Great to see this, and it is a pity if the latest US poll results are true, that 63% support Israel's illegal actions. I blame the MSM (or fawnng corporate media) for the ignorance of the Mercans.
btw it is "flouting" the law (flaunting is showing off!)
I can only admire the two rabbis, as I do the wonderful Uri Avnery. Now that we see how quickly the UNSC can act against a brutal Arab leader, but cannot even have a mild rebuke of Israel's illegal acts because of the USA's support of any Israeli government action, no matter how cruel and unfair, it seems peace is impossible. US citizens, afflicted with media like the WP and NYT, are unable or unwilling to make fair judgments, and it is not the fault of the Jewish population of the USA, but extreme Zionists in high places and their disproportionate influence.
Like the USA, you equate terrorism with legitimate self-defence. Hamas is only named a terrorist organisation, as Noam Chomsky said, because the US puts it on a list, and others feel free to copy it. How are the people supposed to resist? Everything is on the side of the criminal state of Israel, which started with terrorism, as the British knew well, and later became legitimised. Nobody gave a chance for Hamas to join the electoral process and be accepted as legitimate. Why not?? South Africa's ANC was still called "terrorist" by Margaret Thatcher-does that make it true?
How Obama can be so cowardly, after the humiliation by Netanyahu and the refusal of the disgusting bribes made to Israel, which gave Obama freedom then to NOT support any new resolution, shows his domination by AIPAC.I just cannot believe that the few million dollars going to all the US "Reps" , dwarfed by the huge arms gifts to Israel to dominate and murder its neighbours, are a price the US finds it worthwhile to pay. Now that 14/15 UNSC countries support the very reasonable resolution, and still after all the events of the last few weeks, Israel remains, against all evidence, the only country in the world that is more important than the USA, from the point of view of the USA itself.
Free speech if you say the right things. Nobody is allowed to think for himslf in the USA. Listen to and read the MSM, believe all the poor bankers, give up any rights to join unions, make sure you are not a Muslim and/or an extremist (unless you are an evangelical christian zionist), vote for indivduals who represent a country other than yours (you know, it is at the moment the only democracy in the ME), and you will be just fine.
Hamas has never been given a chance, even in partnership, to govern. Many former "terrorists" later join the political process eg Stern gang and irgun in Israel. The PA represents nobody and should be replaced eg PNC or some new body which will act. I agree that Israel and the US are seen to be intransigeant and the PA "negotiators" desperate, but this means another route is needed. israel has no incentive to seek peace- it wants unconditional surrender of all of Palestine.
Witty again on shelling. NO weapons are allowed, no selfdefence, no freedom, farms etc destroyed, constant surveillance and bombing, and you expect nobody ever to respond? Half the population are children, young people have no jobs, Hamas is demonised for not controlling every stone. What would you do in that situation? I think they are more than patient. Has any Israeli leader ever spoken to Ismael Haniyeh? Uri Avnery has . Has Bush or Obama read the very clear and reasonable letters he has sent them? If they had been given a chance at governing when elected, who knows? Israeli terrorists became PM eg Begin.
One of the most interesting Israeli commentators is Uri Avnery, for over 75 years a pro Palestininian, pacifist, humorous, knowledgeable writer. In counterpunch or his own website.
Terrible to think this is the friend of the USA and the West, and stability trumps all human rights or democracy, as long as Israel is "secure". I am glad you survived the experience and can write about it; we just wonder how many others over thirty years have such memories and lasting effects. All the talk of communism and terrorism, and we are the so-called "good guys".
How much damage did the "shelling" do, richard? This is not a theater of war, but a captive population with over half of them children, and no weapons or self-defense allowed.
Why should Europeans or anyone else be Israel lovers? The hostility is because of the cruel, unfair, illegal actions of the Zionist entity, and it is unfortunately, as he notes on campuses in USA, not widespread. The "delegitimisation" is done by the Israeli gov't policies and the IDF's actions.
Nowhere near 300million USans even have a passport, and certainly would not travel all the way to Europe. It is not necessary anyway, but the rule for Israelis would be great, but unlikely, especially with the craven following of the US by Europe.
How often do the MSM speak of "Iran supporting the Hamas terrorists", or "smuggling" of sophisticated weapons, or "thousands of rockets" hitting Israel, and never are they challenged for their grotesque suggestion that the situation is causing Israel to be the victim. The "delegitimising" should be challenged at once. What is legitimate about a homeland, changed into a state, ignoring all international laws and living by violence and destruction of indigenous people and their land?
In one interview he explained that many women were kind,helpful and loving to him, and that he was completely shocked that two helpers in his cause would act in this way. He accepted that they may have been pressured to do so, which is quite possible. He knows Sweden well and had good experiences up th this episode. He denies the likelihood of the "honeypot" trap story.
Recently several Israeli leaders admitted that Jews did very well in most countries in the world, where they are influential citizens, but they were still anxious for more to move to Israel, while dispossessing the Semitic people native to the land. I do not think it is a religious issue at all, and it is sad that Jews in free countries feel fear, when it is obvious now that Muslims are the ones vilified and discriminated against. I correspond often with Uri Avnery in Israel, and that helps to keep me more cheerful about the situation. BTW I thought that film was great, and was horrified by the hatred being pushed into the teenage Israeli Jews.
So sad to see one of the few fearless members bow out, especially with the Eric Cantor/ Ileana Ros -Lehtinen power duo rising. I am not an American but know about Brian Baird from his courageous stand for justice in Palestine.
the concessions should never have been offered. palestinians have not been asked and why on earth should they give up even more when they have received NOTHING except violence and humiliation.
Witty remember that Israel overflew Lebanese territory every day for 6 months before the socalled kidnapping in 2006, and ignored demands to stop. Yhey still do the same, quite illegally, now. You killed 1200 civilians then; let's let the two kidnap victims rest in peace.
Israel in which borders? Where will this "Arab-Palestinian State" be, and when will the "Jewish stat" recognise it? Will they continue to kill their neighbours?
Thanks Avi. The US, as well as supporting Israel and trying to destroy Iran for Israel's ludicrous fears, also has made millions of Iraqi refugees, now taken in by Syria, Jordan and Lebanon, as well as absorbing the Palestinians already pushed out by Israel.
Witty again . Illegal means illegal. You think it is ok to steal land, water; deny rights, kill with impunity. Israel and the US think it is ok if they do this, but it is ILLEGAL in international law, and even US law.
As always, we hear only of the "terrorist outrage" against poor innocent (illegal occupiers) settlers, and never a name of the dozens of Palestinians killed day after day, or imprisoned for peaceful protests, except in posts like this one.
good comments. Israel has never attempted to "compromise" or to follow international law, which would enable some Palestinian independence and real life to have a chance;
It really seems strange to have this in Israel. In the USA this has been going on for so long (Paul Findley's "They Dare to Speak Out" dates from the 1980's or earlier) that very few non-Zionists could get tenure in universities, and there were spies in many classes.
NO country has a "right to exist". This wording was, I understand, a clever ploy of Henry Kissinger, but it is not relevant, and Israel is not "deligitimised" by any action or criticism.
The speech was completely disgusting, but the comments are all great-thanks! How the US can keep pretending Israel is some sort of democratic ally and then be surprised that a few muslims react amazes me.
As an ordinary human I find Gilad Atzmon forthright and passionate. OK, he is a bit over the top, but compared with the lies of all Israeli politicians, most of the US Senators and Congress members, EU speakers and the peace envoy/war criminal Bliar, he is at least on the right side of the truth.
BHL, Pascal Bruckner, Finkelkraut ....these "french philosophers" beloved of arms-dealer zionist "Figaro" owner Serge Dassault get constant coverage as experts while making a mockery of any kind of real examination of ideas or thoughtful insight.
Do not be extreme. Hezbollah are part of the Lebanese government and are defending their home NOT attacking , though Israel constantly overflies and threatensd Lebanon.
Japan must be grateful for the two atom bombs as well. Tha number of US deaths is tiny compared to Europe especially USSR. Check how often in the UN only US and Israel are against any humanitarian bill. The Arab dictators are the ones supporting USA, as they have oil, or of course democratic Egypt, a friend of lovely democratic (for some) israel.
Palestinians are there or in refugee camps and have houses stolen by diaspora jews. "returning" is a ludicrous word for jews, not Palestinians.
What peace offer? When has Israel ever stopped expanding?
Great to see this, and it is a pity if the latest US poll results are true, that 63% support Israel's illegal actions. I blame the MSM (or fawnng corporate media) for the ignorance of the Mercans.
btw it is "flouting" the law (flaunting is showing off!)
I can only admire the two rabbis, as I do the wonderful Uri Avnery. Now that we see how quickly the UNSC can act against a brutal Arab leader, but cannot even have a mild rebuke of Israel's illegal acts because of the USA's support of any Israeli government action, no matter how cruel and unfair, it seems peace is impossible. US citizens, afflicted with media like the WP and NYT, are unable or unwilling to make fair judgments, and it is not the fault of the Jewish population of the USA, but extreme Zionists in high places and their disproportionate influence.
Like the USA, you equate terrorism with legitimate self-defence. Hamas is only named a terrorist organisation, as Noam Chomsky said, because the US puts it on a list, and others feel free to copy it. How are the people supposed to resist? Everything is on the side of the criminal state of Israel, which started with terrorism, as the British knew well, and later became legitimised. Nobody gave a chance for Hamas to join the electoral process and be accepted as legitimate. Why not?? South Africa's ANC was still called "terrorist" by Margaret Thatcher-does that make it true?
You still wrote of Hamas boycotting elections (why not, when they are the elected incumbents and were not consulted)?
How Obama can be so cowardly, after the humiliation by Netanyahu and the refusal of the disgusting bribes made to Israel, which gave Obama freedom then to NOT support any new resolution, shows his domination by AIPAC.I just cannot believe that the few million dollars going to all the US "Reps" , dwarfed by the huge arms gifts to Israel to dominate and murder its neighbours, are a price the US finds it worthwhile to pay. Now that 14/15 UNSC countries support the very reasonable resolution, and still after all the events of the last few weeks, Israel remains, against all evidence, the only country in the world that is more important than the USA, from the point of view of the USA itself.
Free speech if you say the right things. Nobody is allowed to think for himslf in the USA. Listen to and read the MSM, believe all the poor bankers, give up any rights to join unions, make sure you are not a Muslim and/or an extremist (unless you are an evangelical christian zionist), vote for indivduals who represent a country other than yours (you know, it is at the moment the only democracy in the ME), and you will be just fine.
Hamas has never been given a chance, even in partnership, to govern. Many former "terrorists" later join the political process eg Stern gang and irgun in Israel. The PA represents nobody and should be replaced eg PNC or some new body which will act. I agree that Israel and the US are seen to be intransigeant and the PA "negotiators" desperate, but this means another route is needed. israel has no incentive to seek peace- it wants unconditional surrender of all of Palestine.
Witty again on shelling. NO weapons are allowed, no selfdefence, no freedom, farms etc destroyed, constant surveillance and bombing, and you expect nobody ever to respond? Half the population are children, young people have no jobs, Hamas is demonised for not controlling every stone. What would you do in that situation? I think they are more than patient. Has any Israeli leader ever spoken to Ismael Haniyeh? Uri Avnery has . Has Bush or Obama read the very clear and reasonable letters he has sent them? If they had been given a chance at governing when elected, who knows? Israeli terrorists became PM eg Begin.
Imagine the population if they married as well.
hard to see what that was.I read that the PA stopped the protests for the egyptian people, let the proMubarak go on.
One of the most interesting Israeli commentators is Uri Avnery, for over 75 years a pro Palestininian, pacifist, humorous, knowledgeable writer. In counterpunch or his own website.
Terrible to think this is the friend of the USA and the West, and stability trumps all human rights or democracy, as long as Israel is "secure". I am glad you survived the experience and can write about it; we just wonder how many others over thirty years have such memories and lasting effects. All the talk of communism and terrorism, and we are the so-called "good guys".
Please Witty do not go on as though nobody in the world matters except jews and israel, even if you think it. get a life.
Go back further. Mexico lost a lot of territory to the USA. Australia's aborigines lost it all to the white invaders! lots of examples;
Do not insult oatmeal.
How much damage did the "shelling" do, richard? This is not a theater of war, but a captive population with over half of them children, and no weapons or self-defense allowed.
NB the element is phosphorus!
did Senator Fulbright not try to bring this in years ago, and the Zionists changed the name to AIPAC (should be IPAC!)?
Did Brian Baird step down voluntarily? The only voice for Palestine, it seems.
Why should Europeans or anyone else be Israel lovers? The hostility is because of the cruel, unfair, illegal actions of the Zionist entity, and it is unfortunately, as he notes on campuses in USA, not widespread. The "delegitimisation" is done by the Israeli gov't policies and the IDF's actions.
Nobody is allowed under any conditions to be anti-Israel, no matter what the rogue state does.
Nowhere near 300million USans even have a passport, and certainly would not travel all the way to Europe. It is not necessary anyway, but the rule for Israelis would be great, but unlikely, especially with the craven following of the US by Europe.
How often do the MSM speak of "Iran supporting the Hamas terrorists", or "smuggling" of sophisticated weapons, or "thousands of rockets" hitting Israel, and never are they challenged for their grotesque suggestion that the situation is causing Israel to be the victim. The "delegitimising" should be challenged at once. What is legitimate about a homeland, changed into a state, ignoring all international laws and living by violence and destruction of indigenous people and their land?
they pretend this is religious. The god that chose them gave very strange orders.
In one interview he explained that many women were kind,helpful and loving to him, and that he was completely shocked that two helpers in his cause would act in this way. He accepted that they may have been pressured to do so, which is quite possible. He knows Sweden well and had good experiences up th this episode. He denies the likelihood of the "honeypot" trap story.
the charge is nothing so far; if you think it is not political you are very naive.
"Foundation for the Defense of Democracies" always a code name like ADF, IDF,NED.
Also, of course, it is unfair to expect Israel to sign the NPT
They do not have to practice faith- the early zionists were atheists
Recently several Israeli leaders admitted that Jews did very well in most countries in the world, where they are influential citizens, but they were still anxious for more to move to Israel, while dispossessing the Semitic people native to the land. I do not think it is a religious issue at all, and it is sad that Jews in free countries feel fear, when it is obvious now that Muslims are the ones vilified and discriminated against. I correspond often with Uri Avnery in Israel, and that helps to keep me more cheerful about the situation. BTW I thought that film was great, and was horrified by the hatred being pushed into the teenage Israeli Jews.
So sad to see one of the few fearless members bow out, especially with the Eric Cantor/ Ileana Ros -Lehtinen power duo rising. I am not an American but know about Brian Baird from his courageous stand for justice in Palestine.
the concessions should never have been offered. palestinians have not been asked and why on earth should they give up even more when they have received NOTHING except violence and humiliation.
Witty remember that Israel overflew Lebanese territory every day for 6 months before the socalled kidnapping in 2006, and ignored demands to stop. Yhey still do the same, quite illegally, now. You killed 1200 civilians then; let's let the two kidnap victims rest in peace.
Israel in which borders? Where will this "Arab-Palestinian State" be, and when will the "Jewish stat" recognise it? Will they continue to kill their neighbours?
Thanks Avi. The US, as well as supporting Israel and trying to destroy Iran for Israel's ludicrous fears, also has made millions of Iraqi refugees, now taken in by Syria, Jordan and Lebanon, as well as absorbing the Palestinians already pushed out by Israel.
Witty again . Illegal means illegal. You think it is ok to steal land, water; deny rights, kill with impunity. Israel and the US think it is ok if they do this, but it is ILLEGAL in international law, and even US law.
Like Kathleen, I regret the demonization of Ahmedinejad, and the pretence that any other tha
As always, we hear only of the "terrorist outrage" against poor innocent (illegal occupiers) settlers, and never a name of the dozens of Palestinians killed day after day, or imprisoned for peaceful protests, except in posts like this one.
good comments. Israel has never attempted to "compromise" or to follow international law, which would enable some Palestinian independence and real life to have a chance;
It really seems strange to have this in Israel. In the USA this has been going on for so long (Paul Findley's "They Dare to Speak Out" dates from the 1980's or earlier) that very few non-Zionists could get tenure in universities, and there were spies in many classes.
NO country has a "right to exist". This wording was, I understand, a clever ploy of Henry Kissinger, but it is not relevant, and Israel is not "deligitimised" by any action or criticism.
The speech was completely disgusting, but the comments are all great-thanks! How the US can keep pretending Israel is some sort of democratic ally and then be surprised that a few muslims react amazes me.
As an ordinary human I find Gilad Atzmon forthright and passionate. OK, he is a bit over the top, but compared with the lies of all Israeli politicians, most of the US Senators and Congress members, EU speakers and the peace envoy/war criminal Bliar, he is at least on the right side of the truth.
BHL, Pascal Bruckner, Finkelkraut ....these "french philosophers" beloved of arms-dealer zionist "Figaro" owner Serge Dassault get constant coverage as experts while making a mockery of any kind of real examination of ideas or thoughtful insight.
Also read Fisk's article in the Independent and several other links including the IDF commando who killed 6 of the 9 "terrorists " on the ship.
How big did he expect the peaceful nuclear-armed state of israel to be? Where are the borders now?
Do not be extreme. Hezbollah are part of the Lebanese government and are defending their home NOT attacking , though Israel constantly overflies and threatensd Lebanon.
Japan must be grateful for the two atom bombs as well. Tha number of US deaths is tiny compared to Europe especially USSR. Check how often in the UN only US and Israel are against any humanitarian bill. The Arab dictators are the ones supporting USA, as they have oil, or of course democratic Egypt, a friend of lovely democratic (for some) israel.
Palestinians are there or in refugee camps and have houses stolen by diaspora jews. "returning" is a ludicrous word for jews, not Palestinians.
What peace offer? When has Israel ever stopped expanding?