Comments on: The National Interest, and the Israeli interest http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html The War of Ideas in the Middle East Tue, 14 Feb 2012 15:51:18 +0000 hourly 1 By: Thom http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27311 Thom Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27311 <p>Americans enlisted in the British and Canadian armed forces in WWII before the U.S. entered the war. Were they being unpatriotic by helping out U.S. allies?</p> <p>No, of course not. Oh, except the Jews who enlisted in the British or Canadian armed forces.</p> <p>Phil seems to take the position that there is an international conspiracy of Jews and that Jews are all conspiring to undermine the security of the fatherland. Now where have I heard those theories before...</p> Americans enlisted in the British and Canadian armed forces in WWII before the U.S. entered the war. Were they being unpatriotic by helping out U.S. allies?

No, of course not. Oh, except the Jews who enlisted in the British or Canadian armed forces.

Phil seems to take the position that there is an international conspiracy of Jews and that Jews are all conspiring to undermine the security of the fatherland. Now where have I heard those theories before…

]]> By: doug http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27312 doug Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27312 <p><i>Nothing anyone does for Israel while in America, using American offices, methods, manipulation--<b>no matter how treacherous or mendacious</b>--can be seen as anything but a patriotic act for the good of both countries.</i></p> <p>Ah but the T&M descriptors are value laden. Further, treachery, as derived from treason, requires aid and comfort to an enemy. Mere espionage doesn't and friends spy on friends all the time. Is Israel a friend, enemy?</p> Nothing anyone does for Israel while in America, using American offices, methods, manipulation–no matter how treacherous or mendacious–can be seen as anything but a patriotic act for the good of both countries.

Ah but the T&M descriptors are value laden. Further, treachery, as derived from treason, requires aid and comfort to an enemy. Mere espionage doesn't and friends spy on friends all the time. Is Israel a friend, enemy?

]]> By: Suzanne's logic mentor http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27313 Suzanne's logic mentor Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27313 <p>"Phil seems to take the position that there is an international conspiracy of Jews and that Jews are all conspiring to undermine the security of the fatherland. Now where have I heard those theories before..."<br /> Being applied to Muslims on your favourite hasbara websites, I should imagine.</p> "Phil seems to take the position that there is an international conspiracy of Jews and that Jews are all conspiring to undermine the security of the fatherland. Now where have I heard those theories before…"
Being applied to Muslims on your favourite hasbara websites, I should imagine.

]]> By: Richard Witty http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27314 Richard Witty Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27314 <p>"Writes a friend"</p> <p>Enlisting in IDF is an honorable thing for an individual to do, if so moved.</p> <p>And, it itself says NOTHING about "dual loyalty".</p> <p>Your angers are on your sleeve, and it is not endearing.</p> "Writes a friend"

Enlisting in IDF is an honorable thing for an individual to do, if so moved.

And, it itself says NOTHING about "dual loyalty".

Your angers are on your sleeve, and it is not endearing.

]]> By: TGGP http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27315 TGGP Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27315 <p>It used to be that leftists were internationalists that thought going over to fight in the Spanish Civil War was the best thing one could do. I'm glad some are wising up.</p> <p>Friends spy on friends, but we don't tolerate government officials that act as their accomplices.</p> It used to be that leftists were internationalists that thought going over to fight in the Spanish Civil War was the best thing one could do. I'm glad some are wising up.

Friends spy on friends, but we don't tolerate government officials that act as their accomplices.

]]> By: Julian http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27316 Julian Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27316 <p>Phil is a Palestinian firster. He has devoted his whole life to the Palestinians. He is consumed with the Palestinians. Is this normal behavior for an American?</p> Phil is a Palestinian firster. He has devoted his whole life to the Palestinians. He is consumed with the Palestinians. Is this normal behavior for an American?

]]> By: LD http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27317 LD Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27317 <p>Enlisting in any army that has occupied another people for 42 years is a disgrace.</p> <p>The IDF is a disgrace. Israel is a disgrace. A blight unto the nations.</p> Enlisting in any army that has occupied another people for 42 years is a disgrace.

The IDF is a disgrace. Israel is a disgrace. A blight unto the nations.

]]> By: Todd http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27318 Todd Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27318 <p>I think it was stupid for Americans to fight for Britain and entangle the nation in British affairs because of ancestral ties, just as I believe that it is stupid for American Jews to do the same in regards to Israel. BUT let's not confuse Israel with the British Empire! And let's not forget that when Americans were gravitating towards Britain, America was still largely made up of people who were of British stock--still stupid, but somewhat understandable. Jews, on the other hand, are still a very small minority in the U.S. and Israel is of little importance. You can always say that there was at least an upside to fighting with the British in the case of victory. We just fight Israel's wars for her, and get nothing good in return. </p> I think it was stupid for Americans to fight for Britain and entangle the nation in British affairs because of ancestral ties, just as I believe that it is stupid for American Jews to do the same in regards to Israel. BUT let's not confuse Israel with the British Empire! And let's not forget that when Americans were gravitating towards Britain, America was still largely made up of people who were of British stock–still stupid, but somewhat understandable. Jews, on the other hand, are still a very small minority in the U.S. and Israel is of little importance. You can always say that there was at least an upside to fighting with the British in the case of victory. We just fight Israel's wars for her, and get nothing good in return.

]]> By: Richard Witty http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27319 Richard Witty Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27319 <p>LD,<br /> So I assume that you regard enlisting in the US army as a disgrace.</p> <p>Is that accurate?</p> LD,
So I assume that you regard enlisting in the US army as a disgrace.

Is that accurate?

]]> By: Richard Witty http://mondoweiss.net/2009/03/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html/comment-page-1#comment-27320 Richard Witty Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:00:00 +0000 http://www.philipweiss.org/mondoweiss/2009/03/06/a-journalist-jeffrey-goldberg-whose-idea-of-public-service-was-to-enlist-in-the-israeli-army-is-challenging-the-cr.html#comment-27320 <p>The US is militarily active in the middle east to secure the flow of oil, and for no other significant reason.</p> The US is militarily active in the middle east to secure the flow of oil, and for no other significant reason.

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