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	<title>Comments on: &#8216;Peace Now&#8217; Asked Uri Avnery Not to Speak Up at Its Demonstrations</title>
	<atom:link href="http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html</link>
	<description>The War of Ideas in the Middle East</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:10:33 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Ana Sanchez</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52218</link>
		<dc:creator>Ana Sanchez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52218</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I hate it that you keep threatening to end this blog, &quot;I&#039;m unpaid, this can&#039;t last.&quot;  Must we get paid for everything we do?  The un-censored dialogue here is a breakthrough and holds the promise of improving our understanding of the world.  Can&#039;t you think of yourself as a &quot;community organizer&quot; doing the things that need doing, without looking for financial reward?  And as a member of the &quot;meritocracy&quot;, haven&#039;t you in a way already received payment for this service?&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate it that you keep threatening to end this blog, &quot;I&#39;m unpaid, this can&#39;t last.&quot;  Must we get paid for everything we do?  The un-censored dialogue here is a breakthrough and holds the promise of improving our understanding of the world.  Can&#39;t you think of yourself as a &quot;community organizer&quot; doing the things that need doing, without looking for financial reward?  And as a member of the &quot;meritocracy&quot;, haven&#39;t you in a way already received payment for this service?</p>
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		<title>By: Todd</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52219</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52219</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;He says that I am risking my credibility and soul.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That&#039;s a tad silly and dramatic, don&#039;t you think? Your soul definitely isn&#039;t up for grabs, and who cares what Seliger or others like him consider credible?&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;He says that I am risking my credibility and soul.&quot;</p>
<p>That&#39;s a tad silly and dramatic, don&#39;t you think? Your soul definitely isn&#39;t up for grabs, and who cares what Seliger or others like him consider credible?</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52220</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52220</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;I&#039;m not imprisoned by the Israeli discourse. I am an American, a Jew, not a Zionist. It is horrifying to me that Gush Shalom and the great great great Avnery were ever blacklisted by the progressive Zionists. As it strikes me as a horrifying thing that Peace Now stayed on the board of AIPAC, which is a true prisoner of the Israeli discourse, when AIPAC was supporting settlements. Because I have my own litmus test: rejection of the occupation.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;You are imprisoned by the Israeli discourse, but not in the sense of &quot;censorship&quot;.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;You are imprisoned by the absence of political strategy and discipline towards the goal that you state, or rather &quot;litmus test&quot;.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Some of us hold &quot;litmus testing&quot; as an immature political stance, a stance for those committed to being on the armchair, permanently in the periphery, NEVER accomplishing.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Being asked not speak is not blacklisting, its relative to strategy.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I won&#039;t walk in a demonstration with anyone carrying a sign &quot;Death to Israel&quot;, NEVER.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Backbone isn&#039;t constructed by the perspective of non-compromise or non-strategy. Its constructed by the perspective of determination IN CONTEXT, respecting context.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That Uri Avnery accepted that, indicates that there is more merit to it than you judgemental litmus test.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&quot;I&#39;m not imprisoned by the Israeli discourse. I am an American, a Jew, not a Zionist. It is horrifying to me that Gush Shalom and the great great great Avnery were ever blacklisted by the progressive Zionists. As it strikes me as a horrifying thing that Peace Now stayed on the board of AIPAC, which is a true prisoner of the Israeli discourse, when AIPAC was supporting settlements. Because I have my own litmus test: rejection of the occupation.&quot;</p>
<p>You are imprisoned by the Israeli discourse, but not in the sense of &quot;censorship&quot;.</p>
<p>You are imprisoned by the absence of political strategy and discipline towards the goal that you state, or rather &quot;litmus test&quot;.</p>
<p>Some of us hold &quot;litmus testing&quot; as an immature political stance, a stance for those committed to being on the armchair, permanently in the periphery, NEVER accomplishing.</p>
<p>Being asked not speak is not blacklisting, its relative to strategy.</p>
<p>I won&#39;t walk in a demonstration with anyone carrying a sign &quot;Death to Israel&quot;, NEVER.</p>
<p>Backbone isn&#39;t constructed by the perspective of non-compromise or non-strategy. Its constructed by the perspective of determination IN CONTEXT, respecting context.</p>
<p>That Uri Avnery accepted that, indicates that there is more merit to it than you judgemental litmus test.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Easton, Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, Belly Of The Beast</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52221</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Easton, Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, Belly Of The Beast</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52221</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;If Phil sincerely respects the Jewish Community he must now dialog with SOG.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If Phil sincerely respects the Jewish Community he must now dialog with SOG.</p>
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		<title>By: liberal white boy</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52222</link>
		<dc:creator>liberal white boy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52222</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Hey wait a minute. Martillos not an anti-Semite, he&#039;s an anti-Semite light.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Should Those Who Critisize Israel Be Called Anti-Semite Lights? &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;http://homo-sapien-underground.blogspot.com/2008/08/should-those-who-critisize-israel-be.html&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey wait a minute. Martillos not an anti-Semite, he&#39;s an anti-Semite light.</p>
<p>Should Those Who Critisize Israel Be Called Anti-Semite Lights? </p>
<p>http://homo-sapien-underground.blogspot.com/2008/08/should-those-who-critisize-israel-be.html</p>
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		<title>By: higginslads</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52223</link>
		<dc:creator>higginslads</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52223</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Richard, no one mentioned anything about signs that read &quot;Death to Israel.&quot; It is a fact that many of the leading &quot;peace&quot; groups and antiwar groups in this country have refused to allow protesters to carry signs saying &quot;No War For Israel.&quot; Or &quot;End Israeli Apartheid.&quot; Or &quot;Stop the Israeli Occupation of Palestian Land.&quot; Or &quot;One Democrat State in Palestine.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Would you walk in a demonstration with someone carrying these signs? And why do you immediately paint a picture in the reader&#039;s mind of someone carrying a sign saying &quot;Death to Israel.&quot; Such imagery serves the purpose of diverting all attention from the brutal Israeli aggression and in its stead creates an image of a lunatic who wishes &quot;death to Israel,&quot; whatever the hell that means. But, mission accomplished, right? We&#039;re immediately taken from the concrete reality of Israeli killing, torture, and brutal aggression, to the fantasyland of &quot;poor little Israel.&quot; Poor, poor, little Israel...&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard, no one mentioned anything about signs that read &quot;Death to Israel.&quot; It is a fact that many of the leading &quot;peace&quot; groups and antiwar groups in this country have refused to allow protesters to carry signs saying &quot;No War For Israel.&quot; Or &quot;End Israeli Apartheid.&quot; Or &quot;Stop the Israeli Occupation of Palestian Land.&quot; Or &quot;One Democrat State in Palestine.&quot;</p>
<p>Would you walk in a demonstration with someone carrying these signs? And why do you immediately paint a picture in the reader&#39;s mind of someone carrying a sign saying &quot;Death to Israel.&quot; Such imagery serves the purpose of diverting all attention from the brutal Israeli aggression and in its stead creates an image of a lunatic who wishes &quot;death to Israel,&quot; whatever the hell that means. But, mission accomplished, right? We&#39;re immediately taken from the concrete reality of Israeli killing, torture, and brutal aggression, to the fantasyland of &quot;poor little Israel.&quot; Poor, poor, little Israel&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: higginslads</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52224</link>
		<dc:creator>higginslads</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52224</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The &quot;antisemite&quot; label really bothers me. An Arab is every bit as semitic as a Jew, if not more so, yet &quot;antisemite&quot; is reserved for anti-Jewish sentiment. It should properly be called what it is: &quot;anti-Jewish,&quot; just as &quot;anti-Arab&quot; or &quot;anti-Muslim&quot; sentiment is so labeled. We would be better off dropping &quot;antisemite&quot; from the vocabulary entirely.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &quot;antisemite&quot; label really bothers me. An Arab is every bit as semitic as a Jew, if not more so, yet &quot;antisemite&quot; is reserved for anti-Jewish sentiment. It should properly be called what it is: &quot;anti-Jewish,&quot; just as &quot;anti-Arab&quot; or &quot;anti-Muslim&quot; sentiment is so labeled. We would be better off dropping &quot;antisemite&quot; from the vocabulary entirely.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52225</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52225</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Martillo&#039;s comments certainly feed anti-semitism. Whether he personally is anti-semitic or not is a different question.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Maybe he is ignorant as to the potential and actual affects of his words and is merely naive.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Higgisnlads,&lt;br /&gt;
You strike me as someone who will willingly express a great deal of momentum and outrage politically. I consider that 90 degrees to thought and politics that is likely to result in kindness and greater good.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It takes mutual sensitivity (the most important word, sensitivity) to realize justice in the world. You won&#039;t get there by outrage alone.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;If the need is force, then maybe outrage accomplishes the collective political will necessary. &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;If the need is to convince, then it hinders.&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martillo&#39;s comments certainly feed anti-semitism. Whether he personally is anti-semitic or not is a different question.</p>
<p>Maybe he is ignorant as to the potential and actual affects of his words and is merely naive.</p>
<p>Higgisnlads,<br />
You strike me as someone who will willingly express a great deal of momentum and outrage politically. I consider that 90 degrees to thought and politics that is likely to result in kindness and greater good.</p>
<p>It takes mutual sensitivity (the most important word, sensitivity) to realize justice in the world. You won&#39;t get there by outrage alone.</p>
<p>If the need is force, then maybe outrage accomplishes the collective political will necessary. </p>
<p>If the need is to convince, then it hinders.</p>
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		<title>By: higginslads</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52226</link>
		<dc:creator>higginslads</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52226</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Richard,&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Why do I strike you &quot;as someone who will willingly express a great deal of momentum and outrage politically?&quot; And what exactly does that mean? And what does it have to do with the matter at hand?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;For the record, I am a very sensitive person, and I try to avoid the need to convince, although I do admit it is sometimes difficult when &quot;conversing&quot; through a computer screen. Most of all, I am interested in understanding, and I think the best way to achieve understanding, and kindness, for that matter, is through straightforwardness and absolute honesty, and complete purity and integrity of motive. I am not interested in any sort of intellectual dissertations, and I have no patience for academic obfuscation.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard,</p>
<p>Why do I strike you &quot;as someone who will willingly express a great deal of momentum and outrage politically?&quot; And what exactly does that mean? And what does it have to do with the matter at hand?</p>
<p>For the record, I am a very sensitive person, and I try to avoid the need to convince, although I do admit it is sometimes difficult when &quot;conversing&quot; through a computer screen. Most of all, I am interested in understanding, and I think the best way to achieve understanding, and kindness, for that matter, is through straightforwardness and absolute honesty, and complete purity and integrity of motive. I am not interested in any sort of intellectual dissertations, and I have no patience for academic obfuscation.</p>
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		<title>By: Todd</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2008/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html/comment-page-1#comment-52227</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/09/09/ralph-seliger-is-disturbed-with-me-for-linking-to-joachim-martillo-whom-he-describes-as-an-antisemite-he-says-that-i-am-ris.html#comment-52227</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Martillo is anti-Zionist rather than anti-Jewish, and has stated this countless times. I don&#039;t know many of his sources, but he seems to be far more honest and realistic than those who have called him &quot;out there&quot; or worse. If I&#039;m not mistaken, Joachim has made it clear that his intent is to expose Zionism for what it is, and to stop the inevitable backlash against Jews. Is he fighting a losing battle? Probably. But he is far more realistic than those who believe that the current situation can go on without negative consequences. &lt;/p&gt;

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martillo is anti-Zionist rather than anti-Jewish, and has stated this countless times. I don&#39;t know many of his sources, but he seems to be far more honest and realistic than those who have called him &quot;out there&quot; or worse. If I&#39;m not mistaken, Joachim has made it clear that his intent is to expose Zionism for what it is, and to stop the inevitable backlash against Jews. Is he fighting a losing battle? Probably. But he is far more realistic than those who believe that the current situation can go on without negative consequences. </p>
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