Condemn! Condemn!

Israel/Palestine
on 43 Comments

I only heard about the shooting attack of last Wednesday in Tel Aviv the morning after.

It turned out my mom had in fact mailed me in the evening of the attack, noting that she had been there a few days earlier with my uncle – but I only read the mail a day later.

On the morning after, at 8 AM, I got the news from mainstream media. CNN headline mentioned “4 killed in Tel Aviv terror attack“, despite the article noting that “information about a motive wasn’t immediately available”.

Whilst U.S. State Department deputy spokesman Mark Toner had already issued a statement on the day condemning “today’s horrific terrorist attack in Tel Aviv in the strongest possible terms”, Israeli Ambassador to the United Nations Danny Danon was already warning the rest of the world that lack of condemnation may have dire consequences:

“Today’s heinous attack sadly proves that when the international community refuses to condemn terror against Israelis, the next attack is only a matter of time…Terror in Tel Aviv must be treated the same as terror in Paris or Istanbul.”

So, we’re very quick to condemn when it’s apparent terror against “us”. Whilst “terror” is a term which requires establishment of clear political motive, it is generally assumed that when the perpetrators are Palestinian, the motive is political. CNN’s headline does not seem to contradict with its lack of “information about a motive”. It is so reflexive we hardly notice it anymore. We cannot be fast enough to condemn, it cannot be condemned strongly enough, so we use “the strongest possible terms”, and in the race to condemn we cannot await investigations that will clarify the motive. It appears safe to assume.

But how fast are we to condemn, or even admit to our own (Israeli) terror? Historically, Israel has been involved not only in terrorism, but also false-flag terror. One of the most egregious known cases is the “Lavon affair” of 1954 (named after then-Defense minister Pinchas Lavon), where Israel sought to frame Egypt in terror against British and American targets in order to get them to act against Egypt. It is interesting to read this rather recent (2009) article by Haaretz’s Amos Harel, which in its cold technical appraisal seems to bemoan not the morality of the act – but its technical failure. This failure meant that it was revealed. Had it not been – this would have been another conflagration wherein we never would have known for sure that Israel was involved in the actions.

Israel had denied the affair officially for over 50 years. But in 2005, it decided to award the perpetrators with honor:  “Although it is still a sensitive situation, we decided now to express our respect for these heroes” said President Moshe Katsav at the ceremony in Jerusalem (Katsav, by the way, has been convicted since as a serial rapist).

Going even further back in history, and yet reflecting upon our current times, one could mention the bombing of the King David Hotel in Jerusalem by Menachem Begin’s Irgun in 1946, targeting the British headquarters in Palestine, killing 91. What many seem to not be acutely aware of is, that the bombing was planned together with Haganah commander Itzhak Sadeh, whilst the actual bombing was by Irgun alone. “Everything was coordinated with the Hagana,” Begin said in a film clip from the Israel Broadcasting Authority’s “Scroll of Fire” series. In 2006, the 60th anniversary of the terror attack, the Begin Heritage Center unveiled a plaque in honor of the terrorists. As Tom Segev notes, “there is no condemnation”. The terrorists are regarded as “Etzel [Irgun] fighters.” At the memorial event, one of the terrorists, who still uses his nom de guerre “Danny”, said that “the bombing of the British headquarters [in the King David Hotel] was the most important event of the pre-state period. It led to the establishment of the state. We helped to drive out the British Empire, because the British realized that we Jews could fight and that we would. And I would do it again, in a second.”

Benjamin Netanyahu spoke at the event: “The difference is expressed in the fact that the terrorists intend to harm civilians whereas legitimate combatants try to avoid that”, he said.

And there we have it, with a bit of coded language that every Israeli understands – Jews are generally not terrorists, because when they “end up” harming civilians, it’s just “uncalculated collateral”, but when the terrorists (that is, of course, the Arabs) do it, it’s intrinsically evil.

On July 7th 2014, after 16-year-old Mohammed Abu Khdeir was torched alive by Israelis in East Jerusalem, Netanyahu said, in promising justice, that “that’s the difference between us and our neighbors. They consider murderers to be heroes. They name public squares after them. We don’t.”  On August 2, 2015, Netanyahu repeated the message, this time in the wake of another live torching – of the Dawabshe family in occupied Duma:

“We chase them down. They name public squares after the murderers of children, and this difference can’t be covered up.”

JJ Goldberg presents a long list of Jewish terrorists who are commemorated with honor – having streets named after them. He focuses primarily upon the Jerusalem neighborhood of East Talpiot:

“Nearly all the streets in East Talpiot are named after Jews convicted and hanged as terrorists by the British before 1948. That’s right: Israeli streets named after Jewish terrorists. Don’t let anyone tell you different. There were 12 of them: nine members of the Irgun and three from the Stern Group, or Lehi. Two were hanged for assassinating the British minister Lord Moyne in Cairo in 1945. One unsuccessfully attacked an Arab civilian bus in the Galilee in 1938. Three participated in the 1947 Acre prison break. The rest attacked British security personnel. In addition to streets named for each individual, the neighborhood’s main drag bears the name by which they’re collectively remembered: Olei HaGardom, “those who ascended the gallows.” Dozens more cities around Israel have an Olei HaGardom Street. Many have streets named for the individual members, too. Two other streets in East Talpiot are named for Shmuel Azar and Moshe Marzouk, Egyptian Jews hanged in Cairo in 1955 for bombing the American and British libraries. The operation, known as the Lavon Affair, was a bone-headed plot by Israeli military intelligence meant to sour Egypt’s ties with the West. Elsewhere in Israel are streets named for Hirsh Lekert, hanged in Vilna in 1902 for trying to assassinate the tsarist governor; Sholom Schwartzbard, who confessed to assassinating Ukrainian rebel leader Simon Petlura in Paris in 1926, but was acquitted by a French jury; and Herschel Grynszpan, who assassinated a Nazi diplomat in Paris in November 1938, touching off Kristallnacht.”

But that’s history, one might be tempted to say. What about now? Is Israel involved in state terror?

This was indeed the conclusion of the UN Fact Finding mission to Gaza 2009, headed by (Zionist Jewish) judge Richard Goldstone, in its finding that the acts of Israel in Gaza were a “terrorising” of a “civilian population”.  Goldstone had noted that the policy that appeared to be applied here was essentially the “Dahiya doctrine”, patented by the current chief of staff Gadi Eisenkot, when he was chief of Northern Command in 2006 during Israel’s attack on the Dahiya civilian neighborhood of Beirut in its “asymmetric warfare” – Dahiya was a neighborhood that was assessed to house many Hizbollah members. Years after the Lebanon invasion, the Jerusalem Post notes that “at least once a month here [in the Defense Ministry], a disagreement erupts between the top generals over the significance of the Dahiya Doctrine and whether it should be used again in a future conflict. Most believe it should.”

“What happened in the Dahiya quarter of Beirut in 2006 will happen in every village from which Israel is fired on,” Eizenkot said in an interview two years after Lebanon. “We will apply disproportionate force on it and cause great damage and destruction there. From our standpoint, these are not civilian villages, they are military bases.”

But when Israel enacts such terror, we are being asked to confirm – not condemn – Israel’s right to “self-defense”. And we can’t call it terror, that would be extreme. Even when it’s clear-cut murder, by a soldier – it can’t be called that (as I observed before).

The last major Israeli campaign against Gaza in 2014 was supported throughout by 95% of the Israeli Jewish public. 95 percent of polled Israelis were said to be in agreement that medic soldier Elor Azarya did not commit murder when he fired a bullet into the head of a wounded, immobile Palestinian, Abdel Fattah Al Sharif, 21, in March in occupied Hebron. Netanyahu says that “Israeli soldiers are not murderers”, and opines historically that its terrorists are not terrorists.

Now we are being demanded by this state, to condemn the terror of last Wednesday, and it can’t go fast enough.

I oppose violence. If I thought this condemnation was about opposing violence – even about opposing terror – then I would feel that it was very responsible to condemn. But this is not what it’s about. The condemnation that Israel wants is a card of sympathy for its violent policies of collective punishment, and general terrorizing of a whole population. I am concerned that I will end up supporting terrorism, by condemning it.

So instead, I chose to write this – to demonstrate how similar we all are as humans – and yet how cynically we can exploit terms in order to control others. I condemn that.

About Jonathan Ofir

Israeli musician, conductor and blogger / writer based in Denmark.

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43 Responses

  1. amigo
    June 12, 2016, 1:43 pm

    I place responsibility for the deaths in Tel Aviv directly on the shoulders of the leaders of Israel and their supporters who have for over fifty years carried out inhumane and murderous act against the Palestinian people.

    Nobody but nobody would tolerate this treatment without a violent response.Cause and effect.

    If Israel wants peace and security for it,s Jewish citizens , which we all know only too well , are the only ones they care about , then they should prove it by ending their occupation and get the hell out of Palestine and take their vile squatters with them .

    Having said all of that , I extend my condolences to the families of the victims and ask them to question their participation and support for Israel,s policies that have led to their loss. I ask them , was it worth oppressing another people.Do you want more Israelis to pay the same price for decades to come or are you going to wake up to reality.

    Are your leaders who use you as human shields, worth the price.

  2. John O
    June 12, 2016, 2:00 pm

    And now we have the horrific massacre in Orlando.

    As soon as it emerged that the perpetrator was not some homophobic bigot, but an American Muslim of Afghan heritage, I thought – this plays straight into the hands of Donald Trump; and it’s not just the CIA whose actions produce blowback.

    Even here in the UK, with the Brexiteers who want us to leave the European Union having already played the race and immigration cards, it could swing our politics towards disaster.

    • Mooser
      June 12, 2016, 4:45 pm

      “As soon as it emerged that the perpetrator was not some homophobic bigot, but an American Muslim of Afghan heritage”

      Gee, he sure had me fooled. I thought he was a murderous homophobic bigot.

      • John O
        June 12, 2016, 6:06 pm

        I decided not to write “bigot from the Westboro Baptist Church” in case readers thought I was wisecracking when it was inappropriate.

      • John O
        June 13, 2016, 2:25 am

        Now that more details are emerging, and in particular after reading Juan Cole’s assessment, I think homophobia is probably the main motive:

        http://www.juancole.com/2016/06/rightwing-homophobia-terrorism.html

      • Mooser
        June 13, 2016, 11:41 am

        “I think homophobia is probably the main motive”

        Why don’t we do it like an auto accident, and assign percentages of responsibility to homophobia and/or religion?

    • Eric
      June 14, 2016, 11:37 am

      Donald Trump assigns ethnic motives to the “Mexican” judge, born in Indiana, and is roundly condemned by the media. That same media is characterizing the Orlando killer as a radical ISIS-loving “Islamic terrorist”, even though he’s also an American, born in New York. The hypocrisy alarm is blaring loudly…

  3. Atlantaiconoclast
    June 12, 2016, 2:01 pm

    Thanks for bringing up the Lavon affair. I hope other columnists will write about other false flag Israeli attacks over the years, such as the attack on the USS Liberty. Americans, by and large, do not know this information. Getting them educated about Israel’s history of false flag activities would be a game changer. Much more effective than droning on and on about unjust treatment of Palestinians. Appeal to American self interest to help Palestinians.

    • jon s
      June 13, 2016, 4:11 pm

      I don’t know about other false flag operations, but the USS Liberty incident was not “false flag”.
      Israel took responsibility for the mistake , apologized and paid compensation.

      • echinococcus
        June 13, 2016, 8:26 pm

        Mistake my *$$. As much a “mistake” as any other mass murder, occupation, terrorist attack or character assassination by Zionists.

      • Brewer
        June 14, 2016, 3:23 am

        “Israel took responsibility for the mistake , apologized and paid compensation.”
        Yep. They do that when the evidence becomes irrefutable.
        I wish I had a dollar for every time during the past couple of decades I have been slandered as the lowest form of anti-Semite for suggesting they were responsible. Its a little better since the tapes were made public but not much.

        Not too snappy about taking responsibility either – eh Jon:
        “Israel is locking away millions of official documents to prevent the darkest episodes in its history from coming to light, civil rights activists and academics have warned as the country’s state archives move online.

        They claim government officials are concealing vital records needed for historical research, often in violation of Israeli law, in an effort to avoid damaging Israel’s image.”
        – See more at: http://www.jonathan-cook.net/2016-06-09/why-israel-is-blocking-access-to-its-archives/#sthash.eIFTbEl8.dpuf

    • Chu
      June 14, 2016, 2:25 pm

      Al Jazeera had a sound documentary entitled : The Day Israel Attacked America.

      AJ shut down this year because the cable provider oligarchs would not allow them to share a posted links. So much for ‘Freedom of the Press’.
      See below-

      AJAM’s contracts with cable providers prohibited it from “re-purposing” its news clips on its own Web site, thus cutting off a key circulation path in an age of social-media sharing. “It’s been a tremendous handicap,” said Ray Suarez, the former “PBS NewsHour” journalist who hosts AJAM’s “Inside Story.” “People have asked where they can see a show online or where they could get a clip in order to post a link. And we’ve had to say, ‘Those things are not available.’ ”

      https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/al-jazeera-america-news-channel-to-close-up-shop/2016/01/13/aa3ab180-ba1f-11e5-99f3-184bc379b12d_story.html

  4. Jackdaw
    June 12, 2016, 2:18 pm

    ” Israel sought to frame Egypt in terror against British and American ”

    Not Israel, but a rogue operation from within Military Intelligence.

    • Jonathan Ofir
      June 12, 2016, 3:00 pm

      Jackdaw, if we’re going to be that specific, we’ll have to say that Israel didn’t actually conquer the Syrian Golan in 1967, because Dayan (then Defense Minister) commanded the invasion without telling his Chief of Staff (Rabin), nor, more significantly – his PM (Eshkol).
      It does not have to be our great concern that there have been rogue operations because of power fights within Israeli government. In the end, Defense Minister Lavon resigned. I do not know whether Ben Gurion was involved – very likely yes, I would say. But in the end Israel did this – but denied doing it. And then honored the “heroes”.
      I feel no need to make apologetic qualifications for such things.

      • Nevada Ned
        June 13, 2016, 12:14 am

        I could be wrong, but when I checked out the Lavon affair a few years ago, the story was that Ben -Gurion pinned the blame on his cabinet minister Lavon for the false-flag attacks. Ben-Gurion even produced a key incriminating document signed by Lavon. That seemed to clinch it.

        Lavon claimed that his signature was forged. Naturally, Mondoweiss readers will think ?? FORGED ?? fuhgettaboutit.

        But it turned out that Lavon’s signature really was forged. Ben Gurion “retired’ under distress and lived out the rest of his life in disgrace.

        This could be checked out by critical reading of reporting around the time of Ben Gurion’s retirement. Perhaps a Mondoweiss reader, fluent in Hebrew, will take it on as a project ??

      • jon s
        June 13, 2016, 4:02 pm

        Nevada Ned,
        Your chronology is inaccurate.
        In Jan. 1954 Ben Gurion resigned from office and was replaced by Moshe Sharett. It was during Sharett’s incumbency that the rogue operation which came to be known as the Lavon affair took place. BG returned to office in 1955 , was re-elected, and eventually resigned for the last time in 1963.

        BG did not live out his years in disgrace. He was indeed preoccupied by the “affair” , even obssesed. To his supporters it was to his credit that he continued to seek justice.

    • amigo
      June 12, 2016, 3:07 pm

      ” Israel sought to frame Egypt in terror against British and American ”

      Not Israel, but a rogue operation from within Military Intelligence.” jackduh

      You mean the same rogue elements Israel honoured.

      “Israel had denied the affair officially for over 50 years. But in 2005, it decided to award the perpetrators with honor: “Although it is still a sensitive situation, we decided now to express our respect for these heroes” said President Moshe Katsav at the ceremony in Jerusalem (Katsav, by the way, has been convicted since as a serial rapist).”

    • John O
      June 12, 2016, 3:41 pm

      So the rogues have been brought to justice and punished and Israel has repudiated their deeds. Thought not.

  5. ritzl
    June 12, 2016, 2:42 pm

    Brilliant last two paragraphs. Nailed the rhetorical ouroboros of Israeli terrorism. Or any cycle of violence for that matter.

    https://qph.is.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-d4faed8d6a85fba558cd6580972b12ca?convert_to_webp=true

  6. jon s
    June 12, 2016, 4:20 pm

    I can’t understand why Jonathan Ofir can’t bring himself to condemn an act of terrorism, the killing of innocent civilians in Tel Aviv.
    It’s simple: All terrorism should be condemned, with no “ifs” , “ands” and “buts”, whatever the identity of the victims and the perpetrators.

    • Mooser
      June 12, 2016, 4:29 pm

      “All terrorism should be condemned…” “Jon s”

      I just word-searched “condemn” in your archive.

      You, (as will be plain to anybody who clicks the link), cannot bring yourself to “condemn” a single specific action or policy of the Israeli government.

      Every comment in which you use the word “condemn” simply turns into an excuse.

      • amigo
        June 12, 2016, 5:33 pm

        “Every comment in which you use the word “condemn” simply turns into an excuse – “mooser

        Here is one perfect example.Note the use of , “if it can be proved that civilians were deliberately or negligently targeted ” .
        No mention of murdering Palestinian kids on beaches or bombing UN buildings or dropping 2 ton bombs on civilian buildings or dropping WP on innocent civilians or —what ever your,e having yourself.

        “I’ll try to answer:
        -I absolutely condemn any killing of innocent civilians. If it can be proved that civilians were deliberately or negligently targetted – those responsible should be prosecuted and punished. – See more at: http://mondoweiss.net/profile/jon-s/?keyword=condemn#sthash.IGM7F2w5.dpuf” jon s

        jon s is a graduate of the school of “zionist ” history.

      • Mooser
        June 12, 2016, 7:03 pm

        “Here is one perfect example…”

        Yup, that was my pick for “perfect example”, too! Thanks!

    • echinococcus
      June 12, 2016, 5:57 pm

      “Condemn”? How so?
      Did you guys evacuate all of Palestine yet?
      That will surely end the war, no ifs and buts about it.
      Meanwhile, you started war and you get war. Instead of whining, get your bottom back to Brooklyn; it’s safer.

    • jon s
      June 13, 2016, 1:11 am

      amigo,
      Thanks. You’ve shown that I’ve always, consistently , condemned terrorism from whatever side.
      Of course I proudly stand by those comments.
      What about you, amigo? Do you condemn all terrorism, from whatever side?

      • Talkback
        June 13, 2016, 9:22 am

        jon s, do you condemn in general a reckless disregard of the principle of distinction between combatants and civilians and not only a premeditated attack against civilians?

      • amigo
        June 13, 2016, 3:03 pm

        “Thanks. You’ve shown that I’ve always, consistently , condemned terrorism from whatever side. ” jons

        Humour me and elaborate.

        Jon s , nobody can ever prove Israel targets civilians intentionally when it refuses to allow anyone in to collect evidence.

        What is Israel hiding.Why do they go to so much trouble to keep everyone out.Must be hiding something.This is exactly how a guilty person reacts.Innocent people would throw open their doors and welcome in with open arms those who can prove them innocent.

        Btw , I condemn the terrorism that is carried out to deny people their freedom and steal their land and commit war crimes against them for over 50 years more than I condemn the “terrorism ” of the victims of this terrorism perpetrated by Israel.

        So don,t play coy with me old bean.You are an unapologetic zionist who defends any crime your vile little rogue state commits.

        Your archives are replete with examples of support for Israeli terrorism.

      • jon s
        June 13, 2016, 3:48 pm

        amigo,
        My position is that I condemn and despise terrorism perpetrated by anyone against anyone.
        Your position is that you don’t condemn terrorism if Israeli civilians are the victims. In those cases it’s “terrorism” in quotation marks. Feel free to correct me if I’m mistaken.

        Talkback,
        “Reckless disregard” isn’t far from premeditated. Of course it should be condemned. And investigated, prosecuted, and punished.

      • amigo
        June 13, 2016, 4:25 pm

        “Reckless disregard” isn’t far from premeditated. Of course it should be condemned. And investigated, prosecuted, and punished.”jon s

        Better get on to your leaders.They are the ones refusing to allow anyone to investigate Israel,s crimes.

        You have not answered my post.You just keep repeating the same old line and claiming you oppose any form of terrorism.

        Incidentally , I used quotation marks because I do not view the acts of desperate people who have suffered all their lives at the hands of Israeli aggression to be pure acts of terrorism. Your continued refusal to see this simply shows you as a bigot who seems to be claiming you would tolerate such treatment for decades and do nothing about it. Do you think Palestinian people are less human than you.

        Btw , you got a lot of guts rattling on about terrorism from your illegal squat in Beersheba living on stolen land .Who are to you question my motives.

      • Mooser
        June 13, 2016, 8:38 pm

        “you got a lot of guts rattling on about terrorism from your illegal squat in Beersheba living on stolen land .”

        And what is so hilarious about “Jon s” is how desperate he is for us to like him and approve of him, and reassure him he is a decent person.
        He is the Stuart Smalley of Zionism

      • eljay
        June 14, 2016, 8:04 am

        || jon s: … I’ve always, consistently , condemned terrorism from whatever side. … ||

        And you have always, consistently , condemned the application of justice, accountability and equality to the I-P issue.

      • jon s
        June 14, 2016, 3:51 pm

        amigo,
        We seem to be repeating ourselves: I condemn all terrorism , from whatever source and whoever the victims -the only position which stands on firm moral ground, in my view – while you won’t condemn terrorism if the victims are Israelis.

        And I don’t live in an “illegal squat “. I live in a home legally purchased with my family’s hard-earned money, and with a mortgage which I’m still paying. Didn’t steal from anyone. ( You really don’t want to know what happened the last time I squatted…)

      • Mooser
        June 14, 2016, 4:02 pm

        “And I don’t live in a “squat”.”

        “Jon s” you deserve good things. You am entitled to your share of happiness. You refuse to beat yourself up. You are an attractive person. You are fun to be with.

        Happy now? What is it you are trying to prove to us? That you are desperately insecure, know what thin ice you are on, and somehow, the approval of the people in the comment section at Mondo will make it all better? I mean, man, what the f–k is your problem?

        And another thing, Jonny. Okay, you’ve proven to your satisfaction that you are a saint and we are all louses. What do you do then?

    • WH
      June 13, 2016, 2:47 am

      jon s, you seem to have missed, perhaps deliberately, the entire point of the article, which is the instrumentalisation of terrorist acts and public responses to them.

      • Mooser
        June 13, 2016, 11:45 am

        “jon s, you seem to have missed, perhaps deliberately, the entire point of the article”

        And “Jon s” exhibits exactly what Mr. Ofir describes in the article!
        Like he was waiting there in Beersheva for a chance to prove Ofir right!

        Why’d you go and tell him, “WH”? We could have strung him along for weeks, and he would never have gotten it.

  7. MHughes976
    June 12, 2016, 6:03 pm

    The events in Tel Aviv and Orlando were wrong. I don’t withhold condemnation but condemnation is almost meaningless by itself. There must be more to say.

  8. Marnie
    June 13, 2016, 12:50 am

    “Israeli Ambassador to the United Nations Danny Danon was already warning the rest of the world that lack of condemnation may have dire consequences: “Today’s heinous attack sadly proves that when the international community refuses to condemn terror against Israelis, the next attack is only a matter of time…Terror in Tel Aviv must be treated the same as terror in Paris or Istanbul.”

    There’s no limit in the amount of ass kissing the GoI demands. But it’s the veiled threat made by Danon that is unreal, considering the carnage in Orlando, carried out by Omar Mateen, apparently “pledged allegiance to ISIS”. It’s confusing, ISIS = ISIL = JSIL? And why does the united states gov’t refuse to condemn the israeli gov’t – because they’re the same.

  9. klm90046
    June 13, 2016, 2:56 pm

    “…that’s the difference between us and our neighbors. They (Palestinians) consider murderers to be heroes. They name public squares after them. We don’t–” Netanyahu.

    Of course you don’t. You elect them prime minister.

  10. Irfan
    June 13, 2016, 3:21 pm

    Another pair of names belongs on Ofir and Goldberg’s historical list–the region’s first (attempted) suicide bombers, Meir Feinstein and Moshe Barazani. They were pre-1948 Zionist guerillas and their deeds are commemorated in the Underground Prisoner’s Museum in Jerusalem, right off of Jaffa St, in the middle of the most touristy part of the city. Hardly a secret, and yet not well known:

    http://www.timesofisrael.com/the-pre-state-struggle-remembered-at-the-underground-prisoners-museum/

    Note the unapologetic use of the word “terrorizing” in a positive vein. Terrorism is good if it’s Zionist terrorism.

    Though Feinstein and Barazani failed in the homicidal part of their endeavor, they are lionized precisely for their homicidal intentions in the museum, and in the puff pieces I’ve read about them in Israeli journalism. It’s unsurprising that the Times of Israel piece above discusses this the museum in the context of a Travel piece. Islamic suicide bombers engage in terrorism; Zionist ones are just good for tourism. You say “terrorism,” I say “tourism”….

  11. Atlantaiconoclast
    June 13, 2016, 3:35 pm

    I find it so odd that Hamas kills such a far lower percentage of civilians than the IDF, yet IT is the terror group?

  12. Bumblebye
    June 13, 2016, 5:15 pm

    Tonight, in just a few mins, bbcR4 flagship nightly news prog will be discussing the IDF!

    on between 10pm and 10.45pm (5.00 – 5.45pm EST)

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07fdxt3

    prog airing now, not yet reached this discussion.

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