Leon Hadar writes:
I'm attaching a link to an interesting piece by an Israeli writer, Ofra Yeshua-Lyth, who raises an issue –religious identity cards–that should concern American-Jewish liberals/libertarians who assume that Israel is "like America." A few years ago I was staying in a hotel in Athens when Greek-Orthodox religious leaders were campaigning against a plan to remove the religious identity of Greek citizens from their identity cards, which was one of the demands from Brussels that the Greeks had to accept as part of joining the EU. I was having a breakfast with an American-Jewish lady from Marin County, CA, who expressed astonishment that Greece had required citizens to list their religion. "Like in the Dark Ages," she complained. And of course she refused to believe me when I told her that Israel requires citizens to list both their "nationality" and religion on identity card (in the case of Jews, nationality=religion=Jewish).
Yeshua Lyth:
be a member of a nationalistic Jewish underground in the days before
the state of Israel was created. In the last eight years Ornan is
leading a group of about forty Israelis – most of them Jews according
to all religious criteria – who have taken a court action against the
state of Israel, demanding to be registered as "Israeli nationals"
rather than have their nationality defined by religion or ethnic origin
(e.g. Jewish or Arab).
A few thousand Israelis have signed some years
ago on the "I am an Israeli declaration."
It could help transform Israel's national identity, in an angry neighborhood:
that might have been created in thinly populated areas of Finland or
Canada. How long would it have taken to the local native minority to
crystallize into an angry underprivileged group vehemently opposing the
regime which discriminates against it? And how would Scandinavian or
Canadian neighbors, world famous for their good nature, react to the
way their relatives in the "Jewish Area" are treated?…
I dunno about the ID cards, but I have found that Hadar's latest piece, on the website of the loathsome 'Chip' Berlet, contains the usual bullshit: "failure to contain Iran’s rising power and growing influence through surrogates in Iraq, Lebanon, and Palestine", etc etc.
Chip Berlet loathsome? I am not a fan of Berlet, but find it hard to understand the extreme animosity against him.
What's your reason for it?
And no, (from another thread) I don't think you are an ignoramus. I simply think you are wrong, sometimes, and I concede the same right to you.
Israeli teudot zehut haven't indicated "nationality" since 2005.
The "Left Bank" group you got the "Israel in Finland" story from is as antiquated as their hero Stalin. And as rotten.
Its on the bar code now. Authorities can tell which group you belong to without appearing to do so, for those who might be offended. No improvement, just a bit of obfuscation.
Chip Berlet loathsome? I am not a fan of Berlet, but find it hard to understand the extreme animosity against him. What's your reason for it?
He is just a ZOG thought control cop under left cover, like Foxman, but sleazier, if you can imagine that.
Israeli teudot zehut haven't indicated "nationality" since 2005.
Wow, Eurosabra. Israel is so colorblind.
So do Israel's Arabs put their Jewish calendar birthdate on their ID cards, like the first-class citizens do?
No, LeaNder, cannot imagine that. This is because LeaNder is honest, moral, with a sense of fairness. Thus, LeaNder has no clue who and what he or she is dealing with when it comes to Zionists.
You can view LeaNder as a symbol of Never Again–Zionist version only. LeaNder is like the pious one who whips himself for activity
he/she never did. He is a perfect Zionist tool. Lost in his abstract world, fleshed out with NAZI realities that have now been reversed
in terms of thinking, and action on the ground, he is exactly the
opposite of Rachel Corrie. He/she is locked in a teutonic imaginative
embrace with the official narrative of Anne Frank.
He doesn't realize Anne Frank would embrace Rachel Corrie.
You know the Germans, at your feet, or at your throat. (Only half-kidding).
Israel exists mainly because Arab states considered their Jews as Jews, not Arabs, and their citizenship a worthless scrap of British-, French-dictated paper or bourgeois sophistry. The Iraqis violated their own constitution to wrench Jews' property and citizenship from them.
Like most successor states of the Ottoman empire, which began at the gates of Vienna, Israel regards its citizens' religion as their NATIONAL communal affiliation, whereas their CITIZENSHIP affiliation is "Israeli." Thus an Israeli Armenian is an ISRAELI citizen of the ARMENIAN NATION. Bear in mind that Greeks wanted to keep "Greek Orthodox" on their ID cards, and that that was a state formed by the 1923 "ethnic" cleansing, which dumped Greek-speaking Greek-citizenship Greek Muslims in Turkey.
That two-line ID card represents inalienable legal citizenship, which is more than any other Middle Eastern nation has ever done for its minorities, and only Tunisia has equaled it.
If Arab nations were capable of equal legal citizenship, 1m Jews would still be at home, and Israel would not exist.
MM,
Israel, unlike Lebanon, doesn't play "death by ID card".
Chip Berlet … is just a ZOG thought control cop under left cover, like Foxman, but sleazier, if you can imagine that. Posted by: Rowan | February 03, 2009 at 12:32 PM
It strikes me that this entire blog is about the ZOG – the Zionist Occupation Government – not of Palestine but of the USA. We just don't usually call it that, because of the term's wild and wacky associations, we call it 'the american jewish establishment' or something. James Petras calls it the 'Zionist Power Configuration (ZPC)', and again, he is talking entirely about the USA.
Its on the bar code now. Authorities can tell which group you belong to without appearing to do so, for those who might be offended. No improvement, just a bit of obfuscation.
Hats off!!!
You're a genius!!!
If Israel was capable of equal legal citizenship, there would be no need to criticize it. If it could manage to see its Palestinian citizens as equals, then it would not be capable of treating the Palestinians in the occupied territories like dogs. But so far its not been able to do that. And that is because it is set up specifically as a state for only some of its inhabitants(Jews). A state built on such a foundation see nothing wrong with treating others as lesser beings. It only objects when it senses, rightly or wrongly, that its favored group is being treated poorly.
For a good illustration of how Israel treats some of its citizens, see here:
http://www.jkcook.net/Articles2/0331.htm
The Israelis do not treat the palestinians in the disputed territories as dogs. It treats them as enemy aliens. And that is what they are.
Tree,
Citizenship IS equal, the vagaries of land use law notwithstanding, except for the 2003 amendment, which admittedly discriminates against non-citizen spouses of citizens.
Since Israel is the only country you criticize, using sui generis criteria, we will ignore you.
Hey, chris berel, on an earlier thread, you said the Palestinians were chickens, good for nothing but chicken soup. Nothing like the soul of your ilk.
The bar code of ID is still there. Jews A, Non-Jews B class in terms of citizenship. chris berel is like the elder Bush, who was amazed the first time he went shopping in a local supermarket. When they asked him for his bar-coded credit card. Yes, the same Bush who lost
his second term due to actually demanding Israel get rid of all its settlements or lose the annual welfare check–something Shrub, his DUI bible thumping son, learned well, and look what we have now. Phil is so right in claiming the jews are now more than half partners in the USA establishment–too bad for the rest of us.
From a report published in 2007 by the U.S. Department of State –
————
Muslim, Christian, and Orthodox Jewish religious authorities [within Israel] have exclusive control over personal status matters, including marriage, divorce, and burial, within their respective communities. Many Jewish citizens objected to such exclusive control by the Orthodox establishment over Jewish marriages and other personal status matters, and to the absence of provision for civil marriage. Approximately 306,000 immigrants from the former Soviet Union were ineligible to marry in Israel because they were not recognized as Jewish by Orthodox authorities.
Anyone wishing to marry in a secular ceremony, Jews wishing to marry in non-Orthodox religious ceremonies, Jews not officially recognized as Jewish by the Orthodox Jewish establishment but wishing to marry in Jewish ceremonies, and Jews wishing to marry someone of another faith must all do so abroad. The Ministry of the Interior recognizes such marriages when performed abroad. During the reporting period, approximately 300,000 citizens were not eligible to marry in Israel because they lacked religious affiliation. According to the Central Bureau of Statistics, between 2000 and 2004, 32,009 citizens married outside of the country. Almost half of this number–14,214–comprised couples in which both the husband and the wife were Jewish. A smaller proportion of this number–1,764–lacked religious affiliation in the country. Between 2000 and 2003, 5 percent of Jewish couples that qualified to be married by the Chief Rabbinate decided to marry abroad instead. Others decided instead to hold weddings unrecognized by the Government, including Reform and Conservative weddings and those conducted by Kibbutz authorities.
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2007/90212.htm
————
Whether or not religious affiliation is still indicated on Israeli ID cards as it used to be, it is certainly recorded somewhere in order for Israel's marriage laws to be enforced. The unusually large number of offshore marriages of Israelis prove the point.
"Like in the Dark Ages," the American-Jewish lady from Marin County exclaimed. Touché, madam. Own goal, as it were.
Article 3, Jordanian citizenship law of 1954: "Any person who, not being Jewish, held Palestinian citizenship before 15 May 1948."
Only a few thousand Arab Jews still hold citizenship in any Arab land, and they are Moroccan for the most part, "slaves" of the King, protected dhimmis. However wealthy or French-educated they may be, their status is defended through monarchy and dhimmitude.
I am sure all of you are urging recognition of Israel as a Jewish state and the signing of a final peace so that ALL nations of the Middle East can evolve in parallel towards totally liberal citizenship.
Or you simply hold Israel to different standards because of your enmity towards it alone.
Eurosabra, the point for Americans to consider is, does Jordan get
the annual welfare check Israel does, even in these USA trying economic times? Does Jordan policy get lockstep approval in the USA congress and Executive branch that Israel gets?
If it did, this blog wouldn't exist, or if it did, it would be discussing
same. Why don't you look at the points discussed here as an American citizen?
Why point to the Arab states? Nobody here on this blog is defending
their policies or USA catering to them.
Jeez, get a clue.
Jordan gets an insane amount of money per capita, given its small population, and pretty much whatever it wants in terms of security cooperation, although like Israel it is considered a reliable ally (unlike Saudi Arabia) and no real conflicts arise, mainly due to the remarkable resistance of Jordanian security forces to al-Qaeda infiltration. Jordan's huge Palestinian refugee population is alone of its type in the Arab Middle East, in that it is systematically denied the means and opportunity to drag the kingdom into war with Israel. The US thus bankrolls a situation which is good for Israel and Jordan, reducing cross-border terror since 9/11 to two al-Qaeda in Jordan rockets at Eilat.
The US Congress and executive branch have indeed never hesitated to grant the Little King and his son whatever they wanted, not because they are quislings–indeed, the Little King could not make "peace" before Arafat did–but because it is not US policy to return Jordan to the chaos of 1967-70 when that can be avoided so cheaply.
Jordan gets the second highest welfare check from usa taxpayers–but still absurdly less per capita than each Israeli gets:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-03-04-us-jordan_N.htm
However, I agree with you Eurosabra, Jordan gets an insane amount of free dole money per capita–and Israel 's annual dole is off the charts of sanity.
This is the begining They want us held closely close enough for us not to see them stabbing us in the back Along with identity formes cliques. What it does is make you feel as though you are a Jew not an Isreali, or an Arab not an Isreali(even if you were born there, this article seems biased towards Jewish problems and not realizing that this affects everyone) Therefore when the government makes decision there will be even more distrust more anger, confusion and hate, and distrust in this system. Ultimatly we are all going to have computer chips in our arms, and someone always watching. Children taken form their mothers at birth, While we all die inhumanly penned together like cattle in the ghettos that we try to make seem like home. In this wasteland marin county, contra costa and every other county and Country will suffer its own for control And our masters dont care about you or me or our familys, our masters care about what they'v always cared about, it's controlling the whole damn world.