Here is an anti-Semitic letter published yesterday in the Concord Monitor decrying the presence of a "monstrosity," a menorah at the New Hampshire state house. The writer, a New Hampshire woman, expresses outrage at the Israeli occupation, and Israeli support in the United States. I call it anti-Semitic because this creeps me out: "The last thing we need to see is any sense of Jewishness at this time of year." But you attack Jewishness, too, Phil. Well, not quite: I am engaged in a passionate critique of Jewish identity construction. And yes, I am trying to end the Zionist ideology inside Jewish life. I love my Jewishness, it made me. That's different!
Foxman do you got my back?
Sorry. Got distracted. My tipster Felson says that this letter is getting airtime on the web, and that it is precisely the type of statement that will help disqualify the Palestinian cause in mainstream eyes. You can find the signer's name at the Monitor site.
The Dec. 11 letter from Kelsey Wrye of Pittsfield, "Christmas only," prompts me to write. Indeed Christmas does seem to preempt all the other cultural events this time of year. Perhaps that is a bad thing. For Christmas especially so, perhaps, due to the extreme commercialization of the religious event. The one offense that annoys me every year is the construction in front of the New Hampshire State House of that Jewish monstrosity, the menorah. I though there was a separation of church and state in our U.S. Constitution under the 1st Amendment. When I see that Jewish menorah this year, it reminds me of the Bernie Madoff rip-off, the occupation of Palestinian lands, the illegal Jewish settlements expansion, and trillions of American tax dollars wasted in scams over many years and into the future. The last thing we need to see is any sense of Jewishness at this time of year. We see it so much in the negative the rest of the year.
It’s very despairing to see that a newspaper saw fit to print this letter. I agree with Phil that it hurts the I/P cause — it even links Madoff with the Palestinian occupation — and gives ammunition to far-right Zionists that anti-semitism is the primary driver of criticism of Israel’s apartheid practices. Despicable letter, and even worse is the publication that printed it.
The wording is sharp, but I understand the fatigue that many have towards Jews and Jewishness. Jews are a very ethnocentric 2% of the population. Add that to the fact that many Jews tend to set themselves in direct opposition to American traditions and interests, then it should be no surprise that some voice opinions like the one above. I’m more worried about anti-Gentilism from Jews than I am about anti-Semitism.
I disagree with this comment and I find it hurtful. I am reporting this for abuse.
How could my comment possibly be hurtful?
Why do we have to act like Jews aren’t a tiny, but very chauvanistic and influential part of American society that is largely in direct opposition to the majority, their interests and traditions? Why do we also have to pretend that it is outrageous that the majority would find this irritating?
Right now I’m listening to a news program discuss “Jewish scholarly” objections to Pope John Paul’s sainting, as if Catholics should care what Jews think. And last night I watched a sitcom that slipped a few line about kosher butchering into the dialogue from nowhere. It gets tiring.
Anti-Gentilism/anti-Americanism coming from Jewish quarters is more of an issue to me than anti-Semitism is at the moment.
I have reported the follow up comment as well. This is not appropriate discourse.
I’m from Jewish roots, live a Jewish present life (moderate), plan for a Jewish personal future, and encourage a Jewish communal and national future.
Past, present and future. Personal and political.
An optimally humane Jewish life, with an enormous set of precedents for humanity.
Optimally humane? With an enormous set of precedents for humility, eh?
…who is perfectly fine with starving the Gazans and peppering them with white phosphorous.
Yeah, thanks, Witty, but I don’t think “humane Jewish life” in any way equates with your judenreich perspective.
What a crock of shit.
fuck you guys. above is possibly the most anti-semitic on this blog, and you feel the need to bash Witty for you trying to connect w/ Jewishness. You are all a crock of shit.
Doesn’t that make Zionism antisemitic? Doesn’t it imply all Jews are a separate species who need a special place all by themselves? Like a quarantine of some sort that has to be maintained?
What Witty wrote has nothing to do with the letter above. It was basically a bit of self-masturbatory celebration on his part that is totally contradicted by his word and deed.
Credit where credit is due, at least you are always true to form, like your post above.
yonira, everybody here knows a phony when they see one! We know you’re nopt a real Jew until you have personally fought in the IDF, or worked a checkpoint. Witty is just a wanna-be! You, of all people, should know that!
“I love my Jewishness, it made me. “
Never saw anyone so anxious to avoid responsibility. And that statement is so anti-Semitic, too? What power did Jewishness have to “make” you? Only what you give it, if you live in America, Phil.
Thanks for the reminder Witty: We all appreciate that you are a very humble man with much to be humble about. (to paraphrase Disrael)
Careful, Richard. You could literally rip your arm right out of its socket patting yourself on the back like that.
It appears there’s more to the story than meets the eye.
link to concordmonitor.com
From the editor in response to angry readers:
And how many doznes of passionate, even handed liberal pleas for an end to Israeli war crimes and US support for them do you suppose ended up in the trash bin?
This is how they manipulate the debate. Did the Concord Monitor publish any letters in 2003 from supporters of the Iraqi invasion who thought that we should purge the Muslims and make way for Christianity? No, of course not.
This is the bone they throw so that people like Slick Witty can say, “See? They do publish the other side of the debate in newspapers.”
The writer makes the mistake of equating Judaism with Zionism. I wonder how much is visceral antisemitism and how much is simple ignorance? Efforts to inform people of the difference between Judaism and Zionism, especially a realistic appraisal of the latter’s political dimension, e.g. M&W, are crucial to avoiding a rise of antisemitism in the United States as our citizens increasingly become aware of “the occupation of Palestinian lands, the illegal Jewish settlements expansion, and trillions of American tax dollars wasted in scams over many years and into the future.”
Condemnation, richly warranted, should be accompanied by outreach. The suppression of a national discussion about American relations with Israel, largely through self-censorship in the MSM, does horrendous disservice both to American Jews and to the rest of the American people. Only pro-colonization Zionists benefit, at everyone else’s expense.
Judaism is a religion and Zionism is a political ideology. I would think that most people understand this on some level. Is it unfair to question the extent that Zionism is influenced by the Jewish community and Judaism? I’d guess that Zionism is a big part of modern Judaism, since it’s not uncommon for Rabbis to support the state of Israel. I’m not 100% sure that Zionism is the root of the problem.
Actually, I’d consider Zionism to be more like a cult. The actual political ideology at play in Israel is apartheid. Zionism is merely the cultural facade that is attached to it, much like Aryan mythology was the facade that was bolted to fascism in Nazi Germany.
Moreover, Zionism is a cult that seeks to undermine and supplant the entirety of Judaism. You can see it in microcosm, with Witty’s repeated attacks on Phillip Weiss, and the rest of the gang’s decidedly less coordinated attacks on other prominent non-Zionist Jews (Medea Benjamin, Max Blumenthal, Norman Finkelstein, Noam Chomsky, etc.)
those are the facts, and many are aware of them: “Judaism is a religion and zionism is a political ideology.”
However, it is predominantly zionist, or Israeli-friendly, or Jewish voices that smack down, with prejudice, many reasoned arguments that attempt to state: “Zionism is harmful because….” Such an argument is called anti-semitic; the pre-scripted hasbara is: “to oppose zionism is to oppose the right of Jewish people to have their own homeland; to oppose that right is to deny the holocaust.”
That’s how it works.
Kelsey Wrye’s use of the word “monstrous” might be infelicitous, but it seems that it’s necessary to speak harshly in order to be heard. People are now paying attention; a barrier has been breached. No doubt Wrye and the newspaper will suffer some retribution.
Suggested solution:
Next time, instead of publishing a Wrye-type letter about Israel/zionism, print a selection of photos of slaughtered Palestinian infants and children like this one: link to irishingaza.files.wordpress.com
I don’t think you understand why this particular letter was chosen. It wasn’t chosen out of randomness or fairness — it was specifically selected because it undermines anti-occupation activism by portraying it as anti-Semitic.
The goal was to intentionally distract people from talking about war crimes against Palestinians and focus it instead on anti-Semitism. I think I recall seeing that mechanism being discussed at length in another recent topic here.
I see your point, Chaos.
or
The letter and the fact that it was printed might also be a cry, “I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it any more.”
interesting tipping point we’re at.
light bulb (slowly slowly)
no, I didn’t see your point — printing the letter was an attempt to inflame….
well, maybe it will backfire.
somebody needs to invent a word for anti-notsemiticism
One hopes. Although there are some pretty awful (if fortunatel unlikely) ways it could conceivably backfire.
“The writer makes the mistake of equating Judaism with Zionism.”
Why is that a mistake, Colin? I ask you seriously, what would you do, if you were a Zionist? You would make every effort, every conceivable effort, to intertwine Judaism and Zionism in a death-love-embrace, and strive to make Judaism inconceivable without Zionism if you could. And the Zionists were, above all, very capable men, and they have done so. To argue that they shouldn’t have is one thing, but to deny that they have indeed accomplished that (the complete conflation of Judaism and Zionism) is simply self-deception.
I imagine menorahs (and/or star of davids?) and xmas trees (and/or creche?) are being lit on many a public green across the USA. I wonder if any muslim symbol is being lit
on any of those greens–how about in the Detroit area? No significant muslim holiday in December? How about on the green during any muslim
holiday? Just curious.
Looks like Dec 18th and Dec 27th are Islamic holidays in 2009.
link to holidaysmart.com
Islam is holiday-poor. And the lunar calendar shifts the days backwards every year so they never fall at the same time.
In the meantime, in Israel, the nastiness of a “Jewish state” is exhibited in campaigns to eliminate symbols of Christianity from public displays, with Christmas trees being particularly targeted. This, despite the fact that there are Christian citizens of Israel.
If we must have religion, let us have religious toleration, let us have both the creche and the menorah on the green.
When I was an editor at the NY Post, I allowed one of my staff to publish a piece mocking the idea that the “two-percent religion” should have equal public space with the 90 percent religion. The writer was EV Kanterovich (sp?) a Jewish Russian emigre, at the time a precocious and fairly brilliant 23 year old, now a law prof somewhere I think. Seth Lipsky recommended him to me to hire. There was a huge brouhaha about the piece, and EV felt a little surprised and chagrined, though not to the point of regretting writing it. I don’t regret publishing it. Obviously his tone was much more thoughtful than the CS Monitor writer, and wasn’t anti-Semitic or motivated by anti-Semitism. But the argument was essentially the same.
Is Hanukkah as significant to Jews as the birth of Christ is to Christians?
As a matter of doctrine, Easter is actually supposed to be the primary Christian holiday. Christmas is only celebrated as a holiday because, in the days when Christianity was making the transition from the proverbial “cottage industry” to the vast, organized “big business” it eventually became, the patriarchs of the Church needed a new “product” to displace the competition.
Christmas was originally a pagan festival celebrated on the winter solstice. Like any aggressively marketed brand (and hey, let’s not be squeamish about how the sausage was made back then, okay?) Christianity needed a competing product — I mean, who’s going to stick around in a religion that removes festivals from your calendar? So it was decided to celebrate Christmas in December.
There really is no reason to think Jesus was actually born anywhere near December 25th. And of course, you can still see vestiges of the original non-Christian celebration — Christmas trees, gift exchanges, holly and mistletoe, etc.
The only reason I bring this up is I think it’s maybe important to recognize that Christmas really does, historically speaking, have very little to do with the birth of Christ.
But that’s not the point. Is Hanukkah as important to Jews as Christmas is to Christians?
The history you mention is well-known, but it doesn’t change the importance of Christmas to most Christians. And as a cultural event, I wouldn’t put Hanukkah on the same level as Christmas for the vast majrity of Americans.
I’m a cultural Christian (if that’s even possible!) who buys presents after Christmas because I resent what’s happened to the holiday. As a mostly non-religious person, I resent seeing Hanukkah being shoved on the majority. It’s probably too late at this point, but Americans really should have the minority v. majority interests talk.
I think my point is, you need to ask yourself why any particular holiday is important at all?
Some things just are. Do you have a problem with Christians celebrating Christmas? Do you deny that celebrating Christmas is an American tradition, and that few Americans give a damn about Hanukkah? That’s just the way it is, and shoving (minor in this case) Jewish holidays on non-Jews (especially during major non-Jewish holidays) is going to irritate some people.
because holidays are rituals that form community, and man, being a social animal, cannot survive with some sense of community. “Finding one’s identity” really means figuring out where one belongs; nobody has an identity as a solitary being, detached from all other human relatedness.
I suspect the burr under the saddle of the Concord Monitor writer was a sense that an attempt was being made to co opt and displace an established community identity. I am sympathetic to that complaint, particularly since Jews aggressively support their particular and exclusive community identity; recite American guarantees of freedom of religion as basis for their demand that Jewish identity be respected in its particularity; demand special privileges for their particularist community; then, in addition, demand inclusion in the non-Jewish community identity. Jews want to mark non-Jewish community rituals as theirs, while additionally demanding their own exclusive community rituals that identify them as separate from that other community.
My Italian parents used to say a little Italian phrase: tut e du? tut e du.
That means: [Do you want] this or that? [I want] this and that.
Hanukkah was invented in the 1800s….per Israel Shahak.
Hanukkah is pretty insignificant in Judaism, compared to the Passover and the High Holidays of Rosh Hoshanah and Yom Kippur.
(Just in case you wanted a state answer w/ no spin or whatever the fuck you call the shit Chaos does on here)
The evidence there is irrefutable, Todd. Christmas was only one day until anti-Semites extended it to twelve days to best the Jewish Hannukah’s eight days.
Parents all over the world mourned, and retailers celebrated.
But there is really not much we can do. In this day and age, with its concern about Globule Warming and the enviornment, any holiday based on divine oil-conservation is going to be very popular! If only my old oil furnace could get in the Hunnakah spirit and show an eight-fold decrease in oil consumption, why, I would have more money for Christmas presents!
So it’s very complicated.
“Is Hanukkah as significant to Jews as the birth of Christ is to Christians?”
Are you kidding, Todd? I once got a SCUBA outfit for Hannukah, but I never got nuttin’ for Christmas.
On the other hand, when I was a child in Syosset, the sight of my neighbor’s beautiful blond 18yr-old daughter (Marilyn Ohmansen) next to their 16 foot-high Norwegian Christmas tree had an impact never jettisoned. If you can jettison an impact, and I’m not saying you can’t.
Gosh, she was a gorgeous girl! I wonder how she made out in life. But I’ll tell ya, to the eleven-year-old Jewish kid from next door, she looked like a queen!
This is definitely anti-Semitic. The thing that saddens me is that I see these kind of letters all the time – only with Muslim instead of Jewish, Islam instead of Judaism and minaret/mosque/dome instead of Menorah – and with little outrage from the wider public.
Shafiq — I’ve since learned that the purpose of publishing the letter was to spark public outrage against the writer (which he duly earned — mission accomplished).
Now, my problem is that the newspaper is selective in publishing the words of racist idiots. Apparently, the paper wouldn’t publish an anti-Islamic letter writer the same way. In other words, the editor intentionally published this idiot’s letter to demonstrate that anti-Semitism is rampant, particularly in the context of equating Madoff with the shocking human rights abuses of the IDF in Palestine. . . an egregious, intellectually dishonest exercise.
What this guy wrote is no worse than what many prominent and extremist Israel-Firster American Jews are saying about Muslims, and what was written for years objecting to the presence of a creche in front of state legislatures. Doesn’t anyone remember the Happy Holidays debate?
This is much ado over nothing. If you’re going to allow Ann Coulter-like remarks in the public well about Islam and Christianity, then Judaism is far game as well. The morality of saying one is acceptable over the other doesn’t wash.
Oscar,
I had a feeling that was the case.
MRW,
Exactly. Many American Jews have no problem slandering Muslims this way but when it comes to Jews, it’s a whole different story
It reminds me of a certain conversation that took place last year:
I don’t trust Obama. I have read about him. He’s an Arab
No, ma’am. He’s a decent family man, (a) citizen that I just happen to have disagreements with on fundamental issues … He’s not
I find this letter very telling.
As one becomes aware initially of the problems in the middle east and learns more about US policy, treatment of Palestinians, violations of international law, etc – the initial reaction is incredulousness and even fear that you’re an anti-semite for breaking from mainstream thought.
Then as you follow the issue along – looking thru life thru your new prism of scepticism – it becomes clear that Israel (or Zionists, or Jews, or however you want to put it) is quite manipulative and frequently acts in bad faith – and your government enables this behavior in obeisance to evidently powerful Jewish/Zionist interests.
Combine that with realization that your tax dollars are paying for it, swirl in a financial scam by a Jewish guy and a huge bailout of Goldman Sachs and its not too shocking to see a letter like this.
The reason I follow the IP issue is that I feel responsible for the plight of the Palestinians because my government enables their suffering and disenfranchisement. A secondary concern is to avoid an anti-semetic blow-back/pogrom here at home.
Like the Goldstone report, I would ask of folks – ‘What part of this letter do you find factually inaccurate? Indelicate, yes but innacurate, no. Neither a cross nor a menora belong on a public building – as a Catholic I would not take great offense at someone calling a cross on a public building ‘a monstrosity’ because I agree that it does not belong there, is it different if the menora is called a monstrosity?
This letter is the reaction that should concern Jewish people and get them to correct the mistreatment of the Palestinians and all its subsequent implications/repercussions before (and may God forbid) the ‘sleeping bear’ of anti-semitism reawakens and its too late to do anything about it. I figure this is at least partially why Weiss runs this website. He is part of the solution to this problem.
Although candidly, if the ACLU is spending time and resources on abolishing Christmas icons from public spaces, it should also be vigilant on menorahs. Me, I in favor of all celebratory symbols being in prominent display in public.
Yes, this letter is published because it’s about ‘the Jews’.
Yet, when these things happen to other groups, not a word. Nothing.
I don’t think it’s antisemitic. I think it’s honest.
You raise a good point, although to be fair, this blog has shown a spotlight on anti-Arab hate speech. I think a good discussion to have is of the greater disparity. You do have a good point — the letter was published because it was about “the Jews,” and it displaced a more reasoned discussion on any number of topics — like, the occupation and the war crimes, the crumbling, cannibalistic nature of our financial system, the abrogation of the seperation of church and state.
I think you’re assuming too much by assuming that Mr. Weiss called attention to it because it was an example of anti-Semitism. To me, the way this letter was published is an example of how the debate is manipulated.
Keep in mind, publishing that particular letter not only casts a negative light on anti-Occupation as anti-Semitic, but also pro-seperation of church and state as anti-Semitic.
I think the letter was honest, too, Cliff. But I don’t think that means it isn’t anti-Semitic.
This letter raises a very complicated issue. There are three interconnected points.
First it is only natural that good old fashioned antisemites will join in criticism of Israel and zionism. The continuous charge that criticism of Israel is antisemitism makes this inevitable. This has been a political problem for Phil and he was finally forced to scrub this site of the overt antisemites.
Second, as has been pointed out by others here, letters like this will be publicized by the zionist to discredit legitimate criticism of Israel.
Third, Israel needs and likely encourages Western antisemitism in order to frighten jews into immigrating to Israel. Thus highly publicized Israeli war crimes serve to increase the hatred of zionism that can segue into antisemitism.
Antisemitism is an unavoidable roadblock in this debate.
You are so damn overzealous in your little summary. As if you know exactly what the strategy is.
You can’t talk about Zionism w/o talking about Jewish identity and power and how it functions in this conflict.
It’s inevitable.
Antisemitism should be clearly defined. Hey, why don’t YOU define it? Then someone else here who is as superficial and cowardly, can do the same. I bet you’ll both have different definitions.
Antisemitism should be defined as a racialization of ‘Jewish identity’. Lumping all Jews together. Not being specific. Not considering the different constructs of an identity.
Jewishness is a sociological identity. You’re not born inherently Jewish.
It’s something you choose. Weiss could pass for a white guy. How is he Jewish? By his actions.
A black person is black. He doesn’t have to act any certain way. He is black.
Antisemitism then should be defined as those people who racialize Jews. Who imply there is such a thing as Jewish DNA. Whatever the hell that means.
Most Zionists are Jews. There is no such thing as a Christian Zionist – they practice eschatology. They only support Israel insofar as they can fullfil their religious wet dream of a 2nd coming.
Jews aren’t white guys?
I wish people wouldn’t use that phrase. Arabs vs “white guys” when so many Arabs are persons of as much pallor as any Euro.
european european european
jesus tap-dancing christ, no need to be thick, potsherd
This is what this blog has become:
link to youtube.com
So, Cliff, how you like that Curb Your Enthusiasm episode pissing on the Christian wall picture? Equally good satire or no?
Oh btw, why do people have to LIKE Muslims/Jews/Christians/etc. in the first place?
Isn’t it like the question of whether you believe in God/have religion or not?
I mean, why do we have to accept the premise to these questions in the first place?
I see a Muslim, I see funny hats. I see Jews, I see funny top-hats. I see Christians, I um, don’t see hats, but I think Orthodox ones have them right?
Who cares! It reminds me of the ‘Feeling the hate’ videos. There’s a part when some Zio is asked why he doesn’t like Obama. The Zio replies ‘He doesn’t love Jews’ – what? Seriously?
We’re sinking in quicksand here with this stupidity. It’s purely academic. And it does NOTHING to advance the Palestinian cause which is not about ISLAM or about any kind of pan-Arab nationalism. It’s about BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS. It’s about justice.
But we’re here talking about this trojan horse of a letter. No shit, they’d publish it. It’s about JEWS. It’s not about Muslims. No one gives a shit when its about Muslim identity.
Anyone here an American? We know what our culture is like. And around we go. I’m sure Phil’s next piece will be on some Israeli crime. Then we can all rage a bit, yonira or WJ will come in and complain about how the Palestinian who was shot in the face stepped on the Israeli soldier’s foot menancingly and thus asked for it (but didn’t deserve it) – and then yada yada yada, more debate on whether babies in 2010 will be antisemitic.
Jewish identity is kind of like the March of Dimes – a self-perpetuating institution. It has no purpose other than to keep existing. No overall goal, other then to keep people employed.
If you don’t think this letter is relevant, then why are you protracting a discussion about it here? There are other threads on this blog you could be spending time on. If you don’t think a topic is important, then don’t spend your time beating the proverbial dead horse when you could be focusing on the other topics.
I’m not talking about the letter itself. I’m talking about the side-show that is academic discussions of antisemitism.
That’s a different topic. I’m trying to derail the debate at this point.
I mean, what did Phil intend? You have to ask yourself what a writer’s intentions are.
Did he think people would come here and just voice their disapproval?
Yea, it’s so bad. Gosh, this day and age. Blah blah blah. That’s why I cited the Seinfeld clip – because THAT is the only reaction I could think of that Phil must have expected.
It’s idiotic.
And it comes back to my point about the infliction of facts-on-the-ground. Israel will establish more immovable facts while we take two steps forward and one back.
We talk about anything other than tactics, exposure of Israeli crimes, how Zionism functions and Zionist tactics (warfare, both physical and intellectual) – then we lose time.
If we lose time, we lose it all.
Like Pappe said, all societies change.
I want Phil to be fucking honest. Does he REALLY think he’s going to change the whole of the Jewish community (whatever the fuck that means – it really just means European Jews, and more specifically, American WHITE Jews) anytime soon?
Soon?
Fuck no. He’s not. Gandhi wouldn’t. “Mahatma Einstein” wouldn’t!
After the sheer brutality of Gaza, nothing has changed in any meaningful sense. Everyone forgot about it already. That fucker, Finkelstein QUIT the march over the most petty, RHETORICAL issue. As if people – the average American intellectual dwarf – is going to be able to tell the difference?
I mean, ‘with friends like Baltzer/Weiss/Chomsky/Fink who needs enemies’? That’s what the Palestinians should be asking themselves.
‘The Paradigm of Parity’ – that is what Phil Weiss is perpetuating here. A false paradigm where issues of anti-lolism is put on the same plane as Zionist crimes and Jewish supremacy.
Phil himself loves to cite Blankfort – who is much more HONEST than Chomsky – but Phil is much more like Chomsky. He’s a Jewish exceptionalist.
I’m not talking about the letter. I’m talking about why the fuck are we still caring about this stuff? As if you can avoid the topic of Jewish power and identity politics and be anti-Zionist? No. Prepare for CONSTANT collisions and constant examination. Its unavoidable unless your a tepid pussy. In which case, you wouldn’t say anything.
Remember Uncle Remus’s story about the tar baby?
link to rinklyrimes.blogspot.com
We care about the issue of antisemitism because it is a major political factor in the current debate over US’s unilateral support for Israeli war.
Quite frankly, I would just as soon see the US pull out and let the warring tribes settle it among themselves. But that will not happen without a political struggle that has to international and many decades long.
You Cliff are long on passion and rage but quite deficient in political reality.
You want the US to pull out and let the ‘warring tribes’ duke it out?
That’s fantastic. As if the US is SOOOO involved now in such a way that it’s making the Israelis butcher and steal from the Palestinians. As if it’s motivating the mainstream Jewish American community to intellectually brutalize Arabs and Muslims.
Yea, fantastic idea. Let the warring tribes duke it out. Because we all know, the evil US has been making ‘the Jews’ hate ‘the Arabs’! ‘The US’ is promoting antisemitism by making ‘the Jews’ who traditionally love ‘the Arabs’ kill and steal from them!
I think you just plagiarized from Adam Sandler’s ‘Nobody Messes with the Zohan’.
I know the political realities. I’m raging against them right now. I’m not saying, we should love one another and sing songs of liberation and all that bullshit.
I’m saying, focus on things that help the cause and not on these fucking DISTRACTIONS.
Aren’t you married to a Jew? And you want the ‘warring tribes’ to duke it out?
How fucking convenient for you. The Israelis would exterminate the Palestinians.
You are so foolish. The US is the problem because of it’s unilateral support for Israel. Without that the issues would be resolved by now. See, Israel does not have to deal, because it has the backing of the world’s only superpower. Our backing made Shatilla and Sabra, Lebanon 2006 and Gaza possible. We are not preventing Israel from committing massacres against the Arabs.
You are a moron.
The US is not a monolith. The institutions in our country can be influenced by sectors of our population. Hence, the ISRAEL LOBBY.
It’s not like those people in the lobby are foreign. They are by and large – American Jews.
They are part of our society.
Chomsky wrote Manufacturing Consent – an institutional analysis of the MSM from a materialist perspective. He’s a Marxist after all.
Why then, are people so fucking dense, when it comes to our government?
Political tribalism.
In fact, you’re so dense, that the ONLY implication one can draw from your last comment is that there is some shadowy group somewhere named ‘the US’ that has its own interests apart from that of every single other group on the fucking planet, and wants the Jewish Zionists to continue their slaughter and theft of Palestine to continue.
There is a collusion of interests between the ethno-religious Zionist Jewry in the diaspora, the MIC, and just good old fashion corrupt politics.
There isn’t much difference anymore between us and Israel.
And who the FUCK would stop Israel if we just backed out and let the ‘warring tribes’ duke it out, moron?
And I’m foolish? Jews are a part of the Establishment. Just because this is the same old divide-and-conquer strategy, does not mean they aren’t part of the plan.
You’re a fucking liar to imply otherwise and try to disassociate that level of culpability (it’s Zionism, stupid) from the equation.
Gee, I read syvanen’s comment as implying all Cliff says; both the cart and the horses are needed to pull the load, no?
Right on! US our of the Middle East! This is key~!
I suppose it might be possible to be offended by a giant menorah for aesthetic reasons, although one would then have to ask why we’re not similarly grossed out by giant pagan/Christmas trees to the same extent. (I say this because for some reason I find over-sized, towering menorahs in questionable taste, for what reason I’m not exactly sure. Maybe I feel that Jews are internalizing too much holiday-oriented bad taste from us Christians, thereby afflicting me with gentile guilt.)
But no, this writer isn’t about aesthetics. He/she mentions the occupation, then veers into an unmistakable anti-Semitic (or at the very least Judeo-phobic) rant, trying to connect Madoff with Israeli oppression of Palestinians. Actually, Madoff’s hustle was what is called an affinity scam, the successful execution of which trades on trust from people in one’s own group…most of the victims were Jews.
A couple of things are worth mentioning here. One is that the anti-Semites are going to use guilt by association to make anti-Jewish points by pretending that all Jews support Israeli oppression of Palestinians. (Yes, I know many Jews do, but far from all–there is no “they,” only many different stories.) Secondly, we need to keep making the point that criticism of Israel is not the same thing as anti-Semitism. Looking through the letters that appeared in the two days after the letter with the anti-Semitic, monster-menorah-on-the-statehouse-lawn rant, it appears that nobody followed up with a letter dealing with the difference between anti-Semitism and criticism of Israel.
In fact, we should not hesitate to point out that progressive Jews are the strongest critics of Israel when they think its government is wrong, and that the movement for Palestinian human rights is one of the very few in which Jews, Muslims and Christians work together for social justice.
For a moment I thought that perhaps it would be worthwhile trying to explain to the original letter-writer the difference between religious bigotry (guilt by association) and criticizing Israel. But then I ran across some editorial copy by one of the Monitor editors saying that this writer often sends in letters against Blacks, Jews, gays and other minorities, so he/she must, sadly, be considered a lost cause.
I think it’s a little presumptious to conclude that the editor chose to publish this letter out of Zionist sympathies, but the letter is so outrageous that my first suspicion was that it might have been written as a hoax. It is a dream come true for those who smear Israeli critics as anti-Semites. From the editor’s response to criticism, it appears the letter is genuine and written by a man named “Allison.” Maybe that’s his problem – a boy named Sue and all that. The editor’s references to “him” and “he” are so numerous that it does not appear to be a mistake. The editor’s explanation for publication is ludicrous – would he/she publish a letter that called for exclusion of kikes from our community, in the name of provoking discussion?
Scott McConnell’s story is interesting, and he accurately notes the difference between the story he published and this NH letter. But his conclusion that the argument is essentially the same is unpersuasive. There are genuine issues regarding public displays of religious symbols and the percentage of the population that follows that religion. What about Scientologists, etc.? But a letter decrying public displays of Jewishness in the age of Madoff and Occupation is no better than a letter complaining about black faces in the town when there are so many blacks in prison. This letter is just racist garbage. It may be difficult to draw the line, but this letter is clearly over the line wherever it might be drawn.
The editor didn’t have to be a raving Zionist to know that stirring up a controversy against easy targets would sell more papers, any more than Judith Miller at the NYT needed to be explicitly pro-war to publish what she did.
RE: “When I see that Jewish menorah this year, it reminds me of the Bernie Madoff rip-off, the occupation of Palestinian lands, the illegal Jewish settlements expansion, and trillions of American tax dollars wasted in scams over many years and into the future. The last thing we need to see is any sense of Jewishness at this time of year. We see it so much in the negative the rest of the year.”
Would this statement be per se anti-semitic without the last two sentences?
Any problem with the following statement?
“When I see the Xmas displays this year it reminds of Bush, Chaney, those blinkered glass cathedral idiots and end-timers, pogroms in old Russia and Poland, the Crusades, The Inquisition, Gott ist mit uns buckles, and saving the natives of the Americas by killing and exploiting them
to save their souls–if I see one more plastic nativity scene I might stroke out.”
There’s a decided lack of rational, measured cause and effect in both statements, it seems to me.
Yeah –that’s how “it reminds me of” experiences often are, no?
Well, I’d like to think that I have the personal sense to always follow up “it reminds me of” statements with “because,” but not everyone indulges in that much reflection, unfortunately.
Yep. Most people I’ve met along the way do not follow up their blurted out associations with “because;” and even if that is demanded of them (despite “Now, now, no religion or politics in my house!”), the “because” turns out
to be of limited value in justifying their original gross over-generalizations and/or
aggregation of “becauses.” Lastly, if you make counterpoint evidence, often its met by stubborn ignorance. Don’t even try this in a sports bar or local tavern.
But I’m sure you know this.
Well I’m from Bombay and I’ve never seen a menorrah in public. That may make some of you wonder but we apparently have a 2000 year old Jewish community right here in Mumbai [as we now call it, since ethnic nationalism is so much more important than poverty and hunger] and we have lots and lots of displays for Diwali, Christmas and Eid. If I had not lived in the US I probably would have never known what Hanukkah is.
I don’t understand all the fuss about religious symbols in public space. Where else would the public put them? Does Jews in Mumbai not sharing their menorrah with us make them more assimilated or less?
Btw, I agree with Cliff, what does any of this have to do with the blog goals? I keep hearing about how people should not confuse between Jews and Zionists, but I don’t see any anti-Zionist Jews who set aside their Jewishness when they take a stand. In fact, quite the other way around. If Zionism cannot be separated from Jewishness then maybe its time to take it on board into the debate.
sammy:
Here we have lit Xmas tree displays and mennorahs higher than two story houses in
many (more urban) areas across the land. Under our Constitution (1st Amendment), our government cannot interfere
with the free “exercise” or expression of religion of choice, nor can our government “establish” or appear to favor
any religion. (Early American settles often came here to be free of the over-riding power of The Church Of England). Due to the fact most Americans have always
been Christians, until midway through the last century, most town squares across the land sported only creche and/ or cross\Xmas tree during the holiday period. Court suits forced towns to also permit a menorah or star of david display. The
idea being if you allow one religion to display on the public square, you need to also allow another religion’s display if a permit is applied for by both. These constitutional law case principles now apply even a village flag or police car door logo–traditional crosses have been taken off them as violating the prohibition
against governmental establishment (preferring) the cross, the sign of Christianity.
May Jews in Mumbai get municipal permits (if they want to) to display their religious symbols
during their holiday? If so, but they don’t apply for a permit, perhaps they prefer not to share?
FYI, also here in the USA, atheist groups sometimes file lawsuits, asking for
all religious displays to be banned from public land. This purist theory of
the prohibition against the government establishing any religion has not
been very successful, if at all.
The confusion between being Jewish and being Zionist and to what the extent and nature of any such difference has been a subject of debate on this blog for a long time because who is a Jew, what is a Jewish state, and the use of those terms by Zionism always have no clear cut answer, and because advocacy and criticism of Zionism as an ideology, and of the state of Israel’s policies always are conflated
or discerned as “Loving Jews, or Loving Israel, or hating Jews, or Hating the state of Israel, or trying to make “moral equivalency” between different things–principles are turned into different versions of historical and present facts.
I don’t feel like writing about anti-Semitism today. Instead, I’ll tell you about my own thoughts when I saw the giant menorah (I don’t like the Israeli word “chanukiyah”) erected at Piazza Barberini, in downtown Rome. I thought of the Habad movement that put it there, of the local Jewish community and of the municipality that authorises it every year – and I thought of the inhuman and immoral positions taken by all three of these groups last year, when Gazans were being murdered. Ideologically, Habad is anti-Zionist, but its support for the worst Zionist actions (and contempt for Palestinian life) is so extreme, that it puts even the most right-wing Zionists to shame. The local Jewish community (one of the oldest in the world) has replaced much of its own culture, tradition and identity with blind subservience to the State of Israel and support for its every attrocity, combined with a firm commitment to maudlin victimism. This Zionist-Victimist identity was behind the community’s shameful support for the massacre of Gazans last year, and it is behind the permanent display of a poster of Gilad Shalit outside the city’s main synagogue. The current mayor of Rome is a neo-Fascist thug who – like so many neo-fascist thugs turned “respectable” – believes that his path to legitimacy runs through Jewish “forgiveness” for (some) of the crimes of Fascism. Since the path to support from the Zionist-Victimist community runs through support for Israel, our mayor has never met a Zionist massacre he didn’t like. Another poster of Gilad Shalit hangs outside city hall.
These are the thoughts that went through my mind when I saw the giant menorah at Piazza Barberini. I have a much smaller menorah at home, in my living room, which I lit this week. It arouses other thoughts and feelings, both of joy and of deep sadness – sadness at what that other menorah has come to represent.
Shmuel, I value your comments, which bring me a perspective, a view which I could never have acquired through my own experience (which has an almost capillary breadth, I admit) above almost everything else on this blog.
I hope you will keep commenting, (and I see no reason why you shouldn’t be given an opportunity to post on the front page, too!)
Symbols, especially religious symbols, convey as many higher and lower meanings as I can muster. You describe your “I’m reminded of” moment–see the exchange between Chaos and I
above on this thread. Or did you? Re the larger public symbol and your own private smaller version of the same–that’s kind of what I feel for all religions–I don’t think they are merely the “opiate of the masses” or the key evil in the world–their feet are not merely made of clay, but neither are they always inspiring good things in practice, for sure. I don’t have any religious symbol in my home. But I’m not happy about it; nor am I
particularly depressed.
” I call it anti-Semitic because this creeps me out: ”
And for that, they should put people in jail forever!
Gosh Phil, did anyone ever tell you that the right not to be creeped out is not guaranteed in the Constitution?
Anyway, this post shows how tough it is to be a Jew in America! Let’s be frank here, if you are a Negro, or Hispanic, or Asian, you are satisfied is nobody actually lynches you, rapes your daughters, and if you can get a job, life is heaven!
But for Jews, it’s not so easy! We are not made of the kind of coarse stuff which is easily satisfied with material benefits, oh no! No, we get all famischt and verklemperer if anybody thinks a bad though about us! We can tell, and we suffer! And should a lady in New Hampshire write an anti-semitic letter to the paper, it’s 1938 all over again!
Nobody is allowed to dislike us! Oy, it hurts so much!
“I love my Jewishness, it made me.”
It made you…
Marry a non-Jewish girl? Forget every prayer and brocha you ever learned?
Miss services every week? Eat bacon, shrimp and lobster? Be unwilling to join with your Jewish brothers and sisters in a project of national reclamation and identity (per Witty)?
“I love my Jewishness, it made me.”
Phil, tell that shit to the Gentiles, you might be able to fool them. All I see is a guy who either is cynical enough to want it both ways, or dumb enough to think he can have it both ways.
And jeeze, Phil, how about a little credit for the parental units, or were you brought up in a Jewish orphanage?
I gotta admit one thing Phil, for you, even more than the Zionists in some respects, Jewishness is the best excuse in the world, and one of the best places to hide.
RE: Foxman do you got my back? – Philo Weiss
MY COMMENT: Yes Phil, I’m confident Abe and his ADL have your back in their crosshairs. The Anti-Defamation League only has ‘ayes’ for Israel.
PHIL: Do you remember “what happens to nosy fellows”?
FROM POLANSKI’S “CHINATOWN”(1973) –
Jake Gittes: “Hello, Claude. Where’d you get the midget (Polanski)?”
Man with Knife (midget/Polanski): “You’re a very nosy fellow, kitty cat. Huh? You know what happens to nosy fellows? Huh? No? Wanna guess? Huh? No? Okay. They lose their noses.”
Yelburton: “My goodness, what happened to your nose?
Jake Gittes: “I cut myself shaving.”
Yelburton: “You ought to be more careful. That must really smart.”
Jake Gittes: “Only when I breathe.”
Loach: “What happened to your nose, Gittes? Somebody slammed a bedroom window on it?”
Jake Gittes: “Nope. Your wife got excited. She crossed her legs a little too quick. You understand what I mean, pal?”
Jake Gittes: “But, Mrs. Mulwray, I goddamn near lost my nose. And I like it. I like breathing through it. And I still think you’re hiding something.”
SOURCE – Roman Polanski Should Be Granted Clemency! link to facebook.com
RE: “I’m confident Abe and his ADL have your back in their crosshairs” & “what happens to nosy fellows” – ME(O)
A WORD TO THE WISE: Always wear a bulletproof vest with especially good protection for the back. Never visit the Catskills!*
* (from Wiki) Mark “Mordechai” Levy is a U.S.-based political activist and founder of the militant Jewish Defense Organization (JDO)….He spends much of his time promoting the JDO’s Camp Jabotinsky, which provides self-defense and gun training for young Jews at a facility in the Catskills. Levy is an avid follower of Ze’ev Jabotinsky, after whom the camp is named, and often repeats Jabotinsky’s motto: “Better to know how to shoot and not need to, than to need to and not know how.”
According to the Anti-Defamation League, Levy has had an antagonistic relationship with Irv Rubin of the Jewish Defense League. The two of them nearly came to blows during a Los Angeles press conference in 1989, and later that year, Levy was charged with four counts of attempted murder, one count of first-degree assault, and one count of criminal possession of a deadly weapon after shooting at Rubin from a rooftop in New York City. Rubin was attempting to serve Levy with a subpoena in a slander suit.[24]
Levy was charged with four counts of attempted murder and other charges after he opened fire on Irv Rubin in 1989, hitting an innocent bystander. Rubin was attempting to serve a subpoena on Levy. Levy was acquitted of all charges except one count of felony assault with a deadly weapon, for which he served 18 months of a 4 1/2 year sentence.[25][26] Levy pleaded guilty in 2000 to charges that he assaulted a 12 year-old boy in New York State….
SOURCES –
link to en.wikipedia.org
link to en.wikipedia.org
RE: ‘Concord Monitor’ publishes letter attacking ‘monstrous’ Jewish displays – Weiss
MY COMMENT: Yes, that monstrous, menacing menorah is soooo threatening! If the U.S. did not currently have the twin domestic bogeymen of gays and Mé-hē-(ˌ)-kəns (illegals), Jews would certainly ‘fill the bill’! We Americans will not be denied our bogeymen (both foreign and domestic), even if that means that we have to invent them.