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Total number of comments: 45 (since 2010-12-23 03:01:38)

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  • Approaching Easter and Passover
    • They automatically believe the problems Palestinian Christians have all stem from their own Muslim folk, not from anything Israelis do.

  • Al Jazeera publishes leaked intelligence files showing Netanyahu lied about Iranian nuclear threat
  • Warriors for 'the ultimate truth' gather in New York
  • Speech to AIPAC could give Netanyahu his out
  • Next U.S. elections threaten Israel's 'total isolation' -- and the Israeli public is worried
    • "No matter who wins, USA 2016 will be zionist".

      Agreed. The US will remain a prisoner to Zionists for who knows how many more years.

      As well put by Blownaway below.

  • Democratic Party leader echoes Netanyahu's new theme: Hamas equals ISIS
    • Huh?? Your link is to "define ISIS", I saw nothing of your % things.

    • "During the 1920s the Communists Zionists (at that point the bulk) wanted to form a unity with the Palestinian people as part of the common proletariat rising up against capitalists as common laborers… That was rebuffed. During the late 1920s to early 1930s there was a movement of creating a common future by that point the Palestinians had become pan-Arab nationalists so that attempt was rebuffed".

      Let's have the truth about why those rebuffs then, and the continuing rejection of Israeli versions of peace. From no other than Jabotinsky before those rebuffs:

      "Thus we conclude that we cannot promise anything to the Arabs of the Land of Israel or the Arab countries. Their voluntary agreement is out of the question. Hence those who hold that an agreement with the natives is an essential condition for Zionism can now say “no” and depart from Zionism. Zionist colonization, even the most restricted, must either be terminated or carried out in defiance of the will of the native population.

      To imagine that they will voluntarily consent to the realisation of Zionism, in return for the moral and material conveniences which the Jewish colonist brings with him, is a childish notion, which has at bottom a kind of contempt for the Arab people".

  • Amira Hass and the end of Jewish ethical history
    • Yes Mooser, but that is not enough. Jabotinsky again:

      "Zionist colonization, even the most restricted, must either be terminated or carried out in defiance of the will of the native population. This colonization can, therefore, continue and develop only under the protection of a force independent of the local population – an iron wall which the native population cannot break through. This is, in toto, our policy towards the Arabs".

      Britain until 1948, the US for many decades until now, and for who knows how much longer.

    • "I thought one of Zionism’s aim, a clearly stated aim, too, was to get rid of, not be encumbered by, or held back by, 'Jewish morality'."

      You thought that because it is fact, as so clearly put by Jabotinsky in 1923:

      "We hold that Zionism is moral and just. And since it is moral and just, justice must be done, no matter whether Joseph or Simon or Ivan or Achmet agree with it or not.

      There is no other morality".

  • 9 Reasons why Israel is under rocket attack 
    • Tell me, Talknic, something I have often wondered. It is this:

      Are what is today Sderot, and places nearby, actually Palestinian rather than Israeli, according to the 1947 division that Israel officially accepted??

  • Israel's message to the Palestinians: Submit, leave or die
  • Reporters talk about Sykes-Picot of 1916 (and ignore the Balfour Declaration of 1917)
    • "The Truth according to Fromkin. It’s unintentionally funny–in what universe has any people ever voluntarily granted a chunk of their own homeland to foreign immigrants to create their own state?"

      None better to tell the real truth about that than Jabotinsky, writing this in 1923:

      "My readers have a general idea of the history of colonisation in other countries. I suggest that they consider all the precedents with which they are acquainted, and see whether there is one solitary instance of any colonisation being carried on with the consent of the native population. There is no such precedent.

      The native populations, civilised or uncivilised, have always stubbornly resisted the colonists, irrespective of whether they were civilised or savage.

      Every native population, civilised or not, regards its lands as its national home, of which it is the sole master, and it wants to retain that mastery always; it will refuse to admit not only new masters but, even new partners or collaborators.

      Every native population in the world resists colonists as long as it has the slightest hope of being able to rid itself of the danger of being colonised.

      That is what the Arabs in Palestine are doing, and what they will persist in doing as long as there remains a solitary spark of hope that they will be able to prevent the transformation of 'Palestine' into the 'Land of Israel'." [from The Iron Wall"]

  • Fear of anti-semitism accusation did not stop Presbyterians from witnessing occupation
    • For starters, Pat, how many other nations are there that have people advocating their destruction?

  • 'Netanyahu won't act without a cane to his ass' -- Erekat says, urging ICC on Abbas
    • What specifically does Abbas give as his reasons for not taking their case to the ICC? And what are considered to be the real reasons, if different?

  • 'Israel is bitterly dividing American Jewish community' -- AP
  • Let it go
    • Such wise and true words, Clif.

    • "Israel and its oppressive actions and policies are tarnishing the moral standing of Judaism and attaching, perhaps unfairly, the responsibility for that oppression to all Jews".

      Add to this what LeaNder said: "the artificially created Jewish Zionist identity, to start with. Its basic premise is: United as Zionists against the world out there we must stand, Jewish dissenters are self-haters. Since Zionism (and apartness?) is the essence of Judaism".

      "Food for thought" indeed.

      Judaism was, effectively, hijacked, as epitomised in the Jabotinsky claim:

      "either Zionism is moral and just or it is immoral and unjust. We hold that Zionism is moral and just. There is no other morality".

    • "For them being Jewish means a few watered down customs and most importantly, supporting Israel (and as a bonus, hating Arabs/Muslims)".

      Sounds to me pretty much like a description of so-called Christian Zionists.

  • Hillary Clinton's flipflop: We were wrong to take hard line against settlements
  • In Bloomberg internal news memos, 'there is no such country' as Palestine
  • 'There is no veritable religious freedom here': Postcard from the Christian community in East Jerusalem
    • >>> "If you let the books speak for themselves".

      Ah, there's the rub. Plenty don't do that, preferring their own theories from their centeries later ivory towers. Little more than a hill of beans. The truth is indeed that:

      "there just isn’t any documentary, “scriptural” support for the proposition that “Pauline Christianity” was a major departure from the framework of the Church Jesus described".

    • >>> "I’m a secular Jew and I can still grasp all of that".<<<

      Yeah, and didn't you do it so well. Spot on, as usual. I am a Christian and I say gracias!

  • Pope watch: Incendiary flyer passed out in Jerusalem says Francis's visit is against Jewish law
    • "Why would Christians support Jewish Zionist racism?"

      For many of them, because they have been seduced by JohnHagee and similar others.

      "For a time is coming when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear".
      2 Timothy 4:3, New Testament

    • But you are still saying “Many of them[Christians] respect Jews and support Israel. Those who don’t can go to hell"?

  • Repentant Enablers: German Christians, the Holocaust and the resurgence of German power
    • "The “deal” aspect of the Jewish-Christian dialogue is simply put:

      Christians, repent for your sins, hold fast to Israel, and be silent on the Palestinian question. Silence on Palestinians is demanded, otherwise the accusation is that Christians have returned to their previously abandoned anti-Semitism".

      Insidiously clever and disgusting. We Christians are to salve our guilt of one failure and injustice by becoming guilty of promoting another failure and injustice [to put both mildly]. And so many have fallen for this ploy, hook, line, and sinker, and for so long.

      "The Christian enablement list is extended through the various movements of Christian Zionism. Taken together and with their influence on the politics of the enabling political entities, Christian enablement of Israel and disablement of Palestine may be the single greatest contributing factor to the dire situation that the Palestinians face today".

      It is a chilling indictment of Christian betrayal of the one they claim to follow. But there are plenty of us who have seen through the lies and the manipulation. We have taken a strong stand against their golden calf, and for truth and integrity and justice.

  • Apartheid label is reminiscent of runup to Holocaust -- Michael Oren
  • 'Courting powerful Jewish donors,' Christie calls for aggressive foreign policy
  • Inspiration on the quiet streets of Palestine
    • It is not blind hatred of anyone. It is with open eyes that see continuing injustice, its source and its likely solution.

      You don't have to leave this site, you are quite free to express your viewpoint here.

  • Historical whitewash: Great Britain must be held accountable for its role in the Nakba
    • "and everything to do with racist colonialism".

      As confirmed and spelled out by Jabotinsky in 1923 in his The Iron Wall:

      "My readers have a general idea of the history of colonisation in other countries. I suggest that they consider all the precedents with which they are acquainted, and see whether there is one solitary instance of any colonisation being carried on with the consent of the native population. There is no such precedent.

      The native populations, civilised or uncivilised, have always stubbornly resisted the colonists, irrespective of whether they were civilised or savage. Every native population, civilised or not, regards its lands as its national home, of which it is the sole master, and it wants to retain that mastery always; it will refuse to admit not only new masters but, even new partners or collaborators.

      To imagine, as our Arabophiles do, that they will voluntarily consent to the realisation of Zionism, in return for the moral and material conveniences which the Jewish colonist brings with him, is a childish notion... Every native population in the world resists colonists as long as it has the slightest hope of being able to rid itself of the danger of being colonised. That is what the Arabs in Palestine are doing, and what they will persist in doing as long as there remains a solitary spark of hope that they will be able to prevent the transformation of "Palestine" into the "Land of Israel."

      It does not matter at all which phraseology we employ in explaining our colonising aims, Herzl's or Sir Herbert Samuel's. Colonisation carries its own explanation, the only possible explanation, unalterable and as clear as daylight to every ordinary Jew and every ordinary Arab. Colonisation can have only one aim, and Palestine Arabs cannot accept this aim. It lies in the very nature of things, and in this particular regard nature cannot be changed.

      Zionist colonisation must either stop, or else proceed regardless of the native population. Which means that it can proceed and develop only under the protection of a power that is independent of the native population – behind an iron wall, which the native population cannot breach.

  • America's rabbi hoovers celebrities
    • "Even G-d is love? But who said these things and why do we just take it for granted? The source for G-d being love and for marriages being based on love rather than lust is Christianity. Its source is not the Hebrew Bible but The New Testament".

      Not so, it is already there in the Tanakh.

      Oh give thanks to the Lord, for he is good;
      for his steadfast love endures forever!
      Let Israel say, “His steadfast love endures forever.”
      Let the house of Aaron say, “His steadfast love endures forever.”
      Let those who fear the Lord say, “His steadfast love endures forever.”
      Psalm 118:1-4

      "At the same time, said the LORD, will I be the G-d of all the families of Israel, and they shall be my people. Thus said the LORD, The people which were left of the sword found grace in the wilderness; even Israel, when I went to cause him to rest.

      The LORD has appeared of old to me, saying, Yes, I have loved you with an everlasting love: therefore with loving kindness have I drawn you".
      Jeremiah 31:1-3

    • "The principal reason for the breakdown of marriages and relationships is that in modern times they are built not on lust but love".

      Talk about turning things upside down. The mind boggles.

      G-d has always been love.

      "Yet Zion says, 'The Lord has deserted us; the Lord has forgotten us'.

      Never! Can a mother forget her nursing child? Can she feel no love for the child she has borne?

      But even if that were possible, I would not forget you!

      See, I have written your name on the palms of my hands; Your walls are continually before Me". Isaiah 49:15-16

    • They are indeed freaks. Christians United for Israel are a disgrace to the name they claim, Jesus Christ.

      Chief conductor, or so he thinks, is "circus master Hagee".

  • 'There has been terror for some time': Vatican responds to Jewish extremists attacks against Christians ahead of Pope's visit
    • Snippet from the kairos document:

      "In this spirit the document requests the international community to stand by the Palestinian people who have faced oppression, displacement, suffering and clear apartheid for more than six decades. The suffering continues while the international community silently looks on at the occupying State, Israel.

      Our word is a cry of hope, with love, prayer and faith in God. We address it first of all to ourselves and then to all the churches and Christians in the world, asking them to stand against injustice and apartheid, urging them to work for a just peace in our region, calling on them to revisit theologies that justify crimes perpetrated against our people and the dispossession of the land.

      1.1 “They say: 'Peace, peace' when there is no peace” (Jer. 6:14). These days, everyone is speaking about peace in the Middle East and the peace process. So far, however, these are simply words; the reality is one of Israeli occupation of Palestinian territories, deprivation of our freedom and all that results from this situation:

      1.1.1 The separation wall erected on Palestinian territory, a large part of which has been confiscated for this purpose, has turned our towns and villages into prisons, separating them from one another, making them dispersed and divided cantons. Gaza, especially after the cruel war Israel launched against it during December 2008 and January 2009, continues to live in inhuman conditions, under permanent blockade and cut off from the other Palestinian territories .
      1.1.2 Israeli settlements ravage our land in the name of God and in the name of force, controlling our natural resources, including water and agricultural land, thus depriving hundreds of thousands of Palestinians, and constituting an obstacle to any political solution.
      1.1.3 Reality is the daily humiliation to which we are subjected at the military checkpoints, as we make our way to jobs, schools or hospitals.
      1.1.4 Reality is the separation between members of the same family, making family life impossible for thousands of Palestinians, especially where one of the spouses does not have an Israeli identity card.
      1.1.5 Religious liberty is severely restricted; the freedom of access to the holy places is denied under the pretext of security. Jerusalem and its holy places are out of bounds for many Christians and Muslims from the West Bank and the Gaza strip. Even Jerusalemites face restrictions during the religious feasts. Some of our Arab clergy are regularly barred from entering Jerusalem .
      1.1.6 Refugees are also part of our reality. Most of them are still living in camps under difficult circumstances. They have been waiting for their right of return, generation after generation. What will be their fate?
      1.1.7 And the prisoners? The thousands of prisoners languishing in Israeli prisons are part of our reality. The Israelis move heaven and earth to gain the release of one prisoner, and those thousands of Palestinian prisoners, when will they have their freedom?
      1.1.8 Jerusalem is the heart of our reality. It is, at the same time, symbol of peace and sign of conflict. While the separation wall divides Palestinian neighbourhoods, Jerusalem continues to be emptied of its Palestinian citizens, Christians and Muslims. Their identity cards are confiscated, which means the loss of their right to reside in Jerusalem. Their homes are demolished or expropriated. Jerusalem, city of reconciliation, has become a city of discrimination and exclusion, a source of struggle rather than peace.

      1.2 Also part of this reality is the Israeli disregard of international law and international resolutions, as well as the paralysis of the Arab world and the international community in the face of this contempt. Human rights are violated and despite the various reports of local and international human rights' organizations, the injustice continues.

      1.2.1 Palestinians within the State of Israel, who have also suffered a historical injustice, although they are citizens and have the rights and obligations of citizenship, still suffer from discriminatory policies. They too are waiting to enjoy full rights and equality like all other citizens in the state.
      1.3 Emigration is another element in our reality. The absence of any vision or spark of hope for peace and freedom pushes young people, both Muslim and Christian, to emigrate. Thus the land is deprived of its most important and richest resource – educated youth. The shrinking number of Christians, particularly in Palestine, is one of the dangerous consequences, both of this conflict, and of the local and international paralysis and failure to find a comprehensive solution to the problem.
      1.4 In the face of this reality, Israel justifies its actions as self-defence, including occupation, collective punishment and all other forms of reprisals against the Palestinians. In our opinion, this vision is a reversal of reality. Yes, there is Palestinian resistance to the occupation. However, if there were no occupation, there would be no resistance, no fear and no insecurity. This is our understanding of the situation. Therefore, we call on the Israelis to end the occupation. Then they will see a new world in which there is no fear, no threat but rather security, justice and peace".

    • "So who do those evangelicals think were Christian in the first centuries after Christ?"

      They just don't even think logically like that. They have a one track mind in which Zionism/Israel has become a kind of golden calf to which they give their allegiance and bow the knee.

      Their response to the cry of Palestinian Christians, in their Moment of Truth document of 2009, has been to ignore {or be unaware of} what they say, or to denounce it.

      link to electronicintifada.net

      link to kairospalestine.ps

  • Israel's unending settlements 'mortally wound idea of a Jewish state' -- Indyk
    • "What a terrible irony of history".

      It is the terrible legacy of Presidents and their lackeys. Holocaust guilt will be replaced or superceded by the guilt of bending the knee to Zionism and shafting the Palestinians, over a long period.

      Two wrongs do not a right make.

    • Jeff Klein: "Can anyone defend this today?"

      Yes, everyone who defends the reasoning and/or the result.

    • " A change of regime and abiding by the law does not disappear a country".

      Modern examples are Germany after the Nazi regime, Russia [and others] out of the Soviet Union, and South Africa post apartheid.

  • Long faces at Israel's birthday party
    • "they lost whatever was good in their religion and substituted a particularly odious golden calf".

      Exactly.

      "And I looked, and behold, you had sinned against the LORD your God. You had made yourselves a golden calf. You had turned aside quickly from the way that the LORD had commanded you". Deuteronomy 9:16

    • "The only dogma today is the Jewish State".

      Pretty much what happened a long time ago:

      "But the thing was displeasing in the sight of Samuel when they said, "Give us a king to judge us." And Samuel prayed to the LORD. The LORD said to Samuel, "Listen to the voice of the people in regard to all that they say to you, for they have not rejected you, but they have rejected Me from being king over them.

      Like all the deeds which they have done since the day that I brought them up from Egypt even to this day-- in that they have forsaken Me and served other gods-- so they are doing to you also.…"

      1 Samuel 8:6-8

    • "say you don’t support Israel and immediately you will be shunned and told you are likely a self-hating Jew. Israel has become defacto the God of the Jews".

      Indeed, and not just Jews, but any non-Jew who challenges Christian Zionists.

  • Welcome to the post-peace process era: A review of Ali Abunimah’s 'The Battle for Justice in Palestine'
    • "I hope it goes well beyond the last 20-years of ‘peace process” foolishness to recite the facts of life within Israel 1948-1967 and the facts of the occupation (1967-present)."

      I hope and expect it also includes the facts of life within Palestine 1948-1967, as well as a brief outline of those pre 1948.

  • Five reasons the breakdown of peace talks is a good thing
    • Yes, more than enough already. Obvious trollers should be banned, or their troll posts like that one, deleted as soon as detected.

      I am a moderator on another blog, and I would have removed that one.

    • Indeed. Loud and so wrong for but a moment of madness. It has passed, and his silence since then to the truth others present, is deafening.

  • The interfaith agreement on the 'errant weeds' of Christianity, Islam and Judaism
    • Jesus was straight up about violence planned upon him or in God's name. Christianity comprises only those who follow Jesus Christ as their model.

      "I know that you are Abraham's descendants. Yet you are looking for a way to kill me, because you have no room for my word". John 8:37

      "They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, the time is coming when anyone who kills you will think they are offering a service to God". John 16:2

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