Yesterday, Tuesday, April 13th, the Government of Israel demolished 3 homes and served many home demolition orders in the unrecognized village of El-Araqib. The government is coveting the lands of this village and lately has staged a major attack on the residents of this village to forcefully take the lands: the JNF (Jewish National Fund) is planting a forest on these lands; the residents are forced to come to the courts to defend their ownership of the lands, in a legal system that does not recognize any papers prior to the existence of the state; and the home are being demolished. The homes demolished yesterday have been demolished twice before in the past two months.
The government yesterday also razed to the ground all the homes and tents of the village of Twail abu-Jarwal. For these villagers – it is the 40th time that they have had to experience their entire village being demolished in the last couple of years. One wonders, is it not time to change tactics? The police and the inspectors also emptied out the water containers and attempted to bury them – leaving both humans and animals without water. One of the young men from the village asked: Did they also have a "spill water" court order?
Below, left, are photographs of the water containers at Twail abu-Jarwal. Apparently the villagers were reduced to storing water in this manner after their water tank, at right, was destroyed some years ago. For Jews reading this post: These actions are being done in your name.
RE: “What a sleek, modern ethnic-cleansing operation looks like” – Weiss
Just 24 hours to make history
From: Jewish Voice for Peace (info@jewishvoiceforpeace.org)
Sent: Tue 4/13/10 7:44 PM
Join JVP, Archbishop Desmond Tutu, Noam Chomsky, Naomi Klein, Judith Butler, and Bibi Netanyahu’s sister-in-law, Ofra Ben Artzi, as well as Israeli peace groups like the Shministim, Gush Shalom, and the Coalition of Women for Peace and help make history at the University of California at Berkeley by sending a letter of support for divestment now.
On March 18, UC Berkeley’s student senate voted 16 to 4 to divest from General Electric and United Technologies because of their role in harming civilians as part of Israel’s illegal occupation and the attack on Gaza.
A week later, the Senate president vetoed the bill despite a massive outpouring of support for divestment.
But the final decision will be made tomorrow, Wednesday April 14 at 7pm PST, when the veto can be overturned with just 14 votes.
The bill’s opponents have been waging a fierce campaign of misinformation, including a closed door meeting with the Israeli Consulate General where student senators were actually told that massive Jewish criticism of Israeli human rights violations is a cultural pathology. The senators have also been flooded with letters and we’ve now heard that Alan Dershowitz may be on campus.
That’s why we’re asking you to email the UC Berkeley senators to let them know why you support divestment and why they should overturn the veto.
TO SEND E-MAILS – link to salsa.democracyinaction.org
For Jews reading this post, every country has had a huge problem dealing with nomadic populations. Israel is trying to convince these populations to trade their life style for permanent residence, not always successfully. The Negev is half of Israel’s territory and it is just not feasible for Israel to accept that the Bedouins own it especially since even in Ottoman times they rarely had legal ownership of the land. Yes, they have been there before Israel was created, but a modern state cannot accommodate the ultra sparse nomadic life style. Imagine that 2% of the population claimed half the US territory because historically their tribes roamed that area.
Of course Israel has made mistakes in handling the Negev Bedouins. Nobody denies that. But the demolitions highlighted here are not a mistake. Israel has prepared several towns for the Bedouins and they just can’t set up a village wherever they like. They need to move to these towns. Yes, it means changing their life style but there is no other choice. Growing goats and sheep in the desert requires a huge amount of land per person and Israel is a very crowded country.
Preserve rational discourse at this site. Ignore trolls.
I agree, potsherd, but disinformation must be countered.
From the Human Rights Watch report Off the Map: Land and Housing Rights Violations in Israel’s Unrecognized Bedouin Villages (March 2008)
Thank you, Shmuel, for your constant efforts to give readers here the facts, and your courageous objectivity. Speaking in behalf the American non-Jews ( I know, I’m indulging myself) who come here on this blog regularly, your every comment reminds us all Jews are not like eee (or any of his AKA’s, or like Dicky Witty). You are a blessing.
I myself don’t really know what it took for you to move from Israel to live in Italy, and now, for you to put up with Italy as well. And you write here, talking to many Americans, both Jews and non-Jews. You take a chance, always, that truth is of some import. I think the world of you–purely from your comments. I am not young, nor am I uneducated academically. I’ve been totally on my own since I turned 18, born here in the USA during WW2. From that perspective, I say, you are a wonderful and valuable man. PS:
Your family or you arrived in Israel from where, and when? My family came from Ireland and Germany to the USA.
I have been trying, unsuccessfully, to post another excerpt from the HRW report, on the subject of “individual farms” (pp.33ff. in the report). Israeli policies regarding the illegal allocation and development of these huge tracts of land, for Jews only, belie all of the excuses regarding the Bedouin.
Thanks, Shmuel. This is an even more fact filled and thorough refutation than I posted below.
Let me re-highlight a few points, to further demolish eee’s misinformation:
Meanwhile, even though some of the more than one hundred existing Jewish rural communities in the Negev sit half empty, the government is developing new ones.
…..
The state has allocated vast land tracts almost exclusively to individual Jewish families and fenced off the land at government expense in a bid to “preserve state land.”
…..
The state is not concerned about too few individuals having control over too much land. They are only restricting the Bedouins. This is what a state set up to benefit one group of its citizens to the detriment of all others looks like.
Thanks very much, Citizen. My family moved to Israel from Canada, with roots and branches in Poland, Lithuania, Belarus and the United States. My wife’s family has roots in Italy and Libya.
Thanks yet again, Shmuel. I also admire your ability to respond to the trolls with calm, reasoned facts, instead of descending to the same nastiness.
I think we need to remember that Mondoweiss gets many more visitors than commenters, and I would bet that many of the visitors are either young or just starting to search for an alternate point of view on Israel/Palestine. The trolls want to provoke us into throwing around words like “fascist” or using street-corner profanity instead of presenting the facts, thereby poisoning the atmosphere and causing the visitors to leave in disgust.
We are not trying to convince the trolls. We are trying to offer information and a point of view that has been hidden or suppressed in mainstream discourse to those thousands of visitors who never show up in the comments section — and you, and others, are showing the way.
Some day, I hope to salute you in person if I pass through Italy.
Thanks, James. Please looks me up if/when you get to Rome. It would be a pleasure to meet you.
“your every comment reminds us all Jews are not like eee (or any of his AKA’s, or like Dicky Witty).”
It’s only right that I add to that comforting statement by mentioning that not all Jews are like me, either. Now the Gentiles can breath easy.
Here is an objective overview of the Bedouins in Israel.
The Bedouin in Israel
by Dr. Yosef Ben-David
Israel’s Bedouin citizens – a minority within the Arab minority – have in recent years received increased attention, both from the media and from government institutions.
The process of integrating the Bedouin into Israeli society takes place on two levels – the formal, i.e., by government policy; and the informal, i.e., by changing relationships with Israeli society in general and Jewish society in particular.
The process, as may be expected, is fraught with “natural” difficulties experienced by this cultural group:
the transition from a traditional, conservative society which only a generation ago was nomadic, entails relinquishing values, customs and a traditional economy;
the Bedouin have to cope with the process of urbanization – the very antithesis of their nomadic tradition – and the attending poverty and crime rate;
the Bedouin to some extent fail to distinguish between objective difficulties and those connected with their changing sub-culture and thus feel an exaggerated sense of deprivation.
Yet a comparison of the situation of the Bedouin in Israel to that in Arab countries will show that Israeli Bedouin enjoy conditions that their brethren lack, mainly in two areas: welfare and land ownership.
Israel’s attitude towards its Bedouin citizens has always been positive. Well aware of the difficulties of the Bedouin and based on a thorough knowledge of the subject, the last two governments have begun taking steps to solve the problems with unprecedented determination and allocation of the necessary funds.
A Ministerial Committee for the Advancement of Bedouin Affairs, comprising ten government ministers has been set up and, over the next four to five years, billions of NIS will be allotted for the implementation of the new programs. The Minister of National Infrastructure, who is responsible for construction and housing as well as for the Israel Lands Administration, has been empowered to negotiate with the Bedouin regarding land rights and has adopted a policy of a “once-and-for-all” solution to those problems.
Demography
The Bedouin population in Israel currently numbers 170,000 persons, living in the following regions:
some 110,000 in the Negev
some 10,000 in the central region
some 50,000 in the north
The Bedouin population has increased tenfold since the establishment of the State (1948), due to a high natural increase – about 5% – which is unparalleled in Israel, or elsewhere in the Middle East. A high fertility rate related to traditional social values regarding size of family and/or tribe as a political advantage, as well as modern health and medical services with easy access, which reduced infant mortality and increased life expectancy, are responsible for this figure.
Education
More than anything else, education can contribute to the integration of the Bedouin into Israeli society. Under the Compulsory Education Law, every Bedouin child is entitled to twelve years of free education and the law is very strictly enforced, at least at the elementary school level. Three factors enhanced implementation: an awareness of the necessity and the benefits of an education as an economic and social-mobility tool; the idleness of children and youngsters in the wake of moving to permanent settlements (they had been the main labor force tending the fields and the livestock); and the establishment of a relatively large number of schools in the scattered locations of the Bedouin.
Within a single generation, the Bedouin of Israel have succeeded in reducing illiteracy from 95% to 25%; those still illiterate are aged 55 and above.
Thirty to fifty percent of the students in elementary schools (depending on location) go on to high school, a ratio similar to that elsewhere in the country’s Arab sector. They attend Bedouin high schools in the Negev and Arab high schools in the central and northern regions of the country.
Some 650 Bedouin – 30% of the Bedouin high school graduates of 1998 – are enrolled at present in post-secondary education. About 60 percent of them attend teacher training colleges and 40 percent study at the universities (including the Technological College of Be’er Sheva). In addition, 35 students are enrolled in universities abroad, since they did not qualify for admission to Israeli institutions; the universities now tend to ease admission standards for Bedouin students.
Health Services
The National Health Insurance Law (NHIL) which took effect on
January 1, 1996 considerably improved health services for about 30% of the Bedouin population who had not belonged to a sick fund. According to the NHIL, every resident is entitled to a basket of health services provided by clinics, specialists and hospitals.
Mother-and-child care centers provide health education, check-ups monitoring development and immunization. Today, hardly any Bedouin women give birth at home; going to hospital makes the mother eligible for a grant from the National Insurance Institute and provides unaccustomed pampering.
The Bedouin in the Negev
Most of the Bedouin tribes in the Negev hail from the Hejaz, a region in the north of the Arabian peninsula.
Education: At present there are 33 elementary schools, three high schools and three vocational schools for the Bedouin community in the Negev. At the elementary level, with an enrollment of 95%, the school population is made up of equal proportions of boys and girls. But because Bedouin society regards females as inferior and does not encourage them to study, girls make up no more than 10% of the pupils in high schools. At first many teachers had to be brought in from outside the community, today 60 percent of the teaching staff is Bedouin.
All the Bedouin high schools and 60% of the elementary schools in the Negev, are located in the seven Bedouin towns there. Over the past five years, extensive resources have been invested in schools, especially in buildings, services, water pipes, heating and more. Computers and laboratories have also been introduced.
Health: There are clinics in all seven Bedouin towns in the Negev (in Rahat, proclaimed a city in 1994, there are four clinics and a day-hospital). The medical staff includes Jews and Arabs; fifteen of them are Bedouin doctors. Most of the Bedouin living outside the towns can reach the clinics easily; in the more outlying areas, several mobile clinics provide services in the mornings.
A total of 12 clinics provide services in the Negev at present (one clinic per 6000 persons); another 10 clinics are in various stages of establishment. Hospital facilities are available in Be’er Sheva. If a gap still exists between health services in the rest of the country and in the Bedouin towns, it relates more to the physical domain than to the level of medicine.
Land Rights: In most countries in the Middle East the Bedouin have no land rights, only users’ privileges. Israeli Law is derived largely from Mandatory (British) law which in turn incorporated much Ottoman law. Under Israeli law, a person who has not registered his/her land in the Land Registry cannot claim ownership; but in the mid 1970s Israel let the Negev Bedouin register their land claims and issued certificates as to the size of the tracts claimed. These certificates served as the basis for the “right of possession” later granted by the government. Following the signing of the Treaty of Peace with Egypt, it became necessary to move an airport to a locality inhabited by 5000 Bedouin. The government, recognizing these land claim certificates, negotiated with the certificate holders and paid compensation to them. Most moved to Bedouin townships, built houses and established businesses.
In recent years the Ministerial Committee for the Advancement of Bedouin Affairs has undertaken to solve the problem of land ownership and has been assured of the necessary funds. The government is willing to leave some 20% of the land claimed in Bedouin possession and to compensate them for the remainder. In the past, tensions relating to land ownership have led to violence. A solution is now possible, but it requires the willingness and goodwill of both partners.
Two kinds of land offenses make media headlines: illegal building and grazing in protected areas:
Illegal building. Tents and light structures (shacks and huts) built illegally are treated forgivingly. But construction of houses of stone or concrete without a building permit is considered an offense, since adequate infrastructure and services cannot be provided. Some 2,000 such locations with buildings already exist, scattered over an area of about 1,000 square kilometers.
Grazing in protected areas. Most of the livestock of the Bedouin in the Negev who keep flocks of sheep and goats are registered and approved by the Ministry of Agriculture, which provides pasture land outside the Negev for six to seven months of the year, since the carrying capacity of the Negev is limited. Owners who, for reasons of tax evasion, have not registered their livestock and do not receive Ministry of Agriculture services, frequently trespass on nature reserves or populated areas. They are liable to be punished under the law.
Permanent locations: The establishment of permanent towns did not begin until the Bedouin themselves constructed buildings to replace tents. But the urbanization process is by no means simple, as the planners have to deal with issues involving tradition and social structure and the Bedouin themselves have difficulty in articulating their wishes in planning terms.
The first Bedouin town, Tel Sheva, was founded in 1967. Here all possible mistakes were made, both by the planners and by government officials. Since then another six towns have been established in the Negev and an effort was made to learn from each previous experience. But the planning concept focused on urban settlement, while many Bedouin wanted to live in rural localities. Today there are plans to found such rural localities and it is hoped that they will satisfy the traditional aspirations of the Bedouin.
The Bedouin urban population in the Negev (1998)
Rahat
28,000
Tel Sheva
7,000
Aro’er
6,200
Keseifa
5,500
Segev Shalom
2,600
Hura
2,400
Lakiya
1,500
Total
53,200
The total Bedouin population of the Negev is about 110,000, which means that about 57,000 are still scattered in outlying areas. It will be Israel’s task in the near future, to solve, together with the Bedouin, the problems of their settlement in towns and rural communities.
Livelihood: The desire of about 30% of the Bedouin in the Negev to retain traditional occupations – the raising of livestock and dry farming – as a source of primary or additional income, causes them to seek pasture land, the supply of which is decreasing due to development and increased quantities of livestock. Given the arid conditions of the Negev, the government, though increasing quotas from time to time, providing veterinary services and refraining from the importation of mutton, must limit pasture land. This is at times depicted in the media as cruel, and the Bedouin as victims of high-handedness.
Other sources of livelihood are:
1. Thirty percent of the Bedouin in the Negev have permanent jobs (in factories, government services etc.).
2. A similar percentage of unskilled workers cannot obtain permanent jobs and they are the immediate victims when recession and unemployment strike. The National Insurance Law guarantees minimal income to the unemployed, the elderly, the disabled or ill and to orphans and widows.
3. In private enterprise: they have succeeded to capture three niches in which neither Jews nor Arabs compete (providing income to an estimated 25% of the population): as agricultural contractors with modern mechanical equipment; as owners of trucks, utility vehicles, buses and cabs, or as salaried employees of transportation companies; and as contractors for development work, involving the use of heavy mechanical equipment.
The Bedouin in Central Israel
No Bedouin lived in central Israel in 1948. The fact that 10,000 currently live in this region is the result of migration from the Negev, due to two main factors:
Pasture migration: In 1957 the Negev was struck by drought which lasted for six years. The military administration, responsible for the Negev Bedouin localities at the time, came to the aid of the owners of large herds who requested permission to move to State-owned pasture land in central Israel. This migration led to the establishment of dozens of Bedouin settlements from Kiryat Gat to Mount Carmel, which developed pleasant social and political relations with their Jewish neighbors. In 1977 the government decided that the Bedouin should return to the Negev. Those who had land in the Negev returned there, but the majority remained in Central Israel, because they had abundant pasture land and some of the family members had found jobs, especially in and around the major Jewish cities. In 1992 a new policy, under which they were offered additional rural localities, was adopted; but the process of settlement will undoubtedly last many years.
Labor migration: The second factor that led to the migration of Bedouin to central Israel was the search for work, especially by families that lacked land and livestock. This migration process, which lasted from 1954 to 1970, created Bedouin centers in the cities of Ramle and Lod and the villages of Taibe and Kafr Kassem; lesser numbers settled in other Arab villages. The migrants belonged to two socio-economic groups: those who had left behind land in the Negev and those (the majority) who had not. The latter obtained permanent jobs and income and had no intention of leaving. Most of those who had left land in the Negev returned there in 1980, when the government recognized land claim certificates (see above – Land rights).
In the cities: The Bedouin who moved to Central Israel adapted quickly to urban life, free as they were of the social and political pressure of the Negev Bedouin who opposed moving to the townships set up for them by the government. They moved into houses abandoned by Arabs who had fled the country during the War of Independence, or built shacks (such as the train-station section of Lod). The government is now planning housing projects, taking their traditional needs into consideration. Having become permanent residents and enjoying better national and municipal services, the Bedouin show much interest in both general and municipal politics. in these cities they have also developed special relations with the two dominant communities, the Arabs and new Jewish immigrants.
In the villages: Paradoxically, the Bedouin who migrated from the Negev to Arab villages were not able to create positive relations with the villagers, despite a common religion and language; they are, instead, considered foreign implants. In 1997 the Kafr Kassem Local Council published a leaflet criticizing their Bedouin neighbors, even demanding their eviction. The incompatibility between the Bedouin, who bought small plots of land for agriculture, and the villagers seems to be linked to the cultural-historical difference between farmers and desert dwellers. But like all Israeli citizens they enjoy education, health and welfare services, despite their claims of being discriminated against by the local authorities, especially in the separate neighborhoods that they have built for themselves in each village.
The Bedouin in Northern Israel
The Bedouin in Galilee and the Jezreel valley, numbering about 50,000, unlike those in the Negev and in the Central region, hail from the Syrian desert. At the beginning of the century their nomadic way of life and militancy put them in a position to harass villages and demand tribute, giving them a sense of superiority over the fellahin (farmers). During the British Mandate the Galilee Bedouin were encouraged to purchase small plots of land and such purchases were recorded in the Land Registry as legal possession.
Towards the end of the British Mandate and during the struggle for the establishment of the State of Israel, many Bedouin joined the Jewish forces, believing that the Jewish state would be generous to them. This also explains the continued good relations after the establishment of the State, as manifested, first and foremost, in volunteering for the security forces and serving on the front lines; volunteering is considered by the Bedouin to be part of their blood-pact with the State of Israel.
One example of the good relations between the State and the Bedouin in the North is the tolerance displayed by the government regarding violations of building laws, non-expropriation of land and the establishment of the townships of Beit Zarzir and Ka’abiya.
Conclusion
Whereas the Negev Bedouin are ambivalent in their attitude toward the State and their identification with it, the northern Bedouin identify with it almost fully. This is manifested, first and foremost, in the extent of volunteering for the security services. As a result, the Bedouin in the North are rewarded with a friendly attitude, both from the establishment and from Jewish society at large.
YBD: Israel’s attitude towards its Bedouin citizens has always been positive.
This utter falsehood is the crux of this lengthy piece of self-serving colonialist propaganda. For real facts, please consult the very well-documented HRW report cited above. The full report is available for download, in English and in Hebrew.
Facts are to trolls what sunlight is to vampires.
“Oh the fact, it burns”
I would also suggest reporting eee’s post for abuse. He posted over 40 paragraphs(!), thus cluttering up this post just one his one “comment”. Please, eee. in the future, quote the few or even several paragraphs you consider pertinent and then link. Otherwise you are both spamming and in violation of fair use.
What clutters up this site are people like Chaos who insist on feeding every troll who shows up.
Shmuel,
Strange situation with your failure to be able to post the section on Individual Farms from the HRW report. I tried to do the same thing, multiple times, and each time the post failed. Any ideas as to why that would happen?
Okay, okay, I get the hint, you said Chaos, but you meant me. Look, if you don’t like the way I post, just say so, don’t try to bring ordure out of Chaos.
The Israeli shows up and drops bombs, and when I fight back I get blamed. Does that make me an honorary Palestinian?
tree,
I thought it might have had to do with the fact that I had just posted a large amount of text in a previous comment, but I guess that wasn’t it. I wanted to post the first two paragraphs from the section on “Individual Farms” (beg. on p.33), which framed the issue and the highlighted the hypocrisy quite well. That is actually what drew me to the HRW report, because there is a lot of good material out there in Hebrew and English (eg. by Oren Yiftachel, Alex Kedar, Thabet Abu-Ras and others) on the blatant discrimination against the Bedouin in Israel, but the issue of the “individual farms” (havot bodedim in Hebrew) is the best illustration of the real goals and practices of Israeli policies in the Naqab/Negev (and elswhere, of course).
I had the very same problem and have tried repeatedly to post it. No go. Its an interesting puzzle.
Chaos, he meant me, but wasn’t willing to say it. I’m sorry he picked on you instead, but everybody knows what he really meant.
Hi Shmuel,
Welcome back!
Thanks. It’s good to be home.
Mooser,
” don’t try to bring ordure out of Chaos.
If that one doesn’t get you banned, nothing will.
(Fumes of envy.)
Well if this doesn’t smell like “white man’s burden,” huh. Some white Polish Jew telling the natives what they can and can’t do in a land in which they grew up for generations.
Phil Weiss,
You are inciting against Israel. You have put forward a completely one sided view without any context and explanation. Plus you are calling this ethnic cleansing which is just a lie. Where does this hate come from?
You don’t want Israel to be a refuge for Jews? That is not for you to decide. That is for Israelis to decide. Yo do not want Israel speaking in your name? Join Jews for Jesus, convert or start a religion of your own. You do not follow the Halacha anyway, so why would it matter to you? Nobody is forcing you to remain Jewish.
Keep right on attacking the American Jewish community. Keep calling them “traitors to the Jewish race.”
I’m glad we finally have an Israeli who is complicit in Israeli crimes here. All of the things I’ve been trying to explain, I can just point to now.
I want israel to be a refuge for the Bedouins, many of whom may well be descendents of the jews of yore. Probably far more so than eee, who seems not to be very jewish – judging from his posts. May be he is a messianic jew? or a later day convert?
The Bedouins are almost certainly nomadic ethnic Arabs, unlike the Palestinians, who are descended from Judeans. They also serve in increasing numbers in the IDF, yet in many respects their treatment is worse than most Palestinians in the WB.
Danaa,
You are not living in Israel. If you want your opinion to count, come vote in our elections.
I am a simple Israeli whose family came originally from Eastern European roots. I was born in Israel as were my parents. My grandparents were born in cities and villages in Poland and Russia. Their families are from all over the Pale.
I am an atheist Jew. What kind of Jew are you? I think you are not a Jew at all. Are you from Jews for Jesus?
Just so we’re crystal clear, then. You are a white man who’s family are colonial immigrants to Palestine, telling native Palestinians that how they have been living for centuries (or longer) can no longer be practiced on their own land.
And before you say it, yes, I recognize something similar happened (over a hundred years ago….) in the United States. I agree wholeheartedly with my Native American cousins (and I mean that literally, I have Native American cousins) when they recall how atrocious their people have been treated.
Nobody expects the ISRAELI INQUISITION!
What does it matter if I am “white” or not, whatever that means?
I was born in Israel as were my parents. I am indigenous to Israel.
And it is not me telling 2% of the population that they cannot claim 50% of the country. It is all of Israel. It is just common sense, but you are using it to bludgeon Israel. Why? Irrational hate.
Do you think it’s gone without notice that almost all of the land that the Israeli government confiscates, is handed out to Jews and Jews alone?
The fact is, your grandparents stole land. Your legacy, whether you like it or not, is one of crime.
And so is the United States, and one day we will have to come to terms with that. My ancestors came here pretty much at the cusp of the 20th century. No one in my family has killed a single Native American (in fact, one of them married a Native American). No Native Americans had to become homeless to accommodate my family.
Can you say the same about your family? No. I’m still wondering how many Palestinians you are personally responsible for shooting, as an Israeli veteran.
Indigenous to Israel? No you are disingenuous for Israel.
And, eee, I’ll have you know, there is no way I can be a Christian! I have not taken a bath or shower for over fifty-five years, to avoid even the possibility of a stealth baptism.
Nope, sorry, pal, I’m as Jewish as they come.
“Can you say the same about your family? No. I’m still wondering how many Palestinians you are personally responsible for shooting, as an Israeli veteran.”
Chaos, why give that punk the honor of even taking him that seriously? I would call him a chicken-soup-chickenhawk!
Because, Mooser, we need to take the Israeli seriously. We need him to keep speaking his mind.
American Jews need to see what Israel really is.
Thanks, eee, for admitting you have no biological ties to biblical Israel. You’re just a product of “eastern european roots.” And a jew who is an atheist. BTW, what does that mean–you like gifilte fish and
cheap Jewish wine? Hey, comfort foods are important. Heck, crackers like grits and pork rinds, no denying this reality. Rather than ask Danaa, what kind of Jew he is, a more cogent question is, what kind of Jew are you? PS, Americans with dual citizenship vote in both elections. And also, BTW, can a Christian or Muslim be a declared atheist? I suggest you tell us more, especially since you are an aetheist, who is a Jew? Right now we don’t know, except we know that Jews who declare they are Christians are no longer considered as Jews by anyone. As a practical matter, whether you are a Jew or a Christian, or a Muslim, or a Buddist, you like what happened in OP Cast Lead? Also, please tell us precisely how your ideology, or set of beliefs, makes you different than in universal principle–from Himmler’s SS secular faith.
I agree, everyone born between the river and the sea is indigenous to Israel. Thus everyone should get the vote and elect people to the Knesset. One person, one vote.
Gee, last time I looked arabs constituted 20% of Israel, the State, as distinguished from the Israeli illegally occupied and walled-off territories. From where comes this 2% figure? Please explain your version of “common sense.”
One notes, Ael, that’s exactly where Palestine was going before the Zionist terrorism spree that culminated in open ethnic cleansing in 1948 and continues in the form of land theft and pogroms against Palestinians to this day.
Gee, Mooser, I hope for the sake of your shiksa wife you at least
realize that even though you are erotically cut off literally, you have to clean your dick head once in a while.
Do we know from EEE’s mouth whether he actually killed any Palestinians, or maimed them? There’s chicken soup, and there’s chicken soup….er, maybe soup with Palestinian bones in it–you know, to give it flavor?
Yeah, first of all? Sometimes you cross a line of good taste when addressing Mooser. And that’s putting it delicately. I know there’s a lot of animosity between you and Mooser (God knows why since you’re both on the same side) but seriously…. please.
Second… eee refuses to answer on his own personal culpability. He seems content to blame his grandparents all the while that crimes continue to the present day.
I’m no Talmud scholar, but I always thought a belief in the One God was a necessary prerequisite to being a Jew, the most basic, credal prayer in Judaism is the S’hma:
“Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One!
Okay, it’s a little slippery theologically, but it’s got a good beat, and you can dance to it.
Mooser,
The philosopher Nietzsche hated washing too and claimed that his stink helped him ‘cultivate’ his genius :-)
A recent US State Dep’t report shows that Palestinian population is essentially the same as Jewish Israeli population from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean. This doesn’t take into account the 3/4 to 1 million Israeli who live abroad, mostly in the United States.
I’m not at my home computer, so don’t have the citation handy. I’m sure someone else does; I learned of it on this blog.
2% is pretty silly.
I hope for the sake of your reputation you cut out trying to be clever.
I’m in tears. This is just comedy gold. Love it.
“I am indigenous to Israel.”‘
No, you are an Israeli national.
The total world financial commitment to supporting Israel is well over 6 to 12 trillion dollars since its inception; the US portion is at minimal 3 trillion. USA soldiers die daily in support of Israel, even though this is hidden–PNAC lives; it’s currently (by both neoliberals and neocons) enflaming a war against Iran, Israel’s preference as the first step in the plan for maintenance of Israel hegemony in the Middle East until it realized Shrub wanted to take care of Saddam first due to Bush oil interests and Saddam’s attempt to murder Shrub’s father.
A Jewish race? Man, I hope it’s a motorcycle race!
“You don’t want Israel to be a refuge for Jews?”
It’s nto a refuge for Jews, otherwise the majority fo the world’s Jews would not refuse to live there. It’s a state like any other, which some religious nuts and thugs consider a refuge.
More Israeli/Zionist crimes! FREE FREE Palestine!
Free Palestine? Can’t do that. But for just $9.99 …
Just to put this in context, I would like to point out that such actions have been going on for 60 years now in the Negev/Naqab.
Villages and farmers who dare work their privately owned fields in these “unrecognized” villages and plant them with crops, have had their crops sprayed with herbicides by Israel’s Green Patrol (a seemingly innocuous euphemism for land theft and ultimately ethnic cleansing).
Right, take everything out of context just to incite against Israel.
Could the US become a modern nation while allowing Indian tribes to claim the Great Plains states as their own and continue their nomadic lifestyle of hunting Bison?
Only when it comes to Israel, common sense goes out the window and every action is used to incite against the state.
Yes.
Jordan is.
The population density in Jordan: 138.8/sq mi (131st in the world)
The population density in Israel: 839/sq mi (34th in the world)
Jordan is over 4 times the size of Israel and with less population. Israel’s population density is 6 times that of Jordan! A country so densely populated cannot accommodate the sparse nomadic life style.
Well, that’s what happens when white people rush to colonize native lands.
Jordan is generously hosting some 500,000- 700,000 Iraqi refugees in spite of its limited natural resources and small size. Iraqis now account for more than 10 percent of the total population. Between the Iraqi refugees and a long-standing population of Palestinians, Jordan now hosts the largest number of refugees, per capita, of any country on earth.
link to humanrightsfirst.org
Syria has offered Iraqi refugees care and assistance, and continues to do so, in spite of the limited nature of its material resources. At the start of 2007 UNHCR estimated that the
number of Iraqi refugees in Syria exceeded 1.2 million, a huge influx to a country with a population of 18 million.
link to fmreview.org
There are many stories of once affluent professional Iraqi families reduced to begging and prostitution. Kahanists rejoice and plan for the same for Iranians (and Lebanese, Syrians, Egyptians, Jordanians, Arab-Americans…).
The sad part about that kind of mumbling is that anyone who’s familiar with the Bedouin in the Naqab, anyone who’s familiar with their recent history and with Israel’s policies in that region, knows that such rants are mere talking points, mere slogans, limited in depth and in scope and yet stringed together in an attempt to make them seem original, factual and spontaneous.
On a lighter note, what kind of native born Israeli uses idioms like “mountain out of a mole hill” and words like “sanguine”? I’ll tell you what kind, someone who’s native language is not Hebrew. Indeed, Israeli professors don’t have that level of English proficiency, let alone familiarity with said idioms and colloquialisms.
Off-topic. Just wanted to thank you for your contribution to the commentary here Avi~ One thing that struck me about you was how you went on one of those Birthright initiation things and you came out of it un-phased and thinking independently.
Avi, I once interacted with an Israeli on HuffPo. When I pressured him, on a lark, to tell us where he was born, he said he was born in Texas.
Avi, what can you expect from someone who uses the name eee? It’s like www, but one key to the right.
Why not Keyboard Warrior of Zion, eee? I’m sure Phil would approve the change.
Avi,
Enough with your ad-hominem attacks and allegations that Israeli professors do not have a large English vocabulary. I am not a professor, but there are many professors born in Israel that have much better English than me. Why are you so surprised than an Israeli can write passable English? I have a heavy Israeli accent but that is another matter.
“I have a heavy Israeli accent but that is another matter.”
C’mon, eee, I’m eating breakfast! How the hell can I keep my lox, salami and cream cheese bagel down (it’s a light breakfast) when you say stuff like “heavy Israeli accent”
Oh no, now I’ve just thought of sex, with the words “heavy Israeli accent” still in my head. I hope I make it to the bathroom…
I don’t believe you’re born in Israel. Not for a second.
Your posts stink of Brooklyn (no offense to Brooklynians).
Guys? Does it matter where this clown was born? He claims to be Israeli, there’s no reason not to believe he’s in Israel right now, and the fact that a “native” Israel handles English like a first language only helps prove the point of how “native” Israel really is.
I keep picturing that eee sounds vaguely like me and my family, with Polish twangs and consonants with a bit of Germanic grammatical influence peppered into it.
Check the time clock on postings and you’ll find out what
time zone he is in.
Chu rings the bell, hits the bulls-eye, and is entitled to cigar or coco-nut, winner’s choice!
Gratzi, gratzi. I prefer the coco-nut…
I’m uncertain how you can compare the actions of the early19th century United State history, to what is happening in the current day. International laws have been established and the media is watching Israel everyday.
Colonialism and it oppressive tactics are an ugly beast, and the sooner Israel recognizes that their quest for greater Israel is not providing dividends, the better our special relationship will be.
What greater Israel? This is in the pre 67 borders.
…which are still in excess of the UN 181 partition lines.
Not sure I understand the question. What is in pre’67 border?
It is not in “occupied territory”. It is not in land taken in the 6 day war.
Chu, the villages being discussed in this article are within Israel’s 1948 borders, i.e. within Israel proper, not in the occupied territories of the West Bank, Gaza or the Golan Heights.
I have a proposition to make, and I hope that Phil and Adam are reading this:
Would it be possible to include a small map next to articles that discuss villages/towns/cities in the region? I have noticed that some TV news channels use such slides to familiarize their audiences with the location in question. I think that would go a long way in familiarizing readers with the local geography and in preventing misunderstandings.
It would help to have maps at hand. It could even be a link at the right side for quick reference.
“I’m uncertain how you can compare the actions of the early19th century United State history, to what is happening in the current day. ”
Indeed. We are supposed to have learned better. Even here in Australia.
” a modern nation “
Hey, wha’ happened? I go to sleep all proud of my devotion to 4000 years of Jewish history and tradition, and I wake up this morning and it’s all about being “a modern nation”. That’s the damn problem with these 4000 year old religions, always changing on you.
But I guess I’m sorta one of the left behinds, as my Zionist brethren go “movin’ on up” to the Middle East-side.
And “inciting” ooooh! That sounds all legal and shit. Who ya’ gonna call, eee? Gonna get an indictment?
Eee, granted the US imperial conquest of native Americans was not right,
so then why do you plead for Israel’s similar mission? You always comment to ignore the world has moved on since the 19th Century. Readers here recall that Hitler, in Mein Kampf, justified his vision by what the US did to the native Americans, while simultaneously jacking off to romantic visions of the American Indians, as he did throughout his youth. You, eee, are repeating Goering’s defense at Nuremberg. Happy?
Israel, noted for its food (it tastes like poison and the portions are so small) and famous for its fine whines.
“Right, take everything out of context just to incite against Israel.”‘
Hey eee, are you critical of Nazis? Becasue if you are, then you are just incoting against Germany.
And likewise to put this in context, for those who are unfamiliar with this situation, this is occurring within the Green Line, to Israeli Arab citizens of Israel. Israel has refused, since its inception, to recognize some 30-40 Arab villages within Israel that existed prior to Israel’s existencl. This means that Israel has never hooked these villages up to the Israeli water and electrical system, and refuses to allow for town plans to be instituted. Without town plans, no building is allowed to legally take place within the village. Catch-22 for the Negev Beduoin citizens of Israel.
More context from the New Israel Fund:
Facts and Figures About the Unrecognized Villages
* Nearly 90,000 Bedouin live in 36 unrecognized Negev villages and 9 recently recognized villages.
* The Abu Basma Project, run by NIF and JDC, has secured the recognition of the 9 villages with 2 more about to be recognized.
* Even in these 9 recently recognized villages, there is still an absence of basic infrastructure, utilities and health services. The villages are served by only 4 schools.
* The Bedouin comprise 28% of the Negev population but live on only 2.5% of the land.
* There are only 16 officially recognized Bedouin localities – 7 government-planned cities and the 9 recently recognized villages.
* Since 2001, 338 Bedouin homes have been demolished – 110 of them in the first six months of 2007.
Now compare and contrast the bolded text with the apologia we get from eee
Imagine that 2% of the population claimed half the US territory because historically their tribes roamed that area.
The Negev Bedouins are 28% of the population of Negev, living on 2% of the land in the Negev. And Israel, and eee, considers that too much land for its Bedouin citizens. They must make way for the Judafication of the Negev.
Israel had located it’s toxic waste dump in Ramat Hovav. It’s a different kind of slow poisoning to the Bedowin.
link to antiwar.com
About 4,000 people live in the vicinity of Ramat Hovav, Israel’s toxic waste dump – one of 17 chemical plants in the area. Opened in 1975, it has left a trail of wreckage adding to the dire situation: high infant mortality rates, cancer and numerous other health effects from the effluent.
Chu,
Look at Israel’s map and tell me where you would have located the waste dump? Israel is a very small and very densely populated country.
The people who have been living there for centuries don’t get a say?! Seriously, eee? Do you not care that your country has willfully poisoned a village? With children and all?
Israel IS a waste dump full of euro convert trash.
Not in Tel Aviv, I suppose. I guess I’d put it in the Bedowins back yard, so their kids can become ill.
It’s nice to know what the state does to it’s lesser desired population.
No, you’re supposed to react on tree’s facts first. Ducking?
Tree,
Now be fair. What percentage of the population of the Negev are Jews and on what percentage of the land do they live? Why not compare apples to apples? When Israel left the Sinai, it had to move much of the IDF training areas and bases to the Negev. Where could the IDF train? In Haifa? In the super-densely populated areas? Most of the Negev is used by the IDF and other government agencies. Nobody is targeting the Bedouins specifically.
If we’d been doing that since before 1948, Israel wouldn’t exist.
Read Shmuel’s source above. Israel IS targeting the Bedouins specifically. You would do better to understand your own country, and stop stating falsehoods, if you want to debate it here. So far you aren’t doing very well with your apologias.
The IOF trains on a daily basis on Palestinians in the occupied territories and on innocent civilians in Gaza. It’s on-the-job training. They shoot whomever they want and there are no consequences. That, in my book, is the essence of training wherein the liability component is taken out of the equation and the trainee gets to experiment and test the limits of the tools at his disposal.
“The IOF trains on a daily basis on Palestinians”
Jeff Halper of ICAHD agrees with you, and then some”
“The Global Pacification Industry”
link to youtube.com
Comparing Jewish Israeli apples to Bedouin Israeli apples, for eee’s sake:
From the HRW report linked above:
“There are currently 59 [Jewish-owned] individual farms in the Negev, covering more than 81,00 dunams of land, which is greater than the total land mass that the state granted to the seven Bedouin townships housing around 85,000 people.”
From a report by Habitat International Coaltion iin 2004, on the unrecognized villages in the Negev:
“At present, of the nearly 13 million dunams of the Negev, the combined Bedouin population holds only 240,000 dunams, of which 180,000 dunams are held by the residents of the unrecognized villages. In other words, the residents of the villages sit on 1.3% of the land in the Negev, even though they constitute 14.2% of the Negev citizens. Further, this 1.3% is zoned for exclusive Jewish use, for industrial areas, settlements or other purposes. By 2020 the 76,000 residents of the unrecognized villages are predicted to number a minimum of 200,000 persons. According to Israel law, a community of this size requires an area of 1,153,143 dunams.”
link to hic-net.org
In other words, the Bedouins in the unrecognized villages take up an area that is less than 20% of what Israel considers the legal and necessary size for such a population (given, of course, that the community were Jewish).
I apologize for the bad formatting. I did not intend for so much to be bolded.
“Where could the IDF train? In Haifa? In the super-densely populated areas?”
Sure. After all, super-densely populated areas is what Israel targets after all.
Absolutely.
The Bedouin in the area were corralled into a small strip of land, prevented from returning to their villages and towns and forced to make do with a fraction of the agricultural land they used to have.
Fast forward 20 – 30 years, and these days Israeli authorities refuse to allow them to expand to accommodate the natural population growth, while Jewish only villages and towns in the area have been allotted large swaths of land for both residential and agricultural use.
It bears mention that these Jewish-only towns are part of larger Regional Councils (akin to counties in the US).
So, while a Jewish Regional Council may control thousands of acres — which mostly go unused and part of which used to belong to the Bedouin — the Bedouin are not allowed to have such regional jurisdictions (Councils/ Counties) and are limited to their own villages and whatever the central Israeli government allots them.
Again, this is yet another facet of the “legalized” land theft and dispossession.
Whoopee! I’m a modren atheist Jew who has replaced God with real estate and a state! Aren’t I proud of me! And, I’ll have you know, all the people who are exactly the same as me agree with me and I’ve never asked anybody else, cause, I mean, really, what the hell would they know?
And you better not say anything cause I’ll call you the most prejarotive thing I know of, “Christian”!
This must be very, very humiliating for Phil and Adam. Mondoweiss doesn’t deserve at least third string trolls? Hey, don’t look at me, I haven’t posted for days. Not my fault. But they might take a lesson from it and try to improve the site!
-Lol. -modern athiest Jew. wtf…
I bet I could do a song parody of the “Beverly Hillbillies” theme based on “atheist Jew”.
Oh, the first thing you know, e’s an atheist Jew,
And he tells the Palestinians: “it won’t go well for you!”
“We’re a modren Jewish nation, and we need all the ground,
based on a 19th Century British Public School Biblical geography,
which is always sound!”
Hey, I’m not married to those words, just running it up the flagpole to see who spits at it.
LOL, that was great, Mooser! :) That show was before my time, but I’ve seen several episodes and like the intro jingle.
Well, maybe if I could write well-informed and written comments like yours, Colin, I wouldn’t need to depend on song parodies. But thanks, and keep commenting, Colin.
I’ve been reading (and liking) your comments for years. It’s been years, hasn’t it?
I guess the solution is to disdain and ignore, or at least to attack, all self-proclaimed Christians and Jews.
How else can we even start to parse this less than pure affair?
I call myself a Christian; I like to think I argue from reasonably plausible premises to conclusions – and for that reason shouldn’t always be ignored. What should be ignored is streams of sneers and insults and the endless attempts to change the subject.
The argument is frequently made that the Zionists offered the Palestinians peace as long they accepted Israel as a Jewish state. Well the Bedouins certainly did that in 1948. Not only that but they entered into a military alliance with the Zionists in their war against the Palestinians. One would think that as a reward they would be treated as equals. But, of course, that will not be. Their land is for Jews, not non-Jews.
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This is pretty much infinitely sad and disgusting.
I wish the american indians would start a campaign designed at retrieving thier lands. I wonder what would happen if the jews in america were ousted and simple it could be to oust at 4 am people from their homes in america over real debatable issues that not all signed up for the bantor stand lands
and unequality in their own country, look at it now gone forever.
So with this in mind do you really believe the aparthied israel has a real issue for something so very long ago which was not even theirs then, they were only allowed to exist with their scams, not the land, so people should question the history in which the zionist have written as a christain bible which also in fact was not even theirs but stolen from fables of even older times and recreate them as their own to get ownership over the realm of history. These in my mind is were the problem is. There is to be no equality ever, so why not rocket them attack them where ever they are till the point is well taken, that the palestinians are not indians and will never let it rest, no matter how many bombs and weapons are used and paid for by the usa citizens, whom should be included in the lawsuits for they are the ones allowing it to be used in that manner with bad intentions from the get go. I forgot the israel zionist cult has infiltrated the ICC as well as all others. So wouldn’t that mean simple court cases should be filed against them….yes, everyone should drag them into a court and make the case till the zionist go back to khazaristan. Or just wake them at 4 am and let them know there will be demolition of the home the next day, lets see how that would work in the realm of reality. I suppose the christain right which has been the zionist patsys for the long duration will never wake up to what they supported till it is too late anyhow, they are blinded by what else but the zionist created bible which is used in christian churches and other types everywhere. What is going to happen when they realize they are being used and there is “no god” what excuse will the zionist give then?
So strange that you wail and moan about this, but wouldn’t bat an eye at the ethnic cleansing of Jews from Jerusalem and Hebron.
Right, because worrying about something that happened decades ago is far more important than trying to stop a crime that is happening right now.
I like this site and agree with all Mr. Weiss’ objectives, but I must admit oftentimes I escape the commentary and go to Doonsbury for relief!
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Bet very few Americans know that Israel called in the favor extended to an American African American to take care of Israel’s “Bedouin problem.” Further speculate that the ‘problem’ may be eradicated the old fashioned way before it has a chance to be “solved.”
Bill Strickland is a giant in the African American community in Pittsburgh, where he created the Manchester-Bidwell center to educate poor, young (predominately) Black people from Pittsburgh’s less-privileged neighborhoods. At Bidwell, high school students study arts — pottery, music, graphics design; older/adult students can acquire job skills in culinary arts, pharmacy technology, horticulture, office skills, as well as assistance in getting and keeping a job in those fields.
Some years ago the Jewish community in Pittsburgh contributed to Strickland’s enterprise as he was getting it off the ground. In Dec 2007, Steve Cohen of UJF Pittsburgh called in his chits: Strickland was tapped to create a center in Israel’s Negev to train Bedouin and others. www dot post-gazette.com/pg/07360/844454-52.stm
Strickland said he is glad to be doing the work, but people at Strickland’s flagship center in the US do not seem to have any information about Strickland’s work in Israel; and in a 2009 interview, Strickland said he was “in conversations” with Israel to establish replica of his grant- and award-winning center.