Another Congressman uses attacks to say US must block Palestinian statehood

on 62 Comments

Robert Dold is a Republican congressman in suburban Chicago, in Senator Mark Kirk’s former seat. Here’s a report on his statement on the Eilat killings. There seems to be one sentence about the two-state solution. But not a word about Palestinian freedom or occupation. And what is he saying we need to be vigilant about– a two-state solution imposed by the UN? What is clear is that he’s focused on Israeli control and not thinking about Palestinian self-determination as a significant concern. Dold:

Congressman Robert Dold issued a statement saying the attacks “lay bare the tragic reality that our ally Israel is surrounded by hostile neighbors who continue to target Israel’s innocent men, women, and children for murder.”(

 Rep. Dold recently completed his first trip to Israel as seated Congressman for the 10th congressional district in Chicago’s northern suburbs. The trip was sponsored by the JUF [Jewish Federation] of Metropolitan Chicago….

Regarding Hamas, Rep. Dold told the JUF News, “Hamas is a terrorist organization; we must assure that the Obama administration vetoes any United Nations vote on Palestinian unilateral declaration of statehood. We know we have a problem with the U.N., which has been on a steady course to delegitimize the state of Israel for a long time.  We have to continue to be vigilant…There is not going to be a two state solution without Israel at the table.  It is not going to be imposed by the UN or anyone else.”


62 Responses

  1. Richard Witty
    August 19, 2011, 12:19 pm

    Its going to happen more and more.

    The Palestinian assertion that makes it possible for their recognition, is that they are able to be function as a peaceful neighbor.

    If that assumption is rendered to be less than clearly confident, it will not come to pass.

    Terror is that significant.

    • Cliff
      August 19, 2011, 12:36 pm

      Yes, you say this while Israel is colonizing Palestinian land and subjugating an entire people.

      The crime of terrorism pales in comparison. It is precisely because of your ideological blinders and deep-seated racist and supremacist beliefs that these acts of terrorism trump the crime of colonialism, theft, and large-scale murder.

      300+ dead Palestinian children do not matter in your equation for what determines Israel’s capacity to ‘function’ as a peaceful neighbor, but 7 dead Israelis do.

      Do you donate to this blog, Dick? You know Phil. You spam his blog with 10K+ posts. You constantly tell us you are a peace-seeker.

      So add these things up = do you contribute to the survival of this blog seeing as how you use it so frequently?

      • Woody Tanaka
        August 19, 2011, 4:03 pm

        “Yes, you say this while Israel is colonizing Palestinian land and subjugating an entire people.”

        But don’t you get it? That benefits Israeli Jews, so Witty is all for it. When it hurts Israeli Jews, or limits their ability to do whatever they want, that’s when Witty starts yapping about #AND# and “holes not wholes” and worring about whether the settler-pig theives are treated well, and that garbage. Typical supremecist.

    • Leigh
      August 19, 2011, 1:27 pm

      The US cannot function as a peaceful neighbour, look at their relations with south and central America. Israel itself cannot function as a peaceful neighbour, and I’m sure you won’t want to apply your formula to them. I’m sitting in Gaza at the moment crapping myself, counting the dead and especially injured children, knowing that no one will help us or stop what is clearly coming. But yes, if you want to believe that statehood recognition is predicated on managing to be a peaceful neighbour, and that the EU and US apply this consistently, dig your head further into the sand. You’re heading for middle earth.

      • annie
        August 19, 2011, 2:01 pm

        I’m sitting in Gaza at the moment crapping myself

        just read “A number of injuries reported after the last attack on Al-Mansoura street minutes ago.”

        it must be really scary. tweets are coming in about many areas of gaza getting hit. this really freaks me out. i wonder how long before israel stops or are they going to keep this up for weeks?

      • Leigh
        August 19, 2011, 2:23 pm

        Yup, Annie, it’s kind-of awful, but everyone is almost more tense about what might happen than about what is happening. And the knowledge that no one around the world will do anything to help is one of the worst bits. We’re without electricity in most areas; rumours have it that Israel hit a power station. So we’re struggling to communicate with families outside and many people are too scared to leave their homes to communicate with neighbours. the sound of explosions is almost constant, a lot of it is Israeli planes breaking the sound barier, probably to unsettle us further. We never know when it’s explosions and when just cocky IAF pilots. I saw a factory bombed this afternoon and two horrifically badly injured children. It’s been quiet for a while now.

      • Citizen
        August 19, 2011, 3:22 pm

        Leigh, it’s all over Twitter (what’s happening in Gaza), but the US TV News says nothing about it except they are notifying Americans that Israel is reacting with air power because its citizens on a bus had been bombed. At this point the US news isn’t saying more (or showing anything except an Israeli F-16 in the air) except saying “it’s claimed Hamas bombed the bus.”

      • dimadok
        August 19, 2011, 3:49 pm

        Which street you are sitting in Gaza? Remember the Lesbian Arab Girl from Damascus?

      • biorabbi
        August 19, 2011, 3:56 pm

        Sources? What source? You ask about my sourcing citing Syrian atrocities; does the same apply to your tweets? Just asking.

        I’m sure it is scary to have rockets fired at your home in Gaza. I’m sure it’s scary as hell to get your bus bombed outside of Eilat. I’m sure it’s scary as hell to have your child tortured to death in Hama… no matter how poor the sourcing or tweets were.

      • annie
        August 19, 2011, 4:28 pm

        my source was Gaza Youth Break Out:

        Gaza Youth Break Out
        GazaYBO Gaza Youth Break Out
        53 minutes ago

        perhaps they are incorrect, i do not know.

        sorry i asked who your source was, you can ask me for mine anytime. if you scroll on that link you will see the tweet. of course it may be incorrect, i cannot vouch for the accuracy of the source.

      • Cliff
        August 19, 2011, 5:36 pm

        Wow biorabbi.

        What a disgusting example of denial.

        Rockets dont simply fall on Gaza, in the same magnitude and impact as s’derot.

        Israel blows Gaza up, kills indiscriminately, destroying lives and livelihoods.

        Its sick that you whitewash Israeli cruelty by issuing your lame equivocations and then some standard Hamas scapegoating. As if it’s Hamas incinerating 300+ children and stealing land.

        And at the same time you’re indignant about the recent terrorist attack.

        This is why your cult is defined by lies and dishonesty. You expect others to rise to a standard you set, then ignore it yourself.

      • Cliff
        August 19, 2011, 5:37 pm

        Yea because it’s so unbelievable right? You are seriously dense.

    • Exiled At Home
      August 19, 2011, 1:38 pm

      The Palestinian assertion that makes it possible for their recognition, is that they are able to be function as a peaceful neighbor.

      Has Israel shown any ability to “function as a peaceful neighbor?” Hell no. Israel has proven nothing other than its insatiable hunger for land expansion and its morally repugnant dismissal of the Palestinians as deserving of simple human dignity.

    • Dex
      August 19, 2011, 2:45 pm

      It is symptomatic of the occupation.

      Now if you are one of the last 14 people on this planet who do not acknowledge the existance of an occupation, then we cannot have a rational discussion.

    • American
      August 19, 2011, 3:18 pm

      Richard, I have asked you this several times and you never answer.
      Why is it that ardent zionist like yourself continue to live in the US or outside of Israel?
      I believe you said you had children or relatives in Israel and obviously your heart and soul is dedicated to Israel…so why aren’t you living there?
      Why is it that zionist keep staying in this country when all their efforts and loyalty is tied up in Israel?
      It only makes sense to me that people who are so totally consumed with a country and feel it is their true homeland and would have automatic citizenship there would want to be in that country.
      Just one time explain why you stay here instead of living in Israel.
      Why aren’t all the zionist like Abrams, and Feith and Ackerman and Schumer and others like them in Israel trying to govern and help Israel there instead of here?
      I don’t understand it.

      • longliveisrael
        August 19, 2011, 7:09 pm

        Reverse the question, how come so many of you who supposedly support the Palestinians, why don’t you live in Gaza? Sharia isn’t so bad once you get used to it.

      • Real Jew
        August 20, 2011, 4:23 am

        I’m sorry longliveisrahell but by reversing the question does that somehow answer American’s question? or is it a typical and lame pro Israel tactic of reversing reality? Hmmm….that’s a real brain buster.

        The pro Israel camp has been completely void of TRUE Jewish values beginning with the birth of Zionism. Having to spend trillions of shekels on worldwide Hasbara, specifically in the US, in order to maintain their lies, deceptions, and of course the occupation.

        Their attempts to defend the ‘indefensible’ has become so ineffectively redundant that you hear the same lame talking points from NY to Tel Aviv. Sorry but the world, including the people on this site, doesn’t believe or trust a word the Israeli govt says. Aside from the US of course, aka Israeli occupied territory.

        But I’m sure we’re all dying to read your heartfelt support of apartheid. Let the propaganda commence……..

      • edwin
        August 20, 2011, 10:04 am

        There is a difference between supporting the Palestinians and supporting a state.

        Not all Palestinians hold to the same religion. It is racist for you to think so. Palestinian is not a religious designation. It describes people from a certain geographical location. Jews can be Palestinians.

        Some of us support secular democracies and not theocracies.

      • Walid
        August 19, 2011, 7:27 pm

        “I believe you said you had children or relatives in Israel and obviously your heart and soul is dedicated to Israel…so why aren’t you living there?”

        Probably still got a few years left to become eligible to start receiving social security. When that happens, he’ll move to Israel in a flash and forget all about the US, except for the monthly social security cheque, of course.

    • pjdude
      August 19, 2011, 3:23 pm

      it is which is why all thinking people know that Israel needs to go bye bye and be replased with a palestinian state that is welcoming of all people who wish to live in peace. sadly most “ISraelis” don’t want to live in peace

    • Citizen
      August 19, 2011, 3:29 pm

      Witty, the Israeli assertion is only they are interested in peace. We don’t need any “assumption rendering” to know which way the wind blows; the Palestinian Papers shows us Israel is not interested in peace, but only in the “peace process” brokered by Uncle Sam with his AIPAC blinders on, because that way the status quo can continue, that is, more Israeli settlement facts on the ground can and are being built daily.

    • Keith
      August 19, 2011, 5:06 pm

      RICHARDWITTY- “The Palestinian assertion that makes it possible for their recognition, is that they are able to be function as a peaceful neighbor.”

      Peaceful neighbor? If one were to rank nations according to their peacefulness and good neighborliness, how do you think the US and Israel would stack up? Both are demonstrated warfare states that are quick to resort to military force to achieve strategic objectives. Both are hypocritical in the extreme. How many wars of choice has Israel launched against it neighbors since its founding? How often has it engaged in the mass murder of more or less defenseless civilians such as in Lebanon? And the US? How many imperial wars of aggression are US/NATO currently engaged in? This includes Libya where the fog of propaganda has partially lifted and it is finally being acknowledged that the main cause of civilian casualties is NATO’s “humanitarian” bombing of civilian targets in order to topple Gaddafi, always the primary goal.

      “In a long overdue turnaround from last February, when the main stream media here parroted those who for years had been working on toppling Gaddafi about his alleged killing Libyans, CNN just this morning aired a downright balanced report about how NATO’s claims that it is protecting Libyan civilians are dubi’ous and in fact the main cause of civilians being slaughtered here in NATO sorties, now nearly 20,000 with more than 8,000 bombing sites.” link to

      But wait, it gets better. Anticipating a switch from major theater operations towards low intensity conflict, Obama is ramping up the Special Operations Forces.

      “For decades the U.S. military has waged clandestine war on virtually every continent on the globe, but, for the first time, high-ranking Special Operations Forces (SOF) officers are moving out of the shadows and into the command mainstream. Their emergence suggests the U.S. is embarking on a military sea change that will replace massive deployments, like Iraq and Afghanistan, with stealthy night raids, secret assassinations, and death-dealing drones. Its implications for civilian control of foreign policy promises to be profound.

      The Obama Administration has been particularly enamored of SOFs, and, according to reporters Karen DeYoung and Greg Jaffe of the Washington Post, is in the process of doubling the number of countries where such units are active from 60 to 120. U.S. Special Operations Command spokesman Col. Tim Nye told Nick Turse of Salon that SOF forces would soon be deployed in 60 percent of the world’s nations: “We do a lot of traveling.”… SOF forces have almost doubled in the past two decades, from some 37,000 to close to 60,000, and major increases are planned in the future. Their budget has jumped from $2.3 billion to $9.8 billion over the last 10 years” link to

      Against all of this murder and mayhem and militarism and subjugation of the Palestinian natives, it is the Palestinians who must demonstrate their peaceful neighborliness? Jeez, get real!

      • eljay
        August 22, 2011, 3:18 pm

        >> Against all of this murder and mayhem and militarism and subjugation of the Palestinian natives, it is the Palestinians who must demonstrate their peaceful neighborliness?

        That is correct. Although the rapist has raped the victim in the past and is raping the victim in the present, RW places the onus for “humanization” and reconciliation on the victim…even as the rapist continues to rape the victim.

        Why? Because the victim slaps and punches the rapist and, so, she is labelled an “aggressor”. Her acts of “aggression” are given equal weight to those of the rapist, so both parties are now victims. (However, even though they are both “victims”, the onus remains on the actual victim.)

        Those who insist that the rapist should, at the very minimum, halt his rape before reconciliation between rapist and victim can possibly begin in earnest are labelled “dissent”, “destabilizing”, “fools” and Hamas.

        “Live #AND# let live”, he says.

        It may all seem surprising to you, but keep in mind that RW approves of the past ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, and has yet to rule out any future bureaucratic or physical ethnic cleansing. He’s a “humanist” who has stated that he doesn’t know whether or not he condemns ethnic cleansing everywhere and always…something an actual humanist would know to condemn unequivocally.

  2. llama lady
    August 19, 2011, 12:24 pm

    No, it’s not going to be imposed by the UN as long as the US insists upon taking one side.

    When is enough enough to make us turn righteous?

    • Ellen
      August 19, 2011, 1:11 pm

      Only after a really really big horrible crime. One that the world recoils in disgust; one that Israelis do not want to be associated with. That may not happen, but instead the small everyday drip by drip. Then Israel will have what it wants. But at what price? It will be a material state and have a golden calf like any other, but not Jewish. Just another state and institutions.

  3. Walid
    August 19, 2011, 12:30 pm

    Godsend, indeed. Now Congress people are starting to milk it.

    • annie
      August 19, 2011, 12:46 pm

      i’m so shocked. say it isn’t so. vip’s making lemons out of lemonade again.

  4. ehrens
    August 19, 2011, 12:37 pm

    Let’s examine Mr. Witty’s argument. If we look at how Israel began — as a colonial enterprise crawling with terrorists like the Irgun and the Stern Gang, blowing up hotels and murdering their British masters — one could make the same claim about Israel: that it didn’t deserve its statehood either.

    • Ellen
      August 19, 2011, 1:07 pm

      And Ireland did not deserve independence or statehood with that logic.

      BTW, terrorist Yithak Shamir, — 7th Israeli PM, who authorized the execution style murder of UN representative Folk Bernadotte –was a great admirer of the IRA, even taking the underground nick name “Michael” after Michael Collins.

      How many people did Shamir have murdered who he and others determined to be a threat to the Zionist enterprise?

    • Citizen
      August 19, 2011, 3:32 pm

      ehrens, as Dicky Witty says, “Terror is that significant.” Witty just doesn’t follow through with his own logic.

  5. lysias
    August 19, 2011, 1:51 pm

    These attacks have come at a very convenient time for Israel.

    Cui bono?

    • Charon
      August 19, 2011, 2:49 pm

      Let’s see:

      Israel would gain (or hope to gain) international sympathy. The US congress would support Israel, condemn Hamas, and push for dropping all aid to Gaza and the PA. UN statehood chances would be lessened, especially if there was a chance at all that the US wouldn’t veto (yeah right). Israel shifts their focus to terrorism which justifies the military spending so it doesn’t get cut and ignores the recent proposal to cut off US aid. The tent protest gets forgotten and emotionaly the protesters are afraid of terrorism agian, derailing the process. Israel will wind up occupying Sinai like all the hardcore Zionists want anyways.

      Palestinians would gain absolutely nothing from this. It would destroy everything they’ve tried to accomplish. It would impact both Hamas and the PA. Innocent Palestinians would be killed. The Rafah crossing would be completely closed. The Sinai might be occupied by Israel. The natural gas fields would be stolen by Israel. The blockade would be worse. There weapons are no match at all.

      Yeah who benefits from this? I know that the concept of false flags fall under conspiracy theory which is coupled with tinfoil hat wearing kooks under the fringe department. Just remember that Israel has a history of them. When Hasbara trolls respond “oh right, Mossad did it huh?” that’s a confession IMHO. De-classified British documents show that PFLP was created by Mossad and they were behind the airline hijackings of the 70s. This along with the USS Liberty and early things like Lavon Affair and going back to the revisionist Zionist terrorist attacks. This is what they do, it’s all they know how to do. It’s worked and it still works and to deny it is to prove that it works. Look at that Mossad guy in Egypt arrested for stirring up hatred between Copts and Christians. Sounds like Lebanon a few years ago. Plus there was violent incidents between the two leading up to it. People need to wake up

      • longliveisrael
        August 19, 2011, 7:14 pm

        “De-classified British documents show that PFLP was created by Mossad and they were behind the airline hijackings of the 70s. ”

        Oh, pray tell, where are these documents?

        So, Israel conspired to have it’s soldiers and citizens murdered to achieve sinister objectives, right? I guess if we Israelis can pull off 9/11, this would be a piece of cake. And we Israeli posters here are the kooks?

        Oops, I forgot, I actually want you to male these silly statements, it shows the sane readers of MW what sort of people are anti-Israel

      • Dex
        August 19, 2011, 8:31 pm

        No one should pay attention to this Zionist wingnut. I recognize his/her name from Huffington Post; you know, that bastion of intellectualism that let’s anyone and their mother write an article on the P-I conflict. He/she is just another Hasbarist who is paid to monitor blogs and respond with standard protocal Zionist gibberish: deflect, divert, revise, and when worse comes to worse, use the ‘anti-semitic’ card.

      • annie
        August 19, 2011, 8:53 pm

        this is old news. haaretz U.K. file on Entebbe contains claim that Israel behind hijacking

        My contact said the PFLP had attracted all sorts of wild elements, some of whom had been planted by the Israelis,” Colvin reportedly wrote. “According to his information, the hijack was the work of the PFLP, with help from the Israeli Secret Service, the Shin Beit.”

        The document was written on June 30, 1976, three days after the hijacking and prior to the rescue operation.

    • Citizen
      August 19, 2011, 3:35 pm

      Couldn’t be more convenient with the tent protesters & impending clash at the UN re Pal statehood. Meanwhile, I see the New Egypt is having a minor civil war in the desert over that discount oil pipeline to Israel while the Egyptians pay through the nose.

    • MRW
      August 19, 2011, 4:15 pm

      Cui bono?

      (1) Hamas is denying any involvement
      (2) The Palestinians gain nothing, zero, zip from doing this in light of September.
      (3) IMO, this is a false flag operation and soooo typical. (Don’t forget, Israel doesn’t have to convince the world, or the US public. It just has to convince 535 Congressmen.)

      • dimadok
        August 19, 2011, 5:37 pm

        I’ll have what both of you having-it must be a wild trip so far!!! Wow how imaginative, of course Mossad did it!! Also I admit that I am a Hasbara agent, orbiting Earth and intercepting every anti-Zionist remarks.
        The conspiracy theories and proclamation of the Palestinian resistance as “freedom battle’ are similar for their baseless statements and hot air balloons. Whenever it serves the cause -it is a Mossad job, or if they got their tails behind their legs, or when there is an innocent people killed-it is the occupation resistance.
        Come on -make up your minds and decide once and for all, what is it?
        Meanwhile, I’ll be looking from the sky and trying to target your mindwaves through the lighting bulbs.

      • Chaos4700
        August 19, 2011, 9:20 pm

        Are you going to mock Pat Tillman then? Because that’s generally where the Zionists take this topic next.

      • MRW
        August 19, 2011, 9:20 pm

        Go have a drink and spend a day at the beach. You’re outta orbit again.

        False Flags when israel’s back is against the wall:

        The Lavon Affair
        The USS Liberty
        The Bomb in Mexico government building October 2001

      • POA
        August 20, 2011, 10:28 pm

        Don’t give yourself so much credit, Dimatok.

        Can’t speak for anyone else, but I don’t think you’re Mossad, ex-IDF, or an alien from outer space.

        Personally, I think you’re a sofa bound racist, masquerading as a badass, with some seriously fascist leanings.

        Dime a dozen, buddy. Over the course of the last ten years I’ve seen a hundred of you internet soldiers armed with your keyboard Uzis.

        Really, (when one is able to disregard how tragically uncomfortable it must be to have such low self esteem that ya gotta puff yourself up by slayin’ Arabs with your keyboard), it is kinda comical seeing the occassional internet warrior flex his semantics.

  6. DICKERSON3870
    August 19, 2011, 2:47 pm

    RE: “What is clear is that he’s focused on Israeli control and not thinking about Palestinian self-determination as a significant concern.” ~ Weiss

    AUDIO (20:01) – Taking the West Bank Slowly
    Jeremy Sapienza on the Israeli plan for Palestine, 8/18/11

    Jeremy Sapienza, Senior Editor at, discusses the September United Nations referendum on Palestinian statehood; why semi-contiguous Bantustans don’t make for a viable state; the decades-long “peace process” sham between two totally unequal negotiating partners; and how Israel’s settlement expansion slowly expels Palestinians, establishes “facts on the ground” and limits international criticism.

    LINK – link to

  7. American
    August 19, 2011, 3:06 pm

    MafiaISR, Inc. and MafiaUSA, Inc. are both going to have to be dealt with accordingly sooner or later…..if anyone wants this to ever end.

  8. radii
    August 19, 2011, 4:07 pm

    this era may go down as the most humiliating time for America in her history –
    … the momentum will build as more parasite-controlled U.S. elected officials and appointed bureaucrats behave ever more obsequiously in service to our parasite – zionist israel – in creating histrionics and ever more bellicose threats toward Palestinian-declared statehood when it is a needed and natural occurrence (which should have happened decades ago)

    … it is shameful, and shaming to we Americans, to have our “leaders” so slavishly prostrate themselves before israel’s criminal and wrong demands

    Palestine will happen – soon, and we are on the wrong side of history if we don’t help, rather than hurt the effort

  9. justicewillprevail
    August 19, 2011, 4:11 pm

    How pathetic that these Israeli lapdogs know nothing of the region or the history, but just repeat the talking points given to them by their paymasters, no questions asked. Bunch of know-nothing hypocrites, who couldn’t care less about peace or justice, and wouldn’t even know it when they saw it.

  10. Taxi
    August 19, 2011, 6:39 pm

    Ya think the Palestinians by now care what congressman Ziorobot#208 wants? Ya think people at the bottom of the barrel of our aid care about being demoted or cut off? LOL! Let’s get real here: the dollar is falling, the dollar is cheap, folks, and we’re about to hit a second recession: a further devaluation for Crumb’s sakes!

    There exists a balance-of-terror in northern Galilee with hizbollah, but the Apartheid israelis will test the waters with the southern Egyptian borders, only to discover soon enough that down in the Sinai too, there exists a determined resistance hellbent on achieving the same ‘quality’ deterrence/balance-of-terror that hizbollah has already established.

    My point is, the nefarious activities of aipac, congress and the mosad combined, ain’t gonna make a shitodiffrence to what’s actually happening on the ground over there in the mideast. Without further delay, and seemingly well-trained and organized, the ‘southern front’ has already started the first inch of its ‘war of liberation’. They’re ignoring everything America and israel threaten. They ain’t caring ’bout congressman Ziorobot#208 or even #209 in the leastest. His threats mean nothing to nobody over there.

    I know there’s alotta thickos on Capitol Hill: the slow-witted-comb-over-puppet-brigade, if you like. But heck can someone please enlighten them and bring them up to speed with events?! Stuff like: the Palestinians, the Lebanese and the Egyptians CLEARLY/ACTIVELY don’t care ’bout Uncle Sam and his dollar no more and they sure ain’t scared of the idf or our beefy marines either.

    The latest successful multiple attacks on the idf itself, and not just the Sinai-israel gas pipes – this itself is indeed a portent of what’s to come.

    This trend of guerrilla warfare will continue regardless of isreal’s ‘retaliations’ against Palestinian civilians. The ‘liberators’ may have smaller guns but they also seem to have a simple and clear plan: they aim to force the occupier with the bigger gun into a cage of fear. Then the occupier’s cage will be rattled, and rattled, and rattled some more, till it eventually flees back to where it came from.

    • longliveisrael
      August 20, 2011, 10:32 am

      The latest successful multiple attacks on the idf itself, and not just the Sinai-israel gas pipes – this itself is indeed a portent of what’s to come.

      Taxi, please, I am confused. On the one hand many of your fellow travellers here on MW claim that this is an Israeli false flag operation, yet you are portraying them as heroic resistance fighters who are going to kick IDF ass.

      • Citizen
        August 20, 2011, 11:07 am

        Seems to me its about the discount oil pipeline to Israel.

  11. POA
    August 19, 2011, 7:41 pm

    Oh, well, this makes PERFECT sense! Right on the verge of demanding statehood at the UN, the Palestinians launch attacks.


    I don’t suppose that Israeli IDF forces, being trained to impersonate arabs, is an issue to be considered, is it?

    link to

    False flag? Why not? After all, there is ample evidence supporting the assertion that Israel engages in such subterfuges. And, just like clockwork, many of these “terrorist attacks” sure seem to come at opportune times for Israel, don’t they???

  12. POA
    August 19, 2011, 8:21 pm

    “So, Israel conspired to have it’s soldiers and citizens murdered to achieve sinister objectives, right?”

    Why does this strike you as fantasy? If you admit to Israel killing our sailors on the Liberty, than certainly you have to admit to Israel’s use of false flag black ops, with “friendly” casualties, designed to push an agenda.

    And, uh, if you DON”T admit to the above, then you aren’t worth arguing with, because you’re just another lying hasbarist mouthpiece willing to openly expose yourself as completely and utterly devoid of character or integrity.

  13. Hostage
    August 20, 2011, 10:08 am

    Regarding Hamas, Rep. Dold told the JUF News, “Hamas is a terrorist organization; we must assure that the Obama administration vetoes any United Nations vote on Palestinian unilateral declaration of statehood.

    That statement is a complete non-sequitur. States are simply legal entities with rights and responsibilities prescribed by international law. The Congress and the Executive branch already maintain a list and sanction States that have been identified as sponsors of terror. The United Nations and the United States have both recognized Hamas as the de facto government of Gaza. De facto governments have rights and responsibilities under international law without regard to diplomatic recognition.

    The move to block Palestine’s bid for recognition of its statehood is really only about the possibility of an ICC-imposed settlement freeze: “Diplomacy: Can September place Israel on the ICC dock?”

    The members of the Yesha Council should be investigated for their role in widespread and systematic “price tag” attacks directed against the occupied civilian population. See for example the opinion of Israeli Supreme Court Justice Elyakim Rubinstein (then Attorney General) in A-G: New Hague court may indict settlers for war crimes.

  14. Richard Witty
    August 20, 2011, 2:16 pm

    Still, the primary affect of the terror, this and follow-up shelling of Israeli civilian towns, and the school bus attack a couple months ago, will lend DOUBT to the Palestinian assertion that it is capable of self-governing in a peaceable manner as an independent state.

    It definitely was feasible, possible, but militants hated the idea of actual unification that included any recognition of Israel.

    It is utterly counter-productive to the good of the formation of a viable, vibrant, peacable Palestinian state.

    • Cliff
      August 20, 2011, 2:23 pm

      You are simply repeating yourself, troll.

      link to

      People have commented on your one-sided standard.

    • Hostage
      August 20, 2011, 3:05 pm

      Still, the primary affect of the terror, this and follow-up shelling of Israeli civilian towns, and the school bus attack a couple months ago, will lend DOUBT to the Palestinian assertion that it is capable of self-governing in a peaceable manner as an independent state.

      Nonsense. Using violence against civilians to achieve political goals has no connection to statehood. Israel and the United States are both occupying the territory of other states and routinely violating Common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions when they carry-out extrajudicial killings of the civilian inhabitants and displacing the lawful inhabitants. The US State Department maintains a list of States that it has accused of supporting terror. Other countries have accused the US of sponsoring terror through its “U.S. Army School of the Americas”, & etc. According to the International Law Commission, the crime of aggression can only be committed by the officials of a state. The requirement for UN membership that a candidate be a “peace loving state” has always been ignored.

    • Chaos4700
      August 20, 2011, 5:06 pm

      Witty, did Jews blowing up hotels a few decades ago lend DOUBT to the “Jewish” assertion of self-governing? How about erasing 500 villages from the face of the earth? Or blowing up schools, mosques and hospitals NOW?

      Explain to me why different rules apply to Palestinians than to you.

      • Citizen
        August 21, 2011, 8:40 am

        Witty says: I didn’t do anything, Chaos. I never joined the US Army or the IDF. In fact I’ve called US military recruiters pedophiles when my son was around. All I did back in the Nam days was protest US military incursions, which I don’t do know, and I never once protested any IDF incursion or those of the early founders of Israel. Don’t blame me for being complicit in war crimes just because I’ve stated if I had been an adult back in ’48, and in Palestine Mandate land, or even sitting cozy here in USA, I would have allowed Stern Gang & Irgun massacres, while holding my nose. And I also said I may have to condone such in the future. Don’t fault me for being honest once in awhile.

    • Donald
      August 20, 2011, 11:31 pm

      “It is utterly counter-productive to the good of the formation of a viable, vibrant, peacable Palestinian state.”

      That’s true. Of course this applies many times over to Israel, which apparently can’t help but practice apartheid and ethnic cleansing and commit war crimes.

      • Richard Witty
        August 21, 2011, 6:02 am

        Lets talk actually about the relation of the terror to the stated content of the article “block Palestinian statehood”.

        The incident fell right into the idiot likud’s hands.

        They wanted to dissemble from the social movement (that the far left also wanted to dissemble from, for its “distraction” from addressing the occupation). They wanted a rationalization for opposing the basis and then the result of the Palestinian petition.

        They FED likud. And, the utter failure to condemn the terror, and its political significance, in favor of repeating the rationalization of the terrorists, similarly feed likud.

        You make things worse, not better. You make the likelihood of Palestinian self-governance more remote, not more imminent.

        Ice is not turning to water at enough heat. Ice is becoming harder and colder in a well-insulated refrigeration process.

        The melting happens ONLY through the effort at mutual humanization, not at the effort of rationalization.

  15. lysias
    August 22, 2011, 2:53 pm

    Looks like the IDF had been informed (by Shabak) of the date and place of the attack, but didn’t do anything: Shabak Blames IDF for Eilat Terror Attack:

    Until yesterday night, I thought I knew or understood most of the facts of the Eilat terror attack. That changed with Anshel Pfeffer’s article in Haaretz (Hebrew) which reveals a huge fissure developing between Shabak and the IDF over the terror incident. Israel’s intelligence service claims that it offered a very specific warning which named the date and place of the expected attack. Pfeffer’s article, apparently based mostly on Shabak sources, says that the IDF upgraded its security presence on the southern border. But that in significant ways it downplayed the warning and specifically refused to believe the terrorists would mount a daylight attack, and do so near an Egyptian military post on the Israel-Egypt border.

    . . .

    Another strange disjunction I reported last night is that while Bibi Netanyahu almost immediately claimed that the Popular Resistance Committee orchestrated the assault and used this claim to justify killing the group’s top leadership in an Israeli counter-terror attack; Avital Leibowitz, the IDF’s foreign media spokesperson told Lia Tarachansky that the army was NOT claiming the PRC was responsible. She would only claim that the attack emanated from Gaza.

    All of which means that Netanyahu used the Eilat attack as a pretext to gun down the PRC commanders. In fact, it seems unlikely to me they were responsible because, as I posted a few days ago, if your terror organization is about to mount a major terror operation the one thing you do NOT do is gather your top commanders in the same place at the same time. It only makes you a sitting duck for a revenge attack. So I don’t believe these militants were responsible.

    False flag or not, maybe the IDF at least let it happen on purpose.

    • lysias
      August 22, 2011, 3:00 pm

      Leibowitz’s claim that the attackers came from Gaza also apparently is not withstanding scrutiny: Evidence undermines gov’t’s claim that terrorists were Gazans:

      An unknown group carried out a combined attack from Sinai into Israel, hitting a number of targets. Six Israeli civilians were murdered and two soldiers were killed; so were seven of the terrorists and a number of Egyptian security personnel. While the attacks were carried out, Minister of Defense Ehud Barak quickly told the public the people responsible were the Popular Resistance Committee of the Gaza Strip; within hours the IAF attacked a house in the Strip and killed several of its leaders. Later that day, Prime Minister Netanyahu said that the people responsible for the attacks were killed. This attack by the IAF is what spurred the recent round of escalation – and it’s worth noting the IAF has been raising the flames in the regions for about a month, with the Israeli media quietly ignoring it.

      However, Israel has never supplied any proof that the attack has indeed originated in the Gaza Strip. The PRC have denied involvement in the attack. An Israeli propaganda apparatus, the Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center, also claimed (Hebrew) the PRC was behind the attacks, but had to tautologically write “no terror organizations has publicly claimed responsibility for the attack and the Popular Resistance Committee has denied any involvement. However, the Israeli prime minister and other Israeli officials have pointed to the Popular Resistance Committee as the organization who carried out the attack. So, according to the ITIC, the fact that Netanyahu is proof enough, even if the other side completely denies it.

      During the weekend, the news website Real News interviewed a senior IDF Spokesman officer, Lt. Col. Avital Leibovitz, who’s in charge of the IDF Spokesman with the international media. Leibowitz denied that the IDF connects the PRC to the attacks, said she was not responsible for that the prime minister said, but claimed that the attackers did come from Gaza, citing as proof the fact they were using Kalashnikov assault rifies (Sic! 2:28 and onwards in the video). I dunno how to put it to Col. Leibovitz, but Kalashnikovs are the most common light assault rifle in the world – a gift that keeps on giving from the defunct Soviet Union – and are rather easy to get all over the Middle East.

      In a phone conversation with Leibovitz yesterday, she said “senior officials have already expressed themselves on the issue”, and declined to provide more information on the attackers, aside from insisting on them being Gazans. I asked her if she could provide me with the identity of the attackers killed by the IDF, which was until recently standard procedure, carried out within hours of an attack. She said this is unfortunately impossible, and repeatedly insisted they were Gazans. B’Tselem researchers in the Strip, contacted via B’Tselem today, were unaware of the identity of the attackers. Again, usually they are quickly identified and a mourners’ hut is rapidly constructed. They were killed on Thursday; if they resided in the Strip, their families would have heard of their deaths by now.

      Yesterday evening the Egyptian newspaper Al Masry Al Youm reported that Egyptian security forces have identified three of the dead attackers. Egypt has a strong interest to claim the attackers were Gazans, since this would lessen its responsibility for the attacks; nevertheless, they say at least two of the attackers were known terrorists in the Sinai Peninsula. As far as I could find out, the rest of the bodies are in the hands of the IDF – which, again, does not reveal their identity.

      • annie
        August 22, 2011, 3:31 pm

        lysias, we just got permission from gurvitz to publish his excellent article here. it’s up in draft and i assume will be posted shortly. just thought i would mention that because that thread will be an excellent space to respond to this critically vital article. not trying to discourage others from responding to it here, just giving you a heads up.

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