Why my books are not published in Israel

Activism
on 132 Comments

Over a year ago, in June 2014, I was offered a contract by an Israeli publishing house for both Mornings in Jenin and The Blue Between Sky and Water.  As a firm supporter of both the economic and cultural boycotts of Israel, I refused.  I did not make my decision public at the time, but had planned to write about it eventually.  Then time passed too quickly, as time tends to do.  So rather than write an essay, I’ll just share the full correspondence here.  My decision and reasons for it are evident.  I decided to redact names, because they’re not really relevant.

The offer came to me via my agent.  The following is the relevant portion of my response to her:

As for Israeli publishers, that is not an option. When we Palestinians are free to live in [our] own homeland as equal citizens of the state, I’ll be happy to sign a contract for Hebrew translation. But until this Apartheid system falls, I will not have business dealings with Israelis.

My agent must have shared that letter with the Israeli publisher because the following was then forwarded to me:

Please be so kind as to convey my words to Susan Abulhawa:

We at [company name redacted] Publishers share your hope for the fall of the Apartheid system. Our greatest joy would be to live to see the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside the state of Israel. Since our profession concerns books, our way to help realize this dream is by trying to widen the horizon of our readers. We are constantly looking for interesting voices from the Arab and Muslim world. I personally initiated the publication of [name of author and book redacted] a few years ago  and have edited Iranian author [name of author and book redacted], that we published last year to wide public interest. I thought your voice might be of importance to our readers. Dialogue still seems to me the only way.

In the hope for future days of dialogue and peace.

My very best wishes,

[name redacted]

I responded to her directly:

Dear [redacted],

I hope you don’t mind that I’m writing to you directly.  It seems easier this way.

I respect what you’re trying to do.  While I believe that efforts should be made to engage the Israeli public in the indigenous non-Jewish Palestinian life being crushed by the state, I do not believe that is the task of Palestinians.  I further do not believe that dialogue is something that can happen when there is such gross imbalance of power.  There may be other words for such an exchange, but “dialogue” is not the right one.

It is not an easy decision to refuse to have my work translated into Hebrew, principally because Hebrew, like Arabic, is a language that is native to Palestine, spoken there by Palestinian Jews long before the establishment of Israel.  But the existence now of a supremacist state, which subverts the rights of millions of non-Jewish natives, both there and in exile, is the reason I cannot in good conscience participate in any capacity (except where I have no choice, like border crossing etc.) that might normalize exclusion and ethno-religious privilege.

There may come a time when I might see things differently, perhaps more like my friend [redacted name of author], whom I love, respect and admire, regardless of whether we agree or disagree.  But until then, I must respectfully decline your kind offer and hope that you understand.

Warm Regards,

susan

And here, her response was the last in that correspondence:

Dear Susan,

Thank you very much for writing. The imbalance of power requires an asymmetry in the speech act. I feel that my task is to listen. “I fully understand” would be a cliche,.To be more precise –  I can tell you that I feel completely ok about your refusal.

My very very best,

[name redacted]

I believe that engaging with Israeli institutions or companies lends legitimacy to an ethnocratic state whose founding principles are those of ethno-religious entitlement, privilege, and supremacy.  Celebrity names, of course, have a greater impact.  But the only real legitimacy Israel can ever truly have, must come from the indigenous population.  That’s the reason they are constantly demanding that Palestinians recognize their right to exist as an exclusively Jewish nation.  It is only when recognition by the legal, historic, and cultural heirs who have belonged to that land for centuries (at least), can Israel claim the legitimacy chase.  Their claim of Palestine, of our homes and history and heritage, of our culture and food, native songs and stories, was laid by the force of arms and terror, as all settler colonial enterprises do.

How could I sell my novel rights to a people who have been destroying our society?  To a people who have barred me from so much as visiting my country?  To those who speak so confidently of a right to possess a land that has been nurtured by the bodies of our ancestors?

About Susan Abulhawa

Susan Abulhawa is the author of the international bestselling novel, Mornings in Jenin (Bloomsbury, 2010) – www.morningsinjenin.com – and founder of Playgrounds for Palestine – www.playgroundsforpalestine.org.

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132 Responses

  1. WH
    December 16, 2015, 12:55 pm

    Understandable enough, but getting first-hand Palestinian perspectives (which doesn’t mean fake ‘dialogue’) would surely help some Israeli Jews to understand the reality. I generally support the boycott, but I wonder if this isn’t counter-productive.

  2. Neil Schipper
    December 16, 2015, 1:54 pm

    Would an 1840’s slave with literary talent who rode the underground railroad to Chicago refuse to have her work published in Alabama?

    Gandhi in British India?

    Would Ayn Rand have refused to have her work published in Communist Moscow in the 1950’s?

    Western Arab radicals and their radical Trotskyite apologists appear to have a special talent for camouflage. They show great care to not step too closely to the taboo on forms of engagement that might be seen as undercutting the eliminationist fantasies and hysterical dehumanizing incitement preferred by their tougher comrades embedded in the established networks that control money, weapons and the heavily propagandized education on the Palestinian street.

    Meanwhile, for those who care to know, daily life in Palestine, when objectively assessed, including self-reported experience of life, is near to or better than that of some 1/3 of the nations on the planet.

    In particular, life in Palestine compares favorably not only to life in the least fortunate countries in Africa and the Middle East (including of course those presently embroiled in hot sectarian war — it would be an obscenity to try drawing conclusions by comparison with these).

    No: life in Palestine compares favorably to countries that have not known full out civil or cross-border war for one or two or more generations: Egypt, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, South Africa, India, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras, Viet Nam, Philippines, Morocco.

    http://report.hdr.undp.org/
    http://worldhappiness.report/

    Whatabouterry — it’s deep, especially to people curious about why the world is the way it is, and people interested in lived progress.

    On the other hand, those who insist that “supremacist settler-colonialism” explains pretty much everything, and hold to a juvenile narcissistic equalism — such people are unreachable by facts.

    • Kris
      December 16, 2015, 7:42 pm

      @Neil Schipper: “In particular, life in Palestine compares favorably not only to life in the least fortunate countries in Africa and the Middle East (including of course those presently embroiled in hot sectarian war — it would be an obscenity to try drawing conclusions by comparison with these).”

      You use as evidence of this the UNDP “Human Development Index” ratings. But, from the UNDP:

      Human Development Index (HDI)

      The HDI was created to emphasize that people and their capabilities should be the ultimate criteria for assessing the development of a country, not economic growth alone. The HDI can also be used to question national policy choices, asking how two countries with the same level of GNI per capita can end up with different human development outcomes. These contrasts can stimulate debate about government policy priorities.

      The Human Development Index (HDI) is a summary measure of average achievement in key dimensions of human development: a long and healthy life, being knowledgeable and have a decent standard of living. The HDI is the geometric mean of normalized indices for each of the three dimensions.

      The health dimension is assessed by life expectancy at birth, the education dimension is measured by mean of years of schooling for adults aged 25 years and more and expected years of schooling for children of school entering age. The standard of living dimension is measured by gross national income per capita. The HDI uses the logarithm of income, to reflect the diminishing importance of income with increasing GNI. The scores for the three HDI dimension indices are then aggregated into a composite index using geometric mean. Refer to Technical notes for more details.

      The HDI simplifies and captures only part of what human development entails. It does not reflect on inequalities, poverty, human security, empowerment, etc. The HDRO offers the other composite indices as broader proxy on some of the key issues of human development, inequality, gender disparity and human poverty.

      A fuller picture of a country’s level of human development requires analysis of other indicators and information presented in the statistical annex of the report.

      I don’t think that the HDI, which “does not reflect on inequalities, poverty, human security, empowerment, etc.”, supports your implied assertion that life in Palestine is pretty much ok.

      The World Happiness Report ranked countries on the basis of six variables: GDP per capita, social support, healthy life expectancy, freedom to make life choices, generosity, and freedom from corruption. Apparently the reason that India ranks down by Palestine is the lack of social support that Indians feel. http://www.firstpost.com/living/india-is-less-happy-than-pakistan-palestine-says-world-happiness-report-whats-going-on-2288076.html

      If India’s ranking is brought down by perceived lack of social support, it is possible that Palestine’s ranking is brought up by perceived social support and generosity, which are well-known qualities of Palestinian culture.

      I’m sticking with my “juvenile narcissistic equalism,” by which I suppose you mean the insistence that Palestinians deserve equal rights with Jewish Israelis.

    • diasp0ra
      December 16, 2015, 7:57 pm

      @Neil

      Wow, you sure are reading a lot into this article. Eliminationist fantasies? News flash: Palestinians weren’t the ones pushed forward by an ideology to destroy the natives of a far away land.

      It’s completely her right to not want to take Israeli money. But your little rant was entertaining.

      As to your second argument..what are you trying to say? Since Palestinians apparently live “better” than some places in the world (1/3rd lmao dream on)..what exactly. It’s okay? What is your argument?

    • Sulphurdunn
      December 17, 2015, 7:55 am

      “In particular, life in Palestine compares favorably not only to life in the least fortunate countries in Africa and the Middle East …”

      Life in the trailer park down the road from the gated community where my friend lives compares favorably with other trailer parks I have seen. Was there some point to your analogy or was it just a red herring?

    • CigarGod
      December 17, 2015, 10:46 am

      Omg…one of these days I’m going to laugh so hard I choke on my cigar.

      Neil, buy a ticket, turn off your computer and smuggle yourself into Gaza…and post your reviews on Yelp.

    • eljay
      December 17, 2015, 11:37 am

      || Neil Schipper @ December 16, 2015, 1:54 pm ||

      So, basically:
      – Justice, accountability and equality are for “juvenile narcissistic” chumps.
      – People who suffer injustices should STFU and thank their lucky stars that things aren’t worse.

      Interesting. This bit of “reasoning” applies to people who are Jewish as well as to people who are not Jewish, yes? Why do you hate Jews so much?!

    • talknic
      December 17, 2015, 11:51 am

      @ Neil Schipper “Would an 1840’s slave with literary talent who rode the underground railroad to Chicago refuse to have her work published in Alabama?”

      Wrong question. Should be : Would an 1840’s slave with literary talent who rode the underground railroad to Chicago refuse to have her work published by an Alabama publisher?

      “Gandhi in British India?”

      http://www.mkgandhi.org/grf_books.htm …. http://www.mkgandhi.org/other_publishers.htm

      “Would Ayn Rand have refused to have her work published in Communist Moscow in the 1950’s?”

      Wrong question. Should be: Would Ayn Rand have refused to have her work published by a Communist publisher in Moscow in the 1950’s?

      • RoHa
        December 17, 2015, 5:32 pm

        Ayn Rand should have been delighted that anyone would publish her tripe.

  3. Stephen Shenfield
    December 16, 2015, 5:46 pm

    Ms. Abulhawa

    From the title of this article I expected it to be a complaint that the Israeli government or Zionist pressure groups had somehow prevented the publication of your work in Hebrew. That really could happen, because it is certainly in their interest to keep anything that might induce Israeli Jews to question Zionist assumptions out of their reach.

    When I grasped what the article was really about I was flabbergasted.

    Do you think that the publication of your books in Hebrew would be more likely to strengthen or to weaken the hold of Zionist ideas over the minds of Israeli Jews?

    Who are you allied with on this matter — objectively?

    As for what is and is not your task, I would say that for you, as for me or anyone else, if the task needs doing and you are in a position to do it then it is your task.

    You are cutting off your nose to spite your face.

    Please think again.

    • diasp0ra
      December 16, 2015, 7:31 pm

      @SS

      BDS goes both ways. Why would she accept institutional Israeli money when she knows that it was raised through Palestinian suffering?

      • WH
        December 17, 2015, 3:01 am

        It’s a publisher, presumably a private business.

      • Stephen Shenfield
        December 17, 2015, 7:52 am

        Perhaps you could explain how the publisher raises money through Palestinian suffering. I thought publishers get money by selling books. Anyway she need not take the money. Or she could donate it to the cause of her choice.

        There are Israelis who sincerely sympathize with Palestinians. They may be few but future developments will depend enormously on whether and how fast they increase in number. It makes good sense to do everything possible to help them in their efforts, especially efforts to make Palestinian voices more audible.

        Someone asked: why don’t they learn Arabic or other languages? Some do. But there is a class aspect to this. It is the highly educated strata who are multilingual and can read Palestinian works in other languages. Those who can read only Hebrew tend to be workers who do not have the time or opportunity to become multilingual. They are the most isolated from world culture and the most vulnerable to Zionist propaganda.

      • diasp0ra
        December 17, 2015, 8:38 am

        @SS

        “Perhaps you could explain how the publisher raises money through Palestinian suffering. I thought publishers get money by selling books.”

        It’s an Israeli institution, it is de facto erected at the cost of Palestinian suffering. Israeli money is tainted. Why should she accept that? Not even to mention any profits the publisher makes from this book will be taxed by the state and used to further entrench settlement and occupation policies. She is taking a stance against normalization. I applaud her.

        To the Israelis that are sympathetic to the Palestinians: They could always read the book in English if they can. If they can’t, there are a million places online they could go to learn and read more about first hand Palestinian experiences. Hell, they can even talk to a Palestinian living inside Israel if they cared so much. There is no lack of places.

        As mentioned in the article, she is not opposed to it being published in Hebrew, she is opposed to it being published by an Israeli institution.

        Your comment reminds me of those who argue that boycotting Israel is wrong because some Israelis are sympathetic to Palestinians. The same argument was used in South Africa and really it’s a moot point. If they are so sympathetic then they already understand why Israel needs to be boycotted.

        But if they are the kind of people who “sympathize” like “liberal” Zionists who feel bad about the occupation but still think it’s necessary to keep a Jewish majority, then no amount of first hand experiences will change their mind. Because it has nothing to do with Palestinian experiences and everything to do with their perceived entitlement to an ethnocracy where they are superior.

  4. Keith
    December 16, 2015, 6:14 pm

    SUSAN ABULHAWA- “I further do not believe that dialogue is something that can happen when there is such gross imbalance of power. There may be other words for such an exchange, but “dialogue” is not the right one.”

    That is absolutely correct. Reading your works would function primarily to salve the conscience of the liberal Zionists. Also, it ignores the massive influence of US Zionist fat-cats who absolutely desire Israel to remain a right-wing Sparta. A compromise could involve Israel lifting the siege of Gaza as a first step leading to eventual resolution. However, until Israel begins to take positive actions to at least begin to resolve its many abuses and broken promises, little if anything is to be gained by fraternizing with the enemy. And make no mistake, Israel has chosen to be your enemy.

    • Marnie
      December 17, 2015, 6:38 am

      Absolutely right. The onus is on the zionist state, not the people it continues to murder and oppress. How many narratives need to be told before they (zionists) “get it”, if ever? Is this just some academic’s attempt to display one of her books on their coffee table for their fellow milquetoasts to ooh and ahh over because they were able to get it printed in Hebrew? BFD. I applaud Ms. Abulhawa for refusing to allow herself be pimped by the zionist entity. There’s too much blood on their hands and until Palestinians are free – do no commerce with them.

  5. lonely rico
    December 16, 2015, 8:10 pm

    >WH
    … first-hand Palestinian perspectives … would surely help some Israeli Jews to understand the reality.

    It seems most Israeli Jews have precious little interest in ‘understanding the reality’.
    It is just around the corner of their daily lives, which they choose not to see, willed ignorance.
    If they were really interested, they could learn to read Arabic, or English for that matter. The ugly reality of Palestinian suffering in Palestine (and elsewhere) is widely reported.

    >Stephen Shenfield

    Do you think that the publication of your books in Hebrew would be more likely to strengthen or to weaken the hold of Zionist ideas over the minds of Israeli Jews?

    The ‘minds of Israeli Jews’ appear to be in lock-down.
    You ask with whom she is allied on this matter. I am perhaps being presumptuous, but suggest she’s allied primarily with the Palestinian people, secondarily with the rest of the world who wish fervently to see justice for the Palestinians, who have suffered such vicious cruelty for so long.

  6. David Samel
    December 16, 2015, 8:30 pm

    Seems like a close call to me, but Susan Abulhawa, as usual, clearly articulates her reasonable position. I would only add that it would be difficult for her to honor and celebrate other authors’ (eg Alice Walker) decisions not to publish in Hebrew while violating BDS herself, even if an argument could be made that this is an exceptional situation (and I think Keith’s salve-the-conscience argument is more persuasive than WH’s and Stephen’s rosier arguments.)

    All in all, the Israeli publisher was quite respectful in this exchange, though I doubt that Abulhawa would agree with: “Our greatest joy would be to live to see the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside the state of Israel.” If there were a viable exception to BDS, I would think a truly anti-Zionist Israeli publisher would be far preferable to a liberal Zionist one.

  7. yonah fredman
    December 16, 2015, 10:41 pm

    Ms. Abulhawa chooses to boycott Israeli businesses. Fine. I understand her choice. But in fact assuming that her writing expresses her passion, it is not a question of dialogue, but one of communication and she has chosen to limit her communication to exclude those whose first language is Hebrew.

    • echinococcus
      December 17, 2015, 2:29 am

      Poppycock, Mr Fredman. What odds someone whose first language is Constructed Language Modern Hebrew is not a Zionist?
      The three or four cats who haven’t yet emigrated in disgust surely read English or any other Western language.

    • talknic
      December 17, 2015, 8:26 am

      @ yonah fredman

      “..she has chosen to limit her communication to exclude those whose first language is Hebrew”

      Nonsense Read the article.

      ” I’ll be happy to sign a contract for Hebrew translation. But until this Apartheid system falls, I will not have business dealings with Israelis”

      Israelis are not the only people on the planet who could publish her work in Hebrew.

      • yonah fredman
        December 17, 2015, 9:04 pm

        talknic- my statement was invalid considering the possibilities and the number of presses printing Hebrew outside of Israel. But my statement was valid taking into account the economic realities of Hebrew publishers outside of Israel whose missions do not focus on the middle east and certainly not the Middle east from a Palestinian perspective. It is okay for me to figure in economic realities and conclude that her decision to boycott Israel will end up with a stunted communication.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 4:57 pm

        “It is okay for me to figure in economic realities and conclude that her decision to boycott Israel will end up with a stunted communication”

        Shorter “Yonah”: ‘Israelis have a right to make a profit off her! And, why should they read her if they don’t?’

  8. can of worms
    December 17, 2015, 12:05 am

    The Israeli publishers are so out of touch with Palestinian reality that they suppose they’re doing someone a favor these days when they patronizingly say, “Our greatest joy would be to live to see the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside the state of Israel.” Well, kiss my segregated axe! I assure you, my greatest joy would be to see a Bantustan state with no power and no resources situated right alongside the state of Israel! And my other greatest joy would be to prevent the democratic one state solution!

    Abulhawa has taken a truly beautiful stand against Israeli normalization. nuff respect.

    • can of worms
      December 17, 2015, 2:15 am

      “Our greatest joy.” My, my. I mean, it took me a moment to realize just how patronizing and entitled that really is.

      “Our greatest joy would be to live to see….” One can imagine parents saying to their children: Our greatest joy would be to live to see you both get married and have children! Or our greatest joy would be to see you start a business. Or (same difference) imagine a preacher: Our greatest joy would be to live to see each of you embracing God’s Plan. Again: Our greatest joy would be to live to see you all settled alongside Israel as a Jewish State.

      And then, the “joy” to live to see it!! I mean, leaving out the 2ss thang, the fact that you can speak of your “joy” in this context – people are killed, injured, extremely humiliated every minute of the day. And all you can do is anticipate the “joy” of the moment of declaration on TV when apartheid has ended! That moment will be joyous, but it is only a moment in a long struggle that endures!

      And the fact that you imagine yourself in the center speaks volumes about the normalization at stake in any Palestinian’s publishing with you.

  9. mcohen.
    December 17, 2015, 3:00 am

    i think it was a great idea not to publish in hebrew.perhaps she will change her mind when only arabic is the accepted language in israel.then she could publish in hebrew to be daring.

    or maybe she could not publish at all,and just do the occasional podcast,

    i read somewhere that back in the day when great works were possible,mailer nabakov,picasso,……people would talk about a particular book or record and ask the question……yes….but did they have something to say

    • Mooser
      December 17, 2015, 4:39 pm

      “i read somewhere that back in the day when great works were possible,”

      Ah, “mcohen” it’s very nice to see you are working your way back to a total ellipse of the mind.

  10. Ossinev
    December 17, 2015, 7:24 am

    @Krauss = A1 comment
    “The Israeli publishers are so out of touch with Palestinian reality” All the Hebrew language books under the sun detailing the Palestinian reality will have absolutely no effect on the vast majority of Jewish Israelis who are now irreversibly locked into an alternative Zionist reality.
    The rapidly dwindling minority of conscionable Israelis like Gideon Levy who have been trying to coax their fellow countrymen back to reality have failed and will continue to fail. Kerry has failed and has given up.Anything even the smallest of things which drags out this charade is to be avoided.

    Susan Abulhawa has correctly identified this publishing approach , whether deliberate or inadvertent , as an invitation for her to collaborate in the normalisation of Israeli Apartheid and has quite rightly refused.

  11. Sulphurdunn
    December 17, 2015, 7:52 am

    “In particular, life in Palestine compares favorably not only to life in the least fortunate countries in Africa and the Middle East …”

    Life in the trailer park down the road from the gated community where my friend lives compares favorably with other trailer parks I have seen. Was there some point to your analogy or was it just a red herring?

  12. a4tech
    December 17, 2015, 8:33 am

    I totally get Susan’s point. It is the same sentiment shared by POC and Muslims toward white liberals in America. We do not want your solidarity, we do not want your activism towards our liberation, you are the enemy now as you have been in the past 500 years since the inception of white supremacy. Israel must cease to be a Jewish supremacist state for Israeli Jews to free themselves from the hatred and hostility shown to them, regardless if they are Zionist or not.

    White people need to concern themselves with abolishing the white supremacist realm of USA, Canada, Australia, NZ etc before trying to build solidarity with oppressed folks. You, directly or indirectly, are the cause of our oppression, and as long as that is the fact, you positioned yourselves as our enemy, the ultimate antagonist in our life struggles.

    • Stephen Shenfield
      December 17, 2015, 12:00 pm

      The practical result of Israeli Jews feeling “hatred and hostility regardless of whether they are Zionist or not” is to reinforce their own group solidarity and identification with the Zionist state. Whatever you may think they “need to concern themselves with” that is going to be the practical result. Although it is not your intention, objectively you are strengthening Zionism.

      • zaid
        December 18, 2015, 12:29 am

        I am a Palestinian and i am proud of the support we have from people of all backgrounds.

        A4tech is an African American and he have an unresolved issue with the white west due to the historical injustice they received in the past.

        I am not going to comment about that subject because i am not knowledgeable about it, but i think this issue shouldnot be used against the honorable people in this site who despise Racism against Africans as much as they despise Zionism.

      • can of worms
        December 18, 2015, 1:38 am

        @zaid,

        Wow, this is remarkable, there aren’t too many African Americans at Israeli university halls doing Whataboutery work for the student union. (You know how strict the Jewish Agency is about its “one-drop rule” and successful service in the IOF) Hmmm… what does the “4tech” stand for, “The Technion”? Or “ivri”: “The Ivrit” University?

      • a4tech
        December 18, 2015, 3:06 am

        No Zaid, I don’t have an issue with white people, just as I have no issues with Koreans or Greeks. The problems are internalization of white supremacism and the colonial mentality in many here. POC have been fighting oppression 24/7 for all our lives, for 500 years through slavery, colonialism, neo-colonialism, capitalism, Zionism, and neo-liberalism. We are fighting the system that is unrelentingly trying subjugate and destroy us, not white people.

        In doing so, we need the space, among ourselves POC, to regroup and coordinate our political strategy, and also to heal the wounds from living in this white supremacist society. The act of white people continuously stepping into our struggles, our activism and our political space is an act of violence towards us.

        White people need to understand, that their existence is contributing to our plight in this system. There should be no arguments here. As long as the system is standing, all white people are the oppressors, the privileged, the racists, the source of our agony.

        If all you are trying to do is appease your sense of entitlement toward everything from politics to cultures of foreign people, then go ahead and speak for the Palestinians and Muslims. However, don’t be surprised if you are met with derision from us for your self-righteous and intrusive actions. Instead, try to act in solidarity instead, and work along-side us, on equal footing, to dismantle the systems of oppression existing in Israel and USA and everywhere else. White guilt and solidarity are not the same thing, and right now I see little of the latter.

        Tova, I would be grateful to hear your critic of my opinions and stance towards this aspect of IP activism.

      • Annie Robbins
        December 18, 2015, 4:40 am

        As long as the system is standing, all white people are the oppressors, the privileged, the racists, the source of our agony.

        what.ever. zzzzzzz…

        White people need to concern themselves with abolishing the white supremacist realm of USA, Canada, Australia, NZ etc before trying to build solidarity with oppressed folks.

        hmm, whom to believe? should i take my cue from an anonymous poster who claims to be an african american (and a muslim? – i can’t recall) speaking with a forked zionist tongue or the non-anonymous palestinian lead bds movement? sorry 4tech, you’ve got zero creds w/me. and everything you’re preaching totally serves the state of israel. not buying it.

        p.s. it’s not your job to preach what i “need to concern” myself with. i can think for myself. and you are a woefully unconvincing hasbrat as far as i am concerned.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 12:13 pm

        “A4tech is an African American and he have an unresolved issue with the white west”

        “Zaid” my friend, has “a4tech” ever said that? I don’t think he has, so don’t assume it. Anybody can pretend anything they like on the web.
        Just because his ostensible attitudes might lead you to make that conclusion, don’t!
        Why don’t we let him tell us, when and if he feels it is necessary?

      • a4tech
        December 18, 2015, 12:15 pm

        Annie, solidarity with a cause is a two way street. You may really want to help and involve yourself in the Palestinian liberation movement, however this is should be done in consideration of what the Palestinians themselves want from you. Otherwise you are pushing yourself into a space, that is not meant for you. Here’s a link to help you better understand my point.http://muslimgirl.net/17523/muslim-allyship-guide-for-those-seeking-solidarity/

        Note that I am not talking about pursuing your own political interest, which is no ones business but yours. Although political activity and solidarity have many intersections, they are not the same. There are strict rules in solidarity due to the multiple stakeholders involved and potential conflicts of interest, for example a white American who supports Palestinian rights while supporting American foreign policies at the same time.

        In this scenario, many Palestinian-Americans would find your show of support towards them undesirable and unwanted, as it clashes with their opposition to American state violence in the Middle East and the state sponsored demonization of Islam. It is best in this case to act in your own interest, without intruding into the political acts of others. You do have your own interests right, as a white American? Pursue it with the best of your abilities, and let others pursue theirs. Being candid and open with your interests is also good when trying build solidarity. Right now I have no idea what do you stand for and want out of this whole conflict, and as such makes it awkward to engage with you in terms of politics and solidarity.

      • Annie Robbins
        December 18, 2015, 4:03 pm

        I have no idea what do you stand for and want out of this whole conflict

        and yet you insinuate i support Palestinian rights while supporting American foreign policies at the same time.

        american policy in the ME doesn’t support palestinian rights and i do not support american intervention in the ME. my support for palestine, palestinians including Palestinian-Americans does not clash with my “opposition to American state violence in the Middle East and state sponsored demonization of Islam”, it reinforces it.

        your link, it says

        Read: white allies, shut shit DOWN.

        it doesn’t say stand down.

        Your objection and denouncement could hold a very serious hand in halting much of this hate.

        doesn’t say stand down.

        15. Opinions *Yours matter*

        Your opinion likely influences others,’ so help spread the word beyond the web. Write to your local paper, contact your local government official to encourage support of Muslims around you, and educate kids in community. Facilitate understanding. Breed compassion. Teach love, not hate. Never underestimate the power of an oped. Never underestimate the power your opinions can have on strangers, representatives, and children.

        this doesn’t sound like We do not want your solidarity, we do not want your activism towards our liberation, you are the enemy now , in fact it rather contradicts this sentiment of yours. if it’s awkward to engage with me, it’s because i’m calling you out on your BS and that is not supposed to feel comfortable. there’s nothing in your link supporting a notion Palestinian-Americans would find my show of support towards them “undesirable and unwanted”.

        p.s. speaking frankly (again) i don’t believe you are who you claim to be. your pretense of being a person of color is unconvincing. also, palestinians including palestinians in the diaspora do not always think in unison on every issue. i work with a fair amount of them and would take their word over yours any day.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 12:20 pm

        “what does the “4tech” stand for”

        Well, an “A4” is an Audi. And I have also heard of a military rating of “tech”
        Anyway, I sure hope it’s the Audi. Military or Medical? That’s frightening. I mean, the guy doesn’t even know how sexual reproduction works:

        “There isnt some factory in the sky that continuously develops and build brand new souls and identity everytime a baby is born or to replace dead ones. People now are just the newer cells, replacing the old ones through sexual reproduction. They are still the same cells. – See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/profile/a4tech?keyword=sexual#sthash.FehsYG91.dpuf

        Jeez, I hope it’s the car.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 1:04 pm

        “We are fighting the system that is unrelentingly trying subjugate and destroy us, not white people.”

        So clear, so natural, who could object? And we go a little further and:

        “As long as the system is standing, all white people are the oppressors, the privileged, the racists, the source of our agony.”

        D’oh!

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 7:46 pm

        “You may really want to help and involve yourself in the Palestinian liberation movement, however this is should be done in consideration of what the Palestinians themselves want from you.”

        “a4tech”, Mondo has been here nine, going on ten years. Seems to me that if Mondo was as inimical to the Palestinian cause as you submit, some, if not several, Palestinian solidarity organizations would have had something to say about it by now. Don’t you think?
        Can you think of anything keeping them from making a declaration concerning Mondo’s ‘inconsiderate’ stance?

      • Mooser
        December 21, 2015, 12:40 am

        “haven’t followed Mondo for all of those 10 years or so, but I certainly see the site changing for the better over the past couple of years.”

        You started commenting on September 26 of 2015. That’s three months ago.

    • can of worms
      December 17, 2015, 4:10 pm

      @ “We do not want your solidarity, we do not want your activism towards our liberation” [A4tech]

      I don’t understand. Doesn’t Wikipedia have a definition of a troll?

      Isn’t someone’s definition of a ‘troll’ one who posts sickly inflammatory messages in a community under the guise of an “anti-Zionist” and/or “Muslim”, with the primary intent of huffing and puffing and inducing nausea?

      • MHughes976
        December 18, 2015, 1:40 pm

        This may be trolling but it is also a reminder, perhaps salutary for white people (though this category is not well defined), that they are held in the most profound mistrust by many others.
        Mind you, this site is specifically about the ME war of ideas and it has rules, including rules about personal attacks.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 2:05 pm

        “but it is also a reminder, perhaps salutary for white people (though this category is not well defined), that they are held in the most profound mistrust by many others.”

        “MHughes976” that may indeed be true, but that sort of mistrust doesn’t seem to bother “a4tech”. He seems to be entirely un-inhibited about baring his soul and heart to anybody who will listen.

    • Mooser
      December 17, 2015, 4:47 pm

      “You, directly or indirectly, are the cause of our oppression, and as long as that is the fact, you positioned yourselves as our enemy, the ultimate antagonist in our life struggles.”

      And when a man faces his “enemy, the ultimate antagonist in our life struggles” he will need to look good. So, what’s your vest size “a4tech”?

      • MHughes976
        December 18, 2015, 1:29 pm

        I intend to continue arguing here for what I think to be justice. If some people consider the value of what I say to be dependent on my race – indeed to amount to violence against the oppressed if I am white., I stand little chance of changing that view though its existence won’t stop me saying what I think.
        I think that the ME situation is the worst thing in the world, being full of oppression, being connected to the heart of the world economy through oil production and being connected to the heart of our traditions via religion. It has the remarkable feature of mass disfranchisement, on a racial criterion, of those subject to a violently exercised sovereign power. I think that Zionism is the worst thing in this worst situation, being so mistaken and so staggeringly powerful and so widely accepted: therefore the duty to argue against it is a very important one.
        Some people, mainly Marxists, tell me that Zionism is but one feature of a wider system. I say that should that be true, it makes perfect sense to oppose a system by opposing any of its major effects that come to view.

      • RoHa
        December 18, 2015, 6:24 pm

        “being connected to the heart of our traditions via religion ”

        This does not apply to the whole world, of course, but certainly to a portion so large that the connection counts as a major factor.

      • Mooser
        December 21, 2015, 1:11 pm

        “I intend to continue arguing here…/…saying what I think.”

        That was well put. Thanks. I don’t see how we can do any better.

    • Tchoupitoulas
      December 18, 2015, 11:18 am

      Still flogging that crap analogy? People of color and Muslims aren’t segregated in the US, aren’t discriminated against by the legal system, don’t live under martial law, and can vote in elections. There’s one set of laws for everyone here, regardless of your color or religion.

      You can’t say the same for millions of Palestinians living in the territories illegally occupied by Israel.

      Old man… are you incapable of learning anything new?

    • Tchoupitoulas
      December 18, 2015, 11:33 am

      a4tech – I couldn’t figure out what to get you for Hannukah this year: a copy of Walt and Mearsheimers’ book on the Israel Lobby, or a silk screened tee-shirt that says “Je Suis Juif-Boy.”

      Which would you prefer?

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 1:46 pm

        “Which would you prefer?”

        A “tee-shirt” is, I think, a little less than adequate in “a4tech’s” chilly environment. I will send him a nice warm hoodie, silk-screened: “Je Suis Generis!”

        I have a funny feeling he will find himself outside in the cold.

  13. chinese box
    December 17, 2015, 11:13 am

    Off topic (well sort of, we are talking about writing):

    Can someone at Mondo please do a piece about this? This is a gold mine:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/18/opinion/the-assassination-in-israel-that-worked.html?action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=opinion-c-col-left-region&region=opinion-c-col-left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region&_r=0

    Cohen’s hack writing style is even more unforgivable than his lib zionist position.

  14. CigarGod
    December 17, 2015, 11:39 am

    Would her book be published without editorial censorship?

  15. Qualtrough
    December 17, 2015, 1:09 pm

    ad4tech – Your unrelentingly racist commentary is designed to divert from the topic at hand. Don’t think we are fooled by that.

    • a4tech
      December 17, 2015, 2:13 pm

      Quote my racist commentary, otherwise you are just lashing out like Zionists who shouts antisemitic at every criticism.

      By “we”, I know you mean white Americans, even though you are the main demographic who actually benefits from the Israel-USA partnership. POC and Muslims who are the main victims of this unholy alliance are often pushed out of the space to speak against Zionism, but none other than white Americans.

      We are not being given the space to speak out against our oppressors, by people who profit from our oppression. This is exactly what Susan is talking about, Zionism is killing us and our children, not yours. It is stealing our food and water, not yours. So is it too much to ask for our safe space to organize, build solidarity, and empower ourselves to fight this ideology, without being talked over by people who do this as a hobby? Ask yourself, are you genuinely trying to help the Palestinians, or are you trying to act out some form of savior complex?

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 10:19 pm

        “So is it too much to ask for our safe space to organize, build solidarity, and empower ourselves to fight this ideology, without being talked over by people who do this as a hobby?”

        Start a blog. What’s stopping you? No more being talked over by hobbyists with savior complexes. No more Moderation!
        And it’s FREE!

      • Annie Robbins
        December 18, 2015, 10:51 pm

        he’s confused.

      • Sibiriak
        December 18, 2015, 11:30 pm

        a4tech: Zionism is killing us and our children, not yours
        ———————-

        For those of us who are not “tribal”, for those of us who identify with humanity as a whole, any person anywhere, any child anywhere, is one of our own.

      • talknic
        December 18, 2015, 11:34 pm

        “Zionism is killing us and our children … It is stealing our food and water”

        It seems a4tech is now Palestinian

        in contradiction to :“It is the same sentiment shared by POC and Muslims toward white liberals in America. We do not want your solidarity, we do not want your activism towards our liberation, you are the enemy now as you have been in the past 500 years “

  16. gamal
    December 17, 2015, 8:57 pm

    “But until this Apartheid system falls, I will not have business dealings with Israelis.”

    and dialogue

    “I do not believe that is the task of Palestinians”

    I wonder if people really realize what courage it takes to talk like this in the current atmosphere Ms. Abulhawa is too much woman, i would sit quietly in the corner, hands folded in my lap, but also really wow, backbone like iron.

  17. Michael Lesher
    December 17, 2015, 10:13 pm

    For what it’s worth, it seems to me that the dialogue between author and publisher, as described in the article, is a rare example of dialogue between a Palestinian and an Israeli that is NOT falsified by ignoring or tolerating the intolerable — a condition usually demanded of Palestinians in such exchanges. For that I commend both participants.

  18. gamal
    December 18, 2015, 12:57 am

    you know the marrow in our bones is from women like Susan, the concept of too much woman maybe hard to grasp, for instance let Tanya (with subtitles, whitey) explain why real men fear women, when I look at pictures of Susan I can’t breathe [..]

    https://youtu.be/b5paJp4BUDA

  19. Stephen Shenfield
    December 18, 2015, 9:00 am

    I am not an Israeli myself, but I cannot stomach blanket hostility to Israelis irrespective of their views and behavior because I know that it is only by chance that I am not an Israeli. When I was a child my parents considered moving the family to Israel, but fortunately they were able to discern Israel’s fascist character and change their mind. We do not choose our parents, nor as children do we have any control over their decisions. Many Jews have ended up as Israelis through no fault of their own.

    You could say that when they understand and reject Zionism they should leave Israel. Some do. But again not everyone has the resources needed to emigrate in terms of meeting the requirements for entry to other countries and having the work and language skills to earn a living there. Again this is a matter of education and class (a topic very few on this site seem willing to talk about). Many are trapped in Israel.

    Several discussants have gone on about how almost all Israelis are unwilling to listen to other voices and especially Palestinian voices. True enough, I have experience of that myself. Yes, if they want to they can find ways to hear those voices. But we can’t just leave it at that because it is not only themselves they are harming when they block their ears to others’ voices. We (anyone who seeks a just peace) have to find ways to break through their defenses and push those voices into their minds, even against their will. The more translated books by Palestinians are on the shelves of Israeli bookstores, the more likely the casual passerby is to pick up one of those books and perhaps buy and read it, out of sheer curiosity if nothing else.

    I also think it would be an excellent thing if Palestinians who know Hebrew and live in Jordan or Lebanon were to set up radio stations near Israeli borders to beam in Palestinian voices. Or if Palestinians in Gaza were to fire into Israel projectiles to disperse audio cassettes of Palestinians talking to them in Hebrew, Some Israeli youngsters would surely pick up such cassettes and play them. Neither of these schemes would risk cooptation by Israeli institutions.

    • oldgeezer
      December 18, 2015, 11:41 am

      @Stephen

      I tend to agree with you. Although I respect the author’s right to make the decision that she did, I don’t feel it is the best decision. Dialogue and communication is essential to any ultimate and lasting peace. Yes there is a problem in the current situation where the process is used as a fig leaf while more and more land is stolen but that shouldn’t preclude every single form of communication.

      At times of emotion it is easy to label all Israelis as supportive of the wrongs that Israel does but I think the reality is that most of us know that is not the case. Sadly enough of them to continue to elect leaders which pursue the path of war crimes, etc.

      In the end I respect the author’s rights, and decision, but I hope that some means is made to make the book accessible to all.

    • Kris
      December 18, 2015, 12:47 pm

      @Stephen Shenfield:

      I also think it would be an excellent thing if Palestinians who know Hebrew and live in Jordan or Lebanon were to set up radio stations near Israeli borders to beam in Palestinian voices.

      Or if Palestinians in Gaza were to fire into Israel projectiles to disperse audio cassettes of Palestinians talking to them in Hebrew, Some Israeli youngsters would surely pick up such cassettes and play them. Neither of these schemes would risk cooptation by Israeli institutions.

      Trying to get information to Israeli Jews is a good idea, but setting up radio stations or firing projectiles into Israel would lead to disaster, since Israel would undoubtedly bomb the radio stations, and would use the “projectiles” as an excuse to unleash a full barrage of bombs and missiles.

      Maybe it would be better if non-Israeli Jews would engage Israeli Jews on social media, and share information in a way that might not get more Palestinians killed.

      • Stephen Shenfield
        December 18, 2015, 5:01 pm

        Kris: By all means let’s try to engage Israeli Jews on social media, but I assumed we were all agreed on the special value of exposing them to Palestinian voices. The practicalities require careful investigation and I’m not claiming my suggestions are optimal, but can we approach this in the spirit of “how to do it?” rather than immediately dismissing an idea because there is a possible problem with it?

        The Israeli government can always use anything as an excuse for aggression. Does that mean that no one should ever do anything they won’t like? They would like us to draw that conclusion.

      • Kris
        December 20, 2015, 5:22 pm

        @Stephen Shenfield: “The Israeli government can always use anything as an excuse for aggression. Does that mean that no one should ever do anything they won’t like?”

        Sending “projectiles” into Israel, or setting up pirate radio stations, would be a guarantee of more Palestinian deaths, and for what?

        Israeli Jews are about as interested in, and as likely to be moved by, Palestinian voices, as the Aryan Nations are interested in, and moved by, the voices of black people.

      • Mooser
        December 20, 2015, 6:41 pm

        “The blockade imposed by your government makes it impossible for me to get the medicine my child needs”

        is the plea of the message projectile.

        And then, from the other side, a “projectile” arcs back and is eagerly opened. It says ” So call a herpetologist”.

    • can of worms
      December 18, 2015, 1:44 pm

      @ “I also think it would be an excellent thing if Palestinians…were to fire into Israel projectiles to disperse audio cassettes of Palestinians talking to them in Hebrew”

      Well, since you think it such an “excellent thing” to “spread the message” of “dialogue”, what did you think of Mornings in Jenin and The Blue Between Sky and Water ? There has been some controversy here about the author and I am just wondering what someone as vested as you are in the beneficial conscience-raising effects of “dialogue” via paper airplanes thought of the messages you’re anxious we should send flying by projectiles.

      • Stephen Shenfield
        December 18, 2015, 5:28 pm

        can of worms: When did I use the word “dialogue”? You’re mixing me up with someone else or associating me with a stereotype inside your head. The word “dialogue” has become hackneyed through overuse and misuse. Very little of what is called “dialogue” is true dialogue, as distinct from “dialogue of the deaf.” Susan Abulhawa may be right to say that dialogue is impossible where there is inequality of power. It is certainly very difficult.

        I’ve read the first of her books that you mention but not the second. I expect they are both good material for “messages.” For use in projectiles very short messages would be best. For instance: “The blockade imposed by your government makes it impossible for me to get the medicine my child needs” — perhaps with a photo and a URL for a site containing more detailed information.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 5:46 pm

        “I expect they are both good material for “messages.” For use in projectiles very short messages would be best.”

        Stephen, please do some ballistics calculations, before launching your “projectiles”. What weight of projectile will you need to go the distance? And, uh, how do you plan to impart the necessary velocity to it? Or will it be, uh, “self-propelling”? And, got any way to assure it won’t hit some collateral Israeli?

      • can of worms
        December 19, 2015, 1:55 am

        Totally. The medium is the message. And with a few thousand tasty Hebrew fortune cookie projectiles who knows how many consciences we can pierce!

        Sit here a moment. Now, now. Enough clowning around, settle down Shenfield. Put the paper airplanes aside. I want to talk to you.

        The colonized often sends the colonizer conscience-enclosed paper airplanes, tasty audio projectiles with messages, dvds, music, clothes, hairstyles, hip hop music, books, whatever. This is done all the time. And it’s even better to do it in your own loud n’ proud n’ beautiful n’ natural language, not the colonizer’s Hebrew.

        I know this is abstract, but… are you with me Shenfield? one of the little things about the struggle against the colonizer is to make the colonizer be the one to move on over to where you choose to sit at, and to talk your talk, get ‘m to play in your field. So that’s what I’m sayin, Shenfield, jesting aside, is that when you do advise Palestinians to send Israelis those cultural projectiles, books, music, movies, etc, at least let them send the missives in their own loud n’ proud n’ beautiful natural voice. Eh?

    • Mooser
      December 18, 2015, 2:13 pm

      “Many Jews have ended up as Israelis through no fault of their own.”

      No, but now that chance has thrown the opportunity in their way, most of them seem to enjoy it.
      Look, I can think of two possibilities for the “Jews who ended up Israelis through no fault of their own”
      We could be talking about the indoctrinated children of settlers, or other Euuopean or American Zionists. Or we could be talking about the Mizrahi. Just to help me out, which did you have in mind, or was it somebody else I can’t think of? By now, couldn’t we just about cover everybody in Israel with “Jews (who) have ended up as Israelis through no fault of their own”?

      • Stephen Shenfield
        December 18, 2015, 3:33 pm

        We could disaggregate Jewish immigrants to Palestine/Israel into categories and for each category assess to what extent they were at fault (a lot, a little, or not at all). It would depend on when, from where, and under what circumstances they immigrated, what information was available to them, and what other choices they had. We could make a similar breakdown of Israeli Jews and assess on the same basis to what extent they are at fault for not leaving Israel. I haven’t made such detailed breakdowns and assessments, but to establish my general point let me give some historical examples of Jews being forced by the Zionist authorities to go to Israel.

        When the post-WW2 camps in Europe for displaced persons were taken over by the Zionists, they forcibly silenced Jews who raised the Bundist slogan “Open all the gates” (i.e., to all countries) instead of the Zionist slogan demanding that Britain open the gates of Palestine. Such dissidents were threatened and beaten up. Then they conscripted the young men into the Haganah — i.e., into the armed forces of a state of which they were not citizens and that did not yet exist. While some went willingly to fight for the Zionists in Palestine, many were forced.

        Another example concerns the emigration of Soviet Jews to Israel. The Soviet leadership agreed under pressure to allow Jews to emigrate to Israel by way of exception, but they wanted to maintain the general prohibition on emigration. So the Soviet and Israeli governments agreed on arrangements to ensure that Jews leaving the USSR would go to Israel and nowhere else. Many thought that when they reached Vienna they could pause and decide for themselves where to go next. Instead they were sent on immediately to Israel, whether they liked it or not. Of course many eventually got to the US or other countries, but others found themselves stuck in Israel against their will.

        Only slightly less clear is the case of the Jews stampeded to Israel from Egypt and Iraq by black-flag operations, i.e. Zionist agents planting bombs in Jewish cafes and synagogues to stimulate fears of anti-Semitism. This population movement was not directly forced but it was deliberately engineered.

    • Keith
      December 18, 2015, 2:38 pm

      STEPHEN SHENFIELD- “You could say that when they understand and reject Zionism they should leave Israel.”

      Aye, Stephen, there’s the rub! Where could they even go? To the US? That wouldn’t really be leaving Zionism, plus it could be seen as embracing imperialism! In a globalized world, there is no “away.” Also, don’t we already have enough refugees wandering about?

      • Stephen Shenfield
        December 18, 2015, 4:45 pm

        Keith: There is one big difference though, isn’t there? As Americans we cannot legally avoid contributing to imperialism and Zionism through our taxes but we can avoid fighting for them. Israelis cannot opt out of military service, which usually means direct personal engagement in enforcing the occupation. The only alternatives for them are prison and emigration.

      • Mooser
        December 18, 2015, 7:33 pm

        “The only alternatives for them are prison and emigration.”

        Now there’s a subject for an Israeli movie. A Jewish Israeli with strong pacifist convictions, (and a good grasp of Israel’s intransigence), who avoids being drafted into the IDF or going to prison, by converting to Christianity! But continues to practice Judaism in secret. Hilarity ensues.

        Ach I shouldn’t leave a gilt-edged yarn like that out where any gonif can get his hands on it.

      • can of worms
        December 19, 2015, 3:12 am

        @ ““The only alternatives for them are prison and emigration.”

        I don’t even think that’s true
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherut_Leumi

        Anyway, I, too, have a subject for an Israeli movie, a horror flick, called “Creeping Apartheid!”. A liberal middle class Jewish-Israeli family in a Jewish-only gated community, minding their own business and trying their best to live a segregated life, comes to believe that the specter of Apartheid is creeping around their Jewish-only suburban town, their segregated school, their home, their bed at night. It’s terrible, it’s invisible, it’s slowly approaching! It’s creeping and crawling like a drove of coackroaches on the squeaky clean kitchen tiles. Aaaah!

  20. Ossinev
    December 18, 2015, 12:53 pm

    @SS
    “But we can’t just leave it at that because it is not only themselves they are harming when they block their ears to others’ voices. We (anyone who seeks a just peace) have to find ways to break through their defenses and push those voices into their minds, even against their will. The more translated books by Palestinians are on the shelves of Israeli bookstores, the more likely the casual passerby is to pick up one of those books and perhaps buy and read it, out of sheer curiosity if nothing else”

    I fully respect the logic and sincerity of your views but IMHO the die has long been cast in terms of there being any hope of internal persuasion or conversion to the reality of Apartheid in Israel. I believe that the overwhelming majority of Jewish Israelis either through self brainwashing or brainwashing by the state are totally convinced that they are the blameless victims and nothing repeat nothing by way of internal education is going to alter that mindset. With each passing day they become more and more entrenched in what is effectively a Fascist mindset.

    Only external isolation on the model of Apartheid South Africa , once the PA has imploded, will lead to any change in the barbaric reality of 2015 Israel.

  21. Elisabeth
    December 18, 2015, 5:43 pm

    Are people like Gideon Levy and Amira Hass the equivalent of ‘helper whiteys’ then? Wow…

  22. Star Blue Bright
    December 19, 2015, 4:01 am

    Any Israeli publisher who publishes this book should be closed down. They are obviously self loathing Jews. This book would never be published in the West because we control the book publishing industry in the West. Absolute heresy !!!

    • Mooser
      December 19, 2015, 7:54 pm

      “This book would never be published in the West because we control the book publishing industry in the West.”

      Wow, that’s impressive! What else does “we control”? Got a good grip on the financial industry? Do “we control” that? What about the media, are they doing everything “we” want? Politics? Nah? Just the “book publishing industry in the West”? Okay, I guess that’s all right, if that’s all it is.
      Oh, wait, I forgot to ask who “we” is.
      Would you mind telling us?

  23. MaxNarr
    December 19, 2015, 10:48 pm

    When people like her say they won’t have business dealings with Israelis, does that include Israeli Arabs? Or is this a Jews only boycott?

    • Mooser
      December 20, 2015, 2:51 pm

      “When people like her say they won’t have business dealings with Israelis, does that include Israeli Arabs?”

      Ah, “MaxNarr”, your tender concern for the economic well-being of Israeli Arabs is very affecting.

    • echinococcus
      December 20, 2015, 7:50 pm

      Narrish question. The war of the Union against the South must have been directed against the Blacks. Boycott of South Africa pre-1994 sure was directed against its oppressed Black population. No other explanation.
      No matter what anyone says, Palestinians are hostages. Not “Israelis”.
      They are Palestinians, not Arabs for this specific purpose: their language is not in discussion, their ownership of the entire territory of Palestine is.
      To make it simpler for you, Narr: Mauritanians are Arabs, too, but they have just as much claim on any part of (mandate) Palestine as any Zionist-“Israelian”, i.e. zilch, nada, buggerall.

    • eljay
      December 20, 2015, 8:05 pm

      || MaxNarr: When people like her say they won’t have business dealings with Israelis, does that include Israeli Arabs? Or is this a Jews only boycott? ||

      I would hope that she includes all Israelis who advocate, justify, support and defend Jewish supremacism in/and a supremacist “Jewish State” in as much as possible of Palestine as well as related past and on-going (war) crimes.

      I think it would be wrong of her to give non-Jewish Zio-supremacist Israelis a free pass on injustice and immorality simply because they’re not Jewish.

      • Mooser
        December 21, 2015, 1:21 pm

        “eljay” if you would, take a look at the “Bright Blue Star” comment, and the “MaxNarr” comment below it, (starting a new conversation it’s not a reply).
        I’ve been fascinated by the uses Zionists will or won’t put the word “Jew” (and it’s derivatives) to.

      • eljay
        December 21, 2015, 2:05 pm

        || Mooser: … I’ve been fascinated by the uses Zionists will or won’t put the word “Jew” (and it’s derivatives) to. ||

        It’s as though Zio-supremacists suffer from a form of Tourette Syndrome that involves:
        – compulsively re-defining words (e.g., morality = goal + methods; Israel = Jews = Israel; etc.); and
        – repeatedly barking “ant-Semitism” and “Jew-hatred”.

  24. talknic
    December 20, 2015, 5:02 am

    @ MaxNarr “When people like her say they won’t have business dealings with Israelis, does that include Israeli Arabs? Or is this a Jews only boycott?”

    Look at it this way, Arab AND Jewish Israelis are not permitted to illegally settle in non-Israeli territory held under occupation. Many illegal Arab Israeli settlements are there?

    BTW It’s the ‘Jewish State’ in breach of more UNSC resolutions for its actions in territories outside its recognized state boundaries than any other state on the planet isn’t it? Not the ‘Arab State’ !

    • MaxNarr
      December 20, 2015, 3:06 pm

      Anyone who calls Jews living in their ancestral homeland “illegal” will have to back that up with the relevant laws.

      Furthermore I will add the disclaimer I will not converse with @talknic as his previous comments have jutified the murder of innocent Jews

      • Annie Robbins
        December 20, 2015, 9:57 pm

        Anyone who calls Jews living in their ancestral homeland “illegal” will have to back that up with the relevant laws.

        that’s a laugh. anyone calling the zionist colonial takeover of palestine illegal would likely not ever reference palestine as the jewish “ancestral homeland”. so it’s sort of a moot point.

      • MaxNarr
        December 20, 2015, 10:45 pm

        Annie,

        How is a moot point to call Israel “Palestine” the ancestral homeland of the Jews? Do you deny that Jewish national consciousness was born in Judea? In Hebron, Beit El, and Jerusalem? To do so is to deny history going back thousands of years.

        The very legality of the Jewish sovereign presence over the entire of Palestine is codified into international law as United Nations charter article 80 and reaffirms the renewed, reborn and reconstitution of Jewish revenants into their aboriginal, acenstral and native lands.

      • Annie Robbins
        December 20, 2015, 11:02 pm

        i never claimed it was a moot point “to call Israel “Palestine” the ancestral homeland of the Jews” i said it was a moot point to require someone “to back .. up with the relevant laws” anyone who “calls Jews living in their ancestral homeland “illegal”. because no one calling the colonization of palestine illegal would reference it as the jewish “ancestral homeland”. that is what i called a moot point.

        but since you brought it up, the whole concept of “rights” on an “ancestral homeland” is totally bogus. you can’t leave a place for thousands of years and come back to claim real estate deeds (because some miniscule percentage of jews remained like placeholders at a dinner party). that’s absurd. seriously, this whole “ancestral homeland” thing is a bogus brainwashed concept — as far as i am concerned. i never once wondered where my ancestors lived thousands of years ago, not once and i could care less. seriously, this is stupid. you can repeat it a million times i don’t care.

        ancestral homeland ancestral homeland ancestral homeland ancestral homeland ancestral homeland ancestral homeland

        say it a thousand times, it means nothing to me. no feelings, no rights, zilch. you are barking up the wrong tree. bye.

      • MaxNarr
        December 20, 2015, 11:08 pm

        Annie,

        We both know that Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. There is no argument about that. Therefore, Jews are not colonists in their own land. This is the most basic and simple logic. Just as the French could not colonize Paris, nor the Japanese colonize Tokyo.

        You have to be more honest with yourself and the people around you. Human to human, I have to ask you to really do some soul searching.

        I’ll give you an example, every time a Jew is stabbed or murdered, your first reaction is it was a frame-up. Even after the Fogel family was viciously murdered (which talknic previously condoned) everyone on here blamed a “disgruntled Thai worker”

        You have to accept that the Jewish people have returned. You have to accept that the ethnic cleansing of Jews that took place in Gaza will never happen again.

        You, nor your friends and allies will never expel Jews from their lands and homes no matter where they may be in Ramallah, Beit El, Jerusalem, or Tel Aviv.

        Internalize this, and you may think of a more just solution not based on forcing men, women, and children from their homes at the butt of a rifle.

      • Annie Robbins
        December 21, 2015, 12:43 am

        maxnarr’s unsuccessful attempts to hypnotize:

        We both know…..You have to be….. your first reaction is …..You have to accept….You have to accept that …You,[..] will never …..Internalize this

        zzzzz

      • Mooser
        December 20, 2015, 11:29 pm

        “Furthermore I will add the disclaimer I will not converse with @talknic”

        He’ll be crushed. Oh, BTW, do you have a way to stop him from answering you, if he feels like it?

      • Kris
        December 20, 2015, 11:32 pm

        You are so funny, MaxNarr. Obvously you wouldn’t want to “converse” with talknic! Talknic not only calls you on your b.s., he also demonstrates, with complete citations, why you’re wrong.

        I wonder about your extreme sense of entitlement. For example, you say,

        Do you deny that Jewish national consciousness was born in Judea? In Hebron, Beit El, and Jerusalem?…

        Why should anyone care when or where “Jewish national consciousness” was born? And why should “Jewish national consciousness” entitle European Jews to colonize and oppress Middle Eastern Muslims?

        Most people learn in childhood that wanting something REALLY REALLY BADLY, for a LONG LONG TIME doesn’t mean that they get to take it away from someone else. What went wrong with you Zionists, anyway?

      • Mooser
        December 20, 2015, 11:42 pm

        “The very legality of the Jewish sovereign presence over the entire of Palestine is codified into international law as United Nations charter article 80 and reaffirms”

        Yeah, “MaxNarr” I can see why you don’t want to talk to “talknic”.

      • zaid
        December 21, 2015, 12:50 am

        Max,

        Stop playing the Retard kid character.

        Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Palestinians only, and Jews Ancestral land is Europe/Khazaria

        Modern Jews have no ancestral links to the Jews of the old times who themselves were invaders and alien to the land of the Canaan/Palestine.

        It was not for the Jews then, and it is not for the Jews today.

        Besides, the place where someone’s ancestors lived thousands of years ago have no bearing on where they can live today, and doesnot entitle them to anything, and that is international law, and that is Logic.

        If an Irish American went to the embassy of Ireland and demanded the Irish Nationality the only thing he will get is the middle finger which should be given to any Zionist Jew who demand rights in Palestine.

      • MaxNarr
        December 21, 2015, 12:55 am

        Zaid uses the racial argument that Jews are really European Khazars. I want to ask directly, is this trope the official view of the Mondoweiss website? Yes or no?

      • Annie Robbins
        December 21, 2015, 1:09 am

        official views of Mondoweiss website are available here: http://mondoweiss.net/about-mondoweiss

        and here: http://mondoweiss.net/policy

        for further inquires use contact list at first link. thank you for your inquiry.

      • talknic
        December 21, 2015, 1:14 am

        MaxNarr “Anyone who calls Jews living in their ancestral homeland “illegal” will have to back that up with the relevant laws”

        Max, it’s Israelis who’re illegally settling in non-Israeli territories. The law an relevant UNSC resolutions reaffirming the Law and UN Charter don’t mention Jews

        “Furthermore I will add the disclaimer I will not converse with @talknic as his previous comments have jutified the murder of innocent Jews”

        The record here shows you’re lying Max. The Israeli Government endangers Israeli Jews by encouraging them to illegally settle in non-Israeli territories under Israeli military occupation in contravention of GC IV which was adopted in order to PREVENT all civilians being embroiled in hostilities.

        Go whine to the Israeli Government

        —–

        @ MaxNarr “How is a moot point to call Israel “Palestine” the ancestral homeland of the Jews?”

        Foreign National converts included? http://wp.me/PDB7k-Y#Jews-are-a-race

        “The very legality of the Jewish sovereign presence over the entire of Palestine is …”

        Non existent. Only states have sovereign rights to territory an the Israeli Government made it very clear the extent of it’s sovereignty in its 1948 plea for recognition http://www.trumanlibrary.org/whistlestop/study_collections/israel/large/documents/newPDF/49.pdf

        ” … codified into international law as United Nations charter article 80 and reaffirms the renewed, reborn and reconstitution of Jewish revenants into their aboriginal, acenstral and native lands”

        Bullsh*t Max. It says NOTHING about Jews or any other religion.

        Take your pathetic bitching to the Zionist Movement who limited the territorial extent of the State of Israel when they declared that state

      • talknic
        December 21, 2015, 1:34 am

        @ MaxNarr “We both know that Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. There is no argument about that. Therefore, Jews are not colonists in their own land. This is the most basic and simple logic. Just as the French could not colonize Paris, nor the Japanese colonize Tokyo “

        No Max, it’s the height of stupidity. The French and Paris are in France. The Japanese/Tokyo in Japan. Israel’s illegal settlers are not in Israel.

        “You have to be more honest with yourself ..”

        Coming from someone who has lowered themselves to blatantly lying is laugh

        ” Even after the Fogel family was viciously murdered (which talknic previously condoned) “

        Your insistence on making false accusations does nothing to help your cause. All it shows is how low you’re willing to sink and the type of scum the Zionist Colonization of Palestine attracts

        “You have to accept that the Jewish people have returned”

        Great. Let ’em go live in the Jewish State, the State of Israel. That’s what it’s for. What remained of Palestine after the Israeli Government proclaimed Israel’s borders was never included

        “You have to accept that the ethnic cleansing of Jews that took place in Gaza … “

        … by the Israeli Government.

        ” … will never happen again”

        Keeping Israeli Jews from illegally settling in non-Israeli territories would go a long way towards ensuring it doesn’t, contrary to Israeli Government policies of purposefully endangering Israeli Jews by encouraging them to illegally settle in non-Israeli territories

        MaxNarr “Zaid uses the racial argument that Jews are really European Khazars”

        We are not a race. Conversion to Judaism does not alter DNA, skin colour, facial features or anything else that can contribute to racial profile

      • Mooser
        December 21, 2015, 1:43 am

        “Zaid uses the racial argument that Jews are really European Khazars.”

        Well if I was a European Khazar. I’d be a Jewgo! Beep-beep!

        Ahh, “MaxNarr”, I knew you would calm down and talk to “talknic”, a regular conversation. I knew you couldn’t resist. Still, thanks. You didn’t have to do it, but you did.

      • Mooser
        December 21, 2015, 2:03 am

        “Beep-beep!”

        I get pushed out of shape and it’s hard to steer, when I get rubber in all four gears. You don’t know what I got.

      • a4tech
        December 21, 2015, 3:42 am

        Zaid – Stop playing the Retard kid character.

        Let’s not use offensive, ableist language here, Zaid. Thank you.

        We are not a race. Conversion to Judaism does not alter DNA, skin colour, facial features or anything else that can contribute to racial profile – See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/2015/12/books-published-israel#comments

        What is a race though? Even white people can’t really say they are a race, considering the vast genetic diversity in such populations. An Italian-American may share more genes with Palestinians than Irish-Americans for example, even though they are both white, while Palestinians are not.

        Also, while conversion in itself doesn’t alter the DNA and genetic traits, the following assimilation by marriage into Jewishness, does. This is how Ashkenazi Jews (or Khazars as racists call them) came to be.

      • bryan
        December 21, 2015, 4:39 am

        @ MaxNarr “We both know that Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. There is no argument about that. Therefore, Jews are not colonists in their own land. ”

        There is a great deal to be argued with your absurd concepts. People’s origins are often so fluid that to talk of “ancestral homelands” is nonsensical. The ancestors of the English people of today incontrovertibly lived in Scandinavia, Germany, Northern France, Scotland, Wales, Ireland and elsewhere, but no one refers to English ancestral homelands, or believes that any right exists to recolonise lands from which our forefathers once came. English national consciousness was forged over centuries. Jewish peoples had even more diverse origins.

        Zaid erroneously refers to the homeland of Jewish people as being in Europe/Khazaria when that claim can only be made for the Ashkenazi clan: as Shlomo Sand and others have demonstrated millions of Jews were also converts in Yemen, Spain, North Africa, Italy, Greece, Turkey and elsewhere. “Jewish” national consciousness was an invention of the late nineteenth century, when a few north Europeans, mostly living under reactionary regimes like the Russian and Austro-Hungarian empires belatedly argued that their ancestors had been mistaken in not forging a “national consciousness”. Before that there was only a religious and cultural consciousness, which was partly forged as you claim in “Hebron, Beit El, and Jerusalem” but far more signicantly in Babylonia (e.g. Pembedita, Sura, Nehardia etc), Anatolia, and especially Iberia (e.g. the flowering of the “golden age” under Maimonides, Halevi and similar scholars in great centres like Cordoba and Toledo. In the many many centuries before the birth of Zionism, very few Jews felt any urge to reclaim what you refer to as their ancestral homelands – one who did (Nahmanides, 1267) briefly visited Jerusalem but declared it a desolate place, populated by a mere two of his co-religionists and he swiftly left for the more salubrious coastal area.

        So what happened to the Hebrew nation which no respectable historian any longer believes was exiled en masse by the Romans? Over the centuries they either emigrated to more economically attractive areas of the world (surely thus sacrificing any national birthright) or via a process of conversion they merged with the Christian and later Moslem population of Palestine. Thus we have this obscenity called Zionism in which a few Johnny-come-lately colonists invent a narrative (totally at odds with the real history of Jewish peoples) that “justifies” the dispossession of another people from their ancestral homeland.

      • RoHa
        December 21, 2015, 5:13 am

        “We both know that Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. ”

        We know that Palestine is the land where ancient Jews started formulating their religion, though quite a bit of the later elaborations (the Babylonian Talmud) seem to have been developed in Mesopotamia.

        ” Therefore, Jews are not colonists in their own land. ”

        You will have to spell out that argument in more detail. Modern Jews live in a large number of lands. For some Jews, Australia is their own land. That is the land they were born in, bought up in, and live in. That is where their homes are, and that is the land in which they hold citizenship. How can Palestine be “their own land”?

        If your argument turns on “Palestine is the land in which their religion originated”, then the same seems to be true of Christians. Palestine would then be the “ancestral homeland” of Christians as well.

        If your argument turns on “Jewish national consciousness was born in Judea”, you will still need an argument to move from “Jewish national consciousness was born there” to “modern Jews cannot be colonisers”.

        (Assuming there is such a thing as “Jewish national consciousness”.)

        “This is the most basic and simple logic.”

        No, it isn’t. (I was paid to lecture on logic, but I will tell you that free.)

        “Just as the French could not colonize Paris,”

        Being French is being a citizen of France. But being Jewish is not a matter of being a citizen of anywhere. Lots of Jews are French citizens. They are French. They cannot colonise Paris. It is a city in their own country.

        But when French Jews go to Palestine, then they can be colonists, since the land is not their own. They are not Palestinian.

      • RoHa
        December 21, 2015, 5:15 am

        (because some miniscule percentage of jews remained like placeholders at a dinner party)

        Neatly phrased, Annie.

      • Marnie
        December 21, 2015, 6:25 am

        Listen “MaxNarr” –
        You’re sounding more and more like one of the nasty trolls on +972 that attaches itself to a particular commenter, declaring that this man has “openly called for the murder of Jews by cars” and insists this man wants to see Jews killed, which is nothing but LIES. But he continues to repeat it, over and over and over again. Just like you are doing here WRT talknic. You have continued to announce that talknic’s comments justified the murder of innocent Jews, which is absolutely ridiculous as I’m sure he would have been banned from MW. This is all a game for you isn’t it?
        The fact that your posts continue to see the light of day here is a testimony to free speech, no matter how ugly and full of lies and slander it is.

        slander

        n. oral defamation, in which someone tells one or more persons an untruth about another which untruth will harm the reputation of the person defamed. Slander is a civil wrong (tort) and can be the basis for a lawsuit. Damages (payoff for worth) for slander may be limited to actual (special) damages unless there is malicious intent, since such damages are usually difficult to specify and harder to prove. Some statements such as an untrue accusation of having committed a crime, having a loathsome disease, or being unable to perform one’s occupation are treated as slander per se since the harm and malice are obvious, and therefore usually result in general and even punitive damage recovery by the person harmed. Words spoken over the air on television or radio are treated as libel (written defamation) and not slander on the theory that broadcasting reaches a large audience as much if not more than printed publications. (See: defamation, fair comment)

        Or maybe the torah is more your speed:

        Proverbs 10:18 The one who conceals hatred has lying lips, and whoever utters slander is a fool.

        Psalm 101:5 Whoever slanders his neighbor secretly I will destroy. Whoever has a haughty look and an arrogant heart I will not endure.

      • diasp0ra
        December 21, 2015, 7:37 am

        @Max

        “Internalize this, and you may think of a more just solution not based on forcing men, women, and children from their homes at the butt of a rifle.”

        The irony of this coming from a Zionist is killing me.

      • eljay
        December 21, 2015, 7:51 am

        || MaxNarr: … Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. … ||

        No, it’s not. Palestine is the ancestral homeland of all Palestinians, some of whom happen to be Jewish. Palestine is not the ancestral homeland of every Jewish person in the world.

      • mig
        December 21, 2015, 10:09 am

        Talknic @MaxNarr “” … codified into international law as United Nations charter article 80 and reaffirms the renewed, reborn and reconstitution of Jewish revenants into their aboriginal, acenstral and native lands”

        Bullsh*t Max. It says NOTHING about Jews or any other religion.

        Article 80 (and whole chapter ) from UN charter talks about Trusteeship system. Trusteeship system was never implemented in Israel/Palestine. So it’s completely useless article in this debate ;)

      • amigo
        December 21, 2015, 10:58 am

        “If an Irish American went to the embassy of Ireland and demanded the Irish Nationality the only thing he will get is the middle finger which should be given to any Zionist Jew who demand rights in Palestine.” Zaid

        Greetings Zaid.

        An Irish American is entitled to Citizenship of Ireland if he/she can prove , one or both of their Grandparents were Irish Citizens.Any connection prior to Grandparents will not be taken into consideration.

        Unlike our zionist miscreants who allow citizenship to any tom dick and yossi who claims to be Jewish—whatever that means.

        As for maxnarr, I , like Kris and others am awaiting his reply to my request ??.

        What does he mean by “Debunked ” as it applies to BDS. I put two other questions to him but lets give him another opportunity to explain himself and then we will address the other two.With a bit of luck he will refuse to converse with me also and eventually end up talking to himself.

        Israel sure knows how to pick it,s spokespersons , eh.No wonder that pip squeak tin pot entity is on it,s way down the toilet bowl.

      • amigo
        December 21, 2015, 11:31 am

        “Furthermore I will add the disclaimer I will not converse with @talknic as his previous comments have jutified the murder of innocent Jews” maxnarr

        You just did , Einstein.

      • talknic
        December 21, 2015, 11:49 am

        @ mig “Article 80 (and whole chapter ) from UN charter talks about Trusteeship system. Trusteeship system was never implemented in Israel/Palestine. So it’s completely useless article in this debate ;)”

        Whereas Chapt XI tells us

        Article 73

        Members of the United Nations which have or assume responsibilities for the administration of territories whose peoples have not yet attained a full measure of self-government recognize the principle that the interests of the inhabitants of these territories are paramount, and accept as a sacred trust the obligation to promote to the utmost, within the system of international peace and security established by the present Charter, the well-being of the inhabitants of these territories, and, to this end:

        a. to ensure, with due respect for the culture of the peoples concerned, their political, economic, social, and educational advancement, their just treatment, and their protection against abuses;

        b. to develop self-government, to take due account of the political aspirations of the peoples, and to assist them in the progressive development of their free political institutions, according to the particular circumstances of each territory and its peoples and their varying stages of advancement; http://www.un.org/en/sections/un-charter/chapter-ix/index.html

      • MHughes976
        December 21, 2015, 12:27 pm

        What does ‘ancestral homeland’ mean? If ‘ birthplace of many ancestors’ then the same person mught have many AHs. Many Jewish people would have reason to call the UK an AH. Many Palestinians would certainly have reason to call Palestine by that name. However, there is no rational link between distant ancestry and current rights.

      • echinococcus
        December 21, 2015, 12:34 pm

        “Zaid uses the racial argument that Jews are really European Khazars.”
        That’s silly! That only refers to the Eskenazi.
        They could also be converted Berbers and Celthispanics like the Sefardi, or converted Arabs like the Mizrahi, or converted Abyssinians like the Falasha, or converted American Blacks, etc.
        So saying it’s just only Khazars is like favoring the top layer only of the racist Zionist enterprise, forgetting its underprivileged cannon fodder.

    • zaid
      December 21, 2015, 11:58 am

      A4tech

      “Let’s not use offensive, ableist language here, Zaid. Thank you.”

      Lets not play the role of the moderators.Thank you.

      “What is a race though? Even white people can’t really say they are a race, considering the vast genetic diversity in such populations. An Italian-American may share more genes with Palestinians than Irish-Americans for example, even though they are both white, while Palestinians are not.”

      And that is why a lot of Italians look more Middle eastern than Europeans.

      “Also, while conversion in itself doesn’t alter the DNA and genetic traits, the following assimilation by marriage into Jewishness, does. This is how Ashkenazi Jews (or Khazars as racists call them) came to be.”

      Genes are not password or secret numbers, they are carriers of physical features, if a population is a mixture of different Races then their physical features should reflect that mixture ,which is absent among Ashkenazim.

      unless you are talking about few percentages of genes which means probably every single European, Mesopotamian, levantine and middle eastern can be classified as Jew ….that is a lot of Jews.

      “or Khazars as racists call them) came to be.”

      Let’s not use offensive, ableist language here, A4tech. Thank you.

    • zaid
      December 21, 2015, 12:05 pm

      A4teh

      Blacks and whites in the US intermarried and procreated, so from now on you must address Mooser and Annie as Brother Mooser and Sister Annie.

      You are a confusing man, and i always assumed that you are on my side and refrained from answering some of the things that you say here, but recently you are becoming less confusing and drifting towards the Zionazis (Zionism is Nazism) in this site.

  25. Mooser
    December 20, 2015, 11:17 pm

    “To do so is to deny history going…”

    Max, nobody owes us a goddam thing for being Jewish. Zip, nada nothing.
    Sorry. It was a shock to me, too, when I first realized it.

    “reaffirms the renewed, reborn and reconstitution of Jewish revenants into their aboriginal, menstrual, and native lands.”

    Ooooh! “revenants” “A revenant is a visible ghost or animated corpse that was believed to return from the grave to terrorize the living”
    Sure “MaxNarr”, whatever you say.

    • MaxNarr
      December 21, 2015, 1:32 am

      rev·e·nant
      ˈrevəˌnäN,-nənt/
      noun
      a person who has returned, especially supposedly from the dead.

      Zaid: I will ask you not to insult people calling them “retard characters” show some empathy for children and adults with special needs.

    • RoHa
      December 21, 2015, 5:21 am

      “Jewish revenants into their aboriginal, menstrual, and native lands.”

      Revenants with PMS? That is a really scary prospect.

      • Mooser
        December 21, 2015, 12:21 pm

        “Revenants with PMS? That is a really scary prospect.”

        You bet. Like the ghost of Frumah Sarah.

  26. Ossinev
    December 21, 2015, 6:35 am

    @ MaxNarr “We both know that Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jewish people. There is no argument about that. Therefore, Jews are not colonists in their own land.”

    “Zaid uses the racial argument that Jews are really European Khazars”

    Come on then Max. Give us your definition of ” The Jewish People” or “The Jewish Race”

    Presumably it would include eg Jewish Inuits,Jewish Japanese.Jewish Maoris – such a miraculous God given DNA cocktail and all traceable back to their first century AD Judean and Samarian homesteads before the nasty Romans etc

  27. eljay
    December 21, 2015, 8:21 am

    The tag-team of…
    – MaxNarr (Zio-supremacist moron); and
    – a4tech (Zio-supremacist “Muslim” obsessed with “white genocial disease”),
    …has been doing a bang-up job lately of bogging down MW in diversionary discussion.

    So much so, in fact, that hophmi and Mayhem risk becoming redundant and/or irrelevant.

    Why do MaxNarr and a4tech hate Jews so much?!

  28. Ossinev
    December 21, 2015, 1:14 pm

    “Suspected members of extremist group ‘The Revolt’ being held without trial are American and Australian nationals.”
    From todays Haaretz.

    Interesting that the number of Western Jewish “Jihadis” going to the conflict in the Middle East appears to be on the increase.

    I wonder if they will be arrested if and when they return home ?

    • talknic
      December 21, 2015, 9:27 pm

      @ Ossinev “I wonder if they will be arrested if and when they return home ?”

      Aren’t they at ‘home’ now? Please don’t send ’em back!

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