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	<title>Comments on: Slaves of the peace process</title>
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	<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html</link>
	<description>The War of Ideas in the Middle East</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: VR</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125249</link>
		<dc:creator>VR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 10:26:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125249</guid>
		<description>&quot;Netanyahu is very opportunistic and savvy.&quot;

He is a murderer and a thief Witty,  so is the entire system of Zionism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Netanyahu is very opportunistic and savvy.&#8221;</p>
<p>He is a murderer and a thief Witty,  so is the entire system of Zionism.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: potsherd</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125108</link>
		<dc:creator>potsherd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 20:28:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125108</guid>
		<description>And the Peace Process wins another one:

&lt;blockquote&gt;U.S. senators visiting Israel said earlier in the day that on Monday that Washington would veto a Palestinian declaration of statehood in the United Nations Security Council.

The idea of seeking UN intervention has been gaining steam in the Arab world as the impasse in peacemaking drags on. The Palestinians seek a state in the West Bank, Gaza Strip and east Jerusalem, territories Israel captured in 1967.

The senators said the threat by Palestinian officials to take the issue to a UN resolution was a waste of time and would go nowhere. They urged Arab states to stop it.

&quot;It would be D.O.A. - dead on arrival,&quot; Democratic Party Senator Ted Kaufman (DE) told a news conference in Jerusalem. &quot;It&#039;s a waste of time.&quot; &lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And the Peace Process wins another one:</p>
<blockquote><p>U.S. senators visiting Israel said earlier in the day that on Monday that Washington would veto a Palestinian declaration of statehood in the United Nations Security Council.</p>
<p>The idea of seeking UN intervention has been gaining steam in the Arab world as the impasse in peacemaking drags on. The Palestinians seek a state in the West Bank, Gaza Strip and east Jerusalem, territories Israel captured in 1967.</p>
<p>The senators said the threat by Palestinian officials to take the issue to a UN resolution was a waste of time and would go nowhere. They urged Arab states to stop it.</p>
<p>&#8220;It would be D.O.A. &#8211; dead on arrival,&#8221; Democratic Party Senator Ted Kaufman (DE) told a news conference in Jerusalem. &#8220;It&#8217;s a waste of time.&#8221; </p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125046</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 16:10:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125046</guid>
		<description>So, your contention is that Fayyad is a puppet, and not a skillful executive?

There is a Palestinian election coming up in January. Why would you not defer to their judgement?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, your contention is that Fayyad is a puppet, and not a skillful executive?</p>
<p>There is a Palestinian election coming up in January. Why would you not defer to their judgement?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Citizen</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125043</link>
		<dc:creator>Citizen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 16:05:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125043</guid>
		<description>Witty, Vichey France eventually fell. What the US is trying to do in Afghanistan, that is, set up a puppet regime, is the same thing the US-Israel partnership is trying to do to the Palestininans. It&#039;s a bet buttressed by real power, but in the long run a recipe that won&#039;t muddle through--the cost to the Palestinians all along is obvious; and the cost to the US keeps increasing, day by day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Witty, Vichey France eventually fell. What the US is trying to do in Afghanistan, that is, set up a puppet regime, is the same thing the US-Israel partnership is trying to do to the Palestininans. It&#8217;s a bet buttressed by real power, but in the long run a recipe that won&#8217;t muddle through&#8211;the cost to the Palestinians all along is obvious; and the cost to the US keeps increasing, day by day.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: olive</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125040</link>
		<dc:creator>olive</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 15:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125040</guid>
		<description>Chaos,

That has to be one of the best summaries of the recent aspects of the conflict that I have ever read. If I condoned smoking, I would give you a cigar.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chaos,</p>
<p>That has to be one of the best summaries of the recent aspects of the conflict that I have ever read. If I condoned smoking, I would give you a cigar.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Citizen</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125039</link>
		<dc:creator>Citizen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 15:49:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125039</guid>
		<description>Every new &quot;fact on the ground&quot; makes &quot;institution-building [more] difficult; nothing has been real for a very long time now--except settlement expansion (and continued oppressive seige/occupation/and continued de facto second class citizenship of Israeli arabs). This seems to me at this moment an argument for ASAP proclaiming a Palestinian state and submitting that proclamation to the UN for ratification. The ever expanding settlements (despite the official opposition of the enabling superpower state through a whole series of POTUSs) is the only concrete reality, and its companion ingredient is always some version of &quot;the Pals aren&#039;t ready yet.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Every new &#8220;fact on the ground&#8221; makes &#8220;institution-building [more] difficult; nothing has been real for a very long time now&#8211;except settlement expansion (and continued oppressive seige/occupation/and continued de facto second class citizenship of Israeli arabs). This seems to me at this moment an argument for ASAP proclaiming a Palestinian state and submitting that proclamation to the UN for ratification. The ever expanding settlements (despite the official opposition of the enabling superpower state through a whole series of POTUSs) is the only concrete reality, and its companion ingredient is always some version of &#8220;the Pals aren&#8217;t ready yet.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125037</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 15:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125037</guid>
		<description>Thats a misrepresentation, Citizen. You have an exagerated impression of the resentfulness of self-affirming and pro-Zionist Jews.

I&#039;m not sure how you got so bitter.

Phil can make his personal choices on his marriage and children. If his relationship with his wife is a good one, that is preferable to one that would not be as fulfilling.

My argument with his anti-Zionism is that others have made different choices, which I believe that he should respect.

That, accepting is what constructs democracy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thats a misrepresentation, Citizen. You have an exagerated impression of the resentfulness of self-affirming and pro-Zionist Jews.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure how you got so bitter.</p>
<p>Phil can make his personal choices on his marriage and children. If his relationship with his wife is a good one, that is preferable to one that would not be as fulfilling.</p>
<p>My argument with his anti-Zionism is that others have made different choices, which I believe that he should respect.</p>
<p>That, accepting is what constructs democracy.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Richard Witty</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125036</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Witty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 15:25:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125036</guid>
		<description>An interesting one.

Except that there have been critical changes in the tenor of the relationship between Israel and Palestine, that resulted from the confidence of their responsible institution-building.

The changes that result from Palestinian institution-building are qualitative, in that they result in a status that is undeniable.

When interacting with Hamas or with an undisciplined and corrupted Fatah, Israel does have credibility in describing &quot;there is no one to negotiate with&quot;, and many of the events that you describe as brutal and unnecessary (I&#039;m not sure if you said that) are rationalizable as defensive in some regard.

If/when the same actions occur relative to Palestine with the rule of law confidently in place, functioning effectively, then actions like annexation of land without due process are nakedly violations of law.

That Fayyad is proceeding on the path of viability, and that his achievements are undeniable and implausible to attack on any rationale of defense, demonstrate a FAR SUPERIOR and FAR MORE EFFECTIVE approach to realize a sovereign and viable Palestine, than the path of resistance.

It is proceeding, and needs help to continue. Moral support, solidarity strategy that doesn&#039;t conflict with their goal.

One of the reasons that dissent is often accused of solidarity with Hamas, rather than solidarity with Palestine, is illustrated by this condition. So many here post condemning statements about Fatah and Fayyad, that ignore the great progress that they are making, through civil means.

In spite of Fatah actually achieving &quot;victories&quot;, radical dissent chooses the angry, rather than the successful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An interesting one.</p>
<p>Except that there have been critical changes in the tenor of the relationship between Israel and Palestine, that resulted from the confidence of their responsible institution-building.</p>
<p>The changes that result from Palestinian institution-building are qualitative, in that they result in a status that is undeniable.</p>
<p>When interacting with Hamas or with an undisciplined and corrupted Fatah, Israel does have credibility in describing &#8220;there is no one to negotiate with&#8221;, and many of the events that you describe as brutal and unnecessary (I&#8217;m not sure if you said that) are rationalizable as defensive in some regard.</p>
<p>If/when the same actions occur relative to Palestine with the rule of law confidently in place, functioning effectively, then actions like annexation of land without due process are nakedly violations of law.</p>
<p>That Fayyad is proceeding on the path of viability, and that his achievements are undeniable and implausible to attack on any rationale of defense, demonstrate a FAR SUPERIOR and FAR MORE EFFECTIVE approach to realize a sovereign and viable Palestine, than the path of resistance.</p>
<p>It is proceeding, and needs help to continue. Moral support, solidarity strategy that doesn&#8217;t conflict with their goal.</p>
<p>One of the reasons that dissent is often accused of solidarity with Hamas, rather than solidarity with Palestine, is illustrated by this condition. So many here post condemning statements about Fatah and Fayyad, that ignore the great progress that they are making, through civil means.</p>
<p>In spite of Fatah actually achieving &#8220;victories&#8221;, radical dissent chooses the angry, rather than the successful.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Citizen</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125034</link>
		<dc:creator>Citizen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 15:21:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125034</guid>
		<description>Ah, thanks all! Now I see why Witty is so hard on Phil, his boyhood buddy! It&#039;s Phil&#039;s wife--she&#039;s no hope for continuity, the miserable creature. And she&#039;s such a whiner!
A regular control freak! A huge walking heap of passive aggression!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, thanks all! Now I see why Witty is so hard on Phil, his boyhood buddy! It&#8217;s Phil&#8217;s wife&#8211;she&#8217;s no hope for continuity, the miserable creature. And she&#8217;s such a whiner!<br />
A regular control freak! A huge walking heap of passive aggression!</p>
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		<title>By: Citizen</title>
		<link>http://mondoweiss.net/2009/11/slaves-of-the-peace-process.html/comment-page-1#comment-125033</link>
		<dc:creator>Citizen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 15:15:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mondoweiss.net/?p=11082#comment-125033</guid>
		<description>Gee, Mooser, I didn&#039;t realize all Christians are white. Thanks for the that!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gee, Mooser, I didn&#8217;t realize all Christians are white. Thanks for the that!</p>
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