Five young Jews disrupt Netanyahu speech with call for new Jewish identity

Israel/Palestine
on 152 Comments

Update: The video with four of the activists who disrupted Netanyahu was just posted to YouTube.

News from the General Assembly of the Jewish Federations in New Orleans, a press release from Jewish Voice for Peace. Note the inspiring statements from the young disrupters:

TheOccupationDelegitimizesIsraelA group of young Jews with the Young Leadership Institute of Jewish Voice for Peace has traveled to the largest gathering of Jewish leaders in the US, the Jewish Federation General Assembly, to confront leaders on an approach to saving Israel’s reputation and building young Jewish identity they say actually turns young Jews away.

Five of the young adults, including 3 Israelis and Israeli–Americans, disrupted a speech this morning by Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu with banners that said: YoungJewishProud.org and and one of the below-

The Settlements Delegitimize Israel
The Occupation Delegitimizes Israel
The Siege of Gaza Delegitimizes Israel
The Loyalty Oath Delegitimizes Israel
Silencing Dissent Delegitimizes Israel

and The Settlements Betray Jewish Values
(and in hebrew:) Justice justice you shall pursue – Deuteronomy 16:20.

The young Jews faced a violent backlash from some audience members. Some audience members attempted to hit and gag Rae Abileah, a young Jewish protestor. 3 of the young Jews- Matan Cohen, Matthew Taylor and Emily Ratner were temporarily detained, but not before they interrupted Netanyahu’s speech five times with chants, and forced him to address them directly.

Two of them were captured on the conference live TV feed as they were removed from the crowd. Flipcam footage will be available later.

The young Jews’ website, www.YoungJewishProud.org,  presents the group’s Young Jewish Declaration, a compelling vision of collective identity, purpose and values written as an invitation and call to action for  peers who care about Israel and Palestine. It is also a strong challenge to elders. ["We are young Jews, and we get to decide what that means."]

These actions are in part a protest of the Jewish Federations of North America (JFNA) and Jewish Public Affairs Council (JCPA) newly announced $6 million dollar program to target campus, church, peace and human rights groups that are working to end Israel’s human rights violations through nonviolent Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions pressure campaigns. The Federations and JCPA are calling this initiative the “Israel Action Network.”  Critics say it is a “Shoot the Messenger” approach.

“We’re here to call out the elephant in the middle of the room. Israel continues to expropriate Palestinian land for Jewish-only communities, passes increasingly racist laws in the Knesset, the foreign minister wants to strip Palestinian citizens of their citizenship — these are the reasons Israel is becoming a pariah in the world, NOT the human rights groups that are using nonviolent economic pressure to hold Israel accountable. We would be dismissing the values we were raised on if we did not speak up.”
Eitan Issacson, Israeli-American, Seattle

“The Jewish establishment thinks that all we want are free trips to Israel and feel-good service projects. That is in insult to our intelligence and to the Jewish values we were brought up on. What we want is for the American Jewish community to stand up and say that Israel’s ongoing violations of Palestinian human rights are wrong and that we will not continue to support it with our dollars, our political strength and our moral abilities. We are the next generation of American Jews, proud of our heritage, strongly committed to Jewish life. We live our Jewish values in opposing Israel’s human rights violations and we invite – no, implore –all Jews to join in this urgent struggle.”
Hanna King, Swarthmore College, Philadelphia

“We were surprised by how many other young Jews were enthusiastic about the perspective that we brought to the General Assembly. It was scary to ask questions of sometimes hostile panelists, but in fact many people our age were supportive and even asked their own critical questions. We realized this is a terrific opportunity to organize.” Antonia House, graduate student, NYU

“Right now, the choice for those of us who care about the future of Israel and Palestine is between the status quo— which includes continued settlement expansion, the siege of Gaza, and the racist Israeli foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman– or Boycotts, Divestment and Sanctions. Given that choice, Boycotts, Divestment and Sanctions will win every time.”  Matan Cohen, Israeli, Hampshire College

The students also announced the creation of a spoof Birthright Trip called Taglit-Lekulanu http://taglit-lekulanu.org/ , Birthright for All, open to Palestinian and Jewish-Americans which they followed up with a spoof denial. The goal of the spoof was to highlight the one-sided narrative that Birthright presents, the ways it renders Palestinians invisible. The rebuttal laid bare the problematic assumptions underlying Birthright such as the emphasis on marrying Jews and procreating. http://taglit-lekulanu.org/

152 Responses

  1. Citizen
    November 8, 2010, 3:20 pm

    Do I see a pair of older antlers in there? Bravo to these kids.

    • MRW
      November 8, 2010, 9:44 pm

      Ditto. Bravo! And they have a great homepage. All power to them.

  2. maximalistNarrative
    November 8, 2010, 3:37 pm

    Clearly Settlements do not betray Jewish values because one of the core tenets of Judaism is to settle the Land of Israel.

    • Danaa
      November 8, 2010, 5:21 pm

      MaxNar, if that’s what you think then you clearly know nothing of Jewish values. Are you perchance a christian zionist? maybe a poorly instructed recent chabad convert with a score to settle? a kahanist skin-head?

      Just wondering because your “Jewish values” is a canard that is sadly out of date….

      maybe you should go learn something (from eg, the talmud?), instead of trolling aimlessly places where you are clearly out-classed and – given the civility you are accorded here – over-valued…..

      • Kathleen
        November 8, 2010, 9:18 pm

        it is in that book the Bible written by a bunch of Jewish guys

    • potsherd
      November 8, 2010, 5:54 pm

      Exodus 20:17 “Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that [is] thy neighbour’s.”

      THAT is Judaism.

      • Mooser
        November 8, 2010, 6:01 pm

        No Potsherd, that is pre-’67 Judaism. The New Post Six Day War Dispensation takes precedence now.

        Oh and all that stuff about how God, speaking through the Prophets, told us we didn’t live up to his Commandments, and all that? All wipoed out by the founding of Israel and winning the Six-Day War.
        It’s a new day, bubele!

      • Bumblebye
        November 8, 2010, 6:09 pm

        maxN probably subscribes to the settler translation of that, which would claim that your “neighbor” is a fellow Jew, not a non-Jew. Non-Jews, well, it’s no holds barred.

      • Mooser
        November 8, 2010, 8:26 pm

        “Non-Jews, well, it’s no holds barred.”

        Now isn’t that a great attitude to take when you are a tiny, tiny minority of the world’s population, a tiny gene puddle likely to dry up at any time. Got to end in success, that strategy!

      • Kathleen
        November 8, 2010, 9:22 pm

        DEUTERONOMY
        4:1 Now therefore hearken, O Israel, unto the statutes and unto the judgments, which I teach you, for to do them, that ye may live, and go in and possess the land which the LORD God of your fathers giveth you.

        7:1 When the LORD thy God shall bring thee into the land whither thou goest to possess it, and hath cast out many nations before thee, the Hittites, and the Girgashites, and the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, and the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and mightier than thou;

        7:2 And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them:

        7:5 But thus shall ye deal with them; ye shall destroy their altars, and break down their images, and cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire.

        7:6 For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God: the LORD thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

        7:16 And thou shalt consume all the people which the LORD thy God shall deliver thee; thine eye shall have no pity upon them:

        7:21 Thou shalt not be affrighted at them: for the LORD thy God is among you, a mighty God and terrible.

        7:23 But the LORD thy God shall deliver them unto thee, and shall destroy them with a mighty destruction, until they be destroyed.

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 11:27 pm

        What are you trying to prove, Kathleen? That the Bible has some violent passages? Should I start quoting the Qu’ran?

      • Citizen
        November 9, 2010, 8:28 am

        Right, hophmi, the Qu’ran is THE standard for the USA.

      • thankgodimatheist
        November 9, 2010, 8:59 am

        “Should I start quoting the Qu’ran?”

        hophmi, I’m not a Muslim and I shouldn’t care but I can still defy you to find me ONE passage in the Qur’an where you see sanction of theft!

      • thankgodimatheist
        November 9, 2010, 9:03 am

        Not violence, it’s in all “holy” books..Just theft!!

      • eljay
        November 9, 2010, 9:14 am

        >> That the Bible has some violent passages?

        Some? It has plenty! And in the hands of self-righteous, hate-mongering, religiously-deluded fanatics – such as can be found in Israel today – they are as dangerous as the violent passages found in the Qu’ran.

      • Bumblebye
        November 9, 2010, 10:18 am

        tgia
        iirc there’s stuff in the Qur’an about divvying up booty after war. In modern times that would count as theft in international law. As far as I know, only extremists would set such religious text above international law nowadays.

      • Antidote
        November 9, 2010, 7:20 pm

        also works with Goethe’s Faust or Nietzsche’s Zarathustra

    • Shmuel
      November 8, 2010, 6:38 pm

      one of the core tenets of Judaism is to settle the Land of Israel

      That must be why Maimonides didn’t include it in his Book of Precepts.

      Whether it is a religious obligation at all has been a matter of dispute since the days of the Talmud. It has certainly not been considered anything resembling a “core tenet of Judaism” by the vast majority of rabbinic authorities for most of Jewish history. Even Nahmanides’ position on the “commandment” to settle the Land of Israel has been blown out of all proportion by Zionist rabbis, and particularly the disciples of A.I Kook and his son Z.Y. Kook.

      • Richard Witty
        November 8, 2010, 6:57 pm

        I too read in daily prayers and Torah study, the obligation to settle the land.

        And, at the same time, the prohibition to covet possessions, including land, and Abraham’s negotiation for the Caves of Machpelah (rather than being granted them by divine decree), and the prayer after the Shmah declaring “IF you keep my commandments, I will give you the rain in its time….”

        “If you fail, you will be removed from the land” (paraphrase).

        The theological argument to be made is whether the commandments emphasize the ethical (in relation within Jewish community and inter-community) or emphasize the acquisitive.

        I think the answer is obvious. That is that the ethical is most important. That is what invites the messianic times and character.

        But, it is also the obligation of Jews to settle the land legally. Those among the settlers that think similarly support a single-state solution for that reason, that there would be no prohibition or inhibition from them buying much land in the West Bank and making it Jewish land by settlement and purchase, not by expropriation.

      • Shmuel
        November 8, 2010, 7:12 pm

        Without getting into the concept of “a precept fulfilled by transgression,” Richard, where have you seen this obligation? Which prayers? Which passages? Asking God to “gather in our exiles” or hoping “to behold God’s return to Zion”, do not count as obligations to settle the land. Nor do biblical injunctions referring to a specific time and place. We’ve had millennia of Rabbinic tradition in the interim, and that is simply not how Judaism developed. To the extent that some religious authorities do recognise such an obligation it is generally personal rather than national, and is by no means a “core tenet”.

        “Justice justice pursue”, on the other hand, is indeed a core tenet of Judaism.

      • Shingo
        November 8, 2010, 7:14 pm

        “I too read in daily prayers and Torah study, the obligation to settle the land.”

        There is no such thing. The Talmud forbids it. The Jews are sworn not to go up from Exile to the Land of Israel en masse and not to rebel against the other nations.

        Have you never heard of the 3 oaths Witty?

      • Mooser
        November 8, 2010, 8:35 pm

        “Have you never heard of the 3 oaths Witty?

        Stop, stop, you’re killing me! I’m old, I can have a syncope from excessive jollicosity! I can just see the looks on their faces when you try and explain that Judaism isn’t a mixture of the Mafia, a fraternity and a real estate firm!

      • VR
        November 8, 2010, 8:40 pm

        These are the types of reading into texts which cause both nonsense and heartaches, then again there are complete volumes of this type of violence to so-called religious writing. Unfortunately it takes place in all of the monotheism’s.

        Those who read these texts with their newspapers can prove anything to the gullible. So Voltaire’s observation unfortunately becomes a reality (loosely) – those who can get you to believe absurdities can get you to commit all types of atrocities.

        When the obscure becomes the guideline, rather than the clear havoc is not far behind. In this type of atmosphere the walls are painted with allegorical absurdities. What has taken place in Palestine is what happens whenever the strong attack on the weak, it is not “divine” providence of fulfilled prophecy.

      • Mooser
        November 8, 2010, 9:12 pm

        It’s their absolutely hysterical skepticism about this that is so funny “A Judaism which stresses humility? A Judaism which doesn’t start with the Jews being God’s favorite child? What kind of bullshit is this? Are you trying to tell me Judaism isn’t a religion of landed entitlement? Anti-Semite!!”

        Zionists relate to the Torah and Talmud like someone who has only read “Gone With the Wind” up til Ashley left for the war, and assumes it all turned out like Scarlett thought it would.

      • Kathleen
        November 8, 2010, 9:23 pm

        What does it say in the Torah about treating Jews one way and Gentiles another?

      • MRW
        November 8, 2010, 9:43 pm

        Mooser….Zionists relate to the Torah and Talmud like someone who has only read “Gone With the Wind” up til Ashley left for the war, and assumes it all turned out like Scarlett thought it would.

        Thanks for the laff.

      • Kathleen
        November 8, 2010, 10:04 pm

        “Judaism isn’t a mixture of the Mafia, a fraternity and a real estate firm!” Are you sure? Although there are many Jews who have been so committed to social justice over the decades. But who go blind when the injustices of the I/P conflict come up. Really go blind. People are opening up their eyes and ears and understanding that criticism of the Israeli human rights atrocities and the I lobbies endless support of Israel does not mean a person hates Jews (the definition of anti semitism)

      • wondering jew
        November 8, 2010, 11:10 pm

        I don’t think one can denigrate the Judaic connection to returning to the land based upon the 3 oaths or the fact that Maimonides didn’t enumerate settling the land among the 613 commandments. The ability of the Jews to survive an extensive exile/diaspora was a rather unique accomplishment that involved some luck, some internal strength and some sleight of hand by the rabbis. The attitude that the redemption is for future generations is acceptable to stoics or to pre moderns, but not quite acceptable to 21st century impatience. With the prayers filled with gather the farflung and rebuild Jerusalem, it is no surprise that those who are familiar with the prayers see them as a kind of command to go to the land, no matter what the Talmud or Maimonides has written.

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 11:30 pm

        What does it say in the New Testament about beating your wife?

        (Like Kathleen’s example, nothing.)

      • Shingo
        November 8, 2010, 11:44 pm

        Superbly put as always Mooser.

      • Antidote
        November 9, 2010, 12:50 am

        by “some luck” you presumably mean that Jews were not relentlessly persecuted in their host countries. There is no way a minority only survives due to “some internal strength and some sleight of hand by the rabbis”.

      • Shmuel
        November 9, 2010, 2:19 am

        WJ,

        You are right that Zionism is a product of modernity, which has led Jews to read all sorts of things into their traditions and beliefs – not least humanism and enlightenment. (It has also led Jews of all religious streams to abandon many or all of those traditions and beliefs in favour of modern constructs, including Zionism). A connection to the Land and a longing for it is certainly part of tradition, but the core value it represents is the idea of messianic redemption and perfection of world – a universalist vision even in its most ancient, particularist form.

        Rather than combining the best of modernity with the best of Jewish tradition, political Zionism has managed to graft the worst of modernity onto the worst of Jewish roots.

      • Shmuel
        November 9, 2010, 2:21 am

        “A Judaism which stresses humility? A Judaism which doesn’t start with the Jews being God’s favorite child? What kind of bullshit is this? Are you trying to tell me Judaism isn’t a religion of landed entitlement? Anti-Semite!!”

        Very well put, Mooser.

      • Richard Witty
        November 9, 2010, 4:34 am

        “Without getting into the concept of “a precept fulfilled by transgression,” Richard, where have you seen this obligation? Which prayers? Which passages? Asking God to “gather in our exiles” or hoping “to behold God’s return to Zion”, do not count as obligations to settle the land. Nor do biblical injunctions referring to a specific time and place. We’ve had millennia of Rabbinic tradition in the interim, and that is simply not how Judaism developed. To the extent that some religious authorities do recognise such an obligation it is generally personal rather than national, and is by no means a “core tenet”.

        “Justice justice pursue”, on the other hand, is indeed a core tenet of Judaism.”

        The theological discussion is an important one, as it is what forms the ideology (the basis of action) of the neo-religious right.

        The dual nature of the religion (basis of survival and specific character of neo-messianism combined with ethical) is similar to the dual nature of Zionism – Jewish AND democratic.

        Both of those tensions are rationalized away by ideologs and opportunists. Meaning, that those that quote Torah (written, oral and interpretations) opportunistically, sin greatly and harshly.

        The fear of offending God, fear of violating the commandments, should motivate an intense and comprehensive self-inquiry, not an environment of passive acceptance of rabbinic precedent and decree.

        The political (relations within Israel, between Jews and non-Jews within Israel, and between Israel and other nations) however is only one of the fields of that self-inquiry. It is a component of “all my relations” and how one treats one’s close neighbors and family and internal spiritual life is also.

        In this past week’s Torah portion was the story of Jacob and Esau, describing a critical and formative deception. There are two ways for a community to bear that and survive as a community. (Not to suicide from guilt.)

        1. Learn the skill of rationalization to the point that one can twist any set of facts to fit one’s prejudicial agenda.
        2. Learn to forgive oneself, learn to acknowledge imperfection and to reconcile with others, learn to heal.

        As the written purpose of being “chosen” is to serve the world as a “nation of priests”, the second seems to me to be what is commanded.

        The second is uncomfortable to those that regard sins or injustices as unforgivable (by others and by oneself).

        One of the horrible long-term significances of the holocaust, one of its current effects, is that it has imprinted in many many Jews and inability to forgive, first Nazis, and then by extension any others.

        A GREAT process, that comprises a component of our skillset to actually fulfill our purpose on the planet (“a nation of priests”, if one regards Torah as a living guide), has been savaged.

        “Never again” is understandable, but when it ends there and becomes rationalized into neo-orthodoxy, then it hinders the mission on the planet that adherent Jews have stated that they have taken on.

      • Citizen
        November 9, 2010, 8:32 am

        DAMN, that’s an instructive analogy, Mooser!

      • potsherd
        November 9, 2010, 9:39 am

        Impatience is a sin.

      • Danaa
        November 9, 2010, 11:02 am

        “Rather than combining the best of modernity with the best of Jewish tradition, political Zionism has managed to graft the worst of modernity onto the worst of Jewish roots.”

        Shmuel, that’s one of your best yet. You trying to top Mooser or what?

      • wondering jew
        November 9, 2010, 11:48 am

        Shmuel- Zionism was an attempt to use the Jewish religion to form a solution to the modern problem, European antiSemitism of the latter 19th and early 20th centuries. Faced with that problem it was a reasonable response. Today in the early part of the 21st century, when the problem that gave birth to it seems so distant, you can denigrate it as being retrograde, but when it was born it was needed.

        The prayers chanted thrice daily include a prayer for wisdom, forgiveness, livelihood and good health, prayers that involve acts of will by the individual. To place the prayers for ingathering the exiles or rebuilding Jerusalem in the category of “when the Messiah comes” may be one natural way to deal with the yoke of the exile. But when faced with a present danger to take those prayers and turn them into commands for present action is a natural response.

        The genocide in Europe occurred 65 years ago and thus the present tense has its own demands on those who are familiar with the prayers, but Israel came into existence from a normal response to the combination of danger and tradition.

      • Shmuel
        November 9, 2010, 1:08 pm

        You trying to top Mooser or what?

        Thanks, Danaa. I keep trying, but never manage to make it over the antlers.

      • MRW
        November 9, 2010, 2:04 pm

        WJ,

        Zionism was an attempt to use the Jewish religion to form a solution to the modern problem, European antiSemitism of the latter 19th and early 20th centuries.

        Not according to historian Gabriel Kolko. Herzl was concerned about Russian Jews becoming revolutionaries. It was not created to combat European anti-semitism. The nice thing about Kolko is that he speaks and reads so many languages, including Hebrew.
        “Israel: Mythologizing a 20th Century Accident” by Gabriel Kolko
        link to antiwar.com

        Vienna was surely the most intellectually creative place in the world at the end of the 19th century. Economics, art, philosophy, political theories on the Right as well as Left, psychoanalysis – Vienna gave birth or influenced most of them. Ideas had to be very original to be noticed, and most were. We must understand the unique and rare innovative environment in which Theodore Herzl, an assimilated Hungarian Jew who became the founder of Zionism, functioned. For a time he was also a German nationalist and went through phases admiring Richard Wagner and Martin Luther. Herzl was many things, including a very efficient organizer, but he was also very conservative and feared that Jews without a state – especially those in Russia – would become revolutionaries.

        A state based on religion rather than the will of all of its inhabitants was at the end of the 19th century not only a medieval notion but also a very eccentric idea, one Herzl concocted in the rarified environment of cafes where ideas were produced with scant regard for reality. It was also full of countless contradictions, based not merely on the conflicts between theological dogmas and democracy but also vast cultural differences among Jews, all of which were to appear later. Europe’s Jews have precious little in common, and their mores and languages are very distinct. But the gap between Jews from Europe and those from the Arab world was far, far greater. Moreover, there were many radically different kinds of Zionism within a small movement, ranging from the religiously motivated to Marxists who wanted to cease being Jews altogether and, as Ber Borochov would have it, become “normal.” In the end, all that was to unite Israel was a military ethic premised on a hatred of those “others” around them – and it was to become a warrior-state, a virtual Sparta dominated by its army. Initially, at least, Herzl had the fate of Russian and East European Jews in mind; the outcome was very different.

        Zionism was original but at the turn of the century its following was close to non-existent. An important exception was the interest of Lord Rothschild. Moreover, from its inception Zionism was symbiotic on Great Powers – principally Great Britain – that saw it as a way of spreading their colonial ambitions to the Middle East.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 2:10 pm

        Citizen, they never read through to the end of the book. The Old Testament is basically (after a whole lot of exposition which gives a choosen pedastal to fall from) the story of the estrangement of the Jewish people from God, and the consequences of that estrangement. Zionists cannot deal with that reality. And it is a tough one to deal with, especially when you are surrounded and outnumbered by a religion which boasts of it’s saving power, and a triumph over sin and death.

      • Shingo
        November 9, 2010, 2:38 pm

        Why are you only willing to discuss the New Testament Hophmi?

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 4:50 pm

        “Why are you only willing to discuss the New Testament Hophmi?”

        I’m not looking to discuss anyone’s holy books. The question is the action, not the text. I see no need to talk about religion to people who have no interest in it except to mock it.

      • RoHa
        November 9, 2010, 5:48 am

        Ha! Maimonedes! What would he know?

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 11:01 am

        “As the written purpose of being “chosen” is to serve the world as a “nation of priests”, the second seems to me to be what is commanded.”

        A nation of “priests”? Are you out of your mind? Are you really Jewish? Do you have any idea what happened with the Jewish Priesthood? Didn’t God His own goddam Self take the priesthood away from us?
        You see what I mean? They get to about oh, like Solomon or something, and then they never read the rest of the book, or look even, at our real history.
        Oh well, like I always say, Judaism has no central theological authourity. It’s all up for grabs. You got the sheckels you got a bullhorn, you got the chutzpah you can own Judaism.

      • wondering jew
        November 9, 2010, 11:30 am

        RoHa- I was not denigrating the authority of Maimonides, but attempting to put it into the context of the religion of the people. The people say the words of the prayer book three times a day for the main prayer. Those are the words of the religion to them. The statements of Maimonides in a book accessible only to scholars is not an essential part of their religion in the same way as prayers repeated 3 times daily.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 2:13 pm

        “The people say the words of the prayer book three times a day for the main prayer. Those are the words of the religion to them. “

        Nice opinion you have of your Jewish brethren there, pardner!

    • Shingo
      November 8, 2010, 10:30 pm

      “Clearly Settlements do not betray Jewish values because one of the core tenets of Judaism is to settle the Land of Israel.”

      Clearly you’re an anti semite and know nothing about Judaism.

      The 3 oaths of the Talmud stipulate that Jews are NOT to settle in Palestine. The Land of Israel does not exist.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 8:10 am

        Thank you, Neturei Karta scholar. Did you read the part about how this applies even if Jews are being massacred?

        It is obviously a minority opinion these days. The Talmud is not a holy book. Its opinions are subject to rabbinical interpretation, and are not set in stone. Thanks for playing.

      • potsherd
        November 9, 2010, 9:43 am

        That’s a good one, hophmi. Judaism is a minority opinion these days. Now we have Zionism instead.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 11:06 am

        .” Did you read the part about how this applies even if Jews are being massacred?”

        ROTFLMSJAO! And for that you traded your foreskin, and got a chronic dry dick? Oy Vey, what gonifs!

        Hey hophmi, why not go take a dip in a baptismal font, and become the muscular Christian you always wanted to be?

        Hophmi’s comment, I swain, I the single most funniest thing I ever read here. “You mean, we have to make sacrifices to be Jewish? What the hell is this?”

        Freakin’ hysterical!!!

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 11:45 am

        I understand how Jews getting massacred is hysterical to you, since you obviously wish there were less of them. It is not hysterical to me. This kind of religious thinking, which was prevalent before the Holocaust was a disaster, and partially responsible for the way very religious Jews went quietly to the gas chambers.

        Really, I understand this is all a joke to you, and that Israel is to you a simple colonial issue to be fit into your simple worldview, but it’s really not such a big joke.

        You know, it’s interesting to explore the contradiction in championing assimilation into American culture but rejecting Israel which represents an assimilation of Jews (an unwilling one given the obvious pre-1948 tide of religious history against establishing a state) into international nation-state culture, where most nations either are religion-based or originated as religion-based states.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 2:16 pm

        I just won $20 from my wife, hophmi! Thanks, pal. I bet her yesterday you would go right to the Holacaust and how I approved of it if you replied. She said “No, he won’t be that dumb, will he?” And I says: “I got a twenty-dollar-bill says he will” She punted, and looky here, I’m twenty Semolians to the good!

      • Shingo
        November 9, 2010, 3:08 pm

        “Thank you, Neturei Karta scholar. Did you read the part about how this applies even if Jews are being massacred?”

        You mean there’s an escape clause because of the Holocaust Hophmi? In which case, your argument is bunk seeing as Hertzl case up with the settlement idea 70 years before the Holocaust.

        Trust Zionists to argue that they can veto a commandment from God.

        Thanks for playing indeed.

        “It is obviously a minority opinion these days.”

        So is the opinion that God gave the land to the Jews. 

        “Its opinions are subject to rabbinical interpretation, and are not set in stone.”

        Oh O get it. Like borders and ownership of land you mean?.

      • Richard Witty
        November 9, 2010, 3:16 pm

        I’d be interested to hear your interpretation of a parsha, Shingo.

        Care to talk about this week?

        The trick though is to persuade that your interpretation is more reliable than others, otherwise it won’t be adopted.

      • Shingo
        November 9, 2010, 3:41 pm

        “The trick though is to persuade that your interpretation is more reliable than others, otherwise it won’t be adopted.”

        It’s interesting that you refer to such persuasion as trickery. A Freudian slip no doubt?

      • Richard Witty
        November 9, 2010, 4:03 pm

        So, do you want to review the parsha or not?

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 4:54 pm

        “You mean there’s an escape clause because of the Holocaust Hophmi? In which case, your argument is bunk seeing as Hertzl case up with the settlement idea 70 years before the Holocaust.”

        Sorry, but did you forget that the Holocaust was preceded by hundreds of years of persecution? Neturei Karta would say that it was the religious obligation of the Jews to accept that persecution as a punishment from G-d and do nothing about it.

        Perhaps you share that belief. I don’t.

        “Trust Zionists to argue that they can veto a commandment from God.”

        What do you know about G-d or commandments, Shingle? Nothing. Show some proof that you actually know something about my religion before you opine upon it. It is not, in fact, a commandment from G-d to be murdered. It is a commandment from G-d to settle the land, but others take precedent over it, such as the preservation of human life.

      • wondering jew
        November 9, 2010, 11:32 am

        Shingo- Nowhere does the Talmud state that the Land of Israel does not exist. Maybe you’re saying that the laws regarding the Land of Israel do not supercede the vow and thus do not apply today.

      • MRW
        November 9, 2010, 2:09 pm

        It was tribe of Israel, not land. Israel was a man.

    • RoHa
      November 9, 2010, 5:52 am

      “one of the core tenets of Judaism is to settle the Land of Israel. ”

      If so*, that is a good reason for abandoning Judaism. It shows that Judaism is a primitive and immoral superstition.

      (*Though quite a few posters here seem to have a different take on the core tenets of Judaism.)

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 2:21 pm

        Until God chooses to e-mail, snail mail, send a registered letter, or write fiery letters in the sky with a moving finger, the core tenets of Judaism are whatever we want them to be.

        I don’t mind saying that if any of the above happens, I am prepared to change my tune on order, but until it does, the closest thing I’ve got is the brain God gave me. And I’ll use it the best I can.

        God of course, made an awful error by not telling me to listen to hophmi or Wondering Jew, but only Zionists are perfect, you know.

        O BTW, where in any, any Jewish writing does it say that Judaism is a militarist authouritarian religion?

      • RoHa
        November 9, 2010, 6:15 pm

        “all I’ve got is the brain God gave me. And I’ll use it the best I can.”

        That’ll get you into trouble. You have been warned.

        “where in any, any Jewish writing does it say that Judaism is a militarist authouritarian religion?”

        Don’t ask me. I don’t know what Judaism teaches. I only make moral judgements on what Jews say about it.

  3. hophmi
    November 8, 2010, 4:10 pm

    And the narrative presented by Birthright Unplugged is just as one-sided in the other direction, the narrative presented by the ISM and similar groups even more so. So what is your point? All of these people in world oppose Israel; can’t you raise a few million dollars? Birthright is not the world’s most expensive program, you know. It’s not a Cadillac experience.

    And what exactly is wrong with promoting in-marriage? There are around 16 million of us, not a billion and a half like the Christians and the Muslims, who promote in-marriage with, shall we say, a far stronger fist than the Jews do, despite the fact that about half of our youth intermarry. Sorry for actually trying to promote our religion.

    And procreation, my G-d. You actually wrote that procreating Jews is “problematic.” There might be more Jews! Heaven forbid. Lenni Brenner said much the same thing when he appeared at the launching of Alex Cockburn’s The Politics of Anti-Semitism and told the crowd how more and more Jews were intermarrying, that Judaism as a religion in America was dying out, and how great that was since there would be less political support for Israel. I’ll never forget how the audience applauded when he said that. That’s one reason why I find it hard to lend any credence to the protests of radical Jews who claim they are doing this in the name of the religion and talk in religious terms about how Israel is a perversion of the faith they don’t have and the religion they don’t practice. They do nothing else in the name of the religion but this, and in fact, many would be happy if the religion went away or melted into nothingness.

    Because really what Taglit is, much more than a trip to Israel, is an attempt, and a pretty desperate one, by the Federations to give young disengaged Jews a fun, meaningful Jewish experience, the kind that they can’t or won’t find here in the States because their parents don’t care, life is too comfortable, synagogues too boring and unapproachable, and total assimilation too easy. The truth is that for a lot of these kids, the trip would probably be almost as successful if it was to anywhere else so long as there was a little Jewish content. The program was designed for those kids who don’t go to synagogue except (if they’re lucky) to be bar- or bat-mitzvah’d, after (again, if they’re lucky) a bad Hebrew school program where they learned next to nothing spits them out.

    Of course, secular people see nothing wrong with any of this, because they like to bash religion anyway. The problem is that it is a different problem when the religion you bash has a few million followers, many of whom are assimilated, rather than a huge following where the critics make little difference. It’s nice and all to talk about the three dozen or so Jewish members of Congress, but outside of Joe Lieberman and maybe Eric Cantor, do any of them really observe anything?

    So it’s always interesting, Phil, when you try and hold the Jewish community to account for its success, because a by-product of it is that there is little religion left at the end of it. Success in America has come at a huge price for the Jewish people collectively, particularly for modern secular Jews, and Israel has little to do with that.

    It would also, of course, be nice if those who protested Birthright were honest about it. Only one Birthright program is known to have pushed in-marriage. It was the one I went on, Oranim, and pushing in-marriage consisted of a speech by Momo Lifschitz promoting Jews getting it on with one another and offering to fund anyone’s honeymoon in Israel if we ended up marrying someone we met on the trip. Momo left the program precisely because Birthright told him not to do this after a few kids who were the products of mixed marriages complained. So to say that Birthright pushes in-marriage is to state a falsehood. To state that they emphasize it is the direct opposite of the truth.

    All this criticism of Birthright comes from jealousy that opponents have not thought up a successful similar program. George Soros could probably fund it by himself, as could any Saudi billionaire. It’s easy to knock it. It’s harder to build it. Taglit-Lekulanu would be an interesting idea – if the organizers were actually serious about it.

    • Shingo
      November 8, 2010, 7:17 pm

      “And what exactly is wrong with promoting in-marriage?”

      Nothing if you believe in exclusivity, tribalism and racial supremacy, which is clearly the case with you Hopmi.

    • andrew r
      November 8, 2010, 7:52 pm

      People can convert to Judaism. Even people not considered white by the Zionist state.

      And you overestimate how much the Saudis give a damn about anti-Zionist causes. They care about being good imperial stooges, even if they don’t like Jews.

    • Kathleen
      November 8, 2010, 9:41 pm

      Now here is something I truly do not understand. I grew up Catholic (am not Catholic). I am French, Polish, Russian and Irish. But I do not announce any of this (if ever) when I meet new people. Feel no need. What would be the point. But I truly have noticed that most of my friends who are Jewish (non Religious) announce that they are Jewish with in a short amount of time of meeting someone new. They are not religious Jews. What is that need to announce?

      The other day I got in a question to Louis Black on Talk of the Nation (have gotten hundreds of calls in on much more serious issues, but this one was for fun) I all ready knew that Louis Black was Jewish but that was not the topic of the show at all. Why did Neil Conan feel that it was necessary to announce that Louis Black was Jewish. Now I would put money on it that the comedian Louis Black is not religious . So why announce that you are Jewish? Would that be the same for me if I went around announcing my ethnic heritage? I really do not get this.

      If a person is not practicing or participating in their Religious ancestry why would you announce that you are Jewish? Can anyone explain this?

      at 12:12
      link to npr.org
      CONAN: Let’s see if we go next to – this is Kathleen(ph), Kathleen from Athens, Ohio.

      KATHLEEN (Caller): Hi, Lewis Black. You are one of the most hysterical people I’ve ever heard. When you are on the Stewart show and you did the skit about Beck, you know, calling everybody a Nazi and then you said Mother Theresa had a mustache, Hitler must – had a mustache, Mother Theresa must be a Nazi or must be Hitler. I had to pull myself off the floor.

      But anyway, how do you keep your own personal feelings about the war, about the Bush administration getting us into the war, how do you keep those out of that show?

      Mr. BLACK: Because that’s – my job is to entertain them.

      KATHLEEN: Yeah.

      Mr. BLACK: That’s my job. And you can’t talk about – you know, when I was there, you can’t talk about the commander in chief. That’s the gig. I was allowed, and I did evenhandedly talk about Democrats and Republicans. That I could do.

      KATHLEEN: Yes.

      Mr. BLACK: And it’s – and really, it’s almost as if the politics – when you’re there, the politics of the situation don’t even enter into the equation because it’s – I was overwhelmed by the level of – I mean, and this – I must sound like a moron, but until you really see the level of service and duty and – these guys and women are unbelievable.

      And the fact that it was – the fact that they were dropped there, you really realize quickly, you know, that they had been dropped there without any real instruction, and all of the work that was done there was done really, as far as I could tell, by the soldiers on the ground.

      I mean, they had to figure out how to deal with this. And you watch that and your level of admiration increases tenfold. And in a way, I think, you know, my problem has always been with authority, and I’m sure if anybody understands that, it’s people in uniform.

      (Soundbite of laughter)

      CONAN: Kathleen, thanks very much for the call.

      KATHLEEN: Thank you.

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 11:32 pm

        Huh? This is in your head, Kathleen.

  4. hophmi
    November 8, 2010, 4:11 pm

    Apropos of my last comment: I would trade Birthright in a second for 60 million dollars in scholarships for Jewish kids to go to Day School. It would be a better use of the money.

    • Mooser
      November 8, 2010, 6:10 pm

      “I would trade Birthright in a second for…”

      Well, goody for you! And how does that have the slightest bearing on what Birthright is and does?

      • Kathleen
        November 8, 2010, 10:06 pm

        Some of the young people that I have talked to who have gone on Birthright trips have taken the time to visit Palestinian refugee camps. Some come home with the light bulbs of injustice turned on.

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 11:32 pm

        Not much. But just about everything Phil wrote is inaccurate, as I said above.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 11:08 am

        “Not much. But just about everything Phil wrote is inaccurate, as I said above.”

        I’ll be watching for the first posts on that new blog “MondoweissWatch” exposing all of Phil’s inaccuracies and mendacities. Don’t forget to send us a link.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 11:36 am

        Look Mooser, if the program throws the guy out for talking about marriage, how can you say that the program emphasizes marriage?

        That would seem to be a complete contradiction.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 10:28 am

        Actually, on second thought, it has a lot to do with what Birthright does. Birthright is not about Israel as much as it’s about created a shared Jewish communal experience for kids with little Jewish background. I think it would make much more sense to give them a comprehensive Jewish education when they’re growing up instead of sending them to Israel. Israel is a wonderful place with a lot of history, but it is not a substitute for a Jewish education. You guys think Birthright is primarily about Israel. I don’t believe it is, and I think that while it is a successful program, I would be happier if the Federations put that money into Jewish education instead. Wouldn’t you rather have a progressive Jewish day school education than an Israel trip?

        Or do you not want to see kids get a Jewish education?

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 2:24 pm

        “Or do you not want to see kids get a Jewish education?”

        Or do you not want to see kids get a Zionist indoctrination?

        There you go, Hoppila, I fixed it for you. Oh and a nice assumption of the presumption that the two are indeed the same thing.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 4:57 pm

        “There you go, Hoppila, I fixed it for you. Oh and a nice assumption of the presumption that the two are indeed the same thing.”

        Redundant much? I guess your answer is no.

  5. Richard Witty
    November 8, 2010, 4:30 pm

    How does this disruption juxtapose with the post above declaring the Zionists are disrupting the rights of free speech?

    • Danaa
      November 8, 2010, 5:27 pm

      That was not a disruption – that was a correction. Since the American Jewish federation is betraying fundamental Jewish values, wand have turned to worshipping the false idols of settlement and oppression, it behooves every proper Jew to help them find the Jewish values they seem to have lot.

      Ala, when Jewish and human stand in opposition, both will fall.

      What these young Jew did is a Mitzvah – you should applaud them for helping the flock find it way back from the desert of the soul, where the elders of a once decent enough community seem to have been lost.

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 6:04 pm

        “Since the American Jewish federation is betraying fundamental Jewish values, wand have turned to worshipping the false idols of settlement and oppression, it behooves every proper Jew to help them find the Jewish values they seem to have lot.”

        What are the fundamental Jewish values that the Federations are betraying and what proof do you have for your statement that they “worship the false idols of settlement and oppression”? It’s always easier to demonize, I guess, and you seem to know so much about Judaism.

        ” you should applaud them for helping the flock find it way back from the desert of the soul, where the elders of a once decent enough community seem to have been lost.”

        So now Jews are not decent. That’s pretty condescending. What communities are you from? And how are they more decent than my own?

      • Avi
        November 8, 2010, 7:55 pm

        So now Jews are not decent. That’s pretty condescending. What communities are you from? And how are they more decent than my own?

        Self-righteous indignation from the unrighteous. How quaint.

        It’s a pathology with julian, he can’t help it.

      • Danaa
        November 8, 2010, 8:31 pm

        Avi, is hophmi = julian?

      • Mooser
        November 8, 2010, 8:39 pm

        “And how are they more decent than my own?”

        Well, Hophmi, to start with, they are decent enough not to hunt down and kill every goddam Jew in the world, which they could do without a second thought, and using the justification you supply! They are that decent, so why not try and return the favor?

      • Danaa
        November 8, 2010, 8:44 pm

        hophmi:

        Re “decent enough” meaning as decent as any other community is or can be.

        Re “once decent enough” meaning the Jewish federation leadership which now supports the horrors of the ethnic cleaning of the west bank and the Gaza concentration camp, applauds murder and torture and general mayhem obeying ome kind of a base tribal and anti-humanist instinct couched in lots of hot air words. The assembled congregation that agrees with the great evil perpetrated in their name is indeed not a decent one.

        And the young demonstrating Jew are doing a great deed in calling upon the assembled, monied multitude to repent. As well they should before they take us all into perdition. I think you’d do well hophmi to praise them with all your might, as they toil for you as well.

        Hopefully I made myself a bit clearer now.

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 11:33 pm

        No, and I have no idea who Julian is. Avi has some problems, obviously.

      • potsherd
        November 9, 2010, 9:49 am

        Hophmi knows so much about Judaism he says the Talmud isn’t a holy book.

        Which of course cuts down remarkably on how much you have to know.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 10:30 am

        I suggest you look into what the UJA does before you knock it this way.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 10:43 am

        “Hophmi knows so much about Judaism he says the Talmud isn’t a holy book.”

        It isn’t. It doesn’t contain G-d’s name, and if you drop it on the floor, you don’t kiss it afterward.

        The Talmud is a sort of shorthand of discussions between the rabbis of old on a whole bunch of topics using the Mishnayot as a starting point. The Gemara (Talmud) comments on the Mishna and often goes off on tangents. It is a book compiled around the 2nd to 4th centuries largely for the 2nd to 4th centuries, and reflects that time. Each page of it is covered in commentary that takes up more space on a page than the Gemara itself does. It is nearly impossible to learn the Gemara simply by reading it; one has to at a minimum read it with Rashi to understand it; Rashi fills in the blanks.

        It is very easy to quote it out of context because there are so many different opinions stated inside of it.

        The Talmud, when it does come to ruling on something, is one source of Jewish law, though far from the only source.

        The only holy books in the religion are the books of the Tanach.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 11:11 am

        “It isn’t. It doesn’t contain G-d’s name, and if you drop it on the floor, you don’t kiss it afterward.”

        Hey, Hophmi, how many angels can dance on the head of your pin? Or maybe just on your pinhead.

        Funniest thread, ever!

    • Bumblebye
      November 8, 2010, 6:00 pm

      Well Richard, for starters, they’re not trying to change the law to make Zionism illegal. Their protest was more about bringing in their voices, as well as some acknowledgment of the enormous wrongs being committed in their name by the Jewish state. The Canadian meetings were in the (hopefully vain) hope of equating anti-zionism and anti-Israel speech and activity with anti-semitism and therefore illegal and subject to suppression and/or punishment by the law. You’d probably be delighted with such a result, and would then argue for “better wheels” or “incremental changes”.

      • Richard Witty
        November 9, 2010, 4:40 am

        Their statements after the demonstration were uplifting. I wrote on their site blessings to stay positive, to protest policies and practices, and to avoid demonization or generalization.

        Disruption is not what is protected as free speech. Organized disruption prohibits others’ free speech.

      • Shingo
        November 9, 2010, 6:45 am

        “I wrote on their site blessings to stay positive, to protest policies and practices, and to avoid demonization or generalization.”

        Stay positive as in sugar coat and forgive all Israeli attrocities and remember that every crime and act of violence is necessary for self defense and self governance right Witty?

    • kapok
      November 8, 2010, 7:39 pm

      To hell with that. Those who abuse the language, calling one thing by another, eg, democracy for graft or self-defense for terror, need to zip it.

  6. Antidote
    November 8, 2010, 4:33 pm

    Do I sense the implosion of Zionism? Feels like the times before the Berlin Wall suddenly opened up, and there was no looking back.

    • Walid
      November 8, 2010, 5:52 pm

      Title could have been, “Five FINE young Jews disrupt Netanyahu speech with call for new Jewish identity”. The event for Netanyahu must have brought back memories of 2002 at Concordia in Montreal when Palestinians students and sympathizers completely stopped him from making a speech.

      • Antidote
        November 8, 2010, 6:31 pm

        yeah, his last visit didn’t go so well either. Had to rush home to deal with the flotilla crisis before he could bask in the glow of Israeli flags being waved at him at some contrived Canadian-Jewish friendship gala.

    • hophmi
      November 8, 2010, 6:05 pm

      No. You sense the same radical protests as usual, and they’re, as usual, being marginalized because they have no ideas of their own.

      • Avi
        November 8, 2010, 7:58 pm

        hophmi November 8, 2010 at 6:05 pm

        No. You sense the same radical protests as usual, and they’re, as usual, being marginalized because they have no ideas of their own.

        More projection from the resident Foxman messenger.

        Speaking of genuine ideas, when was the last time you had one?

      • hophmi
        November 8, 2010, 11:34 pm

        HAHAHAHA. Avi, you’re not one to talk about genuine ideas.

      • Avi
        November 9, 2010, 4:32 am

        Your “HA HA HA” is not doing a good job at concealing your desperation. Incidentally, given the cognitive dissonance in your post, it’s clear whence your perceptions and views of Israel come.

      • occupyresist
        November 9, 2010, 4:43 am

        “All this criticism of Birthright comes from jealousy that opponents have not thought up a successful similar program. George Soros could probably fund it by himself, as could any Saudi billionaire.”

        Hophmi,

        may I ask, what good has it done the people of Saudi Arabia, that their kooky religious scholars have uncontested power and might (except when it is challenged by corrupt rulers)? And you’re saying we’re jealous that a similar program is not successful here in KSA?

        Frankly, it would be HORRIFYING for me as a Muslim if such a program actually was successful in KSA. The white-washing, the positive, upbeat atmosphere cloaked in Wahhabist-encoded messages, the selective reading of history….damn, I would be f***ing pissed off if a non-Saudi Muslim started defending this country’s corruption and pure Wahhabist doctrine without actually having lived here all their lives and suffered the consequences.

        Hey, I’m not an atheist, and I still think that this country could do with a lot less knee-jerk selective Hadith-hurling and a little more rationality and calm discourse.

        Why do you want to keep Judaism tangled down in a focus on indoctrination and procreation rather than saving it from the horror that is Israel?

      • potsherd
        November 9, 2010, 9:50 am

        Not from the Talmud, obviously.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 10:45 am

        @ occupyresist:

        You misunderstand. I’m talking about funding a Taglit-LeKulam project, not a trip to Saudi Arabia, though I think that a trip to Saudi Arabia would be quite instructive. Caution to girls: If you get caught in a burning building, you might not be saved.

      • Shingo
        November 9, 2010, 3:47 pm

        “Caution to girls: If you get caught in a burning building, you might not be saved.”

        And if you happent o be a girl is Gaza, the fire in that said building was probably cause by an Israeli bomb, and running outside is not an option becasue Israel will be watigin to greet you with white phosphorous.

      • hophmi
        November 9, 2010, 4:59 pm

        If you happen to be a girl in Gaza, get used to being undereducated with Hamas in power.

    • Mooser
      November 8, 2010, 6:05 pm

      Zionism implode before they have succeeded in getting Gentile American soldiers to die in Israel’s behalf? Give me a break.

    • Bart
      November 8, 2010, 6:30 pm

      FIVE??? FIVE whole disrupters????

      If that doesnt herald the implosion of the jewish state I dont know what does…

      Mondoweiss is a bizarre world. You folks do realize that, right?

      • thankgodimatheist
        November 8, 2010, 7:25 pm

        Bart..no need to burst an artery..They were five present at the speech, but they’re much bigger than that..Check them out here:

        The Young Jewish Declaration is a project created by young leaders within Jewish Voice for Peace, America’s largest Jewish grassroots peace group dedicated to reaching a just peace between Israelis and Palestinians based on the principles of equality and international human rights law.
        link to youngjewishproud.org

      • kapok
        November 8, 2010, 7:33 pm

        No, things start small and grow bigger. Perfectly natural.

      • potsherd
        November 8, 2010, 7:48 pm

        Bart would prefer the place be nuked?

      • Bart
        November 8, 2010, 8:32 pm

        Ill be on the lookout for this fast growing herd.

        When I spot them Ill be sure to report back . How powerful of a microscope do you think Ill need?

      • Mooser
        November 8, 2010, 8:41 pm

        That’s what I was thinking, Potsherd. So if a couple of hundred protesters armed with truncheons came in a batted every Zionist on the beezer with no regard to age or sex, he’d be impressed.

        There’s nothing like might-makes-right Jews. They are hilarious.

      • Kathleen
        November 8, 2010, 10:14 pm

        Far more action than five years ago.

        link to bdsmovement.net
        link to psgchicago.org
        Palestinian solidarity groups
        link to en.wikipedia.org
        United States

        * Al-Awda [38]
        * Al-Jazeerah Information Center [39]
        * Brit Tzedek v’Shalom [40]
        * Friends of Sabeel–NA [41]
        * ICAHD-USA [42]
        * Jewish Voice for Peace [43]
        * New Jersey Solidarity – Activists for the Liberation of Palestine [44]
        * Queers Undermining Israeli Terrorism
        * Palestine Solidarity Movement [45]
        * Students for Justice in Palestine
        * End the Occupation in Palestine [46]
        * The Washington Report [47]
        * American Task Force on Palestine [48]

        And if there is nothing to worry about why the freak out and the continued effort to flip the script?
        link to jta.org
        link to jstandard.com

      • Antidote
        November 8, 2010, 9:57 pm

        Read the article on those 5 hecklers, and the readers’ comments, in the bizarre world of Haaretz, then. Online English edition. Once you lift your head out of the Zionist propaganda universe, you see it everywhere.

      • Sumud
        November 8, 2010, 11:26 pm

        FIVE??? FIVE whole disrupters????

        If that doesnt herald the implosion of the jewish state I dont know what does…

        Mondoweiss is a bizarre world. You folks do realize that, right?

        That’s why you feel compelled to comment, right? Because Mondoweiss is so breathtakingly irrelevant?

        Let me save you some typing – next you say you’re just here for entertainment purposes…

  7. thankgodimatheist
    November 8, 2010, 5:52 pm

    Talking about young Jews who say no:

    Young Jewish and proud

    We refuse to have our histories distorted or erased, or appropriated by a corporate war machine. We will not call this liberation. We refuse to knowingly oppress others, and we refuse to oppress each other. We refuse to be whitewashed. We will not carry the legacy of terror. We refuse to allow our identities to be cut, cleaned, packaged nicely, and sold back to us. We won’t be won over by free vacations and scholarship money. We won’t buy the logic that slaughter means safety. We will not quietly witness the violation of human rights in Palestine. We refuse to become the mother who did not scream when wise King Solomon resolved to split her baby in two. We are better than this. We have ancestors to honor. We have allies to honor. We have ourselves to honor.
    link to youngjewishproud.org

    • Antidote
      November 8, 2010, 6:39 pm

      The White Rose of Zionism

      • kalithea
        November 9, 2010, 3:58 am

        Are you a Zionist in sheep’s clothing, by the way? I just like sincerity in people.

      • Shmuel
        November 9, 2010, 4:45 am

        Kalithea,

        Antidote was referring to this – paying these young opponents of Zionist oppression a tremendous compliment.

        BTW, I think you also misread Antidote’s comment on the Canadian thread.

      • Antidote
        November 9, 2010, 9:26 am

        thanks for the clarification, Shmuel

  8. Kathleen
    November 8, 2010, 7:14 pm

    Whoa Matthew Taylor really nailed it
    “The Settlements Delegitimize Israel
    The Occupation Delegitimizes Israel
    The Siege of Gaza Delegitimizes Israel
    The Loyalty Oath Delegitimizes Israel
    Silencing Dissent Delegitimizes Israel”

    From what I am seeing on quite a few campuses in Colorado and Ohio the BDS movement is growing. Young students becoming more and more aware of the facts on the ground. Some of us have focused on this growth for quite a few years. Seeing results

    • pjdude
      November 9, 2010, 6:48 am

      how can you delegitimize something that was never legitiamte

  9. Jim Haygood
    November 8, 2010, 7:35 pm

    A couple of years ago, when picketing an AIPAC event in northern N.J. with a sign reading “No more war$ for I$rael,” I was surprised when an early-teen kid in the back of his parents’ car gave me a thumbs-up through the window.

    A younger cohort of Jews does not share the blind, ‘Israel right or wrong’ dogma of the Holocaust-indoctrinated paranoid generation which preceded them. They have absorbed American values, and see the stark hypocrisy of an Israeli state dedicated to the un-American principle of ethnic privilege. Israel treats Palestinians as the US treated Jews back in the ‘Gentlemen’s Agreement’ days — only worse!

    Just as the harsh anti-Japanese racism of some WW II vets who fought in the Pacific theater is fading from the scene, so is Zionism’s patently bogus free-riding on the tragic events of WW II to justify their nightmarish demographic engineering of a Jewish majority by subjugating millions of Palestinians to unending siege and military occupation.

    What’s happening there is shameful. The tattered, obsolete ideology of zionism can no longer twist its institutionalized cruelty into some kind of Jewish religious obligation. An educated generation of younger Jews has seen through this self-serving sham. Good for them!

    • Kathleen
      November 8, 2010, 7:49 pm

      Good points.

      Although I have met young Jewish students at Ohio State University who were protesting outside of a Palestinian solidarity conference with a crazy ass and violent Rabbi. Talked with them for quite a while. They were arrogant bigots without an ounce of compassion. Not an ounce of compassion.

  10. Les
    November 8, 2010, 7:43 pm

    Great comment on the story as published on Huffington Post:

    “It’s not stealing to remove the vermin!”

  11. Kathleen
    November 8, 2010, 8:43 pm

    Those five young Jews and group may want to head for this award ceremony to protest and disrupt.
    link to atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com
    The Annie Taylor Award for Courage from the David Horowitz Freedom Center is awarded annually to people who have demonstrated unusual courage in adverse conditions and great danger.

    I am deeply honored and humbled to be one of this year’s recipients of the award. My hero, Oriana Fallaci, is a previous recipient of this honor. I attended that historic evening on November 30, 2005. She was honored for “the heroism and the values” that rendered her “a symbol of the fight against Islamic fascism and a knight of the freedom of humankind.”

    I join a small but illustrious group of Annie Taylor Award winners that includes legend Rush Limbaugh, author Ann Coulter, former Attorney General John Ashcroft, civil rights leader Ward Connerly, human rights activist Armando Vallederes, Georgia Democrat Senator Zell Miller, film director Cyrus Nowrasteh, Swift Boat veteran John O’Neill, Iranian dissident Amir Abbas Fakhravar, activist Phyllis Schlafly, et al….

    I am overwhelmed.

    It is an important gathering. Should you wish to join us, go here.

    The David Horowitz Freedom Center will be holding its Restoration Weekend November 18 – 21, 2010 at The Breakers Hotel in Palm Beach, Florida. Prominent authorities and political figures will enlighten audiences at this important annual event.

    The Center will be celebrating the sixteenth anniversary of this event. The Weekend activities begin at 6:30 p.m. on Thursday the 18th and conclude at 10:00 a.m. on Sunday the 21st.

    We are excited to announce that among the confirmed speakers are:

    Newt Gingrich, David Horowitz, Liz Cheney, Ann Coulter, Andrew Klavan, Robert Spencer, Frank Gaffney, Monica Crowley, John Yoo, Marc Thiessen, Michael Barone, Ralph Peters, Caroline Glick, Pastor John Hagee, Rob Pollock, Fred Barnes,Senator Jeff Sessions, Congressmen Ed Royce and Steven King, Emmett Tyrrell, Bill Gertz, Doug Schoen, Ron Radosh, Steven Moore, Arizona State Senators Russell Pearce and Thayer Verschoor, Mark Krikorian, S.E. Cupp, Lee Smith, General Paul Vallely, Congresswoman Michele Bachmann, Fred Barnes and Pat Caddell.

    • Kathleen
      November 8, 2010, 8:50 pm

      Honoring the hate monger and Islamaphobic Pam Geller. Aye yi yi

    • Sumud
      November 8, 2010, 11:50 pm

      We are excited to announce that among the confirmed speakers are:

      Newt Gingrich, David Horowitz, Liz Cheney, Ann Coulter, Andrew Klavan, Robert Spencer, Frank Gaffney, Monica Crowley, John Yoo, Marc Thiessen, Michael Barone, Ralph Peters, Caroline Glick, Pastor John Hagee, Rob Pollock, Fred Barnes,Senator Jeff Sessions, Congressmen Ed Royce and Steven King, Emmett Tyrrell, Bill Gertz, Doug Schoen, Ron Radosh, Steven Moore, Arizona State Senators Russell Pearce and Thayer Verschoor, Mark Krikorian, S.E. Cupp, Lee Smith, General Paul Vallely, Congresswoman Michele Bachmann, Fred Barnes and Pat Caddell.

      What a lineup. Promises to be a right hate-fest.

      “Courage Award” my ass. Geller is Goebbels spiritual heir.

      • Shingo
        November 9, 2010, 12:24 am

        Yes, what a stellar lineup.

        John Hagee: who says the anti Christ will be a Jew and that Hitler was an agent of God

        David Horowitz: pathological liar and Islamophobe
        Liz Cheney: pathological liar

        Frank Gaffney: delusional pathological liar who continues to insist there were WMD’s in Iraq

        John Yoo: Proponent fo crushing a child’s testicles to force a confession from the parent.

        Ralph Peters: delusional pathological liar who can’t wait to bob Iran

    • annie
      November 9, 2010, 7:57 am

      what a cess pool.

      a line up like that all under one roof…..just my imagination, running away w/me.

      • Sumud
        November 10, 2010, 3:14 am

        Annie ~ i had the same uncharitable thoughts, there would be a certain poetic justice if the disregard these creatures demonstrate for human life were visited upon them. But we’re better than that.

  12. annie
    November 8, 2010, 9:08 pm

    rae just sent out these links! the story’s already picked up by jpost:Peace protesters disrupt Netanyahu’s GA speech

    “The loyalty oath de-legitimatizes Israel,” a woman holding a placard yelled and stood on her chair, interrupting Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu’s speech at the Jewish Federations of North America’s General Assembly in New Orleans on Monday.

    She was swiftly escorted out by security. However, moments later another protester stood on his chair and shouted “the occupation de-legitimizes Israel.” The man was also quickly taken outside. But then another, and another appeared. Six in all. One of them was tackled by participants in the crowd and a short scuffle ensued until security reached him.

    The protesters were part of Jewish Voices for Peace, a leftist organization of Jews which helped organize the recent boat which tried to break the blockade on Gaza and attempts to relocate the planned Tolerance Museum in Jerusalem.

    “These actions are in part a protest of the Jewish Federations of North America (JFNA) and Jewish Public Affairs Council (JCPA) newly announced $6 million dollar program to target campus, church, peace and human rights groups that are working to end Israel’s human rights violations through nonviolent Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions pressure campaigns,” a press release fro JVP read. “The Federations and JCPA are calling this initiative the “Israel Action Network.”’ The group’s aim was to draw attention to their cause, and to a large part they succeeded. Haaretz, Ynet and other Israeli newspapers lead with the sensationalist news on their Websites. But the sentiments of the protesters did not reflect greater discontent by American Jews with Israel, according to a sampling of interview with participants after the event occurred .

    more at the link. if they think ‘according to a sampling of interviews with participants after the event’ – ‘ the sentiments of the protesters did not reflect greater discontent by American Jews’ maybe they should asked some other jews, you know the kind who do not show up at conferences to promote the state of israel… unless perhaps they are protesting them.

    “It’s not whether I agree with what they have to . There are ways of protesting, and that defeated their message.” Hecklers at the GA are rare but not unprecedented. In 2005 prime minister Ariel Sharon was interrupted at the event by rightist protesters, demonstrating against Israel’s pullout from Gaza.

    i do not think they defeated their message , it just got plastered all over the press! also rae was the same person who stood on a table in front of netanyahu @ the aipac conference and disrupted his speech last year! he should get used to that gorgeous face, she’s one heck of a gal.

    and there’s more from maam news !!

    this new website of theirs rocks.

  13. annie
    November 8, 2010, 9:17 pm

    here’s more photos and info from the louisiana justice institute about the protest going on outside.

    • Kathleen
      November 8, 2010, 9:51 pm

      thanks. The “everyone is trying to delegitimize Israel” flip the script and distract campaign that Israeli leaders and the I lobby are on is just not going to put the cat back in the bag. The BDS movement is growing, awareness is growing about the facts on the ground.
      Matthew Taylor really nailed it
      “The Settlements Delegitimize Israel
      The Occupation Delegitimizes Israel
      The Siege of Gaza Delegitimizes Israel
      The Loyalty Oath Delegitimizes Israel
      Silencing Dissent Delegitimizes Israel”

      Hope those brave and honorable young folks head to the event that is going to take place in Florida to honor the hate monger Pam Geller
      link to atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com

      The David Horowitz Freedom Center will be holding its Restoration Weekend November 18 – 21, 2010 at The Breakers Hotel in Palm Beach, Florida. Prominent authorities and political figures will enlighten audiences at this important annual event.
      We are excited to announce that among the confirmed speakers are:

      Newt Gingrich, David Horowitz, Liz Cheney, Ann Coulter, Andrew Klavan, Robert Spencer, Frank Gaffney, Monica Crowley, John Yoo, Marc Thiessen, Michael Barone, Ralph Peters, Caroline Glick, Pastor John Hagee, Rob Pollock, Fred Barnes,Senator Jeff Sessions, Congressmen Ed Royce and Steven King, Emmett Tyrrell, Bill Gertz, Doug Schoen, Ron Radosh, Steven Moore, Arizona State Senators Russell Pearce and Thayer Verschoor, Mark Krikorian, S.E. Cupp, Lee Smith, General Paul Vallely, Congresswoman Michele Bachmann, Fred Barnes and Pat Caddell.

  14. yourstruly
    November 8, 2010, 10:23 pm

    Having grown up in a a large Jewish family in a predominately Jewish neighborhood, until I met a Jewish-American from the deep south, it never dawned on me that there were racist Jews – “He couldn’t really be a Jew”, I thought. Still do, when it comes to Zionists with their colonial enterprise Israel, contradicting, as it does, the love they neighbor as theyself, the always side with the slave, never with the slave-master – the beliefs and the life that to me are the essence of Judaism – not from what little I learned from a year or so of Hebrew school, but from having seen Jews standing up against racism in America, against Nazi thuggery, for labor rights, for women’s rights. for whatever cause advanced the human condition. That’s not to say that I didn’t fall for the Zionist pitch about a land without a people for a people without a land; until, that is, the 1967 war, when the stark racism in the boasting about Jewish supermen brought me to my senses – “Damn, have I been had!” Ever since then justice for Palestine has been an abiding concern, as a Jew, as an American, as a human being. It was that concern that brought me to Lebanon during the ’82 U.S.-backed Israeli siege of West Beirut, to Palestine during the first Intifada and to Iraq, a couple year post-Gulf I. Not only to witness, but to report back on what I’d seen and experienced. Some would say that Judaism is much more than standing up for justice and equality, that one mustn’t forget the sacred scrolls, the rituals and such. For some Jews, but to me these are ornaments and trappings of antiquity, nothing wrong with this per se, so long as it doesn’t contradict the essence of Judaism – the you are I, I am you, we are one. So it is with this in mind, that I greet and congratulate the New Orleans Five – for keeping Judaism alive

    • annie
      November 9, 2010, 8:00 am

      i liked your comment yourstruly

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 3:07 pm

        I did, too. I remember how shocked I was when I found out there were racist Jews.
        Which reminds me, isn’t it funny how when Hophmi lists all the terrible things they did to Jews in the US, all the other minorities, Afro-Americans, Asians, Hispanics, you name it, just disappear?
        And those few instances of social anti-Semitism become a reign of anti-Semitic terror? I have always found that attitude grossly embarrassing. ‘Sure, they enslaved and then lynched the shwartzers, but really, does that count? Surely, you can’t claim that Jews are the same as black people?’

  15. Kathleen
    November 8, 2010, 10:28 pm

    The AP story about the interruption being put in local papers all over the place

    Has filled up 14 pages of google
    link to seattletimes.nwsource.com

    link to chron.com

    link to npr.org

    link to kansascity.com
    link to salon.com

    link to daytondailynews.com

    Minneapolis/ St Paul
    link to startribune.com

  16. Kathleen
    November 8, 2010, 10:45 pm

    code Pink has it up
    link to codepinkalert.org

    Not up at Firedoglake. Will take a few days over there. If at all. That is unless Ed Teller or C Tuttle pick it up over here. Jane Hamsher, Marcy Wheeler seldom touch these issues

    Up at Huffington Post, Salon, Mondoweiss, Code Pink. Not finding anything up over at Daily Kos. Will never make it up over at Crooks and Liars. Almost total I/P issue black out over there.

  17. Kathleen
    November 8, 2010, 11:03 pm

    Anyone want to place a bet that Jon Stewart will not touch this protest that is being picked up all over the place.?

    Stewart always reams Iranian President Ahmadenjad. Have never ever heard Stewart go after Netanyahu or the Israeli government. Has done one segment on the Aipac espionage trial. One time

    Put money that his writers, producers, Stewart will not touch this

  18. syvanen
    November 8, 2010, 11:41 pm

    What a great demonstration. This is a real demonstration of freedom of speech. Given that the Zionist have unfettered access to the mainstream media those in the opposition must be creative to get their work heard. They must put their bodies on the line and create scenes of embarrassment for the followers of Netanyahoo and his ilk. And they succeeded here. If the Zionist do not like it, then maybe they should provide these people with an outlet in places like the Washington Post, the NY Times, NPR or the other news outlets. For sure, as long as their word is suppressed in the MSN , then direct public action is the only venue open.

    MLK did not gain national attention until he created major disruptions that forced the American press to pay attention to his message. Once that message was on the table, Jim Crow withered and died since it could not be defended. I do believe that the West Bank settlement movement will suffer a similar fate.

  19. Kathleen
    November 8, 2010, 11:47 pm

    Just linked to Mondoweiss and this story over at Washington Note, Race for Iran, Informed Comment about this. Hope it brings you folks more readership. Such an important blog.

    Posted this

    “Have folks read the news about the five protesters who interrupted Netanyahu’s speech today in New Orleans?

    Five young Jews disrupt Netanyahu speech with call for new Jewish identity
    link to mondoweiss.net

    AP article up at Huffington Post, Salon (i beleive), Mondoweiss, Code Pink. Nothing at all up at Firedoglake (Jane Hamsher and Marcy Wheeler seldom if ever touch these stories, while a few of the smaller hitters over there do at times) Nothing at Daily Kos Yet. Will more than likely not make it up over at Crooks and Liars. Total black out on Israeli Palestinian issues over there. Of course the bravest bloggers of all in the so called progressive blogosphere is Glenn Greenwald who will address the I/P issue even when he is on National MSM news outlets. But not Jane Hamsher she is silent on this issue. Even when she is in the National spotlight (Washington Journal Cspan) addressing why progressives are upset with the Obama administration. In 45 minutes Hamsher did not have the balls to even “whisper” about this issue. But Glenn he goes for it. The truth that is.

    At Google there are 14 pages of links to newspapers picking the Netanyahu being interrupted story up. All over the nation and world.

    Will put money on that Jon Stewart will not touch this story. Never criticizes Netanyahu or other Israeli leaders. Never. Now if this were about the Iranian President Ahmadenijad Stewart would be all over it. Anyone want to bet Stewart will not touch this news on his show”

    • eGuard
      November 9, 2010, 1:45 am

      My impression of the HuffPo thread is that the posts are very well readable, and show hopefull stats (pity we did not see that on Nov 2nd). Few hasbara spoilers, and petty cheap ones at that. Haaretz: same change over the last quarter, imo.

      While I’m at it, Mooser, could you stop feeding the trolls here? My well practised routine page-downs-while-mondotroll-in-lefthand-post is disrupted. Thank you.

      • Kathleen
        November 9, 2010, 10:37 am

        Huff Po opened up the last few years on the I/P issue. Although the issue still does not make the top spot or even anywhere near it.

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 11:18 am

        “While I’m at it, Mooser, could you stop feeding the trolls here?”

        Well, in my defense, I pretty much have, but this was one thread I couldn’t resist. You know I’ve been screaming about how a religion which can’t even regularise it’s theology is in no shape to start stealing countries, and I knew there was gonna be a lot of fun in this thread. Sorry.

  20. Richard Witty
    November 9, 2010, 4:47 am

    The thing that made Netanyahu actually acknowledge the disrupters was that their content was within the discussion of Israeli optimal policy.

    Their next interaction would be interesting. They now have the invitation of a sort of joining the discussion from within, or alienating themselves from a seat at the table by continued disruption.

    Tom Friedman appeared on a live interview on Israeli TV a few days earlier declaring and that it was getting around the US, that there was now significant weariness and doubt as to Netanyahu’s sincerity to pursue peace. That’s a different statement than the protesters, but the message hit the mark that policies and practices communicate to the world (Jewish, Palestinian, others) whether Netanyahu and Israel is sincere or opportunist.

    • Kathleen
      November 9, 2010, 11:02 am

      “They now have the invitation of a sort of joining the discussion from within, or alienating themselves from a seat at the table by continued disruption.” Hopefully they will never fall for that.

      • Richard Witty
        November 9, 2010, 2:45 pm

        Seeing the video was DIFFERENT than seeing the description.

        “They got Netanyahu’s attention”.

        “Hopefully they will never fall for that”, you mean like participating in electoral politics, or civic boards, or a parliament?

  21. Oscar
    November 9, 2010, 10:21 am

    Tom Friedman prefaced his remarks on Israel TV by saying there was no need to question his love for Israel. “You had me at hello,” he said, his feminine side channeling the Renee Zellweger character in “Jerry Maguire”. And this is Obama’s favorite columnist?

    Bibi’s speech was a mockery. All about the threat from Iran, the usual hocus pocus to distract USA attention from the slow motion ethnic cleansing of Palestine. Not even a single thank you or a shout-out to the American taxpayer for its direct fiscal participation in this pogrom.

    • Kathleen
      November 9, 2010, 11:01 am

      “And this is Obama’s favorite columnist?” Has Obama really said this? Terrifying. Unless he is just trying to keep track of some of the most twisted spin.

      Wish he would go read Flynt Leverett, Juan Cole, Glenn Greenwald, Katrina just to balance out Friedmann’s twisted spin and some out right lies

      • Mooser
        November 9, 2010, 11:21 am

        Kathleen, Obama is like a big, big cookie. You have to look beyond the chocolate wafers outside to the creamy white filling inside.

        By the way, I did not type that comment. My wife did, I swear it! She snuck in and did it, or maybe it was the cat. I would never say such a thing.

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