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	<title>Comments on: Israeli Historian: Palestinians Are Biological Descendants of Bible&#8217;s Jews</title>
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	<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html</link>
	<description>The War of Ideas in the Middle East</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 28 May 2012 00:59:10 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Todd</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52932</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52932</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I&#039;ve always wondered why the Palestnians have made so little hay out of the obvious fact that the Jews are not a racial or tightly-bound genetic gorup, or why they seem to have forgotten that Judaism predated Islam. The sight an obvious European looking IDF soldier herding Palestinians around baffled me.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#39;ve always wondered why the Palestnians have made so little hay out of the obvious fact that the Jews are not a racial or tightly-bound genetic gorup, or why they seem to have forgotten that Judaism predated Islam. The sight an obvious European looking IDF soldier herding Palestinians around baffled me.</p>
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		<title>By: cooper</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52933</link>
		<dc:creator>cooper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52933</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Phil, you&#039;ve honestly never heard of the Khazars, or read Koestler or Stoddard?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Ashkenazi are most likely heavily descended from the Khazar. This may go a long way towards explaining why Phil spends so much time thinking about doing some plundering and pillaging on the lusty wives and widows in his community. Khazar is interpreted to mean &quot;wandering&quot; in the Turkic language they spoke. &lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, you&#39;ve honestly never heard of the Khazars, or read Koestler or Stoddard?</p>
<p>Ashkenazi are most likely heavily descended from the Khazar. This may go a long way towards explaining why Phil spends so much time thinking about doing some plundering and pillaging on the lusty wives and widows in his community. Khazar is interpreted to mean &quot;wandering&quot; in the Turkic language they spoke. </p>
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		<title>By: Todd</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52934</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52934</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I read somewhere that Koestler wasn&#039;t serious about his Khazar claims. If so, he went through a fair amount of trouble for a hoax.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I read somewhere that Koestler wasn&#39;t serious about his Khazar claims. If so, he went through a fair amount of trouble for a hoax.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52935</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52935</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The thesis as stated is false.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;There nearly certainly was a Roman exile, as there was prior a Babylonian and Persian exile.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;There was at least a Roman inquisition. If the Spanish inquisition is any model a large number remained, converted for appearance, but remained Jews privately, and a large number left.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;And, if ANY Jews mixed with Khazars, then there had to be at least inter-marriage, and not that Khazars arbitrarily adopted Judaism and imposed it.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;As far as the assertion that Palestinians are the remaining &quot;Israelites&quot;, that ignores migration in and out of the region prior.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Most likely some are descended from Jewish origins, and are genetic kin to Jews, if not matrilinially Jews.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It does not support either Shahak&#039;s or Martillo&#039;s revisionist theories though.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I suggests that there are more tributaries than a single, but not that the European tributaries are fraud.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The thesis as stated is false.</p>
<p>There nearly certainly was a Roman exile, as there was prior a Babylonian and Persian exile.</p>
<p>There was at least a Roman inquisition. If the Spanish inquisition is any model a large number remained, converted for appearance, but remained Jews privately, and a large number left.</p>
<p>And, if ANY Jews mixed with Khazars, then there had to be at least inter-marriage, and not that Khazars arbitrarily adopted Judaism and imposed it.</p>
<p>As far as the assertion that Palestinians are the remaining &quot;Israelites&quot;, that ignores migration in and out of the region prior.</p>
<p>Most likely some are descended from Jewish origins, and are genetic kin to Jews, if not matrilinially Jews.</p>
<p>It does not support either Shahak&#39;s or Martillo&#39;s revisionist theories though.</p>
<p>I suggests that there are more tributaries than a single, but not that the European tributaries are fraud.</p>
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		<title>By: samuel burke</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52936</link>
		<dc:creator>samuel burke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52936</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;and someone is surprised that the palestinians presently  living in the middle east part of the world where the old testament hebrew kingdoms once flourished  are genetically members of the same family?&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and someone is surprised that the palestinians presently  living in the middle east part of the world where the old testament hebrew kingdoms once flourished  are genetically members of the same family?</p>
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		<title>By: Joachim Martillo</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52937</link>
		<dc:creator>Joachim Martillo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52937</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Everything that Sand put together was known when we were undergrads. In fact practically all of it was known by the 30s.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I go through a lot of the material in &lt;a href=&quot;http://eaazi.blogspot.com/2007/10/origins-of-modern-jewry.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Origins of Modern Jewry&lt;/a&gt; and in &lt;a href=&quot;http://eaazi.blogspot.com/2008/04/followup-ii-origins-of-modern-jewry.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Followup(II): The Origins of Modern Jewry&lt;/a&gt; and all the articles to which these blog entries link.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;In the short description of the current state of affairs, Palestinians are the descendants of the Judeans of Palestine of the Greco-Roman period.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Islam has evolved from the peasant form of Second Temple Judaism and is for the most part Jamesian Christianity.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Syrian Christianity and Greek Orthodoxy are closer to the elite Palestinian and Hellenistic versions of Second Temple Judaism. They are grounded in Paul&#039;s and John&#039;s interpretation of Jesus with the modifications that Constantine supported.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Medieval Rabbanite and Karaite Judaism are much later highly modified developments.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;When I have had to deal with Christian Zionists, I start from this point to argue that by supporting Zionist interlopers and invaders in preventing the exiles from returning to their homes in Palestine, they have become actors in the prophesies of the Revelation and are firmly on the side of the anti-Christ.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&lt;b&gt;By their own interpretation of scripture, Christian Zionists are destined to suffer eternal torments in Hell.&lt;/b&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everything that Sand put together was known when we were undergrads. In fact practically all of it was known by the 30s.</p>
<p>I go through a lot of the material in <a href="http://eaazi.blogspot.com/2007/10/origins-of-modern-jewry.html" rel="nofollow">The Origins of Modern Jewry</a> and in <a href="http://eaazi.blogspot.com/2008/04/followup-ii-origins-of-modern-jewry.html" rel="nofollow">Followup(II): The Origins of Modern Jewry</a> and all the articles to which these blog entries link.</p>
<p>In the short description of the current state of affairs, Palestinians are the descendants of the Judeans of Palestine of the Greco-Roman period.</p>
<p>Islam has evolved from the peasant form of Second Temple Judaism and is for the most part Jamesian Christianity.</p>
<p>Syrian Christianity and Greek Orthodoxy are closer to the elite Palestinian and Hellenistic versions of Second Temple Judaism. They are grounded in Paul&#39;s and John&#39;s interpretation of Jesus with the modifications that Constantine supported.</p>
<p>Medieval Rabbanite and Karaite Judaism are much later highly modified developments.</p>
<p>When I have had to deal with Christian Zionists, I start from this point to argue that by supporting Zionist interlopers and invaders in preventing the exiles from returning to their homes in Palestine, they have become actors in the prophesies of the Revelation and are firmly on the side of the anti-Christ.</p>
<p><b>By their own interpretation of scripture, Christian Zionists are destined to suffer eternal torments in Hell.</b></p>
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		<title>By: Joachim Martillo</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52938</link>
		<dc:creator>Joachim Martillo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52938</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;BTW, The Judonia document covers a lot of the same material from a different perspective in &lt;a href=&quot;http://members.aol.com/ThorsProvoni/JudoniaComplete/JudoniaCompleteA.htm#_Toc199522887&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Ernest Renan: A Nation … Presupposes a Past&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://members.aol.com/ThorsProvoni/JudoniaComplete/JudoniaCompleteA.htm#_Toc199522894&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Creating the Ethnicity and National Consciousness of Judonia&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BTW, The Judonia document covers a lot of the same material from a different perspective in <a href="http://members.aol.com/ThorsProvoni/JudoniaComplete/JudoniaCompleteA.htm#_Toc199522887" rel="nofollow">Ernest Renan: A Nation … Presupposes a Past</a> and <a href="http://members.aol.com/ThorsProvoni/JudoniaComplete/JudoniaCompleteA.htm#_Toc199522894" rel="nofollow">Creating the Ethnicity and National Consciousness of Judonia</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52939</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52939</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Its a false summary, Martillo.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;The accurate summary is of multiple tributaries, containing both blood and culture, that retained a common theme.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Those that retained the theme are Jewish, regardless of origin or path.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Identified as a culture, affirmed in a nation.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Racialists that regard themselves as ANTI-Jewish certainly found means to identify common identity and exclude or kill.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Revision isn&#039;t an idea, its a distortion.&lt;/p&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its a false summary, Martillo.</p>
<p>The accurate summary is of multiple tributaries, containing both blood and culture, that retained a common theme.</p>
<p>Those that retained the theme are Jewish, regardless of origin or path.</p>
<p>Identified as a culture, affirmed in a nation.</p>
<p>Racialists that regard themselves as ANTI-Jewish certainly found means to identify common identity and exclude or kill.</p>
<p>Revision isn&#39;t an idea, its a distortion.</p>
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		<title>By: Joachim Martillo</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52940</link>
		<dc:creator>Joachim Martillo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52940</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Richard, I was quoting the Book of Esther, which is quite explicit about conversions.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;The type of essentialism and primordialism you espouse differs in no major way from that of the German Nazis, and is a major reason why I call you an ethnic Ashkenazi Nazi.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;As a group, ethnic Ashkenazi Nazis like Richard Witty are far worse than the German Nazis. They are completely unwilling to acknowledge that they serve a lie and that Jewish ethnic fundamentalism as led to the commission of mass murder, ethnic cleansing, and genocide. Germans show remorse for the crimes committed in the name of the &quot;German People.&quot; Ethnic Ashkenazi Nazis like Richard and his ilk in Stolen and Occupied Palestine never do anything of the sort for crimes committed in the name of the &quot;Jewish People.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;For this reason I believe -- independent of the need to dismantle the Zionist imperial system (&lt;a href=&quot;http://members.aol.com/ThorsProvoni/JudoniaComplete/JudoniaCompleteA.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Judonia&lt;/a&gt;) -- that the Zionist invader and interloper population must be removed. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Until there is some awareness that Zionism was fundamentally wrong, one must assume that Zionists will some time in the future commit exactly the same crimes all over again.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;BTW, Zionist crimes do not stop with Palestine. On the basis of Pipes appearance at Harvard, I have the impression that Neocon sights are already set on Saudi Arabia in addition to or as a substitute for Iran. See &lt;a href=&quot;http://eaazi.blogspot.com/2008/09/saudia-in-gun-sights.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Saudia in the Gun Sights&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard, I was quoting the Book of Esther, which is quite explicit about conversions.</p>
<p>The type of essentialism and primordialism you espouse differs in no major way from that of the German Nazis, and is a major reason why I call you an ethnic Ashkenazi Nazi.</p>
<p>As a group, ethnic Ashkenazi Nazis like Richard Witty are far worse than the German Nazis. They are completely unwilling to acknowledge that they serve a lie and that Jewish ethnic fundamentalism as led to the commission of mass murder, ethnic cleansing, and genocide. Germans show remorse for the crimes committed in the name of the &quot;German People.&quot; Ethnic Ashkenazi Nazis like Richard and his ilk in Stolen and Occupied Palestine never do anything of the sort for crimes committed in the name of the &quot;Jewish People.&quot;</p>
<p>For this reason I believe &#8212; independent of the need to dismantle the Zionist imperial system (<a href="http://members.aol.com/ThorsProvoni/JudoniaComplete/JudoniaCompleteA.htm" rel="nofollow">Judonia</a>) &#8212; that the Zionist invader and interloper population must be removed. </p>
<p>Until there is some awareness that Zionism was fundamentally wrong, one must assume that Zionists will some time in the future commit exactly the same crimes all over again.</p>
<p>BTW, Zionist crimes do not stop with Palestine. On the basis of Pipes appearance at Harvard, I have the impression that Neocon sights are already set on Saudi Arabia in addition to or as a substitute for Iran. See <a href="http://eaazi.blogspot.com/2008/09/saudia-in-gun-sights.html" rel="nofollow">Saudia in the Gun Sights</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html/comment-page-1#comment-52941</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/02/israeli-historian-palestinians-are-biological-descendants-of-bibles-jews.html#comment-52941</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s an interesting question to ask what the evidence is for the claim that the Romans forcibly expelled inhabitants from Jerusalem or Judea in 70 when they sacked the temple.  There&#039;s no question that they did sack the temple - Roman authors talk about it, and it&#039;s commemorated on the arch of Titus and on contemporary coins.  But when I looked into this question a year or so ago, I found absolutely zero evidence among Roman authors, including Josephus, for the claim.  On the face of it the claim is crazy - the Romans never did this elsewhere, at least as far as I could discover.  Does anyone know what the sources are?  If they go no further back the medieval sources, that&#039;s not very good evidence...so I&#039;d appreciate any help here.  Thanks!&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#39;s an interesting question to ask what the evidence is for the claim that the Romans forcibly expelled inhabitants from Jerusalem or Judea in 70 when they sacked the temple.  There&#39;s no question that they did sack the temple &#8211; Roman authors talk about it, and it&#39;s commemorated on the arch of Titus and on contemporary coins.  But when I looked into this question a year or so ago, I found absolutely zero evidence among Roman authors, including Josephus, for the claim.  On the face of it the claim is crazy &#8211; the Romans never did this elsewhere, at least as far as I could discover.  Does anyone know what the sources are?  If they go no further back the medieval sources, that&#39;s not very good evidence&#8230;so I&#39;d appreciate any help here.  Thanks!</p>
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