Comments on: Zeitgeist Alert: The two-state solution is dead http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html The War of Ideas in the Middle East Fri, 19 Mar 2010 20:25:20 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8 hourly 1 By: TGGP http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33902 TGGP Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33902 <p>Why the hell would Israelis ever agree to a one-state solution? The alternatives, however bad, would always seem preferable. I don't even think Palestinains would like a one-state solution very much. How can you expect people who are killing each other to get along and share a country? Belgium can barely keep it together!</p> Why the hell would Israelis ever agree to a one-state solution? The alternatives, however bad, would always seem preferable. I don't even think Palestinains would like a one-state solution very much. How can you expect people who are killing each other to get along and share a country? Belgium can barely keep it together!

]]> By: John Lewis-Dickerson http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33903 John Lewis-Dickerson Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33903 <p>*J Street: Defend 60 Minutes for Telling the Truth About Israeli Settlements in the West Bank</p> <p>The CBS news program 60 minutes is under attack for stating the obvious about Israeli settlements in the West Bank: there can be a two-state solution, or there can be Israeli settlements in the West Bank, but not both. </p> <p>Send a quick note to CBS to counter the right-wing flak -</p> <p>http://salsa.wiredforchange.com/o/2747/t/3251/campaign.jsp?campaign_KEY=2523</p> *J Street: Defend 60 Minutes for Telling the Truth About Israeli Settlements in the West Bank

The CBS news program 60 minutes is under attack for stating the obvious about Israeli settlements in the West Bank: there can be a two-state solution, or there can be Israeli settlements in the West Bank, but not both.

Send a quick note to CBS to counter the right-wing flak -

http://salsa.wiredforchange.com/o/2747/t/3251/campaign.jsp?campaign_KEY=2523

]]> By: Chris Berel http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33904 Chris Berel Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33904 <p>Seems that once Salsa in involved, those in the know play dead. Involvement with salsa is a sure fire way to have your cause ignored.</p> Seems that once Salsa in involved, those in the know play dead. Involvement with salsa is a sure fire way to have your cause ignored.

]]> By: Citizen http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33905 Citizen Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33905 <p>Look to South Africa. If the jews are so great, they can easily do what<br /> lower souls, white S Africans did. It would help, all you readers, if<br /> you supported the boycott of Israel, and badgered your congressmen to cut off aid to Israel. You did it for S Africa. Time for Israel.</p> Look to South Africa. If the jews are so great, they can easily do what
lower souls, white S Africans did. It would help, all you readers, if
you supported the boycott of Israel, and badgered your congressmen to cut off aid to Israel. You did it for S Africa. Time for Israel.

]]> By: delia ruhe http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33906 delia ruhe Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33906 <p>The West is just catching up on what the Palestinians and other Arabs have known for at least 20 of the last 40 years. Tony Karon's last article is a zinger in that it speaks openly of Israel's desire to just keep the peace process processing indefinitely. Until now, it's been only the most marginalized voices that have discussed this at length.</p> <p>Tony is calling for Obama to impose a solution, but I think Obama may just say that doing anything about the MEast crisis would be more trouble than it's worth--and it just might cost him his second term. If Obama has any plans at all, he will probably get Mitchell to talk-investigate-talk-investigate for the next four years. Then, if Obama gets his second term, he might just take drastic action. But the best drastic action would be to cut off aid to Israel--and Obama's got the perfect excuse: the US is bankrupt.</p> The West is just catching up on what the Palestinians and other Arabs have known for at least 20 of the last 40 years. Tony Karon's last article is a zinger in that it speaks openly of Israel's desire to just keep the peace process processing indefinitely. Until now, it's been only the most marginalized voices that have discussed this at length.

Tony is calling for Obama to impose a solution, but I think Obama may just say that doing anything about the MEast crisis would be more trouble than it's worth–and it just might cost him his second term. If Obama has any plans at all, he will probably get Mitchell to talk-investigate-talk-investigate for the next four years. Then, if Obama gets his second term, he might just take drastic action. But the best drastic action would be to cut off aid to Israel–and Obama's got the perfect excuse: the US is bankrupt.

]]> By: delia ruhe http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33907 delia ruhe Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33907 <p>...and another thing, if there is an attempt to revive the two-state solution (see Carter's new book), it will take one more war--a doozie. An Israeli civil war would be a spectacle, since 30% of the IDF is now Jewish fundamentalists--and that figure is growing.</p> …and another thing, if there is an attempt to revive the two-state solution (see Carter's new book), it will take one more war–a doozie. An Israeli civil war would be a spectacle, since 30% of the IDF is now Jewish fundamentalists–and that figure is growing.

]]> By: LD http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33908 LD Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33908 <p>Israel supported White South Africa didn't it?</p> <p>It's amazing how much slack we give those Nazis.</p> Israel supported White South Africa didn't it?

It's amazing how much slack we give those Nazis.

]]> By: Scott http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33909 Scott Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33909 <p>Okay, on another blog, someone commented--without a link, that (the great) Uri Avnery said that the Palestinians would fare better with two states; with one state, the Israelis would have the international law right to do whatever they want from the river to the sea, (and get ethnic cleansing under way)--while currently, the Pals have some status under international law which gives them some protection. I wish someone would find the Avnery link--seems to me an argument that should be weighed here. </p> Okay, on another blog, someone commented–without a link, that (the great) Uri Avnery said that the Palestinians would fare better with two states; with one state, the Israelis would have the international law right to do whatever they want from the river to the sea, (and get ethnic cleansing under way)–while currently, the Pals have some status under international law which gives them some protection. I wish someone would find the Avnery link–seems to me an argument that should be weighed here.

]]> By: American Citizen http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33910 American Citizen Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33910 <p>Everybody I know would affirm cutting off all aid to Israel.</p> Everybody I know would affirm cutting off all aid to Israel.

]]> By: syvanen http://mondoweiss.net/2009/02/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html/comment-page-1#comment-33911 syvanen Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/02/05/zeitgeist-alert-the-twostate-solution-is-dead.html#comment-33911 <p><i>Why the hell would Israelis ever agree to a one-state solution?</i></p> <p>Good question. They wouldn't, but they are in fact operating is such a way that it will be the only option left. As has been pointed out repeatedly, and most recently by Simon on 60 Minutes, they face three choices with the one state solution.</p> <p>1. A democratic binational state with an Arab majority, which as you say Israel will never accept since it means it cannot be a Jewish state.</p> <p>2. An apartheid state which from historical precedence is not sustainable. or</p> <p>3. The expulsion of sufficient numbers of Arabs that maintains a Jewish majority. At the present time this is not a viable option.</p> <p>Thus Israel is on the horns of a dilema. But they cannot give up the West Bank. The current Zionist leadership are fully aware of these options. So what is going on in their mind?</p> <p>Let me speculate here. I believe that they are considering the transfer option 3. The caveat to option 3 is that transfer is not viable <i>at the present time</i>, but it could be if a major international crisis diverts the attention of the rest of the world from the West Bank. That is why they are working so hard to provoke the US to go to war against Iran. If that happened they could have the international crisis that would give them sufficient cover to expel large numbers of Palestinians. So by this reckoning when you hear people strongly urging the US to prevent Iran from developing nuclear power, think about us providing the crisis that could bring the transfer option 3 into play.<br /> </p> Why the hell would Israelis ever agree to a one-state solution?

Good question. They wouldn't, but they are in fact operating is such a way that it will be the only option left. As has been pointed out repeatedly, and most recently by Simon on 60 Minutes, they face three choices with the one state solution.

1. A democratic binational state with an Arab majority, which as you say Israel will never accept since it means it cannot be a Jewish state.

2. An apartheid state which from historical precedence is not sustainable. or

3. The expulsion of sufficient numbers of Arabs that maintains a Jewish majority. At the present time this is not a viable option.

Thus Israel is on the horns of a dilema. But they cannot give up the West Bank. The current Zionist leadership are fully aware of these options. So what is going on in their mind?

Let me speculate here. I believe that they are considering the transfer option 3. The caveat to option 3 is that transfer is not viable at the present time, but it could be if a major international crisis diverts the attention of the rest of the world from the West Bank. That is why they are working so hard to provoke the US to go to war against Iran. If that happened they could have the international crisis that would give them sufficient cover to expel large numbers of Palestinians. So by this reckoning when you hear people strongly urging the US to prevent Iran from developing nuclear power, think about us providing the crisis that could bring the transfer option 3 into play.

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