Marty Peretz says Israel should have let no relief supplies into Gaza

by on February 21, 2009 50

without the release of Gilad Shalit. So one Jewish life is always worth hundreds of Palestinian lives. (Thanks to Jeff Blankfort)

Posted in Beyondoweiss, Gaza, Israel/Palestine, US Policy in the Middle East

{ 50 comments... read them below or add one }

  1. MRW. says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:01 pm

    Criminal thinking.

  2. Sword of Gideonthe point. says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:02 pm

    If your Hamas the logical thing to do is fall totally into character. Mutilate and kill him. That's what hezbollah did to Goldwasser and Regev, and they got a hero of "pig Weiss" in return. Samir Kuntar.

  3. samuelburke says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:17 pm

    http://counterpunch.com/neumann02202009.html

    Remove Our Grandmother's Name from the Wall at Yad Vashem

    By MICHAEL NEUMANN
    and OSHA NEUMANN

    Following the example of Jean-Moise Braitberg, we ask that our grandmother's name be removed from the wall at Yad Vashem. Her name is Gertrud Neumann. Your records state that she was born in Kattowitz on June 6, 1875 and died in Theresienstadt.

    M. Braitberg delivers his request with excellent reasons and eloquent personal testimony. His words are inspiring, but they give you – and those who stand with you – too much credit. I will instead be brief. Please take this as an expression of my disgust and contempt for your state and all it represents.

    Our grandmother was a victim of that very ideal of ethnic sovereignty in whose cause Israel has shed so much blood for so long. I was among the many Jews who thought nothing of embracing that ideal, despite the sufferings it had inflicted on our own race. It took thousands of Palestinian lives before, finally, I realized how foolish we had been.

    Our complicity was despicable. I do not believe that the Jewish people, in whose name you have committed so many crimes with such outrageous complacency, can ever rid itself of the shame you have brought upon us. Nazi propaganda, for all its calumnies, never disgraced and corrupted the Jews; you have succeeded in this. You haven't the courage to take responsibility for your own sadistic acts: with unparalleled insolence, you set yourself up as spokesmen for an entire race, as if our very existence endorsed your conduct. And you blacken our names not only by your acts, but by the lies, the coy evasions, the smirking arrogance and the infantile self-righteousness with which you embroider our history.

    In the end, you will give the Palestinians some scrap of a state. You will never pay for your crimes and you will continue to preen yourself, to bask in your illusions of moral ascendancy. But between now and the end, you will kill and kill and kill, gaining nothing by your spoilt-brat brutality. In life, our grandmother suffered enough. Stop making her a party to this horror in her death.

    Michael Neumann

    I join my brother, Michael Neumann, in asking that any reference to our grandmother be removed from Yad Vashem, the Holocaust memorial.

    I have been to this memorial. Its buildings, paved courtyards and plazas spread themselves authoritatively over many landscaped acres. It frames the Holocaust as a prelude to the creation of the state of Israel. It embalms memorabilia of the death camps and preserves them as national treasures. That treasure does not belong to Israel. It is a treasure only if it serves as a reminder never to permit any nation to claim an exemption for its chosen people from the bounds of morality and decency.

    Israel has twisted the Holocaust into an excuse for perpetrating more holocausts. It has spent the treasure of the world's sympathy for the victims of the Holocaust on a fruitless effort to shield itself from all criticism as it massacres and tortures Palestinians and suffocates them under a brutal occupation. I do not wish to have the memory of my grandmother enlisted in this misbegotten project.

  4. chris berel says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:19 pm

    It seems to me that holding Hamas accountable at the time of the kidnapping would have been the right time. However, now is better than never.

    I see that the life of a Jew is meaningless to Weiss. But that was already established years ago.

  5. Duscany says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    berel: "I see that the life of a Jew is meaningless to Weiss."

    Phil won't reply but if he did I'm sure he'd say that, contrary to your implication, Jewish life is no more or less valuable than any other life.

  6. Shield of Asherahthe boss says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:42 pm

    Goldwasser and Regev were killed in the initial attack, not "mutilated and killed".

    Also, folks, could you please stop claiming there's a God? It's just dumb.

  7. Sword of Gideonthe point. says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:42 pm

    Actually I think that to "Pig Weiss" a Jew is way less valuable that the life of an Arab. And that's ok, but why pass himself off has a Jew.

  8. Sword of Gideonthe point. says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:47 pm

    This is nor more surprising coming from the Neumann boys than it would be for "PIg Weiss" to celebrate the deaths of Jews by suicide bombing.

  9. Dan Kelly says:
    February 21, 2009 at 10:49 pm

    Jewish life is no more or less valuable than any other life.

    You know that drives the Jewish supremacists on here absolutely crazy.

    I once asked Richard Witty (who should not be lumped in with berel, Suzanne, SOG and the other loonies on here) whether or not the genocide of Jews in WWII was any more or less important than the genocide of any other people throughout history. Richard's response: "Who is to judge?"

  10. chris berel says:
    February 21, 2009 at 11:19 pm

    Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to erradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust.

    Phil won't answer because he was caught with his pants down. Quite embarassing, I hear.

  11. Dan Kelly says:
    February 22, 2009 at 12:20 am

    Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to erradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust.

    First of all, that isn't true, or is, at a minimum, highly debatable (depending on how one chooses to define genocide, what sources are used, etc. – the usual factors).

    But that isn't the point. The point is, unless it was the ONLY example of genocide, or unless it was so far beyond other genocides, both in terms of numbers and wanton cruelty, then the answer, to any sentient being who values all human life equally, is a resounding NO.

    The genocide of Jews and others during WWII is not any more or less important than any other genocide throughout history. If we value all lives equally, this is quite easy to see.

    To those who think that "their people" are superior, exceptions to basic humanistic truisms must be made.

  12. Ed says:
    February 22, 2009 at 1:18 am

    I'm sure Peretz also agrees with Rabbi Perin who said the following when eulogizing the mass killer, New York émigré Dr. Baruch Goldstein, who murdered between 29 and 52 Arab Muslims at the Cave of the Patriarchs:

    "A million Arabs are not worth one Jewish fingernail."

    Yet Peretz is an ongoing, highly-respected member in good standing of the left-liberal establishment. I guess according to the left-liberal elites, all people are created equal, but some are more equal than others.

  13. Jim says:
    February 22, 2009 at 3:40 am

    "Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to eradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust."

    Well, the Germans modeled their slaughter on the Turkish genocide of the Armenians. Funny how the Zionists don't ever want to talk about the Armenian holocaust, as if it would somehow diminish the Zionist claim to greatest suffering – all the better to deflect any criticism.

  14. David F. says:
    February 22, 2009 at 4:09 am

    Chris: "Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to erradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust."

    Chris, substitute "ethnically cleanse" or "expel" for "eradicate," and you would be able to make a good argument.

    However, mainstream scholarship (i.e. Hilberg, Browning) has bascially disproven the idea that extermination was a primary goal. Organized mass killing started around 1942, when it became the easiest way to get rid of the victims of the deportations who weren't needed or fit for slave labor.

    However, none of those historical issues make the destruction of civilians' lives more or less acceptible, whoever the perpetrator or whatever their reasons.

  15. syvanen says:
    February 22, 2009 at 4:31 am

    Chris: "Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to erradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust."

    It does appear that the Jews survived the holocaust as horrible as that slaughter was. But you guys worship out of the Old Testament, where as far as the evidence shows, the ancient Hebrews exterminated the Ameleks and the Canaanites down to the last man, woman and child. At least that is what their sacred texts tell us. In fact, they even killed their goats but were allowed to keep the gold according to these texts.

    In general, it seems absurd to hold a religion responsible for the crimes of their ancestors three millinia ago, but there are today West Bank rabbis equating the Amaleks with the Palestinians. It does seem the genocidal rage that burned in the hearts of the Ancient Hebrews is alive and well in modern Israel.

  16. MRW. says:
    February 22, 2009 at 5:02 am

    Chris: "Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to erradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust."

    Once again, you're dead wrong, Mr. Berel. link to ynet.co.il

  17. MRW. says:
    February 22, 2009 at 5:07 am

    Judith Weisman: "Zionism Is The Scourge Of The Jewish People"
    link to youtube.com
    />

  18. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:27 am

    The article does not reveal any invasion of any other country and removing the particular people to another country to await execution.

    It seems as though you are related to Genrikh Yagoda. Is that why you are antisemitic?

  19. Julian says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:32 am

    It's all very simple.
    Hamas was elected to represent the people of Gaza. Hamas' goal is to destroy Israel and replace it with an Islamic State. (I doubt even Weiss or Duke would dispute that) Why would Israelis want to help Hamas to achieve their goals?

  20. HistoryBuff says:
    February 22, 2009 at 8:22 am

    Now for the context: Israel was established for the Jewish people. A slight glitch was people already lived
    there. So the Canaanites were exterminated. Centuries later, Israel was reestablished on the same land. A slight glitch was people already lived there. By this time, the 20th Century, the international world community had recognized a new notion, "war crimes." So, Israel could not honor the Hebrew biblical
    prescription of extermination of the natives. It chose the second best solution: Boot out the natives, starve them, imprison them, all the while speaking of honoring the peace process. Why would the remnant natives want to help Israel achieve its goal?

  21. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 8:27 am

    Of course they will dispute that. It is almost their entire argument.

  22. Koshiro says:
    February 22, 2009 at 8:34 am

    "Hamas was elected to represent the people of Gaza."
    Wrong by being incomplete. If you make the case for collective punishment, make it correctly.

  23. samuelburke says:
    February 22, 2009 at 8:47 am

    its nice to see the wheels falling off the zionist wagon….almost as much fun as it was to see the communist russian nation collapse.

    the fall of russian communism finally put an end to the dream of the idiot fellow travellers who believed up until the end that communism was good and that it was financially viable.

    bolshevist communism was the cause of world war 2…international communism was the threat.

  24. Julian says:
    February 22, 2009 at 8:49 am

    "Now for the context: Israel was established for the Jewish people. A slight glitch was people already lived there"

    "The simple fact is that the Zionist movement had always been amenable to the existence in the future Jewish state of a substantial Arab minority that would participate on an equal footing "throughout all sectors of the country's public life." The words are those of Ze'ev Jabotinsky, the founding father of the branch of Zionism that was the forebear of today's Likud Party. In a famous 1923 article, Jabotinsky voiced his readiness "to take an oath binding ourselves and our descendants that we shall never do anything contrary to the principle of equal rights, and that we shall never try to eject anyone."
    Eleven years later, Jabotinsky presided over the drafting of a constitution for Jewish Palestine. According to its provisions, Arabs and Jews were to share both the prerogatives and the duties of statehood, including most notably military and civil service. Hebrew and Arabic were to enjoy the same legal standing, and "in every cabinet where the prime minister is a Jew, the vice-premiership shall be offered to an Arab and vice-versa.""

  25. Jim Haygood says:
    February 22, 2009 at 9:27 am

    'According to its provisions, Arabs and Jews were to share both the prerogatives and the duties of statehood, including most notably military and civil service. Hebrew and Arabic were to enjoy the same legal standing, and "in every cabinet where the prime minister is a Jew, the vice-premiership shall be offered to an Arab and vice-versa."'

    This sounds like an early version of the Lebanese balance formula. In Lebanon, demographics have rendered it obsolete, making the repeatedly postponed census a political issue.

    Similarly in Israel/Palestine, steady Jewish immigration rendered the cited formula obsolete by the time Israeli statehood was declared. The Jewish majority didn't want to share power, and didn't have to. Furthermore, they increased their majority by driving out some Arabs.

    Statements such as 'Obviously Arabs and Muslims don't go for equal rights' are comically easy to invert. Given Israel's Law of Return which applies only to its Jews, one could just as easily conclude that 'Obviously Jews don't go for equal rights.' But that would be overgeneralizing. It's zionists who, by definition, don't go for equal rights in Israel. Fortunately, the percentage of Jews worldwide who subscribe to this caustic, eugenic doctrine is dropping like a stone. It just ain't respectable no more.

  26. Sword of Gideonthe point. says:
    February 22, 2009 at 9:50 am

    There has never been a case where a modern industrial state, supposedly advanced, like the Germany. Decided to exterminate an entire people. And that was just the culmination of centuries of attempts to get rid of us. Shalit is dead, and without doubt was mutilated while being tortured. That;s the Arab way. Omar Barghouti will eventually get released. Gilead Shalit will not. He's dead. I know that makes "Pig Weiss" happy but why should Israel aid Hamas. Explain it to me.

  27. Mattie says:
    February 22, 2009 at 10:07 am

    @Julian
    It's all very simple.
    Israel was created, and Zionists elected, to represent the Jewish people. Zionists' goal was, and is, to destroy Palestine (and Palestinians) and replace it with a Jewish State. (I doubt even Richard, Chris, Julian or Suzanne would dispute that). Why would Palestinians want to help Zionists achieve their goals?

    Fact is, the first "wrong" was committed 61 years ago by the Zionists – not Hamas. Seems what goes around does come around and, that evil does beget evil.

    So much hypocrisy. Meanwhile good people on both sides – far too many of them children and young people with dreams now unrealized – die for the Zionist dream. I continue to be baffled by how this racist cultism can be reconciled with the Judaic belief system by which Zionists profess to live their lives. Which is why Phil inspires. He's had the guts to question, analyze, think critically – in an effort to sustain ALL of humanity. Zionists, when they do the same – do so to sustain Zionism. This adherence to their own racist schtick will be their Waterloo.

  28. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 10:25 am

    Mattie, your doubts define nothing. Hamas did not exist 61 years ago, but the leaders of Hamas, their, parents, grandparents, or great grand parents were involved in the massacre of Jews 62 years and more ago.

    You are baffled because you are ignorant.

  29. Ed says:
    February 22, 2009 at 11:48 am

    Notice how the Zionists keep coming up with ever more elaborate caveats in order to make their plight unique, special, exceptional, unprecedented, exclusive…

    This is necessary in order that they be given a "pass" by the rest of the world on their own abhorrent behavior, no matter how illegal, be it in the Levant or in America or anywhere else where Zionists gather in large numbers. This is all part of their ongoing grift.

    "Our suffering is unlike that ever experienced by any other, EVER! How dare you question ANYTHING we do. You have no right!"

    Cry me a river.

  30. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 12:22 pm

    Ed, your promotion of Mondoweiss is a Jews's wet dream.

  31. Ed says:
    February 22, 2009 at 1:10 pm

    Is that some kind of confession, or is it a generalization? Are you saying you believe most Jews are grifters like you and Abe Foxman who will exploit constructive criticism in order to scare the entirety of the Jewish people into one single-minded camp? It's not hard to see why Jews have historically ended up in so much difficulty, with cynical and exploitive "leaders" like that. Apparently their "leaders" equate entirely verbal constructive criticism with anti-Jewishness, and then demand a kosher Jihad against the "aggressor." Sad.

  32. MRW. says:
    February 22, 2009 at 1:26 pm

    I repeat, Once again, you're dead wrong, Mr. Berel. http://www.ynet.co.il/english/articles/0,7340,L-3342999,00.html

    You also seem incapable of comprehending plain English. Sever Plocker makes my point.

  33. Ed says:
    February 22, 2009 at 2:25 pm

    The concept of no-holds-barred free speech and its essential and therapeutic value as a social lubricant for a diverse country that doesn’t want socialist thought-police forever looking over everyone’s shoulders and economic affairs seems totally lost on Zionists and other backward peoples, such as politically correct left liberals. None of them seem to have the slightest idea of what America is all about, which makes one wonder why they want to stay here when there are so many other cesspools around the world that conform to their primitive conceptualizations of how countries should be run. Apparently they enjoy the prosperous (formerly) libertarian economic and political climate, even as they continue to strangle it with their backward notions of governance.

    Read a book on the Founders.

  34. Citizen says:
    February 22, 2009 at 2:41 pm

    The gentile nations couldn't try to get rid of jews without first allowing them in, being tolerant. According to the chris berels and SOGs of the world this endless cycle is solely due to "anti-semitism." Interesting "logic."

  35. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 3:55 pm

    Philip, how many times can you promote a false answer?

    Your story does not show an invasion of several countries along with shipping a particular racial group from those countries to another with the exact goal of destroying that particular race.

    I assert that only an idiot believes differently.

  36. history buff says:
    February 22, 2009 at 4:09 pm

    Exactly, chris

    Jews invaded palestinian land and also were shipped there by several countries, jews, a particular ethnic group carrying their own religion, were tossed and tossed themselves onto palestinian land; they carried
    the exact goal of destroying another group of people, innocent people, the palestinians. Simple land grab,
    a conspiracy of the most influential world powers and organized jewry at the expense of the natives.

  37. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 4:33 pm

    Silly me. Who would have guessed that history buff would have discovered the secret plan?

    Hey, snowflake, wake up! You're dreaming again.

  38. Joachim Martillo says:
    February 22, 2009 at 4:36 pm

    A significant portion of the Jewish community has been advocating the starvation of Palestinians for a long time. Click here and then click the very last URL.

  39. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 4:44 pm

    Or perhaps our little snowflake is that one idiot that believes Phil's bullshit?

  40. Snowflake, the individual says:
    February 22, 2009 at 5:12 pm

    "I am snowflake!" "No, I am snowflake!" "me too!"

    chris =SOG=Thom=Suzanne et seq.

    All zionists. Check out Joachim's reference–you non-zionists will find the facts there and the wonderful context historical given–light to the inquiring world of non-zionists.

  41. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 6:26 pm

    Actually, reading Joachim is the same as reading bullshit, as our little snowflake knows.

  42. Duscany says:
    February 22, 2009 at 6:56 pm

    Berel: "Throughout history, there does not appear to have been such a systematic attempt to erradicate a people as occurred during the Holocaust."

    Genocide is common throughout history. A recent example which nobody much discusses these days is the Ukrainian genocide in the thirties in which Bolsheviks killed perhaps 7 million kulaks. Fear that the communists would do the same thing in Germany was a major factor in Hitler's rise to power.

  43. Citizen says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:01 pm

    @ Julian

    How nice of the jews to offer bones off the table to the original owners of the home. Now, why don't you look at the meaty facts of what gracious Jabotinsky has wrought? KKK leaders have echoed Jabotinsky often. The difference in response between Israel and the USA is that the USA majority is gentile, as were its founders.

  44. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:09 pm

    While Genocide is common, Stalin did not invade Italy and remove the Ukranians living there to exterminate them. Stalin did not invade Germany, round up the Ukranians living there and have the exterminated. Stalin did invade Finland, but he did not round up the Ukranians living there for execution.

  45. Citizen says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:15 pm

    chris berel, you don"t make a pimple on Joachim' s buttocks. Onlookers, please check out Joachim' s blog,
    where you will see a very evidentiary support of objective realtiy. Compare Joachim's self-educated POV
    with chris berel's. No contest. chris berel is a racist dummy. Jews come in all colors.

  46. chris berel says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:18 pm

    Of course not. You do, however, make a pimple of Joachim's ass.

  47. Alice says:
    February 22, 2009 at 7:27 pm

    Stalin, surrounded by jewish women, eventually decided, despite his jewish whores, that jews were not good for the USSR population, or his own continued top slot in power. Stalin is most objectively viewed
    as a later form of middle ages goy noble, who needed the jews to pay for his expensive whims. Things change, but remain the same. The current USA government is merely the latest manifestation. The results will follow. Future jews will not see this. Neither will the non-jews. The forecast: Auschwitz 11. The cycle will be repeated, headed for Auschwitz III. So, what's new bubie?

  48. chris berel says:
    February 23, 2009 at 7:11 am

    Thank you for that wonderful antisemitic blurb, alice.

  49. Thom says:
    February 23, 2009 at 9:19 am

    @Phil

    You are half right. One Jewish prisoner is worth hundreds of Palestinian lives… to Hamas.

    All they have to do is release one man. If the democratically elected government of the Palestinians thinks that holding one common soldier prisoner is worth the price of the current war continuing, with the borders closed to all but basic supplies, then how dare you infantilize them by pretending that the decisions are all made by the Israels.

    Hamas has a choice, they continue to make the wrong one.

  50. justwatching says:
    February 23, 2009 at 11:33 am

    Every has an opinion same as they all have a sphincter circumference. chris berel's and SOG's are the largest in diameter by far comparing anyone who posts comments here. Thom and Suzanne are trying to
    compete, but they don't throw out enough direct vulgar potty & racist insults so far.

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