Roger Cohen weighs in on Obama’s speech in Cairo:
Obama is speaking on a significant date. June 4 is the day before the outbreak of the 1967 war that led to the 42-year occupation of the West Bank. U.N. Resolution 242, invoked by Baker, called for the “withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict.” It has, with the exception of Gaza, been ignored.
The president must talk about the cost to Israel — and to U.S. standing in the Middle East — of the occupation and expanding settlements. Campfire Kumbaya about his part-Muslim family and schooling in Muslim Indonesia is not going to win over disaffected Arabs focused on dwindling Palestine. He must be honest to Israel and unafraid to address the issue of justice for Palestinians.
I said little has changed in two decades. But some things have. The wall-fence has gone up, putting some 10 percent of West Bank land on the Israeli side of the barrier. The Israeli settler population of the West Bank has more than tripled to some 300,000. A network of garrison-like settlements, roadblocks and settler-only highways has built Palestinian humiliation into the very fabric of what Baker called “Greater Israel.”
Adam Bittlingmayer, a Google software engineer recently in the West Bank, sent this personal (and not corporate) view to me on his return: “I think the most important word to repeat is ‘humiliation.’ Palestinians can be successful software engineers, they can have an espresso in a café and blog on their MacBooks, but they cannot hide from their children that they are powerless in the face of an Israeli teenager holding a gun who may or may not be in a good mood.
Gazans need help and protection – mostly from themselves!!! Hamas and Fatah have been slaugtering each other for years. I have a video of some of these murders. Youtube only has 3 seconds of it at http://www.thecooljew.net/2009/01/warning-disturb... but I found somewhere where you can see more of this at http://www.thecooljew.net/2009/01/warning-disturb... I have the original. In full-screen, it is quite shocking. The version you see is mild. This is a Hamas recruitment video. Allah is greater than all other gods, all bow to Alla the merciful!!! And you think that Israel can make peace with these killers??????
You really have no compunctions about lying, do you Adam? First you described Israel as "assassinating" a Hamas leader, with a link to a news article that said he was killed in a gun-battle while resisting arrest, not assassinated. Now you misrepresent UN resolution 242 as though it calls for unilateral withdrawal from all the territories rather than what it actually calls for, which is that the Israelis and the Arabs make a peace agreement that includes withdrawal from some of the territories (the Arabs proposed that the resolution say "all the territories" or "the territories" and it was voted down because the Security Council didn't intend for it to include all the territories). The Israelis have tried to make a peace agreement, the Palestinians turned them down every time. The problem with the Palestinian supporters is that they always act as though any deal that involves the Palestinians is binding on Israel but not on the Palestinians. If the deal says "the borders will be open in exchange for the Palestinians stopping terrorism" they act as though the deal just says "the borders will be open". Also, I find it hilarious that after the Arabs started the 6-day war with the stated intent to kill the Jews and take their land that they have spent the last 40 years whining about how the mean Israelis took their land instead. It's like a gambler's kid who complains that the casino won't give him back the money his father lost by gambling.
Irrelevant concerning the basics Roger Cohen talks about. Could you please address the article. Adam Bittlingmayer, a Google software engineer recently in the West Bank, sent this personal (and not corporate) view to me on his return: “I think the most important word to repeat is ‘humiliation.’ Palestinians can be successful software engineers, they can have an espresso in a café and blog on their MacBooks, but they cannot hide from their children that they are powerless in the face of an Israeli teenager holding a gun who may or may not be in a good mood.”
I find it hilarious that some people can still spout hasbara points with a straight face. I find it especially hilarious that they can continue to claim that "the Arabs" started the 1967 War, since their first act of war was viciously attacking Israeli bombs that were peacefully falling on perfidious Egyptian unmanned aircraft sitting on Egyptian soil. Those unmanned aircraft showed no mercy as they, by their very existence sitting there on Egyptian soil, destroyed each one of those poor Israeli bombs that fell on them, proving once again that Arabs just want to kill Jews, even if its only Jewish bombs they attack. And "some territories" is not the language of UN Resolution 242. "Territories" is the language, as in "emphasizing the inadmissability of the acquisition of territory by war". Please, learn some real history. Your post was pathetic hasbara that even the Israeli government doesn't try to peddle anymore.
Olmert foolishly tried. Abbas rejected an incredibly generous peace offer from Olmert. 97% of the West Bank and thousands of Arabs "returning" to Israel. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/arti...
You need to learn history. Egypt blockaded the Israeli port of Aqaba, a clear act of war. Didn't you learn anything in school?
OK, so you haven't bought any Palestinean software or chips or anything useful in recent times. Is this the fault of Israel? Under the Palestinean Authority, they have AUTONOMY to do most anything they want. No one is stopping them from building their own economy. On the contrary, Israel, the US, EU and UN are doing loads to help the Pals. All they want to export, though, is terrorism. If Arabs or Pals humiliate themselves repeatedly, is this the fault of the infidels again?
Actually, your reply is irrelevant. Palestinean terrorists SLAUGHTER other Palestinean terrorists – and you are worrying about… alleged humiliation?????
No, but I didn't buy any chips produced in Israel neither. And I won't in the near future. Spare me your dreamworld. I am familiar with the story. We all can witness Israel's help for the Palestinians. Magnes Zionist writes about a book you may want to read: http://themagneszionist.blogspot.com/2009/06/davi...
The incredible "generous peace offer" is a hoax invented by David Ross, wasn't it? Were aren't interested in the myth anymore.
That 242 doesn't call for the unilateral withdrawal from all the occupied territories is Israel's interpretation. The Arab position is that Israel withdraws from "all territory" and basically they have the support of International law, which Israel's interpretation hasn't. We know that Israel's argument against this is his emphasis of save borders. Are the settlements defensive shields?
Egypt denied passage of Israeli shipments to Eilat through the Straits of Tiran, which at the time was acknowledged by the UN to be part of Egypt's territorial waters. Any country is allowed to block navigation of other countries ships through its own territorial waters.(Not so in international waters.) Egypt even offered to put their territorial claims to the Straits of Tiran up for adjudication before the International Court and abide by its decision on whether it had a right to blockade or not. In the months before Egypt closed off the Straits of Tiran, 400 Israeli soldiers with 10 tanks invaded Jordan and attacked the town of Samu, killing 16 Jordanian soldiers and 3 villagers in Samu, as well as injuring over 150, mostly civilians, allegedly in retaliation for a land mine that killed 3 Israeli border police. The Israeli force also destroyed a large number of houses and other buildings in the village, as an act of collective punishment. There was no indication that anyone from the village was involved in in placing the land mine, and the rapid deployment of such a large force with such a specific plan indicates that the operation was planned well in advance of the mine attack. During this same time period, according to Moshe Dayan, Israeli forces provoked hostilities in the demilitarized zone between Israel and Syria by violating the restrictions on military movements in the zone, and then proceeded to attack the Syria forces with aircraft and even entered Syria airspace and shot down a Syrian plane over the Syrian capital of Damascus. As a result of this incident, Israel and Syria exchanged threats of attack. These are the events that lead up to Egypt closing the Straits of Tiran. I find it extremely disingenuous of you to claim that Egypt's legal closing of what it then considered its own territorial waters was an "act of war" but fail to mention that brutally attacking a Jordanian village and violating Syria's airspace while shooting down a Syrian fighter do in fact constitute acts that can clearly be considered acts of war. And BTW if you consider a country blockading its own territorial waterways is an act of war, what would you say about instituting a blockade in international waters? I know the history fine. I even understand it enough not to be taken in by sophists.
RE: Obama must 'address the issue of justice for Palestinians' in Cairo FROM 'CODE PINK': Tell Obama Where To Go. The President will be in Egypt this month and we want him to visit Gaza and see how the Israelis are using the yearly $3 billion military aid from U.S taxpayers. Sign our petition to the President today! *TO SIGN PETITION - http://salsa.democracyinaction.org/o/424/t/8434/p...
And like the Palestinians, we will destroy ourselves with them rather than return to the status of dhimmi slaves. You certainly haven't asked the Palestinians to tone down their resistance, so why shouldn't the State of Israel immolate them (and Lebanon, Iran, Syria) to prevent the genocide of the Jews Hamas intends?
off-topic update: Confessed spy for Israel Larry Franklin has STILL not begun serving his 151 month prison sentence. Federal Bureau of Prisons, Inmate Locator http://www.bop.gov/iloc2/InmateFinderServlet?Tran...
"[UNSC 242] has, with the exception of Gaza, been ignored." Umm, the Sinai Peninsula anyone? Roger Cohen is clueless.
The Arab position is not supported by International law. Why do you feel the need to lie to support your position? Truth doesn't do it for you? Then tough shit.
The UN recognized Egypt's blockade as an act of war. Thank you for your display of ignorance.
So what?
The truth was never a strong suit for phil and his ilk.
I was watching a debate on pornography one time and the guy arguing against it said that when people are asked what they want to do in school, nobody ever says, well, what they do in porn. If only I could remember who that guy is, I can tell him there's some one in this world who dreams of ending their days like Adolf Hitler.
If you think so, then I'm sure you can find the relevant passage from the annals of the UN which refers to that "recognition". I look forward to your post citing the UN "recognition". Of course, you can't because it never happened. The trouble with you folks is that you swallow all the phony hasbara hook, line and sinker without ever checking it out. Grow up and think for yourself. Check your sources. Don't just believe them because it fits your preferred narrative. One of Israel's excuses for invading Egypt in 1956 was the need for shipping access through the Straits of Tiran. Of course it was later divulged by a high Israeli minister that Israel had in fact colluded with Britain and France to invade Egypt and their primary concern was with diminishing the power of Nasser, not access through the Straits. When Israel was forced by the UN and the US to unilaterally withdraw from Egypt in 1957, the UN made clear that the dispute with Egypt over rights of passage in the Straits was not one that could or should be resolved by a resort to violence and that therefore Israel was not entitled to secure a right of passage as the result of that war. From the Secretary-General's report of January 24, 1957, in re the withdrawal of Israeli troops from the Sinai following the 1956 Suez War: "In connection with the question of Israeli withdrawal from the Sharm el Sheikh area, attention had been directed to the situation in the Strait of Tiran and the Gulf of Aqaba. This problem was of longer duration and was not directly related to the current crisis. It followed from principles guiding the United Nations that the Israeli military action and its consequences should not be elements influencing the solution of this problem. The Secretary-General concluded that upon the withdrawal of the Israeli forces, UNEF would have to follow them in the same way as it had in other parts of the Sinai, its movements being determined by its duties in respect of the ceasefire and the withdrawal. In accordance with the general legal principles recognized as decisive for the deployment of the Force, UNEF should not be used in such a way as to prejudice the solution of the controversial questions involved." http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/dpko/co_mission/unef... The UN determined in 1957 that the Egyptian denial of Israeli access through the Straits of Tiran was not an act of war, and that Israel did not have a right to obtain that access through belligerent action. It did not change its mind on this matter in the intervening years before Israel attacked the Egyptian airforce on the ground in 1967.
Oh come on Euro, when were you a "dhimmi slave"? As if there even is such a thing. I find it utterly fascinating how some Zionists can piss and moan about how the Palestinians didn't greet them with open arms, but then when asked to treat the Palestinians as equals resort to threats of violence and genocidal fantasies.
So you now consider blockades acts of war? You accept that Gazans have a reason for their ire other than mindless antisemitism?
A naval blockade has been a causus belli since rather ancient times. Probably even before Mohammed, so perhaps that is why you don't want to hear about it…. Egypt blockaded Israel and not only practically declared war but quite loudly crowed that this time they were going to push the Jews into the sea. You are ignoring reality. You must really hate Obama….
Half of Israelis are refugees from the Arab world (not Nazi Europe). Many of them were dhimmi and know the Arab world very, very well. Better than you, apparently…
This is a very important point. The formula for peace as evoked in 242 is trading land for peace. Not THE land, but SOME land for SOME peace. MORE land should produce MORE peace. MORE peace should produce MORE land. Israel has already handed over the vast, overwhelming majority of the land in dispute (ALL of the Sinai Peninsula which is itself twice as large as all the rest of Israel!, ALL of the Gaza Strip, MUCH of Judea and Samaria (west bank)) but Israel has received almost no peace at all. Of over 2 dozen Arab states (not to mention many more Muslim states), only Egypt and Jordan have signed (cold) peace treaties with Israel. Israel has handed over VAST tracts of land, Arabs have given Israel nothing but NEVER-ENDING JIHAD. Where is the rest of the peace? Will the IslamoFascists only be happy when there is no Israel at all???
LeaNeder222222: Arabs clearly cannot read plain English. Lookup 242 and see for yourself. Ignorant bigot.
Dennis Ross? Tell us: how much PEACE have the Arabs or the imaginary "Palestineans" offered to Israel? How has terrorism changed since the Pals signed peace at Oslo? More Jews killed? Fewer Jews killed? Has terrorism stopped? Or only increased????? Obama isn't interested in your myths. Be honest. Can you?
Intel Inside. Guess where a large proportion of those are made? Same for your cellphones. Same for a bunch of medications and medical devices. Developed, inspired, imagined and made in Israel. What can you get "Made in Palestine" besides nifty Islamo-Green Suicide Belts?
Numbers: Israel has handed over to Arab rule over 90% of the land in dispute since 1967. Israel has NOT received 90% of the peace! Indeed, 90% of the Arab state are STILL officially at war with Israel. Israel has PAID 90% of the price in land but has only RECEIVED less than 10% of the peace!!! It's time for the Arabs to do their part of the bargain. Or are they just sticking to the Arab tradition of cheating on all deals…. especially with infidels…???
I love it when gays and women support Hamas who despise these same gays and feminists. Someone here isn't thinking, eh?
So I take your obfuscatory response to mean that you cannot cite the UN "recognition" of the Egypt's blockade of its Straits of Tiran as an act of war, and you just pulled that "fact" out of your arse. How unsurprising.
You don't understand, Colin. Blockades in international waters by Israel are a glorious, wonderful and peace-loving thing to do. Blockades of their own territorial waters by Egypt are horrible hateful acts of war. Its all understandable once you get the double standard in play.