An astonishing photo album of destruction to Palestinians' homes in Gaza at Norm Finkelstein's site. Many of the homes belong to people of some wealth, bringing it home a little bit more...
And at Human Rights Watch, a powerful video narrated by military analyst Marc Garlasco, with his conclusion that Israel's use of white phosphorus missiles in civilian areas was a serious war crime. The impact of these weapons is so indiscriminate by nature that to fire them at a school or a hospital cannot be rationalized as an effort to destroy Hamas rocket installations. The U.N.'s John Ging appears to say that Israel was provided with the GPS coordinates of UN schools, well ahead of the attack that killed children in a classroom. Garlasco calls for an international investigation. It's a drumbeat now... Oh, and yes: Garlasco says that Hamas's Qassam fire at southern Israel is also a war crime.
-
-
- ‘Love Under Apartheid’ tells the story of Palestinians fighting for … 0
- Twenty Israeli military vehicles descend on village south of Hebron, … 0
- Israel bulldozes Palestinian community center, making way for a ‘City … 9
- Khader Adnan and Theodore Herzl 2
- UN official condemns Israel’s ‘strategy of Judaization’ throughout Israel/Palestine 14
- Hip hop leads the way in Gaza’s first talent show 3
- Shit Zionists say 16
- Randa Adnan: The world must intervene to save my husband 5
-
- Khader Adnan, political prisoner held without charges, is near death … 137
- The 8th annual ‘Israeli Apartheid week’ is focused on BDS 69
- How Sarah Schulman managed to get ‘Pinkwashing’ into the New … 68
- Likud party members issue call to storm al-Aqsa mosque next … 63
- Palestinian cars sprayed with unknown materials at Israeli checkpoints 62
- Husband of ‘NYT’ Jerusalem correspondent calls for attack on Iran 59
- US citizens arrested in Bahrain supporting peaceful protest near one-year … 56
- MSNBC: Israel trains Iranian terror group to kill nuclear scientists 50
-
- Hasbara PennBDS wrap-up: Pro-Israel students are ignorant 198
- Would you buy a used metaphor from this warmonger? (Niall … 125
- Jewish substitution and the white gaze 124
- ‘Commentary’ covers its eyes and makes Palestinians disappear 115
- Leading Zionist historian was first to say ‘Israel Firster’– in … 104
- Where is the Bedouin Intifada? 79
- A lull on this site 78
- Organizers say pro-Israel filmmaker with controversial past deceives, disrupts Penn … 74
-
Recent Comments
click link to see last 100 comments- Hasbara PennBDS wrap-up: Pro-Israel students are ignorant (200)
- Two new videos take on The Dersh and introduce his toughest client yet – Claus Von Bibi! (8)
- Hostage: Why is he not disbarred . . . Hostage, I hope I am on firm ground when I state that? Dershowitz habitual...
- CloakAndDagger: Sorry, didn’t get it at all. Couldn’t figure out what point was being made. He comes...
- CloakAndDagger: Why is he not disbarred for making legal proclamations that are clearly false in International Law?...
- Khader Adnan and Theodore Herzl (2)
- kalithea: Allow me to hypothesize on the meaning in the resemblance of Khader Adnan and Theordore Herzl. Perhaps...
- The Israel Lobby on campus in Illinois: A challenge for BDS (65)
- Chaos4700: Psst psst, Lavon Affair and it’s role to undermine a relationship between Egypt and the US, as...
- UN official condemns Israel’s ‘strategy of Judaization’ throughout Israel/Palestine (14)
- Chaos4700: Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton issued a condemnation of the bombing incidents, calling them...
- Shit Zionists say (16)
- Annie Robbins: that back and forth action when max says feel. lol
- Annie Robbins: radii, i hope this is the beginning of a trend. someone could slap together a video of shit zionists...
Our Writers
More WritersBlogroll
PressTV (whose site is improving monthly) now offers video proof of how the U.N. is coerced by Israel, US, and Britain.
Ban Ki Moon's report on Gaza, which proves how Israel brazenly destroyed the people and property of Gaza, will not be released soon if ever according to his spokeswoman.
Cowards at the United Nations: Time to once again cover up that painting by Picasso showing the destruction of Guernica.
Press TV is certainly a lot more reliable than e.g., Hizbollah's site, but it lacks human interest; it's too impersonal.
I have been catching up on Avrum Burg's writings after seeing him on Charlie Rose tonight (last night?). And after looking at these pictures, I'm just left with this question: How did Israel — a place of so much promise — become a shitty little country that gets its kicks from humiliating Palestinians at checkpoints and slaughtering their children?
I have the feeling that "we have been here before".
For some of us it was Sabra and Shatila or a Lebanese incursion that awakened us.Today it is Gaza and throughout these events there has been a gross odour of perenniality.We have witnessed varieties of these criminalities many times. Marc Garlasco shines a light on another dirty and degrading inhumanity of a people.
The past continues to enact its presence.Is their any hope of escape from this horrible nightmare of abuse, humiliation and oppression of the Palestinians?
John
That Israel would use white phosphorous on an occupied school brings into question the sanity of those who direct Israeli state policy.
"That Israel would use white phosphorous on an occupied school brings into question the sanity of those who direct Israeli state policy."
Gotta keep you folks honest:
Like the false rumours of the mother and 2 children being shot, and Israelis snipers shooting old women, this never happened. The UN retracted that statement.
UN backtracks on claim that deadly IDF strike hit Gaza school
http://original.antiwar.com/scheuer/2009/04/01/professor-dershowitz-encounters-aworrying-future/
Professor Dershowitz Encounters a Worrying Future
by Michael Scheuer, April 02, 2009
Email This | Print This | Share this
On 25 March 2009, I participated in a "Doha Debate" held at Georgetown University under the auspices of the Qatar-Based Doha Foundation. The Oxford Union-style question before the house was: "This house believes that it is time for the U.S. administration to get tough with Israel." The "no" team consisted of Harvard professor Alan Dershowitz and former Israeli foreign ministry adviser Dore Gold. On the "yes" team were myself and Avraham Burg, a former speaker of Israel’s Knesset. Each speaker made a 2-minute opening statement and then was question by the moderator, Tim Sebastian. Thereafter, the debaters fielded questions from the audience for about an hour, and then the audience voted. The "yes" team won 67-percent of the vote, the "no" team 33-percent.
Having seldom been on any winning team, I was more than a bit surprised by the result.
samuelburke, you beat me to it!
What kind of "expert" talks about "white phosphorus missiles" when there are no such things in existence?
Israel didn't even used white phosphorous bombs, nor shells. This would be indeed barbaric.
Israel used a smoke-producing munitions which have a special material inside them tipped with very small amount of phosphorous FOR PURPOSES OF IGNITION ONLY. Special care was taken in firing them only above free spaces between the built-up areas.
What is it with the leftist imbecils and gory fantasies of death?
And, for the logically impared here: "destruction" of property can not be evidence of "targeting of civilians". All those years of liberal arts mambo-jumbo clearly paying off.
Thanks, Suzanne, for providing a link. Yet it seems Human Rights Watch had the same information.
(Also, Suzanne, surely you're not expecting Israel to admit to illegal use of white phosphorous?)
@Suzanne:
Regarding the reversal of the statement that the U.N. school that was shelled, there is the following in a United Nations report from the 30 January – 2 February (Field Update On Gaza From The Humanitarian Coordinator, United Nations).
"Clarification: While correctly reported on 6 January that Israeli shells landed outside an UNRWA school in Jabalia, resulting in an initial estimate of 30 fatalities, the Situation Report of 7 January referred to ‘the shelling of the UNRWA school in Jabalia.’ The Humanitarian Coordinator would like to clarify that the shelling, and all of the fatalities, took place outside rather than inside the school. According to UNRWA, the number of fatalities is over 40, many of them among the 1,368 people who had taken refuge in the school" (Field Update On Gaza From The Humanitarian Coordinator, United Nations).
On the 6 January, John Ging said the airstrikes were near the school and on the perimeter of the school (Israeli shelling kills dozens at UN school in Gaza, The Guardian, January 6). The UN clarified this mistake. However 40 civilians, as stated above, many who had taken refuge in the school, still died in an area close to the school, the position of which was known to the Israelis, due to Israeli shelling.
And if anyone is about to bring up the "fact" that the ICRC said that white phosphorous use was within the boundaries of international law, there are Peter Herby's comments on the 17th of January on the ICRC's homepage:
"If ICRC delegates in the field gather credible and precise evidence of violations, or if ICRC medical personnel corroborate reports by others, the ICRC would begin by discussing this with the party concerned – rather than speaking publicly – in keeping with our standard practices. We have not commented publicly on the legality of the current use of phosphorous weapons by Israel, contrary to what has been attributed to us in recent media reports."
Within the article linked to above, he also outlines the the rules of international humanitarian law applicable to the use of phosphorous weapons and intended to spare civilians.
Peter Herby is Coordinator of the Mines-Arms Unit in the Legal Division of the International Committee of the Red Cross.
There is more background on Why UN "reversal" over Gaza school should be treated with caution here (or there). This article was originally found on Loewenstein's blog.
Suzanne, what do you get out of this? Really.
arrgh – Who's talking about white phosphorus missiles?
"…tipped with very small amount of phosphorous FOR PURPOSES OF IGNITION ONLY." Please apply a little logic to the question of why the use of white phosphorous for illumination is controversial, and why that use is subject to strict guidelines defining some consequences as OK and others as illegal.
Suzanne & Arrgh,
You're mixing up two separate incidents. The UN backtracked on the claim that the mortar shell was fired inside the school killing 43 innocent people. Instead it was fired NEAR the school killing 43 innocent people.
In another incident, White Phosphorus was used inside the courtyard of another school compound where a child sleeping on the balcony was killed and several others had burns that could only be explained by White Phosphorus shells. This second incident happened towards the end of the war and when journalists were finally allowed in, you could see the White Phosphorus still burning
Destruction of property can be evidence of targetting civilians if the property is private and/or the perpetrators know that there are civilians inside.
It seems that years of hasbara has clearly made YOU logically impaired
Okay, who unleashed the italics of doom?
The phosphorous bombs contain large amount of white phosphorous.
The smoke-screen munitions IDF used contained smoke-producing linen type of material TIPPED with VERY SMALL amount of phsophorous for IGNITION ONLY.
"And at Human Rights Watch, a powerful video narrated by military analyst Marc Garlasco, with his conclusion that Israel's use of white phosphorus missiles in civilian areas… "
(look at the top of this page, it's the words of Holy Mondowoshkeiss Himself).
Note the dishonesty of Zionist apologists. During the Israeli military rampage in Gaza several schools were attack by Zionist forces. The UN backed away from one accusation. As far as I know the rest stand. Click here for a news report.
For Americans the key issue is not so much the number of schools that Zionists attack but the material aid that Israel advocates and Zionist apologists give to Zionist terrorism. By the standards that the USA applies to Muslim groups, not only do Julian, Susanne, Richard Witty, and SOG all belong in jail awaiting trial under US anti-terrorism laws, but all their material assets should also be seized.
Jeremy Haber provides a good discussion of the Jewish Zionist mentality that aids and abets Zionist terrorism. See The Magnes Zionist: The Times on the Gaza War Crimes.
Close).
I did. As apologetic as I feel, I'm also glad to know how it happens and how to correct it. Requires correction from the site of origin, apparently. (This also offers insight to some one with little relating to ITS of how pc's can affect on-line content.)
major digression…
"Destruction of property can be evidence of targetting civilians if the property is private"
WRONG. Private property may be used by militants and thus become a legitimate target in war between those militants and the opposing army. Or it can be in the vicinity of ongoing battle and thus become a part of it. Or it can be legitimately suspected of being used for ambush, or mined up to be blown on the invading soldiers and so targeted by them in advance. There could be millions of reasons, and NONE would involve targeting of CIVILIANS.
"and/or the perpetrators know that there are civilians inside"
which CAN'T be shown by pictures of destruction after the fact. QED.
As for the incident outside the school, the killed were 6 militants and two children near-by. Who really had no business to be nowhere near the mortar-firing militants in the first place.
(and I don't have a link, but that's what I read).
The incident on the perimeter of the school, arrgh! (you defintitely live up to your name). Well, if there were two children near-by, then why would the most moral army in the world fire? I think there were two militants, acutally. And, from the report Phil linked to:
"The Israeli military and government is repeatedly blaming Hamas for civilian deaths in Gaza. Now, do we have something to say about Hamas' behavior in Gaza? Yes, we do … This is the first in a series of reports we will be issuing. Its rocket attacks in Israel … are a war crime. In the cases of this report … we did not find evidence of Hamas using civilians as human shields. Now, were they in the area at the time of these attacks? In some cases, we believe they were, and that is documented in the report. We state very clearly where we believe Hamas was, and where it was not. The bottom line, and the crucial point, is even if enemy forces — from the Israeli perspective, Hamas fighters — are in the area, white phosphorus should not be used in civilian neighborhoods. And that's the bottom line."
"the material aid that … Zionist apologists give to Zionist terrorism"
You mean like going after two children with an axe, hacking one of them to death, the other one seriously wounded? Oh wait, it was Jewish children, so it mustn't be terrorism. Right.
[ Israeli boy dies in axe attack. link to smh.com.au
]
Okay, well here is the report.
Arrgh,
Have you seen the video? Can you not see that:
a) there's white stuff, which experts have concluded to be White Phosphorus
b) It IS a lot
c) It hit INSIDE a UN School (clue: the white and blue paint)
d) A boy died in that same attack (like I said in my previous post)
e) The UN School is full of civilians and no militants, and therefore
f) It is a war-crime
As for the first incident, 43 people were killed (not two kids) and civilians there reported that there was not any mortar fire from the militants.
Where do you get your bullshit from? I'm sure even Israel apologists have some kind of limit.
"This second incident happened towards the end of the war and when journalists were finally allowed in, you could see the White Phosphorus still burning"
actually, some white phosphorous mortar shells very reported to have landed inside Israel, launched by Gazan militants. So clearly they had access to such, so they could've planted it themseves before journalists arrived, for the dramatization effect. Wouldn't be the first time they'd use DECEPTION as their tool.
"Well, if there were two children near-by, then why would the most moral army in the world fire? "
to do the only moral thing in that situation, to stop the mortar firing squad from firing more rounds. To not do so would be immoral, putting the lives at risk of those targeted by the militants.
Wouldn't you agree?
Yes, that is very sad, arrgh, As are these other reports from B'Tselem.By the way, did you know that from 29.9.2000-26.12.2008 that more than 5000 Palestinians died due to Israeli forces or civilians? In the same time period, even though it is sad, I agree, 237 Israeli civilians, and 245 security forces were killed by Palestinians. Seems a bit disproportionate, doesn't it? No death is to be condoned, however, far more Palestinians have actually died. And what conditions do they live under? Would you regard it as equal, arrgh?
Oh, I forgot to mention, those figures do not contain the 1400 Palestinians who died in the Gaza slaughter, and the 13 Israelis (5 from "friendly" fire).
"to do the only moral thing in that situation, to stop the mortar firing squad from firing more rounds. To not do so would be immoral, putting the lives at risk of those targeted by the militants.
Wouldn't you agree?"
Well, I think they were actually running, arrgh (I hope I got the rr's right), and therefore, not firing more rounds. But please forgive me. I don't have the reference. But I did read it somewhere.
You mean like the jews could've planted zyklon b cannisters amongst themselves just to tar the Germans?
Shafiq, – your (f) doesn't follow even if all the rest were true. It has to be INTENTIONAL to be a war crime. It could be a stray round, or it could be a phosphorous mortar planted there by militants themselves. We KNOW Hamas use deception so can't take any word of theirs or the civilians under their rule (or their supporters), at face value.
I would be the first to condemn whomever intentionally fired a white phosphorous round at children inside a school. I know it wasn't the case there, for various reasons (Israelis not being demonic murderers for one, abundance of military prosecutors control for another).
It could also be a faulty smoke munition with irregularly high concentration of phosphorous. Here's the consiliatory possibility for you.
The white phosphorous from Gaza occurred after the dual unilateral "ceasefire" – during which, quite a few Palestinians were fired upon, injured, died, including farmers picking parsley. Maybe they got the white phosphorous from supplies the IDF had left behind? I haven't heard of any more reports.
This 21 year old, mother of two, had recently died from her white phosphorous wounds, by the way.
dance –
1) pay attention. It's phosphorous-tipped smoke-producing munitions, not phosphorous incendiary bombs.
2) "5000 vs 237+245" your numbers are completely bogus. You should consider ditching whatever source fed you this misinformation FOR GOOD.
Total number of Israelis killed in the second intifada is over 1,000 (or just below, I don't recall seeing the exact number – some "propaganda" those "zionists" have, really!). There were also about 5,000 maimed in those attacks and explosions. And I do believe 5000 Arab casualties figure INCLUDES the GAZA casualties, because it was around 3500-4000 if I recall, prior to Gaza war.
And it is besides the point. Were a mob of 20 to attack a house and its owner would get out and kill 18 of them with his rifle, who's to blame for their deaths?
3) "were running" you mean your police, after wittnessing a murder, won't use FULL FORCE against the murderers if they ALREADY DID IT and are now RUNNING? Seriously?
You also ascribe much too much power to the "zionist soldiers". Could it be the case that they didn't have the SUPER-BINOCULARS and were just returning fire to the spot from where the mortar fire came? Wouldn't THAT be much more plausible explanation of what happened?
"abundance of military prosecutors control for another,". Is that why this report only took two weeks? And why B'Tselem said:
Circumstances point to the inadequacy of internal military investigations. The Military Advocate General only ordered the opening of an investigation by the Military Criminal Investigation Division following the publication of the Haaretz story, three weeks after the relevant materials reached the Chief of the General Staff. This tardiness follows a pattern of failures to investigate suspicions of serious crimes and illegitimate officer orders. Such partial investigation represents only a fraction of the necessary attention into this matter and raises suspicions that the norms of whitewashing serious crimes have spread across all ranks of the army?
B'Tselem are Israeli, you know, Arrgh, you can trust them.
"You mean like the jews could've planted zyklon b cannisters amongst themselves just to tar the Germans?"
they couldn't have, because there was no TV cameras around, and no-one were paying attention in the slightest. Unlike the situation for Palestinian Arabs with MASSIVE unquestioning support thay get from their Arab/Muslim brethren in half the world.
IOW there was no audience, and no means to reach it. But for HAMAS, there is a MASSIVE audience, and MASSIVE means to reach it.
It was also a one-off event, unlike the daily gassing of 10,000 new arrivals at Auschwitz and the other death factories.
Don't you remember the fake Jenin funerals where the dead walked? The stories of bombed-up hospital by a doctor sitting in his office in the same hospital, taped by a sympathetic TV crew?
Well, if you'd let foreign journalists and even Israeli journalist in, you wouldn't have had that problem, would you arrggghhh?
dance – "following the publication of the Haaretz story,"
don't you know this is now totally discredited as inventions based on hearsay and rumors, spread by ideologically motivated ultra-leftists soldiers who admitted this themselves after the formal investigation has been launched?
hah-hah-hah, arrgh, you're a real joker. It's a shame that I was able to read the news at the time, and see videos.
"B'Tselem are Israeli, you know, Arrgh, you can trust them."
no I can't, they are ultra-leftist ideologues that would sacrifice TRUTH for the political expidiency IN A JIFFY.
Next you'll say I can trust Avram Burg, that treacherous leech. Right.
and you don't trust your own soldiers. in fact, another Israeli had this to say: Gaza probe / Either troops are liars, or the IDF is pure as snow. What is it? Do your troops and journalist lie, or not?
if Israel would "let foreign journalists in" we'd have a host of another problems alltogether, what with all the fake reportings and staged fotoshoots like they produced from inside Hezbollah controlled territory without ever mentioning that fact for their unsuspecting audiences at home, would we? We'd have a flood of bogus "atrocities" reporting and since we both care for the truth it'd be a problem for us both, right, dance?
so read the news NOW dance, NOW, the news keeps coming. They were LIARS who spread RUMORS and ADMITTED as much.
Keep reading, or keep dreaming. Your choice.
lol, arrgh
Hamas planted the White Phosphorus? Where did they get it from? Israel or the US?
It's a war-crime to use White Phosphorus (whether it's tipped or not, which it wasn't) on Civilians – full stop. Any person with an ounce of logic knows that a UN School will contain civilians. The IDF knew exactly where ALL the UN Schools were, so there aren't any excuses for 'stray fire'.
As for your allegation about Hamas firing White Phosphorus onto Israel, please read the HRW report, which shows that after being asked, not a single person in Sderot could show the researchers where this 'phosphorus bomb' had landed.
Your arguments are getting more and more pathetic each time you post.
"and you don't trust your own soldiers."
what, there can't be an occasional LIAR amongst them? Heck, there can even be a murderor, or a rapist even. What, if they are Jews, they are supposed to be all angels?
Hmm, can't recall mentioning the word Zionist, once. Anyway, I'm off to bed.
What murder? Only 13 Israelis died in operation Cast Lead, and five of those in friendly fire. Were the alleged militants who were allegedly running, which allegedly caused the bombing of the school, the instigators of these murders?
I am not going to ditch B'Tselem. You might want to pay attention to them. They're Israeli, you know, well respected.
Why don't you have the exact number? Why don't you have sources?
What if a man fires on people praying in a mosque and kills 29 of them? Are those people within their rights to disarm him, and maybe even kill him? Should they then be tried for murder? Should the man who killed those praying be revered?
Anyway, you and I have distracted the conversation enough. I hope someone else takes the time out to talk to you.
"Where did they get it from?"
Could it be from Iran, who send them ammunitions regularly? Haven't you read the news of another outrageous Israeli attack, in Sudan, on the unsuspecting farmers driving around in military trucks near Egyptian border, bombed by those scary "Zionists"?
I'll try one more time.
…all belong in jail awaiting trial under US anti-terrorism laws, but all their material assets should also be seized.
Oh, that's harsh, Joachim. And is it really true? Unless they are culpable in more ways than just being bloggers, because -omens protect us- otherwise, you and I could be in the brig next.
"there aren't any excuses for 'stray fire'."
Really? In a war? No excuses for stray fire? ROTFLMAO
You really think Israelis are these super-powerful all-knowing creatures, do you. Might it be because they are the projection of your inner fears and dreams, not the real men and women that they are, in reality?
Do you really think there was no Temple on the Temple Mount but there was a mosque there? Do you really think Jesus was a Palestinian in the age when that land was called Iudea? Do you really believe that "Falastin is [y]our land and Jews are [y]our dogs"?
arrgh: so what – they're supposed to sit out on the streets in front of their houses, waiting for the armed gunmen, who would break into any house locked, to finish smashing their living quarters, wait for whomever to be taken away possibly for an indefinite period of time (ie ?forever?) for whatever reason, an action that would be explained as falling under the rubric of 'suspected of being an enemy of the state.' Or related to someone SoBaEofS, otherwise known as the state of being Palestinian.
Do you know anything about history? This is why Ed and others go on about Stalin.
This must be the stupidest thread yet on here, and I've seen a few. Anyone who is honest will admit that the IDF shelled civilians with phosphorus. Blanket shelling of civilian areas is normal behaviour for them, they did it to south Lebanon, with sub-munitions which are still blowing the legs off children and adults alike. they regard Arabs as vermin, that is not a matter which any honest person can dispute. We have seen it again and again, this mass murder of Arab civilians on their borders, using all sorts of weapons.