Comments on: I-don’t-hate-Israel looks on as colonists chop down 97 more Palestinian olive trees

By: potsherd

potsherd — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 03:36:47 +0000

WJ – to me, the important thing is the motivation. Now, it is lacking. Outrage is motivation. No one can take a path in any direction as long as inertia is preventing it.

By: James

James — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 03:30:52 +0000

wj quote “My primary focus is on the need for a path forward.” perhaps equating actions such as these on the part of israel could be defined for what they are, rather then pussy footing around… lets call the folks who did this terrorists.. that is what they are… they just happen to be israelis which must make it a bit awkward for you and others who are unwilling or unable to put the shoe on the other foot…

By: James

James — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 03:27:35 +0000

this would explain why palestinians resort to bloodshed rather then conflict resolutuion then… how else do you explain the uprooting of the trees, as anything other then hatred expressed towards the palestinians?

By: wondering jew

wondering jew — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 02:09:14 +0000

potsherd- I agree that complacency and ignorance is not the path to change and change is necessary. Outrage at murder and murderous rhetoric and the uprooting of olive trees is appropriate.

But I do not reject all support for Israel as evil. Today it is difficult to combine the urge to support Israel and the urge towards peace. I don’t believe that this is all Netanyahu’s fault, but he certainly is not my choice to lead Israel at this time. I think ultimately there is a need to discern a way forward in order to avoid violence. Though outrage is key to the discovery of the need for change it is not key to the creation of a path forward.

I accept that you view the need for change and instilling that need in others as key. My primary focus is on the need for a path forward.

By: potsherd

potsherd — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 01:21:50 +0000

WJ – the subject of the post is onlookers, people not directly involved in the conflict but concerned with it. People in the US, for example. And it seems to me that the problem is the “I love Israel” group, who look on and make excuses or refuse to look as Palestinians suffer at the hands of definitely unlovable Israelis, who cling to their “I love Israel” and refuse to admit the possibility that Israel may not be so much worth loving and supporting.

I tend to think that the solution to this situation is not precisely hate but outrage. To get in the face of the Israel-lovers with uncontrovertible evidence of the racism, the violence, the oppression at the heart of the Israeli state. To shift them away from loving Israel to questioning it, to opposing support for it.

What we are waging is an information war. The information is so strongly managed by the Zionists as to keep outrage from breaking out. I wonder how many Israel-lovers are aware of the terrorist Jack Teitel, or Yitzhak Shapiro’s fawta against gentiles. I’m sure that there are a certain percentage who know and applaud Israeli racism, but there are equally a significant number in whom outrage can take root, if they only had access to the truth.

By: wondering jew

wondering jew — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 00:57:49 +0000

Unlike chaos and mooser, Phil Weiss’s emphasis is not on hatred and he seems to emphasize a desire to see a resolution of the conflict.

By: Chaos4700

Chaos4700 — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 00:20:32 +0000

Boy am I ever glad most Jews aren’t passive-aggressive wanks who put words in other people’s mouths all the time like, you do. Do us all a favor and stop promoting that ugly anti-Semitic stereotype, huh WJ?

By: wondering jew

wondering jew — Sat, 14 Nov 2009 00:11:29 +0000

Mooser- If you feel that hatred is the best path to resolving the I P conflict, you are entitled to your opinion. Personally I disagree and think that hatred primarily is a tool towards bloodshed rather than conflict resolution.

By: Mooser

Mooser — Fri, 13 Nov 2009 23:24:17 +0000

“the “I don’t hate Israel” that is necessary to create a real solution”

Holy shit, the awe-inspiring entitlement of Zionism. In-fricking-credible! Let me tell you something, in case you are wondering jew, people are allowed to hate Israel, and many, with very good reason, do. The thing we as decent people can’t hate is the Jewish religion, or the Jewish people. But Israel, you numbskull, is a state (isn’t that what you wanted, Zionist) and people are more than welcome to hate states, and people that hate states often have a big hand in “creating” solutions to the things those states do.

The incredible, all-consuming, murder-excusing, entitlement of Zionists, like babies for a tit!
No, wondering jew, in case you are wondering, a State, any State, is not entitled to the same respect that individuals, religions and cultures are entitled to.
Especially when they, as many do (No. 4) kill people.
I know it may shock you, and you’ll wonder why it isn’t prosecutable anti-Semitism, but nobody has to love Israel as a prerequisite for doing something about it.

The Zionist credo, I swear “Maybe I killed my parents, Judge, but have pity on me, I’m an orphan”

By: Chaos4700

Chaos4700 — Fri, 13 Nov 2009 05:46:19 +0000

Culprits, WJ. One person didn't kill almost a hundred sexagenarian in a single night. Funny, those IDF patrols that are so vital to maintaining Israeli security (funny enough, mostly for those illegal settlers) always seem to miss out when Palestinians and Palestinian property is in danger. Funny, that.