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Total number of comments: 19 (since 2010-07-16 14:37:21)

Newclench

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  • New York coalition tries, and struggles, to politicize free Israel trip for legislators
    • Coming from you Mooser, that's a compliment! As if trolling isn't your primary function these days....
      Why you are practically speechless. Have you no compliments for the timing of this action? Or support for calling Leslie Cagan's words "nonsense"?

    • snip -
      Amin Husain, a member of the Direct Action Front, told me that the criticism of the disruption from fellow activists like Cagan was “nonsense” because they would have been called anti-Semitic anyway.
      -- snip

      Ah, Amin Husain you old coalition builder! Part of me suspects you have no idea who Leslie Cagan actually is.
      It is impossible to understand how hard it is to oppose Israeli policies without also understanding how awful the radical edges are at actually doing politics. Yes, there are more people willing to listen to Palestinian rights advocates. But then this sort of shit happens and it all goes to hell.
      And let's not forget the competing stories of assault from the Barclay's Center last year involving the same Front.

      If only this energy was hitched to a political strategy capable of winning something. WIN STUFF is actually a good name for a better strategy.

      Given all the anger at Bibi among Democrats, why not pressure folks like Charlie Rangel to boycott his upcoming Congressional speech, following in the footsteps of John Lewis? That might actual work, since Rangel has no more elections to run.

  • Avraham Burg's Israeli vision, and French passport
    • Avram Burg has officialy thrown in his considerable personal reputation behind Hadash, the only 'Jewish-Arab' party that is defined as such from the beginning and in it's official founding documents.

      link to ynetnews.com

      Looking forward to the trolls denouncing Burg for this move, because moving from the Zionist left to the non-Zionist left isn't nearly enough for some folks.

  • A Knesset without Arab parties?
    • These days when I think about the MW community, this is precisely what comes to mind: a perfectly reasonable comment pointing out some factual or logical error, followed by an utter troll, seemingly in defense of... what? The original error? The Palestinian cause?
      I mean.... the article's errors reflect quite poorly on the author and the site's mastery of the subject matter, which has a bearing on the merits of the editorial perspective.

      I do hope the parties merge, though I wish Israeli could have a unified party of the left that included Hadash and some other entity (Yosef Burg? Meretz?) that would represent the largest overlap of a venn diagram of Jewish and Palestinian voters. Bringing them together would be a real step forward for promoting social change in Israeli society. (The other Arab parties don't have a large enough Jewish constituency, and the other Jewish parties don't have a large enough Arab constituency.)

  • Why I confronted Gregor Gysi
    • I'm not sure what I would do. But I know what I wouldn't: confront a leader of the the German Left Party in a Parliamentary bathroom. Or even someone from another party.
      Just to be clear, I don't think MB or DS deserve to be threatened. But this 'in person hassling' of an aging commie.... keerist. That's a pretty deep end of the diving pool!
      How about folks pick on actual supporters of the Israeli occupation? Far away from toilets?

      And Mooser, the comparison was over picking fights with politicians in the bathroom, not with having to hire bodyguards. The might all be brave, targeted heroes, but some heroes stay out of bathroom fights. Because they have more dignity.

    • Once a leader of one of the most left, most pro-Palestinian political entities in Europe is stalked and harassed in this way, you have to wonder just how nutty the whole scene actually is.
      MB and Sheen are certainly journalists with a lot of expertise. At the same time, Gideon Levy and Amira Hass don't find themselves in this kind of situation, corning an old man in a bathroom!
      This is because they are more professional and politically savvy.
      Everyone has something to learn.
      I can't think of a parliament in the world where this kind of stalking would be tolerated. Imagine the outrage, if some right wing doofus followed Haneen Zuabi into the restroom!

    • You think Gysi is a Zionist? Then the word has no meaning.

  • Allegations of anti-Semitism used to cover up anti-Palestinian hate crime in Brooklyn
    • Kudos to Jewish Voice for Peace for their role here - engaging in responsible political action and denouncing violence.
      Here's the first press release they sent out over this incident:
      link to jewishvoiceforpeace.org

      JVP DEPLORES VIOLENT INCIDENT AT BARCLAY’S CENTER
      Submitted by Naomi Dann on Wed, 10/08/2014 - 1:58pm
      JVP DEPLORES VIOLENT INCIDENT AT BARCLAY’S CENTER

      *Statement amended October 20th*

      Further information regarding the incident at Barclays Center on 1010/7/14 has revealed that a Muslim woman carrying a Palestinian flag was assaulted at the Nets/Maccabi game and is pressing charges. A suspect was apprehended in conjunction with the assault on Mr. Petlakh, and the incident is no longer being investigated as a hate crime.

      October 8th, 2014. Jewish Voice for Peace deplores the violent incident at last night’s NY Nets and Maccabi Tel Aviv basketball game at Barclays Center. We send our sympathies to Leonard Petlakh, who was assaulted at the end of the game and suffered a broken nose and lacerations requiring stitches. The details remain unclear and we support a full investigation into this incident to determine what happened.

      JVP-NY members gathered outside the game to protest the fundraiser held by the Friends of the IDF at the stadium before the game. JVP members held signs and handed out flyers expressing the view that honoring the IDF only a few weeks after Israel’s attack on Gaza has ended contradicts our values as Jewish New Yorkers. We were there as part of a large coalition of organizations who were all committed to non-violently protesting this event.

      JVP-NY member Pam Sporn gave an eyewitness report of the protest:

      “The police had us behind a barricade on the sidewalk, while many people aggressively waving Israeli flags were in front of Barclays yelling at us and making rude gestures. Several times the police used a bullhorn to tell them to back up. The protest dispersed at 8 PM. Before we left, a police official said to us, "Thanks for making our job easier." I don't think he would have said that if someone from the protest had attacked someone. However, while a small group of us were leaving the area, a group 3 young men with Israeli flags harassed us and said that we “need Israeli dick.”

      If something happened after the game, which would have been several hours after the protest ended, it had nothing to do with us or the demonstration.”

      While the details of this incident are unclear, we reiterate our commitment to non-violence and express our horror at the injuries that Mr. Petlakh suffered. We hope to know soon the full details of what happened.

      We reaffirm our steadfast opposition to all forms of bigotry, violence and hate, including anti-semitism, anti-arab hate, and misogyny.

  • Gaza war gives rise to new Jewish group targeting Jewish institutions that support occupation
    • As someone who was part of this group's first action, I can tell you it was refreshing how many were making snarky references to both J Street AND the hard core BDS folks.
      These are sane, progressive Jews who know Israel and the OT, the Jewish community, and themselves. As I experienced them (I guess I'm one of them) they would be denounced endlessly on this site if they expressed themselves.
      Reading Phil's optimistic report, I feel like paraphrasing on his behalf:
      "Dear group that would be savaged by the insane choir on my site for failing to fully endorse BDS or repudiate Zionism: Good job!"

  • Florida Congresswoman sides with Israeli police over her own brutalized teenage constituent
    • Tree is the tone policeman who must shame all other tone policemen. It's 100% hypocrisy.
      "how dare you object to a nuance that I find perfectly reasonable!"

  • Reform Jews offer no proposal to end occupation, says Jewish Voice for Peace
    • "They were all cleared of whatever moral opposition to YESHA existed a long time ago by donor pressure and careerism."
      If you think the Reform movement is pro YESHA than you are quite ignorant of Reform movement politics.
      Unless YESHA donors and funders are happy spending their way to stuff like this:

      The NRA is America’s curse. And the settlements are Israel’s NRA
      link to ericyoffie.com

  • The American father insists that Israel is an egalitarian society, his daughter disagrees
    • Why would you write "while pretending that they are culturally indebted to no one."?

      Do you really think Israelis aren't aware that they borrow things from Palestinian, Arab or Islamic culture?
      Here's an utterly Zionist source describing the direct borrowing from those cultures. I learned of this stuff in grade school, which is how I knew to find it.
      link to esra-magazine.com

      Hebrew speaking Israelis use plenty of Arabic words in casual conversation, and no one is confused about where those words come from. (Finjan, wadi, shabab come to mind. The last is used in particular by ultra orthodox folks to refer to wayward youth who skip class.)

      I suppose you might be forgiven if you meant that some non-Israeli lovers of Zion had no idea where falafel comes from, but that's not what was written here.

      Anyway, the seepage of culture from the margins to the center is kind of universal.

  • BDS is the only means of ending the occupation -- Derfner
    • The modern history of BDS begins with the launch of a boycott of settlement products in 1995, initiated by Gush Shalom, a group that strongly supports a two state solution.
      The Palestinian led-effort began years later. Derfner is on solid ground when he engages in 'two-stater BDS.'

  • South African radicals wanted to kill Paul Simon for violating boycott -- Steve Van Zandt
  • Don't destroy our dream-castle Israel! (Why the Jewish establishment shut out J Street)
    • Maybe the rejection is irrational. But Occam's Razor would suggest that this is a more complicated answer, and less likely to be true. Making assumptions about the motives of others' - how do you like it when that happens to you?
      J Street represents a particular camp in the Jewish world, one opposed by the right wingers and by the Palestinian solidarity movement. Trying to flatten everything into a 'this or that' dichotomy is, aside from anything else, quite undemocratic. Can't there be 3 camps? Or 5? Or 10? Keep in mind that J Street and say, the Palestinian Authority, are broadly aligned with each other. Right wing Jews are opposed to that alignment. So are left wing solidarity activists.

  • Peace Now board member jokes about owning a SodaStream
    • 1. "APN’s milder criticism of the occupation in general." That's just a strange thing to say. Can you support, perhaps with a quote, that APN is somehow 'less critical of the occupation' than.... ??? What does that even mean? Less hyperbolic use of language?
      If there is one thing about APN folks should agree with it is that they oppose the occupation, unreservedly.

      2. I've seen many many pantloads of 'humor' on this site, quite a bit of it from commenters being despicably cruel to others. And when the unfunny, mean spirited, cruel humor flows from the more extreme to the less extreme, it passes muster. But when it comes in this one instance from the less extreme to the more extreme, suddenly, 'whoa, dude, not a laughing matter!'
      Feels a little hypocritical, as though the pump is primed to denounce APN for something, anything, and then this came along so 'gotcha!'

    • She's making fun of the Jewish community's anti-BDS obsession - for Purim.
      The holiday where we commemorate our own attempted genocide with humor.
      There's something utterly humorless about twisting that into 'the occupied territories are just a joke.'

  • 'Netanyahu is a Nazi': Scenes from an Orthodox anti-military draft protest in Jerusalem
    • "...secular-nationalist Economic Minister Naftali Bennett"
      The author has such a good, knowledgeable tone throughout. But not knowing that Bennett is Orthodox, as is his party, sends the message that she isn't quite fluent in Israeli politics yet.
      link to en.wikipedia.org

  • Israeli leftwing party embraces settlements on occupied land
    • Shame on you both.
      You make an assertion "So people in both the Labour Party and Meretz think it’s cool to circulate a list of their illegal settlements" turn it into an inflammatory title "
      Israeli leftwing party embraces settlements on occupied land" and insert a bizarre conclusion: "are sharing a map of Kibbutzim on stolen Palestinian land, including illegal settlements on occupied West bank land, and taking pride in it."

      It's just insane. This FB page, which isn't even the main page of Meretz, posts a graphic and you use that one data point to demonstrate that the party has made a complete about face from opposing settlements to 'taking pride' in them?

      This is shallow and beneath you, Phil. Maybe not Ofer, who I don't know, but come on. Not because I give two shits about Meretz, but because intellectual dishonesty doesn't actually serve a good cause.

      The reality is much less nefarious. A relatively small number of kibbutzim are outside the Green Line in occupied territories. The vast majority of those were settled by Labor, not Mapam. Then the movements merged for economic reasons. And yes, there is a historic connection between Mapam kibbutzim and Meretz. So we have a weird situation where the unified kibbutz movement has a few stray entities which are settlements and a historic link to one third of the historic Meretz coalition.

      Meanwhile, Meretz is as opposed as ever the settlement project, and some junior staffer repeated a pro-kibbutz image showing where they are all located to foster some kibbutz pride.

      It would be pointless, but at least not misleading, to simply attack the entire kibbutz movement for being on stolen Palestinian land. (Pointless, because most of Israel is on such land, not the kibbutz movement in particular.)

      This is just another political attack on two staters using a very flimsy excuse, and asserting falsely that they aren't even against the occupation.

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