The view from Gaza: ‘The Turkish government has sold us out and wants us to be grateful’

Israel/Palestine
on 46 Comments

Israel and Turkey have reached an agreement to normalize ties six years after an Israeli naval attack that killed 10 Turkish activists and 9 years after the imposition of a deadly siege that has left Gaza unlivable.

What do we, Palestinians of Gaza, feel about it?

To put it mildly, we are dismayed and angered as must be the families of the 10 victims of the Mavi Marmara incident. This deal leaves us under a hermetic, medieval siege that amounts to what the Israeli historian Ilan Pappe calls “incremental genocide.” Needless to say that the deal also violates the boycott guidelines which Palestinians civil society issued in 2005. In fact, it is not unlike normalizing diplomatic and economic ties with South African apartheid.

Recep Tayyip Erdoğan’s Justice and Development Party (AKP) is the Turkish branch of Ikhwan (Muslim Brotherhood) who ruled Egypt for a year and failed to open the Rafah crossing and lift the siege. Hamas, the Palestinian branch, has also added misery to the lives of the besieged of Gaza through its strict rule and absence of any political vision. Now, the Ikhwan of Turkey strike a deal with apartheid Israel at the expense of Palestinian basic rights!

(Image: Carlos Latuff)

(Image: Carlos Latuff)

To add insult to injury, Hamas has issued a statement “expressing its gratitude for Mr. Erdogan’s efforts to help the residents of Gaza, which are in line with Turkey’s principled support of the Palestinian cause”! And Hamas leader Ahmed Yousuf made it clear that “Turkey has done all it could to lift the siege and help the Palestinians of Gaza. The regional changes have made it change its policy and accept the easing of the siege instead! We can’t expect more than this from Turkey.” (my translation)

Defenders of the Turkish government, namely Islamists, are up in arms to justify the unjustifiable. The Israel-Turkey reconciliation deal has nothing to do with Gaza, and everything to do with Israel’s, and to some extent Turkey’s, interests.

In fact, the Ikhwan never fail to let u down. They don’t want to acknowledge that the Israel-Turkey reconciliation deal is a slap in the face of ethical and moral decency for the mere fact that Turkey has ended up asking for Israel’s help to lift the siege on Gaza.

So what does “lifting the siege” mean?

It basically means opening the six crossings to Gaza, the keys of  which are in Israel’s hands, and allowing the flow of all kinds of goods, especially essentials, to and from Gaza; and providing Gaza with electricity and clean water; and guaranteeing the freedom of movement of the 2 million Palestinians of Gaza.  This also means opening the Rafah crossing 24/7.  This is the responsibility of the occupying power, namely Israel. But even this does not meet the minimum basic rights of the Palestinian people: freedom, equality, and justice. No normal relations with apartheid Israel should be resumed without the latter complying with International law that guarantees Palestinian basic rights.

A quick reading of the deal proves that it is a stab in the back of Gaza. Improving the conditions of oppression, or rather slowing down the genocide, is a form of complicity because Gaza for the Turkish government is just a humanitarian case. In a nutshell, the Turkish government has sold us out and wants us to be grateful!

The “incremental genocide” continues.

About Haidar Eid

Haidar Eid is Associate Professor of Postcolonial and Postmodern Literature at Gaza's al-Aqsa University. He has written widely on the Arab-Israeli conflict, including articles published at Znet, Electronic Intifada, Palestine Chronicle, and Open Democracy. He has published papers on cultural Studies and literature in a number of journals, including Nebula, Journal of American Studies in Turkey, Cultural Logic, and the Journal of Comparative Literature.

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46 Responses

  1. Boomer
    June 28, 2016, 2:35 pm

    After years of reading this site, and many more years of reading the news, I understand the realities of American politics. Yet I still don’t understand why the U.S., whose leaders have often paid lip service to the notion of humanitarian aid for Palestinians (so long as it does not get in the way of Israel’s aspirations) could not open a port in Gaza, under UN supervision, to make it possible for other nations to bring in non-military items.

    • Annie Robbins
      June 28, 2016, 2:53 pm

      sure, they could open a port, but they won’t. to understand the realities of american politics is to understand that legislative and diplomatic efforts pertaining US middle east policy — especially anything directly impacting palestinians — requires lobby backing and approval. israel wants a blockade — it’s a sadistic policy but the US won’t counter israel on this. not until congress thumbs its collective nose at the lobby (start w/campaign finance reform). we are far away from turning ME foreign policy around. the peoples option is bds, the change will come generationally — and relatively soon.

      • Boomer
        June 28, 2016, 7:51 pm

        Annie, campaign finance reform is not going to happen unless the Supreme Court overturns its own rulings. The Court has again ruled to assure that government of the rich, by the rich, for the rich does not perish from the United States:

        WaPo: “Supreme Court again supports ‘ingratiation and access’ in politics”

        https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/supreme-court-again-supports-ingratiation-and-access-in-politics/2016/06/27/5fc6df7e-3ca2-11e6-84e8-1580c7db5275_story.html?hpid=hp_no-name_opinion-card-d%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

      • Boomer
        June 30, 2016, 1:47 pm

        PS to Annie re Gaza blockade: “it’s a sadistic policy but the US won’t counter israel on this”

        I’m particularly disturbed by US support for the sadism, which should be regarded as superfluous even by Zionist standards. Even if one assumes that Israel is entitled to keep what it has now, even if one assumes that Israel is entitled to exclude Palestinians from Israel, even if one assumes that Israel is entitled to treat non-Jews who live there as second-class citizens, the policy regarding Gaza is unnecessary and sadistic. It shouldn’t require a super-hero’s courage for American politicians to say this. I am convinced that the American public, if not AIPAC, would support such a politician who explained the facts.

    • Mr.T
      June 30, 2016, 12:16 pm

      Most likely because Israel and its supporters in the US, wants Gazans specifically, and Palestinians in general, to suffer for the crime of not kissing Israel’s butt and letting it steal all of the Palestinians’ land.

      • Boomer
        June 30, 2016, 3:04 pm

        re Mr. T on Israel’s sadistic Gaza policy: “Most likely because Israel and its supporters in the US, wants Gazans specifically, and Palestinians in general, to suffer for the crime of not kissing Israel’s butt and letting it steal all of the Palestinians’ land.”

        As one observes’s Zionist rhetoric and actions, that does seem to be a pattern. Thus merely speaking the truth (to say nothing of throwing a stone) is not just unacceptable but unforgivable. Perhaps some of the motivating factors are psychological: projection and repressed guilt. I spent part of my childhood in the Jim Crow South. Even before I read Freud, and before I knew such terms, it was clear to me that such factors were part of what powered the attitudes of many of my fellow white Southerners toward Negroes, which was the more polite word of the era.

        Indeed, I seem to recall Tom Friedman saying as much in “From Beirut to Jerusalem” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_Beirut_to_Jerusalem. It was one of the first books I read after 9/11, as I sought greater knowledge of the region. It wouldn’t be my first choice now, but despite its weaknesses, it was worth reading. I loaned my much-highlighted and annotated copy to someone who never returned it, and I certainly can’t quote it from memory. But as I recall, Friedman says something to the effect that the Jewish Israeli knows the injustice that been done to the “Arabs,” (which I believe is the term Friedman mostly used) and he knows the hate and rage he would feel, where he in their place. Accordingly, by an obvious psychological mechanism, this becomes an implacable fear and hatred on the part of the Jewish Israeli.

  2. genesto
    June 29, 2016, 12:21 pm

    The writer is right on! This is a TERRIBLE deal! I was part of the 2010 Flotilla. Keep in mind that, not only were 10 people murdered, but scores were injured, and 466 of us were kidnapped and imprisoned with all of the cargo and our valuables stolen – including, except for the Mavi, all of the boats. With this deal, the criminals responsible will escape prosecution, at least in Turkey, which practically assures that similar crimes will be carried out in the future until Israel is finally held accountable for them. Worst of all, though, the siege, instead of being lifted, is now being ‘normalized’, just like the rest of the Occupation. Meanwhile, for a payment of only $20 million (which US taxpayers will cover?) Israel stands to gain billions in trade deals with Turkey. Finally, if you believe that Israel will allow critical materials and supplies into Gaza as a result of this deal, guess again!

    It will be very interesting to see what the families of the victims say and do about this ‘deal’. My guess is that they will reject it outright and keep fighting for REAL justice, even if it means fighting their own government to secure it!

    Stay tuned.

    • Boomer
      June 30, 2016, 1:50 pm

      re genesto, “This is a TERRIBLE deal! I was part of the 2010 Flotilla.”

      My sympathy to you. I can imagine how you feel: you cared enough to go, and now you witness this result.

  3. Paul Larudee
    June 29, 2016, 1:28 pm

    “(so long as it does not get in the way of Israel’s aspirations)” – See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/2016/06/turkish-government-grateful/#sthash.HvqQmrCc.zuhrMV9z.dpuf

    A high priority Israeli aspiration is to complete the genocide of the Palestinian people. A port in Gaza interferes with this aspiration.

    • hophmi
      June 29, 2016, 3:43 pm

      Paul Larudee, aren’t you one of the people behind The Syria Solidarity Movement, which fronts for genocidal dictator Bashar al-Assad?

      • Rusty Pipes
        June 29, 2016, 10:54 pm

        Refreshing to see that you have all the talking points down consistent with the neocon playbook of regime change in seven MENA countries, including Syria. GOI has such humanitarian concern for the people of Syria that it is willing to operate as Al Nusra’s MASH unit for Golan operations, but will not even allow Palestinians from Syria to take refuge in Israel/Palestine.

      • Marnie
        June 30, 2016, 4:22 am

        Just another right wing rim shot from hophni. Stick around, he’s got almost 2000 of ’em.

      • Mooser
        June 30, 2016, 3:52 pm

        “Paul Larudee, aren’t you one of the people behind The Syria Solidarity Movement, which fronts for genocidal dictator Bashar al-Assad?

        As usual, “Hophmi” doesn’t know if he’s coming or going.

    • Boomer
      June 30, 2016, 3:20 pm

      re Paul Larudee, quoting me and then commenting:

      ” ‘(so long as it does not get in the way of Israel’s aspirations)’ . . .

      “A high priority Israeli aspiration is to complete the genocide of the Palestinian people. A port in Gaza interferes with this aspiration.”

      I hadn’t attributed a genocidal aspiration to Israel, but I guess that I can’t rule it out. Certainly history suggests that ethnic cleansing, at least, is an aspiration. Still, if Israel merely wanted the residents of Gaza gone, it would seem logical that Israel would make it easier for them to escape. So maybe Israel’s aspirations do go beyond ethnic cleansing. In that regard, I would also refer you to my reply to Mr. T above, which may have some relevance here as well. Perhaps it isn’t a genocidal aspiration, so much as blind, unreasoning fear and hatred that fuel the sadism.

  4. ET
    June 29, 2016, 7:58 pm

    Turkish Government is not the Government of the UNGA 181 State of Palestine: Abbas has sold out the Palestinians of Gaza, Palestinians of the West Bank, & Palestinian Refugees

    Abbas has been purposed on surrendering sovereignty of Territory of UNGA 181 State of Palestine & surrendering sovereign powers accorded under UNGA 3236, A/RES/43/177, & A/RES/67/19 through failed UNSC Saudi Draft & now French Initiative
    .
    1 Abbas at work surrendering the Arafat Leadership gains
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=908192892603846&set=a.862461040510365.1073741848.100002394314450&type=3&theater
    .
    2 VC_LOT Article 53: Absurd premise that UNSC 242 & I_973 could be breached through a bi-lateral agreement
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1026772450745889&set=a.513375965418876.1073741833.100002394314450&type=3&theater
    .
    3 VC_LOT Article 47 Notification vis-a-vis Abbas powers
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=901471446609324&set=a.513375965418876.1073741833.100002394314450&type=3&theater

  5. neggy
    July 1, 2016, 1:24 am

    If it were a hermetic medieval siege, the people of Gaza would be forced into starvation/thirst and eventual surrender. In order to execute such a siege, Israel would have to push into Gaza and circumvallate the city itself, burning or otherwise capturing the rural parts. Electricity, communications, and water access would be curtailed.

    What Israel does to Gaza is more of an economic and military blockade than a medieval siege, and it does nobody any good to tell emotive lies, since Israel could impose a medieval siege on Gaza if it wanted to.

    • Annie Robbins
      July 1, 2016, 1:47 am

      longing for the good ol days of medieval sieges eh negs?

      • Mooser
        July 1, 2016, 2:02 am

        “longing for the good ol days of medieval sieges eh negs?”

        “Neggy” seems to have an almost pathologically exaggerated idea of Israel’s power.

        I wonder if a starvation blockade of Gazans, and watching them starve to death on video will help the world-wide antisemitism problem the Zionists are always telling us about.

      • neggy
        July 1, 2016, 3:05 am

        Aye. To crush my enemies, see them driven before me, and to hear the lamentations of their women.

        Anyway, I am just saying that it may be emotive to call Gaza a medieval-style siege, it’s like saying that a steak with no cheese on it is a philly-style cheese steak. It doesn’t make sense.

      • Mooser
        July 1, 2016, 11:15 am

        “aye. To crush my enemies, see them driven before me, and to hear the lamentations of their women.”

        Yeah, yeah, you’re a regular conqueror.

        Patsh zich in tuchis und schrei “hooray”!!

      • neggy
        July 1, 2016, 11:35 am

        Mooser, that is the definition of a medieval-style siege, not an instruction manual. What do you want from me?

      • Annie Robbins
        July 1, 2016, 1:50 pm

        I am just saying that it may be emotive to call Gaza a medieval-style siege…. It doesn’t make sense.

        um, you’re the only one saying it. if it doesn’t make sense to you, stop. because what we’ve got going on in Gaza is very much a modern age Israeli-style siege and it’s ugly and cruel and sadistic just as it is.

    • eljay
      July 1, 2016, 2:11 pm

      || neggy: If it were a hermetic medieval siege, the people of Gaza would be forced into starvation/thirst and eventual surrender. …

      What Israel does to Gaza is more of an economic and military blockade than a medieval siege … ||

      So…what Israel – a self-proclaimed “moral beacon” and “light unto the nations” state – does isn’t very evil, it’s just evil. Good to know.

      || … and it does nobody any good to tell emotive lies … ||

      And yet Zio-supremacists can’t seem to help themselves.

      • MHughes976
        July 1, 2016, 3:35 pm

        The original reason for the Gaza blockade was that Hamss was not prepared to recognise Israel and to renounce use of force in pursut of Palestinian claims.
        Medieval sieges were encirclements preceding or punctuated by assaults, with people swarming up ladders and all that. Orleans, Joan of Arc etc.. The aim was to produce surrender, ie acceptance of someone as feudal overlord. That does not seem too far distant from what Israel is doing to Gaza.
        Mind you, it is the modernist ruthlessness rather than the medievalism that is so awful.

      • neggy
        July 1, 2016, 11:03 pm

        Nah that’s all silly guff. War is war, not a fun walk in the park with marshmallows and bubble gum. I just think Israel should do what it needs to win outright, and if that means a proper siege (of which, as you see above, they are already accused), they might as well do it. Could you imagine how many times dead all the ppl in Gaza would be if Israel did all the things people say they do?

      • eljay
        July 2, 2016, 9:37 am

        || neggy: … War is war, not a fun walk in the park with marshmallows and bubble gum. … ||

        You might want to mention that to your fellow Zio-supremacists who spend an awful lot of time whining about how nasty those non-Israelis are to Israel. :-(

        || … I just think Israel should do what it needs to win outright … ||

        And not-Israel should do the same to win outright. Seems fair. But that means an awful lot of Jews could die in the process. Why do you Zio-supremacists hate Jews so much?!

      • neggy
        July 2, 2016, 12:56 pm

        eljay they already are. Israel’s enemies aren’t holding back because of scruples. They are holding back because they can’t win right now.

      • Mooser
        July 2, 2016, 1:35 pm

        ” I just think Israel should do what it needs to win outright”

        ” Israel should do what it needs to win outright” To “win” what?

        Love to hear you tell us what, and how, Israel can win. Oh, BTW, don’t forget to tell us how we, the Jews of the rest of the world, win too, when Israel wins. Tell us all about that.

      • echinococcus
        July 2, 2016, 2:49 pm

        Neggy,

        Why so coy? Why not say it in so many words? The world is holding back because of the chokehold of the Zionist Fifth Column on the government of the US, the imperialist superpower

      • eljay
        July 2, 2016, 3:38 pm

        || neggy: eljay they already are. … ||

        You’re absolutely right…except they’re not.

        || … Israel’s enemies aren’t holding back because of scruples. … ||

        Ditto Israel.

        || … They are holding back because they can’t win right now. ||

        Ditto Israel.

        But I’m glad to hear that your fellow Zio-supremacists are wrong and Israel is in fact not perpetually on the verge of being wiped off the map and pushed into the sea by Aye-rabs, the Mooslim hordes and/or Iran.

      • Talkback
        July 5, 2016, 9:09 am

        neggy: “I just think Israel should do what it needs to win outright, and if that means a proper siege (of which, as you see above, they are already accused), they might as well do it”.

        How about genocide since you seem to inspired by crimes against humanity? Does this fit your Zionist agenda?

      • ClearAndPresentDanger
        July 7, 2016, 11:39 am

        MHughes976: “The original reason for the Gaza blockade was that Hamss was not prepared to recognise Israel and to renounce use of force in pursut of Palestinian claims”

        Well, more to the point is that it came after Hamas’ violent takeover of Gaza from the only recognised Arab government in ‘Palestine’, the PLO. Did quite a number of Fatah.

        And rather than being ‘not prepared’, Hamas quite plainly cast them selves as Israel’s avowed enemy.

        The blockade did not start until several years after the Israeli unilateral withdrawal, and more than 1 year after Hamas overthrew Fatah.

        One should also note that Egypt also blockades Gaza; the Rafah crossing is closed most of the time and has been for years. Egypt is also getting very direct in their destruction of the numerous Philadelphi corridor tunnels. Cairo wants nothing to do with Gaza and the residents thereof.

      • Mr.T
        July 7, 2016, 12:34 pm

        “government in ‘Palestine’, the PLO”

        Putting scare quotes around the world Palestine is as morally reprehensible as Holocaust denial (if not more so). I wonder why it is permitted on this site.

      • talknic
        July 7, 2016, 2:22 pm

        @ ClearAndPresentDanger

        “Well, more to the point is that it came after Hamas’ violent takeover of Gaza from the only recognised Arab government in ‘Palestine’, the PLO”

        Bullsh*te! Hamas were elected in a democratic election https://www.google.com.au/search?q=Hamas%20was%20elected%20in%20a%20democratic%20election

        “And rather than being ‘not prepared’, Hamas quite plainly cast them selves as Israel’s avowed enemy.”

        “Israel, the Occupying Power” is as a matter of course the enemy

        “One should also note that Egypt also blockades Gaza; the Rafah crossing is closed most of the time and has been for years”

        Israel is the Occupying Power, not Egypt. The Occupying Power determines when all crossings into Occupied Territories are to be closed.

      • ClearAndPresentDanger
        August 20, 2016, 12:58 pm

        @talknic

        “Bullsh*te! Hamas were elected in a democratic election”

        Hamas did indeed win local elections in 2006, largely because of PLO/Fatah’s perceived (and real) corruption. You should be more aware of the Battle of Gaza, 2007 edition, wherein Hamas and Fatah engaged in internecine atrocities and essentially divided the territories into 2 separate entities. Violent, it was.

        “Israel, the Occupying Power” is as a matter of course the enemy”

        Oh, Hamas declared war on Israel from its inception, long before Hamas’ violent takeover of Gaza (see above). That is just what Hamas, being a subsidiary of the Muslim Brotherhood, does.

        BTW, UN SC Res 476, to which you linked, applies the term ‘Occupying Power’ in reference to Jerusalem only. 476 itself applies only to Jerusalem, and the term ‘Occupying Power’ is simply a non-pejorative statement of fact.

        And Israel certainly does not ‘occupy’ Gaza, they unilaterally withdrew from Gaza 11 years ago.

        “Israel is the Occupying Power, not Egypt. The Occupying Power determines when all crossings into Occupied Territories are to be closed”

        False (see comments wrt the term ‘Occupying Power’ above). Egypt is in complete control of the Rafah crossing, it is they who keep it close to all but pedestrian traffic. And they who are going medieval on Hamas’ tunnels under the Philadelphi Corridor. To say nothing of their efforts in the Sinai. Egypt despises Hamas and the Gazans, wants nothing to do with them.
        +++++

        Is your gross mischaracterisation of Res 476 deliberate, or are you just not willing or able to read and comprehend it?

      • talknic
        August 20, 2016, 10:46 pm

        @ ClearAndPresentDanger August 20, 2016, 12:58 pm

        “Oh, Hamas declared war on Israel from its inception..”

        Uh huh. Ever heard of chronological order? Not many if any Zionists seem to understand.

        In 1948 Israel was proclaimed as an ” as an independent republic within frontiers approved by the General Assembly of the United Nations in its Resolution of November 29, 1947 , and that a provisional government has been charged to assume the rights and duties of government for preserving law and order within the boundaries of Israel, for defending the state against external aggression, and for discharging the obligations of Israel to the other nations of the world in accordance with international law. The Act of Independence will become effective at one minute after six o’clock on the evening of 14 May 1948, Washington time. “ http://www.trumanlibrary.org/whistlestop/study_collections/israel/large/documents/newPDF/49.pdf By 15th May 1948 Jewish forces under Plan Dalet were already outside of Israel’s proclaimed territories, busy dispossessing non-Jews

        Hamas didn’t exist until 1987 after almost a hundred years of Zionist colonization (from 1897 http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/8632-jewish-colonial-trust-the-judische-colonialbank ), 39 years of Israeli occupation (from 1948 https://unispal.un.org/DPA/DPR/unispal.nsf/eed216406b50bf6485256ce10072f637/b4085a930e0529c98025649d00410973?OpenDocument ) and 21 years after Israel started yet another war in 1966 https://unispal.un.org/DPA/DPR/unispal.nsf/0/1A03C7BFB8D6C049852560C3004A4AAF

        “BTW, UN SC Res 476, to which you linked, applies the term ‘Occupying Power’ in reference to Jerusalem only. “

        Strange … This is what it says, verbatim “1. Reaffirms the overriding necessity to end the prolonged occupation of Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem;” http://wp.me/pDB7k-W8

        “And Israel certainly does not ‘occupy’ Gaza, they unilaterally withdrew from Gaza 11 years ago”

        How is it then, that Israel controls Palestinian airspace over Gaza, Palestinian territorial waters off Gaza, dictating what and who can cross through all of Gaza’s border crossings including those with Egypt.

        “Egypt is in complete control of the Rafah crossing … “

        Egypt is not the Occupying Power. Israel is.

        “Is your gross mischaracterisation of Res 476 deliberate, or are you just not willing or able to read and comprehend it?”

        Get your guide dog to read it to you

      • oldgeezer
        August 20, 2016, 11:07 pm

        @ClearandPresentDanger

        “Oh, Hamas declared war on Israel from its inception, long before Hamas’ violent takeover of Gaza (see above). – See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/2016/06/turkish-government-grateful/#comment-168906

        No, in fact Israel supported Hamas as a counter balance to the power of the PLO.

        “You should be more aware of the Battle of Gaza, 2007 edition, wherein Hamas and Fatah engaged in internecine atrocities and essentially divided the territories into 2 separate entities. Violent, it was. – See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/2016/06/turkish-government-grateful/#comment-168906

        There was indeed warfare, at the prompting and with the assistance of the west which did not like the democratic result and wanted the PLO to overthrow the democratically elected government. This is documented in public documents.

        Take your middle school level hasbara elsewhere. I won’t say you’re making it up as you go along as your line has been propagated by zionists all along.

        Yes the UN resolution uses the term occupying power in a non perjorative sense. Most people use it that way. The occupying power has a long list of responsibilities and israel has been derelict and negligent in every one of them. It’s not the term occupying power that’s a perjorative in any sense it’s Israel’s criminal behaviour.

        But it is false. Provably false. And false according to the public record.

  6. Mooser
    July 1, 2016, 1:24 pm

    “What do you want from me?”

    From you? Please don’t worry about that. What you’ve got I don’t want.

    • neggy
      July 1, 2016, 11:04 pm

      Eh? I got Yarmulkes, 50 cents. Also answers and truth and all that good stuff.

  7. kma
    July 2, 2016, 1:21 pm

    neggy: caging a population that you hate, watching them struggle to survive, bombing them and watching them die is beyond medieval. it is basically the same cruelty as shooting up people in a nightclub and holding them hostage as they bleed to death. or dropping onto the Mavi Marmara and doing the same.

    it’s barbaric and really sick, but you know that.

    • oldgeezer
      July 2, 2016, 2:51 pm

      @kma

      I don’t think they do. Despite their outright, and significant, evil I think they believe they are righteous and a light unto nations.

      Truly a perverted bunch of scum.

      • neggy
        July 2, 2016, 4:31 pm

        It’s all guff. Israel isn’t a light unto the nations, it is an ordinary state that kills its enemies (the primary point of states).

      • eljay
        July 2, 2016, 9:36 pm

        || neggy: It’s all guff. Israel isn’t a light unto the nations… ||

        According to your Zio-supremacist co-collectivists, it’s that and a “moral beacon” and a “Western-style democracy” and not as bad as “Saudi Arabia, Mali and African “hell-holes”. Either you’ve not received the memos or you haven’t bothered to read them.

    • neggy
      July 2, 2016, 4:29 pm

      Look matey, if you want Israel to do that, they can do it. There is nothing stopping them from doing that. The Arabs can always leave. I am sure that Hamas could negotiate for all of the Arabs in Gaza to be resettled in Syria, or even to stay where they are as long as they stop attacking.

      However, as long as they are determined to “liberate Palestine”, they will be contained, and maybe if a really good Israeli PM comes to power, forced to surrender unconditionally by use of harsher methods.

      • talknic
        July 7, 2016, 2:35 pm

        // “… caging a population that you hate, watching them struggle to survive, bombing them and watching them die … “//

        @ neggy July 2, 2016, 4:29 pm

        “Look matey, if you want Israel to do that, they can do it. There is nothing stopping them from doing that. “

        Israel is already doing that.

        “The Arabs can always leave.”

        You wish … However “Israel, the Occupying Power” prevents them from leaving

        ” , as long as they are determined to “liberate Palestine”, they will be contained”

        I thought you said they could leave. I wish you’d get your Ziopoop sorted

        “and maybe if a really good Israeli PM comes to power, forced to surrender unconditionally by use of harsher methods.”

        They have a legal right to attempt to liberate whatever remains of Palestine that ISN’T within Israel’s Internationally recognized borders.

        Israel doesn’t have a legal right to continue the occupation (ibid) or to force them to surrender. In fact under Chapt XI of the UN Charter, Israel has a sacred trust to do the opposite http://www.un.org/en/sections/un-charter/chapter-xi/index.html

      • Mr.T
        July 7, 2016, 3:07 pm

        “maybe if a really good Israeli PM comes to power, forced to surrender unconditionally by use of harsher methods.”

        And then we’d get the Final Solution to the Palestinian Question that you so dearly desire, eh?

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