Total number of comments: 103 (since 2012-05-29 01:34:10)
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American says: > ".. Has always puzzled me why some at least half way intelligent people deny the existence of conspiracies. The world is full of conspiracies, always has been."
.. ah, but "intelligence" provides the greatest gift of all .. sophisticated self-deception. The ability to view one's sleazy, self-serving or servile behavior as heroic and honorable action.
The greater the intelligence, the greater the range of self-denial-cloaked evil available.
What if someone with an enormous ego warns you that you're about to step in front of a car!? .. Would Gross suggest you should ignore the warning and be run down in order to teach the fellow a lesson?
Maybe i should check out the ego of Schockley in case it is larger than Gross's ego. And if it is then, by gosh, i will punish the evil man by refusing to make use of any device that involves a transistor.
What kind of retarded logic does Gross use? .. and why does anyone treat this individual as anything but an irrational clown with an obvious agenda?
> "Jews are simply too important to the functioning of western society"
lol .. such self-worship. (And oozing with racism, to boot. But, it's not anti-semitism, so it's fine.) Delusions of grandeur: a traditional substitute for intelligence and a grasp of reality.
when she says "anti-semitism", does she mean against Palestinians, Jews, Zionists, or what?
> "He noted that in responding to a woman who had questioned how he, as a Jew, could criticize Israel, he said that conveying the truth best serves the Jewish state."
the woman in question clearly has never brushed her teeth, had a wash or brushed her hair. Self-criticism is an essential part of self-maintenance.
> "The chief engine of support for Israel is Evangelical Christians who are roughly 33% of the population. Their support for Israel is more dogged than Jewish Americans."
For most people, support for Israel is entirely abstract. People do not (literally) physically nourish themselves with Israel every day. For most people it exists entirley within the realm of thought. It's an idea. People are supporting an idea (via marketing), like they'd support a pop group. And because Israel exists entirely within the realm of abstract thought (for people physically remote from Israel), the only reason it persists in the mind is that the concept is continually marketed (by religious leaders or otherwise) .. otherwise, having no physical day-to-day relevance, it would just fade away as a point of interest. For those where "Israel" exists as a concept void of personal physical relevance, it means the associations with "Israel" can instantaneously change. One set of associations (via marketing) can instantaneously change to another set of associations (revealed previously-hidden realities).
So, absolutely, support can fall off a cliff.
Neo-Nazis are the guys Israel supports in Ukraine, surely?
the "smear" of "anti-semite" is coming to be seen as a badge of integrity. And, of course, this creates a different context within which all previous uses of the "smear" will be regarded.
(In christian mythology, the actual original sin in the garden of eden was Adam's lie (ie. embellishment/exagguration) to eve about what god said about the fruit of the tree of knowledge. The distortion of truth enabled a train of events which led to the expulsion. Of course, christianity, being what it is, eve gets the blame. But, as written, adam's lie is the original sin.)
still perpetuating the fiction of Iran chasing a Nuclear Weapon.
the US wouldn't be sending money to Iran, it'd unblocking Iran's access to its own money.
/tut tut .. honesty is so hard to do.
> "I say let Iran have Nukes."
unfortunately, Iran isn't developing Nuke weapons. Perhaps Iran could negotiate a protection deal with the US where the US will agree to nuke whoever attacks Iran in return, say .., for using the $ to trade oil.
The struggle to invalidate the Iranian political/economic world view requires external co-ordinated political/economic action to cause it to crumble. Ironically, the aggressors' capitalist political/economic world view is collapsing due entirely to its own inherent corruption.
('scuse me for butting in, but ..)
> "Why do you not see the the Palestinians as equally intransigent?"
we often see this weird argument where some people exclaim that both the criminal and victim are equally at fault.
I guess: Israelis are at fault for theft and aggression against Palestinians ... and Palestinians are at fault for having something Israel wants, and being the cause of Israeli aggression by not allowing Israelis to take what they want.
It's like seeing someone being mugged or raped and saying the victim is equally responsible.
i hear Netanyahu is planning to punish Obama and Kerry by refusing to accept any more aid from the US,
i think, for some, "anti-semite" is someone who denies the inherent superiority of Judaism.
> "I firmly believe that the Zionist warmongers DO see the double standard"
Zionists feel that standards which apply when dealing with each other, don't apply when dealing with inferior beings or animals. Ie. as superior beings, they actually don't believe it's a double standard.
> " .. could this mean that the US is, at last, getting tired of the one note whining? Whatever next dare one hope for?"
is the US in danger of becoming self-possessed?
is that you, mom?
i'd like to add my own name there .. but .. i'm not significant and i'm not a jew 8'-(
ps .. any chance of an opportunity to make a donation in Bitcoins?
> "It is mind blowing to have Vladimir Putin lecture President Obama and the world on democracy and justice."
Why? .. given US's extremely nasty recent history, someone needs to step up to lecture it. A lecture on democracy and justice is far more reasonable coming from Putin than any US politician.
.. ahem .. White Phosphorus, Depleted Uranium. The US has no intention of getting rid of those chem weapons.
as a Corporate-Capitalist state, the US is, essentially, a Corporation. And run as one. With the same lack of morality and lack of democracy (except for the "feel good to be taking part" theatrical kind). The Political and Corporate elite are the directors of the US Corporate state. The general citizen is an employee. The US Corporate state expects the same toadying respect and admiration for its Political/Corporate leadership as a Corporation expects from its employees. It's the duty of the US Corporate Citizen to follow orders from the top to achieve their goals in the best way he can. The employees are not expected to have an opinion about the goals set (unless it's to totally agree with them). They are expected to be totally on-board with the goals of the Corporation.
Thus .. the Corporate/Political elite are naturally confused when the average citizen fails to fall over themselves to make their superiors feel good about their decisions. This isn't the behavior expected of a good employee. There will be hell to pay at annual appraisal time. Perhaps the employees should be more closely monitored and supervised.
/end of rant
Kerry only deserves credit if he denies the "rebels" their US military backup - which is the reward they're expecting for using the chem weapons in the first place. .. and, if he volunteers to get rid of all US's chem weapons.
The ones who should get the credit for Syria getting rid of Syria's chem weapons are Assad and Putin.
i lost my pencil the other day. I know Syria was responsible. It's a FACT! [Bangs table hard to emphasize Absolute Truth!] (For any doubters, I have strong scientific evidence. But, obviously, i can't reveal it for security reasons.)
> "it was resolved that the Syrian regime used chemical weapons"
yeh .. a statement that is Political Decree of Truth, and nothing whatsoever to do with hard, evidential reality.
> "America cannot now walk away from its self-declared “redline” without becoming the laughingstock of the planet."
lol .. too late! 8-)
But seriously, if we want to reduce world-wide thuggery, murder, destruction, etc we should assess what is the source of the most significant thuggery, murder, destruction, etc. Ie. the US should be stopped. That would make the, by far, most significant dent in evil that permeates the world.
> "the intelligence community can assert with clarity"
... lol, yeh ... anyone can assert with clarity. And "the intelligence community" no less! But, we don't want vapid, faith-based assertions. Independently verifiable evidence is essential. Not assertions from untrustworthy sources.
> "I woudl say to him what I would say to Obama or your Tel Aviv criminals: if you want me to believe it: release ALL the intelligence, so I can decide for myself. If you’re asking me to trust you, I’ll say, no thanks."
Requiring that no-one use independently verifiable evidence, and instead depend on the word issuing from absolute hierarchical authority - that's essentially dictating a Religious Truth.
Not different, in essence, to a religious decree that the sun revolves round the earth, and to use evidence to suggest otherwise is to be regarded as blasphemy.
zero independently verifiable evidence, yet lots of assertions of "no doubt".
Preferable to adapting to actual reality via reason, empathy, etc is expression of Will through War.
just to get this straight ..
is speaking out against injustice generally "anti-semitism", or is speaking out against the injustices perpetrated by Israel "anti-semitism"?
If the latter, i think it should be broadened to cover the general case.
Either way, the message from the users of the term seems to be: "anti-semitism" is a term used to identify an admirable and moral stance.
(in the real world, the meanings of words and phrases come from usage, not abstract definitions)
the mugger is insulted at the very thought that he should return even the tiniest proportion of his spoils.
ah! .. the "innocent have nothing to fear" myth 8-) .. so then, if they believe that, how come all the lying and deception by our masters about the NSA and the determination to keep its (and associated) activities secret?
MHughes976 ... "That’s to say that the subsidy is from the American government to American firms, though the output of those firms goes to Israel for free."
In other words, the control of money is used to increase the destructive capability of Israel instead of being used for creative production which would improve the quality of life for Americans.
> "I am more than willing to consider the effect that someone like Snowden has on national security .."
we also need to consider what is meant by "national security". It's becoming clear that each nation is actually 2 nations: the People, and the Power Elite and its Security/Propaganda/Political-Economic-Control apparatus. (It's the latter who have an interest in remote, foreign wars, not the former.) Typically "national security" means maintaining the security of the Power Elite against the interests of the People. Ie. any political change that emerges from the People that might threaten the status quo will be a "national security" issue.
> "Putin is doing all of this to make Russia seem like a bigger deal than it is."
.. lol .. the US's tomfoolery and arrogance combined with a detachment from reality made Russia a big deal.
However, re your Putin/Russia myth: there's been a noticeable amount of similar myth-making taking place in blogs and comments along this line.
Is the Mythology under construction a part of a new grand strategy to try and derail the significance of the uncovered crimes against the people? The new Myth seems to be that Russia masterminded this whole Snowden episode to strike at innocent, peace-loving, human rights respecting, US. The proud and hurt US is crying that Russia is doing this to start a new Cold War.
Is it hoped that the patriotic US citizen will put aside her disgust at being spied upon, and rush to the defense of her injured country? Will despite of the spying organizations turn into despite of Russians for their evil onslaught on freedom? Is it hoped the people will demand that their every move be monitored to prove to Russia that its dirty plan has failed?
I guess, for people who haven't been paying attention, this might work!
if doing the right thing means screwing the law, then screw the law.
if going through proper channels means doing the right thing is choked, then screw the proper channels.
Ie. be loyal to the people, not those who make the laws
bombs and bullets are no more than power intensified variants of stone throwing. Is it the tech sophistication of bombs and bullets that makes them acceptable forms of stone throwing? ... whereas the throwing of actual zero-tech stones is despicable?
how many genuine terrorist threats have there been that aren't home made (theater or worse) designed to keep the dear citizens in a state of reason-scrambling, security-demanding, revenge-seeking fear?
so, those who would like us to think Manning has mental health issues, have no problem with the mental health issues of those who he exposed gunning down random civilians?
> "It’s a free country, so you only get what you deserve."
(going off at a tangent ..)
... what's freedom? .. Freedom is related to the ability to influence and the ability to resist influence. In a society angled towards money being the ultimate form of influence, one's relative freedom is one's relative money.
So, it's a free country if you have significantly more money than those upon whom you're inflicting your freedom.
In a money based society, people with the least money have least freedom. Ie, negative freedom = behavior is shaped for you. (Psychologically, socially, politically, economically, etc.) = bottom of the money-influence hierarchy.
The ballot box is irrelevant where money is influence.
the Corporate-Government of the US is essentially a Mafia consortium. What kind of justice would anyone expect from the Mafia?
Everyone has a decision to make. Either be loyal to the people, or be loyal to the Mafia. If you choose to be loyal to the people, the Mafia will call you a traitor.
So we have Israel with no borders implying, to the enthusiastic zionist, that the entire world is Israel. And now we have StandWithUs CEO implying, to the enthusiastic zionist, that Israel is part of America.
This sends a confused message. Some clarity, please. To the enthusiastic zionist: is America part of Israel, or is Israel part of America?
> "Israel as Jewish state has at least as much right to exist as many modern Arab states"
Palestine has at least as much right to exist as Israel.
> "The question about how rich the Jews are is relevant because the interviewer insists that Jews make up less than 2% of the American population and, hence, can’t be that influential. "
Money is a form of social influence (as part of a mix that includes threats of violence, propaganda, etc). A unit of money is a socially acknowledged (ie. backed by threat of state violence, or community acceptance, etc) token of psychological influence. Disproportionate distribution of money = disproportionate distribution of influence. If there is a concentration of money in few hands, then those few hands can shape the economics, politics, and world-view of a society. Being of limited imagination, the purpose of being of the disproportionately influential is to use their disproportionate influence to increase the disproportionality of their influence. Head count matters not one whit.
any person whose fulcrum is morality is anti-zionist. It's as natural as being anti-kittenStrangling.
> "I bet you teach your kids, that there are NO Jews Haters, it’s just a Zionist Myth."
Why would you teach your kids that there are Jew Haters? Why would you teach your kids there are no Jew Haters? Why is "Jew Haters" the axis of your existence? Why would you indoctrinate your kids with a view of the world where they should consider themselves to be at the center of hate? Does it serve some useful purpose? Is the feeling of being universally hated so useful that it needs to be propagated down the generations?
Do Pakistanis sit their kids down and teach their kids there are Pakistani Haters? Do Hindus? Do Americans? English? Germans? French? Italians? Inuit? Apache?
What a damned evil self-fulfilling curse to put into the mind of a child. Presumably, the curse will last the rest of that person's life and color all his/her thoughts, emotions and actions.
What is very telling is that you're projecting into the minds of others what you wish to be there.
> “The Jews” should be anywhere they want to be as long as it is in equality and with respect to others living there. <
"The Jews", or anybody else, shouldn't be marked out for special treatment.
So, really, the question is: should *anyone* be able to settle anywhere, even if the local population (from their point of view) don't want intruders - and even if the hopeful incoming people say they respect the locals? Eg. can the Chinese expect to be able to settle in Israel?
i guess the lesson AIPAC is giving to the world powers (in the only way they know how) is that the Palestinians should be protected and their plight should not be ignored.
> I find it remarkable that whenever these discussions go south for the hasbarites, their final refuge is always the antisemitism card.
That "antisemitism card", is a "white flag of surrender on rational argument".
So, the "antisemitism card" a useful weakness. They are clearly signaling their failure in the rational argument. Now all that's left is their hope to scramble and confuse the issues in terms of the Holocaust Religion whereupon everyone will become defensive (they hope).
hang on .. are you saying Israel can never be accused of being parasitic (like any other nation could) because that would be anti-semitic?
So, identifying Israel's relationship to the west will never be about evidence of nefarious activity or parasitic economic behavior, it will always be about Israel's holy position in the Western mind thanks to the Holocaust Religion.
let me get this straight ..
If Israel has no borders, does that mean all of the world is Israel?
> ... the EU, because of its horrific treatment of Jews in the last century, has bent over backwards to make that right.
That doesn't hold up to examination. If Europe was concerned about horrific treatment of peoples, then it wouldn't have enthusiastically indulged in the numerous examples of mass murder, national devastation and economic looting perpetrated since WWII - including the recent mid-east and north africa examples. Which means Europe's behavior is not founded on atoning for the past horrific treatment of Jews. (Assuming each human being is essentially no more significant than any other.)
Therefore .. there is no morality in the EU is bending over backwards - it's all due to political control.
was the NSA created for nothing? ... surely enough blackmail info has been collected to enable the pulling of a few behind-the-scene strings?
Until concrete, on the ground events occur to prove otherwise, the whole thing is political theater. (Intentions are irrelevant)
Perhaps the Israeli government could replace the lack of investment money with winning money in European game shows.
weird, isn't it, that so many reporters claim Snowden is distracting them from reporting on the spying .. when they could just simply report on the spying. I guess they're really fulfilling their duty to search out problems with the world, no matter how trivial, and see if they can somehow pin them onto Snowden.
However, apart from exposing the godlike power of NSA surveillance, Snowden is providing another service .. his current limbo status is giving the US Mafia state endless opportunities to expose its essential arrogant hysterical character, scornful attitude to international law, contempt for freedom of expression, etc.. I think this exposure for all to see is significant and shouldn't be seen as just a distraction from the issue of spying. The exposed coordinated media and international political control is as much part of the control loop as the exposed NSA telemetry.
The NSA surveillance state is here to stay and is continuous .. isn't going to pass into history because our attention went elsewhere for a few weeks or months, or because Obama makes an comforting statement. Every time anyone sends an email or posts a politically sensitive comment somewhere, "NSA" will rise into the mind. Kind of like an NSA-awareness version of chinese water torture.
the "anti-semitic" shield makes judaism a useful host for those with nefarious motives, doesn't it. If some kind of dubious info or action is being exposed, then using this shield will deflect responsibility to the whole of judaism and be grounded by the holocaust privilege.
woah! .. wait a minute .. aren't Palestinians semitic? What is it about the atrociously inaccurate term : "anti-semitic" : that makes it the preferred slur of smear happy people?
1. Morsi elected on promises of serving Egyptian society.
2. Morsi serves US corporate-government mafia interests and ignores Egyptian social priorities.
3. Egyptians become pissed and kick him out.
.. hopefully, the pattern will be continuous revolt. Each time a government emerges, the US will find a way to reconnect puppet controls into the institutions. And each time democracy is subverted this way, then the people *should* - have a duty to - revolt.
no matter what form of government emerges, the US will find a way to reconnect those institutional puppet strings. And then, later, Egypt will have another revolt.
it'll be interesting to see the many ways that the Propaganda Soldiers will use on comment boards and social sites to subvert and distract from the essence of what Snowden has exposed.
> Steinitz: "Despite all the different circumstances, we see similarities to what happened in the 1930s, when people underestimated the real problem or focused on other dangers."
I think he means Israel.
polls like this are a test of how well western propaganda cloak reality. Looks like propagandists are doing a great job.
> The acts carried out by Roeder and Tsarnaev were done ..
ahem .. the acts have been *attributed to* Tsarnaev .. even though an authorized narrative has been cast in concrete.
lol .. the Carter protesters imply that, to support Human Rights is to be a "defamer of Israel". So their message is becoming a little muddled. Is it: "Human Rights are a bad thing", or "defaming Israel is a good thing"?
Is Biden showing his anti-semitism by encouraging the excesses of Israel?
seafoid > Israel is like the boy whose 0.0001% CEO dad buys him some top model’s time as a date. Couldn’t manage it himself and of course Dad won’t be around forever.
That's a cozy image. All we need to do is wait til Israel is all grown up and all will be right.
But, really, the Hagel shenanigans show Israel is in control.
If you like the analogy of the family, then a better analogy would be the Mafia family. Israel is the Mafia Don in control 0f the weapons bearing US muscle.
We shouldn't wait .. the time to push against Mafia Government is always *now*.
didn't Biden say: "There is absolutely no space between the United States and Israel in terms of Israel's security." ?
which means, where Israel leads, the US will follow. Ie. Israel is the signal, the US is the power amplifier.
modern, de facto definition of "anti-semitic" = "seeking truth; protecting the dis-empowered"
surely someone must have come up with a good strategy to deal with the "anti-semitism" gibe. It's such an obvious, manipulative diversion-into-defensiveness that it shouldn't be treated at face value. Except everyone seems to do just that.
the next stage will probably be to concentrate all Muslims into camps.
> "[I]t’s ours, it’s always been ours for 3,800 years we have Jewish sovereignty over Judea and Samaria since we first got it, 3800 years ago."
Poor deluded fellow. God has since promised it to the people of Wales. I have proof in the form of a hand written, dated statement signed by God himself. He clearly states that all previous agreements are null and void.
.. and for kids there are the Batman/superhero cartoons. Batman is always ready to use righteous torture to get the evil criminals to spill their secrets. And it always gets results. Get the indoctrination in early.
> “antagonistic toward the State of Israel”
they say "antagonistic" .. what they mean is "uppity"
Denis > "Please to calm down, Annie."
Your plan is to divert reason into an emotional squabble. Why is that?
But your dirty little scheme is transparent. Give it up.
> "‘By God’s promise this land is ours!’"
I'm afraid whoever said this is mistaken.
I have in my possession a document that gives all lands claimed by the people of israel to the people of Papua New Guinea as their playground. This document, signed by god personally, witnessed by himself, and dated a.d. 1973, explicitly states that it supersedes all preceding documented promises.
given the dire financial straits the US finds itself in and the casual attitude to murder, i'm surprised the Drone terror strikes aren't the basis of some kind of lucrative, sponsored Game Show.
> "surrender to them or try to run…. or resist and die."
lol .. looks like you and israel get your ideas about law and order from watching saturday morning cartoons 8-)
... on the other hand, the ridiculous Holocaust as Sacred Religious Event nonsense needs to be pricked. It has to start somewhere, somehow.
If nothing else Holocaust as Sacred Religious Event is as insulting to the *actual* event as outright denial. Denying questioning of the details of the holocaust is a form of holocaust denial - ie. denial of the *actual* holocaust by denying examination.
Events like the mass organized killings in europe and the forced mass starvation of indans in the middle of last century need to be examined with an interest in evidence and context - not as the basis of myth building for propaganda purposes. (Lord knows we're sick and tired of India endlessly guilting us about how 6 million died of forced starvation and excusing them of atrocious behavior because of it ... oh wait! ... they don't. Why is that?)
> .. "There is no question that there is anti-Semitism in the Muslim world" ..
yeh .. "they don't like us because they're anti-semitic" is a very weird kind of mindset .. it's very much like the "they hate us for our freedoms" mindset.
Party politics is mere theatrics, tho.
The real political activity is about about managing the theatrics to get the guy elected who would best progress the meta-(party political) war agenda.
> "Romney has a high pandering coefficient: he will say whatever he believes those listening want to hear. What he will do if elected is another matter"
so .. he will be pandering in his actions too. Why believe otherwise?
It's astonishing the number of times "Israel" is misspelled as "Iran".
Where's the one with Bibi's good buddy, Barack?
> Palestinian statehood "can only be achieved via direct negotiations with the Israelis"
cop forcing everyone back and saying: "the situation can only be resolved by negotiations between the mugger and the muggee"
Bibi illustrates how deep is the shit in which he stands.
what symbol do Palestinians use to remember *their* holocaust?
.. oh .. they don't need a memory aid .. it's ongoing.
what if, while Bibi was distracting everyone with laughter, antisemitic nazi ants crept into Israel and ate everyone alive!
i think they spelled "zionism" wrong ..
in any war between the civilized man and the savage,
support the civilized man.
* support israel *
the meaning of "anti-semitism" is morphing into "the exposing of embarrassing truths".
> "America .. has a far more tolerant DNA"
lol ... what?
DNA? .. i think she means culture. But, isn't America steeped in intolerance. Maybe she isn't concerned with intolerance in general, but intolerance against Jews.
Intolerance can switch in an instant. It isn't founded on logic, it's founded on frustration, emotion and the need to vent on a victim. The intolerance against Muslims is only a hair's breadth away from intolerance against Jews.
A firestorm of intolerance that engulfs Muslims can just as easily engulf Jews.
> "Yes, I still think Jews want and need their own particularity. And that Jews need some special protection in the New Diaspora and in society at large."
and who will protect us from Jews who have special protection?
The US is a power amplifier and Israel is the signal.
.. on the other hand ...
Mr. Ellis is doing exactly the right thing if he wishes to obscure history (and the essential sophistication of reality) and replace it with good v. evil religious mythology (which serves the purpose of eternally validating whatever actions we take, no matter when or what reason, as innocent reaction to the evils of Nazis)
Nazis .. they appear to be elevated from human figures in history to religious mythological beings.
.. and the people attacking Palestinians certainly are.
so, really, it's an anti Israeli message?
You once dumped an empty paint can in the garbage? .. you evil, monstrous *#^%#@!!
all this "clever" use of the "anti-semitism" accusation to bludgeon minds away from uncomfortable truths will end up associating anti-semitism with having a conscience
does it count as "civil war" if the vast proportion of energy and will is being channelled in from outside Syria?
> "would Iran supply good weapons to Taliban? If the priority is to hurt USA, why not."
That takes the assumption that Iran's attitude to the US is that of US's attitude to Iran.
However, not so. The US regards Iran as a runaway slave and is keen to return Iran to its former servitude. The US will trumpet any hint of active self-defence by Iran as justification for an attack by the US. (Cowboy justification: eg. Syria and NATO)
Iran would just like the US to go away. Prodding the US with a stick won't work. ... and anyway, the US is hurting itself just fine.
> "any respectable journalistic organization would publish a map with the multitude of U.S. and other Western bases that encircle Iran which show clearly the country is safely contained"
it's not that Iran needs to be "safely contained" in any case. Iran doesn't have a habit of aggression and conquest.
It's the US and Israel that need to be "safely contained".
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