Shingo: What you fear will happen is that the Palestinians would treat the Jews the way Israeli Jews have treated them.
This is definitely to be feared, yes. If history is any guide, such a tragedy would quite likely not end there.
Shingo: There’s only one justice. That which involved addressing the injustices that have been perpetrated, and only Israel has done that.
It would be a perverse justice if the Israeli Jews’ human rights are not respected in a post-BDS, post-Zionist scenario. That’s not the only consideration of course. But it is a real issue. A failure to think about preventable tragedies of the future is not going to right the wrongs of the past. I hope you are not implying all the injustice is on one side.
Shingo: Typical Zionist demands that the Palestinians prove their intentions in advance while refusing to do the same.
I already said I’m not Zionist. I am a critic of Zionism (though I admit my views tend to be pretty close to those of Peter Beinart’s). It seems a true observation even if Zionists use this as a talking point.
What institutions among the Israelis that can be plausibly said to be preparing for the burdens and responsibilities of occupation?
Shingo: You hasbrats had your chance – many chances in fact – and you blew it.
So those of us who have been advocating for a Palestinian state for many years now, and criticizing the Occupation, as well as the US Empire and imperialism more generally, are doing hasbara now? Doesn’t that stretch the meaning of “hasbara” to the point of meaninglessness?
I’m just a person who broods over history and is disturbed by it’s tragic dimension.
Shingo: It’s just that unlike you Israeli firsters and Zionists, Israeli Jews are not front and centre of the concerns of one state BDSers – something you probably find hard to believe.
I certainly don’t expect Palestinians to base their politics solely on keeping Zionists feeling secure or anything like that. Yet the issue of the viability of Jewish rights and physical security in an Arab majority is a real issue. You can’t wish it away. It has to be dealt with front and center. Any post BDS dispensation is probably a deal killer unless some case is made for why Israeli Jews should believe in it. Your righteous indignation against injustice isn’t substituting for that case.
And look, I too am slowly losing faith and hope in the Two State Solution. I still find the more compelling arguments to be from people like Ibish, Chomsky and Finkelstein. They seem to be more rigorous in pointing out the really serious difficulties with the One State/Arab majority scenario. Maybe we’re wrong. History has a way of passing ideas by. Long term, maybe Jewish Israelis could thrive in an Arab majority state. In all sincerity, point me to the best essay making the case for this (in an analytically rigorous way, hopefully)
Overall, I think for Americans such as myself, who are neither Jewish nor Arab or Zionist/anto-Zionist, especially those influenced by the social justice tradition of our churches, we look at this situation and mostly just want all the Palestinians and Israelis to avoid more tragedies.