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The War of Ideas in the Middle East
Kathleen, wanted to mention this story also. Thanks!
Here's a link to Foreign Policy:
link to foreignpolicy.com
Do you get it now, Americans? Paranoid Jewish Zionists in Israel want YOUR kids to die in a war against Iran. And several people in high positions in the US help them, some of them Jewish, some not. How many body bags do you want to see until you stop the war criminals, arrest, try, and sentence them?
The few politicians who are outraged by this, including Ron Paul, get heckled by your corporate media. You have few friends left in politics and media. If you want your country back, you must re-conquer it.
Off to Nuremberg with him, we can dust off the old benches and even the gallows, if need be.
I agree with Koshiros analysis.
Sure, I would rather like a US president to contain expansionist Israel with US troops to keep the peace and finally reinstate pre-1967 borders, but as long as that is not going to happen, I favor "non-interventionism cutting both ways" over the current "let Israel do what it wants but punish Palestinians whereever possible"-approach.
If the US was out of the way, the EU maybe would find a more balanced and productive way of dealing with Palestine-Israel.
And always remember: Ron Paul is a force which, when supported rationally, can bring topics like US imperialism, active support for Israel, war, torture, police state etc. on the table. Other, maybe even better candidates, who until now had to hide, could later take the ball and return to a "productive" interventionism.
That said, I am disappointed that Paul seems to support Israels right to have attacked Osirak. That's preemptive war based on suspicions and paranoia, not on a clear and present danger. Because back then, Israel already had 200 nukes. No way Iraq would have attacked Israel with some alleged nuke produced in Osirak.
Very eye-opening. Thanks James for writing, and Mondo for publishing it!
Why do Jewish Israels cultivate their racist idiots so much?
If this fucker where instead living in Germany and saying "there is no such thing as Eastern France, only West-German Elsaß", we would punch him in the face.
But no, you allow him to go on and on and you even pay some of his kind to do the public relations for your criminal government.
wondering jew,
maybe I did not evaluate Beinarts skin long enough. But even if he has "middle eastern roots", they can not be called "Jewish", only "direct Hebrew-descendant". So if he wants to have a right to some land around Jerusalem, he must say "We direct Hebrew-descendants have a right to live where our ancestors lived". He cannot say "oh and all other Judaism-believers from Russia and Europe and Arabia and North Africa have that right, too!".
So the "intellectual" shoud explain what exactly he means by "I believe in Israel as a Jewish and a democratic state".
So this much-heralded "intellectual" is also a deluded idiot who can't separate Judaism and Zionism. Great. Beinart probably also thinks that his grandfather lived right there in the Holy City of Jerusalem, no matter that the inhabitants of the Levante have slightly dark skin, while Beinart is pale as an Eskimo.
At least Phil is honest with himself and says that his family stems from Russia.
NEXT!
Genius headline, Paul! :-)
If some of those rich gentlemen are really "dovish", why didn't they come out in defense of their fellow Howard Gutman when he was attacked viciously by some "hawks"?
Or could it be that they are not "dovish", but simply care more about their own pockets than about justice and the US nation interest?
What about the recipe from this gentleman?
link to forward.com
The racist Rabbi who famously claims that non-Jews only exist to serve Jews? (link to jpost.com) He gets courted by American Jewish organizations lately. Will someone also backtrack on his disgusting words?
Les, that was exactly what I meant too with my Niemöller comment. Great quote.
First, they came for the "terrorists"..., as Martin Niemöller would say.
Will we all be fooled by the mass murderers again, and then, 30 years later, our children and grand-children vow to "never again" let injustice happen, as they stand above the mass graves where their parents lie? Do we think we are any safer then the people of Germany when they thought that "I will be fine as long as I don't try to stop my mass murdering government"?
Here's a thought experiment: If US politicians were really pandering to "the Christian extremists", as whiny people claim when somebody describes the power of the mostly Jewish-Zionist Israel Lobby, wouldn't at least some of those politicians run on a platform of "we get Jerusalem back for Christianity! No more Jewish-only places! The next religious Jew who spits on a Christian in the Old City will get arrested!"
New strategy by the criminal elite - they threaten Iowa and New Hampshire voters: Vote for Ron Paul and we might get rid of your fancy caucus. You still want to be important, right?
link to politico.com
That's blatant fiddling with the democratic process. No election is legitimate where the voters are threatened.
So many times I pleaded Phil to treat Ron Paul seriously, as in "I like his sincerity and sense of service to the people, and I like his stance on issues X Y and Z, but I don't like his stance on issues A and B." Thank you Phil, this was a fair and helpful post.
Kudos to Klein.
And it's a shame that the NYT evidently is not interested in peace, or she would put Ron Paul on the front cover and endorse him for the Republican primaries.
Evils crosses party lines. Not that hard to accept, but unfortunately some people treat politics like it's a sport: I choose my team, I applaud it even if it plays foul, and I boo the enemy even if he plays fair and entertaining.
"Hate Jews all you want"
Another member of the psychotic crew. Hell-bent on proving that half the world has nothing better to do than "totally irrationally" "hate" "Jews". His own FB page is his business, but the University should delete such nonsense when they appear in the comments on their site.
Kudos to the activists.
To some, it's not racism when Jews do it.
Leaving aside the question whether he really wrote that, I bet 5 cents that Israeli government PR people used some of their fake accounts, acted as Muslims/Palestinians/BDS-people and bombarded Joker with fake messages like "look Jews are bad", "support us you fucker" or whatever.
I repeat myself:
There are people among us who are psychotic - they are not capable of realizing when a Jewish individual or organization does something bad. And they would rather character assasinate anyone, including Jews like Friedman, than admitting to themselves that yes, even Jews can be assholes and buy political power, for example.
Treat them like you would treat other psychos - disregard their views, and lock them up into prison if they seriously harm others. They make it hard for us as a society to discuss vital issues and find true justice for all, so we need to take care of this particular problem ASAP.
"“it’s the latter day Protocols of the Elders of Zion”
What isn’t?"
Good one :-)
Thanks for that link. Greenwald is one of the few really good guys out there.
Didn't know much about Hitchens' views, so this was very helpful.
"Many of them say: “How disgusting, cutthroat, relentless, yeah. But awesome too. And just look at those parties. A crappy way to climb to the top, but aren’t all the ways equally bad?”"
"The news-entertainment programs reinforce complacency by a style of criticism that squanders its force through the multiplicity of its targets, the thinness of its coverage, and the message of ultimate non-urgency that comes from agreeing not to dwell on any horror for too long."
Two very thoughtful observations, in my mind.
The opressors (Egyptian military, Israeli government, European governments, American government) would really like to see this issue go away and the Cairo protesters to go home.
Don't hand them this victory. So thanks for the continued coverage here on Mondo.
See? We have information on our side. If people like Macy, Faithless, Joker get to know the real ugly reality in Palestine, they come to the decent conclusion: It's not "normal" or "OK" how Israel treats the Palestinians and its Arab citizens.
So keep on battling those highly paid propagandists who try to supress the truth.
And a reminder for liberals who view Christian fundamentalism as a potential problem on the Republican side: Please be aware of the fact that Paul is a libertarian first, and a Republican second. He strictly follows the principles that the US government should favor no religion, represent no religion and endanger no religion. No "keep this country Christian"-talk from him.
And even while he would easily win many more votes if he did, he never panders to Evangelical Christians who want a foreign policy that basically turns into an anti-Islamic crusade. No "clash of civilizations" or "god tells us to support Israel"-hogwash from him.
Finally, he, unlike Gingrich, shuns the "marriage is not for homos" crowd. He's a libertarian after all:
"While Paul says he personally believes in traditional marriage, he has refused to sign our [anti-homo] pledge and, worse, has said that marriage is strictly a private affair and that government has no role in regulating marriage."
link to rawstory.com
The only issue where Pauls Christianity (along with his occupation as a doctor) has an effect on his policies is abortion. And I really think that we have more important problems than if women should be allowed to put their unborn babies into a trashcan legally.
With all the money saved by stopping the wars and ending the bailouts, you could easily pay childless couples to raise children which are born to parents who don't want them. Problem more or less solved.
When you touch the really important issues like war or banksters, many supposedly independent voices in the media-political complex rather protect the elite than the people. Because ultimately, their high-paying jobs are only made possible by serving the interests of the elite. They are in effect propagandists in waiting, and whenever the status quo is truly challenged, like Occupy does or like Paul does, then they activate their propaganda mode, so to speak, and try to derail the anti-status quo and anti-establishment voices.
Btw, since Phil mentions the detachment of the Establishment from the costs of war - Ron Paul agrees with this. He said (not verbatim) "this should be the litmus test: If you really think a war is such a great idea, or you willing to send your kids or your grandkids over there?"
First of all, please use the proper word "anti-Jewish". Semites are a group of ancient tribes of which Hebrews were only a subgroup. We need to use precise language goddamnit.
Second, what the fuck is anti-Jewish about showing what a prick somebody is? Zuckerbergs Jewishness is never a factor when it comes to why he behaves badly. He is shown as a stubborn rebel. Nothing Jewish about that.
You are right with the larger context here, though, in that the Jewish producers certainly have commented on the "Jews are taking over the old WASP establishment" theme.
But please don't throw around baseless accusations of anti-Jewish potrayals. That's Abe Foxmans job :-)
Nice article, Allison!
Occupy Everywhere.
On the one hand, thanks to those reasonable voices like Alterman.
On the other hand, non-Jews shouldn't even need some "permission" to criticize anything, least of to all criticizing a government which has killed so many non-Jews.
Never forget. Rachel Corrie was a true human being. Please everybody, listen to this: It seems to be Rachel as a kid, using a speech in school to highlight her concern for the rest of humanity:
link to youtube.com
Her speech begins at 05:05. Maybe somebody could do a transcript?!
Good questions, Phil.
But it's not just Congress which is populated by Zionist shills. The administration has its own share of them, and Obama is very much responsible for their appointment. Susan Rice, Victoria Nuland, Hillary Clinton, and until a few months ago, Rahm "I like to visit the Golan Heights on an IDF helicopter" Emanuel. Oh, and Eliott Abrams, and Douglas Feith.
"his problem was not with the notion of a homeland for the dispossessed Jewish tribe so much as it was with the continued existence of the tribe itself"
wtf
I second that. And don't forget that US/Coalition sprayed Iraq with Depleted Uranium, poisoning society for decades to come. It's really a shame that nobody gets imprisoned for THIS warcrime.
Oh and Phil, since you mention the envirnonment - all those wars and gigantic military machine are hurting the environment very much. Electing Ron Paul would make the planet more happy than electing Obama: The latter didnt really help the environment AND didnt stop the wars.
"Who else is condemning the use of drones? Who else is condemning the Patriot Act? Who else is talking about our endless wars? Who else is condemning the runup to an Iran war? Who else is saying that terrorists attack us because we're bombing their countries?
Again, who else says this stuff? Who contests the belief that Iran has a bomb? Who stands up for Muslims around the world? Who understands Iran's desire to counter the saber-rattling? Who says that Israel has 300 nukes?"
And every self-styled "progressive" and "liberal" needs to give Paul credit for this stance! You do not need to vote for him, but give credit where credit is due! Only with Paul getting the Republican nomination are Obama and the Democratic party, which has the domestic policy more in line with your views, forced to answer Paul on those most vital issues Phil just quoted. If on the other hand someone like Gingrich gets nominated, Obama can freeride into a second term and just continue his strategy of talking smoothly and don't do a thing against war crimes, imperialism, torture, surveillance, bankster bailouts.
FYI
"GIULIANI: I jumped up out of my chair and cheered for Newt when he said what he said about Palestine. Finally. Thank God. Someone is saying the right things about Palestine. Somebody has to question why are we creating a Palestinian state that’s going to be another terrorist state. Put Israel aside for a minute. Is it in the interest of the United States of America to create another state where they’re going to be training people to come over here and blow us up? Of course it isn’t."
link to thinkprogress.org
Gingrich needs to get destroyed at the polls for letting people like the racist traitor Adelson bribe him.
The US and Israel really want to be known as the new evil Achsenmächte, don't they?
Really great guy. I hope he does not get the Thomas treatment.
Oh, and American liberals: If your precious president Obama had one iota of conscience in him, he would fire this bitch ASAP. She's a traitor to your national interest, and seems to be proud of it.
"This one night of the year, Saban can prove to Israel that even though he can’t be with her, he really does still love her."
Over his own country. Treat him the same way that Putin treated the oligarchs - chase him out.
Thanks for the help. Didn't think of the possibility that the ad only appears for US users. Too bad, I was hoping for advice on how to donate without being a US citizen ;-)
A Ron Paul ad in Haaretz? I'm confused. A few days ago I wanted to make a donation to Pauls 2012 campaign, only to realize that only American citizens can donate in presidential election (which makes sense :-)).
So is the ad targeted at American citizens living in Israel?
Judging from some of the reactions to Friedmans statement of the obvious, one can only conclude that there are people in our midst which are truly psychotic: They are on a quixotic quest to prove that a Jew can do no harm and that non-Jews inherently want to harm Jews. Their psychosis is so severe that they are not able to analyze situations in anything resembling a rational way.
Examples are Elliot, Rubin et al.
I don't know if their dangerous psychosis comes from the Holocaust experience, or if it is a cultural thing for anti-assimilationist, conservative and racist Jewish individuals. All I know is they are poisoning the very functions of democracy and open society. They hinder our societies in making progress towards true justice for all.
How many people have to get character assasinated by these raving lunatics, before we as a society treat them as we would treat other psychopaths? Lock them away if they harm others, and certainly not allowing them into important positions at governments, think tanks and newspapers.
Since a search for "adelson" through this article and comments, I decided to add the following:
"In the battle for the Republican pro-Israel vote, Newt Gingrich lacks Mitt Romney’s broad base of prominent Jewish donors. But he has something potentially more powerful: the support of one of Benjamin Netanyahu’s most significant American backers, and a relationship with the Israeli prime minister himself that stretches back decades.
Billionaire casino mogul Sheldon Adelson, one of the wealthiest men in the world and a major donor to Jewish and conservative causes, is widely known as a Netanyahu stalwart. Less well known are his equally close ties to Gingrich, to whom he has been a major giver in recent years."
link to forward.com
Gingrich needs to get destroyed at the polls for letting people like the racist traitor Adelson bribe him.
This was a nicely written article. I hope the optimism is well-founded. Because as of now, what Obama does is not using this alleged cover provided by reluctant adherants to the Lobby thesis, he's not pointing out how pro-Israel Republicans sans Paul are. No, Obama put out an ad trying to paint them as not pro-Israel enough.
Obama is of no help, here. He can't even fire Tim fucking Geithner when Geithner openly disobeyed Obamas order to not help Citibank.
Kudos to this decent individual. May he inspire others to do the same.
We're all Palestinians/Afghanis/Iraqis/Somalis now.
Dan,
link to articles.businessinsider.com
right now in Iowa, Ron Paul seems to be at 21% versus Newts 22%. As business insider notes, this marks a straight decline from Newt since he entered the ring. Given the numerous ethics problems and outrageous policies Newt has, I would say that Ron Paul can easily overtake him.
If Paul wins the nomination, Obama is forced to confront important issues like ending the wars, ending the FED, stop torture, ending the war on drugs etc.
The right answer would have been that the Iranian government is not anti-Jewish, but anti-Zionist.
Foreign aid is taking money from poor people in country A and giving it to rich people in country B.
I also thank all contributors for making this site so good. You make me both angry and happy, that's all I could hope for from this place.
@Mondo: I would chip in a few Euros, I finally managed to get a PayPal account. Unfortunately PP is not offered as an option on the donations page.
I'm very disappointed that Rand Paul is pissing on his fathers principles here.
And of course, I'm also very disappointed that the other 99 senators are still warmongering bastards.
The pressure from Occupy is not nearly high enough. Turn up the heat!
"Six Republican candidates for president, minus Ron Paul, addressed the Republican Jewish Coalition's (RJC) forum today,... " ... and competed about who would sacrifice more future Furkan Dogans and Emily Hechonowizces on the altar of the self-proclaimed "Jewish state".
Thank you Lupe! And Adam, thanks for featuring it.
He's a true human being. I personally think Words I never Said is overall better, but it's great that he keeps the flame of truth and justice going.
The elephant in the room is this simple fact: Zionist propagandists and some members of Jewish organizations (like Abe Foxman) would like to live in a world where every single obstacle a Jewish individual faces is labelled Jew-hatred (or as they falsely call it, 'anti-Semitism).
In their world, if a bird shits on a Jew walking his dog, the bird must be a Jew-hater.
The proponents of this belief always fail to make two distinctions:
One, the difference between obstacles you face because of the ethnic or religious group you belong to, and obstacles you face because of a political group you belong to.
Two, the difference between obstacles you face because of who you are, and obstacles you face because of what you do.
Long story short: If Netanjahu gets protested or if an IDF soldier in occupied Palestine gets attacked, they are virtually always targeted not as members of an ethnic group, but of a political group. And not because of who they are when they are at home with their families, but because of what they do in office and at the checkpoint.
"Reactions to this episode led to a monthly total of 81 antisemitic incidents in the UK in June 2010"
How many of those were truly Jew-hatred? And how many were simply political-Israel-hatred? How many were "I got fired from work so I call Abe Foxman and claim it was because of my boss' anti-Semitism?"-style events?
How much of this is motivated by a desire to use this virtual embassy for anti-Iranian propaganda? We'll see.
"Debate" might be the wrong word. In a debate, there are two opposing viewpoints with equal talking time.
What goes on here is not a debate, but a choir where the audience gives cash bonuses to the singer who sings the loudest.
@RoHa:
"Does Germany owe a debt to my parents for bombing two of their houses?"
In a world where every war crime gets punished this way, regardless of who commits it, yes. Assuming it was a war crime, of course.
Morally speaking, there never was a debt Germany owed Israel. Because whatever crimes the German government in collusion with many German citizens commited, they were commited against members of a vaguely defined group called "Jews", among other victims.
So Germany owes something to the targeted individuals and maybe their children. But it certainly owes nothing to any institution, be it a World Jewish Congress or a State of Israel.
On the one hand, I'm glad that one of those governments which normally don't refuse Israels demands is finally using some leverage.
On the other hand, I'm sad that the same government even thinks about selling weapons of mass destruction to a nation with very strong theocratic, racist and expansionist elements.
I hate it that my German tax euros subsidize a military which runs amok, be it against olive trees or against unarmed aid workers in international waters.
All the best, Annie!
Rusty,
you're right insofar as the little quote Phil offered may not be enough to call it a full apology. But it's certainly defensive, and he should not be. He should not waste time with trying to wipe all the mud away, thrown at him by people with blood on their metaphoric and sometimes actual hands.
It's a shame that he apologized. If anything, his speech was too soft on Zionism. Because even Arafat proclaimed loudly that he knows the difference between Judaism and Zionism. This "lumping in" Gutman refers to, the mixing of Israel/Jewishness etc. is existent, without question, but most learned critics of Israel know the difference damn well.
Sorry guys but I have more to add:
The question is not if its the MIC or Israel. Of course its both. The more interesting question is, is Israel different than other countries in its clout it has over Washington? And the answer is a resounding yes. Because no other nation can afford to kill sailors on the Liberty, Rachel Corrie protecting a civilian home, Furkan Dogan sailing in international waters with peaceful activists. No other nation could do that stuff to US citizens and get away with it.
Damn how could I forget this:
Did everyone watch how the US fucking congress gave Benjamin Netanjahu 60 standing ovations and a blowjob?
Does any US politician get 60 ovations? Or the president of Lockheed Martin? If its just support for weapon-buying and empire-suppporting allies, why doesn't get the King of Saudi Arabia get that treatment in Congress?
If that dog and pony show didn't show you who calls the shots!
I didn't hear Hillary giving a shit when religious rabbis call for the death of Arabs, or even the death of Gentiles in general, which includes herself. But now that some women can't sing in front of the military, she's all over it?
I don't think its right that someone demands women shouldn't sing in front of the military, but I also can't see how Hillarys comments are anything resembling deep, honest criticism of the larger Israeli right-wing attitude. She's useless until she steps up and talks about more important issues.
Beware, Jews of the world: If you don't obey to Zionism, its acolytes treat you just like they treat Palestinians. Just ask Emily Henochowicz.
So know who the enemy is and unite with non-Jews to finally defeat political Zionism.
"‘Commentary’ suggests Ron Paul’s heresy on Israel support is anti-Semitic"
I suggest Commentary's defamation of Ron Paul is anti-American.
I hope that the fastest way to bring down a dictatorship is by forcing it to act where everyone can see it. So keep on occupying and show the world what the US and Israeli and several other governments are really made of!
"I am sure that Israeli society has many good points that I am missing from being in the community on the other side of the green line. But I know that I will be indifferent to them, and even must be indifferent, until Palestinians are free."
Which proves that you haven't lost your moral compass.
By the way, strange how in Europe, whenever the theme "gun crazies" comes up in the MSM, there are pictures of Americans with rifles. Why do they never point out that many Israelis also qualify for the character of "paranoid white people armed to the teeth"?
The New York Times denies a holocaust.
Does the RJC bother to explain how exactly their favorite terrorist state in the Middle East would be hurt by the "friendship" and the "self-determination" which Ron Paul's foreign policy offers to all nations?
Oh, another vampire from the MIC who feeds off the fabricated fears of his fellow citizens. What could young people possibly learn from him?
Good catch, Phil. I say the question of dual loyalty is legitimate. In general, the loyalties of any official must be probed. A official who won't serve his fellow citizens is a traitor and must be dealt with accordingly, regardless of his ethnicity.
LBJ didn't want to get the "Dallas treatment".
Obama should be prosecuted immediately for treason. He stood still when the Israeli military killed Furkan Dogan, a US citizen, in international waters. Obama essentially surrendered his duty to protect all American citizens to the will of a foreign country. By surrendering that duty, he stopped acting as the lawful president of the United States.
You wouldn't keep a gardener if he didn't respect his contract-enshrined duties, right? So why keep a president if he doesn't fulfill his contract with the people?
@Woody:
Blasphemy! Thomas Jefferson certainly was no corrupt idiot.
The same solution applies as in I/P: Self-determination if native inhabitants want, recognized as a people (or several of them, if they want to be divided). If they don't want, then full citizen status in the US.
In any case, compensation and right of return to wherever they lived before the expulsion started.
Great job dissecting the various nodes in the pro-Israel network. We need to know names if we want to resist it.
Mighty Mooser,
I spontaneously thought that spelling it Zi-ocaine would better show that it is just a minor alteration of "C-ocaine". While the traditional spelling of "Ziocaine" could be understood as "Zio-something" by a non-enlighted person.
On the other hand, it might be just my German tongue/brain not fully appreciating your English word.
I'm glad we all have time to discuss such important matters, in any case :-)
"how this aligns with the reality of the zionist enterprise in palestine is well beyond me"
Ziocaine, to quote Mooser.
In fact, let's spell it Zi-ocaine.
"The fact is this happens all the time, to other 27-week pregnant women with no editor to write the IDF and stand up for them. If you cut them, do they not bleed? And if you wrong them, will they not take revenge?"
Fact.
Thanks Phil for covering Paul fairly. It's a rare occurence in most media outlets, both in America and in Germany.
And to all who say "I'm a Democrat, I could never vote for Paul because of his domestic policies", I respond: You don't have to vote for him, but support him and make sure he is given a fair chance! Protect him against all the false accusations made by the usual suspects. Because the more influence he has on the Republican side, the more your Democratic leadership is forced to nominate someone who equals Paul's moral foreign policy of Peace, non-Intervention and non-Imperialism.
Thank you, your country will be better off.
Hey Israel, guess which country also lost a lot of intelligent and moral Jews to America: Germany.
Look in the mirror, because the emigration has a lot to do with how you act.
Vote fraud is always a possibility, sadly. The people need to make sure that their vote is counted correctly. That's a lot harder than getting the right to vote in the first place.
If she had been handled like this by Chinese, Iranian or Pakistani authorities, US officials and/or mainstream media would issue some strong condemnations.
"Egypt lost more than $714 million on the pact."
If that's true, the Egyptian people, who are the ultimate owners of natural gas found under Egyptian soil, have every right to stop the fraudulent delivery.
Israel can have all the gas it wants, as soon as it starts paying that price which the Egyptian people, not Mubarak or the army, decide upon.
Annie,
thanks for correcting my sloppy wording. I didn't mean that Sand contradicted himself. I think "acknowledge" is the proper word!? I meant that Sand does not claim that no "Jews" have direct ancestry to Hebrews, he claims that it's only a small fraction. So he basically acknowledges the existence of X individuals in this world who are "Jews" and have direct ancestry, and Hirsch could claim to be one of X.
What I tried to say is that Hirsch and Sand could find common ground.
Ben,
thanks for the reply! If I understand Sand correctly, he admits that a very small fraction of todays "Jews" would indeed be biologically connected to ancient Hebrews/Israelites. (With the majority being converts and mixed-in people from different biological ancestry)
So the question would be, does Hirsch think of himself as one of those few, while admitting there are many more believers of the Judaistic faith whose ancestors come from other places than ancient Palestine? Or does he indeed think that he and indeed all religiously observant Jews are direct descendants from the ancient Hebrews?
If the latter, I would ask him what he thinks where his pale skin comes from. If his ancestors lived in the Levante area and did not mix with people of different biological ancestry, where did the light brown color go which is typical for Semitic/Levantene people? (I just made 'Levantene' up, no idea what the right grammar is here :-))
I found this inspiring. I knew about Neturei Karta and their anti-Zionist stance, but it was very interesting to go in-depth with their leader. It is really important to all concerned to show that Judaism is not Zionism, and Jews are not Zionists per se. I'm glad his father pointed this out to Arafat, and Arafat voiced it openly.
Three observations:
One, I'd like to hear what Mister Hirsch has to day about Shlomo Sand and his Invention of the Jewish People. From what I read in this interview, Hirsch would agree, because his wife clearly says that "Jews are not based on a land and a language, they are based on following God’s commandments, whether they live in Russia or England or anywhere."
Second, I knew that Zionists killed a lot of their political enemies, be they Jews or not. But never heard about Jacob Israel de Haan. Thanks for the history lesson!
And third: "The Book of Joshua details the migration of the Jewish people out of the desert into the land of Israel, and their slaughter and expulsion of the land’s inhabitants. "
Why the heck do non-Jews even remotely accept the claim that Palestine belongs to Jews, when even the Torah/Bible says that they essentially stole it from other tribes? I'm sick of this, that we essentially take the whole "God gave them the land" at face value.
"Rabbi Hirsch’s doorbell reads ‘A Jew Not a Zionist’."
If only all Jews had this on their doorbell!
That's a great interview. If that's an indicator of what to expect from the newly appointed staff, I look forward to the next years on this site! It's great that Alex arranged for the interview and picked up the phone. Somehow I think this interview is more informative and constructive than, say, the 100th discussion about whether liberal Zionism is compatible with Democracy or not.
"let’s stop arguing about who’s right and who’s wrong, let’s just take sides and start fighting for the human rights and the other rights that the Palestinians should have, and let’s not allow the bully to always win. I mean, it’s time to stop the bully.
Stop defending yourself and go on the offensive right now and start popping those three bubbles."
Couldn't have put it better.
Taxi,
"I used to get very upset when occasionally a zionist supremist losing an argument would throw that mud ball at me. AND NOW I actually like it. Soon as the slur is uttered, I KNOW I’VE WON!"
Never saw it from that perspective. Thanks!
Zuckerman's a coward. At least Haim Saban openly says that he's all about a foreign country when he buys America's politicians.
What a brave and thoughtful person. More of his sort!
I hope so, too.
Unfortunately too many Israelis are brainwashed into thinking that when such a move happens, it MUST be because the company is led by Hitlers grandson. It certainly wouldn't be because Israeli actions, right?