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Total number of comments: 15674 (since 2009-08-08 06:29:45)


"Either we are all sacred or none of us is" - Paul Fourhorns Tenoso "One has to bear in mind that Israelis live in a largely mythic world, a somewhat modified and vastly simplified version of the Iliad. In this starkly polarized vision of reality, in which Israelis are by definition innocent victims of dark, irrational forces operating against them, heroic death in war always makes sense, and violent coercion is the option both of necessity and of choice. The Hebrew proverb says: “If force doesn’t work, use more force.” jon s November 16, 2014, 6:56 am "Hophmi, for participating in efforts to promote Jewish-Muslim understanding , is ridiculed, while Max and David , for spreading lies and promoting hatred , are to be admired." I just think Judaism needs to get back to that justice setting.

Showing comments 4600 - 4501

  • 'The Crisis of Zionism' and the contradictions of Israel as a liberal democratic fantasy
    • Mayhem

      If it didn't matter they wouldn't make such a big deal about it.

    • "The casuistic aspect of this hair-splitting leads to a labyrinthine form of argument where the speaker blows enough rhetorical smoke to make his interlocutor submit".

      The internet has destroyed this .
      Philly Hasbara or Hillel or whoever could send the top rhetorician of his or her generation on here and they'd be wiped out in 5 minutes.
      Danon tried it on al jazeera and he came off it looking like the small minded bigot he is.

    • They all lie. Barak was supposed to be a mould breaker back in 1999 and he's as mendacious as any right wing Zionist.
      The whole ideology is built on lies and manufactured history that doesn't stand up to even the most rudimentary academic treatment. That's why it's so fragile.

    • Likud wasn't around in 1948. Mapai which became Labor was.
      Jewish democracy was only ever possible thanks to ethnic cleansing and the destruction of a nation.

      link to

      "Another historian, Sami Abu Shehadeh, is doing his doctoral thesis on Jaffa as the major Arab cultural and economic centre during the mandate period. It had its own Arabic press, eight cinemas, five hospitals and about 120,000 people. After the 1948 war, 3,900 were left.

      It is standard practice for historians at Tel Aviv University to explain the time frame of their research and why it ends when it does. Shehadeh stopped his in 1948 because that was when Jaffa stopped existing as a city. "My adviser told me: 'Sami, we might agree or disagree on the word expelled, but I don't know who will sit on your committee [to adjudicate the thesis] if you insist on using it.'" A compromise was negotiated – rare in this part of the world. Shehadeh wrote that, as a result of the war, the Arabs of Jaffa "had to leave and were not allowed back".

      "Forget politics, on the basic historical facts we fight on everything," he says. "I dont even know where to start a normal discussion. We live totally separate lives. Outsiders don't see it. In Israel there are different spaces for Jews and Arabs. The problem is the vast majority of elites, and not just political but economic and intellectual ones, define themselves as being part of a Jewish democracy and concentrate all their thinking on the rights of the Jews. Non-Jews, be they Christian or Muslim, are excluded from any serious decision-making process in their lives."

      That goes for the Israeli left as well as right. As a member of the Tel Aviv-Jaffa municipal council, Shehadeh tried to persuade Yaël Dayan, the leftwing head of the coalition in charge of the council, to divide Tel Aviv-Jaffa into quarters, like any other big city. Maybe it is better for the Arabs of Jaffa if we keep on running things for them, he was told.

      "The only thing the world knows about Jaffa is oranges," says Shehadeh. "I am not an orange. [Benjamin] Netanyahu, when he was finance minister, called people like me a demographic timebomb. How can I explain to my children that they are a bomb?"

      The discrimination suffered by his community is extensively documented. Half live below the poverty line, 48% can not build a house for the next 15 years because there no permits or plans. Only 19% of Arab women with Israeli citizenship are in a job, compared with 65% of Jewish women.

      But the terrain of their changing identity and allegiance is not so well mapped. Israel demands expressions of loyalty from them. Loyalty to what, they ask. A democracy or a supremacist state?"

    • Zionism as a liberal democratic project is already dead.

      Is this senior Ziobot a democrat ?
      link to

      Is the war criminal under discussion here a liberal ?
      link to

  • Showdown in Hebron: Netanyahu steps in to protect illegal settlers facing military eviction orders
    • "Israel apparently follows the rule of law"


      You should watch this video. A guy from Coney Island discusses the attitude of Israel to international law on Danish TV .

      link to

    • I have never been to a city where the hatred is so open.

      Hebron is like the logical end point of Zionism. You take your religious fervour and your military superiority and your money and your American political cover and you attempt to "redeem the land"(whatever that means ) and in the process you turn your back on the moral basis of your belief system, the religion that is supposedly driving the process. And what was the point again ?

    • Jewish settlers don't look good on TV. Especially the Hebron Jews.
      Israel has a PR challenge. Zionism is harder to sell than a yeast infection and it needs the brownie points.

  • Video: Israeli military violently evicts Palestinians, internationals from Hebron house
  • Iowa. New Hampshire. Yad Vashem
    • Yad Vashem is built on the land of the destroyed Palestinian village of Ein Kerem . It is the wrong place for a Holocaust museum. " Never again" rings very hollow at Yad Vashem

  • Activists post mock eviction notices in campus dorms to highlight Israeli home demolition policy
    • "While Hillel supports free speech and champions civil discourse on campus we will not sit idly by when Israel is singled out, delegitimized and demonized. "

      link to

      "The Land of Israel, S.Y. Agnon wrote, is bought with suffering. And all those for whom the Land of Israel is dear and who accept the suffering with love, will have the privilege of seeing it built, he said. And may it come to pass that you, too, my children and grandchildren in Migron, as well as your friends who accept the suffering with sacrifice and love, will have the privilege of seeing it, soon and in our days, in its full splendor and glory.

      The goys don't like home demolitions. It is all part of g-d's plan. Or else a mitzvah.

  • Flabby Zionism
    • I had a long chat with my Israeli colleague at lunch the other day. He was talking about the holiday he's taking this week in "the Judean Desert" which is in "Judea and Samaria". And then he brought up Iran and all the talking points. I asked him if it would make any difference if Iran had nuclear bombs. Did they make Israel any safer? He said that when Israel has its back to the wall and the enemies are massing only the bomb has credibility. It was also the bomb that enabled the settlement project to flourish. It is no substitute for diplomacy and bridge building. But they chose the bomb, didn't they ? All the while listening to the words of Ben Gurion/Gruen - it doesn't matter what the goys say, just what the Jews do.
      And here we are in 2012.
      Israel is in a real hole.

    • In the sense that it has a large concentration of Jews and Saturday is the day the shops are closed and Passover is an official holiday (along with Eid etc) .

    • Have nuclear bombs made Israelis feel more secure or have they ratcheted up the paranoia ?

    • "But they could not understand their dilemma, because their story was too unique to themselves and for the greater world to comprehend."

      And because they wrapped g-d around the whole mess and nobody stopped them. 1967 will be seen as the turning point. Messianism and the fetish for the land were the catalysts .

    • "I believe in the notion of a Jewish and democratic state"

      It would be a nice thing.

      I'd like to see a Jewish state of the future run on the basis of the rule of law and equality for all its citizens, where everyone within the borders were granted citizenship.

  • The Israel/Palestine conflict will be resolved when Arab countries kick the U.S. out of the region
    • Fred

      What are you going to do when the 17 oligarchs decide to ditch the Jewish state and accept citizenship and full rights for all the Palestinians in return for guaranteed access to the markets of the Arab League?

    • "Turkey has come out from under US tutelage and has embarked upon an independent foreign policy which includes a break with Israel and enhanced support for the Palestinians"

      Turkey has just cut imports of Iranian oil by 20% as requested by Hillary.

      As long as the middle East supplies oil to the West the US will meddle. I think Israel will collapse before the oil runs out.

      Private Eye magazine had an amazing report on what is going on at New International, Murdoch's company, since the tables turned on them last year. They were a secretive cabal a bit like the Zionists and had access to the highest levels of power like the Zionists and were untouchable like the Zionists.

      Will Lewis is a senior NI manager who is now turning in his own journalists to the police. 2 senior journalists have attempted suicide.

      One day the Feds are going to walk all over the Ziobots. They'll see collaboration from the other side.

  • In pictures: Gaza welcomes Hana Shalabi
    • Sending her to Gaza is a disgrace.

      link to

      "Today, Hana al-Shalabi, who spent 43 days on hunger strike to protest her detention without charge or trial by Israel, was banished to the Gaza Strip for three years, under a highly controversial deal that Addameer and Physicians for Human Rights- Israel have said is illegal under international law, particularly the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949.

      In the course of this appalling act, Israeli occupation forces used Twitter to commit an additional breach of international law and Hana al-Shalabi’s rights."

  • Former State Dep't official says Obama calls for human rights and democracy are 'undercut' by position on Palestinians
  • Marwan Barghouti calls for popular uprising for statehood. Israel puts him in solitary confinement
    • That's just for your stuff, Fred.

      I go direct to hasbara central. No need to have you as the middleman.

    • If the PA police went back to barracks life would become very difficult for the settlers especially beyond the wall. They pretend they live in the West Bank like they would anywhere else but they are quite vulnerable and the Israeli Army can't cover their every landgrabbing move.

    • I won't bother opening Fredblogs but otherwise it's not progress.

    • The Palestinians bombed Israel with white phosphorous in 2008.
      Since 1967 any Israeli who was outside the country has not been allowed back by the Palestinians.
      In 1982 18,000 Israelis were murdered when the Palestinians invaded with the Lebanese army and Tel Aviv was destroyed.

      All the Israelis have is slingshots.

    • The Hamas charter is a document. Israeli brutality is tangible, literally in your face. Israelis delude themselves with notions such as greeting each other with the word "Shalom" and dud phrases such as "Israel wants peace."

      Zionism is set permanently to war and conquest.

      I like the contrast between Barghouti's v sign and the symbolism of the Jewish menorah hanging above the judge. The ziobots appropriated the SYMBOLS of the religion but none of its VALUES which is why Barghouthi will win eventually

    • Gilad

      You should read up on what happened to South Africa in the 1980s.
      Open economies where chosen people enjoy high standards of material comfort cannot run apartheid systems.

    • There is absolutely no point in talking to Israel. Bad faith doesn't even begin to describe the DNA of Zionism.

      It would be better to declare that Palestinians want Eretz Israeli citizenship and are prepared to go to the UN to get it.

  • My spirit is American (a religious manifesto)
    • That's a good list

    • Keith- I think American exceptionalism is a crock. It's different to Zionism but the has the same "chosen people" feel to it.

      Like the attitude of the Americans who invaded Afghanistan. They would have been better off staying at home, frankly. Sometimes your can- do attitude can't.

    • It's Gaelic for "would be a janitor supervisor in any other country "

    • I think Israelis * do have genuine fears about assimilation and loss of identity and it's not going to be enough to say "hey look at the US" . It's going to have to be more nuanced.

      Leading Israeli intellectual Danny Danon mentions the assimilation point several times in this interview and he probably speaks for a lot of less educated Israelis.

      link to

      *Jewish Israelis. The Palestinian Israelis are cool on who they are and where they come from and the future and identity and felafel etc

    • “Israel is surrounded by enemies”

      Israel is surrounded by walls and barbed wire and marinated in fear.

      "I had heard somewhere along the line that the Palestinians were supposed to be my enemy. They are not my enemy. "

      link to

    • The US has this grand nation thing that doesn't really work. I think shared humanity trumps nationalist myth every time.

      What are American values anyway ( other than plutocracy ) ? Low taxes. No to universal healthcare. The right to bear arms. Blind optimism.
      Zero growth in median income over the last 30 years. What values drove that?

      Of course there's good stuff too but the US needs to take a good look at itself. Some of the humility of the smaller nations would go a long way.

      Zbig got it right, I think

      “He then lampoons the standard American candidate’s response to any talk of decline, which is simply to assert that America’s greatness will return if only people would believe in it. “ ‘Help is here. Smile a lot. Everything will disappear. It will be fine’ – well, sad to say, it doesn’t work that way. People are ignorant and scared. It will take more than that.””

  • More on the Barghouti attack at Qalandiya on Friday
    • 2 musta'arbin were captured in Ramallah in 2000 and didn't survive the experience. It's a very risky business.

      The West Bank is one of the only places left where Israel can try to control the story and even that is becoming a challenge. I'm sure the Barghouti spin is enough to convince most dumb Israelis - it fits into the narrative of the bloodthirsty Palestinians- but it doesn't help Israel one jot in terms of extricating the country from the deep hole it now finds itself in.

  • Those who criticize Israel join campaign to 'slaughter the Jews en masse'
    • They go too far and they will end up being seen for what they are - shameless opportunists. Most people around the world are moderate and expect fairness and Israel is unable to meet this most basic of conditions.

    • Agreed. The Zionists got the best part of a century to sort out the Palestinian issue and they never even attempted it. Now the worm is turning and I look forward to their wallowing in the sludge of their own making. On the global scale they are a fringe group. A hypocrisy, not a democracy.

    • 'As a result of this campaign – which is antisemitic by any definition – any and all criticism of Israel not only can be but must be antisemitic"

      Here's a good example of criticism of Israel from Israeli TV.

      Great to see the conversation starting

      link to

      Is this antisemitism? Or is it plain common sense ?

  • Sullivan forces American attention on the settlements
    • I was thinking of buying this book and comparing the teachings of a genuine legend and Jewish superstar to the miserable small minded bigotry and wanton cruelty of the world's only Jewish state.

      link to

    • I thought they meant G-d

      but He seems to be very capricious

    • Julius Streicher's last words were "Heil Hitler! this is the Purim festival of 1946".

      What a bastard.

      He was cremated and his ashes were scattered into a ditch in Bayern and his name was entered in the records as Abraham Goldberg.

      (After the Reich, P 450)

    • The persecution memes go real deep

      link to

      Zionism was supposed to be about escaping from the shtetl....

    • Annie

      Very interesting clip from the Israeli version of the reality show Big Brother - it might be worth its own thread

      Saar Szekely spells out what the occupation is :

      link to

    • But Annie, West Jerusalem is cool. It has a gay pride parade.
      And marketing gay pride is much more important than Orthodox women's rights, right ?
      It's a PR mitzvah. Probably.

    • Tel

      Israel's meltdown is like good bordeaux. It's all about patience.
      Stay here and we can watch it together.

      South Tel Aviv isn't rich. Most of Israel isn't.

      link to

      "Adi Peled, a 30-year-old activist from Ness Ziona, moved to Rothschild Boulevard three days after the first tents went up. She now lives in tent number 13 and occasionally helps out at the communal food stall, which is constantly replenished by donations from supportive restaurant owners.

      “I am a teacher but with my salary I cannot even finish the month without going into debt,” she says. “My friends and I have been talking about this for years. The system is not working for us. It is not just about housing but also about taxes, which are very high; it is about gasoline, which is very expensive and about the cost of food.”

      Ms Peled’s complaints are echoed up and down the boulevard. “Our parents and grandparents used to live in a welfare state. They have pensions, they have everything. But they have crushed the welfare state,” says Yaniv Sharon, a 36-year-old protester. “People are now saying that they cannot even afford to bring a child into the world.”"

      But never mind, eh? At least the settlers have everything they want. And that's a mitzvah.

    • Thomson

      I think the general breakdown in authority/discipline/respect for institutions that have resulted from the post Lehman financial crisis is linked to this as well. So many institutions have been shown up for paper tigers run /run into the ground by know nothings and Israel is no different .

    • I was impressed by the cheap vodka, the absence of Palestinians, the religiousness of the taxi drivers I met and the shoddiness of the architecture.

    • Tel

      Take a sherut to South Tel Aviv and count the number of Prada boutiques.

    • The link must be made (by the side that believes in justice) between insane American support for Israel and what is actually happening to the american middle class in real time .

      link to

      "First, the great American middle class is in long-term crisis. Most people cannot get secure, well-paid jobs any longer. The top 1 per cent captured 93 per cent of the income gains in 2010. The remaining 99 per cent were either treading water or seeing falling incomes. This includes those with an undergraduate or vocational degree, whose incomes have not budged in real terms since 2001. Only postgraduates and those with PhDs have seen income growth since then. Income mobility, once America’s greatest exception, is now wallowing at sub-European levels.

      America now boasts of an unmatched plutocracy – or what one observer dubbed a “plutonomy”, given the growing role billionaires play in politics. Below them is an increasingly large floating world of the former and semi-middle class, who have lost the security their parents once had. Concern about a permanently divided America is not confined to the left, or the centre. Charles Murray, the conservative commentator, talks about a new “cognitive elite” that lives in “SuperZips” (the richest zip codes) far removed in sight and habit from those less fortunate. People on all sides of the spectrum admit that America’s egalitarian creed looks increasingly hollow. “America is a society that is starting to belie its promise as a land of equal opportunity in which the place you were born was not as important as the talents you were born with,” says Lawrence Katz."

      Israel is a complete waste of time

  • 'Judaizing' Beit Hanina in East Jerusalem, with backing from Americans
    • Occupied Palestine is the only real estate market in the world where purchase by a Jew involves transfer of political sovereignty.
      Jews buy property all the time in Chiacgo but the land doesn't thereafter become part of Israel like it does in the OPT.

      Zionism is nuts.

  • Head of Bill Kristol's lobby group calls on Israeli army to use Palestinian protesters as 'target practice'
    • One day the tables will be turned and Israel will scream for the Geneva conventions and the UNDHR to be implemented. As they should always be, bien sur.

  • UPDATE: Mustafa Barghouti stable after being struck in head at Qalandiya; Palestinian protester reports Barghouti attacked by fellow protesters
    • "Apparently, Mr. Bargouti was beaten by fellow Palestinian protestors and not shot with a tear gas canister. Nor was he beaten by IDF provocateurs"

      Yes. And the flotilla last year was full of murderers. And Barak made a generous offer at Camp David. And Israel wants peace.

    • Interesting, even fascinating, Haaretz piece on Zionist paranoia

      link to

      "Professional (Jewish Israeli) politicians know the watch-words and dog-whistles, have an instinctive feel for the tone and inflection that enable them to channel all the terror of survival, persecution, and the fear of assimilation and loss of identity."

      Smearing Barghouti is just the machine at work. The Palestinians must be presented as evil and barbarian. They are the enemy . Just in case you didn't get that here it is in marketing language

      link to
      "These beautiful and meaningful gifts were painstakingly sculpted from metal recovered from actual Kassam rockets fired into Israel by our enemies"

      How many Israeli Jews have the balls to stand up and say 'I will not be afraid. The Palestinians are not my enemy" ?

    • What percentage of Israeli Jews serve in the IDF? How many Israeli Jews have killed Arabs ?
      Israel has a chronic addiction to violence. Remember too that domestic abuse rates are far higher in Israel than in Continental Europe.
      And the biggest fear of Israel is Palestinian non violence.

    • What would you expect from an IDF spokesperson? Integrity?

    • More checkpoint lowlives

      link to

  • Live updates from the Global March to Jerusalem and Land Day protests
    • I told her something that I had been thinking and scared to say for a long while: that the Jerusalem of my dreams, the Jerusalem where heaven and earth kiss, the Jerusalem of my father’s childhood, is finally dead. . .

      Who killed it ? The Pandora's box of violence and hatred unleashed by Zionism has turned in on the ideology. Poor Jerusalem. It never deserved Zionism.

  • Land Day in posters: a retrospective of the 1980s
  • ‏The story of the land
    • I think Israeli Jews are the least free, actually. The Palestinians are not afraid like they are.

    • "I remember that Palestine is bigger than Gaza. Palestine is the West Bank; Palestine is Ramallah; Palestine is Nablus; Palestine is Jenin; Palestine is Tulkarm; Palestine is Bethlehem; Palestine, most importantly, is Jaffa and Haifa and Akka and all those cities that Israel wants us to forget about"


      Palestine has been brutalised for many years but it's still there under all the concrete

      I like this video. It gets the point across very discreetly

      link to

  • Land Day vs. the 'Jewish State': an interview with Haneen Zoabi
    • "There definitely is a Jewish nationality and Zionism is a manifestation of it."

      This where it gets very messy. If there is a Jewish nationality of which Zionism is the manifestation then Jewish=Zionist=Israeli
      Which simplifies to Jewish=Israeli
      Which reduces further to My mother = drunk or sober

    • "To struggle for democracy in Israel is to struggle against Zionism. And this is what unifies our struggle with the wider Palestinian struggle. Racism, Oppression, Judaisation, Apartheid and Undemocracy inside Israel; Apartheid, Occupation, Oppression, and Judaisation in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip; and the denial of the right of return -- all of these mechanisms of control serve the same ideological project: Zionism."

      And Zionism is nuts

      This wonderful Palestinian nails it from 6:30 on

      link to

      Only those who live and THINK CRITICALLY inside the Zionist state can really understand how absurd it all is

  • Bradley Burston dips his toes in one-state water
    • "since political choices are made based on alternative options, and right now the alternatives are more expensive, more painful, and more dangerous"

      The ultimate meltdown will be irreversible. Ask Dick Fuld.

    • He agrees that Israel, if left to its druthers, will probably choose to continue the status quo of “temporary” occupation, which he recognizes is profoundly immoral.

      As well as ruinous.
      Shir Hever calculated that the occupation cost Israel 381 bn shekels to 2008. That's 100bn USD.

    • "There is no denying, however, that settlement construction, Palestinian disunity, and other factors are fast rendering the two-state concept impracticable."

      Like it makes any difference what the Palestinians do. If the front benches of Fatah and Hamas were all dressed up in tutus singing "the border police will stick a log up my ***" (I saw that video recently) it wouldn't change anything. Israel is driven by a deeper force of unreason .

  • The Global March to Jerusalem, a brave and admirable attempt to awaken the world’s conscience
    • There was an article in the FT back in August about the protests over rent and there was one piece in it that said more about Israel than any hasbara could.

      link to

      "No public space in Israel quite matches the elegance and history of Rothschild Boulevard in central Tel Aviv.
      Shaded by four rows of mature trees and dotted with small coffee bars, the avenue is flanked by a unique collection of early modernist buildings. The boulevard’s Zionist credentials are unsurpassed: it was at number 16 that David Ben-Gurion proclaimed the Israeli state in May 1948".

      No public space to match the elegance of some street in Tel Aviv. That says it all . That is how deep the roots of Jewish architecture are in Israel. 1904.

      Jerusalem is incomparable and the crowning glory is the Haram Ash Sharif.
      It's the equivalent of the Taj Mahal.

    • Godspeed to the GMJ.

      Israel must be saved from itself.

  • Another two-stater goes one-state
    • They just want the land, Fred. Erez Israel. The shining covenant with g-d. Or something. They'll do anything to get their hands on it. Even sell their souls to the devil. He got a good deal.

  • Wear your support for Israel on your sleeve. And your head, and your coffee mug, and . . .
    • Presumably all the crap - the pens, the t-shirts etc- is made in China

    • Possibly better :

      Israeli jewellery made from Kassam rockets !!

      "These beautiful and meaningful gifts were painstakingly sculpted from metal recovered from actual Kassam rockets fired into Israel by our enemies.
      An Israeli sculptor in southern Israel who has personally witnessed the destruction caused by rockets raining down on Jewish communities from the nearby Gaza strip has decided to make beauty from the ugliness, and has begun making unforgettable works of art out of the metal bodies of the kassam rockets."

      link to

      Note the "Israel" pendants depict Erez Israel which includes Gaza and the West Bank.

  • There are two liberation movements
    • "If JVP is wasting its time – and perhaps it is – what are you doing here at Mondoweiss? At least they are out there."

      Very patronising, Bruce. I'm like Dan. I have an interesting job too and I like the Mondo comments. Over the last 2 years I have come to the realisation that Israel is headed for the cliff. The sociopaths in charge don't listen to well meaning but powerless groups such as JVP.

      The only Israelis who can see what's coming are way off the radar- people like Gurvitz and Shir Hever. All even remotely relevant institutions in Israeli society have been co-opted by the settler-IDF -government - machine . There is no alternative power structure in waiting.

  • How to win friends and influence people -- to bomb Iran
    • Even if they grab Area C, so what? What would be the difference? Palestinians can't build there anyway. And the people ?

      Say Israel is separated and hates his ex wife. He decides to sequester her house. She still lives there. What has Israel achieved ?

      They seem to have this mystical belief that the land is theirs and it is happily ever after.

      This is typical settler garbage

      link to

      "The Land of Israel, S.Y. Agnon wrote, is bought with suffering. And all those for whom the Land of Israel is dear and who accept the suffering with love, will have the privilege of seeing it built, he said. And may it come to pass that you, too, my children and grandchildren in Migron, as well as your friends who accept the suffering with sacrifice and love, will have the privilege of seeing it, soon and in our days, in its full splendor and glory."

      The land is going to kick them in the ass.

    • "Defense Department would be seeking more money to help Israel fund the Iron Dome antimissile defense system. "

      They are building walls to surround the entire country

      Isolation. Where is the nearest ally? 500 miles away?

      Everyone is going to hate them and they are getting ready for it

      link to

      It goes back to the days of the yishuv

      link to

      It would be really funny if Rev Nachman of Brasov could come back and see what a mess his people have made of the holy land. I'm sure he'd laugh at their ineptitude.

    • I agreee. The Azeris are stupid if they help Israel attack Iran.
      And something like 20% of Iranians are Azeri.

    • "From the perspective of the Israeli leadership, this might be seen as a worse outcome even than a failed attack. At that moment, the rational choice for Israeli leadership would be to attack. "

      Israel needs to talk to a therapist. Has it been sleeping well recently ? Is there any stress at work?

      The Iran situation is fascinating Israel's big bad wolf schtick doesn't seem to be effective. First time ever.

  • Wrong planet
    • The problem, Woody, is that there are 4 separate education systems in Israel and the state has no control over what is taught in the more radical yeshivas. There is no licensing of rabbis, no central control. In Turkey all sunni mosques and all friday sermons are regulated by a powerful ministry but Israel is a free for all.

      You know from the US how relatively easy it is to put forward anti science as logic. The Israeli case with the settler rabbis is potentially more dangerous.

      There is an ideology with religious backup that serves the needs of the state
      and gets people to behave in a certain fashion

      link to

      This article is very informative.

      link to

      Malcolm X once asked "who taught you to hate..?"
      To what extent is the manufacture of hatred in the West Bank contracted out to the yeshivas ?

    • I don't think this is of any relevance to secular Jews and frankly it is of no relevance what Jews were taught 400 years ago but I think the type of crap they teach the kids in the yeshivas in the West Bank is very dodgy and I wouldn't be surprised if they went way off the wall in the manner of the rabbi above.
      Yossi Gurvitz implied as much in his famous cafe interview with Mr Weiss.

    • "The wars of Israel […] are mitzvah wars"

      That's BS. Take religion out of war. It doesn't belong there. Otherwise it becomes Jewish Jihad.
      Most of these rabbis who supply the occupation with the moral signoff are way out of their depth.

      Meanwhile increasing numbers of Ultra orthodox don't want to sit beside women on El Al flights. Israel is really turning out nice .

      link to

  • Sen. Cardin tells how he and Hillary Clinton muscled foreign ambassadors to block 'anti-American' Palestinian statehood
    • Mayhem

      Israel has built up off balance sheet liabilities to the Palestinians in excess of USD 100 bn via the occupation. Israel can't afford any of it. The only reason it's off balance sheet is because the Ziobots have bought Congress. Take away blind US support and see what happens to Israel.

    • "All the american zionists, both jew and christian, will have their day of reckoning. "

      Sah !

      The wall around the shtetl is almost complete.

      link to

      Walls don't work . They can't keep out ideas. Or hope.

    • "The deal was done 30 years before Truman."

      Balfour started the process but it's an insult to the many Zionists who lobbied away for 30 years to 1947 to imply the deal was done. Zionism has always been about back doors and back stabbing.

      Zionism still needs the dark arts.

    • Israel is a jerrymandered garrison at the end of a very long supply chain that is slowly turning its back on its key allies.

    • Clinton, Cardin, Obama,Romney, Santorum, Gingrich

    • "Every time that Ambassador was in my office I talked a little about the UN vote. They understood, they got the message. They need the US support. Well we need their help also. And Bosnia was not going to be a vote on behalf of the Palestinians. We changed the Security Council votes. We made a difference. "

      It was the same in 1947 before the vote that gave Palestine to the Zionists. Deals with Zionist Jews behind closed doors. Israel has always been dependent on raw American power. As long as America controls the Middle East there will be a Jewish Sparta. But how many more years does the US have ?

      The problem with Israel is that it takes too much work. It is a totally artificial state that is unable to fend for itself. Senate support is only good while it lasts. It remains to be seen how smart it is to build a regional empire on the back of the capricious political force of a third party.

      Israel is building up dreadful off balance sheet liabilities while the US Senate delivers it 100-0 votes.

  • 'We must expel Arabs and take their place': Institute for Palestine Studies publishes 1937 Ben-Gurion letter advocating the expulsion of Palestinians
    • I presume that they thought the Palestinians would give up in the face of such Jewish power and savoir faire. But what were they actually thinking ? Did they expect the Palestinians to convert to Judaism ?
      Whatever, they didn't anticipate an Erez Israel that was 50% Palestinian( drinking qahwa mazbootah instead of Nescafe) 3 generations later. Model risk is such a bitch.

    • "We shall build a multi-faceted Jewish economy-- agricultural, industrial, and maritime. "

      They didn't succeed. Instead they built a consumer economy that imports 97% of its energy needs abd depends on Europe to buy its exports. Israel is not sustainable.

      "We shall organize an advanced defense force—a superior army which I have no doubt will be one of the best armies in the world. "

      What did they do with it? YESHA. They would have been better off losing a war.

      "At that point I am confident that we would not fail in settling in the remaining parts of the country, through agreement and understanding with our Arab neighbors, or through some other means."

      That sort of thinking was fine in the 1930s. But it's 2012 now and the world has changed . Israel is still operating as if it were the 1930s .Think of all that Israelis have lost in the last 3 years to keep the occupation going. Imagine how hollowed out Israeli civil society will be by 2022. The consumer economy is a fragile beast too.

  • Sullivan unmasks Goldberg as a propagandist for Netanyahu's 'lies, bluffs and deceptions' aimed at getting us into war
  • Sen. Rand Paul blocks Iran sanctions bill, calls for 'thoughtful debate' before we start another war
    • Robert Byrd to the Senate in 2003

      link to

      Ron Paul in 2003

      link to

      And now it's 2012 and it's the same neocon clowns selling the same horseshit about Iran. They didn't listen to Byrd or to Paul . They should have.

      Over 5000 American military familes would still have fathers.

  • Ethnocentrism and journalism (Beinart's double standard for Israel and Iraq)
    • Mooser

      The "Jewish community" from what I can see comprises

      People who repeat hasbara points at seder
      Anyone who ever went to AIPAC
      All the senior management of Jewish Philly and similar organisations
      Anyone who ever gave money to the JNF
      People who contribute to NGOs that have a Z in the title
      Birthright wrongers
      Jewish sociopaths
      The British board of deputies etc
      whoever wrote the Torah and stood at Masada
      Jews who always did what they were told to do and were a credit to their parents
      Those with common sense
      All those Jews who ever lost their virginity in a log cabin

      It does not appear to include slackers, self hating Jews, awkward Hebrews, left wing Israeli activists, those without power/ambition/drive/an inflated sense of self worth or anyone thinking seriously about where Israel is headed

      the strength of the community will be tested shortly.

    • Mine got dropped too, Mooser, but they seem to have been resurrected in the meantime

    • "One reason I admire Beinart is he is a reflective man who has done penance for his Iraq mistake."

      I think that's the height of arrogance. Were the mothers of Fallujah consulted for this forgiveness thing ?

      Beinart and the rest of the cheerleaders smoothed the way for a war that drove 2 million of its citizens into exile, broke a proud nation and killed countless of its people. Countless cos you didn't count . It was beneath the US cos it was just Brown people. Muslims mostly.

      The formerly bourgeois Iraqi women who were forced to turn to prostitution in places like Amman and Damascus to feed their families can't do anything with a mea culpa from some clown like Beinart. The only possible even remotely plausible gesture of respect would be to ensure this never happens again. I don't see Beinart stopping the war machine against Iran.

      Beinart will take the support of the war to his grave. Plus I don't see how anyone who wanted war can be taken seriously on any matter pertaining to the Middle East.

  • Sfard on Israeli Supreme Court ruling on Migron outpost: ‘It’s Our Brown v. Board’
    • Hostage

      Do you think the settlers will respect the decision of the supreme court? Did Zionism ever respect the authority of any court over its fetish for the land ?

    • The settlers have captured the Israeli state . They will proceed to take down the judiciary.

    • I don't think they will either. Israel is not ready to take out the settlers. It expects the Palestinians to give up. That is Plans A through to Z. History is full of compromises broken by power.

  • JNF launches new 'bluewashing' website - PositivelyIsrael
    • The world is a mess.

      The girl in the first picture knows that its much better not to have olive seedlings since they are antisemitic and may lead to land dispossession.

      The old lady in the second picture is smiling because since her farm was never mentioned in the Torah she can't be ethnically cleansed by the Ziobots.

  • US 'understands' Israel's decision to cut ties with UN Human Rights Council
    • Gosh. The ideological insistence on supporting YESHA over its own strategic and diplomatic interests does more for Israeli delegitimisation than anything the Khamas or the Khezbollah could ever dream of.

  • Bloomberg warns BDS will lead to 'massacres' as Park Slope Co-op holds initial vote on boycott tonight
    • "I think it has nothing to do with the food,” Mayor Bloomberg said of the boycott. “The issue is there are people who want Israel to be torn apart and everybody to be massacred, and America is not going to let that happen.”"

      In 1965 49 people were arrested somewhere in the US for a protest against Chase Manhattan Bank lending money to South Africa.
      In 1990 Apartheid fell.

      Israel isn't at 1965 yet but it should be
      BS like if Israel recognises the rights of Palestinians everyone will die is no different to what the white in SA were saying in 1965.

  • Israeli diplomat chased out of Morocco after mass protest
  • Hundreds of soccer fans crowd Jerusalem mall: 'Death to Arabs!'
  • 'Safe European home'?

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