100 Most Recent Comments


amigo
October 22, 2014, 7:03 am

“I don’t think you can claim the trauma excuse for the IDF.” American

I believe Seafoid was referring to the Trauma that the GOI feeds it,s population and hence the idf get,s away with this brutality.

Trauma leads to victimhood = security concerns = anything goes.

seafoid
October 22, 2014, 6:13 am

The Zionists were naïve. They thought they could escape their history by replanting the land and clearing the locals. As if.
It may have worked during the day but the demons came back in the night. Local djinns and European trauma.
The djinns are still winning.

seafoid
October 22, 2014, 6:11 am

I’m not Jewish. I was not chosen.
But I have been to Erez Israel many times and I find the experience depressing.
Israel is a basket case and a prisoner of the memes of Zionism.

Pixel
October 22, 2014, 5:21 am

.

85, eh?

.

You don’t say.

seafoid
October 22, 2014, 4:16 am

This opera is the dog’s bollocks and it is toxic to the memes of Zionism.

seafoid
October 22, 2014, 3:22 am

“Spodek had us read aloud a sheet called a “covenant for communicating” that urged us not to interrupt or slander but respect difference of opinion and that surely reflects apprehension about battles that have raged inside Jewish congregations over the conflict. -”

Just wait , Hophmi, and the Jewish community will find a solution. Sure it will.
And it’ll take a few more mows of the lawn in Gaza to get to Shangri La.

You should take a step out of your bubble to see what Israel looks like from Galut.
It’s a PTSD society . And while those feelings may be real they are not politically valid any longer. Because it’s never about exclusive Jewish suffering while Palestinians are being persecuted.

Accentitude
October 22, 2014, 3:10 am

“I am Jewish, have been to Israel/Palestine many times”

It’s usually bad news if you need to start your comment with a statement like this to justify what you said. It’s akin to saying “I’m not racist, I have black friends.” It’s not going to help your argument at all. It’s ironic you had to do that by saying you’ve met a handful of Arabs. Oh my God, now I really believe you don’t hate us b/c you’ve actually met Salam Fayyad, an anonymous member of Hamas and some generic “peacemakers.” Next time just say what you mean: “I’m not racist, I’ve actually met and spoken to Arabs.” It won’t work to your benefit but at least we’ll know where you stand without having to put in some effort.

RoHa
October 22, 2014, 3:00 am

“books which were once banned are now being taught in collage courses. ”

Not read, but glued to a baseboard.

Accentitude
October 22, 2014, 3:00 am

The Second Intifada changed the ability of many Israelis to believe that peace was actually possible at least in the short run and required the creation of a Security Wall to separate the populations and eliminate the access of terrorists to Israeli cities.

Sure, take a look at the route of the Israeli wall and tell me again that it’s purpose is to “eliminate the access of terrorists to Israeli cities.” You’re either a liar, very naive, or you think that West Bank settlements constitute “Israeli cities.”

Accentitude
October 22, 2014, 2:55 am

If there was no occupation, there would be no Hamas and there would be no conflict with Hezbollah. Assad as was not a threat to you but rather you were to him and continue to be as long as you illegally occupy Syrian Land. Yes, the Golan is not Israel. It never was, it never will be. Erdogan has a llegitimate gripe with you because you murdered his citizens in international water and like the stubborn arrogant warmonger you are, you’ve refused to apologize for your crimes. The Ayatollahs have never attacked you except in words. Yet you have attacked and bombed their country on several occasions; attacks which are clearly an act of war. What was the reason? That they have nuclear capabilities? Ah that’s right. So it’s not OK for brown Persians to have nuclear capabilities but it is OK for White European colonists in Palestine to have them. I see.

As for Israel, it did indeed a colonialist “nation” of illegal immigrants who’ve forcefully expelled the indigenous Arab population. There is no denying that. The evidence is quite crystal clear. Killing children? Indeed. Land theft? Indeed. Ethnic Cleansing? Absolutely and originally perpetrated by the Haganah, the Stern Gang, the Irgun…all whom have been pulled together and reintroduced as the “most moral army in the world.” Moral indeed. The fact is that Israel is an Apartheid State whether you choose to accept it or not. It has all the characteristics of an apartheid state and then some. It is a morally bankrupt, ethnocracy poorly disguised as a faux “western democracy.”

The lot you’ve listed in your post all have gripes with Israel as a result if Israel’s own doing. It has brought upon itself it’s enemies and it is indeed the only one to blame.

seafoid
October 22, 2014, 1:03 am

Let’s go there, Yonah.

Jewish WW2 trauma is at the heart of Ashkenazi behavior towards the Palestinians. Sephardim such as Danon adopted it to gain power in Israel.

Israelis are like people anywhere- most don’t think and do what they are told. But for the ones with insight, the ones who feel, there were people in 1948 who saw what was happening, who thought that the whole project was a crock of shit. I think his mother was one of them. The ones who saw beyond the frenzied nation building energy and knew it would never make up for what was lost.

Look at it now. A complete emotional mess.

And killing Gazan kids will never compensate for what the Nazis did in Vilna.

Philip Munger
October 22, 2014, 12:52 am

But Klingoffer isn’t about Jesus, Muhammad, Moses, Abraham, Isaac, Isaiah or any other so-called prophet. It is about the dynamics between expansionist Zionism vs. the Nakba, as played out in this sordid episode aboard a cruise ship.

Some Jews apparently see the victimization of a Jew to be something that is theirs exclusively, and others dare not lay even the slightest claim to it.

You are right about that. My 2003 setting of Psalm 137 was criticized as anti-Semitic, because: 1) it is a sacred, imprecatory Psalm, and Jews own it (which is absurd); and 2) because I used the powerful. closing lines to refer to the plight of Palestinians as victims of Israeli aggressive acts, as inspired by ultra Zionist rabbis and polemicists:

Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones.

irishmoses
October 22, 2014, 12:42 am

Great piece Phil.

After I read Shavit’s book, I went to hear him speak at the Skirball Center in LA. His speech was bad enough, ignoring most of the controversial issues in the book. But the audience, mostly middle and upper class West Side Jews who likely fancy themselves as liberals, was disinterested and clueless. No one questioned Shavit about any of his controversial conclusions. Not one! It was a feel good gathering in a huge temple of Jewish accomplishment that was totally devoid of substance. Total waste of time.

Efforts at dialogue are little more than local versions of the negotiated solution approach to the conflict. They are immense time-wasters that allow the bad-acting party off the hook. What’s the point of sharing and “respecting” narratives when one is demonstrably devious and false?

The only way to solve this is through a rights-based legal approach. Israel needs to be hauled before legal bodies like the UN, the ICC and ICJ, and made to answer for its actions. Criminal actions aren’t resolved through negotiation between the victim and the perpetrator. A criminal court hears the evidence then makes a finding of guilt or innocence. The guilty get punished.
We need to get back on that track.

Jackdaw
October 22, 2014, 12:19 am

“.. murder of Leon Klinghoffer, a disabled American Jew, in 1985 by Palestinian militants. ”

You’re priceless, Phil.
Tell your readers the truth, that Palestinian terrorists pushed a wheelchair bound old Jew into the Mediterranian Sea from the deck of a hijacked cruise ship. Crippled old man and wheelchair.

JLewisDickerson
October 21, 2014, 11:34 pm

RE: ” ‘The Death of Klinghoffer’ is a contemporary opera, based on the 1985 murder of Leon Klinghoffer . . . According to The New York Times, some Jewish groups have criticized the work. I don’t fully understand why. Quite a few of the audience members were wearing yarmulkes.” ~ Claire Paddock

MY COMMENT: I suspect it is not completely dissimilar from the way some Muslims would object to an opera depicting Muḥammad (no matter how positively), and some Christians would object to an opera depicting Jesus (again, no matter how positively).
Some Jews apparently see the victimization of a Jew to be something that is theirs exclusively, and others dare not lay even the slightest claim to it.

JLewisDickerson
October 21, 2014, 11:06 pm

RE: “[EXCEPTS]“ ~ me (from above)

SHOULD HAVE BEEN: [EXCERPTS]

JLewisDickerson
October 21, 2014, 11:00 pm

RE: “The JDL is handing these out and organizing outside Lincoln Center.” ~ Blumenthal

REGARDING THE “MILITANT” JDL/JDO RECRUITING “JEWS WITH GUTS” TO “TRAIN IN SELF-DEFENSE”, NOTE THIS FROM WIKIPEDIA [Alex Odeh]:

[EXCEPTS] Alex Odeh (April 4, 1944 – October 11, 1985) was an Arab-American anti-discrimination activist who was killed in a bombing as he opened the door of his office at 1905 East 17th Street, Santa Ana, California. Odeh was west-coast regional director of the American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC).
Born into a Palestinian Christian family in Jifna, the West Bank, Odeh immigrated to the US in 1972.[1] He was a lecturer and poet who recently had published a volume of his poetry, “Whispers in Exile”.[2]…
. . . Irv Rubin, who had become chairman of the Jewish Defense League (JDL) the same year, immediately made several public statements in reaction to the incident. “I have no tears for Mr. Odeh,” Rubin said. “He got exactly what he deserved.”[7] . . .
. . . Four weeks after Odeh’s death, FBI spokesperson Lane Bonner stated the FBI attributed the bombing and two others to the JDL . . .
. . . Immediately after the 1985 assassination the FBI identified three suspects, all of them believed to be affiliated with the JDL, who fled to Israel. In 1987 it was revealed that Israel was hindering the FBI investigation. Floyd Clarke, then assistant director of the FBI, claimed in an internal memo that key suspects had fled to Israel and were living in the West Bank town of Kiryat Arba. . .
. . . In 2007, the FBI revealed they had received information from a deceased informant, believed to be former Jewish Defense League member Earl Krugel who had been sentenced to 20 years in federal prison for 2001 plots to bomb a Southern California mosque and office of an Arab American congressman. It is believed that Irv Rubin, who died in prison while awaiting trial on the same charges, revealed to Krugel the names of those responsible for Odeh’s death and Krugel shared those with the FBI before he, too, died in prison. The bombers are believed to be Manning and two individuals now living in Israel.[14] . . .

SOURCE – link to en.wikipedia.org

Walid
October 21, 2014, 10:46 pm

“lysias October 21, 2014, 6:54 pm I read someplace a few years ago that Abu Abbas was secretly working for Israel and that the attack on the Achille Lauro happened because the Israelis told Abu Abbas to have his people did something particularly outrageous –

I also read that and based on Mossad’s track record of false flag operations, this is highly plausible. After a 10-year battle in New York courts, the daughters settled on a secret compensation package with the PLO. The story from the Truthseeker UK site:

“What Really Happened
The hi-jacking of the Italian cruise ship the Achille Lauro by “Palestinian terrorists” was later reliably reported by former IDF arms dealer Ari Ben-Menashe in his 1992 book, Profits of War: Inside the Secret U.S.-Israeli Arms Network, to have been ordered and funded by Mossad.

Ben-Menashe revealed that Israeli intelligence organizations regularly engaged in “black operations,” espionage activity designed to portray Palestinians and others in the worst possible light. “An example,” wrote Ben-Menashe, “is the case of the ‘Palestinian’ attack on the cruise ship Achille Lauro in 1985. That was, in fact, an Israeli ‘black’ propaganda operation to show what a deadly, cutthroat bunch the Palestinians were. ” According to Ben-Menashe, Israeli spymasters arranged the attack through “Abu’l Abbas, who, to follow such orders was receiving millions from Israeli intelligence officers posing as Sicilian dons. Abbas . . . gathered a team to attack the cruise ship. The team was told to make it bad, to show the world what lay in store for other unsuspecting citizens if Palestinian demands were not met.

AppleFolsom
October 21, 2014, 10:38 pm

If the funding is going to a foreign nation for activities directly opposed to U.S. policy, why isn’t this considered financial support of terrorism?

link to law.cornell.edu

W.Jones
October 21, 2014, 10:24 pm

Wow people age a lot in 7 years. Wish I could take my 7 years back.

Kris
October 21, 2014, 10:15 pm

Maybe what you need, yonah, is an editor, so here goes:

“From ’72 to ’74 I attended a yeshiva (Jewish religious school) illegally built on land stolen from the Palestinians in the occupied West Bank. My nieces and nephews are U.S. citizens who have moved to Israel, and some live on occupied Palestinian land in violation of international law.

” I define Israel’s massacres of defenseless Palestinians trapped like fish in a barrel as “war,” though I know it’s not true. I’m really a liberal, Robert Kennedy, etc., but I can’t get beyond the prejudices I learned as a youth, so I support whatever Israel does.

Hamas, Palestinian rockets: bad. Palestinians would be better off if they didn’t try to defend themselves from Israel’s ethnic cleansing. Stuff happens, it’s complicated, whatever.”

JLewisDickerson
October 21, 2014, 10:10 pm

RE: “But voters who identify with the Romneys or whose moral and intellectual capacities resemble Sheldon Adelson’s or my former schoolmates’ are few in number. “ ~ Andrew Levine (from above)

MY COMMENT: Apparently Andrew Levine has not spent much time down here in Dixie!

yonah fredman
October 21, 2014, 10:05 pm

mooser- Rantisi is dead. But he was a jew hater. and maybe he just hated Jews or maybe he saw it as a means to an end. i think gilad atzmon fits into the category, although because he’s jewish that makes him a special case. i think dieudonne of france fits into the category, although again he might just hate jews and not view it as a means to an end.

JLewisDickerson
October 21, 2014, 9:57 pm

RE: “Almost invariably when I go into an organized Jewish space consisting of people my generation and older I run away with despair.” ~ Weiss

MY COMMENT: You’re not the only one!* And frankly, I’ve gotten so that I completely avoid “organized space(s)” of any type.

* SEE: Let Real Politics Resume; Enough Already!, by Andrew Levine, CounterPunch.org, October 31, 2012

[EXCERPTS] With the (likely) reelection of Barack Obama only a week off, do any Obama supporters have anything but lesser evil arguments to offer in his behalf?

The ever loyal Melissa Harris-Perry does. She wrote in The Nation (Nov. 5) that Obama’s reelection will be good for race relations, even if, as she more or less concedes, his “race neutral” policies are, at best, only indirectly helpful to victims of institutional racism. But apart from sophistries like hers, the answer is: no. Obama will likely win for one reason only: because Romney and the Republicans are (or seem) worse to more voters than vice versa. . .

. . . In addition, there are scattered pockets of Romney-boosters out on or beyond the fringe. I am especially peeved at the ones who overflow my junk mail box with semi-literate, racist harangues. It serves me right for going to my High School reunion only to find that some of the kids I used to know have turned into geriatric, islamophobic Zionists who like the fact that Romney and Benjamin Netanyahu, “king “of the ethnocrats, formed a close relationship years ago in Boston, while the two of them were learning the dark arts of vulture capitalism.

Those demented souls should be careful of what they wish for. If Romney really does believe the snake oil he professes, they and he will never quite see eye to eye on who the Chosen People are or, for that matter, on where the Promised Land is. But, as long as Romney tows the Likud line, they evidently don’t care.

After all, these are people who make common cause even with evangelicals who look forward to the end time – it should be here any day now! — when the Loving God will rededicate the Holy Land to the people of Israel, the better to smite those among them who refuse to accept Jesus Christ as their Savior.

But voters who identify with the Romneys or whose moral and intellectual capacities resemble Sheldon Adelson’s or my former schoolmates’ are few in number. The vast majority of Romney supporters hate Romney. They hate him for his Mormonism and for his supercilious ways. They hate him for the obvious contempt he has for them. But they support him because – for all the wrong reasons — they hate Obama more. . .

SOURCE – link to counterpunch.org

W.Jones
October 21, 2014, 9:32 pm

FROM THE TRAILER:
Isr.: After the Holocaust, can you accept that it’s important for Jews to be in Israel?
Pal. answer: I think it’s wrong to kick people from their houses, there are a lot of empty places you could live.

Yes, those are some different narratives. Apparently each were good with their talking points.

I know that girls are good at cat fights, but it was probably easier that they did this with girls.

Pal.girl: When I see they are Jewish, I have many feelings, because they are people killed my father.

OK, there should not really be anything that they feel from seeing someone who is Jewish, because there are different opinions among Jews on the conflict. It’s only tough when you herd people together with a very closed viewpoint.

Sure, I think that if everyone participated in dialogue programs it would go a long way. But what portion of Israelis and Palestinians are ready to sign up for that?

talknic
October 21, 2014, 8:49 pm

@ amigo

ICJ advisory opinion 2004 by Justice Khasawneh.

link to icj-cij.org

Quite!

Idiots for Israel will claim it is a non binding ICJ opinion, oblivious to the fact that in the court’s opinion were it asked for a judgement it would most certainly not favour Israel’s nonsense legal positions, which are themselves based only on opinions almost entirely given by people AFTER they have left office *

Furthermore although it is a non-binding ICJ opinion given whilst actually serving on the judiciary, the Laws and UN Charter provisions referenced ARE binding. Similarly the Laws and UN Charter provisions re-affirmed and emphasized in any UN/UNGA/UNSC resolution are in binding.

* e.g., Schwebel/Lauterpacht’s opinion on the ‘acquisition’ of territory by war (right of conquest), actually talks about ‘restoring’ the sovereign in an illegal war.

Israel has A) never lost any territory to B) ‘restore’ and C) none of Israel’s preemptive wars have ever been legalized by declaration** under UNSC Chapt VII. Of course in Schwebel/Lauterpacht’s opinion, Syria has the right to restore its sovereignty over the Golan link to wp.me

** 6. To legalize a war it must be declared by that branch of the government entrusted by the constitution with this power. link to mojolaw.com

eGuard
October 21, 2014, 8:38 pm

So JDL wrote on the flyer: Al Queda

A good name for a Spanish restaurant.

eljay
October 21, 2014, 8:29 pm

>> Karl Dubhe: How is the opera ‘anti-semitic’?

According to Wiki:

Controversy surrounded the American premiere and other productions in the years which followed. Adams, Goodman, and Sellars repeatedly claimed that they were trying to give equal voice to both Israelis and Palestinians with respect to the political background.[24][25] Some critics and audience members condemned the production as antisemitic, and appearing to be ‘sympathetic’ to the hijackers.[26]
. . .
The dramatic expression of Palestinian historical grievances in a theatrical context was one source of accusations of ‘sympathy’ with Palestinian terrorism.

With Zio-supremacists, it’s always about “nuances”, “balance”, “shades of gray” and “humanizing ‘the Other'”…except for when it isn’t.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 8:03 pm

This post brought up a lot of feelings for me, mostly sadness after watching the clip, and the feeling that ordinary people caught up in vast mechanisms almost guarantee certain unfortunate outcomes. Individuals relate fine as individuals, but can’t once they answer to larger systems designed to maintain inequality.

It is a waste of time to organize in that community.”

Yes, but isn’t that precisely where the Kerrys and the Obamas and the Camerons of the world expect the Palestinians to operate?

American
October 21, 2014, 7:52 pm

This is not the right place to put this but bear with me cause it is related to I/P and US_Israel issue.
“Pay 2 Play’…haven’t seen it yet. … but we know this is the main problem with Isr as well as everything else.

link to convio.motherjones.com

Please consider joining us at a screening or hosting your own screening of the film Pay 2 Play: Democracy’s High Stakes. link to convio.motherjones.com

SYNOPSIS:

PAY 2 PLAY follows filmmaker John Ennis’ quest to find a way out from under the Pay 2 Play System, defined by Ennis as the cycle where Politicians reward their donors with even larger sums from the public treasury — through contracts, jobs, tax cuts, and deregulation. PAY 2 PLAY picks up where Ennis left off in his last film FREE FOR ALL. Ennis has recognized that by Election Day, so much has already happened to decide which candidates are or are not on the ballot, the result is surprisingly undemocratic. Driven by his need to make the world better for his newborn daughter to inherit, Ennis determines to study our road to elected office to find a way we can get out from under the Pay 2 Play System.
link to convio.motherjones.com

We are asking people to host screenings because we want to create a dialogue around both the problem of big money’s corruption of our democracy and the solutions we can work towards together. House party screenings are a great way to bring people together in your community and then join in the actions of our partner organizations who are working towards the solutions we propose in the film.

It’s more than just a movie, it’s a movement.

hophmi
October 21, 2014, 7:52 pm

You’re a classic extremist, Phil. You seem absolutely incapable of even trying to understand why people might feel this way. If people don’t agree with your politics, they’re evil and all the same, and if they do, they’re all angels. I guarantee that Melissa Weintraub knows far more than you do about the conflict and has spent more time in Palestine than you have. She’s a real peace builder. You’re just a militant.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 7:27 pm

This is all great news.

The arc of history continues to bend. I think the words “cruel blight” to describe the occupation are perfect.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 7:18 pm

That sign the guy is holding in the first photo proclaiming “. . . insult to the arts” is especially disturbing. If “the arts” only exist to make us feel good about things we already believe and hold dear, then they cease to be worth very much in the long run, and we in turn cast ourselves as someone incapable of growing.

The impressionists were outcasts and laughed at; books which were once banned are now being taught in collage courses. It’s an old, old story that everyone’s familiar with. Times, indeed, change.

Not every work of art is going to appeal to everybody; nor, should it. But there is something much uglier than objectionable art, and that thing is something called censorship.

Ira Glunts
October 21, 2014, 7:17 pm

I enjoyed hearing your take on the Kashua/Keret letters. I read the letters in The New Yorker before reading your post and was similarly struck by the ludicrous characterization of Tira as “predominantly Arab.” This “mistake” so frequent in the US media leads one to the conclusion that many writers are just reluctant to point out the extent to which Israel is a segregated society.

My favorite example of the refusal to acknowledge the homogeneity of many Israeli towns, neighborhoods and villages comes from a 2007 speech that then Presidential candidate Barack Obama gave at the annual AIPAC conference. Obama characterized the northern Israeli village of Fassuta, which he had visited, as consisting of “3,000 residents of different faiths and histories … all faiths and nationalities, living together with mutual respect.” The truth was that every single resident at that time was a Palestinian Melkite Catholic. Amazingly, the speech is still available here –> link to blogs.suntimes.com

I have read two of Kashua’s books and had the pleasure of speaking with him briefly four years ago. He strikes me as an honest, highly intelligent, talented and warm person who is able to triumph with great dignity while engaged in a seemingly impossible career path. His newspaper article prior to leaving Israel was as poignant as any piece of personal journalism I have read in years.

There is a great irony that Kashua came to Illinois via their Jewish Studies Program where he teaches some of his current courses. Even in the United States he could not flee from his difficult role as the presenter of Palestinian culture to a basically recalcitrant and uncooperative Jewish community.

Kashua is teaching at UIUC, which is the school that fired Prof. Steven Salaita. What did he think about the student protests supporting Salaita? Was he pressured by pro Palestinian students to join them? Did his Jewish pro Israel students attempt to involve Kashua in support of the school administration? If Kashua ever writes about this, surely he will wait until he goes back to Israel. That much about American culture he surely has learned by now.

Hatim, I look forward to reading your new book of short stories. Thanks for contributing your special perspective to this site.

lysias
October 21, 2014, 7:07 pm

I have seen both movies. If you doubt that the IRA figures prominently (and is treated sympathetically) in both of them, I suggest you read the Wikipedia entries on them.

American
October 21, 2014, 7:03 pm

Here’s another victory….
The I-bully boys lose again.

link to freebeacon.com

”L.A. Hotel to Host Anti-Israel Confab
Westin Bonaventure and owner stand by ASA”

They were threatening to sue Westin for allowing ASA to use their hotel for a conference claiming it was anti semitic.

Westin answered them with the equivalent of a corporate get f’ed brush off:

“The Westin Bonaventure does not discriminate and is committed to meeting the requirements of the Civil Rights Act at all times,” a spokesman for the hotel’s parent company told the Washington Free Beacon in a statement over the weekend.

“The hotel respects the privacy of our groups and guests, and we do not choose, nor refuse, to do business based upon ideologies or affiliations,” the statement said. “We are in the business of hospitality, and if rooms are available, anyone may reserve accommodations and receive the benefit of our services.”

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 7:02 pm

My opinion is that PBS has been missing quite a few opportunities and has gotten a lot dumber since 9/11, right along with most of the country. If perhaps dumber isn’t the right word, it’s close.

BTW, off topic, but that JDL leaflet made me think of Jack Ruby’s comment after shooting Oswald, that he wanted to show the world that “a Jew has guts.”

ckg
October 21, 2014, 7:00 pm

Annie–Why doesn’t my link display as an embedded video? I thought I wrote it correctly.

ckg
October 21, 2014, 6:57 pm

Judging only from the Met’s official trailer, it’s difficult to see how this opera romanticizes terror or even humanizes Palestinians:

link to youtube.com

From these scenes I would have guessed Pam Geller wrote the libretto.

lysias
October 21, 2014, 6:54 pm

I read someplace a few years ago that Abu Abbas was secretly working for Israel and that the attack on the Achille Lauro happened because the Israelis told Abu Abbas to have his people did something particularly outrageous. I think it was in Gordon Thomas’s Gideon’s Spies: The Secret History of the Mossad. Anybody know whether there’s any truth in that story?

Donald
October 21, 2014, 6:50 pm

“Still, you could make the case that if The Death of Klinghoffer caricatures anyone, it’s Palestinians, not Jews”

I have no firsthand knowledge of the opera, but suspect this is true. The very choice of topic suggests it. Why, if one wishes to write an opera about the Palestinians, would the central focus be on the brutal murder of an American Jew by Palestinian terrorists? Perhaps the answer (again, I haven’t seen the opera) is that the work really isn’t about the Palestinians—they are only interesting (to the opera) because their suffering led some of them to commit terrible crimes against Westerners.

I have some sympathy for the Klinghoffer daughters–if I were them I would resent the fact that my father’s murder was used in this way. They have every right to complain. Whatever one thinks of the I/P conflict (and obviously I think the Palestinians are the main victims and the Israelis the oppressors), Klinghoffer’s murder was inexcusable. Palestinians, it seems to me, might resent the fact that the one time a famous opera is written that involves their history it centers on the murder of an American Jew and not on the murder of some innocent Palestinian.

yonah fredman
October 21, 2014, 6:20 pm

seafoid- your speculations regarding the reasons for Amos Oz’s mother’s suicide are either cruel or childish/moronic. chose one.

Shingo
October 21, 2014, 6:19 pm

Stopping the children throwing stones would leave the IDF with no excuse at all for arresting children, and the hasbarists with no basis for their claim that Palestinians are teaching their children to hate.

No, the IDF and Israeli government would just manufacture another excuse. Most of these arrests are not even based on evidence of throwing stones, just allegations from local settlers that they were seen throwing stones.

bintbiba
October 21, 2014, 6:15 pm

To Shmuel , MHughes , seafoid , Eva Smagacz and ‘euromondos ‘, I second the motion. Bumblebye and Bornajoo as well !!

geofgray
October 21, 2014, 6:10 pm

david browmwich used the word velleity –a wish or inclination not strong enough to lead to action–to describe obamba. in america today it seems that having good intentions is all that matters. the surreal fog extends well beyond the liberal jewish community. it is suffocating us all.

American
October 21, 2014, 6:02 pm

” Just look at those IDF pictures of soldiers abusing Palestinians.
Why can’t Israel be a normal country? Because it’s run on trauma”….seafood

I don’t think you can claim the trauma excuse for the IDF.
They have never fought any protracted war like WWI or Vietnam or Iraq. To compare them to the veterans of real wars is actually an insult to others veterans.
They haven’t been traumatized , they are living in a society in which they are ‘The Supremes’—-I hardly call that traumatizing.
These young Israelis in the IDF are run on the hate they got in their zionist milk.
It’s hate , not trauma that makes them what they are.

yonah fredman
October 21, 2014, 5:52 pm

Hello bornajoo, You addressed me on a different thread but I will answer you here. Firstly we come from different sides of the tracks. I am Ashkenazi and your roots are not in Eastern Europe. You do not relate your relationship to halachik judaism. I was raised a rabbi’s son and have spent my life at a distance from that background, but essentially orbiting that planet.

No, I do not send links from MW to my siblings and nieces and nephews. For the most part I find non face to face interactions regarding the middle east with relatives to be unproductive and when i get face to face i realize the limitations of what i could possibly say to change their minds. You seem to be in an “in your face” personality and that is not me now, maybe 20 years ago, but now. but even 20 years ago it was support of rabin rather than acquiescence to hamas that was my rebellion.

consider this P to King 4, a first move in our conversation.

a blah chick
October 21, 2014, 5:46 pm

You’ll be happy to know that the Dersh was there! Here’s a bit of the “review.” I won’t quote at length because life is too short for that:

“The Palestinian chorus is beautifully composed musically, with some compelling words, sung rhythmically and sympathetically. The Jewish chorus is a mishmash of whining about money, sex, betrayal and assorted “Hasidism” protesting in front of movie theaters. It never mentions the six million Jews who were murdered in the Holocaust, though the chorus is supposed to be sung by its survivors. The goal of that narrative chorus is to compare the displacement of 700,000 Palestinians—some of which was caused by Arab leaders urging them to leave and return victoriously after the Arabs murdered the Jews of Israel—with the systematic genocide of six million Jews. It was a moral abomination.”

Elsewhere in the review he refers to the Nakba as “self-inflicted.”

Idiot.

adele
October 21, 2014, 5:43 pm

Some snippets from Adam Shatz’ review in the LRB, “Who’s Afraid of ‘Klinghoffer’?”:

Still, you could make the case that if The Death of Klinghoffer caricatures anyone, it’s Palestinians, not Jews. The ‘Chorus of Exiled Palestinians’ that opens the opera features a group in Afghan-style clothes, evoking the vanished paradise of pre-1948 Palestine and the Nakba that robbed them of their land and future. Dressed in black and virtually indistinguishable, they’re designated mourners of Palestine, an undifferentiated mass united in suffering and thirsty for revenge. The women are all covered in full abayas, which is unusual among Palestinian women today, and was even more unusual in 1985. The men wear Afghan-style beards that, outside the Gaza Strip, are rare in Palestine. They wave the green flag of Islam, not the Palestinian red green, white and black flag that even Hamas prefers. The effect of the set design is to frame the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as an episode in a larger clash of civilisations between Islam and the West. The libretto, too, accentuates the ‘civilisational’ dimensions of the conflict. With their incantatory talk about Islam and their love of martyrdom, the hijackers sound more like members of Hamas (which emerged only in 1988) than of Abu Abbas’s secular nationalist PLF.

I suspect that what disturbs the opera’s critics is that Palestinian suffering is expressed with such eloquence and compassion, not only in the libretto but in the score. Taruskin and others have complained that some of the most stirring music occurs in the ‘Chorus of Exiled Palestinians’. It’s a telling criticism, an example of what Talking Heads called the ‘fear of music’: the anxiety that musical beauty might act on its listeners in transgressive ways, and lead to forbidden forms of pleasure or sympathy. What appears to trouble Klinghoffer’s enemies most is that, through the force of his music, Adams has put Western listeners in the shoes of Israel’s victims.

Those who are afraid of The Death of Klinghoffer because Palestinians have been awarded some of its most beautiful music haven’t listened very carefully – or haven’t stayed in their seats until the end. The heartbreaking aria that closes the opera belongs to Marilyn Klinghoffer, mourning her husband with controlled anguish. The loss that The Death of Klinghoffer invites us to experience most acutely is personal, not political.

link to lrb.co.uk

yonah fredman
October 21, 2014, 5:41 pm

a few quick remarks- the name of the yeshiva I attended from 72 to 74 was Yeshivat Har Etzion located in Alon Shevut.

Currently most of my nephews and nieces live in 67 Israel. I have one haredi niece who lives in a town that is partly in the west bank. i think a newlywed nephew of mine and his wife might be living in the west bank. i am pleased that most of my nephews and nieces do not live in occupied territory.

I’m sorry if my nomenclature regarding using the term Gazans rather than Palestinians does not meet with the approval of all the commentators. So it goes. Add a few more exclamation marks and then we shall know that the TRUTH!!!!! is on your side.

Unlike most commentators here I consider my views a work in progress, particularly since it has been less than 2 months since the end of the war. (sorry if my use of the word “war” does not meet the truth patrol here, either.) It is a weird situation supporting a war i opposed, meaning supporting the rights of those who supported the war not be called racists and to consider them rational if not possessing a plan for the future. they would object to my plan for the future as well and all I can say is that holding the west bank rather than handing it to Hamas makes sense, but holding the west bank and settling people there without giving the residents citizenship and a vote is a stupid policy, because i was raised on robert kennedy and because the western world cannot tolerate such a bifurcation beyond the year 2060. (this year was added to get the goat of he who wishes his goat to be gotten).

as regards the original occupation of the west bank: the 6 day war was caused by events. part of those events were the fault of israel, part of those events were the fault of the soviet union, part of those events were the fault of nasser. once king hussein signed up as an ally to nasser, war was inevitable. ideations about the malleability of history aside, there are dynamics involved in calling up reserves and creating a crisis that led to the war as surely as gravity leads an apple to fall off a tree and knock a scientist in the head. once the war was fought, the west bank was bound to be occupied. i think between 67 and 73 israel could have reached a separate agreement with king hussein and i regret that they didn’t and the settlement movement and the euphoria of a reunited Jerusalem and the emotions of the right wing and the religious Modern Orthodox and the general euphoria of the worldwide Jewish community in the aftermath of 67 ensured that that peace with Hussein was never reached and that is something that I regret.

American
October 21, 2014, 5:41 pm

” That’s the broad center of Israeli society now. You can take that on but you have to oppositional. You can’t do it from the heart of Israeli society and you can’t do it from the heart of Jewish life. They’re not interested. -”…Phil

Give it up, it will only make you crazy…and sick.
Their ‘dialogues’ are like a nice soothing massages for themselves.

ritzl
October 21, 2014, 5:21 pm

Just happened to catch the PBS “report” on the manufacture of a controversy. Pure, biased, ADL trash.

Not once did the “report” stop to ask whether these Palestinians had their whole families killed by Israel in ’48 or ’67, thereby missing the entire point of the opera, imho. You know, complex chains of events and human reactions to them.

They completely (and intentionally, imho, as nobody in that position is THAT stupid or ignorant) missed an opportunity to shed light on the subject.

link to pbs.org

And the yellow stars with “Never Again” on them were outrageous, in the the only Jews matter sense. But then it’s hardly surprising as that was the sole theme of Foxman’s outrage and the PBS report.

German Lefty
October 21, 2014, 5:16 pm

“I don’t know the opera, I probably shouldn’t ask, but I’m confused… How is the opera ‘anti-semitic’?”

Oh, good! I am not the only one who is confused.

gamal
October 21, 2014, 5:08 pm

“The moral basis for Israel’s persecution of the Palestinian people”

“I never knew what that was supposed to mean,”

write to Jerry Slater he says he can explain, he hasn’t deigned to, as yet, but he can, so he says. Of course if it is moral to establish a state for Jews in Palestine, without Palestinian consent, Palestinian self defense is immoral, even though self defense is also a universal moral right, utilizing the moral calculus is a complex process, not amenable to all, I have never been any good at it and thus must defer to elevated persons such as liberal Zionist moralists.

there is a hierarchy, you know, its best to know your place so as not to over step the iron wall of moral dictate, after all is not the main purpose of morality to justify the unconscionable,

Kay24
October 21, 2014, 4:54 pm

Yeah, real tough guys eh? Their mother’s must be proud of them.

Kay24
October 21, 2014, 4:50 pm

Blood thirsty lot. All that, and yet there was outrage when someone drew a cartoon of an old gent sitting on one of those armchairs with a remote, “enjoying” the sight of bombs dropping on Gaza. They said the nose was antisemitic. That cartoon captured the essence of what was happening at that time exactly. I don’t think anyone thought twice about the nose, it was more to silence the criticism, yet again.

666
October 21, 2014, 4:47 pm

phil says

“they,re not interested”

unless of course a better offer comes along,not from the onlookers but the arab states in the region.gas sales to jordan and egypt for instance.regional incentives like manufacturing

bmw or mercedes could open a car manufacturing plant in the west bank like they did in south africa in the apartheid years

how about appliance factories like miele or bosch

that would be interesting

now that d

ckg
October 21, 2014, 4:47 pm

The classical music critic of the Nation, Edward Said (yes, him), reviewed the opera two decades ago.

The background is compellingly established with the opera’s opening chorus of Palestine exiles who sing:

Of that house [in Palestine], not a wall
In which a bird might nest
Was left to stand. Israel
Laid all to waste.

I found this the most musically impassioned an moving sequence in the score, not least because Adams’s music unfolds with a majestic calm that in the final strophes of the chorus blossoms into an extraordinary arabesque digression that loops up and down and around asingle word with breathtaking continuity, searing the spectator’s consciousness with the terrible sadness of it all.

But as you sit there watching this vast work unfold, you need to ask yourself how many times you have seen any substantial work of music or dramatic or literary or pictorial art that actually tries to treat the Palestinians as tragically aggrieved, albeit sometimes criminally intent, people. The answer is never, and you must go on to ask Messrs.-the-nonideological-music-and-culture-critics whether they ever complain about works that are skewed the other way, or whether for instance, in the flood of images and words that assert that Israel is a democracy, any of them note that 2 million Palestinians on the West Bank and Gaza have fewer rights than South African blacks had during the worst days of apartheid, and that the paeans and the $77 billion sent to Israel from the United States were keeping the Palestinian people endlessly oppressed?

Kay24
October 21, 2014, 4:41 pm

Good question. It may be easier to identify the sane over there. It might be faster that way, because you get more lunatics in stolen lands.

Kay24
October 21, 2014, 4:39 pm

Israel’s chosen crazies, always get away with murder. Either they are found to be unstable and not fit to stand trial, or they are treated well (unlike the Palestinian kids suffering in jails for minor offenses), and get off with light sentences. It is becoming more obvious from videos and reports of violent crimes against Palestinians, Mosques being attack, vandalized and even burned, homes attacked with racist graffiti, and the long list of crimes, that these illegal settlers have an insane gene in them. They are armed and dangerous.

Bornajoo
October 21, 2014, 4:38 pm

@mgsoulcraft
You describe the site as “shameful” and at the same time you insult Annie and call her the “worst of the worst”. Yet she didn’t censor your comment and even took the time to reply to you. That’s not shameful, that’s pretty damned decent and very democratic if you ask me. Are there any pro-zionists sites that would afford the same courtesy? It’s strange because as a Jew, when I read this site I really do see it as one that reflects and portrays the actual facts on the ground. All we get from the other side is the same old hasbara.

“it turns out the kid was only held for 15 min”. Actually he’s only 11 years old, had his hands tied behind his back, blindfolded and then put face down into the jeep. He was only released after 15 mins because his father managed to convince the 2 hero soldiers he was mentally disabled. so that’s perfectly okay in your book? You don’t see anything wrong with doing that to an 11 year old CHILD? you actually cannot see why Annie and the rest of us are outraged? Mondoweiss is “shameful” for pointing this out? Really? If that’s the case please seek psychiatric help urgently.

Citizen
October 21, 2014, 4:34 pm

Nothing like volunteering to be put on that ice flow, headed out to sea.

Joe Catron
October 21, 2014, 3:59 pm

“The moral basis for Israel’s persecution of the Palestinian people is eroding fast.”

I never knew what that was supposed to mean, and still have no clue.

amigo
October 21, 2014, 3:32 pm

“I wonder if the Beach boys read about this ???>” Amigo.

I was referring to this article about the arrest of the 11 year old by the IDF.

amigo
October 21, 2014, 3:26 pm

I wonder if the Beach boys read about this ???>

“The American rock band The Beach Boys have canceled their planned Tel Aviv concert, which was scheduled to take place on November 29 in the Nokia Stadium.

Pre-purchased tickets will be refunded.

The show would have been the band’s first in Israel, and would have capped off a tour stopping at France, Denmark, Norway and Hungary. The tour lineup consists of two bandmembers from the 1960s – Mike Love and Bruce Johnston – and five other musicians.

As of Tuesday, no reason for the cancelation was provided on the band’s website. ” Haaretz

link to haaretz.com

walktallhangloose
October 21, 2014, 3:00 pm

amigo, you are 100% right (from a legal sparrow)

amigo
October 21, 2014, 2:54 pm

From the ICJ advisory opinion 2004 by Justice Khasawneh.

link to icj-cij.org

10. There is no doubt that the Green Line was initially no more than
an armistice line in an agreement that expressly stipulated that its provisions
would not be “interpreted as prejudicing, in any sense, an ultimate
political settlement between the Parties” and that “the Armistice Demarcation
Lines defined in articles V and VI of [the] Agreement [were] agreed
upon by the Parties without prejudice to future territorial settlements or
boundary lines or to claims of either Party relating thereto” (Advisory
Opinion, para. 72).
11. It is not without irony that prominent Israeli jurists were arguing
before the 1967 war that the General Armistice agreements were sui
generis, were in fact more than mere armistice agreements, could not be
changed except with the acceptance of the Security Council. Whatever
the true significance of that line today, two facts are indisputable:
(1) The Green line, to quote Sir Arthur Watts, “is the starting line from
which is measured the extent of Israel’s occupation of non-Israeli
territory” (CR200413, p. 64, para. 35). There is no implication that
the Green Line is to be a permanent frontier.
(2) Attempts at denigrating the significance of the Green Line would in
the nature of things work both ways. Israel cannot shed doubts upon
the title of others without expecting its own title and the territorial
expanse of that title beyond the partition resolution not to be called
into question. Ultimately it is through stabilizing its legal relationship
with the Palestinians and not through constructing walls that its
security would be assured.”Justice Khasawneh

Israel has no legitimate claim beyond it,s self declared Borders.As the ICJ,s decision shows , Israel , prior to 67 , was arguing in favour of their self declared orders and demanding that any change to those borders be approved by the UNSC.The Palestinians should be negotiating based on the 48 Borders , then the conversation can be about just how much land Israel has already stolen .

You legal eagles feel free to correct me if I am wrong,

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 2:54 pm

The only thing I’m pissed at France for is wanting their Southeast Asia colony back after WWII and us supporting them. The rest, as they say, is history. Standing up to the Bush-era foreign policy? Their shining moment.

As far as this gaggle of NeoCon pundits, as far as I could tell, they all had ZERO accountability. No matter how wrong they were, they just sailed on to their next pronouncement as if yesterday never happened. Much the same way for government functionaries and Wall Street CEOs, for that matter. Rob a liquor store, you go to jail. Lie about a war and kill thousands for no good reason, you get a book deal and airtime on NPR. Bad times for anyone who holds the country to a higher standard.

walktallhangloose
October 21, 2014, 2:53 pm

According to Montevideo, a state should have government. I take that to mean it must govern its territory, that is, have effective sovereignty over it. When Israel was created on 15 May 1948 it had a Government that controlled the territory it was claiming, and was therefore recognized as a state. If it had not been in control of its territory, I doubt very much it would have been recognized by other states. A state in the sense of Montevideo must be independent, or sovereign as I call it.

Palestine had no government. When the all-Palestine government was set up, it controlled only Gaza, and did not last long. Some of the Arab governments recognized it, but no-one else. Apart from that, Palestine has never had a government that controlled any territory. It has never been an independent state. It has never had any sovereignty that could be restored. Nor was it called a state before its declaration in 1988. That is why I say that the UN has created a new type of state, a territory that should be an independent state but isn’t. I believe that Palestine, because it is not independent, is not eligible to become a Member State of the UN, but we will see what happens about that.

piotr
October 21, 2014, 2:41 pm

The opera is anti-Semitic in the same sense as refraining from building a monument of Stepan Bandera is a treason to Ukrainian nation (topic or recent violent demonstrations in Kiev). Or specializing in obstetric complication is murdering innocent children (an ostensible reason for insulting the host of debate between Congressional candidates) link to rightwingwatch.org

All around the globe people of all creeds raise their conviction to ridiculous levels and view everybody less strict as vile creatures (they could be called anti-Semites, non-Muslim, baby killers, Commies and so on).

seafoid
October 21, 2014, 2:36 pm

“According to a Veteran’s Administration study
Half of the Vietnam combat veterans suffered from what Psychiatrists call
Post-Traumatic-Stress-Disorder
Many vets complain of alienation, rage, or guilt
Some succumb to suicidal thoughts
Eight to Ten years after coming home almost eight-hundred-thousand men are
still fighting the Vietnam War ”

link to youtube.com

And almost 6 million Israeli Jews are still fighting WW2 while suffering from the symptoms of years of Ziocaine abuse

seafoid
October 21, 2014, 2:29 pm

Those pictures of IDF soldiers with their petty cruelty always feature a really white Jew straight outta the forests of Poland in a uniform with a gun. 70 years on, still a failure. Still can’t live in peace. Still fighting ww2.

No surprise that Amos Oz’s mother took her own life, I think. She saw what Israel was. And would become.

Michael Radigan
October 21, 2014, 2:28 pm

I’m not familiar with the opera, but I’m determined to see it performed now, just to see what the furor is about.

lysias
October 21, 2014, 2:24 pm

Alice Goodman refused to write the libretto for Adams’s Doctor Atomic because it was originally conceived (the conception was later dropped) with Oppenheimer being a latter-day Faust, and she thought that any opera along those lines would have to be anti-Semitic. I’m not sure that I agree. To me, that sounds like a very interesting idea for an opera.

lysias
October 21, 2014, 2:19 pm

Anybody who thinks the New York Times ignored the Holocaust during World War Two should read Edwin Black’s IBM and the Holocaust, which cites in detail many times that the New York Times did report on it at the time. Black’s point is that IBM CEO Thomas Watson, in New York, had to have been aware of the Holocaust. But the point stands for other purposes too.

Sycamores
October 21, 2014, 2:12 pm

there is a piece in the Gaurdian from two year ago about Alice Goodman

Alice Goodman: The furore that finished me
link to theguardian.com

“There’s a certain romanticism to the hijackers and that’s something, again, that Taruskin picks upon. But the trouble is they think romanticism is good. Romanticism good, romanticism attractive. I don’t think that. I actually think the most dangerous thing in the world is romantic nationalism. Not religion, but romantic nationalism. And if it’s true, it’s also true for Israel. Israel is not exempt from the problem I have with romantic nationalism. If it’s an evil, it’s an evil all over the world.”

Alice Goodman was planning to write another libretti after Klinghoffer based on Waco

seafoid
October 21, 2014, 2:11 pm

“Notwithstanding Israel’s actions, the unwillingness of the Palestinians to accept a growing Jewish presence predate 1967 by over hundred years.”

Looking at what actually happened you’d have to say they were right.
Just look at those IDF pictures of soldiers abusing Palestinians.
Why can’t Israel be a normal country? Because it’s run on trauma.

Giles
October 21, 2014, 2:05 pm

If you think those movies were “about the IRA” I am guessing you have not seen them. Or any film by Ken Loach.

Kris
October 21, 2014, 1:59 pm

@yonahfredman, thanks for sharing that your siblings and nieces/nephews moved to Israel from the U.S., and that your perceptions are colored by their “reality” and by your own study at a “rabbinical school on the west bank.”

I’ve been trying to imagine how I would feel in your place, and the closest I can get is if I had studied religion at a seminary affiliated with the Christian Identity movement, and my siblings, etc., had moved to an Aryan Nation compound in northern Idaho involved in stealing land/resources from the Nimi’ipuu (Nez Perce) or Kalispel, Kootenai and Schitsu’umsh (Coeur d’ Alene) tribes.

I hope that I would feel ashamed, and not as if I needed to be an apologist for these people.

Also, Yonah, how could there be a “rabbinical school” in Israeli-occupied territory that belongs to the Palestinians? Don’t the Ten Commandments (“8. Thou shall not steal,” and “10. Thou shalt not covet what is thy neighbor’s,”) apply to Jews?

Mooser
October 21, 2014, 1:55 pm

“I know of no other group that the “self-loathing” thing is attached to as a generic means of keeping order. Why is that?”

Because the idea of a Jewish polity, a Jewish ‘peoplehood (and a super-national one, at that!) is so artificial, so specious and so obviously mustered for the worst political ends, that no method is too fantastic to use in pursuing it? Come to think of it, the more fantastic, the more outre the argument, the more it distracts, too, from fundamental questions.

MRW
October 21, 2014, 1:53 pm

Great comment, well written.

piotr
October 21, 2014, 1:52 pm

Truly liberal Zionists exists, although they are rare — beliefs are often contradictory, but this is a difficult combination.

Other than that, Zionist do not care a whit about artistic and academic freedom, using whatever powers that may have to cause dismissal of academicians or censoring art. Of course they complain very loudly when boycotts are advocated, and in those situation they mention freedoms they do not care about, sometimes so energetically that one could think that they are serious.

In the case of Klinghoffer opera, clearly the New York Metropolitan has to have generous donations from rich and often Zionist New Yorkers. I guess those people (former mayor Bloomberg comes to mind) pride themselves to be sophisticated and a better breed than the radical Zionists who demonstrate against the production.

The charge of “romanticizing terrorism” is obviously ridiculous.

Annie Robbins
October 21, 2014, 1:40 pm

@robbins should know that the motive has always been there. – See more at: link to mondoweiss.net

mayhem, way to not get my point. are you going to acknowledge that blockading gaza, virtually ending economic opportunity for over a million people and putting them on a diet, directly after pulling out settlers was not a cause for rockets? breaking the ceasefire was not a cause for rockets? please do not try to pawn off some idea israel only acts in response to palestinian violence, no one believes that. and of course people will always resist the colonialization of their land. of course ever since zionists set their eye in palestine it was a recipe for disaster. so there will always be a motive to resist this occupation of a land, of a people.

and, zionism in palestine (as opposed to some empty island someone) requires either ethnically cleansing or genociding the indigenous people, so your motive is cut out for you too.

but looking forward and to the immediate future and circumstance, if israel doesn’t want rockets they should end the blockade and quit imprisoning, killing, torturing people , and stealing more and more land. no people could live like that without resisting, none. not jews, not anybody. the slaughter of gaza was not a response to rockets. the rockets were a response to israel pogrom in the WB set off with great intent after the hamas-fatah unity deal and everyone knows it. just like everyone know natanyahu LIED about the death of the teens in order to justify the occupation army rampaging throughout the WB in order to punish palestinians for the unity deal and instigated massive upheaval because all israel knows is force. and to expect palestinians to endure that with no recourse? impossible. take some responsibility for the violent nature of the state representing your people and understand the implications of that violence. iow deal with it.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 1:37 pm

Thanks for those links, Sycamores.

I’d say that as much as I’ve loved Chomsky over the years, he seems a bit behind the curve on his assessment of the potential of the BDS movement. Or at least I hope he is.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 1:27 pm

Wonderful writing, Dr. Kanaaneh; I thoroughly enjoyed it, especially as it reminds us how easily false images are created by glossing over the facts, leaving not a fingerprint behind unless you’re shown where to look.

seafoid
October 21, 2014, 1:11 pm

Thanks Philip and “Gute Besserung” as they say in German

Chu
October 21, 2014, 1:09 pm

Meanwhile – ‘Israeli soldiers blindfold and detain 11 year old disabled child’ link to youtube.com

Karl Dubhe
October 21, 2014, 1:07 pm

I don’t know the opera, I probably shouldn’t ask, but I’m confused…

How is the opera ‘anti-semitic’?

A family friend of ours converted to Judaism to marry his sweetheart. Would the speakers at that rally have denounced his conversion in the same way that they denounced the conversion of a woman to the C of E?

seafoid
October 21, 2014, 12:48 pm

@ mgsoulcraft

“I’ve read this site with an open mind for a while but it is shameful And she is the worst of the worst -”

Annie is a legend.

THIS is the Wurst of the Wurst
link to schnitzelbahn.com

And you should go to Arutz Sheva for your intellectual nourishment

HarryLaw
October 21, 2014, 12:46 pm

Introducing the Rt Hon Sir Alan Duncan MP KCMG. and the Rt Hon Sir Gerald Kaufman MP. Heh

lysias
October 21, 2014, 12:43 pm

Or movies about the IRA like The Wind That Shakes the Barley or Hidden Agenda.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 12:24 pm

Disclaimer: I haven’t seen the play.

That said, what a lather these folks live in (save Rabbi Kermaier, apparently). They seem to me like people who don’t spend much time stepping out of their inner circle of like-minded followers. There isn’t just a presumed disagreement over policy, but only a seething contempt of Israel. Why have a prelude when you can open the show with your amp cranked to 11?

I like this line:

Israel is demonized the world over by anti-Semitism couched as anti-Zionism” How the hell do you tell the difference? Killing 500 children isn’t supposed to elicit a negative reaction in a normal person? Only a pre-disposed hatred of Jews could account for it? That’s crazy talk. And the idea that this sort of truncated mentality is pulling the reins of our government’s ME policy is infuriating.

amigo
October 21, 2014, 12:21 pm

“Stopping the children throwing stones would leave the IDF with no excuse at all for arresting children, and the hasbarists with no basis for their claim that Palestinians are teaching their children to hate. ” walktallhangloose.

The IDF don,t need an excuse.They will claim that the children threw stones whether or not they did.

It is the zionist way of ensuring that they can claim to be the eternal victim and then get on with their brutal behaviour.This is what they do.No illegal settler kids are arrested or harmed in any way.Often the IDF stand idly by and do absolutely nothing until they are ready to arrest the Palestinians who were the targets in the first place.

michelle
October 21, 2014, 12:20 pm

.
some people curse when they have no honest discourse
.
it isn’t new that bullys employ name calling as a tatic
.
i’m rubber you’re glue
everything you say bounces off off me
and sticks to you
.
just for fun ….

“Rufio: Boil-dripping, beef, fart-sniffing bubble butt!
Kids: Bangarang, Rufio!
Peter Banning: Someone has a severe ca-ca mouth, you know that?
Rufio: You are fart factory, Slug-slimed, sack-of-rat-guts-in-cat-vomit, cheesy, scab-picked, pimple-squeezing finger bandage. A week old maggot burger with everything on it and flies on the side!
Kids: [in unison] Ugh!
Peter Banning: Substitute chemistry teacher.
Lost Boy: Come on, Rufio, hit him back.
Rufio: Mung tongue.
Peter Banning: Math tutor.
Rufio: Pinhead.
Peter Banning: Prison barber.
Rufio: Mother lover.
Peter Banning: Nearsighted gynecologist.
Rufio: In your face, camel cake!
Peter Banning: In your rear, cow derrière.
Rufio: Lying, crying, spying, prying ultra-pig.
Peter Banning: You lewd, crude, rude, bag of pre-chewed food dude.
Thud Butt: [with the rest of the Lost Boys] Bangarang, Peter!
Rufio: You… you man! Stupid, stupid man!
Peter Banning: Rufio, if I’m a maggot burger why don’t you eat me! You two-toned zebra-headed, slime-coated, pimple-farmin’ paramecium brain, munchin’ on your own mucus, suffering from Peter Pan envy!
Don’t Ask: What’s a paramecium brain?
Peter Banning: I’ll tell you what a paramecium is! That’s the paramecium! It’s a one-celled critter with no brain, that can’t fly! Don’t mess with me man, I’m a lawyer!
Kids: [chanting] Banning, Banning, Banning is bangerang.
Rufio: Rufio! Rufio!
Peter Banning: Oh, Rufio, why don’t you just go suck on a dead dog’s nose”
-Hook
.
we are none of us pod people
ask those who would have you think as they do
am i to find my way to you or to G-d
.
seems like The Christ Jesus is/was called “a self hating Jew” by some people too
.
G-d calls every & all His beloved
.
G-d Bless
.

Philip Munger
October 21, 2014, 11:57 am

Here is the diary I wrote about the opera for firedoglake, back in June, when the Met announced it was canceling the video and radio broadcasts of The Death of Klinghoffer:

link to my.firedoglake.com

The only prominent composer to write in support of former Pulitzer Prize-winning composer of the opera, John Adams, is current Pulitzer Prize-winning composer, Alaskan John Luther Adams.

Horizontal
October 21, 2014, 11:57 am

I guess if we don’t want works of art to romanticize terrorism, we won’t be seeing Exodus anytime soon.