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  • Bill and Hillary Clinton both opposed his invitation from AIPAC in 2010
  • Advice to British leftwingers on kicking racism out of their anti-Israel rhetoric
    • To me, it's a threat, and it shows how shallow the "commitment" to justice in this case is among "liberal zionists."

      "We'll support you, as long as you adopt our platform, language and tact; any deviation from this, or any statements made in anger regarding the group who carries out these injustices and it's FAH-Q"

    • Stop telling people how to talk.

  • It is time to stop celebrating Jewish dissent in the Palestine solidarity movement
    • were white South Africans the face of the anti apartheid movement? Why should anyone give a shit about ol Ian's feelings? I stand by original comment, Martin. Hope you're well by the way!

    • Ha! The article to shutter mondoweiss.... The "it's not privilege it's responsibility" line in some comments is obscene. It's about privilege and it's also about being conspicuous and it's about gatekeeping and it's about self congratulation and it's about skipping the line. The "responsibility" nonsense is a cool trick to prove your modern bleeding heart bona fides while still clinging to a bronze age identity that makes zero sense to anyone outside the tribe.

  • Sanders's leftwing base made him take on Netanyahu
    • I'm not buying it, I think this is how he feels and if you don't like it, oh well. He's been a pretty persistent critic of Israel's. I think folks are coming around to his pov and not the other way around....

  • Obama said in Cuba what he couldn't say in Palestine
    • Yeah he showed the Cubans so much respect, so much that he met with US funded "opposition" groups in the newly opened consulate. Dream on Phil.

  • 'A better relationship with Iran' is the deal's secret promise, but supporters can't say so
    • I want to ask a question here: does anyone here, after watching the "Iran debate" and "The Lobby's" antics ever question the shibboleth that all of European "antisemitism" was irrational and based solely on a racist hatred? Cuz you can read a million and one French, German, English, Spanish, Russian (and others) writers describing THE EXACT SAME shit happening in their countries at different times and obviously in different places.

      Its a question Phil should answer. We're watching a worldwide conspiracy and shakedown right before our eyes, and no one here denies it. I'm wondering if people think this is the ONLY time the stereotype or the accusation is true.

  • 'NYT' and Chris Matthews are frank about Jewish role in Iran Deal debate
  • Patriots' owner brings 20 NFL veterans to Netanyahu who calls on them to block Obama's Iran deal
  • In the propaganda war, Israel will stop at nothing
    • It's not a slur it's a style. Some dudes who switch go full femme and want to be thought of as only women, some dudes want it to be known they are guys and sport an obvious "man in a wig and skirt" look. those guys are called trannys. I've spent every summer of my life in Provincetown so believe me when I tell you. Tokyo Benny doesn't know what he's talking about

    • Tranny tranny tranny tranny tranny tranny.

      Equating tranny with the N word is outrageous.

  • Red lines, shmed lines-- U.S. must buy Israel's compliance with Iran deal
    • Because in 2014 they would have crucified Putin for doing so, but when they got close on the nuclear deal and the public responded favorably in the U.S., Putin could do it.

      the U.S. has folded on Ukraine Kerry was in Sochi recently making nice. Vlad is shitting down Barry's throat....hahaha Putin 4 life!

    • This being about the Iran deal is just cover - the Russians sold the Iranians their new AA package, which makes Iran an impossible target for Israel, this is really no big deal, had to have some excuse for making the sale, no one wants that aircraft.

  • The U.S. is at last facing the neocon captivity
    • The Neocons believe in democracy? Laughable. Its just so hard to take you seriously Phil. Your naive schoolboy routine is so tired. They wanted nothing to do with arab democracy, they wanted to balkanize the region, which they're doing. It was always about Israel dealing with tiny powerless enclaves, not defanged but popularly supported governments.

      There are no mitigating factors here, Phil - and please spare us the standard liberal bullshit about possible good intentions. There were no good intentions. That was all PR. Why are you so naive?

  • Netanyahu flails against int'l conspiracy, as liberal Zionists seek orange revolution against 'fading strongman'
  • Israel's new Asian allies
    • Well we all know about that Indian Israel lobby.........

      thanks for the bit of seriousness john. This place sorely needs it.

  • 'American Sniper' is an antiwar movie
    • I'm a former Marine, who lost some friends overseas, and so I say this was the utmost sincerity - FUCK THIS.

      This "oh, our poor soldiers" stuff is beyond tired. The poor naive kid from small town America who lost his soul in Iraq.. what utter bullshit. He had a blood lust - so did I. So does ANYONE who goes through scout sniper school. Do you know what you chant on training runs in Infantry school? It's all kill kill kill, blood blood blood. So please disabuse yourself of the idea that these guys aren't whole heartedly on board with senseless killing. I can't STAND reading these Jimmy Carter moments from Americans. Oh poor us. Fuck that.

      Fuck Chris Kyle. Fuck Clint Eastwood.

      Semper Fidelis,

  • We're all anti-American now
  • Al Jazeera investigates the USS Liberty attack in 'The Day Israel Attacked America'
    • Umm, what? Dude, I have no idea where you came up with that one.

    • OK, so you don't like the USS Stark example - what about sept 11 2001? All the redacted pages from the 9/11 report? The Saudi's gov't def had a hand in that, that Prince Bandar guy loves him some crazies.

      That's got to be a good example right? I mean, the US government let 9/11 slide - they didn't come for the Saudi's, just the opposite in fact.

      Today, the intercept has a story on "Duqu" the joint US-Israeli spy virus:

      Oil and high technology. Useful.

    • Another USS Liberty article? Gee whiz.

      For those who think Israel is special in this case, I'd like to direct your attention to the Iraqi air attack on the USS Stark during the Iran/Iraq war, when Iraq was a pliant American client state under Saddam. An Iraqi jet killed 37 aboard the Stark with missiles as it sat off the coast. Iraq said sorry, paid some money and that was that.

      The point is, if you're an important American client state, you can get away with this shit, the Israeli's aren't special.

  • 'Chickenshit' attack enrages Netanyahu and lobby, but will it stir voters against Obama?
  • As Kerry scrambles to prevent Palestinian action at UN, Israeli govt makes clear it will never accept Palestinian state
    • Shouldn't it be that they join the ICC first, and if after three months no borders are declared they take up the case? But, I suppose, if these clowns are still "doing favors to the Democratic Party" the level of seriousness ain't that high.

  • The Missing Context: 'Islamic State' sectarianism is not coincidental 
    • "this is an excellent article and i appreciate it being published here. thank you! "



  • Clintonite turns on Netanyahu for trying to bend US 'to his will'
    • Self interest.

    • I'd also like to add: The clintonites have had a lot to say lately. We should be thinking of why they're talking, writing and so on. Clearly Panetta wanted to let the big military and corporate handlers know that Hillary will be more hawkish - now comes this clown saying barry should be harder on Israel. This is pure Clinton tea leaf reading, no more.

    • You are out of your mind if you think jewish israeli's are leaving israel due to a lack of liberal democracy. can you PLEASE stop the projections, Phil.

  • Is ISIS a crisis for the so-called Jewish state?
    • Thanks for the great reads Keith!

    • I'd like to add: I find it both interesting and distressing that even some "radical" Americans are taking up the line of "ISIS is a threat to us, US strategy is in tatters, ISIS is bad for Israel, it's a big blowback etc etc" even Patrick Cockburn at counterpunch was saying these things.

      But what about the critical points Keith mentions in his comments here? How can Phil, and Cockburn and Blumenthal and others, in the face of ISIS rolling around in TANKS not ask themselves: What's really going on here? They're literally flying over ISIS positions to bomb the Syrian army. ISIS is attacking Hizbollah, but not Israel? What about the much talked about attack on Jordan? Never materialized, huh? Weird.

    • No way ISIS is bad for Israel. ISIS is probably the best thing that ever happened to Israel. I'm of course talking of "Israel as it is" not the Israel some hope it to be. They've already added the Golan Heights!

  • Israel and the g-word
    • Not sure what the point is here. Seems to me, if you're killing and expelling year after year with the goal of destroying a specific people your committing genocide, numbers be damned. The Palestinians are the objective enemy of Israel - their existence is what makes them the enemy. They're killed because they exist, and that's what makes their murder genocide.

  • It looks like Obama is checking out on Israel
    • I'm with you, Keith

    • I dunno, I'm a little skeptical about all of this. Seems like a distraction to me. Like I've been saying, the black flags are on Israel's borders; a large scale ethnic cleansing is very possible in the very near future - all of this talk about misgivings won't matter when it really hits the fan.

  • Where is the antiwar movement?
    • I'll be rooting for the Tumbril carts the next time it crashes, Seafoid. Tumbril Time!

      RIP Cockburn

    • Yep - I'd say so as well, Linda. One also becomes curious about the large amounts of money it must take to fly the code pinkers all over the world. She's probably as beholden to donors as the U of Illinois

    • Krauss - please reply to either Seafoid or myself - we'd love to hear about how the US and the West have little to do with the problems in the region, I assume Israel does as well. Let us know why we're wrong to think what we do and why it's just those crazy moooslims acting out on their own.

    • Krauss: "Others, like trying to blame America for ISIS, is mind-numbingly stupid. Sorry, it just is"

      Its mind numblingly stupid to put blame on the US for the rise of Isis? really? really? You talk of the last 100 years in the Islamic world like it's happened in a vacuum. No mention of the Brits installation of the Wahhabi kingdom in SA - themselves religious fanatics. No mention of our installation and support of several other "religious" kingdoms and Emirships.

      The fact of the matter is, the West in general and the US in particular has always found religious fanatics helpful in that region. They're naturally authoritarian, so they keep their populations "in line" so their countries can be opened up for western exploitation and they're also naturally "anti communist" which is code for anti secular nationalism. Secular nationalism being the only ideology suitable for real development, it has to be thwarted.

      Krauss - you do realize that the Wahhabi's tried to revolt against the Muslim Ottomans and they were put down quite well. They didn't get the kingdom on their own, they were installed, by the West - do yo deny this? The crawling counter attack against modernity? ha. How about the only counter attack available to them after 100 years of tyranny, assassination, occupation and ruthless exploitation.

      As for ISIS in particular, I think you can easily draw a straight line from our support for the Mujahadeen to the Chechens to the other fanatics in the Balkans to Al Qaeda, AQ in Iraq, Al Nusra and now to ISIS. ISIS is just the latest permutation to the virus we created. I'll also throw Hamas into the mix here, as they were more than just tolerated by the US and Israel when they were a potential bulwark against the ostensibly secular fatah party. Our support for religious fanatics is legion, that one can deny this is mind numbingly stupid.

      This was just too funny:

      "It’s a favorite past time of white people to pretend that they are omnipotent, in large part because that fuels the White Savour Complex many of them carry around. It also makes them more relevant in the discussion than they actually are."

      This is my point about Phil and most of the jewish writers here at MW on the topic of I/P. Thanks.

    • unfortunately, she's one of the many that believes not going full lefty is the only way to be viable. I never understood that math - if you don't go full left, you end up making the "let's be slightly better thugs" argument. Not very motivating.

      Also, I'll say this: the anti war lefts snobbery toward the right libertarian anti war movement is as big a problem as anything else.

    • I bet Medea Benjamin's a nice lady but she's awful at being a spokesperson. She always accepts the conventional parameters for discussion. All those horrible groups she mentions were started or enabled by the US. Saddam especially. They weren't awful on their own they were awful with our help. An important point I think.

  • Netanyahu lectures Americans on open housing and 'ethnic purification'
    • Bibi gives it away when he gives the breakdown on the new settlement demographics, "designated for Arabs, designated for Jews" sounds anything but democratic.

  • Salaita says UI appeased 'a few wealthy donors' and destroyed his career
    • I love Phils continuing insistence on counter balancing the "few wealthy donors" with a "few wealthy non zionists". I think Phil should be trying to empower non jews to have some backbone and tell the campus watch crowd to sit down and shut the F up. Empower the rest of us, Phil. Let us be rude and intimidating as well.

  • 'Ethnic cleansing for a better world' -- Richard Cohen says Palestinians brought the Nakba on themselves
  • Netanyahu erases the boundary between world Jewry and Israel in celebration of 'our country'
    • Can of worms reminds me of an important point, in extension to the one I made earlier. It works for the crime's of one's state government as well. In other words, Americans, regardless of their makeup, are also not blameless. There are of course many other countries where this also holds true; but especially for Americans, many of whom, when faced with the horrors of American policy, say stupid things like: we meant well but failed, mistakes were made or our soliders were in a terrible place and became savages because of it OR they don't even see or acknowledge the horrors.

      A large portion of the Americans here at MW who obsess over the israel lobby and public zionists I feel fall into the category of folks who don't see or acknowledge the other horrors the US plans and supports, and how the Israel project, as American planning goes, isn't all that different from it's projects in the rest of the world. For many of these people, the American state has been hijacked and good people in government are forced to tow a line they deep down inside oppose. This view in my opinion is unfair to American jews and it really lets the government and other Americans off the hook

    • cheap and distasteful throw away line at the end, peter. that's my bad. apologies to phil as well.

      I was just trying to bust his stones, cuz he uses "we" all the time, when he waxes sympathetic on the origins of zionism in europe. he associates with the suffering and a lot of mythology, but objects to any thought of "we" when violence and so on is carried out in the name of the group. Mine is a simple point: violent israeli zionism is only a click or two on the clock from where Phil is in his views. If you believe in the "we" yourself, you can only oppose those who are violent in the "defense" of the "we" so much.

      The other point is: too many "identity warriors", in the face of their group doing horrible shit, take up a line of: "that's not my (insert said identity marker here), those aren't my (insert identity marker here) values. In other words: I'm not responsible for this. Associate with the good or what makes you feel good and take no responsibility for the bad. I've never been a fan of this thinking.

    • "As Scott Roth always says, this conflation of Israel and Jewry is anti-Semitic. If Israel is the Jewish people, then Jews can justly be blamed for what Israel does. But that’s wrong: the Jewish community is actually diverse, and includes anti-Zionists, who don’t believe in a Jewish nation occupying Palestinian lands."

      That's not wrong at all, in fact, that's how morality works in a group setting. You've got it completely wrong, Phil. The rank and file in ANY group bear responsibility for the groups actions. Also, you're sort of poking holes in your rationale for MW - if Jews the world over aren't partly responsible for Israel's behavior, how could they possibly be important to the solution? how can they be so "important" yet blameless? Just doesn't make sense.

      I guess being jewish really does mean never having to say sorry.

  • Ohio treasurer fights divestment from the 'beacon of American values' in the Middle East
  • What Max Blumenthal saw in Gaza
  • Goldberg tries to police view that Israel's actions fuel anti-Semitism
    • I suppose I agree with Kirchick in principle; so did Hannah Arendt, who talked of when "the racism of myth meets the racism of experience." I'd say, in regards to Israel, a lot of the myths are well represented by their leaders and their supporters outside Israel.

  • US and Canada strengthen economic relationship with Israel following attack on Gaza

      Does that clown from Oxford know more than Tariq Ali? I think my name dropping trumps yours, by a good measure.

    • Please don't call me naive.

      You still seem to be saying that US/Canadian/Western policy on the ME is "greatly" influenced by Israel and by zionist jews outside of Israel. I say there's influence, but on the margins. The real thrust of the policy is EXPLICITLY stated here by British PM Bannerman in 1900 and goddamn 7.

      “There are people (the Arabs, Editor’s Note) who control spacious territories teeming with manifest and hidden resources. They dominate the intersections of world routes. Their lands were the cradles of human civilizations and religions. These people have one faith, one language, one history and the same aspirations. No natural barriers can isolate these people from one another … if, per chance, this nation were to be unified into one state, it would then take the fate of the world into its hands and would separate Europe from the rest of the world. Taking these considerations seriously, a foreign body should be planted in the heart of this nation to prevent the convergence of its wings in such a way that it could exhaust its powers in never-ending wars. It could also serve as a springboard for the West to gain its coveted objects.”

      [Dan Bar-On & Sami Adwan, THE PRIME SHARED HISTORY PROJECT, in Educating Toward a Culture of Peace, pages 309–323, Information Age Publishing, 2006]

      Pretty easy to understand, eh?

    • I always get a good laugh at comments like this. Canada (like the US) has "allowed" lobbies to slither in and so on. What nonsense. It's this sort of "we'd be ok if not for the jewish lobbies, our governments would act humanely" that to me is the worst kind of white/western supremacism. If "the west" acts barbaric or supports barbarians, it's the fault of some nefarious external forces, it's never ever the west (white folks) acting on their own. There's not a shred of integrity in comments like this. Leave me out of this bullshit. Complicit in Israel's crimes? We're the root fucking cause. QED

    • When I think of Canada, I think of a "key partner".....HAHA!!

      Even the Canadians themselves had to be thinking: "Umm, thats nice to say, but really, we just do what Uncle Sam says"

  • J Street can't tie Israel's latest 'illegal land grab' to cutting US aid
  • The rise of 'If Not Now' and the collapse of the pro-Israel consensus
    • You gave it away when you say they spurned JVP because it would out them beyond the pale. These cats arent serious at all. "Politically amorphous" hahaha!! Please stop trumpeting these people.

  • The best U.S. 'strategy' to combat ISIS? Stop supporting religious states
    • Walid yeah I know I was only refuting Phil's claim that Israel is the US's closest "ally"

    • Keith: hahaha! That last line was grrreat!!

    • Not sure what to make of this post. For starters, the Wahhabi kingdom of Saudi Arabia is the US's closest ally in the region, followed by the Fascist Dictatorship of Egypt. The US and Israel have no treaty between them, so Israel does not qualify as an "ally."

      It seems, Phil, like you believe Israel to be the only religious state the US supports. Far from the truth. Why does the US support religious states? Because they've traditionally been anti-communist. It was only when Israel was firmly in the "western" camp that it got special treatment, if it had stayed a socialist country, friendly with the USSR, things would have gone differently. If anything, Israel has become more religious over the course of it's relationship with the US.

      So, the real strategy to combat ISIS for the US should be: stop using religious fanatics to break up secular, multi-ethnic nation states in resource rich regions of the world. But this strategy only works if the goals are different, and right now the goals are domination and control of the entire world. Phil doesn't believe those are the goals, and that's why, in my opinion, he can't be right about the remedy.

  • Joan Rivers's Palestinian finale
  • Deconstructing J Street's statement on the latest Israeli land grab
  • British pol is beaten by man in Israeli army t-shirt, and the chattering classes are silent
    • This is in response to Krauss calling my thoughts "creepy" and accusing Galloway (and myself, I suppose) of weasel wording.

      Krauss - you apparently want him to say "Jews from Israel" instead of Israeli's - but you want him to do this knowing precisely what the reaction would be to him saying it; you call me "creepy" but yet you're here rooting for Galloway to "step in it". We all know that if you say "Jews" it better be in a positive context or else your toast. Gentiles don't get to toss that word around lightly, you know it, I know it - so who's the weasel here?

      What I found hilarious is your feigned ignorance here, all a part of your endless quest to sniff out anti semitism in those whose opinions you don't fully agree with, or whose personalities you find personally off putting.

    • I'd say he meant Jews from Israel - seeing as there is no such thing as "Israeli" - we do the zionists a favor by using the word Israeli. There are no Israeli's. The Supreme Court in Israel has said this time and again.

      The fact that Krauss is even nibbling at this is hilarious to me.

    • The reaction to the rage you expect would be overwhelming and not very kind

  • Elizabeth Warren says killing Palestinian civilians is 'the last thing Israel wants'
    • *Shocked* - Ha.

      Too bad the guy in the crowd didn't have any comebacks ready. For instance: "liberal democracies" have things called constitutions - Israel has no constitution. Not to mention fixed borders. Israel also has no "right to self defense" as if Gaza were a foreign entity; as the occupying power, Israel has an obligation to protect Gazan civilians like it would civilians in Israel. The other thing he might have said is: Go fuck yourself.

  • 40 Holocaust survivors condemn 'massacre' of Palestinians, call for BDS against Israel
  • Hillary Clinton just lost the White House in Gaza -- same way she lost it in Iraq the last time
    • Not sure who wins - but Clinton is deeply flawed and enough people loathe her that there might be a left third party candidate - or, the libertarians on the right might go all in, which could draw a lot of left libertarians like myself.
      The other thing is: in 2008 it wasn't widely understood that Bill Clinton was a big part of the Crash, that the deregulation on this watch lead to this. Now, though he's still popular, in a prolonged campaign, his record is somewhat of a liability.

    • Who knows - do you see him being any different on anything of importance (Rand Paul)? I don't.

    • The people who saw him give the keynote at the 2004 Democratic Convention knew who Barack Obama was in 2006. He was the party darling, he didn't come out of nowhere. There's no such person right now, that is both backed by the party big wigs and can tack left of Hillary. If you're saying a truly insurgent candidate is going to run and beat Hillary, your prediction of her losing in the primary is almost certainly going to be wrong. Hillary loses, but in the general election

  • 'Lesson: The Jews will defend themselves even if it means killing children'
    • Thing is - it's not judaism that's having different views projected on it, it's jewishness. This isn't about judaism, it's about jewishness.

      Funny that the Moose Man and Phil can be in agreement when they're talking about two different things.

    • So, I'm totally with Lozowick's #1 response. The rest is nonsense, but he does a good child of slapping down Phil's selfish and childish "I don't want to be a part of a collective...." plea. The collective is what it is; you can either deal with things how they are, or you can project your own values on them. The former is rational, the latter is just wishful thinking, pure and simple.

  • Rep. Sean Patrick Maloney dodges Gaza question (and how long can he get away with that?)
    • He didn't evade anything - he's for Israel. He's for our "national security" blah blah blah.

      I think it's about time for folks with liberal leanings to wake up and realize identity politics is a sham, most of the time it's a cover for Imperialism. Assuming someone "knows what's right" because he's gay or supports "womens issues" is naive, and frankly, stupid, in light of thirty years of Identity Warriors revealing themselves to be war mongers and apologists for the Surveillance State. One might even conclude there's a quid pro quo with Power: We let "you" in, you support the broad imperial (read military industrial) agenda. Tell me I'm wrong.

  • After Gaza
  • My friends say I'm being too nice to Hamas
    • Probably worth noting that the Israeli's were perfectly happy to deal with Hamas when they thought they could be used as a bulwark against the PLO. Their charter wasn't an issue at then....

      Also, if the rockets from Gaza are really so awful and dangerous, why was Bibi pressing the airlines to restart travel to Israel? They told the airlines basically "no big deal" and then go on CNN and talk about running for their lives.

      I'd have also told "Don" that Gaza is not "territory next to Israel" it's territory occupied and controlled by Israel, which means Israel is responsible for protecting it's civilians, just like in Israel. So, the question is, what if people fired rockets inside Israel, in say, Tel Aviv - does the GOI level Tel Aviv to "stop the rockets"? Me thinks not. Your friends are whack, man.

  • Gaza war gives rise to new Jewish group targeting Jewish institutions that support occupation
    • Hey Benny - I hope you don't think I believe "Judaism is a Zionist Monolith" that's not at all what I think.

      Part of the reason I think groups like these are misguided is precisely because they indirectly blame Jews and really Jews alone for what Israel is. My frank opinion is that Jews in Israel and their Jewish supporters worldwide are being took, by Uncle Sam and the West generally. I'm sure you've seen this quote before:

      “There are people (the Arabs, Editor’s Note) who control spacious territories teeming with manifest and hidden resources. They dominate the intersections of world routes. Their lands were the cradles of human civilizations and religions. These people have one faith, one language, one history and the same aspirations. No natural barriers can isolate these people from one another … if, per chance, this nation were to be unified into one state, it would then take the fate of the world into its hands and would separate Europe from the rest of the world. Taking these considerations seriously, a foreign body should be planted in the heart of this nation to prevent the convergence of its wings in such a way that it could exhaust its powers in never-ending wars. It could also serve as a springboard for the West to gain its coveted objects.”

      British Prime Minster Campbell Bannerman 1907 - The Bannerman Report

      [Dan Bar-On & Sami Adwan, THE PRIME SHARED HISTORY PROJECT, in Educating Toward a Culture of Peace, pages 309–323, Information Age Publishing, 2006]

      The Zionists were convenient. No one really cared about their beliefs or their "claim" to the land, they didn't get hoodwinked, they knew what life was going to be like for Israelis - it would be never ending war for as long as they could stand it. They were of course dooming the entire region to this kind of fate - along with wholesale economic exploitation and dictatorship, but the Imperial powers weren't really doing "The Jews" any favors, at least if you ask me.

      To me, the great failure of Zionism is that it didn't break the Jewish - Western Elite
      relationship. For centuries Jews were like the bailiffs for the ruling classes, doing a lot of the dirty work. Seems like not a lot has changed. So, if anything that rallying cry should be: We're getting taken for a ride by the same crowd that incited anti semitism when it suited them and were indifferent to the Holocaust.

    • I wasn't heated. And thanks Donald for not considering me anti-semitic. That means so much to me. I'm happy to have jewish folks start wholly ineffective, sectarian peace groups, I just don't see why it needs to be congratulated, publicized and so on. I'd be even happier if these same folks could just join existing Palestine solidarity groups and, you know, blend in, but that's probably too much to ask.

      Also, how many times do people need to be duped around here? A peace groups started by Jstreeters? That's "mainstream"? People with left tendencies never fail to be so incredibly naive. This might, might not be a brazen PR move, but no way am I giving it the benefit of the doubt.

    • A Jewish Voice For Peace (JVP)
      Jewish Unity for a Just Peace (JUNITY)
      Jews for a Free Palestine (JFFP)
      Jews for Justice for Palestinians
      Jews for Justice in the Middle East
      Jews for Peace in Palestine and Israel (JPPI)
      Jewish Peace Lobby
      Not in my Name
      JStreet, Jews Say No, If Not Now.....

      There's probably a shit ton more. How many groups like this need to be formed before folks say: Probably good intent, but wholly ineffective. And Donald, you're sort of a Tom for groups like this. You're always there to defend these groups, that are by definition sectarian given their titles.

      These groups make me think - and I know I'm not alone here - that it's as important for the only voices of criticism to be jewish as it is stopping the US/Israeli destruction of Palestine. And I think that's horseshit.

    • I'm comfortable with being an asshole, so here it goes: Yawn. Why in the world is this "news"? And once again, the blatant sectarianism (and frankly, self promotion) shown by jewish groups like this is just shocking. "Don't worry, the entire rest of the world, we got this."

  • Steven Salaita-- unremitting in criticism of Zionism and Gaza slaughter-- loses a job at University of Illinois
    • I bet a letter from a coalition of feminists would help this guy...........
      These tweets could have been sent from Blankfort or Atzmon, two guys banned here. Seems everyone is a little pregnant.

  • Video: If you voted for Hamas, Israel has a right to kill you, says president of NY Board of Rabbis
    • Hey Marnie - kiss my ass with the "Putin as Stalin" BS. That's utter BS - stop with this nonsense. If Putin can be tossed in with those others, where to put Barry O?

      Enough of the Putin bashing.

  • As night follows the day, deaths of 10 Israeli soldiers lead to deaths of 30 Palestinian civilians
    • Losing 53 troops in 22 days against a near defenseless captive population is not the mark of a top notch military. The Israeli brass know this.

  • ‘We have nothing left to lose. I would rather die with my family under the rubble of our house than have a humiliating truce’: Palestinian youth demand justice
    • Look at the smiles on the kids' faces in that picture - lives lived under embargo and bombing and yet they're smiling. Beautiful. The only smiling jewish israeli's I've seen pictures of the last few weeks have been the fascists on the hilltops cheering the bombs drop.

      Who would you rather stand with?

  • Hasbarapocalyse: Naftali Bennett says Hamas committing 'massive self-genocide'
    • When Wolf Fcking Blitzer seems ready to ask an Israeli politician "What the F is wrong with you, pal?" the worm has turned. Bennett is absolutely looney tunes

  • Obama humiliates Muslim guests at White House Ramadan event, endorses Israel’s Gaza assault and NSA surveillance
    • Isn't it funny how all the "progressive" non profit folks sound EXACTLY like the MBA's the supposedly counteract "it was a great networking opportunity (for me)..... the President told us to eat shit, but at least I got to smell his cologne while he said it." Ahh, to be invited to the Imperial Court. Really not a shred of integrity in that room.

  • And now a word from our Democratic Party standard bearer
  • Tel Avivians brave sirens for clothes in NYT story about 'Fashion during wartime'
  • To my fellow American Jews
    • Exactly. So why you busting my balls up thread?

    • We're talking about societal hierarchies Mooser. Jews as an identity group definitely have a hierarchy.

    • What if all the the BS about "standing with the oppressed" etc etc is all just that - a bunch of bullshit? A good smokescreen; witty PR?

      American Jews could become fervent anti-zionists tomorrow and it wouldn't matter - the hard core in the elite aren't going to change their stripes and they're who matters. Any identity group has it's hierarchy, and the hard core right wingers are at the top of the pyramid. And that's before you take into account the Imperial considerations of the US. This is a systemic issue; zionism, while a part, is not the only factor; zionism had to be empowered by external powers. People may argue that those powers were coerced or bribed or what have you, but the fact remains, the western Imperial powers all thought creating Israel was in their interests.

      If you clowns want to say there's "extra pressure on Jews" to renounce zionism or whatever, that's fine - I think that's absurd, this situation isn't the fault of everyday American Jews, and by "appealing" to them, that's the implication. I'll also say there's a certain arrogance in talking past the many non jewish readers here, but that's par for the course; I find it both interesting and sad that many of the jewish cats here, wanting so badly to "change" things go about it in the most stereotypical of ways: with a inter group conversation, pretending the other 99% of the world isn't there. Seems to me thats a long standing pattern in jewish history and it hasn't helped, to say the least.

    • Was it an appeal to "us all"? Was she calling to all "consciences and faiths"?

      Methinks not.

    • Can we have a lot less of this?

  • Israeli strike kills four Palestinian children playing soccer on Gaza beach
  • Rachel Maddow ignores the story in Israel/Palestine
  • Netanyahu says there will never be a real Palestinian state
    • I don't think Phil should be giving advice on the topic. That's all.
      The global community of justice?!? LOL.

      Are you twelve years old? Global community of justice. Ain't no justice, just us.

    • Put down those rockets kiddo's, Uncle Phil is reaching out to the American Jewish Community on your behalf....... Ha. Wow. What a crock. Weird how Phil is now playing that same "waiting game" so beloved by the liberal zionists "just wait and help us, we can transform.....don't shoot!" - puke.

  • Boston transit authority pulls 'apartheid' ads-- for 'demeaning' Israel
    • Annie - look into Keolis, they bought the MBTA commuter rail for a few years, not sure if they might be behind this. They're a french company

  • Chomsky and BDS
    • Who says they're really going to fight it?

    • This is actually a really illustrative example, if only discovered unintentionally by Jones.

      Weir, Blankfort and Chomsky are all Americans. Yet Only one of them is interested in discussing the crimes of the United States. What's more, Weir and Blankfort contend that if Israel and "The Lobby" weren't around, the US would be free to pursue it's "national interests" (which of course are never defined - you can ask yourself why) and it would pursue these interests in a peaceful way. They think this because there are so many other examples of the United States - since it's founding - acting in such a rational and benevolent way in it's foreign policy, especially toward non white countries.

      Chomsky is point is so basic and easy to understand it's not surprising that few here can comprehend it: If you are an American, you are a member of a society that deserves to be boycotted. Your country has killed - Murdered- or displaced tens of millions of people since the end of WW2. It's overthrown democratically elected governments the world over and most of the time it's replaces them with out and out fascists. Does anyone disagree with this? Can anyone here claim this to be untrue?

      So, why don't the Weirs, the Blankforts, the Walt's, the Weiss's talk about this - why wasn't there a "boycott businesses who benefit from the US occupation of Iraq" mass movement active on US campuses? I'll tell you why, because as hard as it is to criticize Israel here in the US, it's impossible to tell the truth about the United States - it's government and society without being pilloried by all sides, like Noam Chomsky has been for fifty years.

      "If Americans only knew" is bullshit propaganda. It assumes that if Americans did know, they would do something about it, because Americans are good and decent people. 'Mericuh! Is there ANY evidence for this being true? And what does it say about Americans that they could not know so much for so long - all the wars, all the coups, all the killing; in fact each time the United States is shown to be murdering and torturing or what have you, the same pathetic shit is thrown out there by "decent minded Americans" like Weir and Walt: "This not us, we as Americans are inherently against such behavior, our government is captured by dark forces etc etc" This is just the radical opposite of serious. I just got done reading Nick Turse's "Kill Anything that Moves" and one of the take away lines from it is: My Lai wasn't an aberration, it was an operation. The same can and should be said about US policy in the ME and in I/P in particular. Chomsky is comfortable saying these things, the others clearly aren't, they have to make themselves and their prospective partners feel better. Or as Jones says, it isn't practical.

      So, to me, on the point of "is it hypocritical for Americans to boycott Israel given the US's record" the answer is a resounding yes.
      On the question of divestment, Chomsky supports it - again, for a simple reason: it's directed (in the case of American citizens and groups) internally, to American corporations. It's Americans themselves "boycotting" American corporations.

      The last point I'll make is probably the most important - the failure of most BDS folks and especially the folks at Mondoweiss to see beyond themselves is what is going to really do them in. Right now their focus is on Presbyterians, EU councils and rock stars playing Israel when the real threat is marching toward Baghdad. And when they get to Jordan, and when the black flags can be seen through Israeli binoculars, that's the end of Palestine forever - because everyone will respect the right of Israel to defend itself (and Jordan) against the Jihadi's and no one will be there to see what happens on the ground. Some astute folks will know that ISIS is the creation of the US and Prince Bandar, but it won't matter. The goal has always been to "Arabize" the Palestinians, and there's no better tool for that than ISIS style pan-arabism. Israel dreams of the caliphate.

    • "This might not work as well as you think" is not "I am opposed to you."
      The rank immaturity and yes, cultishness displayed in this piece and in the comments is really off-putting. The guy doesn't agree with the platform whole-hog, Big Friggin Deal. Grow the F up, seriously. Learn to take some criticism without calling into question the life and work of people, especially Noam Fucking Chomsky. Next we'll probably have a piece about his work on behalf of the "Un-people" all his life was just a ruse to gain sympathy and the benefit of the doubt for himself and by extension his zionism.

  • 'Survival and well-being of the Jewish state' is a national security interest of U.S., Indyk says
    • You are not part of a "we" that was welcomed here, Phil. You're a born American. And you still seem incapable of understanding: No one was or is "welcomed" by the American people; the "American system" allows for economic integration, and to the extent an immigrant group proves beneficial to the system, they are given social privileges, like advocating on behalf of their group for example. But advocating alone is one thing, it's entirely another to claim a particular group has been "welcomed" or is "liked" etc etc. I mean, right wing Cuban Americans have a choke hold on US policy to Cuba, but they don't say that because they have influence at elite levels, the American people are on their side or aren't anti-hispanic or racist. They don't try and convince themselves that the whole or most of the country is on their side. It'd be naive and dangerous to do so.

  • Visit to Hebron (or How can I explain this living hell to a nice liberal Jew in Brookline?)
  • Liberal Zionists' denial of Israeli racism heightens danger to 'everyone living in this land' -- Blumenthal
  • Chomsky supports portions of BDS agenda, but faults others, citing realism and int'l consensus
  • Can a neocon change his spots (and come back as a liberal interventionist for Hillary Clinton)?
    • "I do not believe it is naive to believe that if he were to somehow become president, he would be more likely than Hillary Clinton to push back against the entrenched special interests like Wall Street, the neocons, the defense contractors, etc."

      I do. I think it's incredibly naive. I think Alex Cockburn had him pegged the best, he called him the "brass-lunged armchair bomber of Vermont" - you should look into his record. The guy is the Defense Dept's point man. Just shameful the way "liberals" convince themselves of the good intentions of politicians they "like."

    • It's going to be hilarious to read the "I'm for Hillary" posts and comments, that are sure to come, a few months from now. And if there's a "Enlist Bernie" post, I'll just laugh and then vomit. Oh, "liberals" how naive thou art......

    • "I support the bombing of Libya."

      - Phil Weiss.

      And I'd bet you said the same about the bombing of Yugoslavia by the Clinton regime.

      Phil the neocon.

  • What's your politically-correct World Cup bracket?
    • If Michael Bradley had made the trip to Brazil, the US might actually have had a chance to advance past the first knockout round.

  • 'Forward' editor says Presbyterian vote was anti-Semitic
    • The anti-semitism accusation, in my opinion, is really just projection, and says much more about how the accuser views the gentiles than the other way around.

  • The Banality of Religion: 'Prayer summit' at the Vatican fails to inspire
    • I haven't commented in a while, but this from Joe is just too perfect. He makes my point - and the point of so many others here - perfectly.

      I've been Eliss'd for a long while now. Hey, Phil, can we change it up here? I mean, I can write some self congratulating pseudo intellectual essays if you really feel it's necessary for the site - let's give another hack a try!!

  • A British Jew warns US Jewish orgs to heed rapidly-shifting world opinion
    • Well, I've give the writer this: it's not often the totally full of shit come clean, if only anonymously. Funny thing is, the writer doesn't even realize he's in the same paranoia cycle as the guy's who founded Israel. They're all trying to do their damndest for the tribe, just in different ways. Progress? I think not.

  • Liberal Zionists are the new front line against BDS
  • Democrats have no problem with Israeli envoy addressing GOP group opposed to Obama
    • Warren is a joke. She's allowed to say nice things about middling white folks from flyover country, but that's as far as it goes. You should have seen her foreign policy section on her website while she was running. Hawk.ish.

  • Ululating at Vassar: the Israel/Palestine conflict comes to America
    • Yeah, we're in a dangerous place, Schneiderman - these infantile brats you're schooling are going to be in charge of important institutions one day; I can't even fathom saying something like "you're disempowering us" - what the fuck does that even mean? Is that just post-modern lib arts school nonsense, or do people really talk like that now?
      You empower yourself. Hopefully with facts. If the facts are against you, yeah, you're "disempowered." Is it just me, or do the people debating this issue talk a whole hell of a lot about themselves and about their "feelings"? F your feelings, whoever you are.

      Shocking that Phil left feeling bad for Trip leaders - shocking. (Not really). And while Phil is feeling bad for them, maybe he should think about all the times jewish folks have had careers ended, pulled funding, manipulated schools, business and governments, called anyone and everyone not jewish an antisemite and so on; do you know how many Chomsky lectures I've been to where jewish cats have shouted him down, not letting him continue? You think he said "you're disempowering me?" Seems to me, the SJP crowd is taking a page out of the traditional jewish playbook: advocate for your position tirelessly, don't worry about tact, and take no prisoners. Not so much fun, is it Phil?

  • Michael Ratner's journey away from Zionism
    • I think you could say they've been synthesized, but have kept their original contradictions. Actually, the more I think about it, I'd say american imperialism and zionism were the two "antitheses" and neoconservatism is the synthesis. I havent smoked any weed yet today, so I might be confusing things.

    • Phil - I don't get why it's so hard for you to understand: it's not an either/or scenario between "Imperial Ambition" and "Neoconservative hubris" - it's dialectic.

      Also, you're really in no position to challenge Ratner - he evolved long before you did, and, let's put it this way - he'd have tossed out his sodastream maker without a second thought, Rabbi and mom be damned.

  • Dateline, Ukraine: How the State Department 'midwives' democracy
    • These idiots from the Obama administration are totally greasing the skids for a military dictatorship in the US - the Generals have to be going bezerk right now; we're a wrong move away from DefCon 1, all because of complete ineptitude - remember when Barry was sold as the more "competent manager of Empire"? Haha.

      Just when you thought the republican party was dead too. The "nationalist" blowback from this is going to be severe, "Mericuh looks weak!"; far right wing president here we come. With an american Gen. Sissi to follow.

  • Florida Jewish leader quits a Hillel board to protest bar on free speech
  • Capitalism and its contradictions: From Arizona to Florida to #UCLAdivest
  • Netanyahu mentions 'BDS' 18 times in denouncing movement and its 'gullible fellow travelers'
  • Thought experiment. Dateline Ukraine
    • Hophmi doesnt seem to mind the US supported neo-nazi's. Hmm. Well neither does Vickie Nuland apparently, she was caught handing out cookies to Svoboda thugs. I won't say anymore because we aren't allowed to discuss joint zionist - fascist projects here. Although there'd be plenty to talk about!!

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