Another crack in the wall. The European Union should take over the peace process, argue William Nitze and Leon Hadar in the Guardian, because Obama has his hands full, the US has done nothing with the peace process, the lobby has an "unhealthy" role, and Europe has gotten a free ride on responsibility for the problem. If the EU took over, it could offer both Palestine and Israel membership in the European Union in exchange for making peace. Not much discussion here of borders. But an effort to save the two-state solution in a form of historical poetical justice, the authors say, because Europe began the mess. Oh, and a warning that Israel is on the verge of "apartheid" inside '48 borders.
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Europe can take over supporting Israel’s rapacious military, too.
Recent polls are suggesting that the US is turning isolationist, tired of the expense of military adventurism to which its leaders seem to be addicted. This does not bode well for the Israeli addiction.
If most Europeans are against the idea of admitting Turkey into the EU, why would they favor granting Israel and Palestine admittance? Maybe it is time that the West wash its hands of the mess, reaffirm its own identity, and force our resident Jews to declare loyalties–preferably with their feet!
I like the bit about Europe “getting a free ride” on its responsibility for the problem. It reminds me of Zionists who bring up American Indians as a way to justify their actions, while guilting Americans into support for Israel. It’s way past time for handing responsibility to the Jewish community.
What on earth would modern Europe do with Jewish Sparta’s talents? Is Persia attacking Europe? The profit margin says hands down Uncle Sam is the proper partner with Israel;
hasn’t a few score years shown this? It’s just a question of how to effectively pacify or
ghettoize the surplus people, here, and there. Nicht wahr?
The Spartans were Jewish, you know, or at least children of Abraham for whom (alone among the nations, I think) the Jews prayed as for brothers: this line of descent was ‘written in our books’ according to the Spartan King Arius (309-265) replying to a Jewish delegation. Or so we hear from the Maccabean literature and from Josephus. According to the Oxford Bible Commentary on I Macc 12 this business has ‘intrigued many scholars’; it certainly gives an excuse for some vivid imaginings.
Thus proving that the ancient world, too, was full of bullshit.
An extremely fair comment, potsherd – though it is of interest that it pleased some Jewish writers to claim a Spartan affinity and that the claim retained some hold on the Jewish imagination over the two centuries from 1 Macc to Jos. Was there some ideological likeness between the Spartan attitude to the Messenians and the Israelite attitude to the Moabites, both allegedly guilty of abominable sacrifices? This is speculation verging on bullshit, I know, and shamefully off the point in a discussion of the EU, that sturdy bulwark of the Abbas regime.
Admission to the EU is something that Israel has sought for a long time.
A more rational step would be a Mediterranean free trade zone, that Israel is functionally already a part of.
Even if Palestinian admission were not part of the package, membership in the EU in some real form, would compel an additional layer of accountability.
How would membership in the EU compel the Jewish community to take responsibility for their actions in support of Israel? If EU citizenship were granted to Israel, would you suddenly change your tune?
What tune do you think I’m playing?
I stated clearly that it would provide an additional path of accountability to Israel, that does not rest on mass movement with a high degree of animosity.
…after tying it to an exclusion of Palestinians from the equation.
Ha! Laying the foundation for Palestinian exclusion already? What a shocker.
Admission to the EU is something that Israel has sought for a long time.>/i>
There is no way Europeans are going to saddle themselves with a failing state. Israel has sought admission into the EU with a free pass on meeting the minimum requirements, which including not being an intolerant racist apartheid state oppressing MILLIONS of people under its governance through a permanent military occupation which provides the infrastructure and excuse for ethnic cleansing and colonization. It’s all diplomatic waltz with forced smiles, and never going to happen.
I know Europeans who don’t even accept Israel’s spot in the Eurovision song contest, so I doubt that accepting Israel into the EU would be very popular. The Euro elites wouldn’t be above shoving Israel down the throats of average Europeans, but I can’t imagine them doing so. Outside of Israelis, who would benefit?
Membership in EU is doubtless seen by EU as a “cheap” “carrot”. what it will buy, if offered, I cannot guess. If offered with human-rights requirements (especially regarding the OPTs), it might be beneficial unless Israel merely ignored it.
A “stick” would be better (or both a “carrot” and a “stick”). EU should demand that Israel comply with international law in the conduct of its occupation(s) and, inter alia, remove the wall and the settlers from all OPTs on a short time-scale (say by 1/1/11). The settlements and Israelis-only highways could either be destroyed by Israel or turned over to the Palestinians for their use. This is clearly both their right and their duty (as explained by the 2004 ICJ decision on the wall). supporting the rule of Law is never wrong. It is the eternal shame of the USA that it has abandoned the rule of Law (and, of course, of Israel, that it has elected a course of brazen lawlessness). If faced with demands to remove the wall and settlers — backed up by the threat of economic and other sanctions — Israel might find it prudent to make a peace offer the Palestinians could consider accepting, something Israel appears never to have considered doing so far.
What would Israel get out of EU membership that they don’t already get? Unless the EU is willing to continue to extend membership to Palestine even if Israel turns it down, I don’t think this proposal matters much.
If the USA cannot get Israel to change its tune in the slightest, as is so far post Obama’s Cairo speech, what makes anyone think the EU could? That would be just another one-way street–Israel getting more Gentile West cover and funds to do what it likes, while simultaneously thumbing its nose at the Gentile West nations.
If the USA cannot get Israel to change its tune in the slightest, as is so far post Obama’s Cairo speech, what makes anyone think the EU could? That would be just another one-way street–Israel getting more Gentile West cover and funds to do what it likes, while simultaneously thumbing its nose at the Gentile West nations.
Israeli membership in some respect in the EU is rational as it conducts so much trade with Europe. It conducts far more trade than Egypt, Turkey, certainly Morrocco, Libya even with oil.
There is no natural such relationship between Palestine and the EU.
Such a statement would only be political.
A Mediterranean or Levant free trade zone might create the fact on the ground of Palestinian peer status that you are seeking. But, that is Netanyahu’s pet, so on that grounds, likely you will object.
A ghettoized Palestinian people find it hard to conduct international trade. How hard is that to understand?
Oh it’s not hard for Witty to understand. It’s just hard for him to care.
Witty, I think the word you’re looking for is “blockade.”
Or “pogrom?” Pogrom works too, since it’s hard to sell produce to Europe when settlers are burning down your orchards.
Witty, do you just pull statistics out of your ass? What you wrote here is patently false. Again. Turkey is No. 1:
Here are the facts from the European Trade Commission.
Turkey [In 2007, the EU imported 3.3% of its total imports from Turkey]
link to trade.ec.europa.eu
Israel [In 2007, the EU imported .7% of its total imports from Israel]
link to trade.ec.europa.eu
And Witty supposedly worked as an auditor. Any guesses as to why it’s now past tense?
And Libya is only in the process of creating a Free Trade Agreement with the EU this year. They are still in the draft process, so there are no statistics.
link to trade.ec.europa.eu
“Israeli membership in some respect in the EU is rational as it conducts so much trade with Europe.”
Translation: Israel will need a new host after the US has been sucked dry.
And given our current trajectory, succession planning makes total sense for Israel. As for the poor Europeans, not so much.
Too bad for Israel, there aren’t enough gullible Europeans, I suspect.
More than 75 percent of Israeli Jews would like Israel to join the European Union, a recent survey found. Among the country’s Arab population, 40 percent support the idea. In general, six out of ten Israelis see the EU favorably. The same percentage of Israeli Jews would want Israel to join NATO, while among Israeli Arabs the idea was supported by only 19 percent.
link to haaretz.com
Yes, because apparently NATO doesn’t have enough military personnel with no compunctions about bombing civilians, huh.
EU membership for Israel and Palestine will most certainly not bring peace. On the contrary: Peace, or rather the end of the occupation, is a precondition for Israel ever becoming a member of the EU.
Then again, I don’t really see it coming in that case either, because other preconditions would include adherence to the NNPT and acceptance of the authority of the European court of human rights. Not happening.
I was particularly interested in the authors’ reference to apartheid: “Israel risks becoming an apartheid state with pariah status abroad unless it can find a way to provide its non-Jewish citizens with full civil, political and economic rights.” This does not refer to Israel’s military control over the 4 million stateless Palestinians in the territories, which bears a striking resemblance to apartheid, but to the relationship between the 80% Jewish and 20% non-Jewish components of the Israeli citizenry. I agree that the gross inequalities in these two communities may be seen as apartheid, even if it is not as egregious as the South African version. But I question what the authors have in mind. Israel has had over 60 years to “provide its non-Jewish citizens with full civil, political and economic rights,” and if it hasn’t done so yet, what event will trigger appropriate use of the apartheid label? Moreover, the notion of true equality in a Jewish State between Jewish and non-Jewish citizens is oxymoronic, even if Israel were suddenly compelled to make things less unjust after all this time. The authors obviously put some careful thought into their article, but this loose end seems very untied to me.
There was an article today on Ynet, which is currently 404ed, about the admissions committees that rule on people who want to move into a given community. It seems that a lot of communities in Israel have these committees, and it’s generally agreed that the purpose is to exclude Arabs and other undesirables.
Here’s the Ynet article, potsherd. At least I think it is.
link to ynetnews.com
Yes, that’s the one.
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