Total number of comments: 20335 (since 2009-07-30 20:11:08)
Annie Robbins
Annie Robbins is Editor at Large for Mondoweiss, a mother, a human rights activist and a ceramic artist. She lives in the SF bay area. Follow her on Twitter @anniefofani
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Showing comments 16400 - 16301
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jonah, speaking of points, claiming someone's (self evident) argument or opinion is false sans an iota of evidence makes for a weak argument. israel is an oppressive, colonialist, expansionist and supremacist state. it's worth repeating imho. over and over and over if need be.
besides, i think people are finally realizing the whole democracy lingo is just that, lingo. plus, the 'share our values' narrative is increasing becoming harder for many americans to swallow. this is creeping into the mainstream.
repeating lies devalues an argument and the integrity of the person making them but the same can't be said for repetition of the truth.
if you want to argue the oppressive, colonialist, expansionist, supremacist state of israel has legitimacy..just do it, don't take the lazy way out.
shmuel is israeli too
you guys are really not getting it. this is a great video, silverman is brilliant..so go to the site and sign the petition.
link to scissorsheldon.com
clueless!
Anniversary dates are very important to these hooligans.
they are very popular to other people too, like israelis. check colin's list:
the anniversary would work equally well if someone was planning a false flag. iow, in itself there's no meat to it. also, would you mind providing some evidence "Anniversary dates are very important to".... iranians..wrt assassinations or something terror related.
yeah, because resistance is so teenage..just like the idf. kids phff.. peace talks, now that's where adults hang out.
yep great post.
Who can say that history cannot repeat itself and Iranians will pull something like that again?
you're assuming they did it the first time. that was never confirmed was it?
backed by their population in every election.
not sure i would take it that far. not everyone who supports israel's agenda does so because they kill and terrify innocent civilians as daily practice. some people are brain washed into thinking it is for their security.
i fail to see how a horrific attack like this can serve any purpose to israel's enemies. they were children too. this just feeds into an escalation of violence.
link to cbsnews.com
as for those kerstein tweets, that's just sick. i can't even respond to that kind of opportunistic game playing. of course i condemn the killing of civilians. especially children.
raw numbers? i recommend : "Look over there! All eyes on Iran as Israel quietly devours Area C"
link to mondoweiss.net
link to mondoweiss.net
link to jpost.com
"Danon touts bill to annex Judea and Samaria"
you are confusing the conflict with the oppressors solution to the conflict. the occupation is the system imposed by the oppressors. occupation is too nice a word because it doesn't incorporate the ethnic cleansing and acquisition/theft of territory.
i'd love to attend.
i do not know if he's vulnerable, but he's the highest ranking gop congressperson and being groomed for the long haul. if he could be unseated...
krauss, i didn't listen to the aipac speeches this year. which dem leaders were publicly slamming obama at the conference? did we cover that here?
yeah, we know about the racist rightwingers. at least you know whose company zionists are keeping. 2 peas in a pod.
Klaus,
It’s good to know that you don’t support attacks on Jews.
awesome framing jon.
only 996 comments? well, 997 now. carry on let's push this over the top.
lol, i was wondering if this thread would reach a 1000 comments. at the 990's we'd have everybody jamming the thread at the same time. fun.
And also gets to bypass moderation for all future posts
heaven help us, what if it was one of the trolls.
Jews have always fought for the oppressed and people who are suffering!
so why don't you explain to us which oppressed suffering people sheldon adelson is fighting for?
don't you think your comment is just a little tweaked? that's like saying 'jews have been in palestine for thousands of years'. well, some of them have. but you can't claim the mantel of any and every jew to make broad brush statements about all of them. obviously not every jew has 'always fought for the oppressed'. some jews actually oppress other people. in fact there's a whole army of them oppressing palestinians right now. hellllooo.
not wrt all things israel it isn't. you're living in a fanatsy land if you don't think certain powerful members of the american jewish community do not have undue influence over our FP wrt israel. and if one uses the accusation/crutch of anti semitism to silence legitimate criticism one becomes part of the problem.
@Annie Robbins,
Jews have been affiliated with the organized left for centuries.
i know that, and i've made that pt myself many times.
Jews have always fought for the oppressed and people who are suffering!
not sure why you're jumping from the 'oppressed' supreme court justices to jews fighting for oppressed people. are you confusing fighting for oppressed people with being oppressed? i fight for oppressed palestininans, doesn't make me oppressed. let's review your statement:
so why are you changing the topic away from the specific nature of Jewish oppression to pointing out jews have fought for oppressed people.
let's stay on topic shall we, which is today's reality of oppressed jewish americans.
who is driving that wedge jon? are the supreme court justices being used as tools to drive a wedge between the privileged and the oppressed?
why is it antisemitic to point out the US Supreme Court is 1/3rd Jewish, while Jews make up 2% of the US population? why can't it be used as a marker identifying the success of the american jewish community? is it also racist to pt out we have a black man in the WH?
to a certain pt people are welcoming and accepting of the elite regardless of their ethnicity. but please do not tell us american jews are oppressed when clearly, for the most part, they are not. no amount of 'affiliation' with the oppressed will morph into being oppressed oneself, not in my mind anyway.
Jewish oppression — that we occupy intermediary positions of power; placed into highly visible social positions that isolate us from other oppressed groups.
this is frightening jon, i feel so sorry for you. do you think there is something the oppressed jewish americans, the ones placed in these unfortunate power positions, could do to alleviate the burden of being separated from the other oppressed groups? so that you could stand as one to have your oppression recognized.
They are far outweighed by the Christians and Muslims who have said nasty things about Jews and the strain of hatred toward Jews has historically been a much more prominent feature of both Christianity and Islam than hatred toward Gentiles has ever been in Judaism.
you have staked out a claim for jews as the victims of the most hatred and you covet it. the crimes of zionists over the last decades, the countless abuses and suffering inflicted day after day and night after night; the home invasions, home demolitions, administrative detentions, targeted assassinations, denial of movement, denial of rights..all of this means nothing when stacked up against the hatred in the minds of your adversaries.
You are an antisemite, McBride
you are a coward hophmi. you will not even recognize legitimate information. this is about as much leeway you will afford evidence of racism coming from members of the jewish community: I think maybe you don’t expect Jews to be human beings. I think you expect us to be angelic.
iow, zionist malefeasance is jews just being human whereas everyone who complains of injustices is infected with hatred against jews.
i am curious if there are any jews in your world with a strain of hatred, or is hatred just a gentile thing.
iow, when the nakba started and hundreds of thousands of people were expelled from their homes, it was because they were anti semities.
a long-infected pus bubble of anti semitism burst. uh huh. something tells me what you think 'we need to understand', and reality might not be in synchronization here. does taking responsibility ever enter into your imagination.
so tell me..why is it that you think the goi and reut/think tanks etc characterize the 'deligitimizers' as a serious threat and the internet as being a 'battlefield' if the threat was merely a 'small fringe on the left'? in fact, why are you here? aren't there more important things for you to be doing? or are you here 'watching jews' as you put it?
Non-Jews having an opinion on anti-Semitism is called “nice” here
my understanding is certain 'jewish issues' are in a domain that is staked out and carefully protected. i think i mentioned the conversation i got into at the wedding, the person expressing he was afraid of being called antisemitic for discussing israel. plus reut's redline article. they want to be the ones to define the boundaries. you mention a circle..well a circle is also a boundary. i think the sky is the limit.
so rosen didn't go after alex or MW wrt political ideas or policy and it's not too hard to figure out why. he's not interested in a dialogue. he made it about antisemitism which is sacrosanct ground, a coveted jurisdiction. remember the dkos diary on anti semitism. so...it is nice people who are not jewish are speaking out on this issue, it's about time. it's being used to silence us and it's our (each of us) duty to stand up for what's right. otherwise it may be us getting smeared next time.
let them look the fool coveting their alleged victimhood.
sullivan's link works for me now eguard. i don't think robert wright is jewish.
i felt so proud of our site reading the rosen article. it was really pathetic. the guys were right when they said it was all about making the red lines. those days are over.
remember that hit list on the rightwing site w/Vittorio's name on the top of the list? if i were a detective i'd throw that info into the mix.
remember how many people freaked out over the swedish press writing about dr hess like they were all so insulted, bloodlibel boycott ikea or whatever, and then the dr in berkeley produces the interview the parts stealing doc gave a couple years before admitting to trading in palestinian body parts. that's what this reminds me of. faux outrage. the mossad? kill? shiver me timbers, it's their specialty.
Blaming Mossad for the crime is right out of a medieval blood libel.
no it's not, it's a logical option, one that shouldn't be dismissed. they work undercover therefore one has to speculate what they are up to. they are well known assassins. quit whining.
here's AP link to news.yahoo.com
"I am unable to withdraw my investment at this time" probably means it's bundled in some way that makes it inaccessible for certain time periods.
eguard, some people don't tweet. mondoweiss tweets but i think that's primarily adam. ali abunimah has written over 78,000 tweets. maybe phil just wanted to mention ali without going on a fishing expedition. phil works off lots of tips, he's a busy guy!
I vote for “being poloniumed” as a first entry.
mooser's ziocaine has to be numero uno'd
excellent news
betsy, tribe implies kinship (not necessarily biological..could be thru social/political bonding). there's nothing offensive about the term and nothing suggesting it's 'indigenous' per se. that's my understanding anyway.
lol, you're just discovering this now?
why would i think it a fabrication jon? it's the holy land..of course there has always been christians muslims and jews there. that's kind of a no brainer. but 'continued presence' is just no big deal in the home of 3 major religions. jews not being there at all, that would have been a tad odd. in fact it very much supports the notion that for the most part jews were safe there even when they were a minute percentage of the people. i'm just not getting why that minute percentage remaining in the region gives it some kind of magical power or presence into the future. as if the mere presence of a scattering of jews justifies something, a privileged status.
the prayers for redemption i get, the exclusivity, the ethnic cleansing..not so much.
The source for my figures is Berncastle who cites the “Village Statistics” taken in 1945 by the Brits.
what page of the book is that on? do you have any links discussing these allegations or is everything resting on some inaccessible quote in a book?
As proof, Weitz cited the fact that the government didn’t levy any taxes on this land.
as proof israel claimed it was state land?
Perhaps even more significant is that Jews prayed for a return to Zion three times a day on weekdays , four times on the Sabbath, five on Yom Kippur.
jon, hostage points out, and others have repeatedly claimed introduced into the Hagaddah in medieval times to signify a desire for redemption and a spot in the world to come
so what i want to ask you is why, if, as you claim, it was an actual physical move to jerusalem they were praying for 3-4 times a day..why did so many jews opt out for all those centuries? and since the vast majority of jews opted out of the big move and only prayed for it isn't it fair to say they weren't too committed to their convictions? what else could explain the reason millions of jewish people didn't find their religious convictions til zionism came along with the 'continuous presence' excuse routine?
The continuous presence not a fabrication
"continuous presence" of a few is irrelevant. all kinds of people have been continually present on lots of different kind of land throughout history. "continuous presence" of a few is not akin to a real estate deed. there's not recognized 'continuous presence of a few' laws on the books as far as i know pertaining to dna or anything. just because i tiny minority of jews lived there they do not serve and a seat warmer for the multitudes who may or may not arrive.
try that at a concert. send three people to go stand in line a few days early and then let a thousand come late and stand in front of the stage based on dna of the 3 ..then pull out your 'continuous presence of a few' routine and see how the crowd reacts. 'but all my friends have always yearned/prayed to see bruce springsteen' therefore my thousands of friends are using our 'continuous presence rights of a few' to trump your rights of standing in line for days.
i know what you would do if that were you in line for days, you would look at the buddy's 1000 of friends and say.. you know, they are superior people to me therefor just 3 of them is worth thousands of us. it's the 'continuous presence of a few of your superior dna beings' routine that'll get you every time.
it’s part of the historical record
it's also part of the historical record some jews have blue eyes. but, like continuous presence, blue eyes do not come with a land deed. a historical record doesn't justify ethnic cleansing.
do you believe in the 'continuous presence of a few of your superior dna beings' rights for?
excellent. he perfectly represents the israeli government. slippery liars going thru the motions while supporting expansion and doing nothing to stop it.
they keep messing with the delivery/framing but never the policy. what losers.
i think there were some people who pushed zionism who were not pushing the zionism we see today.
you answered my question with a question. iow, no..you're not here to offer anything of value to the thread. just here to distract.
i have always thought he was a brave man, even when i didn't agree with certain things he said.
i'm glad he said what he did about cultural zionism.
do you have anything of value to contribute to the conversation oleg, or just the diversion tactics again?
thanks adam. the beautiful people.
good luck, crossing my fingers enough funds are raised to keep the site afloat.
i have some idea how much energy it takes to get these posts up everyday.
thanks adam and phil.
yonah, since, according to you, it is extremely common to read comments here that contain a kernel of jew hatred, could you please link to a few examples from the last week without resorting to using examples from this thread. (i say that because i don't think responses to your assertion should be used as entrapment).
i am not saying you are wrong, i am asking for examples of something you claim is extremely common. for a site that gets 100's of comments everyday, 'extremely common' would suggest every single day there are numerous comments you think qualify.
thanks
that was really irresponsible of CSM, there's not one example of why langer called it "latent anti-Semitism"
thank you Evelyn.
I resigned to distance the controversy from my candidacy for Florida's State House District 88 seat
i think it is unlikely there will be any distancing between this issue and your candidacy and therefore my opinion is you should not have resigned. but, that isn't as important as the conversation and the opportunity to discuss 'the controversy' in your district.
while it may appear that israel/palestine isn't that important to your district compared with other local issues that could be said about seats all across the country. furthermore, the democratic party should represent democrats not just democrats who support apartheid. there are many lifelong democrats who do not support the settlements, like the president who started out very firm on this issue and has since turned silent. it is the upcoming election forcing that silence. so we have to be the voice, not party officials who pretend to speak for every democrat.
How about conducting a discussion on that topic instead of persecuting one messenger?
yes! there's a real opportunity here to debate this issue in your district and although you may get hate mail..you may also find supporters from unlikely places.
link to evelyngarciacampaign.com
i agree. it's all threadjack material, witty specialty.
Does he need this kind of aide?
does mark kirk need richard goldberg?
makes me curious if every congressperson's office is staffed with an ideolog lobby gatekeeper. he should be fired for making such a racist statement. he uses the excuse he was piqued at the time, but that doesn't rationalize why he would take his anger out on palestinians.... if he was piqued at garcia. he used a well worn racist hasbara talking point. why? and why are there no repercussions?
kudos to phil for interviewing liftman.
fbi too, and homeland security.
i didn't know he was in the closet. was it a ellen like event? i'm out of the loop.
uh huh, like that's gonna happen any day between now and when he anoints romney's vp running mate.
i think it is fantastic the Israeli press is picking up any of Grant Smith's revelations. more please. push the truth!
fantastic
Does Adam pray or believe in G-d? Adam?
lol, beware secular jews...
I am highlighting anti-Semitic undertones
you have not highlighted anything remotely anti semitic that i can tell. making a claim is not the same as highlighting something specific adam wrote.
saying "Adam has drifted from Judaism" implies he was once a religious jew. you know there are non religious jews who have always been secular. no one is required to provide you with jewish bonafides.
thanks for your response betsy. seems a long long way off. but i suppose it's just around the corner.
I have practiced what I preached.
this is an online discussion, anyone can make that claim. not sure how the actions you allege to have taken amount to more than the efforts dedicated thru this website, of the many many contributors. please take a video next time so we can share your efforts with others. especially if your intent is to shame others into action, give us something we can compare it to besides your many allegations. thanks
bioc, you're a part of this website. i totally support you marching into the New York city council to demanding divestment from Israel. bring a friend with a video camera, record it for us and we can front page it. i know you can do it if you want to.
"choice of conscience" option for Pension holders troubled by investments in Caterpillar, Motorola, and Hewlett Packard, which would be voted on for approval at the next General Assembly.
does anyone know when the next general assembly is?
Politicians want to fix things now and so implement short term programs, where really long term programs, devoid of politics, are the best solutions.
how does this relate to the occupation? do you mean it is a short term program where a really long term program (equality) is the best solution? but politics and the israel lobby get in the way with all their meddling in election funding get in the way and our politicians then supporting apartheid? apartheid is the ugly short term solution, it is not sustainable.
But they don’t want the other guy to get the credit. There is little patience nor true sacrifice. Man can be selfish and usually is.
what kind of sacrifice are you suggesting for our politicians gilad? standing up to the lobby? please tell me you do not think the lobby is in the business of sacrifice.
You want it to be the cause of our time, but allas, it is not.
really. maybe you could use this presbyterian GA as a microcosm to express your views. what stood out for you as being ' the cause of our time' at the GA other than this divestment issue? please explain how a 2 pt separation does not make it the crucial debate of our time.
and to take it even further please explain how or why americans are continually having the US/IS bonding with israel shoved down our collectives throats day in and day out if equal/civil rights is..not 'the cause of our time'.
the conversation is just getting louder and louder. your denial can't stop it.
you force the narrative.
no one is forcing you to be here gilad. people come to this site out of free choice. no one is forcing anyone to divest from israel, to divest from the occupation. we simply provide exposure and truth. the truth will set us free. that is why it is getting louder ever since the internet..free choice and the lack of ability for the msm to control the narrative.
the fashion element builds steam and artificially creates hype
at least we agree on something. like i said “fashionable” is the new hasbara rhetorical trend. remember you are the person who initiated/inserted this fashionista discourse into the narrative. not sure it will serve you tho...resistance to occupation comes in all shades of truth.
When you mix politics into all of this, wise men know not allow themselves to be dragged along
anna baltzer email:
"fashionable" is the new hasbara rhetorical trend. as if human rights were a pretty new dress you could wear one day and discard the next.
let's all wear occupation blue today, that special shade of blue, with the torture shoes and the administrative detention hat. if the light is right with the angle tight it's self-determiningly regal.
wear occupation blue today
This is another story that should be put to rest, rather than becoming the subject of yet another round of conspiracy theories
why? don't you think it is relevant if he was murdered?
from your CSM link:
the assassination or poisoning hypothesis was quickly hushed in the French media at the time of Arafat's death
we never had a full on discussion about it. besides, 'round of conspiracy theories' won't be quite the same if they determine he was killed by polonium after they exume his body. it will be a matter of who killed him not if he was murdered. big dif..also from your link:
French doctors in 2004 did not test for radioactivity ......
Prior to Arafat’s illness, Israeli officials including Ehud Olmert, deputy to then prime minister Ariel Sharon, spoke openly about a desire to be rid of Arafat, who they described as a terrorist.
i can understand why an israel supporter would advocate not discussing mossad political assassinations tho. kind of a no brainer.
Don’t forget the death threats and the cloning of your account (on youtube, yahoo)
i did not know about the cloning on youtube/yahoo because i don't hangout and comment there but my sister has been going thru hellon youtube. she got her account cloned and gets followed around and people impersonating her. i wonder if it's over this issue. i don't know her posting habits but i know her opinion.
hmmmm interesting.
Josh Block, the Israel lobbyist linked to AIPAC, is tweeting "junk" rumors that Arafat was gay and died of AIDS:
they did this after he died. i recall weird pedophile rumors too. it's sexual gutter hasbara. extreme zionist hasbrats have an obsession with homosexuality, pedophilia and beastiality.
josh block lusts after poodles and baby lambs. can i say that? lol, he deserves it. i think i am going to go tweet it.
because it's a highjack.
thanks c&d, another great article by giraldi.
eleanor, sounds like a plan. i will write medea and rae.
He’s probably already a secret Mondoweiss reader.
no definitely not but he was very interested and i spelled out the name for him. when my friend gets back from his honeymoon i'm going to get this persons email and send him a link. i think it is more likely he read about evelyn on a rightwing site.
i'm here now linda. write me ( annie at mondoweiss dot net) and maybe we can visit.
C&D, i do live in the bay area, i am just visiting seattle right now. came up for the wedding and some other business. i know langley..well actually.
we possible know some of the same people.
ok! i will tell you my story from the wedding. first off i am not in the bay area, i'm in seattle. my friends who got married are both very high powered individuals. one a scientist and the other works for bill gates. some of those in attendance i have known for over a decade but had not seen for a long time.
as far as i know none of them are overtly political people (except some parents, see below). one of the people getting married is one of my very best friends, not political. that's the back ground.
so, i was talking with a friend who works for angem, had not seen in a long time. probably 36, very swank and handsome. his new wife also works for angem. neither are white (or religious as far as i know). he asked me what i had been up to for all these years and i mentioned i was a political activist mainly focusing on ME stuff specifically i/p issues.
him:"what's up with israel???????? i mean, if you say anything they say you're anti semitic..it's getting really bad over there.."
me: "well you actually can say something, many of us do and it's important people vocalize, that's a large part of what we do..is try to get that conversation out there. did you hear about the church divsetment"
him: "yes, that's huge. (calls to his wife: " honey..come over here were talking about what we were talking about what i was telling you.....") but nobody says anything and the congress, it's as if both sides, everyone agrees..and i don't"
me:" lots of people don't agree, but if no one says anything no one knows other people don't agree, that's"
him: "that's what the whole silencing thing is about"
then i said something about evelyn garcia and he said he heard about that...so then i knew he'd been following some news..more than he was letting on. then he asked for the name of our blog and i told him.
there were over 80 people from the east coast who flew in for the wedding too. i didn't talk to them as much because most of them were family many of whom..oh..the grooms mother and i got into a conversation at the rehearsal dinner. east coast..ex fbi ...i've known her for years so we spoke more freely...she's sick of congress kowtowing and all the money and what's happened to the state department..and the stepfather i also know..ex federal gov from DC..i can't say too much..completely disgusted.
anyway, it was the benign non political scientist and his wife i suppose that surprised me the most. israel was very much on their radar..and it wasn't before.
gotta go check the church divestment news...exciting.
thanks citizen, i just emailed her too. i will try your link too. she should use all of this in her campaigning and know people will have her back. i just had the most surreal conversations last night at a wedding i attended with non political people. they are talking. people are not stupid.
citizen, her email is printed above and all over these copies. it is dhacf@yahoo.com
i'm serious about keeping this on the front page. after this presbyterian vote today i'm crossing my fingers code pink will focus on this attack on supporters of palestinians.
i hope she raises a bunch of funds from people around the country as a result of these revelations going public. it is a shame she kowtowed and resigned her DNC position but none the less she's still running.
it's grotesque that the democratic party supports the occupation. it's supposed to represent the democrats, not israelis or zionists.
klaus, as i mentioned earlier the beastiality accusations are very popular in zio circles. nasrallah too. so silly. 6th grade humor. they might as well be telling fart jokes.
wow, thanks Ira
roya, something tells me oleg was more interested in getting first comment than opening the links and reading the article, which explains that, and that his wife cooperated with the investigation. thanks.
great news!
It may be a matter of Israel creating a situation where the murderous vermin among us know they can kill with impunity.
yep
how utterly deplorable. a license to kill. mindcrunching.
my sorrow for the Jilani family having to endure this after all they have gone thru.
end apartheid government.
i should have mentioned that you are right, violence against palestinians should never be normalized and this has been going on since as long as i can remember. thanks for your article.
the author(s) of that particular article on +972 was 'The Popular Struggle Coordination Committee'. +972 is a culmination of many writers, i source the site quite a lot. that said i don't think generalizing about the blog is particularly helpful in making the point you are trying to make brandon.
Moor has written a really good article. i hope everyone opens it and reads the whole thing.
there's a recent video towards the end of the post @ the link (says "here's video'), from 6/18 in beit ommar. not sure if it is the one Dooler and Younes were arrested or the following week.
link to mondoweiss.net
agreed
it's surreal a pr firm thinks this kind of branding is a way of bonding with normal people. and that video is just horrendous. no amount of 'deodorant' will fix this.
thanks allison
this is so outrageous i just blasted it off to the state department. is their nothing they won't do?
My theory number two is that it would be VERY awkward for Hezbollah to attack Israel purely “in solidarity” with Israel.
is this what you meant to type piotr? i'm confused.
Fiction is used to discredit the factual account that took place on the beach in Gaza. This sort of spin and deflection has long been Israel’s bread and butter.
not to beat a dead horse but that was a main theme of Famous Gaza killing featured in ‘New Yorker’ broke the ceasefire that led to ‘Operation Summer Rains’
they want to erase history and rewrite it and then double down referencing the lie as if it was common knowledge. it's a tactic. and it's nakba denial.
Silow-Carroll doesn't even link to the new yorker so people can judge for themselves. weird.
phil, MW posted about Isso's arrest, from contributors Popular Struggle Coordination Committee "Issa Amro, coordinator of Youth Against Settlements, arrested at border on way to speaking tour"
link to mondoweiss.net
from the link to Palestinian restaurant Haj Kahil in Jaffa
The Haj Kahil family has lived in Jaffa for over 120 years.
i guess that makes it israeli food!
;) mrw, if you only knew..
sweet of you bintbiba, gracias