Commenter Profile

Total number of comments: 8734 (since 2009-07-30 20:11:08)

Annie Robbins

Annie Robbins is Editor at Large for Mondoweiss, a mother, a human rights activist and a ceramic artist. She lives in the SF bay area. Follow her on Twitter @anniefofani

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  • Let's talk about Russian influence
  • I can't stop looking at these great Gawker posts about the Middle East
  • A new milestone: BDS at the Olympics
  • After Palestinian takes gold in Rio for Jordan, Israelis claim his roots are 'Israeli'
  • The Palestine-Israel language trap
    • absolutely

    • I find it incredibly arrogant and entitled for someone who is not a Palestinian to feel he knows what good or not for Palestine.

      silam just (arrogantly) outed himself as not knowing (or recognizing) what the (palestinian) goals of bds are -- which pabelmont listed after saying "Maybe the thing to do is to join BDS and its goals with a full heart and without saying what you think would be an OK diplomatic outcome"

      link to bdsmovement.net
      link to bdsmovement.net

      mary: Who are YOU, and have the Palestinians elected you to silence all those who stand up for them?

      no, they certainly have not. it's just his (false flag) shtick to get people to shut up. except the zionists of course, he leaves them alone.

    • So some people in the Jewish community started to manufacture, as status symbols false family trees,

      says the poster who's informed us several times he's got "royal blue blood in the line of King David"

      uh huh

    • Listening to language and terminology warns us about the ‘wrong’ people, and lets us know who we should listen to and who we shouldn’t, that is if we don’t want to find ourselves in the fringes of our groups or completely out in the cold. There are plenty of examples of all of these in the way we talk about Palestine-Israel.

      Who are you again? Why do you need to get it?

      Listening to language and terminology warns us about the ‘wrong’ people, and lets us know who we should listen to and who we shouldn’t, that is if we don’t want to find ourselves in the fringes of our groups or completely out in the cold. There are plenty of examples of all of these in the way we talk about Palestine-Israel.

      you have to a special kind of stupid to believe that the Israel’s existence is about establishing a Jewish authority over Palestine

      to answer your question, pabelmont is a long time contributor to this blog who is married to a palestinian. his voice matters.

  • Druze Arabs in the occupied Golan Heights discuss borders, identity, colonialism and war
  • Defying Scottish law, football fans fly Palestinian flags during match with Israeli team
    • I can tell you that to this day no child is too young to remember.

      i believe you.

    • This Neil Cameron is an ass.

      my sentiment exactly! i was writing my post below and didn't see yours til just now. and this crap about kids not remembering the troubles. i mean please!

    • go celtics! the celtic will probably get socked with a high fine from UEFA. they are not the only team in UEFA who do this, dunlauk and the saints fans do it too (to name a few). i've written about this before (a couple times as i recall). this one in more detail about the fines: link to mondoweiss.net

      aside from scotland's laws, UEFA’s Control, Ethics and Disciplinary Committee has deemed Palestine’s national flag to be “a political symbol”. (under pressure no doubt)

      neil cameron is full of crap as far as i am concerned. what is this:

      Celtic have a long tradition of flying the Flag of the Arab Revolt at games and there does seem to be some sincerity in their politics.

      there does seem to be some sincerity in their politics??? lol, gee ya think!

  • The politics of Jewish ethnocentrism
    • sick

    • people forget that their power comes from their willingness to yield

      oh yeah, the American and Israeli Jews willingness to yield. how could we forget that.

      For every rich and powerful Jews you see, there are hundreds of Jews struggling and facing all kind of challenges in their lives, that you don’t see. Black Jews, Arab Jews, Yemenite Jews, mixed or POC Jews,

      for every rich and powerful person we see, there are hundreds struggling and facing all kind of challenges in their lives that you don’t see.

    • his characterization of Levy as someone who’d sell out his people is awful close to the antisemite’s stereotypical depiction of the perfidious Jew

      "monstrous vermin" was a dead give away. this is a person who cannot hear himself. sad.

    • Is White supremacism really a bigger thing than Jewish supremacism?

      i suppose it depends on where you're coming from. most american jews are as white as the majority of americans and jewish-american supremacists are white supremacists. as far was their impact on the world and our culture, it's dangerous -- of course -- like all supremacists.

    • Do you think though that there would have been generational brainwashing if Israel had never been established in Palestine? Or never established?

      my comment was specifically addressing the ethnocentrism in yakov's article, the "moral and ethical contradictions" he addressed. i wrote about 2 (extraordinary) phenomenon merging at a specific time period. and i don't believe the "brainwashing" (for lack of a better word) i addressed (my theory/analysis) would have been applicable without the dual quality. that said, the successive generation of european jewish children born directly after the holocaust would have (likely) had an upbringing profoundly influenced by the pain, suffering (including fear) of such a horrendous event; a collective psychological condition - albeit a different one.

      The brainwashing has also been part of a propaganda machine, developed by the Zionists, to raise funds for the colony of Israel. If there had been no need to fund the State then one presumes, the propaganda would not have been required.

      right. this is what i meant when i wrote "heavily subjected to a massively coordinated propaganda campaign (regarding israel)".

      Without a State of Israel, would Jews who had personal experience of holocaust at the hands of the Nazis, have simply moved on, processed, healed as everyone else has had to do?

      for many yes, for others not. but it's likely 70 years down the road it would have been very very different. and much more private. the world would probably not be engaged in holocaust discussions anymore than they'd be engaged in the millions we slaughtered in vietnam.

      the source of so much suffering and violence has been the decision to found the State.

      i believe the holocaust is kept alive to serve the state, yes. but i don't blame the decision to found the State for the holocaust.

      indigenous peoples in many other countries have suffered similar fates but the difference has been that the nations were not founded as religious states which demanded followers hold power and superiority, and so they have evolved and despite wrongs of foundation, created one state with equal rights for all.

      indigenous peoples in many other countries have suffered similar fates but the difference has been that those conquering nations were not engaged, decades later, in presenting themselves as victims in an environment that included social media offering radical exposure leveling the playing field in public perception. the war over public perception is at an all time high because of technology. it's very clear and common sense who's the oppressed and who's the oppressor. but we've got this oppressor hammering home a radical past violation of humanity underlying the justification of current day atrocities. and it involves not just those generational jews, but world opinion, virtually everyone. it's a war the oppressor is losing. and the more they lose the more they ramp up the killing and propaganda. they just can't seem to face reality and grasp they have to change policy because you can fool some of the people all the time and all the people some of the time but you can't win the war of public opinion when you're the oppressor.

    • meant nothing less to the antediluvian Sheldon Adelson than a “pledge of destruction.”

      it all boils down to the same thing -- take it to the mat -- total destruction -- everyone want to eliminate the jews. not that dif than yonah talking about "the disappearance of the Jews".

      and rudoren would say, everyone in israel has faced this -- has lost someone, and therefore this fear is rational (and they/we should be excused from the boundaries / normal standards afforded to others).

    • who knew he would show up as Annie here at Mondoweiss.?

      i was just throwing it out there. just a hunch of course! i hope no offense taken.

    • i think it's probable that as a result of the holocaust there was an understandable (under the circumstances) generational brainwashing inflicted or imposed upon jewish children born directly afterwards.

      coupled with the founding of the state also occurring around this time, founded on myth and lies that have continued til this day, imposed a double edged burden on the psyches of many many jews, albeit, not all.

      these (2)phenomenas, the first grounded in a parental will to survive or for their children to survive, when merged together (including the toxicity of myth/lies) likely created an environment where a certain kind of collective psychological condition of group consciousness that has effected the way many jews react that is different than other people. for example, the idea and accusation of "self hating" as it is applied to the individual in relation to how it pertains to the group.

      this is unlike anything instilled into me as a child (and while i'm not claiming it's strictly a jewish thing -- i'm just unfamiliar, as an observer, encountering it elsewhere).

      given the conditions of the monstrous lie and coverup accompanying the founding of the state, the jewish community during this time period, were heavily subjected to a massively coordinated propaganda campaign (regarding israel) unlike what non jews were exposed to through the media because it was happening through their breastmilk, in their homes (and for many their schools). and they were susceptible due to the terrific generational loss directly proceeding.

      everyone wants to kill you, israel will save you, speaking against it is speaking against your people, all this stuff. and it wasn't randomly distributed throughout society -- it was specific to jewish homes. so it's quite natural the outcome of this kind of upbringing would produce a condition of damaged groupthink. it's natural that it would produce a society where a large number of people would find this propaganda simply insurmountable. and even the ones not thoroughly brainwashed by this condition would understand it and recognize it for what it is because it is so familiar to them.

      so there's 2 things really, there's the psychological condition of this generation and then there's the heavily scrutinized and selected propaganda of the state imposed on the group collectively.

      and one outcome of this is that because the state has relied so heavily on this propaganda it's been recycled over and over and over that believing lies and having faith in them and holding on to them as tight as can be has become a reality in a way that's maybe different from others. and it's taken as a given, as a first base grounded reality. so as an outsider (non jew) i listen to the sort of stuff that runs through goldberg's logic and it seems like an aberration to me. it seems as though he starts with a given and builds his case around it instead of the other way around, the centrality of this given is so great he doesn't even recognize it. like him saying 30% of his brain is the holocaust and 30% is his children and the atlantic maybe 6% or whatever. but at the core is this group survival thing. and even if jews were the most fortunate people in the world and completely safe you can't wrench this collective group think away (from those afflicted) because it's so deep.

      and this thing w/Leibovitz, he essentially calls levi a "monstrous vermin" and likely doesn't even recognize that as being outrageous. why is that? because at the core of leib's being is collective brainwash instilled in him by this damaged generation. it allows him say things like:

      Levy proved to be an even better businessman: Complex analyses of the conflict, he realized, sold for pennies on the dollar in Paris and Cambridge and Rome, but thundering accounts of Jewish perfidy paid a premium.

      why would he say this and why would the tablet publish it? because in all things israel-related lying is not just acceptable and routine, it's rewarded. and there are no more revered people in the jewish community than the myth makers. so claiming levi chucked complex analysis for accounts of Jewish perfidy and did it for money is just par for the course, there is no insult too low for a person defying the cult. it's cultish. not a cult anyone can join down at the corner store or even in a neighborhood church. this people inflicted after the holocaust were inflicted from birth -- collectively. and the efforts to inflict the next generation (outside of israel) is proving much more difficult. and as time goes on and this malady of conscience become diluted, by everything from the passing of time or the exposure to reality , those still inflicted are going to start squealing louder and louder. we're watching this unfold before our eyes. and yakov, it's likely you're obsessed w/goldberg because you too have been inflicted at one time.

    • ;) yes, well you're allowed to expose it too. perhaps because you're you. long story. let's just say if i tried submitting this for publication it likely would have been edited.

    • Rudoren said there is a lot of prejudice and racism in the world but unlike other people who are racist and prejudiced the world over, we Jews are justified in our prejudices.

      just to clarify, i don't think this is completely accurate. as i recall this is something rudoren said in a video interview so finding the full context surrounding this segment would require watching it again and transcribing it and i don't have the patience for that. either way, i read it differently.

      when rudoren said "blunt and racist in a way that’s just different from America… It’s blunter there" i thought she was specifically referencing israelis. albeit, she could have very well meant "we jews" but what she said (paraphrasing) was 'there is a lot of prejudice and racism in the world but unlike other people who are racist and prejudiced the world over, Israelis are justified in their prejudices."

      IOW, here in america we can't get away w/this shit (blatant racism) so easily but unlike other people leave israelis alone -- they have a right to be racist because of their experience.

      This sophisticated editor turns out to be so ethnocentric she can’t separate her subjective reality from reality itself. When she feels pain when Jews are killed after a Palestinian attack that pain she experiences makes her understanding of what happened totally “prejudiced”. But according to her it isn’t prejudice it’s reality.

      yeah. she's talking about herself. again, i have other comments/opinions (massively profound of course) but will let them settle a tad before sharing them.

    • this is a very interesting article. it is all over the map (and seems a tad obsessed w/goldberg but then he is an excellent example of this phenomena) but i suppose it sort of has to be to make the case. i have other comments/opinions but think i'll let it settle a tad before sharing them.

    • boomer, i tried googling word sickness in french w/parain "mot maladie Brice Parain" and a few books popped up. one by Bernard-Henri Lévy -- you might try it. but parain's wiki page says

      He is obsessed with the problems of language . The critic Charles Blanchard nicknamed "the Sherlock Holmes of language." He continues to scrutinize the mysteries of the origin and evolution of words. Evidenced by later testing as Essay on the Platonic Logos ( 1942 ) research on the nature and function of language ( 1942 ) or on the dialectic ( 1953 ).

      but i don't think the issue hirsch is discussing is a problem w/language, at all.

  • 'The Forward' fails to find source of anti-semitism hoax that its reporter concocted (Updated)
    • killer report again Phan! radical update.

      yesterday after a few tweets back and forth w/adkins (where she called mondoweiss a hate site and other diversions) 8 minutes after a sent her a link and screenshot from phan's 2014 article busting her she blocked me.

      by "evolving" story maybe she meant the more she got outed the more she'd reveal

  • The breathtaking arrogance of Alan Dershowitz's 'advice' to Black Lives Matter
  • 'It's like we're born with guns in our hands': Young Israelis face prison as they resist military conscription
  • Palestinian anti-racist struggle against Zionism and Black anti-racist struggle against White supremacy are crucial to building a just world
    • I doubt it is an actual thing.

      Who are you again? Why do you need to get it?

      divert divert divert. supremacy is not merely a matter of the will of the oppressor, it is something in the mind of people who yield, submit or defer to that authority. this is one reason the accusation of anti semitism is used so liberally by supporters of israel, because people are programmed/manipulated to fear being accused of being an anti semite. and yet when a jew does it to another jew people defer and don't call it out for what it is. it's why a person like Leibovitz can suggest another jew is "monstrous vermin" -- because the reader will mentally defer and not call him out for it as they would a non jew. you can't will that kind of reality away by saying "end of story". not when we're programmed as a society to defer or yield to jewish judgement on certain matters of import.

      Not sure how ethnocentrism would work when Iranian Jews will have one view of other cultures, while Polish Jews will have another.

      you not understanding how something works doesn't mean it not a "thing", nor does it mean it follows some kind of uniformity. every individual perceives their culture individually anyway.

      you have to a special kind of stupid to believe that the Israel’s existence is about establishing a Jewish authority over Palestine

      nothing to see here folks, moving right along. divert divert divert.

    • and jewish ethnocentrism -- is that also something you don't recognize? when you say Jewish supremacism is not a thing do you also mean you do not recognize any of the authority of the jewish state's occupation over palestine as being jewish? or do you not recognize it as supremacism?

      and while i don't think colonialism, regardless of where it's taking place, as 'jewish', i do recognize many of the people administrating it in palestine are doing it because they think they have a right to the land due to their jewishness.

  • The last Gaza war worried Scotland's Jews-- for all the wrong reasons
    • how horrendous! i think it's likely they do this to train their soldiers how to harass and demand palestinian submission. the village is used as a live setting they routinely use like a zoo or something. 'ok guys, let's do a raid training just for the heck of it to harass the family if he's going to expose us internationally we'll give them hell!'

    • Page: 87
  • Beinart calls anti-Zionists 'revolutionaries'
    • what's this "in the region" qualifier? you said liberal democracy i said no -- it's not. and half the people the regime rules over have no "civil liberties protections" so please spare us. and what's this "gay people can live openly without fear" bs when you know damn well gay palestinians are targeted for collaboration because they are gay. how groovy is that? and palestinian women are as fully integrated into palestinian society as jewish women are in israeli society. in fact, i think one of the most famous palestinian women who ever lived is serving in the knesset heavily targeted btw, and another palestinian female politician keeps getting thrown in prison for nothing! seriously, get a grip.

    • i think they're revolutionaries.

    • israel is not a liberal and democratic state and how could any people occupied for decades be liberal and democratic? occupied people don't get to chose their rulers, obviously. the authority is the occupying gov and forces.

    • i'm not sure i agree with stephan low that identifying "revolutionaries... semantically justifies Establishment “violence” to overcome and defeat these enemies of order"

  • The dark secret of Israel’s stolen babies
    • And he’s such a cutie

      ;) and a radical talent. i like a lot of his music.

    • great lyrics

      Hey you imported Arab,
      Take it from a local Arab
      You were dragged here
      To take my place

      It’s hard to be an Arab
      It’s really hard, ask me
      It’s hard to be an Arab
      How much can one be black
      Under the rule of the rich and white
      In the land of Palestine

      - See more at: link to mondoweiss.net

  • Boycott, from within and without
    • Tough shit...Otherwise tough shit.

      how helpful steve, why didn't i think of that?

    • no source at all, what's up w/that mcohen. and why do you think they skipped the source, not even mentioning an anonymous source? and if it was true why don't you think the information was revealed in the US since it is allegedly happening on US campuses. i wouldn't concern myself with such a flimsy "report".

    • I moved from Israel; because I was a Christian Jew; so I basically had no civil rights

      why do you keep repeating yourself, you've told us this before numerous times? do you really think anyone here is that interested in your personal story over and over again. all your posts seem autobiographical. and where do you come up w/this absurd use of the semicolon? google it and learn how to use it once and for all.

    • benedict, Assuming the goals of BDS will ever materialize it will risk the lives of countless Israeli jews

      not necessarily.

      Most Israelis regard this goal as deeply offensive and dangerous hence the attitude to those who support it.

      Most Palestinians regard this goal of a zionist state as deeply offensive and dangerous hence the attitude to those who support it.

  • Palestinian family homeless after Israeli military takes home for military post
  • Olympian at the checkpoint: why a Palestinian swimmer couldn't train in Jerusalem
    • palestinians are not foreigners in palestine. you can't change the name of a place and then claim indigenous people there are therefore foreigners. clueless idiot.

    • The civilians you are talking about are illegal settlers, thus the only legal response for Israel is to evacuate them.

      the settlers are human shields -- therefore their deaths are merely collateral damage according to israeli doctrine. maybe a knock twice 30 seconds notice to evacuate before a mass slaughter would make it a-ok.

    • Christian Zimmermann is palestinian

      He obtained dual citizenship in 2011, when he became a naturalized citizen of the State of Palestine. He switched his national allegiance from Germany to Palestine in 2013, becoming one of only six Palestinian equestrians registered with the International Federation for Equestrian Sports.[3] He chose to switch to Palestine after meeting a Russian diplomat with Palestinian roots, which made him think about the German role in the history of Israel and Palestine.[3][4]

      link to en.wikipedia.org

      either way, it's not uncommon in sports for people of other nationalities/citizenships to represent other countries.

      you seem to be obsessed with palestine being included in the olympics. or palestinian athletes altogether. why would that be?

  • White Jews and uppity blacks
    • All white people have white privileges granted by the system of white supremacy that rules over them and POC.

      amazing information. what would we do without another of your lessons on the way life and identity works. your philosophy aside, not everyone "chooses" a self identity or has an awareness of that choice. that's something that develops over time heavily influenced by a persons surroundings (we're not born w/ego). your perception about When people are complicit with this arrangement, they choose to identify as White is frequently not the case. you have a philosophy, not everyone shares it. comprendo? i didn't think so. while certainly there are lots of people who have white pride and choose to be white there are also a lot of people -- children for example -- who learn who they are by their surroundings. it's not always a matter of 'wow' i choose to be this or i choose to be that.

      it’s not about rejecting privileges but more about what you do with your privileges that determine your place in the fight against white supremacy/Zionism.

      there are a lot of people in this world whose mind is in other places than fighting a system of injustice. just going about their everyday lives trying to figure out things like how to best irrigate their gardens or figure out a good diet for their child's allergies and things like that. gotta go.

    • I’m not sure how true it is saying Irish people are white, since white is a fuzzy socio-political concept, and Irish are not really known for professing such identity towards themselves, despite your allegations.

      you seem to forget this is not about "my allegations". again, tokyobk claimed "plenty of considerations of when/if Irish were/ were not white and i asked for an irish source. thanks for providing one!:

      However, though my mum’s Irish, my father is Nigerian. I am not white!

      I would like to see sources backing up the claim that many Irish use white to describe themselves.

      While you work on that...

      i won't be "working" on providing you anything. my so called "claim" that you're disputing is,

      many people use the term white for caucasian as i am sure you know. chances are there are lots of irish who share that concept.

      bye.

    • Arafat had a Jewish nose.

      this is such a strange concept. why would you think of arafats nose as "jewish", why not arab? or do you think one proceeded the other? isn't it just more likely it's a genetic feature shared by all sorts of people? someone could look at my nose and think i was jewish, or my dads or both my parents actually -- certainly my brother! the woman in your link, sara lipton, her nose isn't much different than mine yet i don't think either of our noses are "jewish". she almost looks the spitting image of susie abulhawa in that photo. the photo of your father just looks arab to me as many many jews are (although we're not supposed reference arab jews anymore).

      It disgusts me that a Jew writing in the NYRB argued that Jews didn’t look like Arabs.

      i missed that part of the article -- which is long. and the passage you picked up didn't mention arabs nor did a search of her article. i think lots of people have distinguishing noses -- including famous people who are not jewish. why would you even reference arafats nose as jewish, it just seems so strange.

      it’s pretty clear I’m arguing with anti-Jewish bigots, most of whom are white and who’ve found a a way to justify their bigotry....

      ok, take your marbles and go home then. it sounds like you're saying lots of different things and if someone doesn't agree with you they're bigots. you said yourself your dad looked arab and from the photo you published he does, maybe it's just because he was. of the jewish variety. but your dad being or looking arab doesn't really say anything about all jews, being white or not white.

    • How could you say Ashkenazis are White, when the white identity only came into existence within the past few hundred years, while Ashkenazi Jews have existed ever since Jewish settlement of Central and Western Europe over a thousand years ago.

      because 'white identity', regardless of when it came into existence, "is [according to wiki link to en.wikipedia.org ] a racial classification specifier", used for people "Europid ancestry" from europe. wiki also points out

      Description of populations as "white" in reference to their skin color predates this notion and is found in Greco-Roman ethnography and other ancient sources."

      the two terms (white and Ashkenazi ) are not mutually exclusive just because of what you choose believe. here's one jewish person explaining it: link to quora.com

      answering the question "Why are Ashkenazi Jews considered white people?"

      Since I am one, I'll answer this too. I consider myself white, sure, socially. And definitely Caucasian. Basically I think of it as like any other ethnic group, like Italians, Polish, Greeks, Russians, we Jews actually are an ethnicity and a people believe it or not along with being an ancient religious tradition. I'm not practicing myself, but still consider myself damn sure Jewish. I think other Jews will know what I mean.
      ....

      Personally I think Ashkenazi and Sephardi , both being from the European continent, should definitely qualify as whites nowadays. If not, after all then what else are we?

      It’s true that through having white skin, Ashkenazi Jews are afforded white privileges at the expense of POC

      they are not just "afforded" white privileges, they take advantage of them as much as any other white person can, some even moreso and no different than any other white person has the ability or choice to take advantage of those privileges, and yet you want to claim they are "of color" in a general way, a way in which you do not afford others. it begs the question, what color might that be?

      Ashkenazis have no say in having such privileges, and can’t really reject them even if they wanted to since it’s not about them to begin with.

      no different than any other american who is white living in america today. i have no say in having such privileges and can't really reject them even if i wanted to since it's not about me to begin with. why are you making exceptions such as "can’t really reject them even if they wanted to" for some white people and not others. we live in a society that privileges white people -- obviously -- based on the color of their skin. there's no other reason whites are afforded these privileges, none what so ever. same if you're jewish or marlo thomas. if you look white -- that's that -- in relation to people of color. hopefully that's changing and will continue to change but as it stands, we're not a colorblind society and there are more opportunities open for white people because of structural racism.

    • so that would be a "no" - you have no irish sources either. the claim was made:

      The Irish and whiteness has been a pretty worked subject in studies of racial formation.

      in that regard i think it's appropriate to ask if there are any irish voices in that conversation. contrary to your suggestion, i'm not calling on the irish to prove anything. but your sentence structure "Assuming them to be anything other than Irish" doesn't make a lot of sense, because i'm sure there are many other identifying features of irish people -- besides simply "irish" (like catholic or mother or whatever). many people use the term white for caucasian as i am sure you know. chances are there are lots of irish who share that concept.

      i recognize your continued effort to conflate the term white as white supremacy but that's not the definition i use. it reminds me somewhat of the authors statement "new American views of Jew and Arab in Palestine .... the arbitrary erasure of Arab Jews from the framing."

      although i wouldn't characterize your framing as arbitrary, as it follows a system of reason, i think it feeds racist conclusions and requires some mental contortions.

    • trying to pick apart the POC’s authors arguments

      sila, why would you call the author a person of color? he doesn't indicate he's white or not white.

      my problem with keith's critique is that he appears to attribute all the ideas solomon is writing about to solomon himself seemingly forgetting that solomon is reviewing feldman's book and in that review addressing feldman's ideas, not (always) necessarily his own. (ie "Feldman explores the tandem views of Zionism") it's difficult to deny the idea that zionism as a "national liberation movement of the Jewish People," is not a "view", whether one agrees with it or not -- clearly it's a view and solomon informs feldman wrote about it.

    • Just google and see plenty of considerations of when/if Irish were/were not white.

      tokyobk, could you please provide an irish source in these "considerations". the author of that book is not irish, he's a jewish social scientist and geneticist using the irish to prove his point:

      that views race distinctions and race itself as a social construct, he is best known for his call to abolish the "white race" (meaning "white privilege and race identity") while being the co-founder of the New Abolitionist Society and co-editor of the journal Race Traitor. His position is positively stated in his website's motto: "Treason to whiteness is loyalty to humanity."

      link to goodreads.com

      it hardly establishes a counter argument to "I have never heard an Irishman asking what would happen if the Irish stopped being white"

      even his publisher claims he's "one of America's .. most controversial historians"
      link to en.wikipedia.org

  • In overwhelming vote, leading Lutheran branch calls on US to cut off aid to Israel
    • thanks boomer! oh look, newsweek features elliot abrams to write about it!

      link to newsweek.com

      WHY ARE THE LUTHERANS ATTACKING ISRAEL AGAIN?

      and this is fun:

      God's Punishing Louisiana With Floods for Church Resolution

      A Hebrew radio host claims the atrocious Louisiana floods are God's punishment for the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America's demand to empower Palestine and end aid to Israel. ...."Folks are calling it 'an act of God.' I wonder what got Him stirred up? Connect those dots!" The Hebrew News radio host said.

      The flood has displaced more than 86,000 people who are now asking for aid. The storm is the worst since Super Storm Sandy hit the East Coast in 2012, and the damage supersedes that of Hurricane Katrina.

    • agreed boomer. just pointing it out. and of course i don't think most americans read jpost, but i consider it part of the msm. it hasn't been picked up by US msn tho... except i could swear i saw it reported at yahoo and i was surprised. but i don't think it's not there anymore. it's gotten a lot of traffic here tho, it's a popular post -- albeit we are far from mainstream.

    • hey sawah, just saw your comment! always good to hear your voice here.

    • jerusalem post covered it link to jpost.com

    • yeah, anything to do w/the middle east "U.S. consulted with Israel over course of sealing deal" . i'm sure they got something out of the deal, like the understanding SA would continue funding the opposition in syria -- or what inbound said.

      so sick of the neocons --

    • jon, what do you think blaine meant when he said the state will "be abolished, like slavery was abolished"?

    • hey joe, they put together 2 resolutions that worked and passed by an overwhelming majority. i'd call that progress. but shucks, the purity parol is always welcome here.

    • it's fantastic news inbound!

  • New San Francisco bus ads say: 'Boycott Israel Until Palestinians Have Equal Rights'
    • jon, please spare me your 'so hard to admit yada yada'. we both know this isn't about "well meaning people interested in justice" -- it's about of a famous icon's signature from 40 friggin years ago to toot your horn -- just like how the lobby tried to use martin with that fake quote. people know a lot more about palestine/israel now -- for one thing. second, belafonte's non answer is likely more about him getting skewered by the usual suspects and accused of racism for comparing the Bush administration to Nazi Germany and stating:

      "I can understand why Jewish leaders would be prone to protect the image of George Bush and his administration," Belafonte told the Post, noting that the president supports Israel "even when there are questions of the humanitarian, the moral and the political [motivation] of things that are done to Palestinians."

      link to cnsnews.com

      so he probably wasn't interested in having the hebrew hammer come down on his head again.

    • no it does not defy logic whatsoever. harry belafonte's signature was also on that 1975 list and then whoops! link to newint.org

      parks died in 2005, lots of people have come around since then. she would have too.

    • gee i wonder who wrote that jon

      did you see this: link to blackforpalestine.com

  • 'LA Jews for Peace' proudly endorses platform of 'Movement for Black Lives'
    • her “lament” (that the Jewish attachment to Jerusalem was merely symbolic as embodied by their physical refusal to move en masse or even in significant numbers to Israel throughout the centuries)

      yonah, if you care to launch off on some OT fangango because it's "the 9th of Av" you certainly don't need to lie about what i think or place quotemarks around "lament" (a word i didn't use nor is it my "lament").

      here's what i said in response to mayhem's allegation (that "The simple fact of the matter here is that Hebron matters more to the Jews historically and religiously than to any other people"):

      link to mondoweiss.net

      The simple fact of the matter here is that had Hebron mattered more to the Jews than to anybody else it wouldn’t have taken a couple centuries and a holocaust to convince the overwhelming majority of them (those who immigrated) to get their tuchuses down there (and that goes for jerusalem too). that’s the simple fact of the matter.

      no where did i say the Jewish attachment to Jerusalem was merely symbolic and no where did i reference a "physical refusal to move en masse".

      suggesting palestine, hebron or jerusalem, "matters more" to jews than the vast majority of people who actually lived there for centuries is stupid.

    • I realize that when ADL reacts people listen and that’s the essential question vis a vis big organizations like ADL

      huh? what's the essential question? you don't need all those extra words.

  • Netanyahu's Academy-award performance of dehumanization is why the conflict persists
  • Trump's vomit is media gold
    • for heaven's sakes mooser, don't even refer to the airwaves as public resources!

    • not sure if the media thinks informing the public is it's responsibility

      link to fair.org

      "Inform the Public? Not My Job, Says Chuck Todd"

      NBC White House correspondent Chuck Todd‘s declaration that it’s not his job to inform viewers when politicians spread misinformation was noted by several progressive blogs today...

      here's another link to politicususa.com

      and i watched a video from a tweet the other day w/chuck todd saying the same thing -- but i can't find it now! the media has the responsibility to counter lies with truth, like trumps statement about arabs celebrating in new jersey, but they don't do it. or with obama care, it's not their jobs to just run allegation after allegation of lies just for the hits and coverage, it's their job to present facts. but inflammation after inflammation drives traffic. and makes the money.

      so it's not their job to "convey implication", it's their job to present facts, not about just the fact someone says something, but researching and countering it with facts if a politicians statements are false.

    • katie! you soooo rock!

  • Solidifying behind Clinton, foreign policy establishment gins up a cold war with Russia/Iran
    • think we're on the same page spring.

      The thaw also suggests that Turkey may take a relatively neutral stance on Syria.

      logistically turkey is a (very) key player.

    • The truth he want to hide is that the Russians and Assad are aiming to retake Aleppo from ISIS, al-Nusra and the less well known Salafist organizations and if they can do it the war will be effectively over, Russia will then press Assad to make a gradual and dignified withdrawal and will have shown policy more coherent and far less reckless than any emanating from the US in a generation. The US, Turkey, and the Saudis want to call it a stalemate before the fall of Aleppo and demand that their original ultimatum, i.e. “Assad must go” immediately, was right and can now be obeyed.

      your friend is right. i've been closely following events in aleppo this last week and it's hard to get info from US msm that's accurate because there's so much hope and support from our press, neocon think tanks and their western politicos this recent unified front from team 'rebel' will prevail there, but i don't think they have a chance. and turkey and russia are possibly in rapprochement , see BBC's

      Putin mends broken relations with Turkey's Erdogan >>> link to bbc.com

      so this is not good news for the neocons...

      Gareth Porter writes at antiwar.com that the Nusra front in Syria changed its name just so that it would be even more amenable to the foreign policy establishment that wants to work with it against Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, and thereby undermine the Obama administration’s talks with the Russians.

      oh heck yes this news of nusra becoming moderate with the blessing of al qeada last week was all over every frigging msm, cnn and all of them! what a joke! hey, we're now moderate and can be part of the negotiations!! haaretz headline ""Nusra Front Eyes Legitimacy in Syria After Amicable Split With Al-Qaida" and a reporters were having a field day pressing kirby about it at the WH press briefing the next morning:

      link to state.gov

      QUESTION: Syria – the leader of Syria’s Nusrah Front says that it is breaking ties with al-Qaida. Do you still regard – they’ve also adopted – they say they’ve adopted a new name. Do you still regard the group by another name as a terrorist – foreign terrorist organization? And from your point of view, are they still a legitimate target in Syria?

      MR KIRBY: Well, look, Arshad, this alleged announcement here of their new name and potentially new affiliation is, what, minutes old here. So I think, as you well know, we judge any organization, including this one, much more by its actions, its ideology, its goals. Affiliations may be a factor, but ultimately it’s their actions, ideology, and goals that matter the most. And that’s how we’re going to judge going forward, as we have in the past. Certainly, thus far – and again, this announcement is, what, less than an hour old – we certainly see no reason to believe that their actions or their objectives are any different, and they are still considered a foreign terrorist organization.

      QUESTION: Have there been any messages sent to the Administration or to your interlocutors, whether it’s in the Arab world or Staffan de Mistura, in this vein that along with this affiliation could come some kind of more moderate position that they’d be interested in?

      MR KIRBY: No. I mean, again, they just made this announcement, so --

      QUESTION: I understand, but they didn’t just do it out of a hat. Like, obviously it’s something that’s been considered for – they didn’t just wake up this morning and say, “We have a new name.” This has obviously been --

      MR KIRBY: Then you have more insight into their thinking than I do. I don’t know --

      QUESTION: Well, I mean, it didn’t just come out of thin air. I mean, obviously this was a considered decision of at least 24 hours, I would think.

      MR KIRBY: You’d have to ask them, Elise.

      QUESTION: So I’m just wondering, have you --

      MR KIRBY: There has been no communication that I’m aware of that would – that would indicate any sort of a different approach to this group at this point. This announcement just got made. And again, we judge an organization by its actions, its ideologies, its objectives. And we see nothing --

      more at the link. i read yesterday (i think it was financial times --but not sure, but they had a good article on it), nusra was 85% of the fighting force in aleppo this week.

      i predict russia/iran/SAA will prevail in aleppo. wouldn't it be heaven if they wraped this up before clinton gets in office? oh please oh please oh please!

    • phil, i fail to see how killing russians and iranians in syria amounts to ginning up a "cold" war:

      "a state of political hostility between countries characterized by threats, propaganda, and other measures short of open warfare, in particular."

  • Google blames bug for removing 'West Bank' and 'Gaza' from Israel/Palestine map
    • boomer. Moshe Feiglin is a fanatic. i wrote about him and this very idea of his back in 2014, same year of that link. link to mondoweiss.net

      Bribing Palestinians with money to leave Palestine is not a novel concept. And yet the idea is as plausible as sauntering down to the local elementary school and offering to purchase the children. Listen to the casualness in the voice of Knesset deputy speaker Moshe Feiglin as he discusses this and other disturbing concepts during this presentation about Gaza last July 14, a few days after last summer’s slaughter in Gaza began. This talk (published in the last month) seems to fly in Israel; many people are normalized to it by now, even though they may not agree with him. Feiglin:

      (includes partial transcript)

  • Reloading comments from February and March 2014
  • When the language of genocide offends us more than ghettoizing another people
    • pabelmont, i responded to your earlier query on another thread : link to mondoweiss.net

      again: the first link goes to the platform's cover page. there is a dropdown up on top that says "platform" and from there go to "invest-divest" : link to policy.m4bl.org

      there are 3 references to genocide. the relevant one is

      The US justifies and advances the global war on terror via its alliance with Israel and is complicit in the genocide taking place against the Palestinian people. The US requires Israel to use 75 percent of all the military aid it receives to buy US-made arms. Consequently, every year billions of dollars are funneled from US taxpayers to hundreds of arms corporations, who then wage lobbying campaigns pushing for even more foreign military aid. The results of this policy are twofold: it not only diverts much needed funding from domestic education and social programs, but it makes US citizens complicit in the abuses committed by the Israeli government. Israel is an apartheid state with over 50 laws on the books that sanction discrimination against the Palestinian people. Palestinian homes and land are routinely bulldozed to make way for illegal Israeli settlements. Israeli soldiers also regularly arrest and detain Palestinians as young as 4 years old without due process. Everyday, Palestinians are forced to walk through military checkpoints along the US-funded apartheid wall.

      the other 2 are in this paragraph:

      Somalia has not only experienced extended military intervention as a result of AFRICOM but has been treated as an experimentation site for the U.S. devastating drone policy. The Democratic Republic of Congo as a region has had a long history of U.S. intervention that have coincided with some of the worst genocides in the world. Not only have U.S. backed African intervention armies committed atrocities but U.S. private companies extract the worlds wealth from Congolese soil. And as is true here, women and the most vulnerable in our communities pay the price of U.S. intervention and the accompanying genocides and civil wars. The U.S. must make room for African-led development and peace-making that is led by grassroots decision-making of the most marginalized and directly affected. We insist on African leaders and demand resources be made to begin the process of community-building at home.

    • definitely an oxymoron. note how it doesn't read "commitment to combatting racism and their Zionism.”

      because clearly they are not committed to combatting racism in israel or else they wouldn't be zionists.

  • Palestinians salute the Movement for Black Lives emphasizing common struggle against racial oppression
    • However, it’s is ridiculous to think she is the only significant POC to be given a platform against Zionism on MW.

      yeah, it is -- who is claiming this ridiculousness? certainly not me. what would you do without your strawmen sillyman? but hey, i noted your perfunctory "thank you" intro w/nary a reference to anything levi wrote (did you even bother to read The Knafo Chronicles or the other embeds?) it's clear you threw her away like a wet towel instead of taking the opportunity to engage in a discussion without talking down to people as if your declarations/claims are some grand revelations. many of us (commenters) have been here for many many years (think -- even before your university hasbara classes) and we've published many many articles by non whites. (ie: try scrolling up to the top of the page and reading the article -- get it? not written by white people) why don't you go start your own blog if you think you can do better. me, i communicate with non white contributors all the time. in fact, one of them from gaza is visiting me for 10 days at the end of the month. you are just making a fool of yourself when you spout about as if you know who we are.

    • Israel and Zionism has quite a few Achilles heels internally, that we must ruthlessly attack and focus our energy on, apart from BDS of course.

      of course... or not. btw, are you familiar with Smadar Lavie? israeli [Mizrahi] anthropologist and author of The Knafo Chronicles: Marching on Jerusalem With Israel’s Silent Majority, she's written extensively about the Mizrahi plight in israel. here's her bio >> link to en.wikipedia.org and here are some excerpts from my interview with her: link to mondoweiss.net

      we also covered her most recent book, Wrapped in the Flag of Israel: Mizrahi Single Mothers and Bureaucratic Torture - See more at: link to mondoweiss.net the book is an anthropological study of a group of Mizrahi women written for foreigners/westerners:

      Lavie describes the demographics of Israel, the power structure, classism and sexism. She tells some of the history of political movements involving the ethnic majority in Israel (Mizrahi Jews), showing how the minority elite (Ashkenazi Jews) suppress political demands. She includes anthropological descriptions and statistics, describes reasons that the majority ethnic group leans politically to the right, and quotes from her diary, giving compelling testimony to the truly bureaucratic torture that impoverished single mothers must suffer in Israel.

      i highly recommend the The Knafo Chronicles.

      So you avoid me. You make valiant efforts to set yourselves apart from the regime as feminists and pacifists. How long can you keep your lies going? There’s a boycott going on. Academics and NGOs now document your compliance. Never mind that you have cultivated your precious Mizrahi and Palestinian academic pets.

      The Education Ministry may surveil your syllabi. But the Propaganda Ministry sends you across the Atlantic to universities that dare let students have an Israel Apartheid Week. The ministry pays your honoraria to entice their cash-strapped Mideast Centers to place you on their speakers’ lists (Traubmann, 2006). But you will not acknowledge that you are willing participants in the Nicer Face of Israel’s antiboycott campaign.

      You prattle on in English about transnational feminist alliances. With whom? Your donors? At your conferences abroad, when you schmooze with editors of academic journals to get your papers published? And for whom? Not moms in the ‘hoods. These mothers graduate from underfunded slum schools barely proficient in standard Hebrew. Proper English is not even on the menu. From the podium, you quote Frankenberg (1993), but do you ever contemplate creating a support group to undo your own intra-Jewish apartheid?

      "we must ruthlessly attack and focus our energy ... apart from BDS of course". yeah, of course.

  • Israel calls on citizens to ‘turn in’ boycott activists for deportation
    • it really pisses me off they control who enters palestine. palestinians should be able to invite /host whichever internationals they want. not to mention other palestinians. i won't be getting used to this -- ever.

    • The law is limited to Israeli citizens, and does allow for criminal charges.

      i didn't realize the law facilitated imposing criminal charges. hmm.

  • Israeli soldier shoots Palestinian taxi driver in head by mistake, then Israel seizes his car and entry permit
    • Other than the snark, do you have a point.

      i think marnie hit the nail on the head. how can you not understand the point:

      “If we absolve humans of guilt because they have a grievance than there will be no limits.”

      ...what you just said has been the cornerstone that the zionist state was built on. The zionists had a grievance, the world felt guilty, and now there are no limits to what the zionists have done and continue to do.

  • Canadian Greens back BDS
    • fw, Lascaris says it's been very difficult for human rights advocates to speak out on this issue yet you say "we" have little difficulty. could it be that pro palestine activists have little difficulty speaking out but generally speaking many human rights activists find advocating for palestine more challenging?

      wrt the immediate practical significance i would think the green resolution backing bds would, as Lascaris points out, place the party in the forefront of human rights in canada thereby having more influence on public opinion and making the issue more challenging for Canada’s news media to ignore.

  • Black Lives Matter will defeat the Israel lobby (because the lobby can't debate reality)
    • M4BL will hurt their ability to get anything done.

      do you think if they took out the word genocide they'd be able to "get things done" and if so why?

      They’ll be like Occupy Wall Street, a lot of kids with anger and without a real program.

      what specifically, aside from the word genocide, do you think makes them sound like angry black people without a real program.

    • BLM does NOT have cred among the masses. You guys are delusional if you think otherwise.

      you don't speak for the masses. or do you think you're the voice of the silent majority?

      it is nonsense that Blacks are being targeted

      clueless!

      nonsense that cop killings are in any way as big of a problem as Black on Black murders.

      this reminds me of zionists deflecting off palestine by saying syria is worse. no one here is arguing black on black murder is not a problem in their community, it doesn't mean there is not oppression built into our law, justice and incarceration systems (to name a few). there's a LOT going on in a persons life before they become part of a black on black statistic.

    • I feel the author

      powerful words dude.

    • BLM ... given it's unpopularity with the masses outside Manhattan and other tony districts.

      hmm, i don't really agree with that assessment of BLM's popularity or lack thereof.

  • Jewish organizations' response to Black Lives Matter platform demonstrates inability to engage with reality in Israel
    • pabelmont, the first link goes to the platform's cover page. there is a dropdown up on top that says "platform" and from there go to "invest-divest" : link to policy.m4bl.org

      there are 3 references to genocide. the relevant one is

      The US justifies and advances the global war on terror via its alliance with Israel and is complicit in the genocide taking place against the Palestinian people. The US requires Israel to use 75 percent of all the military aid it receives to buy US-made arms. Consequently, every year billions of dollars are funneled from US taxpayers to hundreds of arms corporations, who then wage lobbying campaigns pushing for even more foreign military aid. The results of this policy are twofold: it not only diverts much needed funding from domestic education and social programs, but it makes US citizens complicit in the abuses committed by the Israeli government. Israel is an apartheid state with over 50 laws on the books that sanction discrimination against the Palestinian people. Palestinian homes and land are routinely bulldozed to make way for illegal Israeli settlements. Israeli soldiers also regularly arrest and detain Palestinians as young as 4 years old without due process. Everyday, Palestinians are forced to walk through military checkpoints along the US-funded apartheid wall.

      the other 2 are in this paragraph:

      Somalia has not only experienced extended military intervention as a result of AFRICOM but has been treated as an experimentation site for the U.S. devastating drone policy. The Democratic Republic of Congo as a region has had a long history of U.S. intervention that have coincided with some of the worst genocides in the world. Not only have U.S. backed African intervention armies committed atrocities but U.S. private companies extract the worlds wealth from Congolese soil. And as is true here, women and the most vulnerable in our communities pay the price of U.S. intervention and the accompanying genocides and civil wars. The U.S. must make room for African-led development and peace-making that is led by grassroots decision-making of the most marginalized and directly affected. We insist on African leaders and demand resources be made to begin the process of community-building at home.

  • Dream Defenders statement on the condemnation of Movement for Black Lives platform by some pro-Israel groups
    • on second thought ...

    • oh heavens no! i'm sure he'd relate much more to this:

    • No, not delayed until November, just delayed a few hours.

      ok, it's been a few hours. do you support bds now?

      Those who oppose Zionism, in effect wish that three of the branches had been sawed off instead of only two

      can you hold on a minute, i left my violin in the car. i hope these entertain you til i get back:

      link to youtube.com

      link to youtube.com

    • vociferous opponents of the settlement enterprise

      vociferousness doesn't impress me if it's not backed up by action. like the state department issuing condemnations while shoveling money at israel hand over fist. unwillingness to sanction with no concrete alternative to pressure israel -- why should i or anyone respect this method of coercion especially after decades of 'talks', carrots and no sticks?

      Because I feel that the Trump candidacy is the primary issue at this moment, I feel that the exact way of handling this attack on Israel ... can be delayed by myself for the present

      and after november? you'd be willing to support bds at that time? i didn't think so.

    • What is happening in Palestine is a genocide and we will not allow anyone to bully us into sanitizing our words.

      awesome response!

  • Israel lobby panics about 'spoiled' next generation of American leaders turning against it
    • even higher for palestinians

    • the Academic Engagement Network. The group has some 275 members, mostly faculty, on about 110 campuses working in opposition to the B.D.S. movement.

      if you'ld like to get a feel for this group, here's a batch of photos from AEN's first national conference link to facebook.com

      it was their FB page that i first encountered the swastika switched out for the olive branch on SJP's divestment poster. also, the push back from alumni is organized by this group. yeah, they are nervous.

  • Reloading comments from April and May 2014
  • Former AIPAC official says Israel should get no US aid without ending 'oppressive' settlements
    • oh heavens, zionaires! -- if we wrote that article ther'd be howling accusations of anti semitism from the usual suspects in comments and flying all across the innertubes from the hasbrats as well. we might have even gotten picked up by bradley burston at haaretz!

  • Anti-occupation activists stand with Black Lives Matter as Jewish orgs attack movement over Israel criticisms
    • Israel.... wants nothing to do with her neighbors.

      they'll take the land and water as their own tho.

    • i was snarking james. try googling "jewish voice for peace free palestine" by image. you'll encounter an already existing movement, including many banners. as a fellow member, i assumed you knew that. ciao

    • Is it because you don’t like the thought of Jewish Voice for Peace coming up with a banner and movement ....

      jvp is already engaged in a movement (w/many banners) for palestinian lives, independence, freedom and justice.

      i put your comment back and responded to it above.

    • Now how about a banner and movement for “PALESTINIAN LIVES MATTER”! If you can support Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions (BDS) against Zionist Israel, why not support “PALESTINIAN LIVES MATTER” ...

      Why not, Jewish Voice for Peace?

      maybe it just never occurred to jvp before to make a banner and movement supporting palestinian lives, freedom for palestinians, or justice for palestinians.

    • i wonder if wapo thought the BLM platform was worthy of coverage otherwise, or was the "angered major Jewish organizations" the only thing that prompted the article. the platform was published on monday .

    • thanks wilson, excellent news and excellent coverage.

      question:

      "The Black Lives Matter platform also received push back from more left wing groups than JCRC"

      i didn't realize the Jewish Community Relations Council was a "left wing" group.

  • Israeli mayor: No Arabs in our pools because their 'hygiene culture is not like ours'
    • Let’s not play the who’s more evil game.

      as you neutralize israeli crimes day after day after day "As a measure of comparison".

    • Israeli racism towards Arabs are not being disputed. Israeli wider society’s racism towards Arab is also not being disputed

      gag me w/a spoon! get real, of course it is! Your attempt at erasing the racism-soaked atmosphere of the Israeli society, the racist mayor as well as israeli-apartheid culture is absolutely repulsive. also repulsive is your contortion of using an example of an outrageously repulsive racist response to a neighborhood party, advertised on social media, as a 'clear documentation' of a "typical experience". routinely here in the united states whites and blacks swim in the same swimming pools -- UNLIKE israel. we share beaches too! everything is not rosey and wonderful and there is huge racism for sure, but lets not pretend this is israel where the government casually drives through civilian neighborhoods at night drenching the elementary schools with skunk spray and demolishing the family homes of people convicted of crimes. we have laws against the kinds of routine discrimination one finds in israel, and a constitution and ways to seek retribution (albeit if you're poor and can't afford it tough luck!). do those laws always work as they should? hell no.

      we live it a civic state

      Is that why black people have to come up with a movement crying their lives matter?

      no, it is not. black people have a movement crying their lives matter because we have systematic racism here embedded in our society and justice system, but don't conflate that with an ethnic state. do some homework. and quit trying to neutralize israeli apartheid.

    • that clearly documents the typical experience

      no it does not. the only thing 'typical' about that day was racist police targeting the black people. this was a mixed party in a mixed neighborhood and one (1) racist resident, it was not state policy or a mayoral authority justifying racism as was the recent case in israel. i see what you're doing time and again, you are normalizing israeli racism (while claiming to pose as anti zionist fooling no one), a place where the majority of jewish youth don't even think palestinian israelis should be allowed to vote. unlike israel, we don't live in an ethnic national state we live it a civic state -- like all the other democracies. had this been "typical" it would not have gone viral and launched article after article from wapo to salon and the list goes on. also, you failed to mention it was a promotional party (pool party advertised on social media link to slate.com ) that quickly grew. it wasn't just a black person trying to swim in a pool. and look at the reaction! it was hugely denounced and the officer was put on leave and it was investigated -- where is the outrage in israel over the israeli mayors words? was he disciplined? was there an investigation?

    • we've banned him twice but he keeps coming back.

    • Tchoupitoulas, anymore insight you might have on this identity would be appreciated.

    • Silamcuz, aka A4Tech, aka (briefly) Princess, aka Catalan, aka CraigSummers (in the Intercept threads, aka…

      don't forget rugal b!!!! btw, remember #6 of our comment policy?

      6. No imposture. You can use any pseudonym you like, but if you represent yourself as someone you’re not, you’re outta here. - See more at: link to mondoweiss.net

      Tchoupitoulas, were you around when he let slip "here in israel"? tried to walk it back --

    • Even worse, you attempt to refute my claims and statements without having the decency to present your side of the argument

      what "argument" ? you've made no argument, you've made a bold declaration based on what you claim is "obvious", as well as strawmanning (note "are you trying to imply" set up). and thus far i have made minimal attempt to refute your claim while pointing out it was completely unsupported. i offered one recent passage from an article here by tamara nassar as a relatively muted example of rude uncharitableness by iraqi jews to provide you with grist for the mill, you ignored it.

      throwing out a claim and refusing to source it whatsoever, is cowardice. so i have no obligation, much less "the decency", to present a "side" to an argument you've yet to make or clarify. any fool can spew declarations and these kinds of rhetorical flourishes:

      You would think that the Black Ethiopian Jewish leadership would time to time express their own version of supremacist hatred and prejudice, as well as Arab or Mizrahi Jews, or Sephardic Jews.

      triple yawn.

      gamal, public service is its own reward

      absolutely! as a public service perhaps we could use this as a teachable moment as it doesn't appear sila has ever heard of rabbi Ovadia Yosef (iraqi jew), the halachic scholar considered an authority on Jewish religious law -- rather well known for his inflammatory hate speech! and his son's endorsement of the genocidal king's torah! tsk tsk!

      "not anchored on Jewish identity" my a**.

    • me: if you’d care to make the argument there’s no racism towards palestinians embedded in the israel Mizrahi/Sephardic community i suggest you provide supporting evidence because something being “pretty obvious” to you is not in itself an argument.

      silly: Annie,

      So what are you trying to imply then? Racism is colorblind in Israel

      iow, no annie, i won't (and can't) provide supporting evidence there’s no racism towards palestinians embedded in the israel Mizrahi/Sephardic community. but:

      I’ll substantiate my claims once you and MW clearly present your views on the subject matter

      you're a coward. back up your claims. no one here is going is fall for your "only one side is prepared to declare and expend the emotional and mental labour" BS for someone too lazy and too complicit to even quote their references and instead launchs off on some strawman accusations based on what you deem someone is "implying" or "suggesting". seriously, a coward/moral midget.

      gag me w/ a friggin spoon.

    • modern Hebrew… I would like to learn a vocabulary that is sarcastic of the people I’m talking too

      consider brushing up on modern english first.

    • The article failed to mention the obvious

      sila, perhaps you failed to notice this is not one article, like all kate's posts it is list of articles, a collection published elsewhere over the last few days.

      your claim, that "Almost all of the Israeli ... engaging in hateful racial rhetoric towards Arabs, Palestinians and/or Muslims are White Jews" is completely unsupported in your comment. while racism and discrimination against sephardic/mizrahi jews by ashkenazi jews within israeli society is historic (recent example and a story we covered too as i recall: link to forward.com ) that's doesn't necessarily translate into "all the hatred [towards palestinians] is consistently coming from a singular sector of Israeli Jews". in fact, it's my understanding the majority of sephardic/mizrahi jews are conservative voters -- they vote for likud and other israeli parties who pass racist legislation. they also serve in the occupation military. and while i do think currently there's a rejuvenation of intersectionality between the two communities, it's not widespread.

      if you'd care to make the argument there's no racism towards palestinians embedded in the israel Mizrahi/Sephardic community i suggest you provide supporting evidence because something being "pretty obvious" to you is not in itself an argument.

      note this passage from a recent nakba story we published by tamara nassar:

      My grandparents knocked on the door of the first apartment, and the family they found living there was a Moroccan Jewish family. They spoke Arabic. The family received my grandparents with shameful welcome, offering them coffee in their own home. The other apartments were occupied by Iraqi Jews who refused to welcome my grandparents. My grandfather recalls them saying, “Get out of here. We left everything we owned in Iraq as well.”

      - See more at: link to mondoweiss.net

  • Video: Israeli soldier throws 8-year old Palestinian girl's bike into bushes
    • The simple fact of the matter here is that Hebron matters more to the Jews historically and religiously than to any other people and Ben Gurion said it.

      The simple fact of the matter here is that had Hebron mattered more to the Jews than to anybody else it wouldn't have taken a couple centuries and a holocaust to convince the overwhelming majority of them (those who immigrated) to get their tuchuses down there (and that goes for jerusalem too). that's the simple fact of the matter.

    • The news here in NZ is pretty scathing on both of them.

      good, i hope they give us hell!

    • Pray tell why aren’t the Palestinians permitted to use the road now . Could it be because of terror threats and constant friction between settlers and Palestinians?

      as i recall the roads in hebron were closed off after the Ibrahimi Mosque massacre when the fanatic Baruch Goldstein (a hero to settlers) killed 29 praying muslims and wounding 125 worshipers.

      so in this regard -- i guess one could call that "friction between settlers and Palestinians". but it begs the question "why are the settlers who worship the jewish terrorist who murdered the muslim worshipers permitted to use the road?

  • Netanyahu distorts a Palestinian's helpless reaction to occupying soldiers to dehumanize Palestinian parents
    • but that’s what happens when you try to equate the actions of a bad apple, e.g., one border policeman throwing a bike, with an entire nation.

      you mean because bt'selem releases a video of a border policeman tormenting a little child and his sidekick throwing her bike into the bushes (that's 2 bad apples btw, not one) you get the prime minister making a hasbara video humiliating a palestinian family and hasbrats reminding us who the real victims are?

      funny, because i don't see you anywhere on that thread calling this little girl a "poor child" or a victim: link to mondoweiss.net not when the "bad apples" do it. why's that? the palestinian children are only "poor children" and "victims" when you deem their parents responsible?

      but thanks for being honest about why netanyahu would make this hasbara video at this very time -- to distract from the sadistic tormenting "bad apple" soldier and his bike throwing "bad apple" soldier side kick.

      i ask you before where have you ever referenced the “poor child” where he’s been an obvious victim of israeli oppression?

      no where, that's where. like i said before, spare us your concern.

    • jon, netanyahu is exploiting this family for hasbara purposes. the address is in english and it is for a foreign audience. he's using this example, of a man who admittedly has a condition similar to ptsd he sought therapy for who was tortured and imprisoned and his land taken away as an opportunity to claim palestinians don't love their children and teach them hate and all the other hasbara crap israel hasbrats have been pushing for decades ignoring the constant middle of the night home invasions, home demolitions and atrocious conditions the occupation has enforced on this imprisoned community. and you lecture us on the "poor child"? where have you ever referenced the "poor child" where he's been an obvious victim of israeli oppression? spare us your concern.

  • Sam Harris and the politics of 'good intentions'
    • Nothing would be better for an intellectual’s public reputation than to engage Chomsky—who stands above most all intellectuals—on equal terms.

      exactly! that is what i meant when i wrote "the charlatan would challenge an einstein if it boosted his status and the sale of his shoe polish".

    • Shaukat Ansari should easily be able to shred Harris’s pilpul without dragging in Noam Chomsky, which only serves to provide the illusion of gravitas to Harris’ agitprop.”

      i'm confident Ansari could shred harris sans chomsky, but don't believe he should have and glad he didn't. harris is way out of his league using chomsky as an agitprop to boost his claims (as evidenced by his fall out in this exchange link to samharris.org )

      he's an excuser of state atrocities and his theory of intention is an exercise in futility. it is harris (and his islamophobic ilk), who seek to drag chomsky into the theory to enhance his status and that of his theory.

      unlike chomsky, harris is not a scholar yet seeks to be perceived as one. lacking the rudimentary principles of a scholar, meticulously researching the facts one is writing about and building theory based on those facts, harris (it seems) makes declarations that suit his "ethical" theory (designed to excuse state terror) conjuring and criticizing chomsky's ethics to prop up his theory and then tries to snag chomsky into an exchange after the fact.

      ansari:

      Harris informed Chomsky, after the latter author referred him to some of his earlier work, that he had not read that particular book and had simply treated his tract on 9/11 “as a self-contained statement on the topic.” This alone is a remarkable admission from an individual who routinely accuses others of misrepresenting his views or quoting passages from his work out of context.

      it is absolutely remarkable. ethics is not lightweight stuff, people lie about their intentions all the time. in one on one relationships people base their judgements on anothers sincerity by evidence, actions, and outcomes not merely by their professed statements. why should it be any different for governments and state actors. and yet harris, as ansari pointed out, "seems to have based his conclusion regarding the nobility of Western intentions on the public statements of government officials and his own impression of US altruism, as expressed through his idealized thought experiments. This is quite an interesting research methodology"

      so i think the chomsky exchange is the perfect example to shred harris because in the exchange (that i just linked) harris demonstrates he's no match whatsoever for chomsky and admits at the end chomsky "had asked the [ethical] questions I said he hadn’t; I just didn’t like the answers. "

      and even that is not accurate because harris had not researched or even read the bulk of what chomsky had written about the ethical implications. he just wants a public debate to launch himself as an equivalent adversary of chomsky -- which he is clearly not (chomsky wiped the floor w/him).

      harris is a charlatan selling a magic "ethical intention" potion and he has no more qualifications to be making ethical theories than a traveling salesman has selling shoe polish to cure your ills. the charlatan would challenge an einstein if it boosted his status and the sale of his shoe polish -- that's what's going on, nothing more nothing less.

  • Israeli racism unmasks Netanyahu goodwill video
    • Mikhael, when i was in israel in 09 i met a man who was a citizen of israel but he was a refugee from his village. he took me to palestinian land a kibutz had confiscated but it was now in control of the JNF. there was a mosque on it covered w/barbed wire to make sure the palestinian - israel citizens di not come worship there any more. he lives in an unrecognized village. before this trip i (naively) didn't understand there were people inside israel waiting to return -- to their own land. so yeas, there are refugees living in israel as citizens. but they don't have the same (privilegeG) rights as jews.

    • the establishment cause? now that's a cause i've never heard about before.

    • I now have a very fuzzy idea

      that happens with little brains.

      the attempt to define “discriminatory practice” as some action that materially and physically affects a group of people is not new

      wow.

      the discriminatory practice of an overt violation of the Constitution on the dollar bill threatens my life by menacing blood pressure spurts and stroke every time I use one.

      have you tried a chill pill?

    • Annie, Care to explain a little more clearly for my little brain

      sure, people are more apt to view something as discriminatory or feel something is discriminatory when it infringes on their equal rights. however, it doesn't mean a religious symbol (that doesn't represent them) on their state flag they might not view as discriminatory.

      people are likely to feel discriminated against by accompanying actions (referenced as "discriminatory practice" -- which is outlawed in the 24 amendment). but words do matter. i think references to god on our money and in our national anthem privileges the religious amongst us. but i don't make a stink about it or think about it much because it doesn't really impact me (not accompanied by a 'practice'). i'm not a lawyer tho. this is just my hunch.

      jon:

      he and other posters have said that the conditions for a religious symbol on a flag to be discriminatory it must be used in a country where there are other discriminatory laws as well as the symbol. And so it would seem most here feel that simply having a religious symbol on your flag is not a discriminatory law by itself.

      i think you're tweaking others words somewhat. my point was, people are more likely to feel discriminated against by a symbol if the implication of symbol is matched by discriminatory laws. the star of david on the flag, on military ammo, military equipment including weapons (used to kill and oppress others), etc etc is not a law, as far as i know. the star of david doesn't kill anyone, but the state and (some of) the people who worship it do. so it's likely when people burn it, they are burning its symbolism as a symbol of war, not the religion -- not much different than when anti war activists burn an american flag. it's a political symbol. whereas, denmark isn't killing lately so know one thinks much about their flag except maybe the danish.

    • what’s the point of calling Israel a “Jewish State” rather than an Israeli state?

      because if it was an israeli state all israeli citizens would be considered israeli nationals and afforded the rights of israeli nationals (see nationality law which affords only jews certain rights denied to non jewish citizens of israel). #racism #apartheid

    • i don't trust it because it leaves all the settlements in place w/their own policing, huge tracts of palestine's hilltops looking down and dominating palestinian villages - prime real estate covered with settlements. how is this fair? and they police themselves? sorry, not trusting it. and it leaves israel to man the outside borders of the palestinian state? how is this fair?

    • That statement on the money .. tell[s] me that being born in the US does not make me a real citizen in the eyes of its government.

      not to be picky, but how you feel about it or what it tells you is akin to jon's usage of the term "view" ("do you view"). note the responses i cited from both talknic and mr t related to actions (policies) taken by the state demonstrating discrimination. this is what my analogy addressed -- not feelings, views or opinion. although i understand people's perceptions of the value of their citizenship (or non citizenship as the case may be) is an important topic, and likely there's a wide range (multiple/varying) of responses in american society about this phrase on the dollar. but when i wrote "one would likely consider that statement on the currency a form of discrimination" (vs multiple/varying views) i was addressing a discriminatory policy ("ones ability to use that money was hindered by a lack of adherence in trusting god").

      are there any examples you're aware of representing discriminatory US policies or actions taken by the government against any US citizen (including you) as a result of this phrase on our currency?

      for an analogy to be applicable it needs to address the principles for which it was created. in this case discrimination should be represented by something concrete such as "policies of that Apartheid state". i'm not justifying the phrase or arguing it is ok or i don't oppose it. i'm suggesting for a charge of discrimination by the state to stick it's got to be backed up by policies that discriminate. not sure the phrase itself does that.

      whereas, a demand by the state that someone recite the phrase against their will or stand in class and pray -- that is a discriminatory practice.

    • thanks marnie! you cited me before i edited my comment to a reference of "one" instead of using myself as an example. it didn't change the meaning tho.

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