Comments on: Young American Woman Is Red-Lighted, Badgered and Humiliated for 3 Hours at a West Bank Checkpoint http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html The War of Ideas in the Middle East Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:03:10 +0000 hourly 1 By: Doppler http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46121 Doppler Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46121 <p>Thank you, Phil and Anna, for this detailed description of the checkpoint experience. It reminds of Zimbardo's book, The Lucifer Effect, the Stanford psychologist's account of the Stanford Prison Experiment, in which ordinary college students morphed into cruel overseers and submissive prisoners, molded by the structure of the environment in which they find themselves, (and, no doubt, by genetic predispositions etched in our makeup by evolution). Zimbardo came to his senses one week into the experiment and terminated it, shocked at how it affected even him, since we was playing the role of prison superintendent, in his dealings both with prisoners and their concerned parents. How long will it take Israel?</p> Thank you, Phil and Anna, for this detailed description of the checkpoint experience. It reminds of Zimbardo's book, The Lucifer Effect, the Stanford psychologist's account of the Stanford Prison Experiment, in which ordinary college students morphed into cruel overseers and submissive prisoners, molded by the structure of the environment in which they find themselves, (and, no doubt, by genetic predispositions etched in our makeup by evolution). Zimbardo came to his senses one week into the experiment and terminated it, shocked at how it affected even him, since we was playing the role of prison superintendent, in his dealings both with prisoners and their concerned parents. How long will it take Israel?

]]> By: dana http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46122 dana Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46122 <p>This is an incredibly affecting story. One can't stop thinking of Kafka's Castle. Technology combined with fear and indifference have the power to reduce human beings to things. This must be the way cows feel on the way to the slaughter. Probably modern slaughterhouses - designed to minimize panic of crowds - is the model Israelis with their infinite brilliance used to design this checkpoint.</p> <p>the process of dehumanization gives you the absolute chills. </p> <p>Kudos to Anna for telling it all (and to Phil for giving it the play it deserves).</p> This is an incredibly affecting story. One can't stop thinking of Kafka's Castle. Technology combined with fear and indifference have the power to reduce human beings to things. This must be the way cows feel on the way to the slaughter. Probably modern slaughterhouses – designed to minimize panic of crowds – is the model Israelis with their infinite brilliance used to design this checkpoint.

the process of dehumanization gives you the absolute chills.

Kudos to Anna for telling it all (and to Phil for giving it the play it deserves).

]]> By: Sword of Gideonthe point. http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46123 Sword of Gideonthe point. Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46123 <p>They launched a war. Complete with the classic move. A sedar wipeout of holocaust survivors in Netanya. Before that the Palestinians gdp was rising at a rapid rate. But compared to killing Jews that was small comfort. Maybe next time she'll do the right thing and immolate herself like the budhist monks did in Vietnam. That would be impressive.</p> They launched a war. Complete with the classic move. A sedar wipeout of holocaust survivors in Netanya. Before that the Palestinians gdp was rising at a rapid rate. But compared to killing Jews that was small comfort. Maybe next time she'll do the right thing and immolate herself like the budhist monks did in Vietnam. That would be impressive.

]]> By: Mishal http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46124 Mishal Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46124 <p>We are hosting Anna Baltzer this Thursday night at the University of Texas at Austin in Garrison Hall, 0.102, at 7pm, free and open to the public.</p> We are hosting Anna Baltzer this Thursday night at the University of Texas at Austin in Garrison Hall, 0.102, at 7pm, free and open to the public.

]]> By: Rowan Berkeley http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46125 Rowan Berkeley Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46125 <p>In what way is "a sedar wipeout of holocaust survivors in Netanya" "a classic move"?</p> <p>Just curious.</p> In what way is "a sedar wipeout of holocaust survivors in Netanya" "a classic move"?

Just curious.

]]> By: dana http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46126 dana Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46126 <p>@ Mishal - can you provide some directions to the hall 102? say from the austin airport?</p> <p>Also, would you know whether Anna has any other event planned in Texas? Thanks</p> @ Mishal – can you provide some directions to the hall 102? say from the austin airport?

Also, would you know whether Anna has any other event planned in Texas? Thanks

]]> By: Duscany http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46127 Duscany Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46127 <p>Sword of Gideon: "But compared to killing Jews that was small comfort." </p> <p>Is killing Jews worse than killing Palestinians? Or do you rather feel, as it appears, that one is unspeakably grotesque while the other is unfortunate but necessary?</p> Sword of Gideon: "But compared to killing Jews that was small comfort."

Is killing Jews worse than killing Palestinians? Or do you rather feel, as it appears, that one is unspeakably grotesque while the other is unfortunate but necessary?

]]> By: Jaffr http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46128 Jaffr Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46128 <p>BTW, it is significant that the Einav junction described in this horrible tale is not on the border between Israel and the Occupied Palestinian territories. It is located well within the West Bank, between Nablus and Tulkarem, meant to isolate Nablus and protect the illegal settlements in the vicinity, not provide security for Israelis in Tel Aviv. One cannot enter "Israel proper" without passing through at least one other checkpoint near the Green Line.</p> BTW, it is significant that the Einav junction described in this horrible tale is not on the border between Israel and the Occupied Palestinian territories. It is located well within the West Bank, between Nablus and Tulkarem, meant to isolate Nablus and protect the illegal settlements in the vicinity, not provide security for Israelis in Tel Aviv. One cannot enter "Israel proper" without passing through at least one other checkpoint near the Green Line.

]]> By: Eurosabra http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46129 Eurosabra Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46129 <p>So many young female suicide bombers, so many gates and airlocks needed to isolate them, first from the crossing point, then from the soldiers manning it, then ensuring the transition of the unarmed and legitimate visitor, a semi-permeable frontier designed to slam shut to the onslaught of high-explosive in a heartbeat. Rather than a mere slaughterhouse--for slaughter requires just arms, bullets, and a ditch, and stout-hearted fidayin--the checkpoint is a precision-tuned machine of power and control. Nothing guarantees that Anna is who she says she is except a call to Ben-Gurion airport, and the two nice young men who blew up at the Mike's Place pub in Tel Aviv came out of Gaza on their British passports.</p> So many young female suicide bombers, so many gates and airlocks needed to isolate them, first from the crossing point, then from the soldiers manning it, then ensuring the transition of the unarmed and legitimate visitor, a semi-permeable frontier designed to slam shut to the onslaught of high-explosive in a heartbeat. Rather than a mere slaughterhouse–for slaughter requires just arms, bullets, and a ditch, and stout-hearted fidayin–the checkpoint is a precision-tuned machine of power and control. Nothing guarantees that Anna is who she says she is except a call to Ben-Gurion airport, and the two nice young men who blew up at the Mike's Place pub in Tel Aviv came out of Gaza on their British passports.

]]> By: John Lewis-Dickerson http://mondoweiss.net/2008/11/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html/comment-page-1#comment-46130 John Lewis-Dickerson Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2008/11/17/held-at-einab-junction-inside-israels-new-terminals-when-i-first-the-west-bank-in-2003-checkpoints-were-controlled-by-you.html#comment-46130 <p>This story makes me wish that I was dead.....unless, that is....I am already dead. Perhaps it is best that I avoid this website.</p> This story makes me wish that I was dead…..unless, that is….I am already dead. Perhaps it is best that I avoid this website.

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