12 Responses

  1. Me
    December 29, 2008, 10:59 am

    Thank you, all the protesters who didn't let the media fool them. And all the bloggers who are covering this demonstration.

  2. Michael W
    December 29, 2008, 2:20 pm

    At what number of deaths does it start to be called "Holocaust"?

    Any ideas?

    Or is it just when Jews kill people?

  3. contrarian
    December 29, 2008, 2:48 pm

    To phrase it a little differently, Michael W: How many innocent human beings are Israelis allowed to massacre before it's OK to start asking how a people so horrifically victimized by the Nazis could inflict such misery on another people?

  4. Michael W
    December 29, 2008, 3:27 pm

    You are avoiding the question. Well done.

  5. contrarian
    December 29, 2008, 3:50 pm

    @Michael W: I could say the same about you. Your question is silly. Who can say at what precise number of deaths the term "holocaust" kicks in? There is, of course, no precise answer.

    The word is invoked by Palestinians not because of a specific casualty count but because of the unconscionable cruelty, carnage and collective punishment that Israelis — claiming protection against another "holocaust" as their justification — have inflicted on Palestinians for more than six decades.

    I fail to see how a specific number of deaths at Israel's hands is relevant? Does it make you feel better that, at least when the Jewish state is doing the killing, there aren't as many zeroes in the number?

  6. Peter D
    December 29, 2008, 4:49 pm

    Well said, contrarian. Explain to me, Michael W, the big difference between, say, Warsaw Ghetto and Gaza (there was, btw, a sign saying "Gaza is today's Warsaw Ghetto"at the demonstration yesterday)
    Hell, if we need to pat ourselves on the back for not killing millions then we're in a bad shape indeed. And for every family a death of a member is a death of a member, regardless of how many other families suffered the same. The insistence of numbers is misguided here.

  7. anon
    December 29, 2008, 5:12 pm

    Mmmmm, is Candy Rice Reinhardt Heydrich's niece? I'm sure she at least does not think so; then again, her academic study was about the USSR & cold war… she plays the piano sort of like Truman's daughter, and we call it governing…

  8. 3rd generation NYPD Jew
    December 29, 2008, 5:37 pm

    "Explain to me, Michael W, the big difference between, say, Warsaw Ghetto and Gaza"

    In one hundreds of thousands of innocents were killed for who they were, in the other a few dozen innocents were killed because the guilty hid among them. Or were hidden among them.
    Israel tries not to kill innocents. They try one hell of a lot harder than we have tried in Iraq. That's why they have repeatedly avoided tactics that bring them into harm's way. The Nazis, on the other hand, had the mass slaughter of innocents as their raison d'être.
    Can you really not see the difference?
    My father is a retired NY Police Captain, and he always said a good comparison is between the IDF and the NYPD–they do a very hard job very well in front of a very critical audience.

  9. anonn
    December 29, 2008, 6:16 pm

    A more astute comparison is between the young Gaza policemen; they have been the number one target of the American made and paid for Israeli air force and its latest American bunker busters.

  10. anonn
    December 29, 2008, 6:26 pm

    NO, what's the difference, except this time, Uncle Sam at the moment holds the cards? Lebensraum, facts on the ground. At least Germany wasn't reaching into the 2 thousand year old past to justify its force, not to mention, it wasn't relying on American taxpayers.

  11. Peter D
    December 29, 2008, 11:13 pm

    NYPD Jew, you're missing the point. Yeah, of course Israel cannot just kill them all, even though there are enough people in Israel that want just that (I knew many people like that; one such scumbag – Moshe Feiglin – is quite unapologetic about his genocidal views and is the number 20 on Likud list); so, Israel employs "benign" ethnic cleansing tactics: make the life intolerable there, so that they just pack and move to Egypt or something.
    Think of slow starvation of 1.5 million people who have no hope, no future, no nothing. Think about how you'll sleep well in your bed tonight without wondering if you'll ever wake up or you and your family will be blown to pieces as some collateral damage or other. No big difference from the Warsaw Ghetto here.

  12. Peter D
    December 29, 2008, 11:16 pm

    And, NYPD Jew, you must know that because there is a killer in a neighborhood, NYPD will not come there and start throwing bombs left and right, saying "oops" every time an innocent bystander is killed "because a killer was hiding among them". Your own analogies don't help your perverted argument.

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