(Salute to Israel march, New York, May 2009. All photos by Antony Loewenstein from his flickr page.)
Antony Loewenstein writes:
Last year I was told a story about a friend’s visit to Israel on the Birthright program. After visiting Auschwitz and waving the Israeli flag, his group were shown around Israel. One night they were in the Jordan Valley and as the sun was setting a guide decided to role-play as a Palestinian from the West Bank (the group had not visited the Palestinian territories nor spoken to any Arabs on the trip.)
The guide, playing a Palestinian, told of certain hardships in the West Bank due to the occupation but said he understood why Israel had to implement such a tough “security” regime because his brother was a “terrorist” who wanted to kill Jews. The only “interaction” with Palestinians for these young Jews was with an Israeli Jew who was role-playing.
I was reminded of this during Sunday’s Salute to Israel march through central New York. 100,000 Jews paraded in the streets held under the banner of Tel Aviv’s 100th anniversary. The parents of kidnapped soldier Gilad Shalit also attended. Arabs and Palestinians didn’t exist; they were invisible. The world’s biggest public display of pro-Israel feeling had no room for 20 percent of the Israeli population (let alone the millions in the West Bank and Gaza.) Like the Birthright tour, mainstream Zionism wants to completely shield Jews from the uncomfortable facts of the Israeli occupation and Palestinian self-determination.
The event was thoroughly disheartening . Young Jews and old, colourful floats, countless Israeli and American flags, fans with the tag line, “I’m an IDF fan” (in support of Friends of the Israel Defence Forces, pictured right with the author) and t-shirts advertising Israeli airline El-Al. Flyers were distributed celebrating kosher food, the hardline Zionist group Stand With Us and New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg. Some marchers carried small signs with a picture of captured Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit and the words, “Have you seen Gilad Shalit?” New York Democratic Senator Chuck Schumer marched down the road alongside friends waving signs with his name.
The sheer organisational firepower was awe-inspiring, though it was hard not to conclude that the participants were largely going through the motions. They may have loved Israel, but it wasn’t a real country, rather an abstract nation in the Middle East that defended democracy, human rights and freedom (I’ve discussed this Jewish psychosis in the past). How many of these Jews had ever visited the West Bank and Gaza, other than as IDF soldiers? Were they even mildly concerned with Jewish-led pogroms in the West Bank?
The Bruce Springsteen song, ‘Born in the USA’, blared in both English and Hebrew, but the irony was tragic. Jewish immigration to Israel has virtually stopped, so the vast majority of Jews in the West have no interest in moving to the self-described Jewish state. Instead, billions of taxpayer dollars are spent on maintaining an illusion; a garrison state with a ghetto-mindset. The American Jews at Sunday’s parade were happy to have their comfortable lives in multi-cultural America but seemed to have no problem backing a country that proudly discriminated along racial lines.
My American friend attended the parade a few years ago and told me that there was a special section for the “counter-protest.” This year, behind many separation barriers on 5th Avenue, stood no more than 30 Jews, Palestinians and others loudly opposing the march. I entered the cordoned-off area and mingled with them. One Jewish woman in her 70s, holding a sign with murdered Palestinian and Lebanese children and the words, ‘The IDF at work: Beirut 2006 and Gaza 2009’, told me that she was deeply pained by the rally. Israel, she said, “is not [Albert] Einstein; it’s not [Martin] Buber; it’s not Judaism.” I asked why more Jews and Palestinians hadn’t come and she muttered something about organisational issues. A lone Moroccan man held a Palestinian flag and paced back and forth in the police-cordoned area.
Around 20 Jewish protestors, clearly unable to handle the sight of critics, shouted abuse at the Muslims and Jews peacefully protesting the rally. Only a separation barrier divided the groups.
A handful of Muslims stood against the masses (including one with the disturbing sign, “Close Guantanamo Bay. Re-Open Auschwitz”) but the bulk of the counter-protest were members of the anti-Zionist, Jewish Orthodox group Neturei Karta. Heavily bearded men in their 20s and up (including a survivor of the Holocaust, I was informed), the global organization controversially (and in my view, mistakenly) attended the 2006 Holocaust Conference in Tehran. I’ve always held a grudging respect and skepticism of the organization, men seemingly unafraid to speak their minds and endure ridicule in the process.
A Haredi Rabbi and spokesman for the group, Yisroel Dovid Weiss, spoke to me for around 45 minutes. While some of his colleagues shouted to the crowd that Israel was a “Nazi state” – the Neturei Karta have stated that, “What we want is not a withdrawal to the '67 borders, but to everything included in it, so the country can go back to the Palestinians and we could live with them” – Weiss rationally explained why Israel and Zionism had “brain-washed” the Jewish people. It was only God, he believed, who could grant a state to the Jews (or anybody else.) He seemed hurt that many protestors in the parade told their children not to even speak to the Neturei Karta. They seemed perfectly harmless, if eccentric, to me.
Wearing a “Free Palestine” badge, a black coat, white shirt and black hat, Weiss argued that Zionism was the “work of Satan”. His religious fervour, though calmly argued, was irreconcilable to my own beliefs, but his understanding of the Israeli occupation was informed and moving. “When soldiers harass women and children at checkpoints”, Weiss said, “this helps hate and breeds suicide bombing. What do we expect in return?” He had just returned from Iran, where he said his group had been building alliances with like-minded organizations. In times of crisis, strange bedfellows occur. They tirelessly visit university campuses and speak to anybody who’ll listen. They see it as God’s will to spread the message. Weiss invited my Jewish friend and me to a Friday night Sabbath.
Weiss revealed the physical attacks his members experienced in the US and Britain and articulated the reasons why a global boycott on Israeli products was just and necessary (a position shared by his colleague in Manchester).
Weiss compared Israel’s hopeful decline to the USSR and South Africa, two states that eventually collapsed under their own repression, internal contradictions and economic isolation. He held hope that because this conflict was a racial, not religious, struggle, outside pressure would hasten its conclusion.
I didn’t for a second presume that Weiss represented a mainstream view, but his sympathy for Palestinian suffering, caused by Israeli aggression, was deeper than many liberal Jews. A crazed nationalism has captured the hearts and minds of the Zionist community. Even as a strongly atheist Jew myself, I empathised with Rabbi Weiss’s humanity.
The march petered out around four hours after it started but the parade never seemed to end. Marching bands practiced in the streets alongside 5th avenue. Floats waited for their cue. Israeli flagpoles were twirled. Participants would have gone home with a satisfied feeling that Israel had been defended one more day in the world’s most influential Jewish Diaspora city. In many ways, attempts to isolate Israel probably only harden the resolve of the country’s staunchest backers.
But until the realities of the conflict seep into the minds of mainstream Jewry, parades will only reinforce the unspoken truth; Israel cannot sustain itself on Herzl’s “dream” for much longer.
Related posts:
- Antony Loewenstein, on Racism and ‘Jewish-Born’ Critics of Zionism
- Two reactions to the Salute to Israel Parade
- Meeting Australian Author Antony Loewenstein
- Two chances in NYC to hear reports from the Gaza Freedom March
- Settlers, farmers, solders, internationals–Max Blumenthal reports from ‘Greater Israel’
{ 67 comments }
Thanks, Anthony, so you are an IDF fan? Who would have thought so?
including a report from antony Loewenstein can only serve one purpose: to make Philip weiss appear sensible and level headed in comparison. neturei karta is primarily eccentric. so they attend a holocaust denial conference. so they favor passivity in the face of the nazis and blame the holocaust on the attempt to organize a boycott of germany instead of accepting hitler's rise as god's warning. they are harmless, standing side by side with the jewhating "close guantanamo, open auschwitz", smiling warmly as they shake hands with ahmedinijad. loewenstein tosses around terms like psychotic and crazy. i agree that herzl's dream which was based on his prophetic intuition that a catastrophe was coming towards europe's jews is insufficient for our times. and i agree that a thorough personal knowledge of the conflict, especially the palestinian dimension are important to form an educated opinion rather than a superficial one. but clearly the salute to israel parade which is primarily a social event and a chance for jewish educational institutions primarily consisting of children in elementary junior and high school to march is not geared for depth but for something superficial. expecting anything else there is just plain silly as it is to expect an essay on the parade from antony lowenstein to contain something of substance.
Intedresting web site: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/4539473... who Reject Antony Loewenstein We are Australians, who find Antony Loewenstein completely offensive, annoying and wrong. We recognise the rights of all people to live in peace, however unlike Antony and his friends, realise that singling out the victims of terrorism for abuse, is unhelpful…
Lowenstein: "though it was hard not to conclude that the participants were largely going through the motions. " I was there and to be honest the people there were really into supporting Israel. I thought the estimate of 100,000 was kind of low.
RE: "Like the Birthright tour, mainstream Zionism wants to completely shield Jews from the uncomfortable facts of the Israeli occupation and Palestinian self-determination." FROM WIKIPEDIA: Cult (excerpt) Psychological definition Studies of the psychological aspects of cults focus on the individual person, and factors relating to the choice to become involved as well as the subsequent effects on individuals. Under one view, an important factor is coercive persuasion which suppresses the ability of people to reason, think critically, and make choices in their own best interest. Studies of religious, political, and other cults have identified a number of key steps in this type of coercive persuasion:[26][27] People are put in physically or emotionally distressing situations; Their problems are reduced to one simple explanation, which is repeatedly emphasized; They receive unconditional love, acceptance, and attention from a charismatic leader; They get a new identity based on the group; They are subject to entrapment (isolation from friends, relatives, and the mainstream culture) and their access to information is severely controlled.[28]
test
I've had many conversations with neo-con Israel-firsters who keep trying to convince me that despite Iraq, it is in Americans' security interests to bomb Iran. Having had my fill of Version 2.0 of neocon propaganda of WMD, and "another 9/11 right around the corner" I can no longer permit my tax dollars to support the AIPAC crew. Obama needs to change the direction and he needs to do it now. Zionism has taken on a disturbing, Jim Crow tone that is the antithesis of American values, and all the hasbara in the world cannot change intelligent minds. http://www.thejewishweek.com/viewArticle/c55_a159...
SOURCE – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult
Great report, Antony. This year's parade seemed like a politcal rally, a show of solidarity for a nation people feel obligated to accept. But the "not-in-my-name" dissidents are growing in number. More people are coming out of the closet to report on the abuses of the IDF in Gaza, and it's being led by realist, progressive Jews who appreciate the rich multi-ethnicity of growing up in the US, and watching in horror as the "Jewish state" ethnically cleanses Palestine in the name of a "Greater Israel."
Wow, goody for you, man. Still, the 100,000 number would have been dwarfed 20 years ago by an equivalent all-white South Afican apartheid support parade down Fifth Avenue.
Most are Jews and it's in New York. What do you expect? How many Arabs and Muslims live in the US? How much Zionist garbage propaganda is spewed daily in the mainstream in the US? How much general anti-Arab and anti-Muslim (all underlined w/ intense chauvinism) propaganda is spread through mainstream news and films in the US? Of course the superficial will support Nazi Israel. It's much MORE special and compelling when people support the victims and the underdog. When people overcome Zionist nonsense and the superficial narrative of our foreign policy via the MSM and Hollywood depictions of war and 'the US' and of Jews in general (eternal victims). That petition against Lowenstein is good ole' fashion Stalinism masquerading as activism. Zionists don't know a damn thing about peace.
Yeah, yonahred, those anti-Semites won't let us indoctrinate our own children, and worst of all, they are trying to move the world towards social and political justice before the Jews have had their shot! The bastards!
Stop the World, cry the Zionists, We Want to Get On!
I think the "drug" model works better. Gosh, would I like to hook up an American Zionist supporter up to EKG and brain-scans. You could pratically see the ziocaine being secreted, I'll bet.
"This is Zionism." Wow. "All Arabs must die." Good song for Central Park. Kind of catchy. The more Barack Obama takes a stand, the more desparate the Zionists become. They get angry and show their hatred, which is the wedge between normal and 'ziocane'. Perceptions about Israel are changing, and not for the good. The more you hear about Israel, the less likely it is to be news that reaffirms the decency of the Jewish State. They are headed for problems, if they think they can thumb-off the US. This battle will be fought in the halls of Congress. Will they act the fools, or take a stand?
RE: "The event was thoroughly disheartening." RELATED POST: "Traditional Rabbi Appalled As "Salute To Israel" Parade Degenerates Into Arab-Bashing" by M.J. Rosenberg @ TPMCafé, 06/02/09 (excerpt) One hundred thousand people marched in the annual "Salute To Israel" parade in New York on Sunday and apparently it turned into a hate-fest…. ….A group of young men in their 20's….were right in front of me dancing in a frenzy. But they alternated the verse that meant ''the people of Israel lives'with 'all the Arabs must die.' It rhymed with the Hebrew. Given the way all joined in, it was clear that this was not the first time it was sung. "I leaned over to a young man who was next to me, also wearing a kippah and tzitzit. I nodded at the dancers and asked: 'Does this song bother you?' He looked at me with a suspicious look and replied: 'This is Zionism.'" ENTIRE ROSENBERG POST – http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/06/02/t...
Wow, remind me not to invite this douchebag to my St Patricks Day party! But seriously, if I were Phil or Horowimp the sight of tens of thousands of young Jews saying "fuck you" to polyical correctness. . . Yeah, that would worry me.
Despite all your negative commentary I don't see anything particularly horrific about the march. In fact, the worst thing is the sign held by the counterprotesters: “Close Guantanamo Bay. Re-Open Auschwitz". Of course Israel isn't perfect, and there's room for criticism. But there's also room to celebrate a state which has withstood horrific attacks and hatred spewed at it for over 60 years, and nonetheless thrived, with the hope that its people will be wise to compromise with the Palestinians (and putting the settlers in their place in the process). Treating them all as pariahs will not help to achieve this goal.
More accurately he is holding an IDF fan. Seems like a good idea considering the weather.
I have been a participant in the protests at Salute to Israel for 2 years now, as a member of organizations that support human rights for all the inhabitants of the land between the river and the sea. Every year it is the toughest thing we do, between the sheer hatred and anger of young children, old people, and every sort of person shouting at us as if we were the devil. The fact that police refuse to separate us from the anti-semitic kooks (the "Islamic Thinkers") who hold blatantly genocidal signs and instead lump us together into one protest bin makes it especially depressing. This year I couldn't deal with it and skipped it. I think many felt the same way.
“I’m an IDF fan” …. i suppose this is the same mentality that 'supports our troops' and is in favour of war 24/7… trying to get my head around someone in the usa supporting a foreign armed force, or is it just that some people in the usa show more support for a foreign country then they do for their own??
RE: I think the "drug" model works better. MY COMMENT: You might be right. The "cult" analogy is far from perfect.
EH-I am glad you are beginning to understand that the fact that Israel bashers like Phil, MJ Rosenberg and others who seem to feel at home with antisemites and neonazis, as we indeed see on this site, simply discredits sincere members of the so-called "peace camp" who do care about Israel but want to see a change of policy.
More Palaprop. There has never been a white South African parade in New York. You need to deal in reality not Palaprop. What's anti Muslim? Relating the the homophobic, anti woman, anti minorities attitudes of Muslim governments?
"I can no longer permit my tax dollars to support the AIPAC crew." That's really funny. What are you going to do, stop paying your taxes? You will continue to support Aipac. I contacted my congressman to increase aid to Israel. Hopefully very soon, more of your tax dollars will go to support Israel.
Someday there will be a few hundred of you losers.
I was also at the protest on 59th and 5th. There were about 2 or 3 genuine Islamofascists protesting the parade, including the man Lowenstein mentioned. As soon as I saw his utterly offensive sign, I went over to a group of police officers who had also noticed the sign. I told the cops that the majority of people protesting the parade were offended by the sign and we would appreciate it if they removed the man from the premises. The police told me that they had to respect his first amendment rights just like they were respecting everyone else's. I wanted to let the NYPD know that his racist views did not represent the views of the rest of the protesters. I went up to the Islamofacist and said, "I respect your right to express yourself but your sign is extremely offensive and we would appreciate it if you separated yourself from the rest of us." He stubbornly shooed me off, but about 5 minutes later an NYPD officer told me that they were able to get him to move away from the bulk of us. It important to note that the fascists on our side of the fence were isolated and shunned by the majority of protesters. I'm suprised Lowenstein doesn't mention anything about the pro-Israeli fascists counter-protesting us across the avenue who had the support of most of the crowd. An entire chanting squad of counter-protesters (including very small children) were chanting things like "2,4,6,8 Israel is a Jewish State, 3,5,7,9 there's no such thing as Palestine", "Arafat Bitch, Arafat Whore" and "Rachel Corrie, rot in hell". It really broke my heart to see small children participating in disgusting pack behavior like this. The parents should be ashamed of themselves. There was also a man with a large Caterpillar sign, I guess he supports house demolitions. One of the more disturbing parts of the parade was a section almost entirely comprised of children, all holding up pictures of Israel without the West Bank and Gaza. The paraders were completely brainwashed and indoctrinated with Jewish exceptionalism, fear of The Holocaust and the belief that anti-Semitism is rampant throughout the world. It is hard to place blame on the paraders because the propaganda is coming from the top-down and it is incredibly effective. The Jewish people are purposefully scared and taught to belief that critics of Israel are anti-Semitic Nazis. In turn, Jewish paranoia enables Israel's policy makers to get away with colonizing Palestinian land in the name of "self-defense." The parade reminded me a bit like Triumph of the Will, in terms of the effectiveness of the brainwashing. The paraders showed a large amount of blind support for a nation with racist and inhumane policies toward the indigenous Palestinians. I couldn't help but think that the people protesting were more concerned about the safety of the Jewish people than the paraders themselves. Israel is driving towards a cliff right now and we all have a duty to make sure it doesn't fall off the edge.
Dickerson, I was at the parade and the pack mentality of the paraders was absolutely cult-like. However, I blame the charismatic leader at the top before I blame the victim of the brainwashing. The feelings of paranoia, fear and exceptionalism are driven into the Jewish mind from day one. The indoctrination of the Jewish people enables the Zionist policy makers to get away with stealing land in the name of self-defense. The Jewish people need to be freed from their mental prison in the same way that the Palestinians need to be freed from their physical prisons.
Learn to be more tolerant of your fellow human beings. This world isn't a Jewish world, it is a human world.
Do you really think Phil allies himself with Islamofascists? You didn't understand a word that EH-NYC wrote.
The Auschwitz signs sound like agitprop. I would not be at all surprised if they were planted to discredit the peace movement.
If you have ever had the dubious pleasure of watching some one's personality degrade under the influence of cocaine, I think you might see the uncanny parallels. I think it has to do with the wierd "permissions" ZIonism gives its supporters. Permission to hate, permission for violent attitudes or actual violence, permission to have any ethical sense coarsened or completely suppressed. Look at Witty, that's mellow ziocaine, Ziocaine mit schmalz. Jacobwolfen, now there's your classic ziocaine habitue! I came up with the term when posters at Salon, who were advocates of the full range of progressive and liberal attitudes, suddenly turned ugly when the subject was Palestine. "They take PEP (Progressive- Except for Palestine) pills" said one commenter. And the drug model was born.
"Put the settlers in their place"? Gosh, you ZIonists have such a tender regard for each other. What the Israeli government has done with the settlers is inexcusable, not to mention illegal. It will take, probably, a world-wide effort to get them out of there and make sure they don't all get themselves killed.
"The Jewish people are purposefully scared and taught to belief that critics of Israel are anti-Semitic Nazis." Joel, do you think the Jews in America are restricted to ghettos, and have no source of outside information that doesn't come through their Rabbis, or Zionist agents? Every single Jew at that parade is a free agent, able to read, correspond with, talk with, or even get an Internet connection, to anywhere in the world. They can even go to college, here in the Goldenah Medina When Jews were restricted to ghettos, yes, they had no opportunity to learn about the world except through their Jewish leaders, such as they were. Any Jew who is doing it today is doing it because he wants to, and is doing it the way he wants to. There is absolutely no way to lessen their responsibility, or excuse their mis-use of their children. They may run the risk of being dis-owned by their families, but that's about it.
Check out Ray McGovern's report about the award of a Silver Star to a Navy Seaman who served on the USS Liberty when it was attacked by Israel in June 1967. http://original.antiwar.com/mcgovern/2009/06/01/n... Congressman Nunes of California made the award, what? 42 years late? McGovern also recalls Admiral Mike Mullen's excellent warning last year to the Israelis about not flying over American-controlled airspace in Iraq without permission (to get to Iran). He said something like, "We don't want another USS Liberty incident." McGovern doesn't give Mullen much credit for what a fine diplomatic jab this was, since it was left to the listener to decide if he meant: 1) Israeli forces might attack Americans again, accidentally or on purpose, and we all remember the Liberty and wouldn't want that to happen again, 2) this time US forces might shoot Israelis down mistakenly, and that would be a pity, or 3) US forces might shoot them down on purpose, but claim it was a mistake, and that would be an eye for an eye. The reference would have been a shot across the bow, as McGovern notes, but it bordered on the sublime, because they wouldn't have had any leeway to ask him exactly what he meant. I enjoyed reading about Mullen's cleverness, but I like this award much better. No need nor excuse for ambiguity when American seamen put their lives at risk and act heroically under hostile fire.
Joel, You are terrific. What an intelligent, thoughtful piece you've written here. Yes, the so-called "supporters" of Israel, who for some reason don't emigrate there, are driving them to terrible self-destruction, in addition to harming so many others. Please stick with it. I share your views and have voiced them to colleagues and friends, and to my surprise almost everyone agrees with me. (Have you found this, too.) I found out most Americans are just staying silent, but they know what we know: that a system of segregation, separatism, discrimination, disenfranchisement, confiscation of property, etc, CREATES ITS OWN ENEMIES. BY DEFINITION. The people who are harmed by any social system will struggle against it. It's wrong even for a government to classify people by race or religion, much less to discriminate against people on that basis. To create an underclass, which will always be with you (against you!) because no country in the world is or can be ethnically pure. Americans also know the US is bankrupted and unable to subsidize Israel and its military anymore. And we don't want to. Look at the hundreds of email letters the NYT receives each time it publishes on the topic of Israel. Ten to one, the readers agree with us. It's common sense. History is on your side Joel. Courage, you are speaking the truth.
"What's anti Muslim? Relating the the homophobic, anti woman, anti minorities attitudes of Muslim governments?"–thedhimmi Why don't you concentrate on relating the Saudi, Egyptian, and Jordanian so-called moderate by the West governments(because they serve U.S./ Israel's interests in the region) homophobic, anti woman, anti minorities attitudes, so that we who are not ignorant can know for sure that your anti-Muslim relating isn't seen as being selective and politically motivated….
Have you ever considered that the "anti-semitic kooks (the "Islamic Thinkers") " just might possibly be planted there in order to discourage those who are attending the counter demonstrations for the right reasons? And they may just be planted there so that the Zionists can film them and say see what kind of hatred we are up against, which is why what Israel does in the name of Jews should be excused or overlooked..?
Mooser, I think you are being a bit harsh on JoelBitar here. I completely agree with you on individual culpability, and I agree with you on the principle of an individual duty to be properly informed as to one one's own standpoint, but surely you can't question the fact that there is a very effective propaganda apparatus aimed at American Jews? Even if they go to college they may run into people like to Ruth Wisse, who brooks little dissent from her Jews-are-perfect-and-therefore-everyone-is-out-to-kill-us line. (And then they go on to law school and are taught by Alan Dershowitz…) (As regards Israel, things do seem rather cultish at times: have a look at these three clips from Yoav Shamir's Defamation: http://bit.ly/yWoOY (it's a Norwegian web page, but the clips are in English/subtitled in English).)
"…I couldn't help but think that the people protesting were more concerned about the safety of the Jewish people than the paraders themselves. Israel is driving towards a cliff right now and we all have a duty to make sure it doesn't fall off the edge."–Joel Joel, although I am concerned for the Jews in Israel who continue to allow themselves to be brainwashed by Zionism, yet at the same time, I realize that they are the ones who are responsible for themselves living in denial. As long as they keep choosing to be in denial there is not much any of us can do for them. Therefore, I am personally more concerned for the innocent Arabs(or Iranians) that Israel will try to take down with it in the process of falling off the edge they have created for themselves…
"The Bruce Springsteen song, ‘Born in the USA’, blared in both English and Hebrew" You… Are…. Kidding…
Obama’s Cairo Speech "…What makes Israel's right-wing government nervous, and what is worrying the center-right Israel lobby in Washington, of course, is the fact that in order to make his approach to the Muslim world credible, he will have to sustain his already robust effort to roll back Israeli settlements and to pressure Israel into accepting a state in Palestine. Virtually all of the neoconservative commentary on Obama's Cairo speech focuses on their preference that Obama tell the Muslim world to look inward, to correct its flaws, to get its own house in order, to suppress extremism, and so on. And no wonder — because they desperately want to change the subject from the Israel question…." http://www.middle-east-online.com/english/?id=324...
Wow, it makes sense with the indoctrination component. This article reinforces your points: http://www.avigailabarbanel.me.uk/gaza-2009-01-04...
Thanks for your kind words Laura. Most of the people I surround myself with are politically conscious activists who are educated on the I/P conflict. Everyone else I talk to, who hasn't been indoctrinated with Jewish exceptionalism and The Holocaust, believes that Israel is engaging in criminal behavior in the West Bank and Gaza. They are the people who believe that Israelis and Palestinians are equally human beings. Israel's supporters, who have let the propaganda affect their very being, get extremely angry and violent towards me when I question their beliefs. However, we must keep pestering those who disagree with us.
So..what's changed with the jewish zionist.? Evidently nothing. 1000 BC?- 1940? – 2009?…..they never learn. http://www.archiveeditions.co.uk/titledetails.asp... 8.44] January 1946, British Consul, New York reporting a mass demonstration for Jewish freedom put on by the New Zionist Organization of America. "It was constantly patrolled by the Betarim, the new Jewish Youth Army, attired in a Hebrew version of the old Nazi Bund uniform." "Great Britain was public enemy no. 1 of the Jewish people, more dangerous and shrewder than the Nazis…" [8.65] February 1946, formation of B´rith Trumpeldor of America or Betar, affiliated with the NZO. "there is noticeable similarity in the organisation´s character, structure and aims to those of the Hitler Youth…", reported by British Embassy, Washington
Boy, what have you been drinking?
Well, to leave any words about this clearly disgusting poster is already much too much. You don't have to be an Israel-fan to feel sick and tired of so much stupidity…
'The Bruce Springsteen song, ‘Born in the USA’, blared in both English and Hebrew, but the irony was tragic' I have often thought that if Springsteen, Dylan and Cohen made a joint statement decrying Zionism and Israeli behaviour, things might change a bit. Of course the wingnuts would ignore them but the liberal Zionists who have destroyed American progressivism in general and the Democrats in particular, might stop and think. But then, those blokes might be big IDF supporters, who knows? Looks like they're not keen to tell us. There's no obligation for them to do so, but it would be nice, don't you think? 100,000 to 30 – reminds one of the relative Israeli-Palestinian body count. Still, it's darkest before the dawn, and I would very surprised if in say 5 years all those people will feel it's still kosher to march on behalf of a country like Israel. The nervous nellies will disappear at the first whiff of grapeshot, leaving the settler-style crazies to face off against a crowd of something more than 30 I would think. Time will tell. Good piece Ant. It must have been disheartening if it depressed your generally optimistic self. Cheer up, they might still be winning the battles but the trajectory of the war has taken a turn for the better post-Gaza, particularly with the recent evidence of Obama having balls.
I was joking. Which is obvious considering his blog.
I would appreciate additional smilies, instead of distributing +'s or -'s.
So was I :)
And we used to think ridiculous conspiracy theories were only possible on the right. Luckily enough, we also have deranged people on the left who are willing to come up with whatever fits their world view. Antisemitic Muslims?? Unbelievable!
And the same goes for the balance of 97-98% of Americans. It's not like they are limited to a Goebbels radio to get information.
Thank you for distinguishing Islamo-fascist rhetoric from dissent originating in a compassionate urge. We are still in a state of dilemma relative to proposal. What you identify as paranoia creating its own enemies, also applies to the logic and rage presented by dissenters. The reality of the situation is not solely of oppressed relative to oppressor, or dominated relative to dominator. I don't know if you are a Zionist, in the sense that you agree that the Jewish people have a right to a state, to form a jurisdiction within which to self-govern. The "anti" exploitation perspective is important, but also easy, and does not address the actual aggressions on civilians by Hamas, nor does it address the selection of jurisdiction that would create a 50/50 divide in Israel/Palestine (single-state). Do you advocate for two states for two people (as the PLO did for decades) or for single democratic state from river to sea? And, in advocating for either, do you think that the political means of dissent is the most effective use of your effort, or are more socially integrating efforts more effective?
Marion: "I am concerned for the Jews in Israel who continue to allow themselves to be brainwashed by Zionism" Zionism is simply nationalist patriotism. Are you concerned about IslamoFascism brainwashing the masses? Are you concerned about Sunni/Shia factionalism drawing blood? Are you conserned about the dozens of Palestinean terrorist splinter groups who slaughter each other relentlessly? How about other nationalisms? Is American patriotism also "brainwashing"? Or maybe you only support IslamoFascist nationalism? Or Communist nationalism? Do you think at all? Do you know anything at all?
"Do you really think Phil allies himself with Islamofascists?" Constantly. Every day of the week. Have a look at MondoCrap and you will see for yourself…
What's wrong? Can't you admit that people who think like you are actually wrong???? ALways blaming it on someone else???
One fiction (Zionism's beliefs) on top of the next ("Islamofascism"). It's not only Hitler who prided himself himself on going through life like a sleep walker. I could care less, except the USA pays for these crappy dreams in both its treasure and blood.
The picture of the "IDF Fan" with a Bundeswehr eagle on his T-shirt is breaking my irony meter. Next they'll be singing "Israel Uber Alles." http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GERMAN-ARMY-EAGLE-BLACK-BUN...
Nelson, how much is your govt spending on the Arab world? Do you have an clue? About anything? How many US soldiers are protecting petro-sheiks at this very moment? How many billions / month does THAT cost you? Have you saved anything on your gas bill or do the PetroSheiks pull it out of your nose every week? You have a problem with reality. You have a problem.
I agree bizarre, and i wonder how long before the US public realize that the Israeli spin machine places their security at risk….I have a sense that Obama does but his statement that the palestinian state , peace, end to settlements is important to US security is couched in the most obtuse diplomatic speak, so as not to scare the horses…….yet
"I couldn't help but think that the people protesting were more concerned about the safety of the Jewish people than the paraders themselves. Israel is driving towards a cliff right now and we all have a duty to make sure it doesn't fall off the edge. " Interesting post, but I can't say that I have any duty to Israel, one way or another.
I liked Mullen's comments, also. I know a man who was stationed on a ship in the Mediterranean at the time of the Liberty incident, and he didn't buy the accident story based on the talk he heard. He told me that he was in port when the boat was brought in for repairs. He has nothing good to say about the Liberty incident or the way it was handled.
1000,000 to 30 in favor of Jewish crimes. My exerience with Jews is that the vast majority support the violence, murder, theft, oppression, racism and bigotry directed at their supposed enemies in Palestine–as well as the crude exploitation, manipulation and extortion directed at Gentile Americans. This reality puts all the self-righteous talk of Jim Crow, freedom riders, slavery, holocaust, Nazis, Jewish compassion, etc. in a different light, doesn't it?
I am not from the left or the right….And it doesn't hurt to keep in mind such possibilities considering that the Zionist movement has a history of trying to cover all ground(including the planting of people) when it comes to achieving their agenda…
Israel is actually the world leader in trafficking women for prostitution. Or is that one pro woman for you? Homophobia is rife in Israel too. And do you really want to talk about minorities in Israel? I didn't think so….
That's actually a quite interesting sign. It is certainly offensive – which is a good thing. It makes people think – there is a few different interpretations and ideas one can get from that sign…
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