In the Jerusalem Post, Alan Dershowitz goes against the new trend among political Zionists who base Israel's right-to-be-there in the Bible-- as opposed to the Holocaust, which Obama cited in Cairo. Dersh is with Obama. He says, Actually the Holocaust is a basis, because the Palestinians supported the Nazis in the second World War.
I find the article emotionally revealing. Dershowitz fell away from Orthodox observance in his own life; and he really does think the Holocaust could happen again here against Jews. His book Chutzpah suggested as much, and when I heard him at Brandeis 2 years back he referred to the '67 line as the "Auschwitz borders," parroting the Revisionists. He holds the Palestinians responsible for the Holocaust; and thereby underscores Avraham Burg's belief, that Jews too quickly forgave the Nazis, and put their unresolved rage against the extermination on to the Arabs. Like here's his take on the Nakba:
The war started by the Palestinians against the Jews in 1947, and the war started by the Arab states in 1948 against the new state of Israel, were both genocidal wars. Their goal was not merely the ethnic cleansing of the Jews from the area but their total annihilation. The leaders said so and the actions of their subordinates reflected this genocidal goal. They were aided in their efforts by Nazi soldiers - former SS and Gestapo members - who had been given asylum from war crime prosecution in Egypt and who had been recruited by the grand mufti to complete Hitler's work.
Professor, who got pushed into the sea?
So Little Big Horn was the Native Americans prolonging their ethnic cleansing?
You can’t tell one way or another from the article.
How could anyone be convinced, unless already converted?
Speaking to the converted is self-talk.
You hold on to your conversion until it collapses on your head. I’d rather stick a human (that includes all humans) right’s paradigm.
Fine, if it was the capital Haitch-Holy-Coast, the one, the only, the non-pareil, providing Israel’s reason to be, they could have sited Zion in the center of Europe. France, Germany, Bulgaria etc etc, you know, the ones who actually DID the Holy-coasting, were in no position to object in the spring of ’45.
Obviously, the precious Holy Coast, is not the whole story.
Israel: wrong from the start.
This item goes to the discussion on the other thread. There are two types of Jewish nationalists — the right-wing blood and soil variety, an left-wing, which is more common in America. Dershowitz and the Holocaust-exploiters, consistent with left-wing “victim” ethos and modus operandi, are of the left-wing variety. So were the Jewish Bolsheviks, who, like Dershowitz, were crypto-racists filled with contempt, fear and loathing of non-Jews which was revealed by the murderous anti-Christian, anti-dissident character of early Soviet communism.
Also like the Jewish Bolsheviks, the contemporary Jewish nationalist Left has developed elaborate intellectual rationales for what underneath it all merely amounts to primal racism and Jewish supremacy. They’ve essentially developed a sophisticated and “scientific” bodyguard of lies. And too, Jewish nationalism has fostered elaborate State-centered or State co-opting apparatuses (Soviet Bolshevism, the Zionist State in the Levant and the Israel lobby in the U.S.) used to advance the Jewish nationalist project.
I think the Left and left-liberalism need to carefully re-examine the intellectual background of their entire ideology to determine which components were cultivated and developed by crypto Jewish nationalist racists in conscious or sub-conscious aid of the Jewish supremacist agenda and program. In fact, so does the Statist American Right.
OT, Rep. Eric Cantor insists that U.S. policies in the Middle East be “firmly grounded” in Judeo-Christian principles.
Cantor: Set Mideast policies in ‘Judeo-Christian’ tradition:
Nakba is a myth. The Holocaust is a myth. Thus polarization has produced the inevitable nonsense.
Alan Dershowitz wrote:
“Considering the active support by the Palestinian leadership and masses for the losing side of a genocidal war, it was more than fair for the United Nations to offer them a state of their own on more than half of the arable land of the British mandate. ”
Poorly considered by Dershowitz on at least two levels:
A.) The obvious already noted here: If it’s the U.N.’s actions that make Israel legitimate then why doesn’t Israel go back to the lines the U.N. drew for it?
B.) If the fundamental rational that he uses is legitimate then why isn’t it legitimate to hold jews responsible for what amounted to a Holocaust perpetrated against Christian slavs by the Bolsheviks?
His words again: “Considering the active support by the Palestinian leadership and masses for the [the Germans], it was more than fair….”
Essentially identical words: “Considering the active support by the Jewish leadership for the Bolsheviks (such as the Jewish Bund for instance, or the support of jewish leaders both in the Soviet Union and abroad) and masses for the what amounted to the Holocaust they perpetrated…..”
You can’t have it both ways Alan.
A) Before the bet, you had $100 and I had $100. You lost the bet, so why don’t I give you the $100 back? Because you lost the bet, and if you had won, you wouldn’t have given me my $100 back.
This isn’t a game. The Arabs tried to exterminate the Jews, that has consequences.
B) Because the Jews didn’t do that.
@ Andrew R
The Palestinians are in “reservations” because, when they tried to kill the Jews, they lost. If they had won, the Jews would be dead, not in “reservations”. So I think they got the better end of that bet.
Only you Thom, make Alan your opening act…LOL
Thom wrote:
“B) Because the jews didn’t do that.”
But Thom, that’s what’s so startling about Dershowitz’s thesis. He isn’t saying that the Palestinians did the Holocaust, instead his words about it were “[c]onsidering [their] active support….”
Your position—which seems to me a valid one as I’m only pointing up that Dershowitz’s is wrong-headed—goes precisely to what might be called the “classic” case of saying that “the jews” were responsible for Bolshevism. That is, it was based on the number and importance of jews in the Bolshevik movement. And your point there seems to me pungent: They weren’t doing it “as jews” essentially.
But my point is that Dershowitz is now arguing for the validity of what has precisely been the secondary position of people who hold jews at least somewhat responsible for the Bolsheviks: Not that it was done solely by jews or that the jews intimately involved were acting out of jewish impulses, but instead solely on the basis that many jewish leaders and a good chunk of the jewish masses “supported (Dershowitz’s word) the Bolsheviks.
A very different argument.
Seems to me it has a weak point no matter what way it’s applied. To say that the Palestinians “supported” Hitler doesn’t mean the Palestinian people knew about the Holocaust. To say that jews “supported” the Bolsheviks doesn’t mean they knew about the gulag and all the other horrors the Bolshies committed. (Although I will say that the early Bolshies at least were much more open about their bloodthirstiness than Hitler and the Nazis ever were. I think it was Trotsky in fact who right after getting in power talked about how only “rivers” or “oceans” of blood were going to be necessary.)
How about the German Jew soldiers who fought alongside Nazis? Should we put the Jews in cantons now? Should we put their photos up on walls in embassies around the world?
And how about the Nazis themselves then? Do Jews have the right to go expel the Germans and settle their land now? Oh right, these are white Christians. Guess maybe later when they are not in power you can go ahead and rape them using some kind of a new myth which, even though objected to by all Rabbis, will soon afterwards be adopted by them.
I am wondering how long do I have to go if I wanted to list the right to settle and expel that your reasoning will generate from historical wars and genocides.
@Sin Nombre
Haj Amin al-Husseini wasn’t a random Arab, he was their leader. He wasn’t merely an unknowing “supporter of Hitler” he was made fully aware of the Holocaust, and advocated and abetted attempts to exterminate Jews in the Middle East.
The few Jews who were also Bolsheviks were more commonly people like Phil and Adam, those who were Jewish by birth, but otherwise had no connection to Judaism.
Dershowitz also wasn’t making this argument in a vacuum. It was a response to people who are claiming that the establishment of Israel was (A) entirely in response to the holocaust and (B) not fair to the Palestinians, since it was the Germans who did it.
Point being that the argument of those who say it wasn’t fair _because_ the Palestinians didn’t do it, is wrong, at least because they did have a hand in the Holocaust.
The Germans actually exterminated the Jews with the help of Romanians, Poles and Ukrainians. And I don’t see them in reservations. Maybe it would help if they were the prior inhabitants of Palestine.
Thom wrote:
“Point being that the argument of those who say it wasn’t fair _because_ the Palestinians didn’t do it, is wrong, at least because they did have a hand in the Holocaust.”
I guess I’m not understanding your point Thom because I well understood that was indeed Dershowitz’s “collective responsibility”-type argument. Maybe you could put it another way? I could be having a brain hiccup or something.
Otherwise though yeah, I’d concede there’s no jewish figure vis a vis the Bolsheviks comparable to the Mufti and his knowledge and relationship with the Nazis. But while I think you have a point I also think it’s one of “collective responsibility” degree only.
For instance, the Mufti wasn’t elected I don’t think, and Dershowitz obviously just mentioned him to support his main point that a … “significant enough” (my phrase) amount of support for Hitler was present amongst the Palestinians to matter. (Even if of course he can’t say they knew about the Holocaust.) And I think that by almost any standard one has to admit that there was a significant amount of world-wide jewish support for the Bolsheviks over time. (With at least a few “big” jewish names supporting them too, from quite early on in fact.)
So …. Just because a “leader” knows and supports something doesn’t mean—thank God for us all probably—that everyone he or she “leads” can be painted with the same moral brush. After all you got jewish *religious* “leaders” right now being indicted left and right for organ trafficking; not long ago on the eve of the Gaza business one of the IDF’s *rabbis* (if not its chief rabbi) was telling IDF soldiers that mercy is not a jewish value; some American jewish “leader” was extolling “jewish values of war” by saying women, children and pets were fair game; and then we saw the head rabbi for the settlers saying that thousand or a million non-jewish lives weren’t worth one jewish fingernail.
Thus at any rate I think it’s just a matter of degree. (Which, for those who do like such “collective responsibility” ideas applied to jews and the Bolsheviks means that they have to cope with the fact that at least amongst *Russian* jews the Bolsheviks were far from being their first choice. For instance in the beginning at least the Jewish Bund clearly favored the Mensheviks because, unlike the uber-assimilationist Bolsheviks, the Mensheviks went along with the idea of the jews being able to maintain a separate identity.)
As I said though originally I don’t much like Dershowitz’s argument anyway because I don’t much like these collective responsibility ideas. But, again, to the extent one accepts his as regards the Palestinians and the Holocaust I think it applies in ways he definitely wouldn’t like to at least some significant extent as well.
Thom,
We’ve been through your lies before, which are the same lies that Dershowitz is repeating now.
Haj Amin al-Husseini left Jerusalmen in 1939 and in spite of his call for Jihad against the British, the Palestinians ignored his calls and fought with the allies. The Palestinians NEVER supported the Nazis and had no part ot play in the Holocaust.
So the argument that it wasn’t fair _because_ the Palestinians didn’t do it, is absolutely correct. They had no hand whatsoever in the Holocaust.
Sooner or later, you’re going to have to give up the lies.
Ethnic Ashkenazim were already formulating plans to genocide the native population of Palestine in 1881. By the standards of post WW2 Nuremberg Law and the International Convention for the Prevention and Punishment of Genocide, the native population had (and still has the right) to kill any and every racist murderous genocidal Zionist invader, interloper, thief and usurper.
Because Jewish murderousness has constituted a threat to the whole human race since the Bolshevik Revolution, all Americans and all decent human beings should consider the Palestinian resistance heroic in battling the latest form of genocidal Jewish barbarism.
@ Sin Nombre,
This is why the Soviet holocaust has been buried by the Western establishment, and not just by Jewish Zionists. The State-worshipping Left (which didn’t want Bolshevism to totally discredit Left-Statism) and the money-worshipping American Right (which can identify with and is sympathetic the nationalism and the culture of extremist greed embraced by so many Jewish nationalist networks) also played roles in burying or ignoring the Soviet conflagration.
I’m not sure why Western Christians allowed the Bolshevik-perpetrated Soviet holocaust of Orthodox Christians to be buried, but I suspect it may be related to anti-Orthodox bigotry, and the Judeo-Christianity (as opposed to authentic Christianity) practiced by a lot of the leadership, and to the charlatanism and greed of those Judeo-Christian elements.
But to their credit, at least most Christians have always opposed Communism. Even the Judaized ones.
BTW, the case that the organized Jewish intelligentsia collectively supported early Soviet Communism is much stronger than the case that the Palestinians were sympathetic to Nazism. In addition to the huge and massively disproportionate number of Jewish Bolsheviks, there’s the equally significant fact that the Communist coup was underwritten by Jacob Schiff and other Western Jewish bankers.
Why would Jewish bankers support Communism? Because they are Jewish nationalists first, and because they correctly recognized it as a crypto Jewish nationalist apparatus.
All of this buried history has to be sorted through and atoned for before humanity can ever move forward. Those attempting to continue to keep it buried are the true enemies of progressivism.
Ed, is that supposed to mean that you deny us entry because Bolshevik accusations, because you know that is what went on. “They are all Bolshevik’s,” no entry for them, even if they all die – let so and so take them, not us. Not everyone was of this persuasion. However, I have to tell you the truth, to use the almost identical accusations regarding Arabs – “they are all terrorists,” is just as horrifying. It may not mean the immediate and same results – but millions dying in a so-called war on terrorism adds up pretty fast, it makes me sick.
@ v…
I never said “They are all…” But when the organized Jewish intelligentsia gets behind a murderous, authoritarian Statist mass movement designed to advance the Jewish nationalist agenda, be it left-wing or right-wing, it is they who are bringing any consequential blowback upon the Jewish people in general. They are the cause of the misery. That’s something that a lot of self-absorbed Jews don’t seem capable of grasping, which is why they so quickly reach for the victim card, as you have.
If you want to blame someone for the fact that Jews weren’t welcomed with open arms during WWII, blame the Jewish Bolsheviks who attempted to exterminate Christianity. If Dershowitz wants to blame someone for the fact that Arabs haven’t welcomed the Jews with open arms, he should blame the Nakba Zionists AND the Bolsheviks.
It’s called self-responsibility, self-examination, minding the log in your own eye. The Jewish cognoscenti should try it someday. Maybe at that point they will start evolving, as Weiss has.
So you think it was to exterminate Christianity, interesting. Let me clue you in on something Ed, what was feared in these countries then is feared now, the loss of the franchise of an elite. Sure, as far as religion goes, they are all equally fallacious and are primarily used to drive the people in the direction that a few want.
What you are seeing now is the death knell of this defunct capitalist system, which so gravitated the wealth to the few and than created similar franchises all over the world – that it is collapsing in on itself. If you think the worse is over think again.
However, in the context of this discussion, it does not matter what the fears were of the countries which allowed genocide to proceed – nor do the forms of government argument suffice. As I said previously, anyone anywhere using these methodologies should be stopped. It does not matter if it is in Israel of the USA, the former Soviet Union, or any other part of the world. That is why I am able in the same paragraph to step from what took place in the Holocaust to the current so-called war on terror.
Ed wrote:
“Why would Jewish bankers support Communism? Because they are Jewish nationalists first, and because they correctly recognized it as a crypto Jewish nationalist apparatus.”
Oh, Ed, you’re viewing history too much through a retrospective lens, though which it always tends to look like what happened was the result of fully informed and consciously designed plans and etc. If you look at history from the perspective of its times however, it’s just like we see the future now: Probably determined far less by knowledgeable design than by ignorant blundering and happenstance.
I don’t think Schiff, et. al. thought they were bankrolling a “crypto Jewish nationalist apparatus.” I think that they felt they were bankrolling something that at least wasn’t Tsarist Russia, and you forget, I think, the absolute utter disregard and hatred that Tsarist Russia had engendered in all the West by the time it fell. Its name was a virtual by-word for corruption, stupidity, brutality and you name it in almost everyone’s mind, everywhere.
And of course that was especially so amongst jews given its pogroms, but if Schiff, et. al. had really been out to fund a “crypto Jewish nationalist apparatus” they would have funded the Mensheviks not the Bolshies. If you think the latter had a lot of jews in same just read up on the Mensheviks; it was damn near totally jewish in nature, and as I said in my post to Thom it positively celebrated the idea of jews keeping a separate identity, with the Bolshies trying like crazy to stamp that out almost from the start.
Not something that the Schiff you imagine would have tried to encourage at all, and so clearly there was an element there of him just feeling that anything was better than the freaking Tsar, and remember, for a long time bringing the Tsar back was exactly what the Whites were threatening to do, and then even the monarchy generally after the Tsar and his family got in the way of Lenin’s bullets in that basement.
Like I say, looking backwards damn near everything can appear to have been caused by someone’s plan or conspiracy or etc., but look at today: Nobody is cagily negotiating their way into the future and nirvana. At best everyone is just careening forward, liking to think that what they are doing is sensible, but as often as not with it being found that same was stupid, futile, and very often precisely counter-productive.
I.e., hindsight can be *so* 20/20 that its very clarity can mislead us into thinking that such clarity also appeared to those who viewed it in foresight.
@ v and SN,
Both of you are apparently believe the Judaized narrative of Czarist Russia, which is about as reliable as the Judaized narrative of the Islamic Middle East. I concede all ideological narratives have a built-in bias, but we all know that ethnocentric Jews (whether they admit to being Zionist or not) lie through their teeth routinely. We all also know a lot of Jews have incredibly active imaginations and are gifted at storytelling, which makes organized Jewry’s version of “history” unreliable, to say the least.
Ed, every people in one way or another is given to myth in regard to their beginnings or origin, the point of departure is what does one do with their myths (and religion for the most part is just overactive myth). You put too much weight on the word Judaized, it is usually the word used to imply that there is a Jew behind every problem. Lying is also not something which any people, however identified, have some franchise on – what, you have never read the Greek myths or others of this nature? To be frank Judaism at the root is nothing but a mixture and twist of the religious myths in the region, so you can hardly say there is anything unique about the content. In fact, someone claiming what you have is just a sign of not having studied antiquities.
There are no versions of history told correctly, especially by a moneyed victor. No settler states have ever owned up to their origins, including but not exclusively the USA as an example. However, even having said all of the above, there is never any excuse in any historical scenario for the genocide of any people. There are excuses that people make for being a participant in such atrocities, but I say unequivocally none of them hold muster – especially in our long history of humanity, the means of communication we have in the 21 century, and the fact that virtually every people have contributed to each other in such significant ways .
Oh, and one other matter – just because their are genocides throughout history, it does not give a green flag for their present day continuation. In this context I have used the example of Morris and hs incessant reference to the “good” that came out of the genocide of the indigenous population in the USA region. It is like saying that I have found if you shoot dogs in the night you will never hear them barking again, so lets shoot all the dogs – utilitarian arguments, and arguments of pragmatism with no thought to the result are reprehensible. Likewise, to have settlers in the early history of the United States say they are a “city on a hill – a chosen people” etc., and than kill the indigenous populations was inexcusable. It certainly does not give carte blanch to every would be Hegelian state to march in the same direction and perpetuate acts of barbarism.
@ed – are there any Jews you don’t find ethnocentric? Name one. Come on, there has to be one.
The fllowing quotes give the true explantion for why the Palestinians are in “reservations”.
In 1891Ahad Ha’Am similarly wrote of the Palestinians:
“If a time comes when our people in Palestine develop so that, in small or great measure, they push out the native inhabitants, these will not give up their place easily.” (Righteous Victims, p. 49)
Moshe Smilansky wrote in Hapoel Hatzair in the spring edition of 1908:
“Either the Land of Israel of Israel belongs in the national sense to those Arabs who settled there in recent years [before 1908], and then we have no place there and we must say explicitly: The land of our fathers is lost to us. [Or] if the land of Israel belongs to us, the the Jewish people, then our national interests come before all else. . . . it is not possible for one country to serve as the homeland of two peoples.” (Righteous Victims, p. 58)
Israel Zangwill, who had visited Palestine in 1897 and came face-to-face with the demographic reality. He stated in 1905 in a speech to a Zionist group in Manchester that:
“Palestine proper has already its inhabitants. The pashalik of Jerusalem is already twice as thickly populated as the United States, having fifty-two souls to the square mile, and not 25% of them Jews ….. [We] must be prepared either to drive out by the sword the [Arab] tribes in possession as our forefathers did or to grapple with the problem of a large alien population, mostly Mohammedan and accustomed for centuries to despise us.” (Expulsion Of The Palestinians, p. 7- 10, and Righteous Victims, p. 140)
In 1923, Ze’ev Jabotinsky wrote of how Palestinians really felt about their attachment to Palestine:
“They look upon Palestine with the same instinctive love and true favor that Aztec looked upon Mexico or any Sioux looked upon his prairie. Palestine will remain for the Palestinians not a borderland, but their birthplace, the center and basis of their own national existence.” (Righteous Victims, p. 36)
Similarly, Ze’ev Jabotinsky also wrote in 1923:
“The Arabs loved their country as much as the Jews did. Instinctively, they understood Zionist aspirations very well, and their decision to resist them was only natural ….. There was not misunderstanding between Jew and Arab, but a natural conflict. …. No Agreement was possible with the Palestinian Arab; they would accept Zionism only when they found themselves up against an ‘iron wall,’ when they realize they had no alternative but to accept Jewish settlement.” (America And The Founding Of Israel, p. 90)
In 1926 Ze’ev Jabotinsky wrote of the national struggle between the two conflicting, but justified Jewish and Palestinian national movements:
“The tragedy lies in the fact that there is a collision here between two truths ….. But our justice is greater. The Arabs is culturally backward , but his instinctive patriotism is just as pure and noble as our own; it can not be bought, it can only be curbed … force majeure.” (Righteous Victims, p. 108)
In the early 1930′s, Ben-Gurion finally admitted the mistake of trying to bribe or buy the Palestinian national movement, rather than working with it, he stated in a Mapai forum:
“We have erred for ten years now . . . the crux is not cooperation with the English, but with the [Palestinian] Arabs.” By this he meant not merely a relationship of friendship and mutual aid, but political cooperation, which he called the “cornerstone” of the “Arab-Jewish-English rule in Palestine. Let’s not deceive ourselves and think that when we approach the [Palestinian] Arabs and tell them ‘We’ll build schools and better your economic conditions,’ that we have succeeded. Let’s not think that the [Palestinian] Arabs by nature are different from us.” In the heat of the argument, Ben-Gurion said to one of his critics and asked: “Do you think that, by extending economic favors to the [Palestinian] Arabs, you can make them forget their political rights in Palestine?” Did Mapai believe that by aiding the Palestinian Arabs to secure decent housing and grow bumper crops they could persuade the Palestinian Arabs to regard themselves “as complete strangers in the land which is theirs?” (Shabtai Teveth, p. 114)
I am sure that Alan is “sincere,’ but anyone that writes a book on a principle of plagiarism, primarily of a hoax (Joan Peters “tome”), should not be anyone’s spokesperson. Felix must be turning over in his grave with this clown in his chair. He should stick to what he does, be an attorney in earnest – history, nor apparently the facts involved are his cup of tea…lol
You cannot pay enough to get this sort of comedy (its only value), what does this remind me of?…
BRING ME MY FOOL!!
LOL
THE FIGHT OF THE CENTURY!
LOL
According to Edwin Black’s The Transfer Agreement: The Dramatic Story of the Pact Between the Third Reich and Jewish Palestine , the Nazi regime survived its first year or two in office in large part because of the agreement it struck with the Jewish Authority in Palestine: the Jewish boycott of Nazi Germany would be moderated and hard currency would be sent to Germany in return for Germany allowing large numbers of German Jews to migrate to Palestine.
I’m currently reading another book about the first years of Nazi rule, Heinz Höhne’s ‘Gebt mir vier Jahre Zeit’, and it presents much the same picture of the Transfer Agreement.
From Dershowitz’s article:
Husseini is still regarded by many as “the George Washington” of the Palestinian people, and if the Palestinians were to get a state of their own, he would be honored as our founding father is.
As far as I know, Jewish terrorist David Raziel, who killed 35 innocent civilians (including women, toddlers and senior citizens) with a bomb hidden in a barrel of pickles at the Arab marketplace in Haifa (among countless other atrocities), is honored by the state of Israel, which has named a moshav and streets in all major cities after him.
And in America, Ulysses S. Grant, the antisemitic monster who expelled Jews from Kentucky during the civil war, is celebrated in the 50-dollar bill, to the deafening silence of Zionists.
You know, all peoples and countries can be made out to be catastrophically evil.
Moreover, Dershowitz has been exposed as a bare-faced liar regarding Israel’s “purity of arms” (see here), so that we need not believe the stories he tells about Husseini.
There’s also a statue of Grant in St. Louis.
And lots of claims about Husseini need to be scrutinized closer. Philip Mattar found no evidence he had any effect on German policy or even a single aktion.
A cursory look at Wikipedia’s article on Husseini is enough to see that Dershowitz talks crap. For instance, he says Husseini stopped 4,000 Jewish children escorted by 500 adults from leaving Europe. Actually, the children and adults did manage to leave Europe for Palestine (a crucial fact that Dershowitz omits), after which Husseini wrote to the German Foreign office asking for further such proposals to be blocked. I.e., Husseini was trying to avoid Jewish immigration to Palestine, not in any way collaborating with the Holocaust; he didn’t block emigration to other places than Palestine. He was acting in accordance with his national interests, not in accordance with the Final Solution.
With subtle language shifts, Dershowitz twists the sources to make them mean that Husseini became an active perpetrator of the Holocaust, when all he did was what Jews like Avraham Stern also tried to do: associate with the Nazis to further their own national goals.
No kidding? I usually avoid wiki on controversial issues.
You’re right andrew r.
Husseini has become one of the favorite boogie men of the Israeli propagandists, but he was insignificant. He was no longer revelant to Palestine after 1939, and in spite of his twisted ideas, he commanded no respect among Palestinians, who ignored his calls for Jihad against the British.
Unlike Husseini, the Stern Gang received funding from Nazi affiliated fascists in Italy, while Jews were burning in ovens in Germany.
unfunny clown with the superior ability to create laughter among the reasonable and the wise.
The Zionists supported the Nazis much more than the Palestinians. No wonder Zionism is the last bastion of the Nazi virus.
The Israelis are so disgusting. Truly, they won’t be satisfied until the entire world retroactively justifies the holocaust, until the whole world says “if this is what jews are like, maybe exterminating them wasn’t a mistake.”
That’s what Israel is working on achieving.
The are the bitter enemy of all jews of conscience and they need to be utterly destroyed.
Finland was full of Jew hating nazis also, apparently, what with their siding with the Axis in WW2…
There is an analysis by some of the indigenous that I think has merit, in regard to the theistic gods with all of the anthropomorphism. They erect these gods that are purely there in their own image, so that all of their acts can gain ascendancy as if they were coming from some almighty being. This includes all of the excuses for the atrocities that have been committed in the name of this supposed god(s).
I say the god of manifest destiny is dead, he has drowned in the blood of millions of innocents that has been she in his damn name. Yes, a pronouncement that should bring great joy to the billions of individuals that inhabit the earth. It carried within it the seed of what has been spread across the globe, a beast that cannot grow unless it devours all in it’s path.
The shinning “city on the hill” is nothing less than a mirage, created by an elite to motivate an ignorant people. A belief of superiority written like a stain in the documents of origin, that would look upon the original inhabitants of the land and call them “savages” (Declaration Of Independence), and hence forward to look upon all people as expendable to it’s twisted goal. That would continue to this day to demonize people, which is merely the same reprehensible goal of “who they wish to exploit they vilify.”
However now, at long last the people begin to awaken and curse the man made god of elite design. We have begun to realize that there is nothing noble in ancient or modern crusades – they are cruel jokes that kill multitudes and enrich the few. People are beginning to see that this is nothing but the exploitation, there is nothing new – it is only something old dressed in new garb.
What god is this that would approve of such atrocities? One that deserves to die, and has truly died when the people see the acts of these reprobates for what they really are – unforgivable murder, unrelenting exploitation, which bespeaks a god made in the image of the few, the elite, and their duped minions.
GOD WANTS YOU TO GO TO WAR
Some of my best friends are lawyers, … but ….
There is an inherent problem when Zionism is defended by attorneys. For that matter the Palestinians could be vulnerable to that.
Instead of examining the truth by universal standards, and being willing to courageously acknowledge what truth is discovered, the lawyer is trained to be a shill for one side or the other, to dig out the dirt on the other, twist the truth, ignore the warts and weaknesses in the “case” for his team, and ignore truths that might support the “case” for the opponent. If inconvenient truths appear then it is the lawyer’s job to mangle and mutilate beyond recognition and use his superior intelligence to outwit the opponent. And when one cannot dazzle with brilliance, one can baffle with BS.
Attorneys have their place, but when they get into advocating for a faction in a complicated human tragedy, they are by nature going to confuse and cloud the truth, Dershowitz being a most excellent example.
Yes, it’s called “the adversary system.” The judge or jury (limited by the instructions to the jury) is suppose to choose between the conflicting theories with the presented totality of testimony and evidence presented by the opposing attorneys. Obviously if the judge is biased or the jury is biased justice is not served. Dershowitz is very much the trial lawyer advocating in the invisible Court Of Public Opinion–every time he does so an opposing trial lawyer should be there too. Otherwise, his scholarship
works have been fully discredited by much better scholars.
Well, yeah. “Smear the victim” is one of the oldest tricks in the lawyers’ books.
And still the jerk Jerkowitz keeps jerking off…
That’s the most I’ve gotta say on his latest exploits…
Summary: Holocaust and Ashkenazi Genocidalism
Followup (II): Origins of Modern Jewry discusses Jewish anti-Czarist propaganda and other Jewish lies.
For the record, Huffpo is back to their old tricks . One poster is leaving comments about the Palestinian/Nazi connection, but when I try to cite the Zionist/Nazi connection, the comments never see the light of day.
So why are the Palestinians the ones in reservations?
What an idiotic comment. Read your own book of fables, otherwise knownas the Torah. You see the land was occupied by the Canaanites when Abraham from Ur arrived. So you were never “native.” You were just one of many groups who lived there over the millienium.
And when are you thieves going to give Jerusalem back to the Jebusites?
Somebody lived in the land of Israel before “God” promised it to Jews if I remember correctly the Bible, so your “native” theory is rather disputable. If we look back the last 4000 years actually Jews have been most of that time a tiny minority on that piece of land.
Native Americans might be surprised to hear your version of their history. They think
you have a hole in your head, insisting they never virtually vanished for a couple thousand years to wander the earth.
The stage was set and there are already a number ready for the ptII , I am hoping they do all the politicians then the media and leave the public masses throughout the world for last because once they realize the political people are finished they will realized they had been sold a false bill of goods by belief that they are entitiled to someone elses money or land or lively hood, they steal all they have and are murderous pigs that need to be stopped too bad this was not 50 years sooner.
If you think Jews are in reservations, that just goes to show how we’ve colonized ourselves. We must have really liked the Pale of Settlement to move back there once the cage was open.
“The same question may go for Jews, why are Jews in reservations? ”
They’re not. That’s the point.
As soon as we can find them.
Translating Черта оседлости as Pale of settlement is simply false use of a term from British history in the wrong context. It refers to the Boundary of (Jewish) settlement within those territories of historic Poland.
Backgrounder on Pale of Settlement
Origins: Jewish Viciousness and Violence
by Joachim Martillo (ThorsProvoni@aol.com)
Understanding the Russian Pale of Jewish Settlement is important because the Jewish Zionist violence and viciousness evinced during the Israeli attack on Gaza did not originate with the Holocaust but was an important element of Jewish society in the Pale and probably contributed to the form that Zionist ideology ultimately took.
Even though the Pale is often identified as a (cramped or overpopulated) Russian-established ghetto, in reality it was vast and initially corresponded to the Russian ruled portion of the historic homeland of Yiddish-speaking Russian Jews, who are more precisely described as ethnic Ashkenazim.
During the 19th century the Czarist government added Chernigov and New Russia to the territory of the Pale. Jewish income, education and life-span in the whole region were all greater than those of the non-Jews among whom they lived.
Yet ethnic Ashkenazim were on the whole extremely angry because they no longer had the elite status they had enjoyed in Commonwealth Poland. In fact, without actually ever having moved the ethnic Ashkenazim of the Czarist Empire lived in the imperial sticks and no longer at the imperial center.
Like all other populations in the Czarist Empire, ethnic Ashkenazim had no freedom to relocate to the central territories without an internal passport and official permission.
Ethnic Ashkenazi population was increasing while the traditional Jewish economic sector was vanishing.
Ethnic Ashkenazim were able in some ways to call upon the resources of extremely wealthy Jews that dominated the media and banking industries in Central and Western Europe.
From the 1850s onward German American Jews were developing similar power generally with the help of the capital resources of relatives in Europe.
As their political economic muscle grew German American Jews became ever more willing to flex it on behalf of Russian Jews.
When the Czarist Empire started moving Jews away from the Western boarders because of Jewish smuggling, the outcry from the Central and Western European press forced the Czar to reverse his decision.
As ethnic Ashkenazi economic and political frustration grew, a small segment of them undertook a campaign of revolutionary violence, sabotage, and targeted assassination.
Ethnic Ashkenazim planned and carried out the three defining murders of Russian history: Alexander II, Pyotr Stolypin, and Nicholas II.
[To read the entire article, click here.]
“Translating Черта оседлости as Pale of settlement is simply false use of a term from British history in the wrong context. It refers to the Boundary of (Jewish) settlement within those territories of historic Poland”
should have been
“Translating Черта оседлости as Pale of settlement is simply false use of a term from British history in the wrong context. It refers to the Boundary of (Jewish) settlement within those historic Polish territories absorbed into the Czarist Empire.”