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Kaisa of Finland

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  • Trump's recognition of Jerusalem as capital of 'Jewish people' is assault on my religion -- Queens rabbi
    • RoHa,

      Here is a Finnish children's song from the 1980's (aka my childhood), I wish it will compensate all the bad Zionist vibes there might be spreading here while visiting these pages and then keep you on the safe track of getting better:

      Etkö ymmärrä/Don't you understand

      "Etkö ymmärrä
      mitä sulle lausuin,
      kerran vielä mä kuiskata sen voin:
      Että sullekin
      uudet leikkini näytän,
      siihen vielä mä lisäisin,
      että sinusta välitän"

      "Don't you understand
      what I just told you,
      once more I can whisper it to you:
      I will teach you all my plays (games)
      and then I added, that I care about you"

    • " as good as “Boris” when it comes to identifying Jews from a picture.."

      And Finns.

    • Boris:

      " I am glad that you agree with me and not with a rabbi in the video that Jewish identity is not defined by your religion.."

      As a non-Jew, it is not up to me to define what makes a person Jewish. In Finland Judaism is concidered to be a religion and that is the way I was raised: We have Finnish Christians (Lutheran, Greek Catholic, Roman Catholic, Evangelicals etc.), Finnish Muslims (Shias, Sunnis), Finnish Jews, Finnish Buddhists, Finnish Hare Khrisnas, Finnish Baha'is, Finnish Atheists etc.: All Finnish people, with different religions.

    • Boris:

      "I am sorry, I did not know I are blind.."

      And again I do not understand your comment.

      We have a minority of Roma people living in Finland, who arrieved here about 500 years ago. They are considered as Finnish people, no matter how they would look like.

      Those of the Finnish Roma who decide to ware their traditionl dresses, you will ofcourse be able to tell they are Roma, but those who do not ware the traditional clothes, I could never tell.

      It is interesting that you (and some other commentators here) seem to know how Finnish people look like, I do not. Even when travelling abroad, I can never tell if someone is Finnish untill I hear them speak - unless they wear some typically Finnish clothes (like Marimekko..).

      BTW, these guys are all Finnish: They are Finnish citizens, speak perfect Finnish and there is no argument there could claim they are not Finns. So tell me, could you see they are Finnish, if you saw them at the airport somewhere else??

      https://www.fum.fi/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/lihamyrsky1.jpg

    • Boris:

      "They don’t look like Finns, do they?"

      You just made me remember JeffB, who also claimed the Sami people look different. I thought such times had already passed.

    • "Well, Kaisa.."

      Well, Boris..

      I did not get your point at all..

      My point was that (like in your comment the Jews) the Roma people too, were murdered simply because they were Roma people, not for their religious beliefs. So what is the difference??

    • Boris:

      "but Jews, unlike everybody else, were hunted and murdered simply for being born Jewish.."

      And just like everyone like you, you forget the Roma people, who's genocide seems not to exist in your minds at all:

      "Genocide of European Roma (Gypsies), 1939–1945"

      "While exact figures or percentages cannot be ascertained, historians estimate that the Germans and their allies killed around 25 percent of all European Roma"

      https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005219

  • Israeli prosecutors try to make Ahed Tamimi a terrorist
    • Haaretz Jan 04, 2018 10:15 AM

      "What Happened When a Jewish Settler Slapped an Israeli Soldier"

      "Both Ahed Tamimi and Yifat Alkobi were questioned for slapping a soldier in the West Bank, but little else about their cases are similar — simply because one is Jewish, the other Palestinian"

      "This slap didn’t lead the nightly news. This slap, which landed on the cheek of a Nahal soldier in Hebron, did not lead to an indictment. The assailant, who slapped a soldier who was trying to stop her from throwing stones, was taken in for questioning but released on bail the same day and allowed to return home.

      Prior to this incident, she had been convicted five times — for throwing rocks, for assaulting a police officer and for disorderly conduct, but was not jailed even once."

      "Jewish violence against soldiers in the territories has been a matter of routine for years. But even when it seems like there’s no point asking that soldiers in the territories protect Palestinians from physical harassment and vandalism of their property by settlers, it’s hard to understand why the authorities continue to turn a blind eye, to cover up and close cases or not even open them, when the violators are Jews. There is plenty of evidence, some of it recorded on camera. And yet the offenders still sleep at home in their beds, emboldened by divine command and amply funded by organizations that receive state support."

      "In the winter it’s nice to get warm and cozy under these double standards, but there’s one question that every Israeli should be asking himself: Tamimi and Alkobi committed the same offense. The punishment (or lack thereof) should be the same. If the choice is between freeing Tamimi or jailing Alkobi, which would you choose? Tamimi is to remain in custody for the duration of the proceedings — trial in a hostile military court — and is expected to receive a prison sentence. Alkobi, who was not prosecuted for this offense, and was tried in a civilian court for much more serious offenses, lived at home for the duration of the proceedings. She was represented by a lawyer who did not have to wait at a checkpoint in order to serve his client and her only punishment was community service."

      More in: https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.832939?=&ts=_1515089781581

  • 'We have taken Jerusalem off the table' -- Trump bullies Palestinians
    • "We have taken Jerusalem.."

      "You want it all but you can't have it
      It's in your face but you can't grab it.."

  • Why Ahed Tamimi's slap is so thrilling to Palestinians
    • "Use proper English and you’re regarded as a freak!"

      Well, these guys are from Norway, so forget their accent:

    • "did you see this?"

      No I did not!!

      "We have taken Jerusalem, the toughest part of the negotiation, off the table.."

      YOU have?? Who is gonna come and tell that Trump, that he only is the president of the U.S., not a GOD!!!

    • And back to the I/P:

      Haarez Jan 02, 2018 11:22 PM

      "U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley said on Tuesday that Trump administration wants to stop funding the United Nations Relief and Works Agency, the agency tasked with assisting Palestinian refugees, until they "return to the negotiating table" with Israel."

      "It was not immediately clear from Haley's comments if she was referring only to UNRWA's funding, or to general U.S. funding related to the Palestinian Authority, but either way, her statement will be perceived as a threat and an attempt to coerce the Palestinians into peace talks under the guidance of the Trump administration."

      "Haley added that "I stood proudly, even if I was the only hand in the Security Council, to fight for the will of the people of the United States. They wanted to see the embassy moved to Jerusalem and we followed through with that. We very much still want to have a peace process, nothing changes with that. The Palestinians now have to show the world they want to come to the table. As of now, they're not coming to the table, but they ask for aid. We're not giving the aid, we're going to make sure they come to the table and we want to move forward with the peace process.""

      https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/1.832685

      Yes: "We very much still want to have a peace process, nothing changes with that. The Palestinians now have to show the world they want to come to the table."

      That is if Nikki&co may dictate all the terms and the Palestinians will agree to them. No reasonability what-so-ever.

    • P.s. Amigo:

      The independent Finland has never really been a class society and prior to that, the "upper class" aka the educated people spoke Swedish, since to be able to study in a University or to work in the administration, you had to first learn Swedish. So for the centuries Finnish was "the second class language" in Finland and that is why there are still some people, who do not see it as worth of anything.

    • Amigo:

      Thanks for the link. Is the real Irish not spoken anymore at all?? I remember my Irish friend speaking about it, but it is so long time ago, can't remember exactly what he said.. I remember him teaching me some sentences too, but they are all gone from my memory.

      What comes to your sentence: "Don,t be so bourgeois.."

      I am not sure what you mean. I have been told that in British English you can hear differences between how "different social classes" speak, but in Finnish we do not have that and since I have never lived in Britain, I do not hear it. So for me, I only listen to the way the spoken language sounds in my ears, not in social hierarchies..

    • Moose:

      If there is some kind of a "hierarchy" between the different dialects or accents in English, I do not hear them. For me in that way they are all equal.

    • Moose:

      "One common language I’m afraid we’ll never get.."

      I was only talking about the way the language sounds, not judging people who speak it.

      As a language lover, I would find it both sad and horrible, if the whole world only spoke English and everyone with same accent - like machines. Every now and then we have some geniuses here in Finland suggesting that Finns should start speaking English, because Finnish is such an unneccessary language.. For a person who has all her life been "diving" into the different worlds of different languages, such an idea sounds horrific!!

      Every language has its regional dialects and many regions have their own languages, so the huge variety of the ways to speak must be something which belongs to the humanity.

      As a non-native English speaker I can't hear all of the regional nuances, but it is fun to try to locate the accent where people are coming from. (And this can easily be done in Finnish, Swedish, Danish, Arabic and surely in every language on the earth!)

      (And Gamal: I think I was able to understand most of the spoken words, but not all of the jokes.. Stand-up comedy is a difficult "field": Understanding the language is not enough, most of the times you need to be "inside the context" to be able to get the jokes too :) )

    • “One of the glories of the English language is its regional accents”

      And how could I not interfere into this discussion..

      My absolute favourite accent is the Irish, can't really explain why, but speak English with Irish accent and I can listen to you forever. The Scottish then, is the most difficult one: For a Scottish movie I need subtitles or I am gonna miss atleast half of it..

      But one question: Is there a difference between the English spoken in Canada versus the English spoken in U.S. (I don't mean the South of U.S., but like Califorina/Northern U.S.)?? I can't really hear a difference..

      And RoHa, I must add that in my ears, the Australian accent is the funniest.. It usually always makes me laugh, when I hear someone speak it :) (It sounds so "round"..)

  • Why liberal Zionists have nothing to say about Ahed Tamimi's slap and arrest
    • Peacefull New Year 2018 to everybody (and the world)!!

      (Forget the religion, just take a good song :) )

    • "boycott, divestment and sanction.."

      I could not agree more with your comment Annie. Most of the Israelis like to live a "good life", travelling, shopping and enjoying stuff. So if they were treated like - lets say - the North Korea, the attitudes of most of them would surely change quite fast.

    • " so, no, they do not accept a symbolic number of returnees.."

      What number is needed?? If it is going to be equal rights, it means the same as for the Jews: Every person on this earth who has atleast one Palestinian grandparent is entitled to return to the area and the day they arrive they are entitled to have equal rights to vote, to move around, to buy land where ever they want etc. than anybody else living in I/P.. And why would you oppose that?? Why would Jews have special rights over the indigenous people of the area?? (And no, Bible/Torah etc. are not the answer.)

  • Pop star 'Lorde' honors BDS call, cancels Tel Aviv concert
    • " if there is a way to profit .."

    • "i wouldn’t take this too seriously kaisa.."

      Thanks! I rarely follow any celebrities and have no idea how such things work. This just "jumped on my face", with being so illogical!

    • This video should be added to her letter:

    • Annie, I just noticed some days ago this:

      "Sketches of Meghan Markle’s wedding dress designs have been revealed.."

      "Inbal Dror, an Israeli haute couture fashion brand, has been contacted by the palace to produce designs for Markle’s wedding dress.."

      Since Meghan Markle is usually presented in media as somekind of a human/animal right activist, is there (do you know) anyone who could write to her and ask her to BDS = change a desingner for her wedding dress?? I would have written to her personally, but I did not know where to address a letter (I am not in Facebook.)

      I saw a headline somewhere that she doesn't want prince Harry to go hunting anymore, so why would she use her wedding day for giving so much positive "visibility" for a country with so many human right violations going on every day..??

      (I think it would be worth trying!!)

      http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/fashion/meghan-markle-wedding-dress-designs-prince-harry-royal-family-a8123081.html

  • New Yorkers rally in solidarity with Ahed Tamimi
    • Cat,

      If things are as you describe them, it sounds depressing. I like a Finnish saying: "Matters altercate(?*), not people". Obviously I can get really irritated by someones opinions in a conversation, but still like the person after the discussion . (This actually happened to me few times in Israel too: Having a HUGE fight over the I/P situation and then sharing our shabbat meal together in peace. A bit absurd, but good too.)

      Since the Earth (the ground, the water, the air) is common, we just have to find a way to get along with eachother.

      *quarrel? (Sorry for the inaccurate translation).

    • "for the most part, the people do not have a say in the choices being made.."

      But do you still call the U.S. a democracy?? Doesn't democracy mean that the ordinary people "have a say" in the choices being made??

    • "demand? good luck with that. they can’t offend their big donors.."

      Obviously the taxpayer-funded media means something else in U.S. Here it is funded by the taxpayers, not private donors, 'cause then it would not mean it is a taxpayers media anymore. I do not mean to be rude, but often when I read comments here, I think you Americans should take your country back to yourselves. Here it sounds like it has been sold to someone.. Like who sold it and when and on whose permission??

    • Addition to my previous comment: It is also the taxpayers responsibility to demand honest news coverage from their media.

    • "I am also not a fan of taxpayer-funded media, since it promotes state propaganda.."

      Häh?? WTF are you talking about??

      A taxpayer-funded media is a media owned by the taxpayers aka the ordinary citizens. So it can not take sides f.ex. in politics or it will be abolished by its only supporters aka the taxpayers. Also a taxpayer-funded media can not be bribed by any politicians or again it will be abolished by its owners, the taxpayers. So in a democratic country it is the best way to get a media which purpose is to represent as many different perspectives as possible on different issues.

  • A day after UN vote on Jerusalem, Israeli aggression intensifies in the West Bank
  • Trump threatens to cut aid to countries voting against Jerusalem decision at UN
    • Well, I think the world is ready to see that it is the Zionists who are to compromize now. None of those Palestinians I have met, have talked about "getting it all" unlike the Zionists are doing. And now, the Palestinians want the East Jerusalem, but the Zios the whole town. So who is the one here who is not compromizing?? Palestinians have already lost part of their land and anyone can see, they should not lose a one small piece of it more.

      (We Finns have recovered from our loss of that part of the Karelia. If you ask anyone here, if we had rather kept all of it under the Russian rule or lost part of it and kept our independendency, I would be really surprised if you were to find even one person, who would say, rather to whole land under the occupyer's rule. Obviously we do not accept it, but we have continued our lives, they way we have wished our future to be built!)

    • 1944, who would have believed..

    • " there are many similar conflicts.."

      And then there are us, who aginst all of the expectations were able to get our independency, even with a completely overpowered "occupier"..

    • "Togo, Micronesia, Nauru, Palau, Marshall Islands, Guatemala, and Honduras.."

      There's some powerfull support there!!

    • "catalan is a sadist troll.."

      Exactly my thoughts..

      Hey Cat, do you have wet dreams of other peoples sufferings?? I hope you get some pleasure out of it anyway.. And thanks for reminding me, why I should never give up using my time for spreading the truth about Israel everywhere I go.

      Being around about the same age, we might both live about 40 years from now, so we'll see then what happened, if you'll die happy cause the Palestinians were suffocated and the Zionists may live in their Apartheid state "forever" or did the Palestinians get their freedom and some kind of justice they deserve. Obviously neither of us will decide for the future, so only time will tell.

  • US vetoes UN resolution on Jerusalem, as Muslim states recognize East Jerusalem as Palestine's capital
    • " I can’t see what is radically new now.."

      Time has passed, WW2 is not good enough of an excuse for keeping up an Apratheid State anymore.

      "Anyway, no need to go on about it.."

      No, I would not have time for it either:

      Merry Chrtistmas for those who are celebrating and Peace for everyone!!

      http://www.ts.fi/static/content/pic_5_421870_k421865_1200.jpg

    • Now, this is like very bad commenting, too much other stuff in my head..

      I was meant to write: I hope someone takes the leadership (not chance) soon for some "negotiations". For the first time, different options should really be discussed and then also go through with something, if there was an option the Palestinians could agree with. This has never really happened before, but in this time, there could be a change for it.

    • Sorry, I think in this case, I should have used the word ultimatum instead of "negotiations". Anyway, I hope Turkey or someone will take this chance soon, the moment might pass, if it is not used now.

    • Echi:

      The world around Israel/U.S. is not the same any more. I think for the first time since 1948 the world could be ready for some HONEST negotiations. And if it is world against Israel/U.S./Nauru/Honduras/Guatemala etc. I wonder how long time U.S. is still ready to defend Israel. I understand every word you say, but I am still saying the context to this all is not the same as it used to be.

    • echi:

      For the memory of my grandparents, I will never support a war.

    • echi:

      I must add, that my proposal earlier was that there would first be a state for the Palestinians, (as a first step solution), which then later could become one joined larger area with what now is called Israel. Those Palestinians on the Israel's side would stay there anyway, since they have not moved there illegally.

      I think the diffrence between us is that I wish as non-violent outcome as possible. With the pressure of the world against Israel/U.S./Togo/Nauru and what ever they were, one could get the settlers out of the West Bank and a place for the diaspora Palestinians to return too (If I remember correctly about 700 000 illegal settlers in EJ and WB, so some place for the "returnees"..)

      Ofcourse the different options should be discussed with the Palestinians, but I think most of them would rather have less violent way for their future. I have no compassion for the Zionists, but as a descendant of war survivers, it takes about 70 years for a nation to get over all that violence and destruction, so for the sake of all the women and the children of the area, I wish a more peacefull way to be found. I don't mean the settlers would leave voluntarily, but it doesn't necessary mean, their removal would cause a war. Depends on how many countries there would be backing up the plan. In my opinion, there has not been any plan in several decades and now there could be a good time to introduce one.

      And if someone asks where to put all those settlers: Well isn't Israel proud of changing desert to an oasis?? As there are New This and That all over the world, let them build a New Hebron on the desert.

    • echi:

      "I’m only observing that for the majority of Palestinians, the main thought of a majority of Palestinians is not “it is finally time for the Palestinians to get their own state” but “it’s been a hundred years since Palestine has been stolen and must be given back..”

      Ofcourse, if that is what they say.. I've just only happened to meet those, who wanted their own state and right to visit their relatives living on the other side of the boarder. It is difficult for me to see how that one state would be accomplished without the Palestinians becoming the 2nd class citizens on their own land.

    • "But you are still reading too many fairy tales.."

      I know! But if we do not talk aloud about options and just stay passive, nothing will ever happen. Like if we just start talking about that now it is finally time for the Palestinians to get their own state, those Palestinians who are living in diaspora to be able to return, it is not about changing the minds of the Zionists, but changing the minds of everybody else.

      I think Europe is ready now and most the Europeans are brought up to share and compromize so, if someone wants everything, he/she is tought to be greedy and who has any sympathy for the greedy ones?? And China, Russia, most of the Arab/Muslim countries, why would they not back up a Palestinian state??

      I think we should speak more about the free Palestine and the posibility of the "diaspora Palestinians" to be able to return. How many Zionists are there in the world?? Hardly a majority?? Can they live in a closed reality without other countries??

      My mother grew up less than 10 km's away from the Soviet boarder in 1940's-50's-beginning of the 1960's. The boarder was totally closed and they did not know anything about what happened on the other side. Each New Year they could hear shootings at 11pm because of the different time zone, that was all. She always says, no-one could ever have believed that one day Soviet Union would collapse and that boarder would be open and about 2,6 million Russians traveling through it annually to spend their holidays or just coming to shop in Finland..

      I know it is hard to believe in change, but since world is under constant change anyway, we have to try to affect the way it is changing!

    • "It would be a great help if Israel would make public what if would consider a fair long term solution.."

      The amount of illegal settlers has risen with about 100 000 people every decade in the West Bank. The current situation where no real "peace plan" or "negotiations" are going on, serves grately Israel's purposes. The longer nothing really happens, the deeper the illegal settlers will "penetrate" into the Palestinian territories and then there will be nothing left for the Palestinians anymore.

      And does someone honestly believe that the settlers would suddenly start to treat the Palestinians as equals, if it became one state?? The IDF would stop bullying the Palestinians and the checkpoints would be removed.. ?? I just do not see that coming in atleast the next 200 years.. That is why I believe, it has to be two states before that one united one.

    • "That wasn’t the case in Southafrica which is not different from the Zionist Apartheid Junta and its Nonjewish Bantustan.."

      But do you honestly think that white and black citizens in South Africa have equal possibilities in life?? For the empowerment of the Palestinians and strengthening their own culture it would be usefull for them to have their own state atleast in the beginning. As I see it, allthough in law they would be equal, in practise they would still be the 2nd class citizens, if that one state was born under the prevailing circumstances.

    • "“Let them vote against us. We’ll save a lot. We don’t care. But this isn’t like it used to be where they could vote against you and then you pay them hundreds of millions of dollars,” he said. “We’re not going to be taken advantage of any longer.”"

      We are living in interesting times right now: Trump seems to think that he can dictate all the terms and others will follow just because he.. ??? What?? Is a narcissist??

      While he keeps isolating U.S. it makes power relations change in the world and it might just be what we need right now. What is Trump going to do, if he stands there with Israel and Saudis against the rest of the world?? Is he gonna throw himself on the floor and "kick and bite the rug".. ?? Like: "Do these stupid people not understand me..??"

    • "A one-state solution can only come about by an agreed union of the two existing states. There can be no such agreement until Israel has recognized Palestine, halted the settlement program, and ended the occupation of the West Bank and the siege of Gaza, so that Palestine has gained its freedom. That is, a two-state reality is a necessary step on the way to a one-state solution.."

      This is exactly what I tried to propose in one of my earlier comments as a "1st step solution". If there would not be a "free Palestine" first, it would be one Apatheid state in any case: Hebrew over Arabic, Zionist culture over Palestinian culture etc. (I just do not see any realistic possiblity of all of the Jewish population suddenly leaving). Walls tend to fall, but it is best they fall in the right time.

      I wish I had more time (Christmas coming and lots of wrapping to do!!) to write why I think we are living in a bit different(and more interesting) time around this I/P matter, but here is the short version:

      1. Too long time from the 2ndWW to use it as an excuse for everything anymore.

      2. Since Trump got elected, he has only shown his a** to Europe in those matters which are important here = f.ex. climate change&conservation(nature), so I don't think there is any special loyalty to be expect from Europe.

      3. Because of Brexit, Britain is weak and Germany strong and atleast this year the Forgein Minister of Germany has been meeting people from the Breaking the Silence despite Netanyahu's "ultimatum" not to meet with them, which shows, Germans are ready to see the "other side" of the conflict.

      4. EU(specially Germany) and Turkey have had a bit cold relations since Erdogan started to limit the freedom of the press and jailing his opposition, but since no-one here wants any conflicts and Germany and Turkey are important to eachother(about 3 million Turks living in Germany), if Turkey starts to push for a independent Palestine, it would be a good place for Germany/EU/Turkey to agree on something and "work together"/co-operate.

      5. Putin has personal connections to Israel, but, he also wishes to be in good relations with Turkey and if Iran is there too, backing the deal, Putin most likely won't oppose.

      6. China, wants to do business with everyone, does not have any special favourities(loyalties) between Jews, Christians or Muslims, so most likely won't oppose a free/independent Palestine, if the joined Arab/Muslim countries were to "push" for one. Maybe would even want to be acting as a negotiator..

      So what do we have left?? Saudis and Egypt? Two question marks, because of their common interests with U.S., but atleast the ordinary Egyptians seem to back up the Palestinians, so their leadership can't really forget their opinions..

      So.. There is U.S. joined Israel and who else, Saudis??

      (This was my "curves straight" version, but IF the Arab/Muslim "coalition" starts to push for some kind of solution and end of the occupation, then I do not see any reason, why most of the European countries wouldn't back up the plan as would most likely do China, Russia etc too. So my "utopia" would be: the settlers out of the WB&EJ and no more road blocks, checkpoints and nightly "home penetrations" by the IDF.. That would be a good start!)

      But the time will tell..

  • 'Trump's a crazy man, but I like it' -- the view from Jerusalem
    • "In Mooser’s world, everybody stays where they were born.."

      Well, Mooser may correct me if I am wrong, but I asume in his world the one's who move to another country, should be the one's who respect the local people and adapt to their way of life, instead of throwing them out of their houses and treating them like some 2nd class citizens.

  • Israeli Jews 'will never accept' giving vote to Palestinians -- liberal Zionist leader
    • echi:

      I know what you mean, but I do have some real argumentation to why there might be more possibilites to push Israel than before. With my limited English I just need more time that I have right now. I try to share my "utopia" later, just to give another point of view on what might be possible now..

    • I noticed that I forgot to mention in my "first step solution" that the illegal settlers should ofcourse leave from the East Jerusalem too.

    • And this might become interesting:

      "Turkey's Response to Trump: Erdogan Vows to Open Embassy in East Jerusalem

      'God willing, the day is close when officially, with God's permission, we will open our embassy there,' Turkish president says"

      https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/turkey/1.829489

      "Arms race" with embassies??

    • I know there are many people here who think the Palestinians should alone decide for the future. Obviously thinking about how everything went in the past, that would be fair, but since it is not realistic right now, I wish for the next best thing: End of the occupation and normalization of the lives of the ordinary Palestinians as soon as possible.

    • As I see it, to get one state with equal rights right now, is so far away, that I think at the moment it would be wiser to try to get some kind of a "first step solution" for like next 5-10 years, where (f.ex.) IDF and all the illegal settlers(when they moved there, they knew it was illegal) would be pushed to withdraw complitely from the West Bank and the UN peacekeepers to replace the IDF by the boarders (obviously the living circumstances in Gaza should also be normalized).

      Meaning of this "first step solution" would be to show the Zionists that they alone can not anymore dicatate all the terms for the future state/solution and also would it give some time for the Palestinians to recover from their daily experience of oppression, humiliation and bullying and they would also have a better possibility to form a functioning administration for themselves.

      So it could be a "two state practice" for a period of time and after both Israelis and Palestinians have had time to find these new positions on the issue, the real "peace talks" could start from a more equal level. Weather to have one state or two states as a permanent solution, could be negotiated then.

      At the moment I find it most important to get some kind of a fast solution, which makes the daily lives of the ordinary Palestinias easier and mentally more tolerable as soon as possible.

      And if there was someone who tought China would come and support the Zionist's agenda in any case:

      "China called for the establishment of an independent Palestinian state based on 1967 borders with East Jerusalem as its capital, Xinhua state media reported Thursday.

      "China understands the Islamic countries' concern about the status of Jerusalem," a spokesperson for the Chinese Foreign Ministry said, adding that China "calls for a resolution to the issue in accordance with the relevant UN resolutions and international consensus."

      China also called for resuming talks between Israelis and Palestinians in the near future in order to provide a chance to solve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

      The remarks come a week after a Chinese high-tech delegation canceled its trip to Israel following U.S. President Donald Trump's recognition of Jerusalem as Israel's capital."

      https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/asia-and-australia/1.829009

  • Neoconservatives may finally get their war with Iran, from Donald Trump
    • RoHa:

      Well it has always been kind of devided, some people drink most of the alcohol drunk in this country and the rest do not drink or drink rarely. When I was a teenager, I had my wild party years too, but it irritates me that some people over 25 years old, still can't behave when they drink and you can ask Estonians, what happens when these people travel to Estonia, where alcohol is cheaper.. I think whole Finland owes an eternal apologize for the Estonians, because of those "ördäävät* suomalaiset"..

      *(ördätä, does not translate to English, so you can just quess what it means and yes it means like it sounds :) )

    • p.s. You can count our current president on that list.

    • "In this life, you can be either be successful or liked, pretty much never both.."

      OMG, you must be provoking. If not, just talk about yourself then, most of the people I know, do not count their success in life in any currency and they have all succeded the way they wanted and they are all deeply loved as being what they are.

    • "alcohol content has been approved to go up.."

      Heh heh EKI, to be exact, that news was about stronger beer "to come to be sold" in the supermarkets. Do you remember that stronger drinks have traditionally been only sold in restaurants and ALKO-shops here?? So soon the stronger beer will be available in every supermarket and they are trying to do the same with wines too. (If you ask my opinion, I was against, cause some of the Finns have always known how to drink too much and I am tired of it. I guess there should be some kind of a "drinking license" here: First you learn to drink in moderation and then you'll be allowed to buy alcohol.. :) )

      Anyway, well done and ten points for understanding!

    • A news that surely did not reach you in U.S.:

      "Finnish Joulupukki (Santa Claus) and Russian Дед Мороз ("Uncle Frosty") had today their annual meeting by the Finnish/Russian boarder in Tohmajärvi, North Karelia.."

      (The clip starts at 16.36)

      https://areena.yle.fi/1-3824566

    • Misterioso:

      "I remain convinced that despite pressure from Israel to do so, the US will not attack Iran, (fingers crossed.)"

      I hope you are right. I think that the war in Irak was a warning signal to Europe and no-one here wants that kind of things happening again in the Middle East.

  • Times super-Zionist Bret Stephens commits fallacy and falsehood, on Jerusalem
    • "You are a hypocrite. Not only did Hillary defend Slick Willy, but she was the driving force behind the illegal and immoral intervention in Libya where thousands of innocent women and children died. But you don’t care, not really. You are scoring points with your reference group, hypocrisy be damned.."

      Show me one place where I have defended the Clintons. Obviously you have not read my comments.

    • Keith, obviously you are a man and you could not care less abot women's rights, also your memory must be short. Would enough of the Americans care about such things and the history of Donald Trump really been investigated, he could easyly be winning Harvey..

      "Another type of accusation was made, primarily after the audio recording surfaced, by several former Miss USA and Miss Teen USA contestants, who accused Trump of entering the dressing rooms of beauty pageant contestants. Trump, who owned the Miss Universe franchise, which includes both pageants, was accused of going into dressing rooms in 1997, 2000, 2001, and 2006, while contestants were in various stages of undress. During a 2005 interview on The Howard Stern Show, Trump said that he could "get away with things like that", at least backstage at the adult pageants.."

      And please read the section with "Public allegations of unwanted physical contact", there is even a former Miss Finland on the list:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump_sexual_misconduct_allegations

      About 50% of the population on this planet are women and I have to say, I am happy to live in a country where my rights are protected also by the leading men, not only women, and part of those rights are the right not to be peeped, harrased or grabbed by any disgusting, slimy, pompous men.

    • Keith, if a person thinks he/she is entitled to harras, oppress or bully other people for anyreason, in my point of view, such person shows he/she is not capable of leading a democratic country.

    • Keith:

      "The conversation you referenced was recorded in the back of a tour bus in 2005 and has zero affect on the Middle East.."

      So you did not get my point at all.. Trump was runing for his campaign when the tape came out and had it been in Finland, he would have been kicked out because of that before he got elected. My point was, you could have kicked him out because of that tape and tried to find better representatives in the first place. So it has everything to do with what is happening today. (And if there was some similar evidence on Hillary, you could have changed her too.. So the whole elections could have looked like something else..)

    • p.s. Keith:

      I had to try to think, where I was and doing what, when Clinton got elected for the first time: I was spending my year as an exchange student in a High School in Denmark and eventhough I had some American friends there too, we were not at all interested in the politics of the U.S.A., but rather used our time on studing Danish, partying and hanging around with some cute Danish boys.

      I became politically active about four years later when I started at the university, but still, my main interest has never been U.S. politics and that is why I have no oppinion about the past. I do not have different standards on different people. Everyone should be treated the same.

    • Keith:

      In this matter I am only interested in what is happening NOW and how it affects the Middle East. In Finland I would not want to have any pu**y graber to run for President, no matter what party they represented and it might be good for you Americans to sit together and think about why there is so much sexual harrasment involved in the U.S. politics and why it does not seem to bother many of the voters.

    • RoHa,

      I am sure you'd handle it better.

    • Keith, I am a "Green Leftist" and in Finland the "Green Leftist" men call themselves Feminists and they would never allow any "pu**y graber to run for a precidency in this country. And neither would most of the rest of the population. We are talking about Trump, because he and his "Royal Family" is now in charge of your country and I could not care less, if he was not envolved in this issue with the Palestinias.

    • "Nobody “rules” America because it is too complex to rule.."

      Try real democracy. (Two parties and a mad man, doesn't sound like a democracy to me..)

    • “Trump is an old man in a big house who likes golf and twitter..."

      Moose, Cat forgot to mention, his favourite president also loves - and sees as his right - to grab every p***y he wants. So what the heck with the way he acts, just he makes sure one's money is safe, right??

  • Only grassroots activism and global solidarity can bring justice to Palestine
    • catalan:

      " I can’t stop laughing. I own a thriving business and have a terrific job with benefits. I live in one of the richest countries in the world, in a beautiful state.."

      You keep writing stuff like this, but you still often sound very negative. Shouldn't you be happy and thankfull??

  • 'NYT' columnist says struggle for equal rights in one state is upon us
    • "In some perverse way, maybe trump has moved things along, just not in the direction his donors intended.."

      This is exactly what I am thinking/hoping too.

  • 'My aim is not to resolve the conflict' -- former top Israeli negotiator
    • "Jews had been persecuted.."

      OMG Jack, are you like copy/pasting this same stuff every second week here??

      What ever happened before 1948, does not give any justfication for the Zionists to oppress the Palestinians.

  • The world's anger toward Trump gives Palestinians a clear path for action
  • Photos: 'Day of Rage' rocks Jabalya refugee camp in Gaza after Trump's Jerusalem announcement
    • "This guy is for real.."

      He sure is:

      "A laughing trAmp" (You can start at 0.45)

    • catalan:

      Never underestimate the power of the ordinary people:

      https://www.nonviolent-conflict.org/estonias-singing-revolution-1986-1991/

    • "engineers and doctors.."

      The wisest people in the world.

      The most uneducated people rarely demonstrate (protest), because they do not know their rights.

    • Cat:

      Never heard of demonstrations?? (Where people protest against things they do not agree with..??)

      Just in case you did not know, in the Free World there also is a thing called freedom of expression.

    • At least here in Europe, this has made it very clear for those who did think U.S. was somehow neutral or "impartial" in these enternal "peace talks" between Israel and the Palestinians, that Trump and U.S. supports Israel and should not alone act against the International Laws. In Europe I have only seen statements, where it is said that East Jerusalem should belong to the Palestinians, would they want to have their own state.

      Anyway, when Trump got elected, there was this joke going around in Europe, "America first, but who should come second", and all though it was supposed to be a joke, the Israelian version showed already then, Israel is second, if it is not the first, counted as part of U.S., which it easily could be too..

      (published 12.2.2017)

  • Palestinian officials say, Trump 'destroyed' the two-state solution
    • At least Nikki Haley did not even try to pretend U.S. would be impartial in this issue:

      "Mrs Haley said the decision "recognises the obvious; that Jerusalem is the capital of Israel".

      She said the US continued to be "committed to achieving a lasting peace agreement", and accused the UN of bias.

      "Israel will never be, and never should be, bullied into an agreement by the United Nations or by any collection of countries that have proven their disregard for Israel's security.""

      http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-42287429

      .

  • Trump just 'pushed the two-state solution over the cliff'
  • Trump intends to move US embassy to Jerusalem, Palestinian president says
    • ""I have determined that it is time to officially recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel," Trump said from the White House.

      "It's the right thing to do."

      The declaration calls into question seven decades of deliberate diplomatic ambiguity about the final status of a holy city vociferously claimed by both Israelis and Palestinians.

      Trump also kicked off the process of moving the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, making good on a campaign promise dear to evangelical Christian and right wing Jewish voters -- as well as donors.

      He said his decision marked the start of a "new approach" to solving the thorny conflict between Israel and the Palestinians.."

      https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-recognize-jerusalem-israels-capital-020407741.html

      As we say in Finnish, this is like "diging blood from your own nose": After this there will be no sympathy, compassion or understanding for these Ziokings from outside their own "bubble". As we also say: "The greedy ones have a shitty ending."

    • BTW, when ever I start to feel like getting a fair solution for the Palestinians is so far and Israel with strong allies, I remember my mother saying that in 1950's and 1960's no-one believed that Soviet Union would ever collapse, but only few decades later, it did. And the Berlin Wall broke down in 1989..

      So everything is possible as long as there is opposition and resistance.

    • John:

      Have you ever heard Finlandia Hymn by Sibelius?? The song has always been very important to Finns and the lyrics get even another perspective, when following this eternal show called "Peacetalks of the Middle East".. This oppression will end, since nothing in this world lasts forever, but I wish it will happen soon. It has lasted too long already.

      (Chorus starting at 5.08)

    • Marnie:

      "On a different note, happy 100th birthday Finland.."

      Thanks Marnie!! With our history and neighbours, these 100 years were never a self-evidence and that is why I am going to dedicate our 100th birthday for the freedom and the human rights of the Palestinians!

      So peace and justice for everyone!!

    • I hope most of the Europe will oppose and send a clear message to both U.S. and Israel. Trump's move on this issue will feel devastating for the Palestinians, but it might also force the European countries take a clearer stand on I/P. There might be Trump, Kushner, Saudis and their allies, but other than that, remains to be seen..

      "Germany Urges Against U.S. Recognition of Jerusalem: 'We Must Spell Out Limits of Our Solidarity'"

      https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.826987

  • Netanyahu ditches US Jews for alliance with Christian evangelicals and the alt-right
    • "Evangelical Christians are strongly motivated to share the gospel either one-on-one or through organized missions. Emphasis is placed on the Great Commission's call to share with the world the Christian message of salvation through Christ, and to "be publicly baptized as a confession of faith," according to PrayerFoundation.com."

      So good luck with them, next year in Jerusalem.. ??!

    • Moose:

      I don't know about the Evangelical Christians in U.S., but for our pro-Israel Pentecostals (about 0,5% of the population) every Jew is a potential convert and the best Jew ofcourse, is an ex-Jew converted to Christianity.. So in the end, I am not so sure about this deal..??

      (Just saw some days ago in their own tv-channel, some Finnish Pentecostals located in Israel, praising Netanyahu for "wanting to co-operate with them" and "calling them as Israel's friends"..)

    • RoHa:

      I hope I did not cause you any headache, I think I should have written "feel the spring".. I don't know what I was thinking..

    • RoHa:

      "so I’ll mostly have to stay indoors.."

      If I was there, I would bring you some beautifull flowers, but since I am not, I'll just share one of my favourite Swedish "power" songs with you. Just close your eyes and sence the Nordic spring :)

  • US embassy move to Jerusalem would spark 'fanaticism and violence' and end US status as negotiator -- Arab leaders
  • Flynn's plea on Russian influence reveals... Israel's influence!
    • Hophmi:

      It is not about Judaism, it is about a guy who is a real-estate investor and was not voted by anyone to do his job. U.S. claims to be a democracy, but its president behaves like a Saudi King.

      Had the son-in-law been a Palestinian, you would be crying here your eyes off: How wrong it is - so wrong..

    • "Of course thats the way the Chinese do business.."

      Exactly. Some of the Zionists seem to think that the Chinese are going to come and save their a**, after the U.S. has gotten enough.. Well, the Chinese will do business everywhere and with everyone when they see a good business opportunity coming. So they won't care about the Jews any more they care about the Palestinians outside their businesses. (It might end up Chinese buying the whole area though..)

  • In age of forest fires, Israel's law against Palestinian goats proves self-inflicted wound for Zionism
  • Why a children's book has Zionists losing their minds
    • "well there’s no “P” sound in Philistine.."

      Like there is no "F" sound in Suomi (Finland in Finnish) either, so I guess Mayhem just forgot the book was written in English, not in Arabic.

    • bintbiba:

      Kiitos itsellesi! (Sukran, bi al-lugha al-Finlandii)

      I just wanted to say to you, that the occupation can not last forever and the tighter it gets, the more resistance it wakes up in those countries where equal rights and justice are the ideals of the society. Generations change and the old Zionist propaganda is not going through anymore. The younger generations will see the other side of the story. It will take some time and I hope it won't take too long. There have already been too many generations of Palestinians suffering from it already.

      My Arabic has gone a bit rusty, cause I have not had a possibilty to use it in a long time, but there is one sentence, the most important for me, I will always remember: Uhibb (wa uriid) anashrab shay bi nana, bidun sukar :) !

    • Eva:

      Each time our Zionist friends are accusing Palesinians for their resistance, I am thinking about our little Finland, which is filling 100 years next week the 6th of December.

      Centuries under Swedish and Russian rule, becoming independent needed a lot of resistance (not neccessary violent, but cultural, lingual, etc.) Before attacking Finland in 1939 the Russians were demanding Finns to give them certain areas of the Eastern parts of Finland and when the Finnish administration refused to do so, the Russians started the war to take the areas by force. So these Zionists obviously think, Finns should just have raised their hands and said: "Wellcome, take what you want.."

      I like this new Electronic Intifada. It is the easiest way to brake the "Holy Facade" of Israel the Zionists are so keen on to maintain: Like watch this, Hebron, behind the beaches of Tel Aviv and all the Hummus and Shakshuka.

    • bintbiba:

      Ana min asl Finlandii wa atakallam al-lughal arabiia fusha qaliilan :)

      Do not give a s**t about those Zionists, they are rasing their children with so much propaganda that they can't afford to blame anyone else about stuff like that!!

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