Commenter Profile

Total number of comments: 27029 (since 2009-07-30 20:11:08)

Annie Robbins

Annie Robbins is Editor at Large for Mondoweiss, a mother, a human rights activist and a ceramic artist. She lives in the SF bay area. Follow her on Twitter @anniefofani

Showing comments 27029 - 27001

  • Sam Harris and the dangers of false atheism
  • Letter from Baltimore
  • Netanyahu eulogizes settler movement founder convicted of manslaughter
  • The U.S. is at last facing the neocon captivity
    • “generally favor military action to get rid of (anti-American governments)”..... You simply made this up.

      the vast majority of jeff's analysis here he "simply makes up" (and the twists and turns when you call him on it trying to shimmy out of it). he presents it as fact instead of his flawed wishful thinking. people should just ignore him (including me). it's like junk food cramming up the discourse, bad for ones health. and a paper tiger to boot.

    • another great article phil. it will be condemned by the usual cohorts as "counting jews" but so what? it's true, every word of it is true. i'm so sick of all the silencing.

  • Netanyahu: Jerusalem was always the capital 'of the Jewish people alone'
    • Jews seems like a nice neutral 3rd party between Christian and Muslims - See more at: link to

      ??? nice? neutral? 3rd party between Christian and Muslims? what are you smoking dude?

    • thanks kay. just read your excellent history of jerusalem link.

    • BDS mythos. ... And they picked it up from Soviet anti-Zionism who got it from the Nazis. Salaita ....

      ;) you are sooo desperate jeff.

      You are right those positions you created contradict

      actually i quoted you contradicting yourself. i'm not missing your argument, i am debunking it while easily demonstrating your hypocrisy at the same time. you on the other hand are not countering it or addressing my questions -- your just engaging in diversion BS, like this:

      I’m not presenting evidence in this post. I do think the Palestinian case is easily torn apart from the archeological evidence of non continuity. But I’m not doing this with you ..

      shorter jeff:

      'yada yada pt #1 - #6 unsourced, diversion, evasion, and that's my opinion.'

      got it!

      and what, pray tell, is this:

      The Palestinians claim to be culturally descended from the inhabitants of Judaea. I claim (4) is impossible because their culture shows signs of hard breaks, particularly in the area of language.

      you are a coward jeff. your argument is so weak and pathetic you're afraid to post it under "reply" and continue to spam the thread by not posting underneath the comment you are responding to so as to create a break in the dialogue and make it difficult for people to follow the conversation.

      fyi ziad addressed this stupid allegation of yours ...Palestinians adopted Arabic after the emergence of Islam - See more at: link to

      you do not counter any arguments (nor acknowledge your hypocrisy wrt "They can’t be both."), you just double down on your opinions. what's good for the goose is good for the gander jeff. you got no argument. i'm not interested in speculative opinion from a robot hasbrat.

    • brilliant Zaid!

    • The claim is they are original to the region and were there for 3000 years. That’s the thesis that your side is defending. That there is a continuous pure ethnic group directly descended from the inhabitants 2000+ years ago with little or no external breeding. - See more at: link to

      "The claim"? "the thesis"? what/whose claim/thesis jeff? who, besides you, said palestinians were a "pure ethnic group ... with little or no external breeding."? according to you this is "the Palestinian delusions which you are feeding" but who's feeding this crap? only you for the benefit of arguing against it. that's called a strawman you little paper tiger. and a pathetic one at that.

      and you said this, right?:

      Jews obviously interbred with the European populations so that they now look European. And I don’t care about genetics. That doesn’t however mean they aren’t descendants of ancient Jews......either they are the original population or they are a mixed group formed from different waves of peoples. They can’t be both.- See more at: link to

      so which are they (jews)? the original population or a mixed group from different waves of people. according to you they can't be both.

      pure ethnic group directly descended from the inhabitants 2000+ years ago with little or no external breeding. If you willing to concede that no continuous ethnic group - See more at: link to

      in case you think anyone here is an idiot and didn't notice how you morphed "pure ethnic group directly descended from the inhabitants 2000+ years ago with little or no external breeding" into "continuous ethnic group" i've got a bridge to sell you from the sahara.

      or do you plan on arguing jews do not constitute a continuous ethnic group because they are not pure nor directly descended from the inhabitants 2000 years ago with little or no external breeding? according to you -- can't have it both ways!

      see how easy this is?

      The BDS movement stands firmly with the anti-colonialism and embraces permanent racism as policy. - See more at: link to

      by all means quote them directly. they have a web site y'know. oh, you can't. you're content to spew paragraph after paragraph of unsourced garbage (lies) masquerading as argument. it's no argument jeff.

    • Under USA law link to

      not, which is why the law has never been implemented.

      Constitutional separation of powers[edit]

      Under the Constitution of the United States the President has exclusive authority to recognize foreign sovereignty over territory.[23] The Justice Department Office of Legal Counsel concluded that the provisions of the Embassy Relocation Act inveighed exclusive presidential authorities in the field of foreign affairs and are unconstitutional.[24]
      U.S. presidents Bill Clinton, George W. Bush, and now Barack Obama have alluded to or explicitly stated the belief that Congressional resolutions attempting to legislate foreign policy infringe upon the Executive's authority and responsibility to carry out sound and effective U.S. foreign relations.
      Regarding the status of Jerusalem specifically, President Bush had deemed Congress' role as merely "advisory", stating that it "impermissibly interferes with the President's constitutional authority".[25] The U.S. Constitution reserves the conduct of foreign policy to the President and resolutions of Congress, such as the ones found in the Authorization Act of 2003 that included the Jerusalem Embassy Act's provisions, makes the arguments in favor of legislating foreign policy from Congress extremely problematic if not arguably invalid for that Constitutional reason.

      so sad for israel we have 3 branches of government and their only in full control of one of them.

  • Settlers Supporting Settlers: Towards an explanation of the US/Israel relationship
    • they had been in the Holy Land continuously for thousands of years.

      no, the overwhelming majority of them and their ancestors had not. sorry, this is not a situation where a minute fraction can represent the whole kitten kaboodle. you can't compare this to native americans.

    • i agree steve, really good article.

    • Tamir said, “Asia is basically the continent of the Yellow race. Australia and Israel do not belong to it – we basically belong to the White race.” Further, “Israel and Australia are like sisters in Asia. We are located in Asia but without the characteristics of Asians, our skin is not yellow nor are our eyes slanted."

      Australia is not in the continent of Asia. it is in Australia/Oceania.

  • 'Forward' reports what 'NYT' covers up: Jews for BDS
    • when they marry some will marry other jewish people and some will not. but they'll all probably raise jewish kids, when they have kids. they wouldn't be on the trip if they didn't identify as jewish.

  • 'This is where we are, and we are not leaving here' — Notes from BirthWrong
    • No chick.
      What’s very sad is that a village in Spain chose to keep it’s anti-Semitic name for 500 years.

      actually you don't have a monopoly on what's sad jack. i had a similar response to your initial comment as blah chick and i too think it's sad. it doesn't mean what happened to jews hundreds of years ago in spain isn't sad also.

      What’s galling is that Max buys into the ‘Golden Age’ myth and whitewashes 1000 years of Jewish suffering under Islamic rule.

      hm, not so sure that accurately characterizes what i'm gleaming out of his (excellent) recent reports. link to

      you sound upset.

  • Scott Walker's foreign policy education begins w/ lesson: East Jerusalem is not occupied
  • In Israel, racism is standard procedure
  • Ilan Pappe on the western awakening and what it means for Israel/Palestine
    • Disseminate the correct political catechisms to the poor benighted students.

      one problem from my perspective is these kids are smart. stanford, berkeley, the whole UC system. i don't think they'll get far convincing these kids pro palestinian advocacy is anti semitic. it's just same ol same ol and this sort of hasbara (accusations of AS when people criticize israel) has been around for a long long time. it's just not a compelling argument.

    • ;)

      whoever it is i am appreciative tho. it's time consuming!

    • what creative thinking robert.

    • My so called marxist multi millionaire parents have been impressed by Israel’s savage behavior. They are Marxist Zionists who actually have values, and my dad told me last week that he is proud to be a Socialist and is glad we are European Jews,

      oy vey oh my

    • yep, someone else has been doing lots of moderation.

  • 'NYT' and 'MSNBC' leave Marco Rubio backer's Israel agenda out of the story
  • Front-page attack in New York Times says BDS movement is driven by minorities' 'hostility toward Jews'
    • catalan is a numbers man

      a hasbara train wreck if you ask me.

    • It’s more like, these things are outside of their sphere of interest, like some stone on a distant planet.

      how do you know what people read online catalan?

      i lived in new mexico for many years, my son was born there and my mom's from there. there are definitely political people there and a very robust palestinian solidarity movement. NM is home to the stop30billion campaign link to which has now spread all over the country facilitating billboard ad campaigns in major cities. (we've written lots of articles about their projects) they also have a very active jvp in albuquerque and sjp at NMU -- you're just wrong, flat out wrong.

      and this conference was packed (note the heavy handed pushback): link to

      here's one of my favorites from 2011 that links to a few older mondoweiss NM articles link to

      we've run at least 15 - 20 articles about or connecting to NM activism. it's a very active pro palestine state with a relatively large pro palestine activist community.

    • keith:The vast, vast majority of the people in crimea (and I mean way up in the 90+% majority) want to be part of Russia and not part of the new coup orchestrated Ukraine. Furthermore those in eastern Ukraine held their own referendum and way over 90% voted to (once again) be a part of Russia - See more at: link to

      ckg I have to agree with oldgeezer.

      catalan: lalalala i can't hear you!

    • Page: 270
    • shorter hops. 'i'm going to avoid discussing the jewish kid who got caught link to and instead focus on the mystery swasticas that haven't and pretend they had.'

      and ps, notice no one claimed "Every instance of antisemitism is dismissed". but really hops, you can't pin down what happened at davis now can you? try sticking to conclusive events.

      can you back this up: Several BDS campaigns have included the appearance of swastikas on Jewish fraternity houses. - See more at: link to

      because what it looks more like to me is Several counter BDS campaigns have included the appearance of swastikas on Jewish fraternity houses. it's not too hard to figure out who this helps. the mainstay argument of counter divestment folks is how their ideological opponents are hateful and anti semitic. so the appearance of these swasticas supports their meme. they have as much to gain from this (or more) than anyone else. so why not produce one instance where a campus bds group has been caught placing one of these swasticas? because you can't that's why. pff.

    • So what? Caroline Glick is a far-right op-ed columnist. She’s not the sum total of Israel.

      #fail. no one here, certainly not myself, claimed these allegations represented the "sum total" of israel (keith wrote "we are not talking about Jews in general"). if you'd like to argue this meme doesn't exist, have at it. you're the one who insinuated gentiles being “demonized” by the Jews doesn't happen. what's the point? and i still don't get your reference to fox news. did they claim that?

      please explain yourself. it's a well worn meme, everyone knows that. doesn't mean it's all invasive and no one claimed it was.

      ” i think we’re all familiar with the promotion of the idea anti semitism is rampant or growing”

      Why can’t you simply acknowledge that antisemitism IS growing?

      stop your cherry picking at the exclusion of my point:

      i think we’re all familiar with the promotion of the idea anti semitism is rampant or growing .... at the exclusion of bigotry towards others which is not given the same sort of attention in the press. - See more at: link to

      but you’re an antisemitism denier.

      triple yawn. anti semitism definitely exists, all better now? and we all note your evasion/diversion; the topic i was discussing, which you commented on, was "gentiles are being “demonized” by the Jews".

      another hasbara fail by hops. you're such a transparently lousy arguer. one ad hominem set up after another.

      edit, and i'd like to point out one more thing. when glick made the statement at the jpost journo conference that all europeans were anti semites (paraphrasing, i think she attributed a disease to them obsessive compulsive jew hatred or something) many many right wing blogs lauded her diatribe and reran the video on their blogs. so this is not rare in the least. you want to carve out this space of "moderate" zionists, so be it. i'll be the first to disagree that all zionists (jstreet sorts etc) are compulsive demonizers of gentiles. they aren't, ok. but you take the cake trying to frame me as in the same comment as trying to distance yourself and others like you from the charge.

      take a break and regroup, you're sounding very hypocritical today hops.

    • nothing more to say gil. thanks. and i got a little ruffled -- sorry. it's not your fault.

    • jeff, can you source some of these allegations regarding venezuela please.

    • gil, have you checked out blaine's archives? aside from this article, let's try 5/3 (or pick almost any comment)

      Let everyone speak as they please, including Max. Let them be funny or serious, as they wish. The problem is that there is nothing yet that resembles a movement. - See more at: link to

      or 5/2

      why bother with Mondoweiss? Because it's an extremely valuable resource for boycott-Israel activists on campus -- what's missing is the activists. There is no student on any campus campaigning for boycott of Israel. They are terrified to even be accused of that.

      So the very few, honorable students pushing for "BDS" spend one month a year pushing to form committees to consider divesting from a few companies that contribute to the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and the Israeli bombardment of Gaza.....the BDS crew has designed it to be really hard to understand. This is how they protect themselves from accusations that they seek to boycott Israel itself. Yet they really should demand total boycott of Israel itself.

      So we get one month of weak divestment resolutions each year, and a menu of tasty Mondoweiss articles

      - See more at: link to

      another, to Max:

      A few years ago, I begged you, in Ann Arbor to please mention boycotting Israel in your presentation. You simply could not do it. Now it's fashionable -- so you do speak favorably of BDS, to those who invite you. A good time is had by all -- and it never appears in the mass media.


      Enjoy your junket, lubricated with the tears of 15th-century European exiles. It would have been timely and important 600 years ago.

      But today, if you're not marching into the big city councils of the United States, demanding a total boycott against "Israel", you are no more than coffee-table chatter for those few who read Mondoweiss.

      - See more at: link to

      i am working my way down the list. note all his nagging criticism is focused on people in the movement. Apr 11:

      I've noticed that Mondoweiss is flatly not covering a number of divestment campaigns, for example at the University of Michigan two weeks ago.

      Your emphasis is less on protest, more on whining without acting.

      - See more at: link to

      need i go on? we've been hearing this mantra from blaine for years. he doesn't really comment on much else accept complaining what a lousy job we're doing. it's a broken record.

      My main point was that the issue of whether the current BDS-Lite is working or whether a stronger version is needed is an important discussion.

      well that's not my main point gil. my main point is that calling phil and activist "whimper and whine(r)" telling phil to "Grow a backbone". coming on top comment, on an (excellent) article reviewing and critiquing the nyt with advice like "If you want a better article, try yelling for a total boycott against Israel" as if mondoweiss has some position on only boycotting the settlements (we don't) or that we solely run articles advocating bds limited to the settlements (that's not our policy) and these sorts of comments are not aberrations they are (as far as i know) almost exclusively what blaine writes here. it is, for the most part, as far as i can tell, a rant directed at us.

      extending BDS to cover Israel, not just its settlement-produced products, is not intrinsically disrespectful of the immense efforts of JVP and MW.

      imho, blaine's very much are.

      Discussions about whether tactics or strategies are working are important.


      My advice to him would be tone it down several notches and try to persuade people to accept his point of view.

      glad you mentioned that. because i only heard the part about our snarkyness and ad hominems.

      As to MW editorial decisions about what to publish, that’s your call. Those decisions are difficult to make

      it's not my call what we publish. it's only my call what i want to work on and draft. and that call is not difficult at all for me. for others not having read blaine's article nor viewed his submission, not only do i find it outlandish and highly unprofessional he would drag the rejection into this thread, along with my name attached to his complaint to debate it here (and whoever moderated his comment dragging my name into it, and you can believe it was not me) to have to come on here and defend my decision, the idea it's even a debatable topic is absurd. he could try getting it published elsewhere.

      i am not alone in being hostile to his tone. locals have noticed: link to

      i think it is quite telling he's chosen to deny the option to post the video we rejected into this thread! it would be an excellent example of how NOT to advocate for palestine, which i told him and explained thru several emails!

      so he can go on denigrating mondoweiss, phil, me, activists on campus, whatever. but for me, the over riding emphasis of his advocacy is not a discussion about "whether tactics or strategies are working are important" it's about bashing bds tactics and the bds movement. and i'm not going to be part of it.

    • i don't think he can link to the writing unless it's self published, but he could blockquote the text. the video he could link to, assuming he's downloaded it somewhere, no one is stopping him. he could put it on youtube and link it to the comment section.

    • smart, a no brainer actually.

    • Is that why you feel, like Fox News, that gentiles are being “demonized” by the Jews?

      i wasn't aware fox news was promoting the concept gentiles were being demonized by jews. do tell!

      but what keith mentions (quoting goldberg one presumes) about “irrational, eternal Gentile hatred of Jews” is nothing new. glick has made this allegation in numerous videos and i think we're all familiar with the promotion of the idea anti semitism is rampant or growing or whatever (it's invasive all over the press and a mainstay of zionist propaganda) at the exclusion of bigotry towards others which is not given the same sort of attention in the press.

      in an environment where islamophobia is promoted (often/generally by the same cohorts promoting the anti semitism theme) and african americans are routinely gunned down in the streets by law enforcement (jews are not subject to this kind of racism certainly) how someone can deny there's a demonization campaign going on -- well, i find it startling. or are you implying hasbara central is suggesting all this anti semitism is coming from self hating jews? otherwise, it's very much a demonization of gentiles, non zionists in particular. protesting against israel's apartheid policies is not anti semitism. conflating the two, which is a campaign supported by millions of dollars, is demonization.

    • Blaine Coleman
      May 10, 2015, 11:27 am

      .....You’ll get better articles when divestment resolutions are stronger, louder, and non-stop, all semester, every semester.

      irishmoses May 10, 2015, 5:55 pm
      Hey, Blaine has a point. Fiddle fucking around with BDS on the edges to hurt Israeli manufacturers for products made in the territories is a pathetically weak response for a state that has been knowingly committing apartheid for half a century. link to

      irish, thanks for linking to your excellent article. however, in the context of blaine's remarks i notice your article doesn't tackle the ineffectiveness of campus activisim on american campuses that he has a penchant for continually harping on.

      i have a suggestion, since you are a great writer, why not try to work with him "editing" his articles, or better yet write one on your own denigrating the work of student activists reduced to a "series of whimpers". inform them of how they could be more effective and do it better. of course, i can't guarantee an article like that will get published here but you could give it a shot. and if that sounds snarky, i'm serious. i'm really not sure there's any amount of lipstick you could put on that pig to make it publishable, but you could sure as heck give it a shot.

    • blaine, i did not "flatly omit" your submission. the final say on what's published on MW is always at the discretion of phil and adam. whenever i think a submission (sent solely to me, as opposed to cc'd to phil and adam) is not worthy of publication i send it to them. i am not the gatekeeper of what gets published here and you can always send things directly to submissions@mondoweiss (see our about page) and those get picked up by adam and phil. iow, i don't have final say. when you pressured me to explain why i didn't think your video was worthy of publication i explained this to you. neither phil or adam were impressed by your video and text (which was also unpublishable).

      * See link to (2014)

      * See also link to (2014)

      your communication to me i recall rejecting was not last august and you have not included the rejected video in your comment above so those are not "examples" of what you sent that we had multiple exchanges about. why is that?

      Is that really something of no interest to Mondoweiss readers?

      why not simply post a link to the video that was rejected and let readers judge for themselves. it included an older gentleman (not "a kid") discussing/lecturing on the holocaust out on the sidewalk after the protest inside the city council meeting. i'm sure you have it. it was not recorded by local news staff or attached to a news article as i recall. i'm sure you know what video i am referencing, i sent an extensive email explaining why i thought it wasn't suitable for publication. unfortunately my old computer crashed last december so i don't have a record of our exchange anymore or i would post it myself.

      there are many people in ann arbor who can write, why not have someone else report about these protests or send in a forward to the news article? or, if you think i am the impediment to why your submissions get rejected simply send them directly to phil and adam. i am one of 5 editors on staff. why are you sending me your submissions if you think i'm the reason you're not getting published here?

      i must say, i find this to be an extraordinary exchange. many submissions have been rejected over the years, but this is the first time i have ever witnessed someone complaining in the comment section about their submission being rejected or blaming me for that. why not take up your complaints with phil or adam? also, have you tried other publications? is anyone else publishing your work? also, i don't know how to edit videos, that's not something we do and your text was unpublishable imho.

    • mooser, note how blaine does not link to the video i objected to. besides, it was not a student protesting i objected to. but i sent it to phil and adam. it wasn't publishable imho.

    • Thus BDS has morphed into a series of whimpers to please form college committees to please consider possibly selling off stock in a few American companies which do bad things to Palestinians.

      it's blaine again, brightening up our day.

  • Needing a 'crash course in foreign policy,' Scott Walker heads to [Guess which country]
    • me too. and here's something else i said

      "literally, i am repulsed."

      it's just -- how long can this go on? how blatant? this traipsing to israel for the anointment. this pandering to jewish billionaires. i mean really! and then the howls and screams of "anti semite" if one suggests rich jews are virtually ruining the election process in this country when getting on the ballot requires this pandering. then the commercials phase where no normal person can compete with the millions poured into the coffers of israel supporting competitors. it's sick and disgusting. it's exhausting and repetitive. i feel like it's a rerun everyday almost reading the news.

    • It’s gross.

      that was my exact phrasing (in email) to phil this morning about this story - except i didn't capitalize.

  • An open letter to Pamela Geller
  • 'Most reactionary government in Israel's history' -- when will liberal Zionists hit bottom?
    • link to Coalition committed to making anti-leftist-NGO bill law..If the bill becomes law, an NGO seeking a tax exemption for a contribution from a foreign state will require ministerial and Knesset approval.

      The so-called NGO Bill will be brought before the Knesset during the tenure of the new government, according to a clause in the coalition agreement between Habayit Hayehudi and Likud.

      The wording of the bill submitted by Habayit Hayehudi stipulates that an NGO seeking a tax exemption for a contribution from a foreign state will require the approval of the defense and foreign ministers and the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee.

      The NGOs likely to be affected by the bill are primarily human rights organizations identified with the left.
      The bill was proposed by MK Ayelet Shaked, who is tapped to be justice minister in the new government. The original wording stipulated that an NGO seeking tax exemption would need the approval of the justice minister and the Knesset Constitution, Law and Justice Committee.

      With Habayit Hayehudi holding both positions in the next government – it will also get the committee in terms of the agreement, with MK Nissan Slomiansky likely to head it – the party will have complete control over NGOs requiring tax relief – if it decides to revert to the original wording.

  • As presidential field broadens, GOP candidates race to show their love for Israel
    • how depressing. i'm trying to find the silver lining in all this. hopefully it will wake up america and instigate a nationwide argument about the criminal state. i'm imagining israel getting dragged into the hague during the months leading up to the election.

  • Shit Israeli soldiers did in Gaza
    • it's not sacrilegious at all bintbiba. besides, we know there's a much larger arena of trauma and pain behind the "we left Jerusalem on May 2nd, 1948" than your simple phrasing implies.

  • Searching for my grandmother's home in Yafa
    • created in .... the age of telephones, televisions, cars, airplanes, etc

      unsustainable in the age of internet, cell phones and social media

    • speaking of sadistic, remember allison's article A tale of two Susiyas, or how a Palestinian village was destroyed under the banner of Israeli archeology - See more at: link to

      well, check out this Press Release:

      Israeli state pushes Court to take an unusual step threatening immediate demolition of an entire Palestinian village

      By refusing to issue an interim order until the case is heard, the court is allowing for the demolition of the Palestinian village of Susya and subsequent expulsion of its 340 residents to Area A.

      The refusal of the state to the request of an interim order freezing the demolitions suggests it has plans to demolish the village in the near future.

      The court allows the state to destroy the village before even deciding on the case.

      Jerusalem. May 6th, 2015: Yesterday, May 5 2015, Israeli High Court Judge Noam Sohlberg rejected the request for an interim order by the Palestinian village of Susya, represented by Rabbis for Human Rights, in a petition against the Civil Administration's decision to reject the master plan prepared by the village and against subsequent demolition of the entire village.

      The village argued that their plan was rejected for non-professional reasons and that the village should be legalized due to its unique history. The residents sought an interim order to freeze the implementation of the demolitions until the petition is heard, as is standard practice in these sort of cases.

      It was against this request for an interim order that Justice Solberg, without even conducting a hearing on the request, made the unusual move of granting the state's request not to freeze the orders. This decision means that the Civil Administration can now destroy Susya at any time. The demolition of the village will lead to hundreds of residents living in the desert with no roof over their heads and may result in their displacement. The state’s refusal to commit to waiting for a conclusion to the court proceedings raises great alarm that it intends to implement the demolition order in the near future; tragically, it seems the villagers are in real danger.

      In the petition, Susya's residents claimed that the army is obliged to legalize their village as it was the one to confiscate their land and their caves in 1986, leaving them without a housing solution and forcing them to move to their adjacent agricultural lands. As evidence to the life in the village prior to the expropriation, various testimonials and photographs of life in caves were presented to the judge. Among other things, there were documented photos of a visit by the US Consulate to the village at the beginning of 1986. The photos and testimony clearly shows that the Palestinian village of Susya is an old village formed prior to the Israeli occupation and the declaration of the area as an archaeological site.

      Among the evidence was the opinion of the late governmental legal adviser Plia Albeck (considered to be very pro-settlement and who wrote in her memoirs that she tried to find legal ways to declare Palestinian land as State land), indicating the existence of a Palestinian village in 1982 where today the archaeological site stands.

      Despite the evidence presented before him, revealing the many injustices done to the villagers – from the expropriation and dispossession of their lands, to the refusal by the state to recognize the status of the village in its new location - Judge Sohlberg did not agree to hear the case before allowing the demolishment the village and setting the fate of its inhabitants.

      Attached to the petition, inter alia, was an expert opinion by Prof. Eyal Benvenisti, a renowned expert in international law, stipulating that the demolition of the village of Susya constitutes a war crime.

      This week, a report by radical right-wing NGO "Regavim" (which has close ties to the settlement enterprise) was exposed indicating that in the nearby Jewish settlement, also called Susia, there are 23 illegal homes built on private Palestinian land. We have no indication of any attempt by the state to demolish these illegal structures in the settlement Sussia or in its nearby outposts. We see in this current situation that this Jewish settlement, whose very existence is prohibited by international law, and where some of its homes are sitting on private Palestinian land, is prosperous, while the Palestinian village of Susya, whose inhabitants are on their own private land, is at risk of displacement and loss of their entire village.

    • thank you Tamara! i am so ready for round 2 of this story ;) i love it.

  • Netanyahu appoints Ayelet Shaked—who called for genocide of Palestinians—as Justice Minister in new government
    • hmm, i'm not sure who cleared tony's comment for moderation but we're not supposed to discuss the holocaust on this level here because it leads to these very kinds of discussions. that said, i think, according to the kastner trial (lots came out in the trial) and argument could be made in tony's favor, which doesn't mean the majority of zionists or zionists "more broadly" at all, but key figures in the zionist movement (as opposed to your argument jeff regarding the Vrba-Wetzler "widely decimated") would not have existed had zionism not existed, so in this regard he's got a point (he qualified by using the word "indirectly" and was not referencing the holocaust in its entirety).

      anyway, i don't think debating these topics or challenging these specific points means one is an anti semite, otherwise all the judges who came to their conclusions in the kastner trial would be deemed anti semites.

      and on the other point, it is not a translation issue jeff. attributing hate to someone (which is something i don't even do to ideological enemies) is a lousy form of arguing (and an ad hominem) because in reality we can't ever know what is in someone else's heart or intent and it is quite different that claiming someone is an enemy of humanity. one judges how other thinks of a person or group (which can be measured; you are my enemy (speaking for ones self) or you are their enemy, judging others reactions) vs ascribing an emotion. if you want to speak of your own hatred, have at it. claiming others hate is a fool game, only for the weak and lame w/no argument.

      so, they are very different.

      that said, i think we've all spoken our minds and i'll be trashing anymore comments debating this historical aspect of what happened in hungary during the final year (and horrendous last summer of death) of the holocaust.

      someone else might pass them for moderation but i'll trash them. so can we switch topics please?

    • I would be happy to write a piece for the blog, in which case I might drop the anonymity. Then my credentials would be public. However, my views are not fully in line with the editorial ones so I doubt that would ever happen.

      we've published lots of opinion here not "fully in line" with any particular editorial stance. what would you write about? yourself? your anti bds stance? and when you reference your credentials it implies an authority on something relevant to a topic of interest. what might that be? why would being bulgarian or spanish or speaking several languages give your anti bds positioning creds?

      if you send in a submission it will be judged on its merits. and why are you concerned about losing your anonymity? do you think your opinions are radical?

    • just, a lot of thread spamming if you ask me.

    • b)

    • these quotes of jeff's are really gruesome-disgusting. it's the first time i have read them.

      jeff, re your link: thanks for at least staying on topic. Netanyahu 'avoiding going head to head with the court', and "he may well not want this headache." is a far cry from "doesn’t want someone in the cabinet who is coming in promising to fight a war against the supreme court. " albeit, you could be right. thanks for the source tho according to your link he may want to appoint the next attorney general or have that be in likud's corner, that could be at the crutch of his priority along with the demand from his own likud party members to hold onto a minimum of ministries (i read that latter claim yesterday).

      furthermore, your allegation "Netanyahu likes a balanced coalition with Likud in the center this is not his doing. " is absurd. this is very much "his doing". yes he is in a corner but you act like he has no choice. he has a choice. hertzog said he would form a coalition w/likud ( link to ), netanyahu shot that down w/the words "radically left and anti-Zionist list". if netanyahu had any interest in a 'balanced' coalition w/likud in the 'center', he could have had one.

      he'd rather form a risky coalition prone to extortion than have likud in the "center". likud will end up being on the far left inside the coalition he's cobbled together. and did you read:

      "Next head of 'Civil Administration' said Palestinians are sub-human"?
      link to

      MK Eli Ben-Dahan was just appointed to oversee the Administration, which oversees the theft of Palestinian land, settlement expansion and controls the movement of millions of Palestinians.

      “[Palestinians] are beasts, they are not human.” — MK Rabbi Eli Ben-Dahan, Aug 1, 2013. (Hebrew)

      “A Jew always has a much higher soul than a gentile, even if he is a homosexual.” — MK Rabbi Eli Ben-Dahan, Dec 27, 2013. (Hebrew/English)

      Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu finalized the formation of a new government this week when he signed a coalition agreement with far-right settler party Jewish Home. As part of the agreement, Rabbi Ben-Dahan will be Israel’s next deputy defense minister, responsible for the army’s “Civil Administration.”

      The Civil Administration is responsible for all aspects the occupation that don’t involve boots-on-the-ground security operations — it administers planning, building, and infrastructure for both Jews and Palestinians in Area C of the West Bank. It also administers the Palestinian population database and is responsible for granting and revoking entry and travel permits for Palestinians, controlling every aspect of their movement.

      In other words, the man slated to take charge of an organization entrusted with supervising the theft of Palestinian land and supervising Palestinians’ lives, is a racist who said he does not see them as human, but rather as animals

      this is not his doing? he'd prefer this than forming a coalition w/the "anti zionist" hertzog list.

    • just, somehow i don't think catalan is interested in dictionary definitions. she'd rather assume the reference was to israel lovers being a deseased dogs than being extreme · fanatical · overzealous · maniacal · passionate · fervent · overkeen · diehard · uncompromising · illiberal · etc etc.

      she wants up to pussy foot around what rabid "conjures" (in her mind) instead of the obvious definition .. and she wants respect at the same time. that's a tall order.

    • in general, are you an advocate of a carrot diet for israel, as in no sticks? and if so would that philosophy carry over to other countries as well, or just israel?

    • jeff, you claimed Netanyahu doesn’t want someone in the cabinet who is coming in promising to fight a war against the supreme court.

      your response to my request for a source for that allegation doesn't quote netanyahu or reference him. i have opened enough of your links in my days to know they don't provide sources for your allegations. the first link doesn't even mention netanyahu. can you try quoting something relevant to your allegation please. before demanding a retraction. thanks.

      btw, what you call 'censorship' we call spamming the thread with endless unsourced allegations.

    • this is to be expected (her ascension)and what was predicted (generally speaking) when netanyahu won the election. in a normal society someone would be cast out of politics for that genocidal FB screed. in israel, she gets promoted. this is the direction israel is heading, it should be no surprise to anyone.

    • jeff,

      She’s not for killing all the little snakes...I don’t know why you all feel the need to make up stuff.

      They are all enemy combatants, and their blood shall be on all their heads. Now this also includes the mothers of the martyrs, who send them to hell with flowers and kisses. They should follow their sons, nothing would be more just. They should go, as should the physical homes in which they raised the snakes. Otherwise, more little snakes will be raised there. - See more at: link to

      who's making stuff up? you.

      Netanyahu while desperately wanting the coalition doesn’t want someone in the cabinet who is coming in promising to fight a war against the supreme court.

      do you have a source for this or are you making it up?

      edit: whoops, i see someone exited your denial/accusation comment. smart. oh well, my comment stands.

  • Not a single Muslim is quoted in 'NYT' profile of Geller
    • david, that's the least of it. from your jpost link:

      Netanyahu reached an agreement with Bayit Yehudi that will give the party the Education and Diaspora Affairs portfolios for its leader Naftali Bennett. MK Uri Ariel will be agriculture minister and MK Ayelet Shaked justice minister. Bennett succeeded in pressuring Netanyahu to give Shaked the Justice Ministry, because a coalition could not be formed without Bayit Yehudi’s eight Knesset seats. She was originally going to be given the Culture and Sports Ministry.

      did you read "Netanyahu appoints Ayelet Shaked—who called for genocide of Palestinians—as Justice Minister in new government" - See more at: link to

  • A response to the 'Washington Post' blogger who calls me an anti-Semite
    • honestly, where does he come up w/this crap about phil's life:

      phil was born into a jewish world.

  • Human rights activists thank Lauryn Hill for canceling upcoming concert in Israel
    • more accusations of hatred from catalan. yawn, that's not very buddha like (your phrase). why would you think mooser (or anyone) would care enough about you to hate you? that's crazy, and certainly not classy.

    • p.s. again for your edification miriam:

      your comment and accusation of hypocrisy applies a stunning false equivalence. it’s your logic that’s deeply flawed, not amigos.

      and this is to your pathetic accusation here:

      Amigo @

      Your lack of logic and hypocrisy is quite stunning.

      You disapprove of cultural boycotts imposed by Israel on Palestinians but then go on to applaud the BDS cultural boycott of Israel / Israelis?!

      Shame on you!

      - See more at: link to

      what idiot who compares a violent military occupation to a non violent resistance movement? you, that's who. and the reason i am copy/pasting this dialogue here is because instead of scrolling up where the argument took place on the thread and posting your reply (that would land right under just and adele's [ "Any failure and shame belongs to you and those like you, miriam6. jmo - See more at: link to"] skewering response to your ridiculous allegations) you decided to respond down thread to divorce yourself and the argument from the source. iow: scroll up to the nearest reply function.

    • what petard? miriam's strawman? lol. you've got to be kidding me RoHa. she's made me a nice soft pillow of straw to launch a counter attack, it's very comfortable and quite easy.

    • YOU are being disingenuous!

      Sanctions are widely regarded as an act of aggression

      strawman miriam, you have no argument because i never made any claims regarding sanctions being non aggressive, nor would i. plus, you didn't even address my argument:

      you know quite well that bds is non violent resistance to a decades long imposed military occupation controlling who can and cannot enter palestine. what amigo referenced as “Israel boycotts Palestinian cultural activity.” is not a resistance movement nor is it non violent. the 2 cannot be compared. - See more at: link to

      you're spamming the thread miriam. nothing i said was hypocritical or disingenuous. try staying on topic (BDS = non violent resistance).

      So do not lecture me that BDS is non aggressive / non violent -

      i'll lecture you on bds whenever i see fit, especially when you try building strawman arguments by putting words in my mouth i didn't say. lick your wounds, you #FAILED

    • You disapprove of cultural boycotts imposed by Israel on Palestinians but then go on to applaud the BDS cultural boycott of Israel / Israelis?!

      this is disingenuous miriam. you know quite well that bds is non violent resistance to a decades long imposed military occupation controlling who can and cannot enter palestine. what amigo referenced as "Israel boycotts Palestinian cultural activity." is not a resistance movement nor is it non violent. the 2 cannot be compared.

      your comment and accusation of hypocrisy applies a stunning false equivalence. it's your logic that's deeply flawed, not amigos.

  • MSM's platform for Pamela Geller is equivalent to normalizing David Duke and Nazis
    • perhaps. i don't know citizen. but how does one decide who to drop and who not for the figure to remain the same year after year?

      besides, many of those marriages produce children raised in jewish households. i'm not sure how they count secular jews. perhaps it has to do w/jews who worship in a synagogue?

    • if there’s 6M who counted them? That’d be plenty goddam ironic, if you ask me

      mooser, once i happened apon a website that was nothing but polls about the american jewish community. at the time someone had asked how many jews were in long island so that was what i was searching for. i found a poll (and linked to it here so it's somewhere in my archive) and the community was surveying jews wrt what they donated to and whether they raised their kids at a synagogue and things like that. what i noticed was over time it appeared as tho jews who lived independently from the mainstream community were dropped off the list.

      re the 6 million, i think there's an agenda to show a population of less US jews vs israel's more jews. because the population of US jews doesn't seem to expand in numbers. and it doesn't shrink either. i find the number strange and unbelievable. i rarely believe in coincidence, much less perpetual coincidence.

  • 'NY Review of Books' says Tony Judt didn't really mean it when he called for the end of a Jewish state
    • bystander, you say the judt article stands on it's own, and i agree with you that it does. it also just so happens to be entirely prescient and penned by a great scholar now deceased. but curiously you don't see what others see as obvious. which is the phenomena of an influential public figure writing in a public forum 5 years after judt's death that judt didn't really mean that based on a personal conversation between freedland and judt that allegedly took place during a whiskey induced confessional over a decade ago that debunks what freedland himself coins as judt's "most notorious essay".

      to me, this is a classic case of if you can't beat em, co-op em. because only freedland has the keys to what judt really meant. he's set himself up as the gatekeeper of tony judt. and you don't find it offensive. needless to say freedland had plenty of time as well as access to publish his claims while judt was still alive -- but he didn't.

      it reminds me of camera making claims about what martin said after he was dead. not only that, he claimed it was written in an article of a magazine pre web, that no one seemed to have a copy of. an article also penned by -- a dead man!

      if the article, as you say, stands on it's own. freedland is free to write all the commentary he wants about it. but claiming the author wouldn't have written that for an american readership is an insult to our intelligence. all it does is provide fodder for future fights about judt's prescience. throwing crap on the wall to sully the integrity of his essay. so, it makes no sense to me you would defend freedland.

    • dickerson, i heard he was not going to be appointed. and this article says Katharine Viner has been appointed the editor-in-chief when Alan Rusbridger steps down this summer. link to

  • Palestine’s moment of truth for the International Criminal Court
    • mohandeer, do you know how to copy and paste? link to

      highlight text and copy it by clicking control (ctrl) and "c" on your keyboard. then go to another location (like our comment box) and click control and "v" and it will drop the copied text wherever you put it. again, to copy a link simply highlight the url at the top of your browser page click ctlr and c, and drop it (control and v) into the comment box. try it! it's so easy.

      Ctrl+C (Copy) and Ctrl+V (Paste).

  • Night of horror at Ben Gurion airport for two French music students
    • Ah, again with the propoganda – call Israel the apartheid state at every chance, and call anyone that challenges your views a ‘hasbarist’.

      au contraire i do not call everyone who challenges my views a hasbarist nor do i call israel an apartheid state "at every chance". furthermore, if you dish it out -- be prepared to eat crow when it's thrown back at you.

      The tunnels are not there because of the blockade, the blockade is there because of the tunnels and how they are used.

      what bs. the embargo was set in place to take effect immediately after hamas won the election and before the inauguration. the tunnels are a direct consequence of the blockade.

      I was not insinuating that you did not know that.

      you stated "You can easily find evidence for this online, but you have to want to do so of course." which does insinuate readers here are unaware the israeli press publishes criticism of israel.

      My comment was in response to @Kris asking for someone to explain why ‘treating this people is acceptable’.

      kris wondered where the hasbrats were and why they were not here in droves defending israel on this thread. your diversion to the israeli media publishing criticism of israel is a diversionary tactic.

      I will ignore you calling me a hypocrite for now

      don't. it's relevant.

      Regarding hamas, I strongly disagree – the spending is not for ‘defense’, it’s clearly spent on aggression, they are not under attack unless they show aggression.

      perhaps you fundamentally misunderstand hamas. prior to hamas firing missles at israel last summer israel carried out a weeks long pogrom (collective punishment)against the palestinian people. they invaded homes, arrested hundreds of people (reneging on the gilad shalit exchange rearresting prisoners from the exchange pandering to the rtwg factions who resented the deal), killed people (including children), all under the false pretense of searching for the teens the gov of israel already knew were dead. it (the teen kidnapping/murder) was not a hamas operation. so no, hamas's actions were in defense and in response to weeks apon weeks of brutal west bank pogrom. hamas is the duly elected representatives of the palestinian people, both in the west bank and gaza. and the palestinian people were most definitely "under attack". it just so happened the response came from gaza. but you're totally wrong with your claim "they are not under attack unless they show aggression." the palestinian people did not "show agression" before the pogrom. quite the contrary.

      drawing a comparison between their status and South African apartheid is ridiculous.

      democracy now: "Ex-U.N. Official John Dugard: Israel's Crimes are "Infinitely Worse" Than in Apartheid South Africa" VIDEO MAY 6, 2015 link to

      You’re making it hard for people who might agree with you (sometimes, always, whatever), show that support. Your language is just antagonizing.

      bummer. truth isn't always comfortable.

      some of the comments here that seem driven by pure hatred

      accusations of hatred are a mainstay of israel's defenders. it's merely an ad hominem -- not very effective actually. and the "pure" does nothing but double down. try talking about your own hatred instead of pretending to know what's in the hearts of others.

      so I try to think about how life could be made possible for everyone there, instead of perpetuating hate.

      not really. if you were not perpetuating hate you wouldn't be inserting it into the discussion. btw, i don't hate you. i don't travel in hate, you're definitely not worth it. as a rule i don't accuse my adversaries of hatred. it's just a transparently flawed propaganda tool/ cheap trick (boring and weak ad hominem).

    • The Israeli media very often criticizes government, and there are many good people and organizations that do the same and act towards change. You can easily find evidence for this online, but you have to want to do so of course.

      we're already aware the israeli media publishes criticism of israel, many of our articles are sourced by israeli media. still, it doesn't change the apartheid practices just because those practices are reported in the media.

      I don’t feel I can say the same about Palestinian self-criticism (for example, why hamas so much money on terror tunnels, instead of education, welfare, government, etc.)

      hamas spends peanuts on defense in comparison to what the US and israel spend on israel's terrorizing occupation/military expenditures. if that money had been diverted to an equitable system of education, infrastructure and welfare in israel instead of investment in settlements and colonial expansionist policies we wouldn't be having this conversation. your hypocrisy is noted. and the tunnels help sustain a population strangled by the blockade.

      I think you won’t find a lot of ‘hasbarists’ commenting here, because a quick browsing of this site and some of the comments on this page even, suggests that the activity is mostly about fueling hatred of Israel and wishing it gone, not about criticism that is meant to bring change.

      you're wrong. first of all, we have a constant stream of hasbarists here every day. just not many on this thread. second, our criticism (along with others)is exposing israel and fueling a change in the US conversation about the apartheid state. otherwise, you wouldn't be here.

  • Obama's role model to journalists -- Dorothy Thompson -- turned against Zionism and was silenced
    • ;) thanks!

    • thanks gil, it's good to be back. and thanks for the great article!

    • She angrily wrote to a colleague at the American- and Saudi-funded organization - See more at: link to

      a lone casual unsourced mention by Susan Hertog does not a credible source make. is that all you've got to establish American Friends of the Middle East is saudi funded?

      link to

    • that book you quoted was written by susan hertog, wife of neocon roger hertog. link to

      Hertog has been associated with various conservative and neoconservative think tanks and publications. He is a chairman emeritus of the Manhattan Institute for Policy Research and board member of the American Enterprise Institute and the Club for Growth. He also helped found the Shalem Center in Israel. He was a part-owner of now-defunct The New York Sun, was a part-owner of The New Republic, and is a board member of Commentary. Inspired by John Lewis Gaddis and Paul Kennedy's Grand Strategy Program at Yale University, Hertog funded similar programs at Duke University, William E. Macaulay Honors College at CUNY and elsewhere.[2]
      Hertog has also funded the Hertog Global Strategy Initiative, a research program Columbia University that uses historical analysis to confront problems in world politics. Participants include high-ranking government officials, scholars, and graduate students.[3]

      perhaps she had a particular agenda when she wrote the book.

  • Palestinian teenager is shot dead at a checkpoint outside Jerusalem
    • Gaza is a war torn territory almost entirely dependent on foreign assistance

      and therefor the people are not like us? is that your point? but you don't really know any gazans! lol

    • have you ever met anyone from gaza?

  • Using the dead: the 'NYT' works with Israel to justify military service
    • My Rabbi introduced our shul to Mondoweiss in her Shabbos sermon about preparing your college bound children


  • Accusations of anti-Semitism roil Stanford campus as student coalition denies discrimination charges
    • i think it's molly who has problems with telling the truth link to

      Additionally, the accusation that we asked endorsees to sign a contract prohibiting them from affiliating with Jewish or Israeli groups is categorically false. Shortly after hearing this rumor, we published the contract we ask endorsees to sign, and it makes clear that we do not prohibit affiliations with any community. In fact, two SOCC-endorsed candidates were also endorsed by the Jewish Students Association.

    • and doesn't it seem a little odd someone would be running for student senate and not be familiar with the senate committees?????

    • Isn’t that really what you want? To force Zionist Jewish students to be marginalized unless they support BDS?

      no one is forcing Zionist Jewish students to be marginalized. i do think in social situations on campuses or anywhere it is natural for people to stay clear of, or isolate, people who support racist politics. i don't think this necessarily means a demand for everyone to support bds, it means not supporting a zionist agenda. but i don't think people should be forced into financially supporting war criminals and crimes against humanity and that's what using student funds to invest in corporations that invest in apartheid amounts to, a forced investment of student funds.

      I wonder how many people would find it objectionable for a student who is a fundamentalist Christian, to be asked how his or her Christian identity would affect their position on gay marriage rights

      if a student runs on a platform of being a proud fundamentalist Christian, then it's not only acceptable to ask what those values mean to them it's prudent to do so. they should not mention it in their profile unless they plan on communicating what that means and how it pertains to their candidacy. and that doesn't just go for religion it pertains to anything someone highlights about their identity in their platform.

      btw, i'm not sure if everyone opened the links. but this is instructive, it sounds like molly didn't do all her homework : link to

      SOCC, like several groups on campus, annually endorses election candidates. Any candidate may apply for an endorsement. We base our endorsements on the following criteria: (1) knowledge of senate functions, (2) nuanced understanding of campus issues currently impacting the communities that make up our coalition, and (3) a commitment to advocating on behalf of our communities. During our endorsement process, we offered an oral interview to all 31 applicants.

      Molly Horwitz did not receive a SOCC endorsement due to her lack of knowledge about the role of the ASSU Senate and lack of familiarity with SOCC communities. In particular, when asked to name the six organizations comprising SOCC, Ms. Horwitz was unable to correctly identify a single group. Her lack of familiarity with our organizations, from whom she sought endorsement, demonstrated a failure on her part to conduct basic research about who we are. Furthermore, when asked what Senate Committee she envisioned herself being a part of, Ms. Horwitz replied, the “Mental Health” Committee -- a committee that does not exist. It was these responses that led SOCC not to endorse her candidacy.

      In contrast, Ms. Horwitz provided well-thought out responses to questions about divestment. We asked 26 of the 31 candidates interviewed, including Ms. Horwitz, a standardized question regarding the Senate’s handling of divestment and sometimes follow-up questions. Other candidates were asked about other major campus issues like sexual assault or mental health resources at Stanford. The question served as a means for us to assess the candidates’ ability to evaluate a problem and design an action plan to resolve it. The question was not a litmus test for candidate views on divestment; indeed, SOCC endorsed candidates who did not sign the divestment petition.

      i recommend you read "Divestment doesn’t foster discrimination — Hillel and the ADL do" link to

    • They also dispute other claims, aired in the conservative publication Stanford Review, that student candidates were asked to sign a contract forbidding her and other candidates from partnering with Jewish groups on campus.

      this is a total lie. SOCC released the doc that all potential endorsees were asked to sign. the word "jewish" was not even in it.

      read it yourself: link to

      I agree to the Privacy and Confidentiality of Information of Materials...

      more at the link.

    • What a starling coincidence. One week after the explosion of press generated from the UCLA judicial review -- accusations of anti semitism "surge of hostile sentiment against Jews’ nationwide" that made it's way into the pages of the NYT, Morning Joe, Huff Post -- huge shitstorm on UC campuses across the state, allegedly, according to Molly Horwitz, (who's mother happens to be an ardent supporter of Stand With Us), a panel from SOCC just happens to ask Horowitz the exact same question ???

      maybe the members of SOCC all live under rocks and don't read the nyt or follow the latest accusations about anti semitism on californian campuses?

      Horwitz: I think that there’s no motivation for them to tell the truth, like at all.

      i think this was a set up. i think there was no reason for SOCC to do a repeat of UCLA during the very same week it was exploding in the press.

      On the evening of March 13th Molly Horowitz wrote this email (pdf) to Stanford University Election commissioner Sijjan Sri-Kummar ..... it reminded her of the "Rachel Beyda (Google for more information) fiasco":


      I had my SOCC interview today and one of the questions was literally this, “Given your Jewish identity, How would you vote on divestment?” I don’t know if other applicants were asked a question about divestment or whether it was just me. I also don’t know if it was recorded or not. They didn’t inform me that it was, but people were taking notes during it. It reminded me of the Rachel Beyda (Google for more information) fiasco at UCLA. I also asked my friend on the judicial affairs committee whether that was proper conduct. Please let me know if you need more information.


      It reminded her of Rachel Beyda? maybe ms horwitz and her mother w/stand with us wanted molly's face in the new york times. maybe she wanted national attention during her candidacy for Undergraduate Senate, and when she didn't get the much coveted SOCC endorsement she decided to make up a story.

      It's almost mana from heaven the way this incident just plopped itself right into the middle of big campaign alleging anti semitism is running rampant on california campuses.

      Here's a photo of Molly Horwitz in the New York Times, looking downright traumatized. She said she was "horrified" by the experience.

      please. this is a bunch of BS.

  • Marking Memorial Day in Tel Aviv with Kahanists and Combatants for Peace
    • I’ve tried to disentangle your angry, and mostly valid, attacks on Israel to find tactics that make sense, I just can’t find any.

      i engaged with you respectfully addressing your specific argument. initiating a response with an unsubstantiated reference my so called "angry" attacks is weak, diversionary, and duly noted!

      of course Palestinian violence is not “responsible for the perpetuation of the conflict. ” He most certainly did NOT imply that.

      tip: refuting an argument that's logical and sourced requires more than a mere refutation, capital letters won't help. Wishnitzer's quote "If I were Palestinian, I would have several different choices. But what I can do as an Israeli?” very much does imply that he thinks future available options rest solely with palestinians, not with israelis. and that, in turn, implies the responsibility for perpetuating or ending the conflict rests with palestinians. i welcome you deconstructing his statement otherwise. but "of course" and "NOT" is not an argument with merit, not in my book anyway. you should have stopped at "tried to ...find tactics that make sense, I just can’t find any."

      What he clearly knows, as do his Palestinian counterparts, is that Palestinian violence has played A ROLE in the perpetuation of the conflict, and Israelis are not the ONLY people who have agency in this ongoing tragedy.

      hmm, i'm not sure anyone is making the claim palestinians have no agency.

      But they most certainly did not want to rule over another people.

      given tho options of ruling over another people or treating them as equals, evidence suggests you are wrong. but of course i do recognize the founders of the state as well as the majority of zionists wanted the land without the people on it and would have much preferred they (palestinians) simply had disappeared vs all that maiming, killing, imprisonment, torture, home demolitions and wiping villages off the map (which is still going on, read allison's recent article) and global response to decades of zionist war crimes and human suffering . so in that regard, point taken. but so what? i could as easily say i didn't want to run you over with a truck, i just wanted you dead and gone.

      I don’t see what is gained by denying that Palestinian violence and the fear it created was an important factor.

      this is a strawman, primarily because we're not discussing "important factors" regarding israeli fear. we're talking core issues (causes) for the conflict. you didn't answer my question:

      they could elect leaders who would stop building on palestinian land! Despite the obvious asymmetry of power and the asymmetry of suffering, despite the fact the gov of israel routinely ‘mows the grass’ in gaza slaughtering hundreds of civilians, despite the bulldozed homes, imprisonment of thousands of palestinian people and continued land theft, “they” (presumably combatants for peace) acknowledge israelis fear violence.

      so what?

      get it? i did not deny Palestinian violence or israeli fear. both so called "liberal" zionist and right wing gov coalitions have all operated as colonial expansionists. the release of the palestine papers exposed israeli intransigence wrt the "peace process."

      there's only so much coddling of israeli fear people can take. evidence suggests even if israelis didn't fear palestinians they'd still want all the land. it runs against human nature to do nothing when when your land and rights are denied. assuaging israeli fear is a diversion that perpetuates the conflict.

      Even if you think those fears are completely unjustified, do you honestly think any change is possible if they are completely ignored?

      yes, i do. in a situation of crisis put out the flames before tackling the therapy. if a kid with a box of matches is standing in the living room screaming his head off in fear of the fire that is raging in the bedroom where people are sleeping you don't focus your attention on the fear of the child. that comes later. in fact, in that circumstance it's irrelevant whether the child's fears are justified. you put out the fire. this is a no brainer.

      as long as you're prioritizing israeli fear you're part of the problem. as long as the house is burning put "those needs" on the back burner. they are not part of the immediate critical solution, they are part of future resolution. in fact, the action of putting out the fire will go a long way to assuaging the screaming child's fear. this require adult supervision. it requires the global community to fix it. support bds. fire requires oxygen to burn. stop giving the fire oxygen. suffocate the flames. stop expanding the state.

    • A group that refers to “violent struggle for Palestinian freedom” is not, as you write “portraying Palestinian armed resistance as responsible for perpetuation of the conflict rather than the colonial violence that has always defined Israeli policy to Palestinians.” But they are acknowledging what you have apparently decided warrants no attention of any kind: Israelis DO fear violence. Despite the obvious asymmetry of power and the asymmetry of suffering, that is a reality that can’t be blithely dismissed by anyone who wants to end the occupation.

      dan fleshler, merely because they referenced a "violent struggle for Palestinian freedom" on their website does not refute what cohen wrote regarding the responsibility for perpetuation of the conflict.

      let's review what cohen wrote before deconstructing the basis of his logic: (my bold)

      Wishnitzer denied that the event portrayed symmetry between the deaths of Israeli soldiers and Palestinians who resist but asserted that, “There is always a choice for [Israeli] soldiers and for those [Palestinians] who fight the occupation. If I were Palestinian, I would have several different choices. But what I can do as an Israeli?

      This narrative turns reality on its head, portraying Palestinian armed resistance as responsible for perpetuation of the conflict rather than the colonial violence that has always defined Israeli policy to Palestinians.

      first of all, when cohen writes "this narrative" he is referencing a revealing quote by Wishnitzer not something on their website, so i am not sure this represents the official position of the group. that said, the framing of (paraphrasing the bolded section above) 'as an israeli my options are limited whereas palestinians have multiple options for ending the conflict' does flip reality on it's head and does imply Palestinian armed resistance as responsible for perpetuation of the conflict rather than the colonial violence.

      "But what I can do as an Israeli?" --- to begin with they could elect leaders who would stop building on palestinian land! Despite the obvious asymmetry of power and the asymmetry of suffering, despite the fact the gov of israel routinely 'mows the grass' in gaza slaughtering hundreds of civilians, despite the bulldozed homes, imprisonment of thousands of palestinian people and continued land theft, "they" (presumably combatants for peace) acknowledge israelis fear violence.

      so what? every human being fears violence. if israel's main concern was the fears of israelis they would end the actions that perpetuate that violence but they won't do that. do you know why? because expansion of their state is more important to them. the colonial enterprise is worth more to the powers that be than peace and it has always been so since the founding of the state.

      so why is it you think acknowledging israeli fear is so important in ending the occupation? palestinian fear, due to the asymmetrical dynamics you have acknowledged, has by far more basis for pronouncement. and yet Wishnitzer, denying a portrayal of symmetry between the deaths of Israeli soldiers and Palestinians, asks "what I can do as an Israeli?" and thinks palestinians have lots of choices!

      you're not seeing the forest for the trees. if everyone on the planet acknowledges israeli fear then what? if palestinians ended all violent resistance then what? there are already laws in israel making the non violent action of sanctions and boycotts a crime. as well as legislation promoted in this country. the cause of the conflict is the zionist expansion of the state. that has to stop. no people anywhere on earth will be pacified when a ruling authority is bulldozing their homes, imprisoning their family, and denied their civil rights. the very word "resistance" means it is a response. that is a reality that can’t be blithely dismissed by anyone who wants to end the occupation, not "israeli fear." this whole obsession with fear and hurt feelings and jewish or israeli emotions (including all those oh so sad pro israel jewish students on campuses having their feelings hurt) is a diversion. a decades long diversion and no, it simply is not at the center of the conflict, israel aggression, violence, domination and colonial expansion is.

      wake up.

  • In defense of Cornel West's prophetic voice
    • thanks philip!

    • there are 2 highly recommended embedded videos in this text, one ( embedded in "strongest public commentary by a nationally known figure on the American scene") we just added to the base so you can watch it below the text of the article.

      the other is part one of west's recent interview with dave letterman (embedded in "Black and lacking the moral fortitude to speak truth to power")

      for some reason i find it really hard to see these embeds, but i hope people watch both the excellent videos. here's pt 1 of the letterman interview:

      link to

    • I strongly disagree joe. I did not just vote for him because of his color.

  • Will Graham's gaffe about 'all-Jewish cabinet' get the MSM to talk about pro-Israel money?
    • maybe you are on the wrong thread steve. what are you talking about? lots of rich people are "good in finance', it has nothing to do w/being jewish.

    • The best defense as we all know, but you, is pre-emption

      no we definitely do not all know that. besides, "pre emption" is offense not defense.

    • It’s antisemitic to mention it, unless you are Jewish and bragging about it.

      i opened the jta article phil linked to "Who are the Republican candidates’ Jewish donors?" link to and they list each candidate with 3 sections underneath each one boldly titled.

      the headings being,

      Campaign status:

      His Jews:

      His views:

      his jews? i thought that was weird. but then it was published in jta so i guess they can get away w/it.

  • Defending the Iran nuclear deal from Israel and its supporters
    • amigo, israel knows very well it won't be a cakewalk and they don't care. they are using the quick and easy promotion to convince americans to go to war, not because it relates to the truth.

      once we invade, like iraq, they want iran to burn for a long long time. they want to destroy it just like iraq was destroyed. they want to send it back to the stone age. they know it won't be quick. they lie w/impunity all the time.

    • Suissa copies former Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak to say that bombing Iran’s nuclear facilities will be more like the assassination of Osama bin Laden

      this is hysterical, comparing taking out all of iran's nuclear facilities to invading one domestic home/compound in pakistan! ah, but it's all relative:

      than the U.S. invasion and occupation of Iraq.

      iow, it won't be a ten year war? and they know this how? don't they think iran has the capability to retaliate? or are they so confident that if iran does retaliate the US/IS is capable of making a desert and calling it peace.

      on a scale from 1 to 10, one being the (alleged) assassination of bin laden and 10 being the invasion and occupation of iraq, Suissa is claiming this would be a 4, 3 or 2 (closer to 1 than a number over 5)? what kind of idiots speculate like this?

  • Leaked Sony emails reveal Hollywood execs efforts to support Israel
    • “a really good director who on the face of it doesn’t seem completely biased, so that we can show something that gets the message across without making it seem like propaganda.”

      fat chance of that.

  • If Not Now, When?: Jewish anti-occupation activism and accountability to Palestinians
    • Then about 9-10 years ago knowledge of and criticism of Israel’s policies began to seep into the American public and suddenly we have J Street, Jewish Voice for Peace, etc.

      jvp started 19 years ago. j street was founded 7 years ago. they are very different orgs.

      i'd urge you to poke around:

      link to

  • The grave danger of derailing the Iran deal -- an interview with Chas Freeman
    • i love how he's such a straight talkier.

      people in the Middle East are not in the least surprised that the flea directs the dog

  • Israeli racism takes center stage at Manhattan JCC
    • just goes to show you can't tell a book from it's cover. her hippy dippy hairdo w/the scarf and glowing smile and twinkling eyes --- and she's a friggin racist. blatant as the sky is blue.

    • dealing w/zionism -- it's a completely different standard of what's acceptable under other circumstances.

  • Kristol frets that he walked into Obama's 'trap,' and Rubio says he'll demand Iran recognize 'Israel's right to exist'
    • link to

      The strongest disagreement came from Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, who argued that although the U.S. would prevail in any conflict with Iran, such a course of action would be dangerous. “I think a military attack on Iran opens up pandora’s box,” said Graham. “You’ve got to assume the worst, not the best. They could attack our bases in the region. They could cause disruption in the Gulf of Hormuz [sic — the Strait of Hormuz connects the Persian Gulf and Gulf of Oman]. It would be a messy affair.”

      Former Hewlett-Packard chief executive Carly Fiorina said, “I think a bombing campaign would be very difficult … as you may well know it’s not clear we could even reach a lot of the facilities.” Fiorina stressed that she would prefer increased unilateral sanctions over a military strike. Ohio Gov. John Kasich declared that, “I don’t think anything is quick and easy there but to me this deal is unacceptable.”

      In addition, Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal asserted that while he is “a strong supporter of Senator Cotton,” when “it comes to this specific issue, I don’t know what the military believes in terms of how long it would take them,” emphasizing that such a call would be determined by classified intelligence.

      Most military experts disagree with Cotton’s assessment, and believe an attack on Iran would carry “significant costs and dangers.” In 2009, the Center for Strategic and International Studies found that “Any strike on the Bushehr Nuclear Reactor will cause the immediate death of thousands of people living in or adjacent to the site, and thousands of subsequent cancer deaths or even up to hundreds of thousands depending on the population density along the contamination plume.”

  • Understanding the Jewish National Home
    • Ian, i am not a member of FB either. but i can follow links (like the one you just posted). once you're a member of FB they can track your readership. it makes me uncomfortable.

      thanks for your participation.

    • hops, why bother copy/pasting my comment and supporting link without addressing the argument contained within it? that's the definition of ad hominem. and my comment here has nothing to do w/whether i am a moderator or not, it's my opinion. but that's the crux of your argument i see. that i am a moderator? the fact most people here will agree with a solid argument is no reason to not make it. this thread is almost a month old. so i don't know what kind of "sunshine" you're talking about anyway. it sounds like you're just finding something to pat yourself on the back about while avoiding all argument that's on topic. do you think it's somehow intimidating to point out people here will agree with Ian? that argument could be made about virtually every thread. of course this is a place that supports palestine. your argument boils down to 'people here support palestine therefore you like sunshine up your ass if you do too or argue such.' pff. hypocrisy much.

    • nice try, but he didn't call you a moron. he gave an example of what name calling is. you're right about one thing hops, Ian's comments stand on their own. Israel's actions amount to state sponsored terrorism. time and again you've demonstrated support for that state and those actions. an ad hominem attack "means responding to arguments by attacking a person's character, rather than to the content of their arguments."

      Ian has consistently attacked the content of your arguments, even here: link to in effect demonstrating support for israel amounts to state sponsored terrorism. hence, it's not by definition an ad hominem.

      your latest gambit: 'if you're more secure than needing "sunshine constantly shined up your backside" you'll change your approach' is pathetic. So go lick your wounds from the act of the desperate and spend a moment thinking from the point of view of displaced Palestinians.

      Ian, your fortitude is stunning.

    • Ian, hops always has a comeback. he's a swift operative. in hops world 20 years of endless talks that go nowhere except more israeli expansion and demolished homes is a sign israel is willing to make peace. it's completely absurd but that's the upshot. you'd be better off to just ignore him. soon he'll be accusing you of arguing in bad faith.

    • that's bs hops. ian specifically referenced "key points" that you "the problem was and continues to be that the Zionists chose an inhabited land."

      so you counter that by claiming selective application for political purposes by referencing events that happened hundreds of years ago? you're avoiding the topic, diverting. israel is currently expanding and preventing any resolution to the fact there are millions of people w/no rights being represented by a gov they have no say in. and you're just diverting by claiming victimhood, poor lil isrsel is picked on and we have historical guilt.

      it's a transparently stupid diversionary argument. you're making excuses for crimes against humanity. take the last word, i'm not interested in debating while you're beating a dead horse.

    • That’s because you’re being silly when you talk about Israel’s legality as a nation as being based on documents that have little legal effect.

      shorter hops: laws don't matter if israel doesn't follow them.

      “Yet the problem was and continues to be that the Zionists chose an inhabited land.”

      I don’t think that’s the problem. I think the problem is that most countries, particularly Western countries, have little historical legitimacy... Today, to assuage their historical guilt, they’ve made Israel into a scapegoat, even as most of them continue to persecute their minorities.

      never mind that "most countries", unlike israel, are not in the process of ethnically cleansing people from their homes and land. never mind that! let's pass off all the criticism as "historical guilt"!!!

      “They implemented plans that had been in conception before the Holocaust.”

      That is total nonsense.

      denial denial NAKBA denial.

    • i agree too, thanks Ian.

    • excuse me? my archives are available to everyone by clicking on my name. why don't you try producing that which you allege?

      btw: link to

      Hamid Dawud Mohamed Khalil al Zawi, most commonly known as Abu Abdullah al-Rashid al-Baghdadi (ابو عبدالله الراشد البغدادي), and also known as Abu Hamza al-Baghdadi and (About this sound pronunciation (help·info) ah-boo oh-mahr ahl bahg-dahd-ee[needs IPA] Abu Omar al-Qurashi al-Baghdadi,[1][2] (died 18 April 2010) was presented as the leader of the Mujahideen Shura Council (also translated as "Council of Freedom Fighters",[3] "Consultative Council of Mujahedeen",[2] and "Council of Holy Warriors"[4]), an umbrella organization composed of eight groups that oppose the United States' military presence in Iraq, and its successor organisation, the Islamic State of Iraq.
      The U.S. however since July 2007 consider this person to be fictional.[5]

      fictional. get it. that means "he" could have been "created" by any number of intel psyops orgs, national or otherwise. (including the cia).

      not to be confused with Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi link to

      p.s. ISIS (successor of ISI circa 2013) did not exist when the illusive omar al baghdadi character was purportedly to have existed, therefore he could not have been the "leader" of ISIS.

    • Zzzzzz. You got anything else, Professor, other than old discredited zionist screeds. You’re unbelievable, man. Just unbelievable. It’s sad.

    • Hop… did you provide links to articles, evidence that demonstrate that Bolton is a neo nazi and a Holocaust denier?

      not that i am aware of, just the links alleging he was. he also provided a link written by bolton refuting this allegation. i thought neo nazis were proud of being neo nazis. why would he refute it?

      there was reference to some secret 3 hour tape recording him when he was in college with 13 minutes of clips edited from the tape -- that allegedly prove he was a holocaust denier. but nobody has provided any quotes of anything. ( as i recall -- i have not read all of the comments)

      anyway, i'd never heard of bolton until this thread and don't know much about him at all. but what i can't figure out is the massive amount of pushback against the man instead of the (unsurprising) allegations in the link, about the desecration of christian sites. this is still going on today, as well as advocates for blowing up the temple, so none of it is that controversial as far as i am concerned. and the people killed, either they were or they were not. it makes sense to refute the allegations in the bolton article would be to simply find counter narratives about what happened to those dead people. why not just prove he's a liar by countering the allegations? seems like it would be easy if it was true.

    • thanks hostage

    • I’m not interested in whether or not they were anti-Semites.

      I’m interested in whether their conclusions were true or not. And the truth of their conclusions does not depend on their ideology.

      roha, ahhhh! don't even go there, it's clear they are not interested in the conclusions -- which are impossible to refute anyway. note how they don't accuse jabotinsky of being a virulent anti semite. as hostage points out (w/quote):

      Jabotinsky’s interpretation of the meaning of the Balfour Declaration/Mandate and his written assessment of the military situation in 1923 were in total agreement with the initial impressions reported by the King-Crane mission

      all they have is ad hominems.

    • “Kg. [King] and advisers” met “with the Syrian Commission, less Rihbany [an American Arab] who went home. They do not want a Zionistic State-no instructions beyond.”

      i'm shocked!!!!

      by the time of their departure, the commissioners were nothing more than rubber stamps for Arab opinion and that their findings were predetermined days before they left.

      and do you think the standing ovations for netanyahu during the last congressional speech were predetermined or a la naturale? and are they all virulent racists because they support the zionist state?

    • hops, is there anything specifically in bolton's article that david linked to you'd care to refute? because the zionist harassment mentioned in which you've provided sounds all too familiar. i've only gotten to the end of page two but it sounds as though 2 people, bing and green, are encouraging students to write their master thesis focusing on smearing their adversaries. that in itself sounds fairly bizarre. if they act anything like some of the cohorts we have here in the US, who frequently lie with impunity, i'm not sure how this builds your (new) case.

      i was just wondering if there was something specific in either of those bolton articles you care to refute? or perhaps another bolton article. since allegations of anti semitism and holocaust denial tossed around so liberally, perhaps you'd care to quote the man himself other than the allegations made against him. your complaint seems to be limited to ad hominem in nature.

    • yonah, here's a book with a passage that might interest you: Future of the Middle East - United Pan-Arab States
      By Sam A. Cohen

      link to

      link to

      Sam A. Cohen is a naturalized American citizen with deep roots in the Middle East. He earned two master’s degrees and a doctorate before working as a scientist for 50 years. Cohen is now retired living in Montecito, California.

      i have not read the book.

    • irishmoses, accusations of "jew hater" and "jew hatred" is the mother's milk of israel hasbara. it's the big tamale, numero uno ad hominem. they just wear it out, day in and day out. boring ritual.

  • Just like the Nazis, Iran 'plans to exterminate six million Jews' -- Netanyahu
    • jon, as i recall, Yehouda Shenhav wrote about it. i have linked to it here before. no time now...

    • yes, i assumed it was "informed" by his personal experience too jon. since he left iraq when he was 13 it's likely his perceptions of events going on around him in iraq have been severely impacted by political opinions as an adult. after all, he was born in the 1930's, memories generally morph with adulthood.

      if you scroll on that haaretz link under the heading of "Political agenda" the author mentions the final chapters are the most poignant, probably because he more matured when he experienced these events over time and therefore can write about them with more authority.

      Surprisingly for me - a reviewer who relishes any opportunity to visit Baghdad, whether in person or in fiction - it is the book's closing chapters, when the family finally makes it to Israel, that are most poignant. The description of the breakdown of Kabi's proud father, who experiences enormous disappointment after years of dreaming of life in Zion, is perhaps the most touching of all. It is here we see the odd mismatch of cultures, and feel for a people who had a sophisticated, urbane and ancient culture but are now reduced to living in tents and eking out a new existence due to Ashkenazi discrimination and the raw newness of a state ill-prepared to absorb so many immigrants.

      could it be that he was piecing together his understandings of his past experiences, tinged with his political views in recreating events in his youth? and not to beat a dead horse, but when the author writes "It becomes clear that Amir wants .... to prove the ultimate superiority of the Zionist outlook" i wonder how much and otherwise interesting story might also be a bit of indoctrination with huge gaps in history) like israel's involvement in the fate of iraqi jews and why they left. i'm sure it probably is an interesting story, but it reeks of agenda, an agenda i am not sure i need to be privy to for the sake of art.

    • asherpat, all the israelis on the streets screaming death to arabs, should they be bombed? and how many sweet ways can america say we were not making war on the iraqi people as we blasted falluja? so what if a chanting mob says "death to america"? we do it with live ammo, which is worse? words or a drone taking out your family?

      grow up. we're responsible for the deaths of 4 million muslims in the last few years. so they have every right to say death to america as our leaders plan their demise.

    • based on the the writings of Eli Amir

      based on his (fictional) novel by the same name. Amir left bagdad for israel with his family when he was 13. later worked for the Jewish Agency, and as a special advisor on Arab affairs to the Israeli president. i would be interested in whose writing Amir's story was based on unless it is autobiographical.

      link to

      The novel drags, however, when it attempts to capture so many trials and tribulations that it seems it will take forever for the Jews to leave Iraq for Israel, as some 80 percent of them did in 1950-51. Some scenes border on the didactic, as if the writer is trying to give the reader more of a history lesson than a plot-driven novel.

      ....It becomes clear that Amir wants to explain the great battle going on within the Jewish community of the time between Zionists and communists, and to prove the ultimate superiority of the Zionist outlook. Those who belong to neither camp and want to stay rooted in Baghdad, like the narrator's bourgeois cousins, are portrayed as having sold their souls - people who essentially survive by paying protection money to the most powerful neighborhood gang.

      Missing is the background that would explain to the reader why this famous chapter of aliyah is so controversial, accompanied as it was by rumors that Mossad agents set off bombs in Baghdad to scare reluctant Iraqi Jews into signing up for immigration. Although there is a slight hint in the novel that fellow Jews might have planted the bombs, it isn't at all clear in the narrative that Israel was likely involved in these events.

      that was probably left out of the movie too.

      the zionists were certainly motivated to get iraqi jews to come to israel as they had tried to set up a deal w/the british puppet gov to "trade" iraqi jews with palestinians way before the immigration/expulsions. one wonders to what efforts they took to make life so unbearable for iraqi jews they would leave after centuries.

      either way the zionist got their wish didn't they -- at the expense of iraqi jews. and now they want to be compensated for what they set out to do to begin with. really evil shit if you ask me. did they mention any of that in the movie? or was it primarily framed as anti semitism?

  • Obama's long & passionate Monday with Saban, Foxman, Hoenlein and other Jewish leaders demonstrates power of Israel lobby
    • i beg to differ shingo. israel is not part of america, even the very worst parts of America. it's a separate country - not "all american".

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