J.E., a student from the United States, who is currently living, working and learning in a refugee camp in Occupied Palestine, reports from the recent conference United in Struggle against Israeli Colonialism, Occupation and Racism. J.E. blogs at http://tasteofapear.blogspot.com/.
Martha Myers, the country director of the West Bank and Gaza for CARE International, a standard BIGNO (Big International Non-Governmental Organization) operating with a multi-million dollar budget in the West Bank and Gaza, said something incredible recently. Well, what she said wasn’t incredible, what was incredible was that she said it in public. . .
The really interesting part came during the question and answer period. I don’t even remember what the question was but I perked up when she prefaced her answer with (and I’m basing this off my notes) “Well I’ll probably be escorted directly to the airport by Israel or the PA for saying this but…just drive to Ramallah, there’s no room left. The only choices are genocide, ethnocide or a one state solution”
I took this to mean either a) Israel wipes out all the Palestinians (genocide) or b) Palestinians give up on Palestine and move to other countries (ethnocide). Now obviously neither of these is likely to happen which leaves us with c) one state for all. And Martha Myers is not saying this based on an ideological position, after she made her statement there were cheers among the crowd, which did seem to ideologically support a one state solution and she chastised us, saying “you shouldn’t be clapping you should be crying”.
But the facts are clear that a one state solution regardless of what you think ideologically is what we’re left with. Driving between Bethlehem and Hebron today I was reminded again just how entrenched the settler presence is in the West Bank as I passed the massive settlement of Efrat. It cost Israel 2.7 billion dollars to move 8,000 settlers out of Gaza. There are 500,000 settlers (200,000 of these in East Jerusalem) in the West Bank. You do the math.
Related posts:
- More on why some are cynical about the 2-state solution
- CBS’s Bob Simon: 2-state solution is over
- Why preserving a ‘Jewish state’ should not be an argument to save the two-state solution
- Barring 2-State Solution, Israel Becomes South Africa–Without South Africa’s ‘Solution’, Israeli Minister Warns
- One State for Palestine Conference – ‘Israel’s massacres are the price of maintaining a Jewish state’
{ 89 comments }
Let them stay as Palestinian citizens, or return to Israel if they choose.
The presence of individual residents is a different question than the strategic design of isolating Arab East Jerusalem from the rest of Palestine in particular.
There always remains the possibility of a two-state solution until the population reaches close to parity in both states. At that point, partition efforts would resemble India/Pakistan in which large percentages of the populations in both areas were forced to migrate.
How come suddenly parity matters now? It didn’t matter in 1948 when Jews were still the significant minority.
The fact is, if international law was honored and the refugee families restored to their homeland in Palestine, Jews would be the minority. Always have been.
The two state solution is a corpse with no reincarnation privileges.
Do we realize why the Divine Creator despite of being vehemently against divorce, mercifully respect the sinful and painful decision of couples to have separate lives? That they both may live in peace…
If the Islamic Palestinians and Jewish Israelis systems are fundamentally immiscible, why force them to live under one abode (one-state system)? Even the Gospel teaches, if one is not welcome in another man’s abode, leave (separate) in peace …These teachings showed the righteousness in respecting one’s right to accept or reject…the essence of separation. Let us not force the issue of having Israel and Palestinian leaders live under one state and quarrel now and then…
Lately I have read the presentation of Khaled Abu Toameh (that was reported February 4, 2009), and I thank him very much for such sensible perspectives and background over the Gaza conflict. Now, we can see the issues much deeper and broader…And it manifest some window of opportunity for peace in Gaza – as well as Israel, and Palestinians even just temporarily and local…
a) Israel, the western countries that support Israel, and the international community must allow, without intervention, the Palestinians settle and consolidate their leadership first. Of course this will not promise peace between them but it would create only one clear enemy after all (the fact that the present struggles present no clear cut enemy after all…)
b) Allow them to unify as one state, stop the siege, and allow them access to open sea under similar supervision by Israel and Palestinian authority. This will give Palestinians as well as the Egyptians a strong chance for peace, prosperity, and security…
c) This will also give chance to the Palestinian people in general to make clear discretion and responsibility whether to choose peace or war…If they suffer again, there is no one to blame but themselves, leaving Israel no moral responsibility. At the same time with such clear moral and diplomatic position, the support of pro-Israel nations would be unequivocal.
d) After allowing the Palestinians determine their leadership and unification, Israel has to offer the two-state option for a more permanent peace between two peoples…
e) If the Hamas would later insist to wage war, then at least Israel has only one clear set of motive, enemy, and territory to contend to…after all, without such measures it is constantly at war with Hamas anyway…(I think after the Palestinians have their own peace and prosperity, there is still this chance they would not mind about the Israelites for a little while…)
A current goal is to optimize the degree of self-governance, regardless of the past.
Forget the past. The present makes that impossible, Witty. Israel has been too greedy and they’ve turned the affair into an “all or nothing” gambit with their apartheid walls, exclusive settlements on stolen land and other repeated violations of international law. The Palestinians have no route to self-governance without the resources that Zionist Jews have stolen from them, so the only option left is to consolidate the societies and let modern democracy run it’s course.
I’m sorry, Witty, but the Zionist dream of Jewish supremacy was never going to work. It’s more than a century too late for tolerance of colonialist attitudes, for a start.
When Israel and Palestine societies exist separately, ‘there will be no more issues’ (between the them) on supremacy, equality, Palestinian rights, economic suppression, brutality, siege, supply shortages, rockets, IDFs, sufferings, destruction, deprivation colonists, stolen lands, apartheid, etc… what a relief to the Palestinians, Israelis, Americans, the moderate Arabs, the moderates, liberals, and the conservatives, and the whole western world!
(of course, war is distinct to issue; for there could be war without any issue…)
“Optimizing self-governance” is a euphemism for excluding Palestinians from, and oppressing them in the majority of their homeland. Whether there is one state or two, Israel must be either a secular or a Jewish-Palestinian state. (And when that happens, there will likely be no need for a separate state in the West Bank and Gaza.)
So now Witty tells us the past has no relevance …..
He must have forgotten that Zionism is based on tales of past injustice, invented to legitimate wholesale robbery. This falsified “memory” perpetrates new injustices indefinitely.
And of course, any ‘optimal degree of self-governance’ acceptable to his gun-toting and ethnic cleansing buddies would be a permanent state of racist inferiority. Or to borrow the terminology of his even more rabid friends, the naked Islamophobes, he wants the already victimised to agree their dhimmitude. Fat chance. The truth is that Israel is slipping rapidly towards a society containing most of the (religion based?) unpleasantnesses of other Middle Eastern societies, but without the strengths of those other societies.
Correct, whatever you describe it…the fact that zionism of the Jews is evil among you, there is no other plausible choice but separate the two peoles (you from them), and establish two separate states in the land…
Who points to history, the past, more than which group of people? If Israel is a democracy, as it says it is, is it talking about governing on the principle of one man, one vote? I wonder what would happen if a referendum on the best form of self-governance was given to all Israelis and Palestinians to vote on? Of course the votes would have to be counted by an outsider agency. http://www.wrmea.com/archives/april03/0304071.html
The most important thing JE says is “you shouldn’t be clapping, you should be crying.” The stillbirth of the Palestinian state is a tragedy. The triumph of evil is depressing to witness, the sense of impotence as well.
History will so record it.
The one state versus the two state solution is a perfectly reasonable issue for Palestinians, especially for those immediately effected, to discuss and debate. Sholmo Sand’s recent presentation at the Brecht Forum included his response to questions from a Palestinian who grew up in a refugee camp. Sand said the Palestinian was being lied to when he was being encouraged to think that 4 to 6 million Palestinians would be able to return to their homes in Israel, noting the millions of Turks and Greeks, Indians and Pakistanis, and Germans (at the end of WWII) who were forced to immigrate, a situation that could not be reversed. Sand pointed out that Israel was a nuclear state and that Jewish Israelis would not vote to become a minority. He said everything should be done to force Israelis back to their side of the Green Line and he suggested a state of Israel with actual rights for its Palestinian citizens could form a federation with a Palestinian state as well as with Jordan which has a Palestinian (non-citizen) majority. I am reminded of a Palestinian’s observation that shifting the debate from a two-state to a one-state solution puts the resolution for the Palestinians, i.e. ending occupation and ethnic cleansing, further into a distant future and, cruelly, shifts the focus away from the everyday plight of the Palestinians.
Great points Les.
The “one-staters” never consider how the Jewish population of Israel would react to such a solution.
Israelis being forced back to the ‘67 borders, an international Jerusalem, and full sovereignty for Palestinians is the only viable solution.
“The “one-staters” never consider how the Jewish population of Israel would react to such a solution”
They will kvetch like hell, threaten to kill their children and parents, and beg for mercy on account of being orphans, and childless. And they will, as Zionists have always done, curse God. So what. I’d screech too if I was supreme and circumstances reduced me to equality.
Oh yeah, and a lot of thenm will have to face criminal charges related to Israel’s actions. What are you gonna do, throw atom bombs at people?
I’ve never understood why people want to be rewarded for facing accountability. Imagine a guy killed your mother, raped your sister and tortured your little brother. The cops came and demanded he give himself up and he asks, what do I get out of that. Well gee, you already made your choice when you committed your crimes, bubba. Now its time to face the music. And there is no reward for being accountable for your crimes. They weren’t passing out gifts at the Nuremberg trials.
Mooser, so that is a non-starter. is that the mentality of all one-staters? is this how you’ll entice the Jewish population to go along with such a plan by telling them your going prosecute them once they accept this solution?
is this how you’ll try to convince the rest of the world that this is a viable option? perhaps its this type of ‘persuasion’ or lack there of that has gotten the Palestinians what they’ve gotten so far…… nothing.
Will these kvetching Jews kill their children and parents directly, or will they use them as human shields and use their deaths for propaganda purpose?
will this jail sentence only apply to Jews? or will Palestinians of this bogus state also be tried for their offenses. (I know, i know, the Palestinians are totally righteous and have done ZERO wrong for the last 60 years, but if they did, would they also be persecuted for their crimes?)
Let’s see Hamas rocketeers prosecuted. Strangely, Israelis I’ve spoken to really don’t want that to happen. But I cannot understand why not!
Well, younira, let’s ask David Ben-Gurion, one of the fathers of the Zionist state:
“If I knew that it was possible to save all the children of Germany by transporting them to England, and only half by transferring them to the Land of Israel, I would choose the latter, for before us lies not only the numbers of these children but the historical reckoning of the people of Israel.”
Seems pretty straightforward to me what Zionists are willing to sacrifice. Or who, rather.
Anyway, the notion that Israel can exist even on the 1967 borders is a pipe dream, too. Literally. Israeli society has consolidated and engineered itself around the twin evils of colonial expansion and unsustainable decadence in resource usage. The Israel that has been built over Palestine cannot survive without sucking up resources that rightly belong to other people. That’s what Golan and Sinai was about, ultimately it’s what Lebanon and Gaza were about, and that’s also why Israeli interests root canalled the progressive influence out of the Democratic Party post-Carter.
Thanks, Chaos. You were much nicer than I would have been.
And if Yonira wants to keep up her fantasy that Israelis weill have choices like the ones she details, and will be coaxed or persuaded into changing, well, she can think of those Israeli atom bombs and comfort herself.
Yeah, sure, yonira, that is just what is gonna happen, the world is gonna plead with Israel, and they will say: “No! A man said mean things about us on a blog once, so we won’t do it!!!”
Yeah sure, Yonira. Ah well, it’s just the grandiosity phase of the ziocaine high, next comes the paranoia and kvetching
In a one-state scenario, the refugees would, in theory, be able to return to their homes in Israel, as there would be no distinction between the Jewish and Arab side of the line.
There is a recent movement in Israel, in East Jerusalem particularly, for Jews to show up at some house with pre-1948 deeds showing their ownership of the property and expelling the Palestinian residents. The courts, astonishingly, have allowed this.
I’m waiting for some Israeli Arab to show up at a Jew’s home with such a deed and a gang of goons. There are thousands of this “internal refugees” in Israel now, but in a one-state scenario, there would be hundreds of thousands with such claims – almost all the land in Israel has been confiscated from Arab owners. And in at least one case, the Israeli courts have ruled that they have the right to get it back, although the IDF always blocks implementing the decision.
Israel has painted itself into a corner from which only mass ethnic cleansing can extricate it. They will either have to shift a half million Jews or six million Arabs.
“I’m waiting for some Israeli Arab to show up at a Jew’s home with such a deed and a gang of goons.”
Their intentions would be reported by collabarators, and the people would be arrested before they reached the house. C’mon, don’t you know how colonial set-ups work?
No way, the one state option is a road to Israel self-destruction by violating itself the intent of the Balfour 1917 Declaration – ‘favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people…’
Take note that the ‘national home for the Jewish people’ is likewise interpreted a ‘Jewish nation’.
And if Israel does that one-state option, it is an indirect self declaration confirming the dissolution of the Jewish state.
The Jews by no other means, given this momentous miracle, surrender this right and privilege through generations…
Balfour was not god.
If your point of departure is that Israel has the ultimate say, and will never accept a one-state solution, then Palestinian advocacy of a single state still could help them achieve an independent state if that demand is more difficult for Israel to co-opt or deflect. Even if it does not achieve what it proposes, the one-state idea is still an under-used source of leverage for the Palestinians (whose only true source of power is their ideas). Allowing Palestinian independence is up to Israel, and they might do it if they are faced with an alternative that they find worse.
Adam,
You forgot to make the tasteofapear blog a clickable link.
http://www.reuters.com/article/vcCandidateFeed1/idUSL459361
c’mon, reuters?
Seriously? So now Zionists are attacking journalism itself, huh?
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1125875.html
Happy now?
it was a joke, usually all that is linked on here are far left blogs. I was actually quite impressed that you used a real source of news. kudos……
You’re not actually here all that often, yonira, so I guess we can forgive your stupid, hasty, incorrect comment.
A helluva development, even if I suspect it’s just a calculation. (Like Abbas’ recent and yet apparently entirely evaporated statement/threat to not run again.)
On the other hand might not matter. Even if a mere calculation today not made seriously, a recognition that same might be the P’s only way forward, which it is.
Real test of when it becomes serious: When Israel starts drawing up the boundaries of what it will renounce in anticipation of doing so unilaterally.
$168.75 billion isn’t much to settle the entire region.
Much more was spent on invading and occupying Iraq.
There is nothing to lose for Palestinians in a one state solution in the long term.
You mean because no Israeli government will give the Palestinians anything but a rump state without full sovereignty and/or because the demographic time bomb is on the Palestinian side? If so, I tend to agree with you.
You mean because no Israeli government will give the Palestinians anything but a rump state without full sovereignty and/or because the demographic time bomb is on the Palestinian side? If so, I tend to agree with you.
There is only one solution.
And that is WW3.
And the meek shall inherit the earth.
I think you might mean the geek will inherit the earth–especially those adept at video games.
It’s not the only solution yet, Taxi. It’s… er… merely the most likely one at this point, unfortunately.
I’m sorry chaos, I’m sorry folks but we are living through dark history.
I don’t see Zionism giving up ANYTHING. Everything they say in the meantime is a sick charade.
Jerusalem will be swallowed up by the Zionists, the rage of the 1.3 billion moslems will be known, Iran will get nukes and we’ll be dragged into it.
So will China, Russian, England, France, Germany and all other countries that trade in arms or petrol.
It’s all lining up. In the big picture.
In the meantime, the birds are singing and the sky is blue, right?
In the meantime, the birds are singing and the sky is blue, right?
And there’s still plenty of weed in the jar. Whoopee!
Are you waving or drowning, Mooser?
Neither, he’s just putting out the match. Pass some over this way, Moosey old pal!
Here’s how the 2 state solution can work.
The Jews keep their state, and the Arabs give up 21 of their 22 states,
leaving them with one state, and then we would have a two-state SOLUTION!
Oh, so you’re advocating with mass genocide against 21 Arab states? With Israel’s nukes, then? Which countries specifically, or are they all the same to you?
I applaud you for unwittingly evoking the longed for UNITED STATES OF ARABS.
A very desirable dream for most Arab people (though not their leaders as they’ll all lose in fair elections).
A successful, prosperous and democratic USA (United States of Arabs) would easily swallow-up that plucked-up little country called Israel in its midst.
THEN we can have the REAL one state solution in the middle east.
fuck it’s the troll again
Adam you are dreaming.
The previous goverment of Olmert offered Abbas everything.
Olmert offered Abbas the equivalent of 100% of the territories the Arab sections of Jerusalem. Abbas wouldn’t even respond back to Olmert. Abbas then said he wasn’t even close to an agreement.
So i have 2 words for you. Palestinian Rejectionism.
The Palestinians want 2 states. They want their own state and to flood Israel with millions of Arabs for the 2nd state. What Arafat called the stages plan and what Faisal Husseini called the Oslo Trogan horse to eliminate Israel.
Do you think if the Arabs defeated Israel in a war and took over Israel, do you think they would offer the Jews a state with a capital in Jerusalem. I dont think so.
All you have to do is look at the Kurds and how the Arabs are determined to make sure their is no Kurdish state.
Please read this article.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1253820672890&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
Olmert: I offered Abbas the best deal ever
Sep 25, 09
Abbas has been nothing but a useful tool for the USA-Israeli control of the Middle East; until finally he really made it obvious when he had to reverse himself on the Goldstone Report. Too bad Shrub made the hegomony mistake of allowing Hamas to be elected in a fair vote, which has since then been ignored by USA-Israel.
“The previous goverment of Olmert offered Abbas everything.”
Correction.
Olmert not onyl offered Abbas 100% of 21% of that the Palestinians are entittled to, broken up into non connecting pieces of a jogsaw puzzle, but he made the offer (or claims he made the offer) when he didn;t have a hope in hell of convinving the Knesset to go along with it.
Hey Nomi, want million bucks? Sure I’ll give it to you. Just go to the nearest bank in your neighborhood and tell them I said you can have it.
There is no different then Hamas and PLO Rejectionists.
Both want to eliminate Israel, they just disagree on how to do it.
Fatah wants all of Jerusalem and to deny Jews have any history there.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1249418552346&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
Aug 8, 2009
Fatah: All of Jerusalem must be returned before negotiations
The sixth Fatah General Assembly decreed on Saturday that the return of both east and west Jerusalem to Palestinian control was a “red line” which was non-negotiable, and would need to be fulfilled before any peace talks with Israel could renew, Israel Radio reported.
According to the report, a document adopted by the Fatah delegates of the assembly declared that Palestinians would “continue to be sacrificed until residents of Jerusalem are free of settlements and settlers.” The document went on to state that all of Jerusalem, including the surrounding villages, belonged to the Palestinians, and lands conquered following the Six Day War shared the same status as those located within the Green Line.
Transportation Minister Yisrael Katz blasted the statement Saturday, saying that the declaration was a clear message to all those who maintained the “illusion that the Palestinians were prepared for compromise,” Israel Radio reported.
On Hamas its the same thing.
Here’s an article from a few weeks ago where Meshal says all of Jerusalem belongs to the Palestinians.
‘Force will determine Jerusalem’s fate’
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1256150048522&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
Masha’al claimed. “Jerusalem is all of Jerusalem, not only [the east Jerusalem neighborhood of] Abu-Dis. The Arabs and Muslims are [the city's] residents, and the Zionists have no claim over it,” he said.
Yeah, right, Israel only wants equal rights and justice for all.
How long can the radicals on here be silent to Palestinian lies.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=80382
Ahmed Qurei says Israel has no history in Jerusalem. Jewish Temples never existed, and Israel has been working to “invent” a Jewish connection to Jerusalem, the chief Palestinian negotiator asserted.
The real question is how long can average Americans remain ignorant of the history of the I-P situation and their own government’s heavy role in it? The answer is, as long as Zionists jews control the USA MSM and both houses of congress, which in turn rests on the fact that USA campaign finance reform does not exist as a possibility because why would incumbents voted against their own personal financial situation? It’s really basic when you come down to it. The USA congress
are nearly all whores.
This should make it clear that non-Jewish USA congress people as a whole are the problem. The Zionists are merely taking advantage of the USA political campaign system.
I mean, precisely, how political campaigns are financed. No matter where a candidate runs, and no matter his or her local constituency, big Zionist dollars can turn turn the tide from anywhere in the USA; the locals hardly count at all. McCain-Feingold made this easier. Check it out, fellow Americans.
Right,
So Israel doesn’t have to agree to a Palestinian state becasue one PLO official says Israel history is based on lies.
Netnyahu doesn’tbelieve there were any Palestinian in Plaestine before Israel came along either. I guess that means all Isrlei Jews shoudl go back to Europe then.
PA Historian & Official Deny Israel’s History in Land of Israel
Yoni Kempinski
11/4/09
A Palestinian historian and a senior PLO official have denied that the Jewish nation has any historical connection to the Land of Israel, thus continuing the Palestinian Authority’s ongoing historical revision.
Palestinian Media Watch (PMW) published an interview that was broadcast on official PA television. The interview features PA historian Nabil Alqam first denying thousands of years of documented Jewish history in Israel, then replacing it with “4,000 to 5,000 years” of fictitious Palestinian history.
PMW’s Itamar Marcus and Barbara Crook explain that Alqam may have been responding to the archaeological finds publicized by Israel in recent years, including coins with Hebrew writing and even ancient stamps [bullas] with names of biblical figures. Alqam accused Israel of creating “artificial Israeli symbols.”
The following video was broadcast on PA TV (Fatah) on Oct. 22, 2009:
In another video publicized by PMW, Saleh Rafat, a member of the PLO Executive Committee, says that Israel has stolen “cuisine, clothing [and] architecture” that were Palestinian in origin and claimed they are part of Jewish history. He denies that the Jewish Temple ever existed, arguing that the tunnels near the Western Wall of the Temple ruins are merely the remains of old aqueducts.
The following video was broadcast on Al-Filistiniya (Fatah) TV on Oct. 15, 2009:
In PMW’s report about the two interviews, Marcus and Crook explain: “For more than a decade, the PA has been conducting a longstanding, systematic campaign to deny Israel’s right to exist, first by claiming there was no Jewish history in the Land of Israel and then by fabricating a ‘Palestinian’ history for Jewish sites, artifacts and archaeological finds. Since 1998, PA academics and religious leaders have claimed that Palestinians, Arabs and Muslims all populated the land of Israel in biblical times and even earlier. This year, the Supreme Islamic Council of the Palestinian Authority declared that Arabs have been living in the land of “Palestine” since 7500 BCE.”
Marcus and Crook say that placing Palestinians, Arabs and Muslims in Israel in biblical times is historically impossible, for the following reasons:
1. The name “Palestine” as a replacement for the Land of Judea/Israel was coined by Rome only in 136 C.E., and for nearly 2,000 years Jews were the only Palestinians the world recognized.
2. Islam was established only in 610 C.E.
3. Arabs first arrived in the Land of Israel with the Muslim invasion in 637 C.E.
“PA Historian & Official Deny Israel’s History in Land of Israel”
So so most Israeli and non Isralei historians.
Adam, you are right about genocide.
Its just the Arabs want genocide.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/05/hamas-official-after-we-defeat-the-zionists-we-will-persecute-them-we-will-persecute-them-to-eternit.html
Hamas Foreign Minister “Zahar:”After we defeat the Zionists we will persecute them… we will persecute them to eternity”
May 14, 08
Hamas leader Mahmoud Zahar said Wednesday that a Palestinian state will be established on all of the land of Palestine and not only on parts of it, and that it will include “Jaffa, Lod and Haifa.”
Zahar also reiterated Hamas’ unwillingness to recognize the State of Israel and said that the group “will continue to persecute the Zionists wherever they are, after we prove that the Zionist army can be defeated – contrary to what was believed in the past, that it is impossible to beat the Zionists.”
Speaking in the Gaza Strip, he went on to affirm Palestinian right of return, claiming that the “right of return of hundreds of thousands of Palestinians is closer than ever.”
“After we defeat the Zionists we will persecute them… we will persecute them to eternity, and the sun of the freedom and independence of the Palestinians will burn all of the Zionists,” he continued
How long can Citizen, V, Chaos4700 be silent on the Arabs aims?
http://www.hvk.org/articles/1201/34.html
Sheikh Muhammed Siyam, a Hamas military leader.
“I’ve been told to restrict or restrain what I say. . . . I hope no one is recording me or taking any pictures, as none are allowed . . . because I’m going to speak the truth to you,” Siyam reportedly said at the conference. “It’s simple. Finish off the Israelis. Kill them all! Exterminate them! No peace ever! Do not bother to talk politics.”
http://www.rightsidenews.com/200904214454/global-terrorism/hamas-cleric-calls-for-extermination-of-jews.html
Hamas Cleric Calls for Extermination of Jews
Itamar Marcus and Barbara Crook
April 21, 2009
A Hamas cleric who once participated in an international conference of “Imams and Rabbis for Peace” — whose delegates vowed to “condemn any negative representation” of each other’s religions — has wholeheartedly espoused Hamas’s racist ideology in a recent Friday sermon on Hamas TV.
Ironically, this latest profession of Hamas’s genocidal racism was preached and broadcast at the start of the month in which the UN is meeting in the “Durban II” conference in Geneva to condemn Israel as being “racist.”
According to the Hamas interpretation of Islam, the Jews are inherently evil, seek to rule the world, and are a threat to Muslims and all of humanity. Therefore they are destined to extermination. In the words of Hamas religious leader Ziad Abu Alhaj, “Hatred for Muhammad and Islam is in their [Jews'] souls, they are naturally disposed to it…”
He asserts that because of the Jews’ inherent evil, the Jewish state, “Israel … is a cancer that wants to rule the world.” One can find the details of the Jews’ plan in The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, which he jokingly refers to as “The Protocols of the Imbeciles of Zion” (a play on words in Arabic). He concludes that the Jews are destined to be annihilated:
“The time will come, by Allah’s will, when their property will be destroyed and their children will be exterminated, and no Jew or Zionist will be left on the face of this earth.”
[Hamas (Al-Aqsa) TV, April 3, 2009]
He also claims that the Jews wanted to murder Muhammad.
Hey, they can say what they want, Nomi; meanwhile the “special relationship” does what it does, and arent’t you happy your kids don’t have to pay for it as the Palestinian kids are paying now?
So we have Olmert who offered Abbas everything and Abbas responds by saying,
He wants all Jerusalem with no Jews in it.
He responds by saying Israel must take in 5 million Arabs.
Abbas and Hamas are the same.
Its time to send this Holocaust denier back to Tunis.
Read this from August 09, which describes what Fatah wants.
http://www.camera.org/index.asp?x_context=2&x_outlet=2&x_article=1710
The declared preconditions to a peace agreement with Israel include:
the release of all Palestinian prisoners
opening up of Gaza borders to Israel
the resettlement of millions of Palestinian refugees and their descendants in Israel
the handover of Jerusalem to Palestinians and
the removal of Jewish residents from Jerusalem.
And yet all the radicals on here blame Israel.
Are you people deranged.
The facts are, the Palestinians are the genocidal people.
They are the ones that talk about killing all the Jews in their media and Mosques.
They are the ones who always reject peace.
They are the ones who celebrate massacres of Israeli civilians by handing out sweets.
“So we have Olmert who offered Abbas everything and Abbas responds by saying,”
Olmert offered nothing.
No one is listening to you.
nomi998,
Freakoid hasbara-robot on steroids or wot!
I just thank god I don’t know what your actual voice sounds like the way you go on and on and on and on. I mean if were so wretched as to be married to you, why I’d be jumping off a bridge for freedom at first opportunity.
If I survived that, I’d have to take a hammer to my own ears – or to the source of my disturbance.
And Jesus, Taxi, that amazing entitlement they manifest. More than anything, it’s gonna be that amazing sense of entitlement, based paradoxically enough, on their sense of themselves as victims, which’ll bite ‘em in the ass.
That is her brain on ziocaine.
I am sad to see that my assessment (a one state solution) is the only alternative. The Zionist Jews got what they wanted: “all the land from the river to the sea” (and almost part of Lebanon and Gaza were it not for Hezbolah and Hamas). Now they need to be dragged kicking and screaming away from their ancient Torahs into the modern 1950’s, where the struggle for black civil rights began in the US. It’s such a bummer when you realize that as God’s chosen racists you need to accept your “spoils of victory” (millions of Palestinians possessed of God-given human rights) as human beings and not cattle or chattel. It is a battle for Civil Rights between people with pop-guns and bottle rockets against alien druids, druzes and drones with space-based full-spectrum forward-based computer-controlled chain-gun hell-fire missiles. The latter commit war-crimes, the former are guilty of wanting to survive a genocide.
[Permission granted to DAM and others to use in rap tunes.]
Richard Witty: Hypocrit! the only State you’ll grant the Palestinians (out of your high magnificence or munificence) is a 54th State of Poverty dependent on the Jews.
I suppose its the Zionists fault that after 60 years of armed struggle all they can muster is a ‘bottle rocket’ and strapping themselves w/ vests.
Does a backwards ppl like this deserve anything better? Might is right everywhere but in Israel? would this be the case if the Israelis didn’t dominate the Arabs/Palestinians in EVER conflict they ever had? Why does a ppl keep fighting when they know they can’t win?
How bout you Cogit8, where do you think the Jews of Israel should go after this one state solution is enacted?
yonira – have you ever considered the history of Judea under the Romans?
yonira wrote:
“Does a backwards ppl like this [the Palestinians] deserve anything better?”
Sure is going to be interesting now seeing you get into debates about the fundamental nature of “ppl” like “the jews” without screaming anti-semitism given how you have so clearly declared your own belief in the validity of racial/ethnic/tribal/group stereotypes.
And Phil banned *Chris Moore* from this site?
I suppose its the Zionists fault that after 60 years of armed struggle all they can muster is a ‘bottle rocket’ and strapping themselves w/ vests.
1. You do realize that Israel owes its existence to American and European military technology? All those F-teens were built in America, right? And the tankers for inflight refueling, where were they built? And the nuclear technology, who is responsible for that? And the contracts for the next generation of Israel air power? What, sorry, I can’t hear you.
Does a backwards ppl like this deserve anything better? Might is right everywhere but in Israel? would this be the case if the Israelis didn’t dominate the Arabs/Palestinians in EVER conflict they ever had? Why does a ppl keep fighting when they know they can’t win?
2. You do realize that your argument is identical to that of historical anti-Semites? Why do the Jews and other parasitic races deserve to live, so say the Nazis, eugenicists, etc.? And why did Jews “keep fighting” against seemingly insurmountable odds during centuries of persecution? Should the Jews in Warsaw have given up? Was their battle against the Nazis any more ‘winnable’ than the Palestinian struggle against Israel?
You know what your problem is? Well, at least one of your problems. You see yourself, your own history in the death and destruction in Palestine, and it’s just too much to bear. What you learned from WWII was that Germany was the ideological power, and America the industrial power, so you have incorporated German racial ideology with American industry.
Yonira, the contradiction between your past and present will inevitably tear you and your people apart, and you’re too proud, too narcissistic, too hell bent on retribution to see it.
Do we really need any more proof that Zionism equals racism?
No need. It is a reality that Zionism is truely, absolutely, and historically a racist society…read the Bible, they were born chosen and mandated for that fact through generations…from Isaac to the present…The Bible based Christians accept that fact also. However, this racism is not synonymous to hatred, rejection, separation, animosity, intransigence, rebelliousness, enmity, superiority, prejudice, irrationality, nor oppression; for these attitudes are abominations in the Bible…
This Zionist racism according to the ancient scriptures is God’s will, ordinance, and in His pleasure…we believers, just like Job, do not question that…
A) This discussion was months ago. Seriously. What’s with the creepy stalker act?
B) You are seriously going to argue that Jesus Christ endorsed racism, huh? and that racism isn’t an expression of hatred? You’re one of those wack-jobs that voted for McCain / Palin, aren’t you?
And one more; this view is not acceptable to all reactors; In the point of view of those who value biblical studies, the war against Israel is not only against Jews, but equally against this great Almighty of the Bible who ‘ordained’ such ‘racism’ of the Jews (by avoiding marrying the heathen by grounds of faith), and by the utterances from Jeremiah to Isaiah, to Daniel, decided the fate of battles, kingdoms, nations, and empires, and whose truth and existence is judged primarily and accordingly by history…This is the Deity whose existence and whose belief at is sneered, ridiculed, and laughed at by mostly of ‘humanists’ and supporters of Palestinian Islamic militants of Gaza. By this premise, the seventh answer to the young student of Gaza is that – just like the Pharaoh of Exodus whose heart was hardened, the hearts of Israel, Egypt, and American, and the rest of the western world were hardened,… and the hearts of Palestinian Islamic militants were hardened…so the war of Gaza continues…and the suffering of Palestinians in Gaza continues…
What the hell are you babbling about? Are you mentally ill?
Does a backwards ppl like this deserve anything better?
Thats Zionism for you.
You are such a slimy jerk. First you lecture me about insulting you – and then you once again, confirm what a ignorant person you are.
Really? 60 years of continuous armed struggle?
Here’s some questions:
Who? What? When? Where?
Since you’re an expert in the history of this conflict, identify who was involved in this continuous struggle to the present-day. Then tell us if these ‘people’ are the same ‘Palestinian people’ of today. Give us the context of this struggle too. Like for example, did Israel stop all it’s forceful actions toward the Palestinians the moment it ‘won’ the 48′ War? Like were there any killings of Palestinians, either on an individual basis or perhaps entire fucking villages – after 48′?
You are so fucking ignorant. You don’t know a goddamn thing about this conflict. Brainwashed douche.
The history of the Jews under Rome is very revealing, as is the former history of the Jews under Egypt. Does anyone who comes to this blog, not see a very long term problem? And now we are confronted with the newbie Elizaeth,the wannabe Rabbo–we’re sure at least she’s not one one of those rabbis caught on Predator on cable TV. God forbid priests are equated with rabbis…
Phil: TROLL ALERT!
Oh, take it easy, cogit, I gotta go do some work and I’m leaving.
yonira: you say “where do you think the Jews of Israel should go after this one state solution is enacted?”
Reply: Open Your Eyes: The existing condition today is One State from the sea to shining river period stop. Repeat, the Jews control all of Palestine, including the Correction Facility of Gaza. All of the talk about “final status”, “reviving the peace talks”, “road map”, “peace process” is a load of horse-shit that BYahoo keeps beating out of a dead horse. The One State was “enacted” by the same “might is right” mindset that enacted the Israel of May 1948. You marched into the West Bank and said “this is mine”, ie, this is part of my State, ie, One State.
Now you Jews need to calm down, accept your one state fate, and think seriously about living in peace and co-existence with your captive war booty, and if you can’t, vacate the premises of Israel.
Couldn’t have said that better.
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