Israel’s proof that Marwan Barghouti is a terrorist – a cookie

Israel/Palestine
on 43 Comments

There seems to be no bottom to the abyss Israel is willing to sink to in its desperation to save its public image against the current Palestinian hunger strike.

Yesterday, the Israeli Prison Services released footage which is allegedly from the 27th of April and 5th of May, supposedly showing hunger strike leader Marwan Barghouti eating something which was wrapped in paper, while sitting on the toilet. Minister of Public Security and Hasbara (propaganda) Gilad Erdan exploited the ‘discovery’ to make his own video, saying that this proves that “Barghouti is a murderer and hypocrite who urged his fellow prisoners to strike and suffer while he ate behind their back.”

There are multiple problems with this footage, beyond the very real possibility that it is fake. A Palestinian prisoner’s advocacy group is saying that the footage is not recent and possibly even a decade old.

ברגותי אוכל בתאו from שירות בתי הסוהר on Vimeo.

But let us return to the technicalities later, in order to address the real moral abyss here – the absolute shamelessness of Israeli propaganda. Those who eat that propaganda raw, and even with glee (like Jewish Press), are the real story here.

I mean, let’s just think about this whole thing first, morally. A society, with its top security officials and prison apparatus, is willing to air footage of a prisoner in a toilet. And for what? In order to weaken a hunger strike.

But there’s also the technical issue here, which is problematic on several fronts. In the first section of the video, supposedly from April 27th, Barghouti is seen taking a small package with paper, going to the toilet and closing the door. The ceiling surveillance camera from which this is shot manages to catch some of his image when he is there, but it is not clear that he is actually eating something. His concern, for which he closes the door, appears more to be for the guards being able to see him through the cell door (he lets the toilet door open slightly at a point, which puts him more in sight of the camera but still not in sight of the door angle). It is also unclear why this footage is then run for 3 whole minutes. Then comes the supposed footage from the 5th of May. But strangely, it starts with a few seconds from another angle, and then, when the ceiling camera appears again – it has no timestamp (as the Times of Israel noticed, thus admitting that it could not independently verify the dates the footage was recorded). When asked for comment by Times of Israel, the prison service spokesperson said: “The video speaks for itself.” But does it? The only video which shows Barghouti rather clearly eating a wafer, is that one without a timestamp.

But honestly, I cannot believe that we are actually having to discuss these things. The Palestinian hunger strike regards serious issues. And here we are discussing whether Barghouti ate a cookie, and when.

Israel is obviously desperate – and has already spoken of bringing in foreign doctors in order to force feed the prisoners, as the Israeli Medical Association is refusing to take part in what its chairman unequivocally calls “physical torture”.

But is there a doctor out there that may ever be able to heal the sick Israeli society, led by populist propaganda ministers that have not a shame in the world?

About Jonathan Ofir

Israeli musician, conductor and blogger / writer based in Denmark.

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43 Responses

  1. John O
    May 8, 2017, 11:21 am

    Thanks for your analysis, Jonathan. The moment I saw this story on the Guardian website today, I thought: fake news. Now, why would I have developed an attitude like that?

  2. Jackdaw
    May 8, 2017, 12:37 pm

    Barghouti isn’t a terrorist because he eats cookies during a hunger strike. He’s a hypocrite.

    Barghouti is terrorist because he was convicted of multiple counts of murder.

    Is anyone disputing his rightful convictions for murder?

    • echinococcus
      May 8, 2017, 12:57 pm

      Sure a lot of people are disputing it, Jacksomething. “Convicted” by a fake court set up by an illegal invader, manned by criminals against humanity illegally residing on other people’s land. For exercising his inalienable right to resist the occupier by all available means, as clearly stated in international law (with, by the way, an absence of facts established to the civilized standard of proof, but that is irrelevant.)
      What is so surprising is that anyone would recognize the fake courts and the armed terrorists exercising local authority there.

      • Maghlawatan
        May 10, 2017, 1:49 pm

        I wonder what sort of kavanah Mayhem has when he prays. Prayer without kavanah is like a body without a soul. So trace elements I guess.

    • John O
      May 8, 2017, 1:01 pm

      “Is anyone disputing his rightful convictions for murder?”

      Just about everyone outside the Ziobubble.

      Perhaps you would like to refuse food for a few days (we wouldn’t want you to suffer any permanent organ failure), lock yourself in a very small room, and then see how long you last after someone slides a cookie under the door.

    • Mooser
      May 8, 2017, 3:03 pm

      “Is anyone disputing his rightful convictions for murder?”

      ROTFLMSJAO!! “Mayhem”, you are a card. I try to believe you are not an over-the-top performance by an embittered anti-Zionist, but sometimes that isn’t easy.

    • oldgeezer
      May 8, 2017, 6:55 pm

      @jackdaw

      International observers likened his trial to soviet show trial. The judge showed bias and prejudice during the trial and on tbe record.

      There is nothing rightful about his conviction.

    • Blake
      May 8, 2017, 10:23 pm

      A child throwing a stone is deemed a terrorist from propagandists of an occupier/oppressor which was born out of terrorism and sustained by it.

    • Edward Q
      May 10, 2017, 1:43 pm

      Many Palestinians are jailed by Israel based on “confessions” extracted by torture. Others are jailed without charge in “administrative detention”. Lately, Israel has been especially going after Palestinian children. Meanwhile, in Israel’s racist justice system, a Jewish settler can be fined 80 cents for murdering a Palestinian.

  3. echinococcus
    May 8, 2017, 1:00 pm

    The “foreign doctors” would be our very own American torturers, boasting of the experience of Guantánamo, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Some of them not so foreign, as they also have, or are elibigle for, “Israel” citizenship.

  4. Jonathan Ofir
    May 8, 2017, 1:11 pm

    Jackdaw, ‘is anyone disputing his rightful convictions for murder’? Oh, you betcha. You probably missed my recent article on this. I don’t want to repeat myself: http://mondoweiss.net/2017/04/making-barghouti-terrorist/

    Barghouti might have eaten a wafer at some point (I don’t know when). But you ate all that Hasbara raw. That’s probably more unhealthy.

    • Jackdaw
      May 9, 2017, 2:18 pm

      Barghouti was tried in Tel Aviv District Court, not in a Military Court.
      He had defense counsel, including French attorneys, but Barghouti chose to represent himself. By doing so he forfeited the right to cross examine witnesses. That’s his bad, not the Court’s.

      There were international jurists present, who were given great access to the court records.

      The Prosecution charged 37 counts of murder, at the Court threw out 32 of them. Obviously, this wasn’t a biased panel of Judges, one of whom threatened the Prosecutor with sanctions. Again, no bias.

      The three judges convicted Barghouti, and their decision is public record.

      Why Jonathan Opir chooses to ignore the Judge’s written decision, and instead cite to international ‘faerie law’, tells me that Jonathan is lazy and biased.

      So what if the Prosecution tried to stage a ‘show trial’. Barghouti wasn’t judged by public opinion, or even a jury. He was tried and convicted in a transparent public forum under close scrutiny by the world press.

      Pleezz.

      • punterweger
        May 9, 2017, 5:12 pm

        @jackdaw – your comment is just another red herring. No one had criticized Barghouti’s trial for being held in a “Military Court”, but you blithely ignore the fact that holding the trial in Tel Aviv itself constituted a violation of the Geneva Convention. So Israel once again violated international law, and it shows us that even you think that Israel’s “Military Courts” are highly problematic.

      • Jackdaw
        May 10, 2017, 11:59 am

        @punterweger

        Holding the trial in Tel Aviv was, according to Judge Chen, not a violation of the Geneva Convention.

        Judge Chen argued that the interim agreements signed between Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organization as a result of the Oslo negotiations in no way prevent Israel from arresting and trying people who live within the Palestinian autonomous areas for crimes carried out in Israel or against Israelis.

        Sorry. She had sound legal grounds for her ruling.

      • echinococcus
        May 10, 2017, 2:00 pm

        Jackwhatever,

        Tel Aviv is already a major violation of the most basic laws of humanity. See, there is no room anywhere in Palestine for Zionist invaders. They can go back comfortably to wherever they belong and occupied peoples have every right to resist by all means available.
        So screw Judge Chen and the jackass he rode in on. If you’re young you may live to see that.

      • Jackdaw
        May 10, 2017, 3:32 pm

        @tapeworm

        When will you stick your head out of your hole and finally see the light of day?

      • Mooser
        May 10, 2017, 4:56 pm

        “your comment is just another red herring”

        What in the world? Just small, mouth-sized pieces of herring, and of pinkish tones!

      • oldgeezer
        May 10, 2017, 8:15 pm

        @jackdaw

        There wasn’t a judge chen on the trial.

        There were international observers and they not find it to be a fair trial.

        Typical bs from you

        http://www.ipu.org/hr-e/174/report.htm

      • Jackdaw
        May 11, 2017, 12:54 am

        @oldgeezer

        You are right. Chen was the Prosecutor, Gurfinkle was the Judge.

        Here is Gurfinkle’s ruling on the murder trial of Barghouti.

        http://mfa.gov.il/MFA/MFA-Archive/2002/Pages/State%20of%20Israel%20vs%20Marwan%20Barghouti-%20Ruling%20by%20Jud.aspx

        If anyone, including lazy ass Jonathan Ofir, believes the that this trial was unfair, than this ruling is where you start your analysis.

        And BTW, Barghouti made this a show trial by foolishly refusing to acknowledge the Tel Aviv District Court’s authority in this matter.

      • talknic
        May 11, 2017, 11:36 am

        @ Jackdaw May 11, 2017, 12:54 am

        “Here is Gurfinkle’s ruling on the murder trial of Barghouti.”

        Under International Law Zvi Gurfinkel didn’t have jurisdiction

        “.. this ruling is where you start your analysis”

        1) From a judge who didn’t understand they didn’t have jurisdiction? Sure thing.
        2) Strange. It’s where Mr. Simon Foreman started his analysis! http://www.ipu.org/hr-e/174/report.htm

        People don’t do research and give links for the information to be ignored by rrrrrrsols for coloniozation. No siree ma’am! By answering your constant stream of ZioCrap, they educate folk who’re actually interested in peace

        Keep up th’ good work

      • Jackdaw
        May 12, 2017, 12:54 am

        @talknic

        “Under International Law Zvi Gurfinkel didn’t have jurisdiction”

        Assuming, arguendo, that Judge Gurfinkel misinterpreted the law, a defendant has the right to appeal a lower court’s decision.

        Barghouti willfully chose not to exercise that right when he refused to fully defend himself in court.

        To wit, Barghouti had been given the opportunity to participate in a ‘fair trial’, but he foolishly squandered that opportunity and caught five life sentences.

        As an aside, during the waning days of the British Mandate, three young Jewish terrorists were arrested and charged with the capital crime of weapons possession. They refused to acknowledge the authority of the court, refused to cross examine witnesses, and stood and sang Hatikvah during their sentencing.

        The young terrorists all swung on the gallows.
        They were fools, and so is Marwan Barghouti.

      • talknic
        May 12, 2017, 8:39 pm

        Jackdaws are supposed to be smart.

        @ Jackdaw May 12, 2017, 12:54 am

        “Assuming, arguendo, that Judge Gurfinkel misinterpreted the law, a defendant has the right to appeal a lower court’s decision.”

        Appeal to someone who doesn’t have jurisdiction about a court that doesn’t have jurisdiction. Sure thing buddy. Thinking just isn’t your forte is it!

        “To wit, Barghouti had been given the opportunity to participate in a ‘fair trial’, but he foolishly squandered that opportunity and caught five life sentences”

        Israel is the Occupying Power, it’s civil courts in Israel do not have jurisdiction over matters in Occupied Territories. Barghouti should not have even been in Israel, it’s against the Laws of war for the Occupying Power to remove persons rightly in Occupied Territories from Occupied Territories. ‘fair trial’ where Palestinians are concerned is an anathema to Israel

        “As an aside, during the waning days of the British Mandate, three young Jewish terrorists were arrested and charged with the capital crime of weapons possession. They refused to acknowledge the authority of the court, refused to cross examine witnesses, and stood and sang Hatikvah during their sentencing.

        The young terrorists all swung on the gallows.”

        So? They were terrorists and the British DID have administrative power and jurisdiction in Palestine under the LON Mandate for Palestine

        “They were fools”

        They were Jewish terrorists

      • Mooser
        May 12, 2017, 10:38 pm

        “They were fools”

        Thus “Jackdaw” reasons, according to a principle every young Zionist should learn well:
        “Zionism never fails, there are only Jews who fail Zionism.”

      • Jackdaw
        May 13, 2017, 4:50 am

        @talknic

        The Courts do not suffer elliptical arguments, and I won’t suffer yours.

        I will say, that beyond the Mondoweiss echo chamber, and back in the real world, there are legal concepts such a Conflict of Laws, conflicts of jurisdiction, Personal Jurisdiction, forum non convienence and ‘long-arm’ statutes, which Courts the world over decide everyday.

        I don’t know what Barghouti’s court appointed lawyers told him, but some international jurists seem to feel that Barghouti probably had grounds to make an appeal to the Israeli Supreme Court.

        But Barghouti failed to exercise his right to appeal, and has suffered the consequences.

        Question: Did the Jewish terrorists who refused to acknowledge the authority of the Mandate court, and died on the gallows, get a ‘fair trial’?

      • talknic
        May 13, 2017, 9:15 pm

        Another Ooooops

      • talknic
        May 13, 2017, 10:36 pm

        @ Jackdaw May 13, 2017, 4:50 am

        “The Courts do not suffer elliptical arguments, and I won’t suffer yours.”

        The Israeli court made an elliptical argument in order to justify to itself its trying of a prisoner from the Occupied Territories in a civil court in Israel was somehow legal.

        “I will say, that beyond the Mondoweiss echo chamber, and back in the real world, there are legal concepts such a Conflict of Laws, conflicts of jurisdiction, Personal Jurisdiction, forum non convienence and ‘long-arm’ statutes, which Courts the world over decide everyday.”

        Uh huh. Beyond the echoes of your attempted and empty justifications, it was decided by representative jurists of the International community out in the real world that the removal of prisoners from Occupied Territories for detention and/or trial in the territory of the Occupying Power, is illegal. Israel agreed via its being a UN Member and thru its acceptance of GC IV

        “… some international jurists seem to feel that Barghouti probably had grounds to make an appeal to the Israeli Supreme Court.

        ‘some’ without examples is cute. ‘seem to feel’ is another great line. Opinions aplenty and no ‘judgements’ mean little. Making an appeal to an illegal court is also cute. Amongst a plethora of other legal aspects, one would immediately lose right to persistent objection and likely incur even more hateful and unjustifiable wrath of the Israeli juridical farce for opposing it

        Question: Did the Jewish terrorists who refused to acknowledge the authority of the Mandate court, and died on the gallows, get a ‘fair trial’?

        Not so fast. Let’s expand that into a truer equivalent
        Question: Did the alleged Jewish terrorists taken to Britain and tried under a civilian court, who refused to acknowledge the jurisdiction of the British Civil Courts, and died on the gallows, get a ‘fair trial’?

        If that were the equivalent case, no! However, they weren’t tried in civil court in Britain. They were tried under the guidance of the LoN Mandate for Palestine by which the court had jurisdiction. Their sentence of course is another matter. What was the sentence at the time for murder as guided by the LoN Mandate for Palestine?

      • talknic
        May 13, 2017, 11:22 pm

        Format correction:

        Jackdaw “Question: Did the Jewish terrorists who refused to acknowledge the authority of the Mandate court, and died on the gallows, get a ‘fair trial’?”

        Not so fast. Let’s expand that into a truer equivalent
        Question: Did the alleged Jewish terrorists taken to Britain and tried under a civilian court, who refused to acknowledge the jurisdiction of the British Civil Courts, and died on the gallows, get a ‘fair trial’?

        If that were the equivalent case, no!
        However, they weren’t tried in civil court in Britain. They were tried under the guidance of the LoN Mandate for Palestine by which the court had jurisdiction. Their sentence of course is another matter. What was the sentence at the time for murder as guided by the LoN Mandate for Palestine?

      • catalan
        May 14, 2017, 10:10 am

        “It was whether catalan thought it would be fair or not for a Jewish resistance fighter to be taken from Occupied Territories to Germany to be tried in a German civil court”. – Talknic
        I think that life is not fair.

      • Mooser
        May 14, 2017, 12:38 pm

        “I think that life is not fair.”

        No, it is not. Look what it’s done to you.

      • catalan
        May 14, 2017, 12:52 pm

        “No, it is not. Look what it’s done to you.” Mooser
        Dear friend,
        I worry about you when you say things like that. I believe in Karma. It’s not too late for you to change your priorities. There are things you do not understand, things which may hurt you.

      • Mooser
        May 14, 2017, 2:25 pm

        “There are things you do not understand, things which may hurt you.”

        Just ask the Axis, he knows everything! Yeah, yeah, yeah!

      • talknic
        May 14, 2017, 8:36 pm

        Seems Zionists have no honesty integrity ethics or morals as amply demonstrated poor valueless catalan

        @ catalan May 14, 2017, 10:10 am

        //“It was whether catalan thought it would be fair or not for a Jewish resistance fighter to be taken from Occupied Territories to Germany to be tried in a German civil court”. – Talknic //

        “I think that life is not fair”,/em>

        = you can’t honestly answer a simple question! http://mondoweiss.net/2017/05/israels-barghouti-terrorist/#sthash.os4BpJdn.dpuf

        Keep up th’ good work

        “I believe in Karma.”

        That’s why you bullsh*t so much! Interesting theory

    • catalan
      May 13, 2017, 9:16 am

      “Barghouti should not have even been in Israel,” talknic
      But you have said many times that the the Palestinians, to quote, “turn the other cheek” to “show folk who is the aggressor”. So this is an excellent occasion to practice this strategy.

      • talknic
        May 13, 2017, 9:16 pm

        @ catalan May 13, 2017, 9:16 am

        //“Barghouti should not have even been in Israel,” talknic//

        “But you have said many times …” your propensity to exaggerate is matched by your idiocy http://mondoweiss.net/profile/talknic/?keyword=turn+the+other+cheek “… that the the Palestinians, to quote, “turn the other cheek” to “show folk who is the aggressor”. So this is an excellent occasion to practice this strategy.”

        He did by not recognizing an illegal court An illegal court you support. You must be every proud!

        Every time you attempt to justify the unjustifiable you reveal even more the immoral soul of Zionism and the stupidity of those who support it

        Answer this honestly: If for instance during WW2 a Jewish resistance fighter in France was taken to Nazi Germany to be tried, you’d think that was OK, valid, fair? Right?

        Keep up th’ good work

      • echinococcus
        May 13, 2017, 11:34 pm

        Talknic,

        I’ll join you in your reply to the usual Catalan but there’s one thing you don’t seem to get:

        If for instance during WW2 a Jewish resistance fighter in France was taken to Nazi Germany to be tried, you’d think that was OK, valid, fair? Right?

        Not right: the Resistance, not only in France but anywhere in Nazi-occupied Europe –correctly– did not recognize the legality of the German occupation or any official German presence and it rejected any legality of Nazi German or local collaborator puppet government courts. There was no need for transportation to Germany proper to reject any authority of the Nazi and collaborationist organs (this as a general/overall statement that of course had many exceptions, considering the diversity of Resistance organizations.)

        Anyway, the correct parallel situation for Palestine would be a rejection not only of a resistant being tried in Tel Aviv, but of the validity of Zionist presence anywhere in the post-1967 and pre-1967 occupation area, also of the collaborationist PA courts and police. Just as the occupier German courts in the occupied countries and their collaborationist governments were denied any legitimacy and the Vichy zone, to now be specific about France, was in all significant points what the post-1967 area is, administratively speaking, to Palestine.

      • talknic
        May 14, 2017, 9:20 am

        @ echinococcus May 13, 2017, 11:34 pm

        “I’ll join you in your reply to the usual Catalan but there’s one thing you don’t seem to get: “

        Oh? There’s something you don’t get. The issue wasn’t whether the persons on trial did or did not recognize the legality of proceedings. It was whether catalan thought it would be fair or not for a Jewish resistance fighter to be taken from Occupied Territories to Germany to be tried in a German civil court.

  5. vacyv
    May 8, 2017, 5:26 pm

    Another moral issue is the abuse of prisoner privacy by Big Brother Zion

  6. oldgeezer
    May 8, 2017, 6:59 pm

    This doesn’t even come close to the moral abyss and cesspit known as Israel. Not trying to downplay this incident but it rather pales next to covering up the murder of young children by the israeli terrorist force. Murders of those who are middle aged or old as well.

    The only question is whether it can change for the better. I am beginning to doubt it can.

    • WH
      May 9, 2017, 3:29 am

      It’s about the specific character here – there are some even more inhuman regimes in the world, but I’ve never encountered one that is so petty and insecure.

    • pabelmont
      May 9, 2017, 8:43 am

      Shooting fishermen in the water off Gaza is not OK even if the fishermen are not, technically speaking, women, children, or old-timers.

      Murder is murder, And impunity is impunity and a strong reinforcer of a tendency to murder. And constantly reinforced teaching of racism (or of racial fear) is a strong impetus to both murder and impunity.

      And as we are coming to understand in the USA, there is a widespread attitude among America’s armed “security forces” (usually a/k/a “police”) either that [1] it is always OK to kill black people or that [2] black people may be assumed or perceived to be dangerous (and therefore, based on that assumption or perception, can “properly” or “legally” be killed) when doing things that would not lead the very same “security forces” (a/k/a “police”) to the assumption or the perception that white people doing the same things were dangerous.

      Seems to be a very great deal worse in Israel and the OPTs. We sometimes hear of black American police shooting black Americans (improperly) but I’ve never heard of Arab Israeli police (in Israel or OPTs) shooting Arabs (or Jews) improperly. Gee, I wonder why not? Maybe no Arab police there?

  7. JosephA
    May 8, 2017, 7:36 pm

    Wow, this was very good commentary. Also, the modern Israeli security apparatus seems to be sinking to shameless moral lows.

  8. JLewisDickerson
    May 8, 2017, 10:40 pm

    RE: “But is there a doctor out there that may ever be able to heal the sick Israeli society, led by populist propaganda ministers that have not a shame in the world? “ ~ Johnathan Ofir

    MY SUGGESTION: It’s a long shot, but perhaps Dr. Faustus, working in collaboration with Dr. Mabuse, would do the trick.

    Doctor Faustus (play)
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_Faustus_(play)

    [EXCERPT]The Tragical History of the Life and Death of Doctor Faustus, commonly referred to simply as Doctor Faustus, is an Elizabethan tragedy by Christopher Marlowe, based on German stories about the title character Faust, that was first performed sometime between 1588 and Marlowe’s death in 1593. Two different versions of the play were published in the Jacobean era, several years later.[1]

    The powerful effect of early productions of the play is indicated by the legends that quickly accrued around them—that actual devils once appeared on the stage during a performance, “to the great amazement of both the actors and spectators”, a sight that was said to have driven some spectators mad.[2] . . .

    Doctor Mabuse
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_Mabuse

    [EXCERPT] Doctor Mabuse is a fictional character created by Norbert Jacques in the novel Dr. Mabuse, der Spieler and made famous by the three movies director Fritz Lang made about the character; see Dr. Mabuse the Gambler. Although the character was designed deliberately to mimic villains, such as Dr. Fu Manchu, Doctor Nikola, Fantômas, or Svengali, the latter of which was a direct inspiration, Jacques’ goals were commercial success and to make political comments, in much the same way that the silent movie The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari (1920) had done just a few years previously.

    • Description
    Dr. Mabuse is a master of disguise and telepathic hypnosis known to employ body transference, most often through demonic possession but sometimes utilizing object technologies such as television or phonograph machines, to build a “society of crime.”. Mabuse rarely commits his crimes in person, instead operating primarily through a network of agents enacting his schemes. Mabuse’s agents range from career criminals working for him, to innocents blackmailed or hypnotized into cooperation, to dupes manipulated so successfully they do not realize that they are doing exactly what Mabuse planned for them to do.

    Mabuse’s identity often changes; one “Dr. Mabuse” may be defeated and sent to an asylum, jail or grave, only for a new “Dr. Mabuse” to later appear, as depicted in The Testament of Dr. Mabuse. The replacement invariably has the same methods, the same powers of hypnosis and the same criminal genius. There are even suggestions in some instalments of the series, that the “real” Mabuse is some sort of spirit that possesses a series of hosts. . .

    ● PROPAGANDA – Dr. Mabuse (Das Testaments Des Mabuse) (Original 12″ Mix)

  9. objak
    May 8, 2017, 11:05 pm

    I wonder though why in 2017 we need or expect pure heroes. Is any human not flawed? Do those flaws mean the movement they are representing is flawed in the same way? Just saw another post about Gandhi’s inconstancies and of course Hoover (with his own secrets) caught MLK doing and saying things that hurt his wife. Hoover hated King’s personal hypocrisies more than he hated his country’s hypocrisy when it came to life liberty and happiness for all of its citizens. I think we all know though which was the larger problem.

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