Tons of people have commented on Max Blumenthal's video from Jerusalem. It's about time that Adam Horowitz and I, who run this site, offer our views of the matter. My response is bound to be positive, because it created more traffic for this site than anything in our history (certainly anything I've posted!). That said, here is why his video is important journalism: because it reveals an essential component of Israeli and Zionist society that has largely been covered up.
You can argue about Blumenthal's method all night long. I won't be there for that argument. Is the video somewhat sensational? Of course. But the views expressed are shocking, and, while they are obviously cherrypicked, they are representative of a real current in Israeli society; and a journalist who is on to something important should have the freedom to highlight shocking stuff. That's how journalism works. You don't show readers your out-takes.
Does drunkenness matter? Not really. It didn't exonerate Mel Gibson. And as to the comparison to the frat boys that Sacha Baran Cohen set up on his bus in Borat, plying them with liquor, imagine if Cohen had been touring the south during the days of segregation and had produced such film, would anyone have objected? Of course not. Jim Crow needed to be explained by exploring the underlying racist attitudes. The cruel Israeli occupation, which is so utterly contemptuous of Palestinian existence, must also be explained; and these attitudes explain it.
As to the revelation, Americans have been in denial about Israel's character for decades now. Bob Simon pulled the veil back in his 60 Minutes report on the hateful occupation earlier this year; and of course Gaza demonstrated utter disdain for Palestinian life on the part of the Israeli military. Blumenthal has now done his part to show that murderous racism is a real current in Israeli society, and among the American Zionists who rally to Israel. The shocking quality of his video may be a rhetorical necessity: in bringing the news home to Americans in a way that so many reasonable blogposts have failed to do. Blumenthal may even be a game-changer.
The rage at the video is evidence of the denial about Israeli extremism that has pervaded the American discourse forever. I am reading Benny Morris's One State, Two State, published by Yale Press. It includes endless descriptions of Arab violence, Arab assassinations. The fact that a rightwing settler killed Yitzhak Rabin, amid a festival of threats toward Rabin from the right, is glossed; and while Chaim Arlosoroff, an early Zionist, is cited by Morris for his binationalism, the author declines to say that Arlosoroff was murdered by rightwing Zionists. As he fails to say that the Stern Gang took out UN negotiator Folke Bernadotte in 1948. Or that rightwingers killed Jacob de Haan, a Dutch anti-Zionist who met with Arabs.
So the murderous feelings in Blumenthal's video have a long pedigree.
A friend objected that these are kids from West Orange and Bethesda. I don't see the point. Zionism has always depended on Americans; and if you look at Netanyahu's braintrust, there are many Americans who were called to Israel: Ron Dermer, Dore Gold, and Michael Oren. And who are these Americans who are called to Israel? They are Americans who don't especially believe in minority rights, but like Oren, speak of the demographic threat that Arabs pose to the Jewish majority in Israel. They are Jewish nationalists.
That seems to me the largest point of the video. Who is Israel calling to in the age of Obama? To creeps. Watching this video, even I have sympathy for Israel. We're a long way from '67, when idealistic Jews were mobilized by Israel. Now it's purely the ethnocentric. A Jewish anti-Zionist friend of mine says he has a policy, No Jew left behind. He means that even as he opposes Israeli policies, he wants to look out for the Jews. I feel the same kind of tribal loyalty. Jews have made a terrible error in Israel by fostering racist policies; and it will require the vigorous efforts of enlightened American Jews to save them. Blumenthal's video is a wake-up call.
One of the news stories on HuffPo right now is about Daniel James Murray, a man who threatened to kill Obama. – http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/06/daniel-j... Of course he has been arrested, and Huff Po is covering the story. The American Zionists in the Blumenthal film who threatened to kill Obama will not be arrested. Neither will their views be known by readers of Huff Po.
It [ethnocentric and ethnocratic thinking] pervades Israeli society and its Zionist (Jewish or not) non-Israeli supporters. It may not be universal but it exists on a rather grand scale, you only need to put your goggles and armpit-high wellies on and wade into the far Right pro-Zionist blogosphere to get more than a whiff of it, IMHO. It comes with the territory: impossible to create a state that entirely favours entry by and citizenship for one exclusive group and systematically refuses that same right to another group, based on a false sense of 'ethnicity', without fostering racist attitudes. Add to the mix religious justifications about the 'Divine' right to the land, ideas of 'Chosen-ness' and you've got a potentially explosive racist cauldron. Israel is as bad for Jews as it is for Palestinians. If the clip caused a serious traffic spike to Mondoweiss, I can only hope some of these first-time visitors will drop by more often. US grassroots opinion on Israel/Palestine can be changed, if need be one man/woman at a time.
It is enlightening. I hope you see loud and clear the downsides of its publication. What comes of its publication? Do Jews change? Or do others generalize "Jews are like …."? The method of presentation IS important. It is the distinction between a respectable and insightful presentation, which obviously Dana and Blumenthal are capable of, and a more vicious one. If you've not met similar idiots among the left, among Palestinian solidarity, among paleo-conservatives, then you live an artificially sheltered life. "I didn't present them as typical" is not honest journalism.
Numbers and fame. Please see through it.
Witty, what Zios are always complaining about is 'balance' and 'even-handedness' [lack thereof] but how can any decent journalist or blogger be 'balanced' about a conflict situation where 95 % of culpability lies with one side of the belligerents?
I'll pay for you to take a writing course, Witty. You're posts will still be nonsense, but at least they'll be grammatically digestible nonsense.
Richard why aren't you preaching to your fellow Zionists about honest journalism, why are you preaching to us about it?
This is certainly the year that a lot of stereotypes have bitten the dust: of course the top of the list of broken prejudices is symbolized by our president, Barack Obama, the first person of known African descent to occupy the Oval Office and soon we will have the first Hispanic Supreme Court Justice. This is wonderful. But the destruction of other stereotypes, though they fill the observer with wonder are anything but wonderful. Max Blumenthal's little film "Feeling the Hate" has broken more stereotypes for me, personally, than the election of Barack Obama or the nomination of Sonia Sotomayor to the Supreme Court. The success of either Obama or Sotomayor is no surprise to me on racial or ethnic grounds, as I have never thought that the color of a person's skin or ethnic origin had any bearing on their ability to carry out the duties and responsibilities of high office. However, I also never thought I would ever hear Jewish people throw the word "nigger" around with such practiced aplomb as in this video. As a matter of fact, I don't ever remember seeing a Jewish person as drunk as those portrayed in Blumenthal's interviews in my whole life; in my youth it was proverbial that, "Jews don't drink": getting roaring drunk was something that was left to brutish, wife-beating, Polish peasants and to feral Russian Cossacks. So here, thanks to Mr. Blumenthal, we have a group of future "my son the doctor(s)" and Jewish Princesses, stumbling drunk, talking with the same disgusting bigotry as the Polish peasants and Russian Cossacks that used to rape their great grandmothers or the rednecks that spat on the Jewish Freedom riders in the 1960s or that lynched Leo Frank. To whom do we owe this transformation, this leveling? To the USA? To Israel?
YOUR posts. Jesus. I'm becoming illiterate by osmosis!
Mr. Witty, what would you consider to be 'honest journalism'?
Do you have any ideas what dishonest Zionist journalism in the U.S. and Western press has caused?
I think the best thing that could come from Max's video would be for a lot of Jewish parents to see it and decide that sending their kids to Israel is an astonishingly BAD idea.
Phil you are so right "been covered up" I have witnessed this type of rabid hatred and bigotry spewed from the mouths of Ohio State students who are Jewish and a rabid Rabbi at the third Palestinian solidarity conference at Ohio State some years ago. I was in shock as a Rabbi stood out of the conference building screaming "murderers murderers" at everyone walking into the conference. I politely invited the Rabbi into the conference and he picked up his megaphone and started screaming "murderer" he was insane. along with talking with a group of Jewish students who were as insane as this group about the Palestinians. have also had a friend Art Gish who has been to Israel 14 times and lived with Palestinians who are daily subject to this type of humiliation and violence. At the same time there are plenty of Jews who counter balance this bigotry. But this needs to be seen by the world
Seriously, Witty, you have no sense of balance. Like 98% of the U.S. media presents the I/P story almost exclusively from the Israeli perspective, treating Palestinians only as "terrorists" and anti-Semites. I don't see you lecturing the writers and producers of that content — the content that shapes mass opinion and, ultimately, public policy in this country — about "honest journalism." Nope. You just go after the very, very few voices who are open to considering the issue from the Palestinian perspective. For a man who shouts about balance and fairness here, you are a truly poor example of it.
What I am really afraid of is that one of these settlers, who is an American citizen, who can enter the US without any restriction, who can blend into an American crowd without being noticed as "foreign looking", who has had military training, will try to kill Obama the same way the killed Yitzak Rabin… Then the shit will really hit the fan.
I was very struck by the fact that both you, Phil, and JPost's Tori Cheifetz quote as first among responses the peculiarly named Ta-Nehisi Coates, writing for the the Atlantic magazine, who came up with a complete non-sequitur: I’ll show you Negroes claiming that God’s messenger lives in a space-ship orbiting the earth. Apart from the fact that the word 'Negro' is nowadays regarded as offfensive, which Coates presumably knows, there is no comparison between believing that "God’s messenger lives in a space-ship orbiting the earth," which is a completely harmless idea though pretty peculiar, and the sort of genocidal, racist rubbish that the Jews in Max's video were spouting — none whatever. The only link is an underlying contempt for Black people, which is evident both in Max's subjects and in Coates' supposed comparison, which isn't a comparison at all.
BTW. a few minutes ago I posted something that I had posted previously at TPM about "Feeling the Hate" and since then I cannot access this site from that browser. Am I being censored or is this just a glitch?
By the way, Zecharia Sitchin's "Annunaki" theories are almost the mirror image of the old Nation of Islam belief (or, possibly, leg-pull) to which Coates refers.
It's a glitch. I had the same experience after each comment I posted. For me, exiting the browser and re-opening gave me access again. I just downloaded Safari 4.0 and that solved the problem on my machine.
What you don't seem to understand is that Mondoweiss, along with a few other sources such as Helena Cobban's justworldnews.org, is the "balance" to the extremely off-balance, mindlessly pro-Israel viewpoint offered by the mainstream media.
My IP hasn't been blocked or anything, just the browser. The problem seems to be with my Mozilla SeaMonkey I restarted it, but the problem continues, I'll clean my cache and see what happens.
I experienced the problem again as I sent the above comment. My fix still worked, but it is a problem to be solved.
Ziocaine and alcohol is a particularly dangerous combination. The effects can be very destructive, especially combined with parental and contemporary approval.
RE: "What comes of its publication? Do Jews change? Or do others generalize "Jews are like …."?" If they don't change, "others" will eventually see beyond the golden status quo generalization fed the American public for- many decades– When's the last time you saw a negative portrayal of a script -identified Jewish character in the MSM, from Hollywood, or on any Cable TV or broadcast TV entertainment series show? Now, Witty, you don't want that do you?
OK. You know I'm appealing.
I purged Phil's cookie and the browser opened up fine.
The same thing happened when I tried to post the following: http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/d... Could we have some doctrine on this? What is happening? Is the post too long? Is it offensive?
richard witty takes exception to max blumenthal's video… """I didn't present them as typical" is not honest journalism."" according to some honest journalism rely on whether we're shown a photo of someones shoes on the desk while they're talking on the phone or not!
I published the following comment about "Feeling the Hate" on Mondoweiss's sister blog TPM Café: http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/d...
I still think the really serious problem here is an attempt on POTUS's life. If an Israeli wingnut was able to kill the prime minister of Israel and has received a lot of support in Israel for doing so, why should anyone think that an attempt on Obama would be out of the question. One of the drunk kids even says he would like to. OK so he is just a drunk kid, but there are a lot of settlers, who aren't drunk, but are very dangerous.
Nothing you say is principled Witty out of principle. There are some times when you make good points but it colludes with your tactics to equate the conflict and whitewash Israel's crimes. Furthermore, here you are lecturing Phil about presentation. Satire is a form of presentation. And it's quite obvious that Max's video was supposed to be satirical but truthful. Phil summed up the point of the video and why it matters: "That said, here is why his video is important journalism: because it reveals an essential component of Israeli and Zionist society that has largely been covered up." It's not about racism in and of itself. A lot of Jewish Zionists are going to say: 'Big deal Jews are racists? There are Palestinian and American racists too!' And that's blatant intellectual dishonesty – something you've come to symbolize on this blog. It's not simply about racism. It's about hypocrisy and sanctimony. We are not presented an honest perspective on the conflict and on the ME. We always hear about Arab this and Muslim that. So this video is revealing that, yes, Jews are racist too. However childish you may think the presentation was – it's backed up by studies done on the attitudes of Jewish Israelis versus Palestinians concerning 'the other'. And by and large, it's the Jewish Israelis who are more racist – which is quite astonishing. The Palestinians are the ones who are suffering much much more. They have been abandoned by the powerful governments of the world and even the Arab governments (puppet regimes). And this is representative of the suffering of Arabs in general. The Arab people in all those countries are voiceless. They are represented by corrupt family dictatorships and religious fanatics who are all supported by the West. We know about all this. Yet, we're told Egypt and Jordan are 'moderate' Arab States. This is not unique to the Middle East. Jewish Zionists like to debate this conflict like it's entirely unique, but the US did the same stuff in Latin America. Really, who fucking cares about Radical Islam. Zionists just talk about the religious component to mystify the conflict and add an exotic appeal to what's happening to attract the fucking legions of retards who will support the white/European 'side' as opposed to 'the savages'. This is about imperial racism. I mean, we're sitting here debating what rights the Palestinians have about this and that. It's ALL their land. They are not immigrants. They were the majority. Israel had to dispossess 800,000 of them to set the tone for what happened later. And the Arab world was already subject to divide and conquer tactics by the Imperial powers so it's not like the Palestinians ever stood a chance. So the video is about the juxtaposition of 'Jews being racist' to the presentation of 'the Jews' that we see in everyday America versus the presentation of 'the Arabs'. That's the OBVIOUS context. It's about REVEALING racism within the Jewish community.
Thanks, Bruce. I just did the same. I hope it works.
Incitement: the new 'non-issue' issue for Zionism Eric Fingerhut, of the JTA has his finger on the button of the "most serious issue":
These things really do get published in Jewish pro-Zionist publications. Now wonder they end up with their heads so far up their arses…
If I understand you correctly, and you can't access Phil's site. It's a feature I encounter occasionally, one of the problems it feels may be connected with the new intensedebate software. since then I cannot access this site from that browser. You mean the connection is shut down? If it is only the connection to Phil's site, I have that too occasionally. http://blog.intensedebate.com/2009/04/ … I’m sure you’re all aware of our outages over the last few weeks. We’ve been working non-stop to address these issues. Our highest priority is improving the performance and long term scalability of IntenseDebate for you ************************************************************************************************ My problem is I can't update more than I already have.
Given that the overwhelming majority of Jews in this country, even on the Left, are Zionists, then basically from Left to Right the vast majority of American Jews are essentially Jewish supremacists advocating institutionalization of their beliefs, and always have been. In this context, and the context of murderous Jewish Bolshevism, the question then must be asked: Is this supremacy only inherent in Zionism, or is it essentially inherent in the Jewish race and religion, as many Jews and Leftists have argued supremacy was/is inherent in whites and Christians, and thus shaped their doctrine and policies accordingly? What would be the consequences of this for self-identifying Jews like Weiss and Blumenthal, who want to cling to their Jewish identity?
Zionists are upset with the video because they prefer to be on the attack and not of the defense. Take a look at the last paragraph of Origins: Zionist Gay Pubic Diplomacy.
Why has Max & Dana's video become such a big deal? I suspect it's partly timing and the broader political context. But few commentators have pointed out what to me is utterly striking about Max's videos – and why I like using them on my website. They are beautifully produced and very funny. Actually, I thought the vid that Max did in NYC during the Gaza assault was every bit as powerful – in some ways more so – because the participants weren't frunk and included quite prominent politicians. It was also very amusing. See http://sydwalker.info/blog/2009/01/16/persecuted-... Keep up this standard guys – and the world will keep watching. Everyone likes a laugh – and seeing how riduculous one can look through the eyes of others is a powerful motivator to Change.
Actually, what we're seeing is the phenomenon of what bloggers are now calling "Semitic-supremacy." In this particular world view, Palestinians and Arabs are sub-human, and American goyim are powerless cattle whose taxpayer dollars are diverted to fund an apartheid state that shocks the conscience. 350,000 hits in five days, even as it is censored by HuffPo, dailyKos and its "honors" are suppressed by YouTube administrators. The comments section on YouTube is often disturbing, but equally revealing in its vitriol for all things Zionist. Typical quote: "Why do we give these skinheads $3 billion a year when the quadrapelegic American soldiers injured in the name of Dougie Feith's 'Clean Break' can't even get enough money for a wheelchair??" Why, indeed.
It's really interesting that white supremacists like David Duke and, apparently, the geezer who just shot two guys at the DC Holocaust Museum, and the the entitled American brats in Blumenthal's video, both claim "white power." It's fun to watch these people. James Von Braun expressed anti-semitic views in the past. He once carried a shotgun into the Federal Reserve HQ in DC. Nothing like the feeling of being chosen by birth, whatever the flavor. Maybe blonde girls should just rule the world since they are always the most worshiped around the world. I'm not saying this makes sense–ask one of those frat rats in Blumenthal's video, how do you differ from the Nazis? Since they grew up in the USA, I don't think education will do it.
My new theory is that Adam and Phil have made up the character of Richard Witty to keep the dialogue on the comment boards compelling. Kinda like how Bibi needs a stalking horse like Ahmedinejad (sp.) to divert attention from the pogrom being inflicted on the Palestinians.
They need to stay home and continue to beat me at chess.
Ed . . . be careful here, man. Jewish identity is being reconsidered in America by progressive Jews who are being intellectually honest and self-soul-searching. There is a rejection of Zionism as part of the identity of American Jews, and Gentiles really have no place focusing on that. We need to join the like-minded progressives seeking to destroy the Apartheid in Palestine by any means possible. It's not a Jewish thing, it's a Zionist thing. My best friends and colleagues are Jewish — my adversaries politically and morally are Zionists taking MY tax dollars and oppressing Palestinians.
I hope the Mossad & co are very keen to preserve Obama's good health. Even a false flag op – in which blame is instantly pinned on Arabs / Muslims (as on 9-11) – would have no credibility this time for many, many people. This is not 1963. It's 46 years on. This time round, a lot of people are watching Obama's back. If – God forbid – Obama is attacked, israeli black ops would be the first thought to spring to many minds – not the last.
Subsidies Not Aid: Israel: A Giant Ponzi Scheme
Funny you should suggest that. I thought of that myself – witty is too good to be true: a perfect stereotype: the long time israel loving american new york jew, the son in chabad, the nature of the comments themselves – always asking for balance, reminding us of evil-doing arabs, the just aggrevating enough to hook, not enough to ban, and of course, the ubiquitous keen interest in all thing Phil. Putting it another way: if they did not invent the wit, they should have. If so, it is quite witty (just look at all the comments he generates – impossible not to reach fro the typepad).
Sorry David, but I'm so sick of people saying 'drunken kids'. Hey! they're at a bar for godssakes. What is the drinking age in Israel that these so called 'kids' are drinking to excess in public like that? They are NOT kids! It's amazing how many different arguements racists will come up with to defend those disgusting haters.
"We're a long way from '67, when idealistic Jews were mobilized by Israel. Now it's purely the ethnocentric. " That sounds suspiciously like the liberal Zionist myth that Israel transmogrified in 1967 from a formerly lovely, peace-lovng country filled with lovely, kind, peace-loving people who thought only pure thoughts and did pure only deeds into an aggressive, racist bully bent on conquest and land acquisition. Nonsense. Zionism is by definition ethnocentric. From the very beginning, starting with Herzl, Zionists have understood clearly that removing the non-Jewish portion of the existing population – aka ethnic cleansing – would be necessary to the creation and maintenance of a viable Jewish state. As we know they have been ruthless in this endeavor from the very beginning. To believe that Zionism was ever anything but ethnocentric or that Israel has ever been anything but an ethnocracy is delusional.
"… imagine if Cohen had been touring the south during the days of segregation and had produced such film, would anyone have objected? Of course not. Jim Crow needed to be explained by exploring the underlying racist attitudes." "Watching this video, even I have sympathy for Israel. We're a long way from '67, when idealistic Jews were mobilized by Israel. Now it's purely the ethnocentric." Talk about hypocrisy and spin. Jim Crow was due to the underlying racism of Southerners, while prior to '67 Jews were idealistic, and had no idea what it took to expel people from land and keep them off! Nope, there's no strain of racism and bigotry flowing from the tribalism of American Jews. All the Israeli violence, dispossession, and hatred bought with American Jewish money and influence is the result of a small number of Jewish Zionists who are both blacksheep within the Jewish community and sockpuppets of the massive and powerful Christian Zionist community. Is that the official story that's emerging?
Well said.
It is very necessary, for some reason, for Ed to believe there is some inherent, congenital, defect in Jews which makes them unfit for civilisation. Ed also believes we need more Christian religion in American government. And Ed also believes that Mel Gibson shows "reverence for the Cross! But don't say anything bad to Ed, cause he has an army of his own, called "the rest of us" and they will get ya! It's straight Linbergh type social anti-semitism and isolationism, right out of the thirties through the fifties. It's hilarious, but Ed will fight it out on those lines all day.
After looking at primary sources for about 30 years, I can fairly say that Ethnic Ashkenazim really were not so different from other Eastern Europeans except that they were more skilled at corrupt social networking for a profit and at propagandizing on their own behalf.
One of the most unnerving things for me about the video, something that I expected was the case as I was watching it and which was later confirmed by both (I believe) Blumenthal and Dana, was that many of the interviewees were on Birthright tours. I don't know a whole lot about the Birthright program, but I imagine one of its goals is to foster more young Jewish immigration to Israel. It follows then that these young men and women who were on Birthright tours, who obviously had to go through an interview and vetting process and pass a litmus test, "made the cut", so to speak. Either their racist tendencies didn't surface during any part of that process, nothing in the process was designed to make any of those feelings come to the surface, or both of those conditions DID happen, but it didn't matter to the administrative bodies involved. Regardless of which of those three failures (or successes, depending on your point of view and that of the Birthright administration) occurred, I think the Birthright tour aspect of this video needs to be further examined for the benefit of educational institutions and parents here in the States, and obviously for the well-being of Palestine and Israel above all else.
Except that they didn't do it in fact. The population of Israel is 20% non-Jewish, mostly Arab. Whereas the population of the West Bank when Jordan controlled it was .05% Jewish. Its still in that percentage (except for the Jewish solidarity activists) if you disregard the settlement population.
I think that it feels good for certain races to, dare I say it, 'cling' to religion. It connects a small group that share the same values and common purpose. Granfalloon (from Bokonism) is another way of saying it; a common purpose with imaginary connections to each other. If I'm in a room with total strangers, do I have greater connection to a Asians because I'm Korean? What's fascinating about Jews in the world, is their belief that Israel has always been their land.They (many) work toward developing greater Israel through the Diaspora networks that help in part to occupy more territory. It's like Israel is a great statue to worship and they all bow to it whenever they believe it's in jeopardy. At some point the statue is too big and is in danger of collapse, which is what's happening now.
HuffPo headline right now: "WHITE SUPREMACIST OPENS FIRE AT HOLOCAUST MUSEUM." Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Especially the "White Supremacist" part. (Unless someone is trying to specifically thwart allegations made by the American kids in Max's video.) White Supremacist web sites have had a love affair with Avigdor Lieberman since he came to power. Lieberman was their man in the run-up to the February elections. Ditto the Dutch right-winger anti-Muslim guy. Another false flag? And security is that lax at the museum? This smells like a five-day-old tuna to me.
the inference in philip weiss's post that chaim arlosoroff was assassinated for his binationalist ideas, may have been accidental, but it's certainly not true. though the right wing continues to deny responsibility, those that attribute responsibility to the israeli right wingers do so based on arlosoroff's involvement in negotiating the ha'avara agreement with the nazis. the max blumenthal tape has become a phenomenom, so who can deny that which the public has viewed on youtube. the right wing jews are uglier than the british chick who came in second on their version of american idol, and they can't sing. yet comparing them to drunk mel gibson is a little outlandish. gibson is a celebrity caught driving drunk mouthing off in a police car. barack obama, president of the united states, has just changed policy from the previous administration. the sober will know how to couch their anger in diplomatic terms. the drunk will not. if one supports the settlements, anger is the appropriate reaction. epithets and threats are not.
Jim Crow isn't even in the same league with the violence, inhumanity and terror that American Jews have sponsored abroad. But the view that Israeli and American Jewish racism, violence and bigotry is somehow idealism gone wrong, while other groups are just inherently bad, and their "crimes" are rooted in pure evil and ignorance, is laughable. Yep, Jewish Americans are completely innocent as long as their racism, violence and bigotry are projected abroad through a loyalty to a foreign nation–or towards the acceptable groups at home. Am I reading this right?
He oscillates between more blunt and more masked comments. self-identifying Jews like Weiss and Blumenthal, who want to cling to their Jewish identity? He forgot Adam. Yes, both threatening, "we will get ya!, and in its more blunt face amazingly stupid too: Is this supremacy only inherent in Zionism, or is it essentially inherent in the Jewish race and religion, as many Jews and Leftists have argued supremacy was/is inherent in whites and Christians, and thus shaped their doctrine and policies accordingly?
I guess the 88 year old nut who did the shooting wasn't following the party line, but rather was convinced of his own philosophy. smells like an 88 year old nut.
I checked out this guy's website (it's been taken down) with archive.org. He sounds well and truly insane, and spent time in prison for trying to make a "nonviolent citizen's arrest" (with guns) of the FED Board of Governers. He was definitely a white supremacist, but any of the organized groups would have to be nuts to want to associate with someone like him. It sounds like he was a crazy "lone wolf," but of course this will be used to smear anyone on the right. It sounds like he was stopped by the guard (who returned fire), but the guard was fatally wounded in the process.
RE: "Jews have made a terrible error in Israel by fostering racist policies." MY COMMENT: I hope it's not too late. I fear that the die may have already been cast. Remember "Operation Cast Lead"?
it's all good. The hasbarites have been piping up and testing the righteous with their infantile cavils as never before. Submerge your own egos gentle people, have at 'em!
My soft misgivings about the "Jewish" State(What is a "Jewish" state, anyways?) have hardened into adamant.. How obnoxious is Israel! The "Jewish" State can't even abide by the Jewish law! Losers.
I agree, it is the racist Zionist ideology that must be rejected..Not all Jews are Zionists and not all Zionists are Jews…Jewish identity is not monolithic, just as Muslim, Christian identity is not monolithic. Every individual actually forms their own identity within their faith based on their individual interpretation of it…
So Witty, too bad the Zionists couldn't finish purifying the land they took because of being dependent on the USA, hence the need for PR and doing it slowly by stealth, settlement by settlement?
Yeah, having to purify by stealth, settlement by settlement, is a bitch, not to mention the need for constant PR–that's the cost of being dependent on the one super power.
yonahred You are completely wrong about Chaim Arlosoroff and Phil Weiss is correct. Edwin Black in his 1984 edition of The Transfer Agreement discusses this on pages 146-153, 162, 288, 204, 296.
He was killed on the beach by two men whom Arlosoroff identified earlier to his wife on the beach as safe because they were Jews. After they shot him and his wife Sima cried out that Jews shot him, Arlosoroff told her not to say that. Edwin Black cites Zionist Organization minutes for the binational complaints against Arlosoroff.
Max Blumenthal's video is important because Zionism has to be exposed to the light for the project it is. For 80 years or more it has been promoted in the West by respectable people in well cut suits and in Palestine by thugs with guns. The disconnect is understood fully by anyone who has ever been at a West Bank checkpoint. Operation Cast Lead brought the phenomenon more clearly into focus. Hasbara needs compliant editors and sympathetic politicians to work. It's very weak on video, live.
It seems like you are reacting negatively because the video attracted so much attention. Although the video is damaging, this is how 'Youtube' phenomenon's work. If these were skinheads in Germany from America, saying the same exact things (less the Israeli parts) It would receive a lot of attention. This video shows exemplifies the cracks in the media narrative of Jewish people. Because they are Jewish, it is more appalling since we never hear Jewish racism, as you might expect it from a group of skinheads..
Devil's advocate here… Isn't it an absurd statement that the way journalism works is that journalists "have the freedom to highlight shocking stuff" when they are "onto something?" It just seems that's how rationalization and self-justification work, not journalism. There's a difference between the two.
Shortly before his death, not only had Arlosoroff renounced binationality and negotiation with the Palestinians, but he was publicly advocating a Jewish dictatorship over Palestine. By the time Arlosoroff was murdered, there were so many groups that had reason to kill him that the case will probably remain one of the great historical mysteries. He is the list off the top of my head: Jabotinskian Zionists, Labor Zionists, various Palestinian groups, Magda Goebbels, Josef Goebbels, the NSDAP, Sima Arlosoroff, and an assortment of former lovers and spouses, But keep in mind he could simply have been killed by criminals with no political or revenge motives.
Did it trouble you that the people shown in Blumenthal's video, many of whom were apparently American, showed more far loyalty to Israel than they did the United States?
Ain't that the truth? Three years ago I considered sending my son on one of those trips. My wife was against it then. Recently she changed her mind and now wanted to send him. But having learned so much about Israel in the meantime, i said, no way.
It wans't just their casual bigotry that disgusted me. It was their astonishing sense of entitlement and, for the American born ones, their total lack of loyalty to America.
i suppose you feel (think) that martin buber and judah magnes were not zionists.
Well, I need to correct my own record. I finally watched the cable news about this guy. I hadn't realized that he banged on the door, the guard answered and he shot him. I thought he saddled through security, which is what I heard initially. I shouldn't have jumped the gun. I should have checked the facts. I didn't I apologize. I still dont understand how some guy under surveillance since 1981 and viewed as a threat could buy a rifle.
Well, I can certainly understand why you wouldn't want non members of the tribe to see the sense of entitlement and disloyalty to America shown by these young people.
I suppose you feel (think) that martin buber and judah magnes were not zionists (yonahred) I don't know whether Shirin thinks that, but I think that they were, in terms of results, just liberal stage props for people like you to use, irrelevantly, to obscure reality.
I was with you, Phil, until almost the end when you wrote "Jews have made a terrible error in Israel by fostering racist policies…." It isn't that I disagree about the "error" part, it is at least that, but that it is something that had to be fostered. There is more than enough in Torah (especially Deuteronomy and Judges) extolling the slaughter of people whose only "crime" <sic.> was in trying to find a different understanding of the cosmos. The people in the film, and as you pointed out a major chunk of Israeli society, secular or religious, are really just updating Deuteronomy and applying it to the Jewish state of today. So maybe it isn't an aberration, or even a poor choice, but something intrinsic not in Jews as a people but in the culture IF there is a Jewish state at all, anywhere or anywhen….Someone on another site wrote that as long as enough Jews really do feel that they are a chosen people, then everyone else is only fit to be chopped liver….
Jewish author renounces Judaism over racist Video of … DANNY BLOOM BLOGS: "This is such a disgusting video, as a Jewish American man, 60, i am deeply ashamed of these young men and women in the video, and because of this video I am renouncing my Judaism today – publicly. … http://northwardho.blogspot.com/2009/06/jewish-au...
Blumenthal's video is a wake-up call.
http://www.rantrave.com/Rant/The-Ugly-Sick-Racist... What a shame. The world Jewish community should be very ashamed of that video and of those young Jewish American kids. A sad day in Jewish history. I protest! DANNY BLOOM BLOGS: "This is such a disgusting video, as a Jewish American man, 60, i am deeply ashamed of these young men and women in the video, and because of this video I am renouncing my Judaism today – publicly. Not that anyone reads my blogs, but here it is. I will never again call myself a Jew. This was a very sad day in modern Jewish life, and the makers and distributors of the video should be ashamed of themselves. Oi."