Total number of comments: 127 (since 2009-11-18 13:09:48)
Einstein says
living in the place where you guys spend all your time talking about...
Website: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsVUO3kotH0
Showing comments 127 - 101
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Showing comments 127 - 101
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hophmi, are you saying that people who commit war crimes or support war crimes should have a right to peacefully assemble?
if they support Israel, and the murder of children, if they assemble we should kill them where they stand. thats our right!
Freedom and democracy for all (who hate israel that is)
at least this issue has united Sweden's skinheads and muslims. thats really a silver lining!
true danaa
yet another good point
we need to round up all these zionists and exterminate them.
then the world would be a perfectly peaceful place
i see this is the correct way now.
i just thought you guys hated Jews before but only Zionists.
so any Jew (or non-Jew too we dont want to be anti-semitic) that supports Israel should die!
you are right. i didn't realize i thought they were out to call for a ceasefire. but if they were out to express support of israel those filthy animals deserve all the bottles firecrackers and I ONLY WISH BULLETS that they get
way to go to the real PEACE activists
shingo, what do you mean by switching the term Jew to muslims? thats what i did....
i have trouble following you as the only thing that makes sense is your curses..
anyway, i am glad that you are not sanguine about injustice. there is so much injustice in the world i am sure that all of these injustices are equally burning you with hate and the pursuit of justice...you are just focusing on the worst of the worst for the sake of the world. congrats...i hope you get all those nasty zionists and that they all burn in the ovens! best of luck seeker of truth and defender of justice
you really are a sick individual shingo and i feel sorry for you. you sound very troubled and emotionally disturbed.
you are precisely the reason i don't even bother posting anymore.
not that I need to defend my comment to you after such a sophmoric and vulgar rant but if you are having trouble reading my post through your intense hatred i will summarize the point.
i suggested that Phil's assessment of how Jews were treated in muslim countries was disingenouos and hypocritical for if you were to make the same statement regarding how palestinians are treated in Israel then he obviously wouldn't support it.
thats a pretty valid and fair point. frankly i am surprised a moderator doesn't censor your crude, obscene and vulgar response.
anyway, go seek some help for your own sake, shingo, you sound like you can use it
shingo that was quite an eloquent defense. please continue to prove my point with your hateful ad hominem attacks. I realize that there is no way to defend against the point I made.
Mr. Weiss is getting paid by dishing out the disinformation like a progressive Alex Jones. He doesn't respect you shingo, and neither do I.
Look into your heart and ask yourself why you hate the way you do...
at least Phil has got a benefit from it. whats yours? have you come to Israel/palestine? take an ISM tour and enjoy. :-)
Wow, i've been away for a while but, Phil is sounding more and more desparate hateful and pathetic.
Consider this gem...
"Jews were not then persecuted in the Muslim world. They were often second-class citizens, but they weren't persecuted"
So what's the problem? Lets just use the old switch test to test for double standards and hypocrisy. we substitute the word Jews with Palestinians and how would Mr Weiss take this?
"Palestinians aren't be persecuted in Israel, they are second-class citizens, but they aren't persecuted"
Please, Phil, how could you possibly be excusing a violent hate attack by the "leftists" on people who were out there to promote peace? that behavior is excusable. if people you were with on a demonstration like the one outside the waldorf started throwing "bottles and firecrackers " would you think your fellow "protesters" were justified?
have you simply gone mad? or is it that this hatemongering gig is paying off nicely? no shame in that type of journalism, glen beck and rush limbaugh can attest to its lucrativity on the other side, right?
parisian, that is a ridiculous question...
The term the "nakba"relates to the establishment of the State of Israel.
The term "nakba" means "catastrophe". Obviously from the perspective of those who oppose the State's creation that may be the perspective. And I believe that for some that is a very legitimate gripe.
Does it make me happy that people suffered or suffer in the realization of an independant Jewish State in the land of Israel? no. a resounding no. All people's suffering is horrible and abhorable and deeply regrettable.
Aref, I regurgitate truth, it makes no sense to you because you are so deeply entrenched in comfortable lies that make you happy in your little world.
if you need me to clarify any of my points then please draw up a list of questions, i'd be happy to enlighten you.
Chaos, it's funny that you call me the intellectually deficient one here. I make compelling arguments that fly in the face of your circle jerk hatefest, so instead of manning up and defending your ignorant position, you choose to ban me.
I understand why you would want to ban me as my logical and thorough understanding of the conflict and the real aggressors and instigators is seen by you as a threat.
look how hypocritical you are, i am revelling in this, i hope that one of these mods agrees, that would certainly affirm my belief that you are all hypocritical and propaganda (or hasbara) spewers
no one here is a real liberal
What is Palestine, or don't you understand English you Parisian dunce?
What were Palestine's borders? How does one decide who is Palestinian?
these are all false constructs. I am not saying there aren't arabs residing in Israel, and I don't like to see them live in the condition they are currently in. But the fact remains "Palestine" and "Palestinians" are fictional constructs, that exist only once you have defined "Israel"
unless of course you refer to British Mandate of Palestine, which would therefore include all of what is now the State of Jordan and parts of Lebanon, Syria, and Iraq. Therefore if you subscribe to the idea of an indiginous "Palestinians" a person born in Amman would be a Palestinian as much as someone from Nablus (also a false name) and someone from Sheikh Muwannis or Ramat Aviv.
So you are basically championing a divisional distractional technique that the West is using in order to keep this region de-stabilized so they can continue to rob and control the mid east's resources.
"we" didnt return to a land, Jews returned to the land. They were people here but far more people (i.e. non Jews) arrived here at the same time.
You dont get to cry over the "massacre" of peoples when your country, France, is still involved in massacring and raping the "poorer" nations of the world. You want Justice go and riot in the streets of Paris. The re-establishment of the Jewish people in their ancestorial homeland is a Just and noble cause and if the West would quit manipulating the currupt leaders of this nascent State then true justice, peace and prosperity will be realized for all peoples in the mideast, both Jew and Arab. those that fear this new age, and rightfully so, are those pigs who worship the false idols and pagan practices of the Western world. those westerners who have profitted off the lives of all the "poor" nations of the world.
Tell france to pay reparations to Haiti instead of blockading and sanctioning those people for shaking off the yolk of Napolean.
Incidentally, I've read plenty of Chomsky and Finklestein (at least Chomsky unlike you has put aside his "Jewish" identity) you and finklestein are bigotted hypocrites. you are not a Jew so stop confusing yourself and others.
i am not claiming to be anything....
but you are just admitting that i am right.
aparisian:
"Even the killing of innocent Jewish people?"
once again, maybe there is a languange barrier as I have no idea what you meant by that...
"Jews can live in Palestine under Palestinian sovereignty, there was no need for a state."
Why should it be under "Palestinian" sovereignty? when in the entire history of this land was it controlled by "Palestinians"? What is a "palestinian"? how would you define what is palestinian? Does that include the people of transjordan? transjordan was referred to as Palestine under the british occupation.
you have no idea what you are fighting for, because thats how the western powers want you to think you are a shill and joke. again you need to understand that your supposed support of "palestinians" is the continuation of the imperialism that your government wants to impose on both arab and jewish residents of this land... but oh well it is a catchy slogan..."free free palestine"
"At the same time you continue to support the robbing of Zionists on the land of the indigenous peoples in Palestine.
you support imperialism when it is in the interests of the terrorist state of Israel.
You are full of BS! none and contraédictions "
you are full of contradictions learn your history. Zionists (rather Jews) who have returned to their ancestoral homeland is a very natural correction of one of the biggest injustices and crimes of human civilization. they are not occupiers and not colonialists, colonialists imply that they are doing this on behalf of a foreign power.
to the extent that the modern State of Israel accepts and collaborates with the West, they will have their retribution as those who do so are committing high crimes against the Almighty.
Israel should accept it's place as a middle eastern state and establish a Jewish theocratic monarchy similar to Saudi Arabia
i dont see the connection, citizen, please enlighten me as to the connection between the creation of the State of Israel and the US use of an atom bomb on Japan? seriously, how is this related much less inconsistent?
Citizen, how can you justify the use of the atomic bomb?
there is absolutely NO DEBATE! it is a war crime, pure and simple.
if you are outraged at gaza, yet you can somehow civilly debate Hiroshima and Nagasaki than you really need to examine your true anti Israel motives as it is certainly not what you are purporting (i.e. you care for human rights and civilian lives)
where the hell do you live? where do you get the nerve to call Israel a terrorist state when the terrorist history of France is much longer much darker and far more broad in scope?
I am against war and against killing. you are a shill for your western imperialist government. "palestinians" are your concern now? not all of course just some "palestinians" those living in Israel, those living in Lebanon and Syria those arabs that your government bought and sold, like they did/do in North Africa in Morrocco, in Algiers, in Tunisia. those arabs you do not care about.
you are a hypocrite and a bigot. and elitist racist, get over yourself "Jew"
i read shlomo sands he says nothing new... nothing that a true Jew did not already know and acknowledge at least 3 times a day.
only you are "shocked" by that revelation as now it makes you question your "birthright" to your elitist pass. how can you continue to call yourself a Jew (by virtue of your special birth) if perhaps your ancestors were actually converts?
Ron Paul all the way...cut all across the board. a government's first responsibility should be to their citizens.
"Historically? How many years Jews lived in the holy land? and how many years non Jews lived in the same land? "
Jews have lived in the holy land continuously since the destruction of the second temple. what is your point?
"None sense, Palestine is occupied by western occupiers yes they come from the USA/Russia/Europe. People here offer them reconciliation but they are very hungry for more lands theft and blood."
At least you preface what you are about to say "none sense" because your statement is horse shite. if you are saying the Jewish people are USA Russia and Europe than you are pathetically mistaken, and prrobably your confusion is due to your own confusing "Jewish" identity
"Nope i m not proud of atrocities committed against any countries and i fight for their rights. "
how by supporting the "Palestinian" cause? that is just a re-labeling of your country's imperialism
YES and YES
US Congress are both ignorant and a bunch of liars.
The US should not only stop aid to Israel but stop aid to all middle eastern countries and DEFINITELY cease waging wars everywhere in the world and especially in the Middle East.
US should have a minimalist foreign policy, US citizens should be FAR more outraged with the fact that the US invests 10 times more in foreign occupations and invasions than it does for its OWN citizens. while spending on education and growth in the US is cut or frozen, spending on Afghanistan and Iraq increases...doesn't anyone find that disturbing?
what about change and hope?
i don't condone war or killing of innocent civilians. thats all
i do support and believe in the rights of Jews to establish and independant and sovereign State in their ancestoral homeland.
i am against the continued neo-liberal agenda to rob indigenous peoples everywhere of their sovereignty and resources (i.e. latin america, Africa, Afghan, Iraq, etc etc)
i am against the IMF the world bank Nato the UN all tools of Western imperialism.
aparisian, you are the one who is exceptionalist. think about it. anyone from any race or color can be a Jew, that is my belief. You believe that a Jew is someone who is born that way from a Jewish mother (take yourself as an example) whether or not you actually believe in any of the tenets of the Jewish faith. You use your "Jewish" label to seperate yourself, when you are just like your fellow Parisians, you share their beliefs culture and languange, yet you are DIFFERENT from them as you are special and Jewish and your fellow countrymen are not.
That is racism. how you don't see that is beyond me...however, it makes no matter, as call yourself what you want, say you are protesting in the name of Jews, it won't matter. the true Jewish people are moving forward according to Allah's will, may his destiny be fulfilled speedily and in our days.
Says who? says logic. Yes, Adolph Ochs is a great example of how this is so.
I find it offensive, parisian, because you scream long live palestine, which is a totally nonsensical and historically inaccurate statement.
this shows your ignorance. anyone who chants long live palestine, is basically saying...long live foreign western occupiers of the middle east (and the whole world)
so yes i know you are a proud french man, proud of your country's occupation and looting of many indigenous sovereign nations throughout the "now called third world" the "so-called poor" countries. the fact that you cant arrive at that equation is disturbing, the fact that you are just one in so so so many is truly sad and tragic.
if you want to do good learn your history before blindly supporting the cause du jour. "long live the NWO" "long live oppresion and suppresion and corporate control" "long live PALESTINE"
those who chant long live palestine are those who ironically don't want palestinians to "live long"
aparisian, quit calling yourself a Jew. anytime you do, you are being a racist.
i get it. you have jewish ancestors, but you yourself are a parisian, secular, no ties of any kind to the religion or tradition of your ancestors. you cant play both sides of the fence. you cant assimilate and call yourself a Jew.
the reason you (and phil) so desperately hold on to your Jewish label is out of poor elitism and racism. you feel somehow superior due to your "Jewish" identity. however, this is a racist belief.
i'm sorry to tell you that you are a racist and hypocrite, but if i don't who will, brother?
Aref, you are late to the party, the fact why you all idealize Einstein has been made clear to me.
Truthfully, I am not a big fan of Einstein. His work on nuclear science helped contribute to the Greatest War Crime in human history, the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki
A crime, i might mention, that has not a miniscule percentage of the support to prosecute like the Goldstone's "report". and yet the loss of life was somewhere like 100s of times more. oh well, those were really nonWesterners...so who here cares about them..
Chaos, what gives you that idea? because I support Jewish independance and sovereignty in their ancestoral homeland?
I am against Western society. There is no Judeo-Christian tradition. Judeo-Christian refers to the hellenistic tradition. I believe all christians are pagans and that western society (mostly "christian" but whether or not a westerner believes or not) are pagans.
The true resolution of the conflict in the middle east will only come about when the foreign Western occupiers and instigators leave these lands and allow the people of Shem to work out their problems by themselves.
aparisian, you are a miserable lil man arent u?
long live palestine...restore it to its former independent glory, huh?
"Jews of good will need to understand that Jews no longer get to decide for Palestinians."
whoa!...but what will Phil, Gideon, Bradley, Jews for Justice in Palestine, etc etc etc what will they all do? those poor palestinians better damn well take their elitist Jewish charity or else they will have to deal with Jews like Avigdor!!
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
lots of very powerful words parisian, very loaded and troubling indeed...
however, are you actually saying that Israel committed/is committing "Genocide"?
if thats what you believe, then I should just ignore you as you are clearly mentally handicapped.
again rabbi parisian isn't it you that thinks himself eceptional, as you still have not explained how zionism is not traditonal judaism whereas witty has,but you are the jewish authority as your mother birthed you and hence your racist exceptionalism....
oh look who is here to argue that zionism has nothing to do with Judaism...rabbi "my mother is Jewish"
please rabbi parisian, teach us the true tradition of the Jewsih people?
get over my name...dumbasses and address my comments.
jeez, how often do we need to go through this?
the comment was that Gideon Levy and Yossi Beilin aren't exactly great examples of being Lieberman lackies. i think that mr. levy would be very offended by mr. weiss' treatment or categorization with respect to this post.
anyone out here have anything intelligent to say regarding this?
no of course not. this is just a support group (er...cuircle jerk) for anti-semites (er...sorry how un-pc of me...anti-Zionists)
yossi beilin and gideon levy excellent indications of their right wing israel bias!
the outrage!
aparisian"I think i m helping Jews by showing them the differences between the real Jewish tradition and Zionism."
i thought you said you were secular? is secular the "real" jewish tradition?
wow! i really got you worked up you are finally seeing the hypocrisy of your existence. Saudi is not a military theocracy?
israel is hardly a theocracy. although it should be then it wouldn't be held to a different world standard.
the French, (like all western countries and like all countries who set these so-called "international laws" that Israel "violates"), have a wonderful track record on "justice and peace and human rights for all human beings"
look at Haiti, Algiers, Tunisia and not too mention the French's role in the current conflict in the middle east. learn your french history. the only reason you are equating Palesine and Justce and Friendship for all, this whole framing of the conflict is misleading.
aparisian it's obvious you are very thick headed.
you want me to publicly condemn Geller....I didn't even know who she was. but here you go...."WORLD I HEREBY PUBLICLY CONDEMN GELLER" is that ok? she doesn't seem like such an important person in the whole IP conflict anyway. but if it makes you happy
you got Jews in Paris who hate muslims and arabs, what can i tell you? i wish they wouldn't. i auto critisize them as well
but you i especially auto critisize. i think i made it clear why its racism. you label yourself as Jewish, yet you do nothing to warrant such a label aside from the fact that you were born that way. which means you can say whatever you like about Jews everywhere. you got a priviledge pass from birth.
be honest being Jewish means nothing to you, so why do you hold that label? like Phil here, you have an elitist attitude. you were born Jewish which somehow makes you special and different from your other parisianers.
aparisian:"Your are not god to tell who is more Jewish among Jews, i have a Jewish heritage, but i m a secular guy who believes in equal rights for every human beings. France is not my host country, this is where i was born, this is where my parents were born, this is our country, certainly not Zionist Israel. But i can confirm that many people like me are desperately angry when they frequent the closed Jewish communities, desperately angry because we feel uncomfortable with the situation and the future of Jews in the world and you are to blame, certainly not your enemies the Arabs nor the Muslims."
I dont like the EDL and I dont like christian evangalicals like hagee.
i dont think arabs or muslims are the enemy.
you are french, not jewish, just french. i am sorry to take away your jewish label which although you have done nothing except being born you feel entitled to
that is racism. you and phil have it.
aparisian...so i can't speak on behalf of jews and judaism. but you can cause of your jewish mother? most israelis live in western cities, no religion, as you state. where do you live? as you are identifying as a Jew, i am sure you live in a much holier city than any in western israel.
Racist Jews like you and Phil, here cling to some "Jewish Identity" when its clear your identity has nothing to do with Judaism (maybe you read Kafka, or watch woody allen and eat bagels...thats your "Jewish" identity)This begs the question why you are allowed to call yourself a Jew anymore? and the reason you offer is that your mother is Jewish. thats racist
Yet you want the very right to speak on behalf of Jews and denounce Israel, in order to be comfortable in your Host's countries. I think thats fine but stop your racistly focused definition of Jew and identify with your national host country.
In answer to your questions:
Show me one reason why i should support your colonialist movement?
You shouldn't. No one is asking you to. Protest do whatever you like but realize that you are not doing this out of your loyalty to your religious Jewish beliefs. You do so in rejection of them. So if thats the case, then don't protest under a Jewsi banner, protest under your national banner.
tell me when Zionists have accepted goys of all races and cultures?
tell me a case when Zionists have not...Israel took in many refugees from Vietnam, recently from Darfur and Sudan. there are plenty of incidents. I know I know that is not enough, immigrants face hardships and struggle in integration and acceptance to Israeli society. Israel should be the most perfect society, any good deeds must be complete and their after effects should only be positive. just like all the other perfect countries
And why should Saudis grant them their citzenship? they belong to Palestine, they belong to this land, they are not Saudis, they are refugees and they have the right to return.
Well, it stands to reason that be granted citizenship by Saudi, would not take away a palestinian's right to fight for return to his native land. however, as a chief proponent of so called human rights on behalf of palestinians. you would think they would be decent enough to extend to a quarter of a million palestinians who have been living there for decades Palestinians were the only excluded group from legislation that granted citizenship to other foreign immigrants in 2004
Is that the way to treat people whose rights they supposedly care about? i guess like you say its for their own benefit. I suppose the US should revoke all citizenship rights granted to palestinian immigrants, that would help their cause.
proceed with your bashing, i know that no one here including the contributers give a damn about actual people, not palestinians and certainly not Jews (or in your case parisian, your "fellow jews")
look quit trying to justify or rationalize your hatred of Jews..
embrace it, be honest (Chu, parisian) (avi - not sure what the hell your point was but yes thank you for finding yet another mondoweiss article which if penned by BNP's Griffen would be considered anti-semitic)
you all love to use this word hasbara as if it is some sort of evil mysterious conspiracy. in essence your anti-zionism talking points are also "hasbara" its just that you guys want to bash Israel and when people support Israel it is called "hasbara"
can we just call sites like this anti-zionist propaganda? that is what it is. just like pro israel blogs like standwithus are pro-zionist propaganda "hasbara"
its all hasbara. the word is not special. get over it
what is exceptional is the level of hate by all of you against the Jewish people's right to self determination and sovereignty in their land. and the State of Israel, as crazy as it sounds in light of Gaza and all, is STILL the most accommadating country to the rights and needs of the Palestinian people. look at how Palestinians are treated in any of the Arab league countries! this is a fact that you all wish to ignore. so excuse the hasbara, but maybe you should stop your hasbara against israel and instead of raising funds from Saudis demand that the Saudis grant citizenship to palestinians who have applied for it.
ok i am ready spit your vicious anti-semitic (no sorry i need to be PC anti-zionist) rhetoric.
Who is in fact racist? Jews who abide by their faith are accepting of all peoples who wish to convert regardless of race color or other
or Phil, who vehemently rejects his Judaism, he subscribes and promotes assimilationism. and who has obviously abandoned any trace of being Jewish....except for his so-called "Jewish" identity i.e. according to him this is his elitist guest pass. he is Jewish by virtue of birth and therefore some how better than all people. smarter etc...
jeez i heard that blowhard on boiling frogs, the guy is a straight up racist it is disgusting. if he had any real integrity after seeing what kind of hatemongers hangout on his site he would decide to look more closely into the IP conflict.
Wait a minute why is this section not quoted
"The BNP’s Griffin, who has openly denied the Holocaust and accused Jews of controlling the media, urged his allies to transmute their anti-Semitism into Islamophobia to broaden the party’s political appeal. He wrote in 2007, “It stands to reason that adopting an ‘Islamophobic’ position that appeals to large numbers of ordinary people – including un-nudged journalists – is going to produce on average much better media coverage than siding with Iran and banging on about ‘Jewish power’, which is guaranteed to raise hackles of virtually every single journalist in the western world.”"
Holocaust Denial (change to "Industry") & Jews Control the Media & Jewish Power
link to mondoweiss.net
link to mondoweiss.net
Sounds awfully like 80% of the posts on Mondoweiss!
maybe Geller and Weiss are Nazis.
Max is such a pseudo journalist. he is a young geraldo what a douche
This is my point. The Palestine Government was not in favor of donating land for Jews. the problem was that the independent state of Palestine did not accept the Jewish immigrants. So the powerful Jews conquered the small independant government and ousted their Palestinian King (it was a King who ruled Palestine prior to Israel's occupation, correct?). Think of how sad it was when the vicious Jews ransacked the Palestinian central bank and made off with all of the Palestinians' currency reserves (what was the name of their currency? i always forget)
My heart truly goes out to the palestinians i would like to also restore their country to its former glory as the most independant and free country in the middle east.
So you see if a people like the US who tolerate Jews can be kind enough to provide the Jews with a piece of land (Vegas sounds nice) then Jews can all just live there. They can build new holy places and stuff, whats the big deal?
good i am sure Jews will be happy establishing their homeland right next to Vegas!
we could build a new Jerusalem. right by the Hard Rock
problem solved MRW! finally
I agree citizen Jews should not have the right to protect themselves or their country, they should relegate themselves to the graciousness and generousity of a Gentile Host country and not attempt self determination.
America should take in all the world's Jews. that way they will be safe from antisemitism, right Weiss??
You would think they would have produced one already, what with all their experience throwing stones for so long...
the racist Weiss exposing his true self yet again. I read this blog for slip ups like this post. look even his so called "Jewish" supporters and lackees that comment on his every post (you know who you are...) they are even disgusted by Weiss' true racist self.
Keep posts like this up. it helps clarify the issues. like bronner's kid joining the IDF.
Hamas carries out scandalous human rights violations but Gaza Freedom Marchers support them, Mondoweissers support them.
Quoting the position of the Christian Science Monitor declaring Papa Doc to be "terrorizing" haitians is symantics...why do you think the people of Haiti named him PAPA DOC. because of the medical attention he secured for the country's poor. he was a folk hero. and here you are condemning him as a terrorist. he was a freedom fighter and Israel helped him defeat the US push to regain control in Haiti.
Can't you see how hypocritical you are being?
exactly, Cliff, so re-examine your point
Phil never accepted the US coup - EXACTLY he (like Duvalier) is for Haitian independence and sovereignty
Phil has cited the Israeli reporter’s work here to further undermine the PR extravaganza behind Israel’s Haiti relief operation- HOW? if Duvalier was for Haitians and Israel supported Duvalier, then how would this undermine their PR in their relief efforts?
Israel's support for Duvalier regime should also be seen as a POSITIVE like their relief efforts in the wake of the quake. Since Duvalier was a populist leader who rejected US and foreign occupation and exploitation of Haiti, Israel sold him weapons.
So, are you saying Phil shows us this in order to commend Israel in its efforts.... makes sense given the nature of this blog...i think your on to something Clifford..
now all i have to do to be clever is think of some name as clever as clown shoes...how about "false tooth"?
i tell you i agree with you there cliff, but maybe you should be as active protesting and bashing your own government which pressures its little stepchild into selling arms to, among others, the shah in Iran (remember Iran Contra?!? those weapons were shipped from Israel.)
dont blame israel for supporting america's neo-imperialism. you can't play both sides. israel is a victim of america's neo-imperialism, when the US tells Israel to jump they say "How High?" they work for their 3 Billion...
Addressing comments from Mooser-
"are you an anti-Semite? If not, stop trying to quote-mine prayers" - I know you are supposed to be the "bee's knees" on these forums, but this sentence could have been written by a five year old. it makes no sense. however, i will take a stab at what i think you meant. How does my quoting thine prayers make me an anti-semite? in fact, it shows my tolerance and understanding. However, you do admit that these are, in fact, quotes from Jewish prayers, we agree?!?
"If you are not Jewish, how on earth do you know" - upset that i know more about "your" religion than you?!? it's called google and wiki and a million other resources that the internet opened up. However, you do admit that these are, in fact, quotes from Jewish prayers, we agree?!?
"how many of the world’s remaining Jews say these prayers, and what those prayers mean to them." - are you suggesting that these prayers which have comprised the Jewish tradition and defined Jews for millenia, are no longer important to Jews? Then what makes one a "Jew"?
Jewish tradition and prayer is not important to you so doesn't that mke you elitist, arrogant and not to mention racist for you to consider yourself a "Jew" based not on your beliefs but by virtue of your genetic disposition. furthermore, you are marginilizing and trying to delegitimize those "remaining jews" for whom these traditions and beliefs form the core of their Jewish identity. unlike your birthright, to these jews their identity is derived from their belief in the traditional Jewish religion. Some of these people may have converted to Judaism, does that make them LESS of a Jew then you who are a "pure-breed"? seems a bit racist to me
"the great majority of the world’s Jews want nothing whatsoever to do with Zionism" - i dont think that is the case at all, look at the facts, if it were only a small minority of Jews that supported Zionism, like you suggest, i doubt that zionists would have been successful in establishing the modern state of israel. please explain your assertion
"It won’t get you anything, and any Jew can see through it to the bigotry and muddled thinking behind it. " - Jews like you? or real Jews?
Eva, i love reading your posts, you are so intentionally misinformed, and you are the biggest jew hater on this site.
how is that a stretch.
it is a fact that this excert was posted because Weiss found it interesting, the excert is condemning Israel's involvement in selling arms to Duvalier.
Duvalier opposed the US occupation and control.
Duvalier represented the oppressed people, the rural afro-carribeans (people here on this blog would obviously compare those people to the quintessential victims "the palestinians")
here, however, Weiss exposes his ignorance (and that of the Israeli journalist who wrote the piece) as to him it is more important to condemn Israel, then defend human rights and the populist struggle. this is a theme on this website...MondoWeiss' message is not so much give palestinian rights as it is destroy the evil Zionist regime
I hate racist and jews
actually I don't want to answer. NEVER...
he is voicing his support against Duvalier or rather he supports the israeli journalists condemnation of Israel for helping to arm Duvalier. Duvalier was opposed to the American sponsered coup.
I make simple for you in mondoweiss talk
Duvalier supporters = palestinians
Coup supporters = ZIO- colonialists
Now Cliffy, understand?
here we go: the following are from Jewish prayers and for themost part recited up to several times A DAY!!
"if I forget thee Jerusalem, I forget my right arm, let my tongue stick to the roof of my mouth if i dont raise you at the height of my hapiness"
"gather us up from the four corners of the earth and return us to zion"
"rebuild Jerusalem"
"return your presence to Jerusalem"
etc etc etc etc certainly lots of zionistic rhetoric..(especially cause there is no specification whether East or West Jerusalem)
the prevelance of the theme of Jews returning to their land is in EVERY ASPECT of Jewish daily life....now prove to me there is Judaism WITHOUT Zionism.
thats your arguement Citizen? you are not ashamed yet?
you call me a liar without proof! For some weird reason you need me to be Jewish. whatever...
but no i dont believe nazism is germanic...how did you even arrive at that conclusion. was it just because a Nazi analogy hadn't been mentioned in 3 posts?
i would liken it to Judaism without Zionism is like Christians without Jesus.
does that help you understand better? let me know and I will start posting FACTS to back up the above assertion...something you have never done in any post (i.e. i pwn u troll)
thats an 88 good buddy
also, just because i argued on what the definition of who is a Jew doesn't mean that I am Jewish myself. I am not. Your multitude of quotes does not prove that I am. for again, I am not.
I can argue with you about who is an "African-American" as well, it wouldn't necessarily make me one. You still may consider me one. But I am not, I am FULLY American, my skin color happens to be dark and my hair kinky, but I argue I do not need a qualifier before my "American" as my family can be traced back to America way longer then most of you Caucasian Americans
anyway, i don't see the point in arguing this point. it is hardly worthwhile. you should actually address the ISSUES, i brought up, because my arguements have exposed the lies and misinformation you try so hard to convince yourself and others of...
but you are not capable of free thought you are the real "troll"
again, i am not Jewish, i am who i said i am.
the fact that you choose to call me Jewish and accuse me of being one, is proof positive that you are in fact a racist.
it's very important that you frame me as a Jew then you can continue your, rather poor, line of arguement that i am a "hasbara" spreader and parrot back the other acceptable covers for your anti Jewish sentiment
zionism is judaism. it is the essence of the 2500 year old religion. that is a fact. a fact overlooked by anyone who wants to call themself a Jew but doesn't want to really "be" one
Hey look guys, it's the mondoweiss parrot, that is threatened at the thought of a non-Jew who actually supports the Jewish Nationalist initiative in the middle east. It's someone who fears and bashes ad hominem at the postings of someone who is clearly more intelligent and informed and whose posts expose this parrot's doctrine for what they are racist, violent and oppressive all wrapped up in a pc neo progressive shell
Citizen,
I, for one, would like to commend your organization on its wonderful efforts in protecting the environment
the above was said by Kim Ives of Haiti Liberte
lets not forget that Duvalier was a liberator. He was a populist leader who opposed the 1950 military coup. He championed the plight of the afro-carribean poor rural majority against the racist and corrupt ruling elite.
He promoted Haitian sovereignty which as we see from kim's comment has been stripped completely by the occupying forces of Weiss' own government.
yet Weiss defends the US supported Haitian coup.
Seems like Mondoweiss'ers would have supported Duvalier and his movement back then. i guess everyone on this site can pick and choose when they want to be progressive, as long as the end result is the condemnation of Israel, it is all good
Hypocrites!
And since the fall of the Duvalier regime, it has really been opened up. The neoliberal regime, one of its principal demands is the lowering of tariff barriers, so that rice grown in Arkansas and Texas and Louisiana can be dumped on the country, which has effectively destroyed the rice farmers of the Artibonite Valley, leaving Haiti now required to import almost 80 percent of its food. So foreign aid has essentially destroyed Haitian food self-sufficiency.
so clearly written by an israeli outsider to american politics
anyone that has followed obama's first year sees clearly that the "change" was merely superficial.
America's neo-imperial foreign policy continues and is strengthened, if anything i see the lack of support from the president to the democrat candidate as an indicator.
now he has a political scapegoat, a republican candidate, to blame his continued bush policies as out of his hands due to the "rebuplican" congress
mooser, c'mon, it's not like one copy of mein kampf the book is being sold with a distribution that rivals John Grisham novels.
you don't think seeing the widespread sale of the book as a bit disturbing?
if you really find nothing weird about that photo you are not being honest (it's ok to agree Phil wouldn't have posted it if he didn't find it weird)
be honest with yourself you antisemitic whackjob
oh please, Shmuel, these are foreign instigators that are neither interested in peace and nonviolence nor the lives of the palestinians. they are cowards cause they don't protest or demonstrate in their own countries, but have the guts to critzise the Israeli governement because the Israelis wont do diddley
neither bradley...
the fact is that it doesn't matter who they are here to "help".
all countries have laws that control the activity of tourists and immigrants at their borders.
mooser once again you have picked a meaningless point to argue and you have won it sucessfully, i am sure that your cronies will soon rub that incredible win in my face
James Bradley January 20, 2010 at 1:56 pm
No one deals with right wing trolls better than you Mooser.
you guys are pathetic...
enjoy your insular self congratulating little world. you guys are the kings of the internet.
i am content for every legitimate point i have brought up has never been touched, i just get ganged up on by the internet tough guys who spit the same talking points and refuse to recognize facts
the real einstein developed a method to eradicate whole cities of their populations in milliseconds. so what?
how you logically arrived at "breathing while egyptian" is a crime from what was a totally imagined discriminatory act (and one that totally exposes the author's own deeply racist world view) is beyond believable!
all riled up are you, peacenik? the demonstrations in Niilin are hardly "non-violent"! your country may give you the right to peacefully demonstrate but that doesn't mean another country has to let you in so you can protest. which was my point (that was obviously lost on your 10 year old brain)
I assume you are an american, I'd like to see you non-violently demonstrate there. remember what happened in Pittsburgh a couple of months ago or Seattle a couple of years ago. Your own country doesn't grant you the right, why do you feel you are entitled to it in a foreign country?
it seems that you commentators are the one's with entitlement issues.
like i said, let's see foreigners
WOW! big news go figure...whodathunkit? a couple of people whose agenda is subversive to a particular country's government are deported. what a conspiracy!!
try marching with the NLD against the Junta...why not?
these "confrontations" to show how "oppressive" the Israeli government is, are laughable.
...or is the fabrication claiming that it was a hoax?
he did say that anti-zionism is anti-semitism in his speech at Harvard. that is certainly documented and without question
"The antisemite rejoices at any opportunity to vent his malice. The times have made it unpopular, in the West, to proclaim openly a hatred of the Jews. This being the case, the antisemite must constantly seek new forms and forums for his poison. How he must revel in the new masquerade! He does not hate the Jews, he is just 'anti-Zionist"
---- M.L. King Jr., "Letter to an Anti-Zionist Friend"
Dr. King was truly a smart man and ahead of his time.
five years ago, natural disaster struck Indonesia, the tsunami that killed 200,000 + all networks covered it extensively, US send lots of aid and relief missions. same response as Haiti if not more during the Bush Era. what the hell are you talking about Weiss?
I am from Georgia, you racist.
my hasbara corn cheese?!?!?
look how you never answer a question.
i give a damn about palestinians or israelis....i want justice for my people..but it seems if you ain't jewish no one gives a damn about humanity...unless of course an earthquake hits.
really and where do you live Taxi? answer the question, defender of the poor! I bet you are living in the US...just killing babies by remote control from drone planes and keeping the poor poorer and stealing land from Iraqis and Afghanis...
you certainly didnt hit a nerve with me but maybe with some of the victims of your country's terrorist actions. Here is a project to help improve the quality of life of 40,000 people and you sitting at your comfortable desk on your superpowered computer with high speed internet speak for the people and cry out for "dirt is better than a gilded cage"
you are a real hero...let me spit shine your shoes for you boss..
and Taxi, where do you live? where are you typing that message?
what the hell do you know about poverty and hunger? you ever live on the street?
you are such a pumpous insulting jackass...only you can help the poor people...give them money or a better life and then its not genuine
puh-lease spare me your hypocritical bs
How dare they try to raise the quality of life in the West Bank for Palestinians!!!!
Don't they see we Americans want a place where we can visit people in squalor and be indignant at the "oppressors" who put them there!! I want to sleep on the dusty floor of a concrete shack when I throw stones at soldiers as a form of my "non-violent" protest..it is so much more authentic!
then I can go back to my American home and play my playstation and watch flavor of love and truly appreciate the struggle for freedom my arab brothers are going through
did you know that the SHeikh Jarrah neighborhood has traditionally been a predominantly Jewish neighborhood?
Did you know there are several Jewish holy sites that Jews have cared for for centuries?
In 1948, the neighborhood's Jews fled due to the attacking arabs. SO how can you on the one hand be outraged at the displacement of Palestinians but when Jews return to a neighborhood that has been Jewish since before the creation of the State of Israel, you are against it?
hypocrites and hateful people.
what is your point? jews = bankers
how come i feel a stereotypical old school anti-semitism coming?
I know, your tax dollars pay for it. but maybe the US can't save every dumb Rachel and Tristan, who decide to travel (against numerous advisories by the State Dept) to war torn areas to protest.
I mean, what the hell do you think would happen in Israel/Palestine? Why not try Burma? Why not protest in Darfur?
Just look what happens when Americans try to protest in AMERICA!!! Seattle, Pittsburgh....can't blame Israel for that
no, he has legal title to that land, he had bought it legitimately and he removed squattors.
but however you want to look at it..
also Chaos, yet another comeback without substance...
Sheikh Jarrah was historically Jewish it has been occupied for the brief period between 48 til now by squatters..
also, no one ever responded to the original dilemna from the hebron history thread
the Jews were a weak and pathetic minority before '48. The British supported the Jews in their Zionist land grab against the majority Arabs...the british gave the zionist weapons, when Zionists were attacked by Arabs, the Zionists responded by attacking the British....why?
Sorry I dont know how to quote:
From Wikipedia-
In the late 19th century, Sheikh Jarrah incorporated the Jewish neighborhoods of Shimon HaTzadik, founded in 1876; Nahalat Shimon, founded in 1891, and villas owned by leading Arab families. The Husseini family owned six homes east of Saladin Street. In 1918 there were eighteen Arab families living in Sheikh Jarrah.
The neighborhood was predominately Jewish until 1948 when the Jews fled following attacks by Arab militiamen. [1] During the 1948 Arab-Israeli War, 78 Jews, mostly doctors and nurses, were killed on their way to Hadassah Hospital when their convoy was attacked by Arab forces as it passed through Sheikh Jarrah, the main road to Mount Scopus. In the wake of these hostilities, Mount Scopus was cut off from West Jerusalem.[2]
The Jewish presence in Sheikh Jarrah centered around the tomb of Shimon HaTzadik, one of the last members of the Great Assembly, the governing body of the Jewish people after the Babylonian Exile. According to the Babylonian Talmud, Shimon HaTzadik met with Alexander the Great when the Macedonian army passed through the Land of Israel and convinced him not to destroy the Second Temple. For years Jews made pilgrimages to his tomb in Sheikh Jarrah, a practice documented in travel literature. In 1876, the cave and the adjoining land, planted with 80 ancient olive trees, were purchased by the Jews for 15,000 francs. Dozens of Jewish families built homes on the property.[19]
Also located in Sheikh Jarrah is a medieval mosque dedicated to one the soldiers of Saladin, the Muslim sultan who wrested control of Jerusalem from the Crusaders in the 12th century. St. George's Anglican Church is situated in the neighborhood, along with an old Jewish cemetery known as the "Graves of the Kings."[1]
Quick someone edit wiki...the truth may get out about who is the settler in the Sheikh Jarrah case (yikes! what will all these guys do, maybe andrew can use all his millions of tax dollars to actually HELP AMERICANS)
exactly, Todd!!
the Liberal American Jews instead of addressing the wrongs that their Jewish relatives did in the US, focus on correcting the wrongs that Jews did to the Palestinians. Again, dual loyalty, and these Americans are not particularly concerned with helping America or correcting injustices done to Americans, they rather focus their efforts on helping a people 6,000 miles away
they ascribe the crime of Slavery to the non Jewish whites in America. (yet take credit for winning the Blacks' civil liberties)
They will bring a war now to stop the Israelis, so they can claim they liberated the Palestinians....
yes, but my point is the injustices committed against the black people in america have not been undone by the promotion of one black man as president.
especially when that one black president has done not a thing to help most of the american black population (or the american population in general).
he has approved billions to private banks, and filled his advisers with former bankers. men with names like geitner....so yea, big win for the liberal Jews
Amen Todd!!
and by the way, you said:
"As someone who has had plenty of guilt directed his way over the years by liberal American Jews for being white, American, and a Southerner, I can say that Israel is your cross to bear, and I have no sympathy or admiration for you, crocadile tears or not. "
throw a couple of truths back in the Liberal American Jews face. Most of the blacks who arrived in the Southern US arrived through Jewish owned and operated ships, were traded by Jewish slave brokers.
and actually the civil war may never have happened if it weren't for a fellow Jewish assimilationist elitist (like Phil Weiss except far more talented and gifted) named Judah P Benjamin. who as a southern, i am sure you are familiar with. or David Yulee, or numerous other Jews who helped defend DixieLand
Of course AnteBellum south was the cultural center for American Jews, where the american reform and reconstructionist Jewish movements were founded.
I for one think liberal american Jews should lead the effort to correct the wrongs committed on the African American population through the disproportional participation of Jews in the African Slave Trade.
I mean it sucks that you got ripped off when you thought you were planting trees, but the Jews at the time knew exactly what was involved in trading in slaves.
Where is the Liberal American Jewish effort for reparations??
Much better that these Liberal American Jews right wrongs 6,000 miles away from their homes...I mean after all, I am sure Phil did his part to right the wrongs done to African Americans by voting Obama, and giving his cleaning lady the day off when he traveled to Palestine.
yes. silence a different opinion quickly....(i thought only hasbara and nazionists do that, i guess it is a Jewish trait)
shmuel, i am not a liar, but you are a hypocritical elitist. so explain that to the mirror
and best of all Chaos...I AM NOT WHITE!!!
I am a Southern Black...born Gee Chee so take that elitists...
ban me if you want ban the truth...all of you are scared of the real truth
half of you are just Jew haters and the other half are Jews of the swarthy, lying, synnagogue of satan types...I cant wait till you both meet over the bodies of the innocents you will slaughter with your rhetoric...
see you in real black america...
No, in truth, i am none of those things...
i am not even a Jew,
I do however love egging on liberal hypocritical Jews like you and Weiss...and expose how you conveniently choose where your loyalty goes are you American or are you a Jew, espouse liberal values like equality but really are elitist and racist cause you were born a "Jew" (i believe Phil just posted something just now that addresses that).
I think you ruined America..The Civil War was started by Jews (defending the South, if you didn't know) yet they want all the credit for the 60's civil rights movement. Godforbid one mentions Black civil rights efforts without including the Jews who supported it.
One may...i'd like to see the rest of her from the Heights of the Golan to that Sinai pennisula....
not anne frank the girl wearing her picture on her sleeve...H-O-T
I just think she is hot, thats all I see.. show another picture from the front.
Don't forget the disproportionately Jewish ownership of the Dutch West Indies Company. The outfit that was responsible for an estimated 70% or more of all the African Slave Trade.
Many prosperous Jewish American merchants can attribute their wealth by their participation in the African Slave trade.
And later the Jews were at the forefront for the fight for Civil Liberties for African Americans.
Jews conquered and occupied Palestine, but Palestinians do not fear cause now that injustice will end by virtue of Jews leading the effort for Palestinian rights
We can do it guys! Jew Jew Jew
a regular Ellen Mordecai, this Rabbi Gottlieb is...
so sad, so misguided...
shift focus, once again, resort the argument to a ad homenum once again this tactic is working.
Shmuel - "Personally, I define Judaism as a culture and a civilisation, which also includes a religious component that has had many different manifestations throughout Jewish history. Being born into a culture is not about race or genetics, and is often only a small part of one’s connection to that culture (if any)"
then everyone in the world should be defined as Jewish, anyone who has been born into this world can be said to have somehow been affected by Jewish culture to some extent.
or lets go further Everybody in the world has been born into a culture that has been influenced by America, definitely, movies, tv, music, mcdonalds. therefore the whole world are Americans.
You do believe that being "born" into the Jewish culture or whatever cockapoo you just spewed confers upon you a special priviledge. You believe it gives you the right to discuss this issue as a "Jew". however that is disingenuous given your "personal" definition of how you define that term.
you are a racist and an elitest. just listen to yourself.
Chaos4700 - you mention reinrassig, not being a Nazi, I had to look that up.
this is what I found in Wikipedia:
"Reinrassig is a German zoological term meaning "of pure breed".[1] In Nazi Germany, the term was applied to human races.
By the racial policy of Nazi Germany, persons who could not trace Aryan ancestry back at least four generations could be considered nicht reinrassig or impure."
That seems to describe Shmuel's and Phil's version of defining who is a Jew, but being born to Jews is hardly the only criteria by which one can be a Jew...
ANYONE CAN BE A JEW. FROM ANY RACE, AND ANY COLOR
this is evidenced in the demographic makeup of the modern state of Israel.
I am hardly calling for a Jewish equivalent of "reinrassig". "Reinrassig" is based on genetics, solely, like Shmuel's and Phil's and Rabbi Gottlieb's identity. They came from Jews, Nazis would have put them in the ovens, therefore they are Jews. However, they are far from Jews, they threaten Jews, they highjacked the name Jew and have assigned it based on genetics.
I am calling for these "so-called" Jews who have long abandoned the faith of their fathers (and now speak in their names by virtue solely of genetic makeup) to stop spreading misinformation.
Any inhabitant within the State of Israel and its controlled territories should be offered the ability to convert, not to some Rabbi Brant or Rabbi Shnier or Gottlieb transformed paganism that they label as Judaism but the real Torah Judaism as studied and practised in the land of Israel for millenia.
Shingo "Chistians claim to believe in the One and True God, so does that mean that all Christians are Jews and threfore Zionists?"
Christians believe in the Holy Trinity, this is idol worship. Our muslim friends, however, believe and worship the One True God.
A jew is permitted to pray in a mosque, yet forbidden to pray, or set foot in a church. So all you "so called Jews" on this site should know if you walked in a church you are probably not Jewish.
Shingo "So what is the answer we should expct, to the question as to who is God, that tells us if someone is Jewish? If it is a fact that Neturei Karta are Zionists, then where is the evidence that proves this fact?"
The Neturei Karta will chant, at a minimum of five times a day, for God to expel the infidels from the Land of Israel, to restore the Davidic Kingdom, to make all the outside nations (goyim) bow to God's power, to rebuild the city of Jerusalem, etc etc etc...
This is all found in the Jewish texts they say, as religious Jews they probably say it several times in a given day. Let me know if you would like more detailed info.
"If being Jewish means you’re automatically a Zionist (ie. like gravity) then why is the concept fo Zionism even necessary?"
Being Jewish isn't like Gravity, I said God is like gravity. A real Jew prays to the real God, like a real Muslim, a "so called Jew" doesn't necessarily even believe in God. However, God's existence is not subject to who worships him or how. God's existence is
one need not believe in the law of gravity to observe it, likewise you may not choose to recognize the One and True God, nor may you ever arrive at any meaningful understanding of the One God in this world, this doesn't mean that God is not there.
i have said that racial makeup doesnot make one a Jew.
all over the Land of Israel there is evidence of the Jewish Kingdom. Have you been to Hebron?
I dont understand AFAIK?
Where are you from Cliff? I am the colonialist, I am the Nazi, and what are you? which country are you living in? the US? your hands are bloody too.
Zionism is not racism that has been established even in your "so called" international "law"
admit that you would like to destroy Jews, or relegate them to subjects of another nation. fighter for Justice and Democracy, Cliff, here here!! jolly good chap.
A Jewish State is racist, yet a Muslim State (of which their are many) is fair....or are you one of those neocon war mongers that wish to inject democracy to the savages....methinks Cliff is a racist too..
ask Finklestein, who is God?
ask most "so-called" Jews (Zionist or not), this question in order to determine whether they really are Jewish as well.
If you define Zionism so narrowly as support for the modern State of Israel then you are ignorant. Neturei Karta are virulently "Anti Israel", yet are themselves, in fact, Zionists. when you can understand this then we can talk...
BTE, anyone who doesn't believe there was a Jewish Kingdom is not Jewish...without respect to your parents... no one is born Jewish, they are simply born to Jews. Halakha provides for them as Jews, but if one simply calls oneself a Jew by virtue of their birth, that is racism.
Finklestein is not a Jew. Like Shmuel, and many others on this site, he only calls himself one.
Just because his parents almost got baked in German ovens, doesn't make Norman Finklestein a Jew any more than it makes him a Homosexual or a gypsy.
and growing up in a Jewish neighborhood in Brooklyn in post WWII America doesn't make you a Jew, just as eating bagels with lox and cream cheese does.
Zionism was invented when the Jewish Kingdom was invented.
very nice. is that how you will defend your stance?
i am still waiting to hear why the analogy to the springfield riots of '08 is no good, and how such a progressive can defend the actions of the whites in Springfield or the arabs in Hebron?
do you want to use the Khazar argument to justify the brutal murders and rape that happened to the peaceful and indiginous Jewish residents in Hebron?
every Jew is a Zionist, EVERY JEW, even neturei karta.
they are only aggressively anti the modern government of the State of Israel
i am not always on the side of the Israeli' State's government either. however, i have no politics (in your suggested sense) . i am simply a jew.
a jew is someone who has accepted the yolk of the Kingship
shmuel, reading Isaiah doesn't make you a Jew. lots of christians read the bible and the old testament.
i used the label in order to emphasize my point. are you not of European background? and let me guess, you live in america go to a "temple"
what makes you a Jew? the fact that maybe you had a relative who was sent to the gas chamber in Nazi Germany because the Nazis called your relative a Jew also doesn't make you a Jew...(nor does it make you a homosexual or a gypsy)
maybe you should learn what a "Jew" is before you start calling yourself one and speaking in the name of Jewish people.
shmuel, let me guess you one of these racists that call yourself jewish, by virtue of the fact you are an Ashke-Nazi. Leave the name of our Holy Prophet off of your tongue, you so-called "Jew".
ask yourself why it's so easy for you to throw out an answer like this when it comes to desecration of Jewish holy sites but "oy va voy" if this answer were given to justify the demolition of a mosque (it would sound like it came from Glenn Beck):
"Use religion as a pretext for violence and oppression, and religious sites will be targeted"
Danaa January 9, 2010 at 11:08 pm
hasbara in action – a deconstruction:
The israelis surely lie (or, in this case exaggerate)
Arabs (somewhere, maybe) have it worse
It’s Israel's fault anyways
israel only slaughters and expels (they have been engaged in genocide, yet somehow are 60+ years later they have been unsuccessful in killing all the palestinians)
Note the alignment to Mooser’s favorite: You suck (in this case a "dumb ass"), the Israelis suck, maybe we suck a little too, but Israel is destroying mosques everyday(paraphrasing). Epilogue: that’s life. get one and get on with it – somewhere else.
"I can only imagine the international uproar that would occur if I was describing
a synagogue or a Jewish cemetery"
Friday night, while you were here, Ms. Rothchild, the synagogue at the tomb of the prophet samuel was broken into and vandalized....Yet somehow the international uproar seems to be held up, Ironically, google news doesn't list one article on the incident
When the synagogue of Yamit was destroyed, I don't recall any outcry, and certainly, I don't remember hearing the world cry out for the multiple times which the Tomb of Joseph (arguably Judaism's third most Holy site; equivalent to razing the Mosque at Al Quds). Where was the outrage? Well perhaps the rest of the world might not speak out for a desecration of a Jewish Holy site...but certainly, "Jewish" journalists would cover this....but I guess they are too busy with the Nakba...
I don't understand why Rothchild and others find it so important to identify themselves as Jewish?
i dint intentionally call you a jew just said that you use the same tactics of argument that you decry Zionist propagandists of using...with out the hint of irony....
no, just cause i was kidding about you using the same tactics you complain zionist use, i wasn't calling you Jewish, just hypocritical.
but i bet for a second, you were insulted by the thought of being a Jew, huh?
imagine if you really were like Shmuel, you also would be begging the world to help you kill off that ugly reflection you have staring back at you in the mirror...
excellent comeback, chaos, now your position makes sense.
you know if you take a random post by you or any of the cronies here, you are likely to come across the same empty rhetoric as above....
you deny and insult and shift focus, project your inaccuracies on your opponent, etc...the same tactics which you attribute to the Hasbara Zionist machine, you seem to employ yourself...what did you go to Zionist propaganda school and this is your way of lashing out against them?!?
Shingo your world is falling a part and you are beginning to see your hatred and fear of the "Zionist" as the same hatred and fear the Springfield Whites held for the "blacks". I can tell by your hastened typing.
You are beginning to arrive at the right questions and conclusions the "holes" in the mondoweiss armor of propaganda and lies...
"How can Israel be a wholly a European invention and a Jewish homeland at the same time?"
"The Palestinians did not atatck teh British, becasue they trusted that the British would allow them independence as they’d been promised. It was teh Zionists who atatcked and murdered teh British, the British BTW. who were giving them the land."
If the British were helping and arming the "Zionists" and giving them the land, as you say, why would the "zionists" want to attack them? doesn't make much sense.
Here you show your poor knowledge of history. obviously there are some holes to your knowledge and understanding of what was going on here in Palestine on the ground at the time.
yet you have no problem finding a rationalization of the brutal murder of 70 Jews in Hebron in 1929.
you seem to brush off violence against Israelis/Jews as justified and violence against "palestinians" as crimes of war
(Palestinian being a very loaded term in and of itself, i mean, go down to the local library and check the microfiche of some newspapers from the turn of the 20th century up until 1960, the term "palestinian" refers to the Jewish immigrants and not to the Arab population)
but this is the age of marketing, "journalist"s are merely ad men selling you the latest "story"
so let's see if your view of the history of the state of israel makes sense:
a weak minority of jewish immigrants were placed here by the British who supported their evil Zionist plan with guns and military force, to steal arab lands
the British promised the arabs their own land in exchange for their help expelling the ottomans.
the Arabs of Hebron in response to the threats of the minority Jewish population took arms against the Jewish occupiers in a pre-emptive attempt to stop the evil zionist plan.
Out-numbered and faced with arab violence, the Jews in Palestine decide it would be best to attack the brittish, who give the Jews weapons and whose military occupies and seizes the arab lands on their behalf.
Maybe this view of history makes sense this way the Jews could help the Arabs by destroying the British and gain their favor to establish their homeland in Palestine
Shmuel thinks he is something new, that his being Jewish throws a monkey wrench in my line of reasoning, it only supports it. There have been plenty of Shmuels and Phils throughout Jewish history. Herzl himself was a Phil Weiss. Hertzl was an avid assimilationist. Most of those you support in Israel come from backgrounds of this "racial" superiority.
However, for those that truly understand what it is to be a Jew, and who want to protect and provide for freedom to practice as a Jew, there are many who were sacrificed by these Mondoweiss Jews.
The fighters who tried to liberate Jerusalem in 1948, who were stranded by the founders of Israel the "elite" racially Jewish spiritually empty. Many instances of this betrayal occurred.
aparisian - "I am not anti-semitic i am just anti-Zionism the ideology, i have nothing against Jews. If you are unable to make difference than its your problem.
Zionism is very similar to Nazism. "
Zionism is not at all like Nazi Ideology, if anything it is way more comparable to Hamas ideology, which you guys here are way cool with...
WHen you say you have nothing against Jews, you mean rabbi brant and rabbi gotlieb and phil weiss, or the neturei karta. thats how you can say you are not anti semitic but yet you are intolerant of the Jews you don't like, and all though it makes the issue much easier when you demonize all of Israelis, (except for those that are helping the palestinian cause), the majority of the practicing religious Israelis are not some sort of violent monster, yet you wish to destroy their places of worship and have no problem calling for their extermination
so hypocritical....you are all a bunch of lame wackos...
and i love it!!
you are the one calling israelis nazis...
israelis are semites. nazis is a term to decribe the epitomy of evil, a very negative term indeed.
unless those terms have changed, i would say that there is a good case for making you guys out to be anti-semitic
you guys don't see it, though, huh?
i mean why accept and tolerate my religious Jewish views, when you can accept the religious views of Rabbi Brant Rosen or Rabbi Lynn Gottlieb. Those two claim to be "Jews", so if you accept them for what they claim to be you are therefore not anti-semitic or intolerant when you trample on my religious views....hmmmm, nicely played.
I would love to see more "Muslim" teabaggers. that could be a good move for them.
MRW and aparisian, I apologize, I will now cow to the will of mine fuhrer...
Zeig Heil!! NazIsraelis to the GAS!!!
aparisian
"Zionists used the effects of the holocaust and the Jewish sufferance to get the support of Jews and those who oppressed them. The problem that this unconditional support went so far, it gave them the right to commit Nazi like atrocities. Zionists use this emotional part of history till today to fuel the war machine in Israel. "
actually, without the help of the German Jews and Jewish collaborators, the Nazis would have hardly been so successful at killing so many Jews.
Therefore, I can give a damn about the Holocaust, if anything all the Holocaust Industry does is promote euro ethnocentrism and the globalist agenda. Why is it that there are Holocaust memorials in almost every major American and Western city?!? I don't recall any Nazi concentration camps in Washington DC or Seattle, Washington.
Also, it seems the Holocaust is used to attack Jews by "so called" Jews of today. Finklestein, Hass, Baltzar etc all are cashing in on the Holocaust bandwagon.
No, I don't remember the Holocaust on a Holocaust rememberance day. I remember that the Holocaust against my faith is on-going and the enemy is always trying to trick and pick off those of weak mind, to strip them of the knowledge of the true God.
i agree the modern state of Israel is wholly a European invention.
other modern European inventions are Jordan, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Iran, and a ton of other countries outside the middle east.
that is indeed the problem. you want your UN to enact international justice, when the UN and the IMF, NATO and the US military (and its mercenary contractors) are tools of Western colonialism.
The biggest mistake of the Zionists is that they relied on this mockery of a court, of this so called international law, the Jewish immigrants of European descent desperately sought the approval of the Western powers to give them the legal right to return to their homeland. Quite a "civilized" ambition
The right to this land is not one for anyone to give. it is the promise of the God of Abraham that the children of Israel will inherit the land. that is what we see happening.
just take a look in the mirror, to see the absurdity in who accuses Jews of being colonists...where you from Chaos?
"The fear of Zionists taking over Palestine was real in 1929. Jewish privilege in Palestine was the essence of political Zionism (opposed by the Old Yishuv and most of world Jewry), freely and openly declared by Zionism’s secular assimilated leaders, and backed by the might of the British Empire. Jews had lived next to Arabs in Hebron for centuries. Arabs did not fear Jewish neighbours. They feared Jewish privilege and European imperialism. Their fear was legitimate. The massacre was not. Legitimate aspirations, illegitimate actions."
so your beef should not be with the Zionists but rather the British Empire and Western colonialism. The Arabs living there were fine with Ottoman imperialism, i guess you are fine with that too.
However, it is strange that these Arabs did not massacre the British occupiers, wouldn't you say? After all the Zionist of the time were weak, as you say, it was the might of the British that kept the arab in Hebron down in 1929... yet the attack was strangely carried out against the Jews there
Shmuel is an ethnocentric racist. He calls himself a Jew only by virtue of the fact that his parents were Jewish. While that criteria certainly allows one to be considered a Jew, it doen't mean that he is one.
this blog is devoted to the discussion of Israel/Palestine. Israel claims to be a homeland for the Jewish people. Therefore if one claims to be a Jew and speaks for or against Israel it carries a different weight than an outsider's opinion of the issue. my aim is to expose that Shmuel and the majority of commentators and contributors to this blog falsely claim they are "Jews" when their beliefs run antithical to that of Jews.
They espouse their ethnic identity as a means of justifing their severely anti-Jewish propaganda. Many people come from Jewish parents but if they do not hold Jewish beliefs then that should be presented to the outside world instead of speaking in the name of Jews.
I understand that Shmuel's comments help you feel better about coping with your anti-Jewish beliefs as in this politically correct age you would hate to think that you are a racist, but you are. Just cause Shmuel and other so-called "Jews" are willing to deliver Jews to the slaughter doesn't negate the fact that their slaughter is immoral.
Free Palestine, Free Iran, Free Iraq, Free Afghanistan, Free Israel
it means the Arabs of Hebron in 1929 feared the Jews taking over Hebron forty years later (sarcasm), they didn't want Jews to live next to them, they didn't want Jews to own property there, etc....
Likewise, the whites of Springfield in 1908 feared the Blacks would take over their town, they didn't want Blacks to live next to them, they didn't want Blacks to own property there, etc....
the fears of the whites of Springfield were also well founded, and later proved true (civil rights amendment would pass 60 years after). it doesn't make their violence, or their reasoning behind the attack, any less of an atrocity.
who is the one spraying divbersionary excrement?!? man you are transparent, and so clearly racist.
i am not what, shmuel? what am i not? a jew?
Shmuel, you are a "so-called" Jew. you call yourself a Jew in order to promote hate against real Jews. You feel you are entitled to the title Jew by virtue of your white european heritage. this gives you no right
you have been on these forums for a while, i have read several of your posts. i know that the identity which you have built by virtue of these posts is not a Jewish one.
so I ask again, why do you insist on calling yourself a "Jew"? and what do you have against Jews?
lazy rebuttal Shingo...
you are excusing the actions of the arabs in these riots cause, in your opinion, the subjects were some monstrous evil "maniacal Zionists" conspiring to conquer the arab and subjugate him. (again, you are essentially justifying the massacre as a pre-emptive attack on the "occupation" that would come 40 years after)
i can almost see the horns on the 70 Jewish victims that you have so completely demonized.
thanks again, your racism is in full force
I am not the one putting race into this, you are.
I am claiming you are not Jewish. and you claim you are by virtue of your "so-called" birthright. well if that's why you are Jewish surely you are the racist.
I was born in America, if you must know.
ok, shmuel knows a term "straw man"...wow.
if anytyhing your post supports my argument against potherd's stupid comment. potsherd attempted to explain the phenomenon of the 1929 Arab riots, but it can be inferred that his explanation was a justification.
and it was a horrible justification at that. he is in essence affirming my sarcastic characterization of the '29 massacre as a "pre-emptive strike"
"Palestinian nationalists who were alarmed at the drive for unlimited Jewish immigration into Palestine with the intention of creating a Jewish state. Correctly, as it turned out" potsherd
Considering that the State of Israel didn't exist and that there was no Jewish military "occupation" of Hebron, your so-called "blanket" Zionist explanation (anti-semitism or more appropriately anti-jewish) seems like the most appropriate.
what did you find inappropriate about my springfield riot analogy? you need to provide a counter if you want to dismiss a point. unless of course you are OK with your arguments (similar to arguing with a klans member, you can bring him all the proof you like that blacks and whites are the same but the klans man will stand by his hatred)
potsherd found a way to justify the arab riots by arguing that the arabs feared Jewish immigration (not oppression, as the Jews were a minority, right? the arabs like the whites in springfield illinois were the majority). the whites in springfield also feared black immigration and black workers taking their jobs...if potsherd can defend arabs for these riots, then logically he would defend the whites in 1908 Springfield Illinois...QED potsherd is a racist
you are also shmuel...as you call yourself a "Jew" based on some Khazar european invention. and you use your "assumed" identity to persecute jews without limitation
So that excuses the massacre? well in that case it's a good thing Israel won't need to apologize for a riot incited by Israeli nationals who are alarmed at the arms shipments successfully being smuggled into Gaza and if they were to murder civilians then its not such a big deal. because correctly as it turns out there were rockets fired.
or better yet, i guess, in Springfield Illinois in 1908 the whites who were alarmed at the inclusion of colored people in the workforce and, heaven forbid, in interpersonal relationships with the white population, with the intention of integrating blacks into the normal human population. And well, they too were correct as it turned out.
potsherd fly your racist banner high!
when 70 innocent Jewish Hebron residents were massacred in 1929....several years prior to your holocaust photo...and several more years before the dispicable "Occupation"....what was it then? pre-emptive?!?
link to upload.wikimedia.org
Don't forget this star of david that was put on the wall over a 100 years ago and now hangs above a house occupied by palestinians...
Big win for you there Ratner...way to go!