving for an education.</p> <p>Is there a lesson here for American Jews?</p> Jesse Jackson (Mister Civil Rights) whispered that Obama was "talking down" to his people. That struck me as similar to the way black teens say "don't act white, nigger" to some lone peer who is striving for an education.

Is there a lesson here for American Jews?

]]> By: Richard Witty http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55601 Richard Witty Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55601 <p>So, what did your father say? Did your mother go as well?</p> <p>What do you think?</p> <p>What do you see as the path forward? Practically?</p> <p>I appreciate the civility that you describe in the presenter. I've met many Palestinians that similarly had a strong sense of consideration for their audience.</p> <p>The reality that you don't acknowledge is that there is a gorge between two points. As the crow flies, its a hundred yards, but to get there, you have to drive a hundred miles, and wishing that you could drive a hundred yards, hinders the effort.</p> <p>Maybe someone could build a bridge.</p> <p>The metaphor that I've used is the drive from Boston to Provincetown. As the crow flies, its what, 45 miles? But, to get there, the shortest route is an 150 mile drive, through a lot of traffic.</p> <p><br /> Also, China doesn't see itself as the world sees it. Why should you expect Israel or Israelis to?</p> So, what did your father say? Did your mother go as well?

What do you think?

What do you see as the path forward? Practically?

I appreciate the civility that you describe in the presenter. I've met many Palestinians that similarly had a strong sense of consideration for their audience.

The reality that you don't acknowledge is that there is a gorge between two points. As the crow flies, its a hundred yards, but to get there, you have to drive a hundred miles, and wishing that you could drive a hundred yards, hinders the effort.

Maybe someone could build a bridge.

The metaphor that I've used is the drive from Boston to Provincetown. As the crow flies, its what, 45 miles? But, to get there, the shortest route is an 150 mile drive, through a lot of traffic.

Also, China doesn't see itself as the world sees it. Why should you expect Israel or Israelis to?

]]> By: charles Keating http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55602 charles Keating Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55602 <p>schizophrenia</p> <p>one hand doesn't know what the other is doing</p> <p>two different narratives</p> <p>it's really hard to get beyond the dialogue in one's own head</p> schizophrenia

one hand doesn't know what the other is doing

two different narratives

it's really hard to get beyond the dialogue in one's own head

]]> By: charles Keating http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55603 charles Keating Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55603 <p>Did Hitler's Germany see itself as others saw it?</p> Did Hitler's Germany see itself as others saw it?

]]> By: charles Keating http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55604 charles Keating Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55604 <p>The right of return.<br /> Who says there's no more irony in the world? </p> The right of return.
Who says there's no more irony in the world?

]]> By: LanceThruster http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55605 LanceThruster Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55605 <p>In many events that I have attended (Dr. Finkelstein to name one), I have seen angry Jews react to the speaker in a manner that showed that they hardly heard anything the speaker was saying. No matter how calmly and articulately the speaker tried to address the questioner (or more often, the "accuser"), the angrier they got.</p> <p>It's as if they fear that without the heated rhetoric, agreements *will* be hammered out in a rational manner.</p> In many events that I have attended (Dr. Finkelstein to name one), I have seen angry Jews react to the speaker in a manner that showed that they hardly heard anything the speaker was saying. No matter how calmly and articulately the speaker tried to address the questioner (or more often, the "accuser"), the angrier they got.

It's as if they fear that without the heated rhetoric, agreements *will* be hammered out in a rational manner.

]]> By: Ed http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55606 Ed Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55606 <p>"The Jews had been defensive, even in this highly educated privileged community. When will that change?"</p> <p>Never, because it is their lot in life, and their nature. And it is why they should never be given power over non-Jews, because they are bound to abuse it…which is yet another argument for the two-state solution, and the imposition of peace from without.</p> <p>Force the Israelis to write a constitution enshrining the rights of all Israeli citizens, force them to draw their borders, have the Palestinians to do the same, and don’t give either side another dime until they do so. It’s not rocket science.</p> <p>Ah, but then we run into the political dynamic and reality here in America, where deranged and “defensive” US Jewish Zionists (like the cow and her Zionist cohort trying to shout down the Arab) impose their dysfunctional will. Until their like is dealt with here, there will never be an I-P peace.</p> <p>Are hand-wringing liberals ever going to have the gumption to marginalize them? </p> <p>I don’t think ex-hippy Boomer left-liberals nor their simian-like, WWII-worshipping Bushcon counterparts on the Right are ever going to have the guts to do this. It’s going to take Generation X, Y and Z, which are quickly getting fed up with the entire dysfunctional Jewish and Zionist mentality, in all its sick forms and manifestations throughout American society.</p> "The Jews had been defensive, even in this highly educated privileged community. When will that change?"

Never, because it is their lot in life, and their nature. And it is why they should never be given power over non-Jews, because they are bound to abuse it…which is yet another argument for the two-state solution, and the imposition of peace from without.

Force the Israelis to write a constitution enshrining the rights of all Israeli citizens, force them to draw their borders, have the Palestinians to do the same, and don’t give either side another dime until they do so. It’s not rocket science.

Ah, but then we run into the political dynamic and reality here in America, where deranged and “defensive” US Jewish Zionists (like the cow and her Zionist cohort trying to shout down the Arab) impose their dysfunctional will. Until their like is dealt with here, there will never be an I-P peace.

Are hand-wringing liberals ever going to have the gumption to marginalize them?

I don’t think ex-hippy Boomer left-liberals nor their simian-like, WWII-worshipping Bushcon counterparts on the Right are ever going to have the guts to do this. It’s going to take Generation X, Y and Z, which are quickly getting fed up with the entire dysfunctional Jewish and Zionist mentality, in all its sick forms and manifestations throughout American society.

]]> By: syvanen http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55607 syvanen Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55607 <p>You capture here a dynamic that I have been sensing now for many years. I remember Aba Eban and his addresses to the UN compared to the statements by the Arab forces. In the PR department it was no contest. Later when Arafat emerged as a major player in Palestine -- it was the same thing. He would bluster away in his barely understandable and unappealing gutteral English while some suave Israeli would calmly explain the Israel position in perfect English. But recently I have noticed much more articulate Arab spokesmen who have a perfected calm who seem to provoke hysterical reactions from Zionist.</p> <p>I admit these may seem like very superficial observations but when we consider that the US is probably the most critical battleground in Israeli-Palestinian war today, then each of these kinds of PR victories by the Arab intellectuals can make an important difference. </p> You capture here a dynamic that I have been sensing now for many years. I remember Aba Eban and his addresses to the UN compared to the statements by the Arab forces. In the PR department it was no contest. Later when Arafat emerged as a major player in Palestine — it was the same thing. He would bluster away in his barely understandable and unappealing gutteral English while some suave Israeli would calmly explain the Israel position in perfect English. But recently I have noticed much more articulate Arab spokesmen who have a perfected calm who seem to provoke hysterical reactions from Zionist.

I admit these may seem like very superficial observations but when we consider that the US is probably the most critical battleground in Israeli-Palestinian war today, then each of these kinds of PR victories by the Arab intellectuals can make an important difference.

]]> By: syvanen http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55608 syvanen Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55608 <p>You capture here a dynamic that I have been sensing now for many years. I remember Aba Eban and his addresses to the UN compared to the statements by the Arab forces. In the PR department it was no contest. Later when Arafat emerged as a major player in Palestine -- it was the same thing. He would bluster away in his barely understandable and unappealing gutteral English while some suave Israeli would calmly explain the Israel position in perfect English. But recently I have noticed much more articulate Arab spokesmen who have a perfected calm who seem to provoke hysterical reactions from Zionist.</p> <p>I admit these may seem like very superficial observations but when we consider that the US is probably the most critical battleground in Israeli-Palestinian war today, then each of these kinds of PR victories by the Arab intellectuals can make an important difference. </p> You capture here a dynamic that I have been sensing now for many years. I remember Aba Eban and his addresses to the UN compared to the statements by the Arab forces. In the PR department it was no contest. Later when Arafat emerged as a major player in Palestine — it was the same thing. He would bluster away in his barely understandable and unappealing gutteral English while some suave Israeli would calmly explain the Israel position in perfect English. But recently I have noticed much more articulate Arab spokesmen who have a perfected calm who seem to provoke hysterical reactions from Zionist.

I admit these may seem like very superficial observations but when we consider that the US is probably the most critical battleground in Israeli-Palestinian war today, then each of these kinds of PR victories by the Arab intellectuals can make an important difference.

]]> By: peters http://mondoweiss.net/2008/07/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html/comment-page-1#comment-55609 peters Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/07/28/one-of-the-reasons-i-came-up-to-my-parents-is-that-there-was-a-lecture-last-ngiht-at-the-episcopal-church-by-an-arab-rami-k.html#comment-55609 <p>beautiful article. i wish i could get people i know to wake up but i can't. some, out of friendship or politeness, ask me a few questions, and quickly get restive. i am talking about highly educated gentiles here, they don't want to know about the issue. i believe they think i am unduly obsessed. i know why my jewish friends don't want to talk about it but i don't understand why the gentiles don't care about our country. this topic is tabu even to think about. <br /> </p> beautiful article. i wish i could get people i know to wake up but i can't. some, out of friendship or politeness, ask me a few questions, and quickly get restive. i am talking about highly educated gentiles here, they don't want to know about the issue. i believe they think i am unduly obsessed. i know why my jewish friends don't want to talk about it but i don't understand why the gentiles don't care about our country. this topic is tabu even to think about.

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