There’s movement at every hand. First Carlo Strenger at Haaretz telling Peter Beinart that the two-state solution is a “mirage of the past.” Can you imagine an American publication running this?
This brings me to the final point of disagreement. You hope to save the two state solution. But I think you try to save spilt milk. You probably know the wisdom of every investment advisor. It is profoundly wrong to handle your investment portfolio reacting to previous losses. You need to look at it as if you were creating it now.
There is little use for us to decry the folly of Israel’s policy of the last forty years. We need to look at the situation as it is now: no Israeli politician will be able to retreat to the 1967 lines as long as Hamas will not radically change its views, and this, researchers familiar with the movement tell me, is not likely to happen soon.
…I have argued against the one state solution time and again; both in the version of the greater Land of Israel propagated by Israel’s right, and in the version advocated by many Palestinian intellectuals and activists and some Jewish intellectuals on the far left. I didn’t see how such a state could conceivably function, and I thought the two state solution, imperfect as it is, was preferable to all alternatives. But history has moved on, and the two state solution is nothing but a mirage of the past.
(The awfulness of this debate IMHO is that Palestinians face these realities every day, have for years, and yet we American Jews and Israeli Jews get to stand around the blackboard. Oh my. The structure of imbalance.)
He’s right that 2SS is a mirage of the past, but he’s right ONLY if the determining factor is internal Israeli politics in today’s circumstances. The on-going Israeli-preferred 1SS (apartheid like, profoundly undemocratic, oppressive to Palestinians, and based strongly on a 44 years violation of international law) is and has long been a “present reality” and will be as far as one can see — unless and until Israel’s circumstances change. BDS is the civil-society movement for such change. The UN is the place where the nations — once no longer cowed by the USA and AIPAC-like organizations — could do a nation-state-BDS action.
What’s important to realize is that Israel’s external circumstances must change either [1] to remove the settlers and end the occupation and make way for 2SS or [2] to change the present-since-1990 apartheid 1SS into a democratic 1SS.
Each path requires outside pressure. Neither can or will happen without the outside helping. Israel’s apartheid 1SS is not going to “morph” into a south African-style democracy without pressure. The 1SS-proponents do not seem to understand this (or understand it and refuse to pronounce the words).
To see that this is true, consider the 60-years of Tibetan protest against China’s take-over of Tibet. I judge that protest against China will not help the Tibetans. Protest against Israel just might work, especially after the next one or two or three major Israeli stupidities (Iran war being the one to — sort of — hope for).
“no Israeli politician will be able to retreat to the 1967 lines as long as Hamas will not radically change its views”
What does Hamas have to do with it? When they were running for office in 2005, they made lots of noise about accepting a two-state solution. It’s Israel that won’t change its views, and therefore destroyed (and continues to destroy) any hope of a two-state solution.
Is Gaza part of Strenger’s ‘vision’ of one state? Is equality? Is restitution or compensation when formerly stateless people can cross the green line back to their homes with the deeds to their lands and homes? Would an ‘Israeli’ court hear their petitions for the return of their property? The whole thing needs a huge commission of willing Israelis and Palestinians, a mixture of exiles and not on both sides to start over on the state building exercise to create something fair and equitable to both. Does that equal “destruction” to our ziobots?
RE: “no Israeli politician will be able to retreat to the 1967 lines as long as Hamas will not radically change its views” ~ Strenger
MY COMMENT: No Israeli politician will be able to retreat to the 1967 lines, no matter what! PERIOD! EXCLAMATION POINT(S)! ! !
Phil this is why i think you are the best, it’s the money quote for me and how i view the issue, it is why it repulses me so to watch it play out in zionist-time.
“The awfulness of this debate IMHO is that Palestinians face these realities every day, have for years, and yet we American Jews and Israeli Jews get to stand around the blackboard. Oh my. The structure of imbalance.)”
Stand around the blackboard indeed and pontificate all the while patting they-arrogant selves on the back over how humane and wonderful they-all-is.
Alleluyah Phillip Weiss! go tell it on the mountain, o’er the hills and everywhere!