Here's a funny/weird story in the Times about NY Mayor Mike Bloomberg’s less-than-warm relationship with Senator Kirsten Gillibrand. Why doesn't he like her? the story asks repeatedly. And meanwhile he likes the other NY Senator, Chuck Schumer, and is cozying up to both Mort Zuckerman and Dan Senor as possible Senate candidates to go after her.
I'd just like to point out that, notwithstanding the fact that Bloomberg is a modern man (with a girlfriend with Greenwich pedigree), he is, as I am, culturally more familiar with Jews than non-Jews-- and all those politicians he's friends with are Jewish. While Gillibrand is a shiksa. Is this meaningful? Of course it is. I got most of my work in journalism over the years from Jewish friends. We threw around Yiddish words as a shibboleth as the non-Jews stood there with their jaws hanging-- till they learned to use Yiddish too!
Jews like to brag about how smart they are, but Jewish kinship networks are as strong as Tammany.
“Jews like to brag about how smart they are, but Jewish kinship networks are as strong as Tammany”
Please don’t smear all American Jews with the sins of your particular set, please.
Personal standards and ethics have very little to do with being Jewish, those are individual decisions.
Or are you saqying those lapses in ethic and nepotism are required by Jewishness?
I don’t know Mooser. I got my first job from a Jewish friend of my father. It turned out to be quite an opportunity. Maybe Phil needs to find different Jewish friends.
That’s what I am saying. The guy takes the worst set of Jews he can find as his examples.
So which is it? Are the Jews in America an exclusive nepotistic people, or the great repository of ethics and justice who will show the Israelis what for?
Well, they are probably both! So then what does being Jewish have to do with it?
But I agree and so does Phil, I would guess, and he is finding new Jewish friends, and all kinds of other friends, too.
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This kinship network has no small effect on Ivy League admissions practices as well.
I am very pleased that Phil continues to highlight the significance of Jewish kinship networks in contributing to Jewish success. The disproportionate representation of Jews in positions of wealth and power is a significant aspect of the political economy that some sort of understanding of the phenomenon needs to occur.
No doubt there are multiple factors involved, however, if we abandon the racial determinist analysis that Jews are genetically more intelligent than Gentiles, what environmental factors might offer insight. I think the kinship network is a significant factor. This raises the interesting question as to why this kinship group exists. Why do people with somewhat different religious beliefs (Orthodox Jews, Conservative Jews, Reformed Jews, secular Jews), and different ethnic/racial backgrounds (Ashkenazi, Sephardic, etc.) share psychological kinship with their fellow self-defined Jews?
To pursue this further, to what extent has Zionism replaced Judaism as the ideological unifier of the Jews? To what extent has perceived anti-Semitism contributed to this kinship of perceived mutual defense? How has the Holocaust contributed to Jewish feelings of Jewish kinship? Finally, to what extent has support for Israel been the organizational unifier of the Jews?
Summing up, to what extent has Zionism and support for Israel contributed to Jewish kinship and organizational effectiveness, and to what extent has this contributed to Jewish “success” in general, and to Jewish elite power-seeking success in particular? It seems to me that to talk about Israel/Palestine without discussing Zionism and its impact on both Israeli and diaspora Jews is remiss. This is a significant factor, not adequately discussed, and I welcome feedback.
“and I welcome feedback.”
And I can give you all the feedback you should need in one sentence, chump: Jews are no worse than anybody else.
When you can show me that other religious associations have spurned the temptations of temporal power, money and status, and have used their religious associations entirely for good, I’ll be ready to worry about the Jews.
All you are telling me is that Jews act like other people. I already knew that.
MOOSER- My comments and request for feedback is an attempt to further discuss Jewish kinship factors as they relate to both Zionism and Israel. The current rather obvious extraordinary success of American Jews is significant and may provide insight on a multiple of levels. You say that “Jews act like other people.” How then to explain Jewish success and Jewish power? They act like other people yet, curiously wind up on top? I am attempting to explore the organizational dynamics of Jewish success, and how that relates to Zionism. I think it is relevant line of inquiry.
You will kindly note that one of my questions asked: “To what extent has perceived anti-Semitism contributed to this kinship of perceived mutual defense?” Your response to my inquiry indicates that I pushed your hot button. That the nature of my inquiry was by definition anti-Semitic.
Perhaps, my four paragraph list of questions was a bit much to swallow, and taken, in toto, created an impression I did not intend. If you would be so kind, I would be most appreciative if you could respond to just one question. “Why do people with somewhat different religious beliefs (Orthodox Jews, Conservative Jews, Reformed Jews, secular Jews), and different ethnic/racial backgrounds (Ashkenazi, Sephardic, etc.) share psychological kinship with their fellow self-defined Jews? Thanks.
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“The Jews are so dominant, I had to scour the trades to come up with six Gentiles in high positions at entertainment companies. When I called them to talk about their incredible advancement, five of them refused to talk to me, apparently out of fear of insulting Jews. The sixth, AMC President Charlie Collier, turned out to be Jewish.”
As a proud Jew, I want America to know about our accomplishment. Yes, we control Hollywood. Without us, you’d be flipping between “The 700 Club” and “Davey and Goliath” on TV all day.
“I appreciate Foxman’s concerns. And maybe my life spent in a New Jersey-New York/Bay Area-L.A. pro-Semitic cocoon has left me naive. But I don’t care if Americans think we’re running the news media, Hollywood, Wall Street or the government. I just care that we get to keep running them.”
link to articles.latimes.com
CHARLES BARWIN- Thanks for the feedback, however, I am not that concerned with a lot of examples of Jewish power/success. My interest concerns the organizational dynamic of Zionism and how that effects Jewish tribal solidarity. How important is Zionism and Israel to Jewish kinship and how does that impact Jewish success and support for Israel. What role does the Holocaust and perceived anti-Semitism play in all of this.
I guess you’d have to go back to ancient Judaism, the Talmud, and the Torah.
A religious tribe Chosen by God to be a light unto other nations, which didn’t and still doesn’t even accept converts into the tribe (except those Reform wusses).
And the Messiah, when he comes, will rule the world from J-lem, where the master race will reassemble and study the Torah. The goy will be voluntarily accept the dictatorship of the great Jew.
A more supremacist religion is hard to imagine, especially when you get into the nitty gritty of the Talmud.
To summarize,
“To communicate anything to a Goy about our religious relations would be equal to the killing of all Jews, for if the Goyim knew what we teach about them, they would kill us openly.”
Libbre David 37
Surely this supremacism and ethnocentrism played a large role in Jewish culture throughout the centuries, regardless of persecution.
And persecution itself was built into the religion, right along with the supremacism. “The meek shall inherit the earth,” etc.
It was a religion prone to breed a persecution complex and a superiority complex in the same person.
Such a religion is built to last, but also built to experience a steady stream of conflict.
Since most of the rest of humanity was just as tribal and supremacist throughout most of history, conflict was never far away anyway, and countless other sects were undoubtedly wiped out or assimilated by the majority in all regions of the world. I’m guessing extinct sects didn’t have sacred victimhood built into their religions, and assumed the gods were on the side of the stronger clan.
Obviously the Holocaust continues to have a large, not entirely understood impact on the psyches of most Jews.
Exceptionally strong tribal solidarity and back-scratching can be rationalized as a way to make sure another Holocaust never happens again (to the Jews), just as pogroms, lynchings, and general distrust of Jewish communities undoubtedly helped justify tribal solidarity throughout the ages.
What’s interesting to me is how the state of Israel didn’t receive widespread diaspora interest, support, and in many cases reverence until after the ’67 War.
Perhaps before then the correct lessons of the Holocaust were more highly regarded than after ’67, when many Jews started to identify more with the tough guy image of Israel kicking ass and taking names. “Don’t fuck with the Jews” as a personal motto likely came into prevalence after ’67.
Another factor which I believe explains the success of Jewish solidarity is the seeming direct correlation between extreme wealth and Zionism among many Jews.
Long before Hitler, extremely wealthy Jewish bankers like the Rothschilds and Warburgs co-opted the Zionist movement from peaceful co-existence supporters like Theodor Herzl. To these Barons and central bankers, the idea of Israel was more of a vanity project than anything else.
It is commonly understood that the extremely wealthy are prone to unhappiness and questions like “is this really all there is?”. What better way to transcend this human dilemma than to play God with the Holy Land?
Extreme tribal solidarity prevents many Jews from acknowledging Zionist collaboration with the Nazis, but the collaboration was extensive, nauseating, and had little to do with the well-being of individual Jews or entire Jewish communities throughout Europe.
But I believe playing God in the Holy Land, and every place that has influence on the events of the Holy Land, is a big motivator for many billionaires and mega-millionaires. Bloomberg flying to southern Israel to watch the Cast Lead fireworks with crazed picnickers comes to mind, as do the activities of Sheldon Adelson and Haim Saban. I could name 10 others, as could you.
I think most regular Jews don’t even realize when they are beneficiaries of favoritism when getting hired by departments of companies which are owned by conglomerates controlled by billionaire Zionists with quietly expressed or unspoken hiring preferences. And to some extent you can’t blame these regular Jews for not being inclined to consider that favoritism benefited them. I’d probably be inclined towards vague notions of ethnic superiority myself.
To wrap this up, I’ll try to summarize the factors which contribute to what I see as unparalleled tribal solidarity:
Roots in the religion itself (probably still very strong now among Feith-types)
Real historic and recent (holocaust) persecution, whether or not unique
Billionaires with God complexes
Obviously near total control of mass media by billionaire Jews creates a certain narrative that many regular Jews can’t help but swallow, hook, line and sinker.
Fortunately, the American Jewish community appears to be in early stages of a major fracturing this week, after Israel’s latest arrogance.
The bigger the fracture, the more anti-Semites and would-be anti-Semites will realize that many Jews are not supportive of the commanding influence of Zionists in our government, media, and even banks and companies.
An anit-Semitic backlash would be an ugly thing to see, especially after an invasion of Iran and the collapse of the global economy.
“Jewish Americans Increasingly Angry, Radical, Split on Middle East”
link to huffingtonpost.com
EVERYBODY- In my initial comment (comment 5), I was attempting to initiate a discussion of certain organizational factors relevant to Jews/Zionism/Israel. With the benefit of hindsight, I now feel that my original comment was overly broad and poorly phrased. While I still feel that this is both an important and relevant line of inquiry, I no longer feel that the comment, as stated, is going to achieve what I had hoped for. Worse yet, I am now growing concerned that I may have inadvertently encouraged people with an agenda to promote their views in response. I apologize to all concerned.
I guess I apoligize for undoubtedly being indelicate, insensitive, overlong, and appearing to have an agenda of some nefarious nature.
I might have also better stressed how nutty I believe Christianity, Islam, and other religions to be, as well as zealous atheism. Not to mention how tribal, supremacist, and kinship network-oriented most people have been for all time.
Maybe I missed your meaning, or came to the wrong conclusions, about the details of your inquiry:
“How important is Zionism and Israel to Jewish kinship and how does that impact Jewish success and support for Israel. What role does the Holocaust and perceived anti-Semitism play in all of this.”