In London, Benny Morris runs the gauntlet

Israel/Palestine
on 113 Comments

This is a little like Marty Peretz being assailed at Harvard by people holding placards with his own repugnant words on them, only stronger.  Benny Morris, the Israeli historian who has rationalized ethnic cleansing to create a majority-Jewish state in ’48, being badgered as he walks to a lecture hall at London School of Economics to make an appearance. Schlumpfy historian. Note the intensity of the accusations, racism, justifying apartheid. The mood is shifting across Europe, and it’s coming here. Morris losing prestige, Zionism losing prestige.

A member of the audience reports: “He purports to be a historian yet when asked questions for example — “How can Palestinians be asked to compromise with their own land?”  (when he painted a picture at how wonderful and considerate Israel was for offering them 45% a while back) — his response — ‘I have only scratched the surface in my research; you would need at least 10 historians working together to answer these questions.’  He must have given this reply at least 5 times. He failed to discuss the refugee problem other than to say that it was caused by the Arab-led war.  He also referred to the Jewish refugees (Jews forced to leave and  expelled by Arab countries) which he said people aren’t aware of as they were all absorbed by Israel. . .  Several protesters left during his lecture with stickers taped over their mouths and holding up signs as they left. “

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113 Responses

  1. Kathleen
    June 15, 2011, 10:22 am

    Excellent. In most European countries they have been far more aware of the brutal human rights crimes that Israel has been committing. Part of that being the BBC etc allow more fact based criticism of Israel to be broadcast than NPR, MSNBC etc. More getting through.

    This was quite civil really. Good to have “charlatans peddling racism” like Benny Morris confronted. He will call it “anti semitism”

    • hophmi
      June 15, 2011, 4:25 pm

      “Good to have “charlatans peddling racism” like Benny Morris confronted.”

      Benny Morris is a charlatan now?

      Seems to me all of you were crazy about his research as long as he was on your side of the political spectrum. It just goes to show how intellectually bankrupt you all are.

      • marc b.
        June 15, 2011, 5:08 pm

        hophmi, there is a distinction, lost on you, between morris ‘the historian’ and morris ‘the ideologue’. morris ‘the historian’, reading dusty archives and reporting his findings on the zionists’ plans to drive arab palestinians from their land, is ‘history’. morris hypothesizing on about what a glorious world it would be if ben-gurion had the stones to finish the job a la andrew jackson is not the work of a historian. his opinion in that regard doesn’t merit any more respect than that of any other doddering racist, spouting off at the corner coffee shop. geddit?

      • ToivoS
        June 15, 2011, 5:26 pm

        Good point hophmi, Benny Morris is not a charlatan. He presents the true face of Zionism and provides a factual and accurate picture of your ideology.

      • eGuard
        June 15, 2011, 5:52 pm

        No, he always was a charlatan. Which is different from his research, as intellectuals know. The quote was (you quoted, remember): “charlatans peddling racism”. That is his new twist. (#2 you suck, #4 all of you suck — can I collect my points please, M?).

      • Mooser
        June 15, 2011, 5:56 pm

        “It just goes to show how intellectually bankrupt you all are.”

        Intellectual bankruptcy is nothing compared to the crime of holding you against your will and forcing you to read and comment on Mondoweiss.
        I just can’t believe somebody I admired at one time would sink to something like that. For God’s sake, Phil and Adam, set Hophmi free! Let him go! He hates it here, thinks the website id fulla crap, but you won’t let him leave. Why, if I didn’t know you were holding him in the old durrance vile, I might think he was paid to be here.

        Why is Mondoweiss denying Hophmi’s right of return?

      • Chaos4700
        June 15, 2011, 9:11 pm

        Weren’t you condemning and decrying Goldstone’s report right before he “recanted” it? (And before he recanted having recanted it?) Seriously, hophmi. People in glass houses shouldn’t waltz around in their underwear.

  2. Erasmus
    June 15, 2011, 10:49 am

    Re Benny Morris video.

    i have seen the video only up to 2:10. Even if Morris’ views must appear more than critique – worthy and objectionable, i feel that such a staged and video-taped public avalanche of street-criticism rather awful. It appears much more like public persecution than an decent and appropriate confrontation with Morris’ untenable “justification” of Israel-policy wrongs, past and present.

    • Woody Tanaka
      June 15, 2011, 11:35 am

      Perhaps, but isn’t someone’s views, at a certain point, so extreme and unacceptable that decent and respectful confrontation unwarranted?

      • Erasmus
        June 15, 2011, 12:27 pm

        !unwarranted” it may very well be – i agree. I wanted to express my dislike for the videotaping that – above all – may even make appear B.Morris a victim. And that BM can hardly claim for himself.

        And: to answer simultaneously marc b. commentary below :yes i do think that from a “public relations or educational perspective” i do find such videotaped confrontation counterproductive.
        In sum, the video put me off and i would not be surprized if i were not the only one.

        • eGuard
          June 15, 2011, 1:40 pm

          DSK did not like it too.

        • Woody Tanaka
          June 15, 2011, 2:04 pm

          Gotacha. Fair enough.

        • ToivoS
          June 15, 2011, 5:36 pm

          Erasmus you seem to have struck a chord. Let me offer my take. I once heard a holocaust scholar point out the David Irvine actually came up with a number good observations in the course of his research. He said if Irvine hadn’t married his scholarly findings to the preposterous claim that the holocaust was a myth, that he would have likely been accepted as just another conservative scholar.

          But today we all freely ridicule Irvine. Now I would argue that Morris is more dangerous than Irvine. He is an advocate for more ethnic cleansing in the future. Irvine is a harmless crank that just disputes historic events. He certainly has never said Jews should be exterminated.

    • marc b.
      June 15, 2011, 12:03 pm

      erasmus, all i would concern myself with is effectiveness. if this type of confrontational tactic is counterproductive from a public relations or educational perspective, then, by all means, find another way. but i am not the least bit concerned about what you describe as the ‘persecution’ of the execreble benny morris, your use of ‘persecution’ being a bit of hyperbole in any event.

    • Danaa
      June 15, 2011, 12:22 pm

      Point is, erasmus, that Benny Morris does not merit respectful treatment, as if he was an actual “academic” like any other. He advocates ethnic cleansing – pure and simple – and the appropriate response to that is the modern version of being tarred and feathered and run out of town.

      What i can’t believe is that he continues to get invitations – usually Jewish organization supported – outside his little sinkhole, and there are even people who shake his hand and invite him into their parlors!

      The comparisons of Morris, as he currently is – after he recanted from truth telling – should be more to someone like the “academic” minions of Goebbels. What Morris is advocating now is a “final solution” to the “Palestinian demographic problem”. He just realizes it is not [yet] PC to tell us what he really thinks should be done.

      • Miura
        June 15, 2011, 1:06 pm

        What i can’t believe is that he continues to get invitations–usually Jewish organization supported–outside his little sinkhole, and there are even people who shake his hand and invite him into their parlors!

        I’d like someone to correct me if I’m mistaken, but wasn’t Benny Morris invited to start writing his blood-thirsty op-eds for NY Times only after he had shed his earlier persona of a “dove” and started “paint[ing] apocalyptic visions with a smile on his lips” (a sample is analyzed here):

        No person into whose mind had entered the idea that an Iranian may be a human being–and that there are millions of innocent Iranians–could have generated with such casual facility the image of Iran as a “nuclear wasteland.” Yet this was the image of Iran that the Israeli Benny Morris decided to conjure up for American readers in the New York Times…[W]hether the attack on Iran comes sooner or later, whether it is executed by Israel or the U.S. or both, and whether carried out with conventional or nuclear weapons, Morris has no doubt of one thing. It will have served the “apocalyptic” vision of the “whole Zionist project,” and it will coincide with the highest values of humanity properly defined.

    • Citizen
      June 15, 2011, 9:30 pm

      All I get when I click on the video is a black screen and white letters saying, “This is a private video.” I located the same video on another site and the restult was the same. This happen to anyone else?

  3. Taxi
    June 15, 2011, 10:58 am

    Hahahaha I just love this bit: “How dare you walk on our streets…. you’re a plain old-fashioned racist!”.

    Very intense and gratifying video! Bravo the conscientious pair who named and shamed the wicked “charlatan” in public and hahahaha had it filmed and posted for our education and pleasure!

    No asshole is safe from youtube no more hahahaha!

    Benny must have crapped in his patchy unmentionables – I hope he has nightmares over this both sleeping and waking and I hope he spends an effing fortune on his personal ‘security’ from here on!

    Viva Palestina!

    • hophmi
      June 15, 2011, 4:27 pm

      So hilarious. Benny was your G-d before he started discussing his politics. Now, this refusenik is a racist.

      • Taxi
        June 15, 2011, 5:11 pm

        Huh hops? Benny is “my god”? Bwahahaha! What the eek are you on about?! Show me when/where I glorified Benny the wretch? Uhuh THAT’S what I thought: YOU CAN’T CUZ IT DON’T EXIST!! I ain’t shy to say it’s been years that I been hating on Benny the scum!

        Hahaha you’re out of your mind hophmi!

        Go pack a suitcase or something- make yourself useful buddy.

      • justicewillprevail
        June 15, 2011, 5:38 pm

        Usual tripe from Hoppy. He was never a God, he did some original research which showed the deliberate ethnic cleansing of Palestine, then tried to justify it. He was never a refusenik. Keep up, you’re way behind as usual with your feeble whining.

        • lysias
          June 15, 2011, 6:40 pm

          Anybody know whether Morris’s change of view coincided with his appointment as professor at the University of the Negev in Beersheba (i.e., the equivalent of getting tenure):

          When Conrad Black bought the [Jerusalem] Post in 1990, Morris was one of the Israeli left-wing journalists. He continued to write as a freelance, producing Israel’s Secret Wars, co-written with Ian Black of The Guardian, and Righteous Victims, a history of the Arab-Israeli conflict. In 1996, he told a journalist that he was thinking of moving to America to find work; when this appeared in an article, he was invited to talk to Israel’s president, Ezer Weizman, who reportedly interrogated Morris for an hour about 1948, to find out whether he was a good historian and a good Zionist. Satisfied that he was both, Weizmann found him a job as a history professor at the University of the Negev in Beersheba.[6]

      • ToivoS
        June 15, 2011, 5:46 pm

        He was never anyones hero. His racism was obvious from the beginning. He was accepted because, finally, an honest Zionist had come forth and explained what happened in 1948 and why it was necessary for the success of Zionism. He spoke the truth. For those of us brought up on the incredible lies that were spread across the US in the 1950s and 60s about the founding of Israel, it was refreshing in a very chilling way.

        Of course, after he caught some flack in Israel for being too honest, he has in recent years practiced the arts of deflection, dissimulation and obfuscation that earlier Zionists have perfected.

      • Chaos4700
        June 15, 2011, 9:14 pm

        You and your proverbial signs marching outside of Goldstone’s granson’s bar mitzvah, hophmi. Don’t you think it’s pretty silly when we can tear off your straw man’s canvas face and find you yourself stuffed inside?

  4. seafoid
    June 15, 2011, 11:06 am

    Kathleen

    Even right wing newspapers like the UK’s Daily Telegraph have not been shy of exposing Israel’s atrocities. The FT is very anti Netanyahu.
    Benny Morris is an old man now who has nothing to say to the young generation of Palestinians.

  5. Miura
    June 15, 2011, 11:16 am

    Joel Beinin took a good look at our Cambridge trained historian:

    [Benny] Morris now provides a moral justification for ethnic cleansing that he did not offer before the second intifada, arguing that “[e]ven the great American democracy could not have been created without the annihilation of the Indians.” Native Americans and those with a sounder knowledge of North American history may demur. But in Israel, appeal to the authority of the US is the ultimate clincher in any argument. Yearning for the success of the American example, Morris now criticizes Israel’s first prime minister and defense minister, David Ben-Gurion, for failing to do “a complete job” because “this place would be quieter and know less suffering if the matter had been resolved once and for all. If Ben-Gurion had carried out a large expulsion and cleansed the whole country”. It may yet turn out that this was his fatal mistake.” Palestine-Israel might also be quieter today if Hitler had completed his planned genocide of world Jewry. It does not occur to Morris that there might be a parallel between these two historical counterfactuals. The first is in the realm of acceptable speculation; the second is too obviously outrageous to consider.

    Gabriel Ash is also good at diagnosing what ails Morris:

    His sickness is of the mental-political kind. He lives in a world populated not by fellow human beings, but by racist abstractions and stereotypes. There is an over-abundance of quasi-poetic images in the interview, as if the mind is haunted by the task of grasping what ails it: “The Palestinian citizens of Israel are a time bomb,” not fellow citizens. Islam is “a world in which human lives don’t have the same value as in the West.” Arabs are “barbarians” at the gate of the Roman Empire. Palestinian society is “a serial killer” that ought to be executed, and “a wild animal” that must be caged.

    Morris’ disease was diagnosed over forty years ago, by Frantz Fanon. Based on his experience in subjugated Africa, Fanon observed that “the colonial world is a Manichean world. It is not enough for the settler to delimit physically, that is to say, with the help of the army and the police, the place of the native. As if to show the totalitarian character of colonial exploitation, the settler paints the native as a sort of quintessence of evil…

    • Mooser
      June 15, 2011, 11:54 am

      This is incredible stuff coming from Gabriel Ash! I mean, considering Benny Morris learned pratically everything he knows from him!

    • Shingo
      June 15, 2011, 8:36 pm

      Fascinating anamysis Miura.

  6. seafoid
    June 15, 2011, 11:44 am

    I think the whole ideological framework of Zionism is going to collapse under the weight of its own contradictions. Even a lefty like Uri Avnery who supports the idea of a Palestinian state but defends 1948 – how does this following effort of his look if seen through the eyes of a palestinian from 1946 ?

    Regarding sovereignty

    Every state
    Has the right
    To defend its
    International borders,
    Provided
    It defines its borders
    In agreement
    With its neighbors
    And gains
    International recognition.
    For them.
    Netanyahu has done
    Neither.

    • hophmi
      June 15, 2011, 4:29 pm

      Every state
      Has the right
      To security
      and secure borders.
      Israel’s neighbors
      will not accept
      this axiomatic principle
      unless its Western border
      is the Mediterranean Sea.

      • Shingo
        June 15, 2011, 8:18 pm

        Every state
        Has the right
        To security
        and secure borders.

        Not the right
        to change those borders
        in order to steal land

        Israel’s neighbors
        will not accept
        this axiomatic principle
        unless its Western border
        is the Mediterranean Sea.

        That like saying
        that those who opopse rape
        only do so
        becasue they are secually inhibited

      • Chaos4700
        June 15, 2011, 9:15 pm

        Killing kids with white phosphorous
        Is okay
        As long as you’re “Jewish” like hophmi!

      • pjdude
        June 15, 2011, 10:59 pm

        what about palestine?

  7. wondering jew
    June 15, 2011, 11:46 am

    Wow! Just can’t wait until this comes to the streets of New York! What fun! How great!

    • Mooser
      June 15, 2011, 11:58 am

      Gee, Wondering Jew, I realise it is the most precious dream of every Zionist to drive a wedge between Jews and the rest of humanity, so that the Jews may eventually come under the control of Zionism, but do you have to be so obvious about it?

    • Donald
      June 15, 2011, 1:08 pm

      Benny Morris openly defended the ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians and also of the Native Americans. Do you have any comment about that? Do you think that people who endorse crimes against humanity should be treated with respect?

      My only concern is the one Erasmus had–to people who don’t know what the issues are, Morris might look like a victim. Of course to people who can’t see that crimes against humanity matter when they are committed against non-Westerners, Morris will also look like a victim.

      • wondering jew
        June 15, 2011, 1:51 pm

        I disagree with Benny Morris. I also disagree with this type of behavior in the street. I think celebrating it is stupid.

        • Mooser
          June 15, 2011, 2:33 pm

          “I disagree with Benny Morris. “

          Then why the hell are you a settler? You always do this, wondering. You say “I disagree with this…” or that, as if that makes it go away.
          Yup, you disagree with it, but sure as hell don’t mind basing your life around the evil fruits of his doctrine.

          “I also disagree with this type of behavior in the street.”
          Ever heard the name Lucas Koerner?

          “I think celebrating it is stupid.”
          Well, you might be right, but you must admit, coercing you to read about it, and join in the stupidity by threats of harm is worse. I’m telling you, Mondoweiss won’t get away with it!

        • Chaos4700
          June 15, 2011, 9:15 pm

          #4) Everybody sucks. It’s a classic!

        • Donald
          June 16, 2011, 7:33 am

          “I disagree with Benny Morris. I also disagree with this type of behavior in the street. I think celebrating it is stupid.”

          Well, so long as you’re consistent and would feel the same way no matter who the target was I can’t argue with you.

      • hophmi
        June 15, 2011, 4:39 pm

        “Benny Morris openly defended the ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians and also of the Native Americans. Do you have any comment about that? Do you think that people who endorse crimes against humanity should be treated with respect?”

        Yeah. My comment is that Morris points out the hypocrisy of a world that treats Israel as harshly for playing a role in causing a hostile group to leave during a civil war while treating America as a hegemon when America’s crime was much, much greater. In the orgy of easy accusations that takes place on the left whenever Morris’s name is mentioned, no one has the courage to address his major point, which is that had all of the Palestinians left or been made to leave, Israel would have no problem in the international community. That’s because, deep down, you know it’s true.

        Morris never “endorsed” crimes against humanity. He has merely made the point that Israel’s crimes are nothing special in the history of humanity, and in fact, Israel founding was a good deal less bloody than the creation of those states that would purport to criticize it.

        Morris has done more for Palestinian rights than anyone here, and treatment of him on the left is symptomatic of the radical tendency to try and censor speech it doesn’t want to hear.

        • Woody Tanaka
          June 15, 2011, 5:34 pm

          This: “playing a role in causing a hostile group to leave during a civil war ” is as bad as Holocaust denial. Bigot.

        • Shingo
          June 15, 2011, 5:35 pm

           My comment is that Morris points out the hypocrisy of a world that treats Israel as harshly for playing a role in causing a hostile group to leave during a civil war while treating America as a hegemon when America’s crime was much, much greater

          Dos the Nazi’s merely play a role in the Holocaust, and were Jews in Germany at the time a hostile group?

          Following the passing of 181 at the UN, the Israeli cadre assured the UN that all people in Israel would enjoy the equal rights in a secular society. No mention was made of hostile groups.

          The next day, Israel began expelling Palestinians and destroying their villages.

          You’re a sick and sadistic piece of work Hophmi.

           Morris never “endorsed” crimes against humanity.

          Yeah right Hop. How could criticizing Ben-Gurion for not finishing the job be considered Amy kind of endorsement?

        • eGuard
          June 15, 2011, 5:40 pm

          Hopmi: “[Morris merrely made the point that] Israel’s crimes are nothing special“.No. He calls for a nuclear war, he is racist, and he states that Ben Gurion should have completed the genocide.
          But of course, incomplete genocides are “nothing special” to you.

        • Leper Colonialist
          June 15, 2011, 6:02 pm

          “…no one has the courage to address his major point, which is that had all of the Palestinians left or been made to leave, Israel would have no problem in the international community.”

          Oh, yeah, thanks; remind me to leave my doors and windows unlocked and a big welcome mat outside my home. That way, burglars will have no need to carry burglar tools and so attract unwanted attention from the local constabulatory.

        • Citizen
          June 15, 2011, 6:03 pm

          RE: “… no one has the courage to address his major point, which is that had all of the Palestinians left or been made to leave, Israel would have no problem in the international community. That’s because, deep down, you know it’s true.”

          Pure crap; merely hophmi’s own projection of his own mentality. There were two World Wars fought after Wounded Knee. The Nuremberg Trials laid out basic international communal standards, and Geneva followed, and has never stopped. Hophmi thinks the world would have stood for Israel doing “nothing special” to the Palestinians after the carnage of those wars. Basically, he yearns for the days of the Barbarians, the cave man, where Israel could have done whatever it had the power to do.

        • American
          June 15, 2011, 7:44 pm

          ” no one has the courage to address his major point, which is that had all of the Palestinians left or been made to leave, Israel would have no problem in the international community. That’s because, deep down, you know it’s true.”

          Oh man…I can’t resist that one.
          You do know don’t you hophmi, that if Hitler had just finished off all the Jews the US and the international community wouldn’t be having this Jewish State problem. Deep down you know this is true.

        • Donald
          June 16, 2011, 7:25 am

          “In the orgy of easy accusations that takes place on the left whenever Morris’s name is mentioned, no one has the courage to address his major point, which is that had all of the Palestinians left or been made to leave, Israel would have no problem in the international community. That’s because, deep down, you know it’s true.”

          Hophmi, that doesn’t make sense even from your own point of view. If Israel’s crime had been even greater, do you actually think that people who see Israel as a settler colonial state, a bastion of Western imperialism, a bone in the throat of people in the Middle East, would have been more forgiving? People who see Palestinians as human beings would be even more disgusted by Israel than they are now.

          What I know “deep down” is that if the Palestinians had been 100 percent ethnically cleansed and if the refugee population had been dispersed and was no longer a festering sore there would be zero interest in mainstream American political and governmental circles in what happened. They really do think the way you claim everyone thinks. They’re interested in the Palestinians to the extent that they are interested at all because of how it effects US policy and of course because of the Lobby even that concern doesn’t influence our policy that much–we end up supporting Israel no matter what they do.

          “Morris never “endorsed” crimes against humanity.”

          Yes he did. He endorsed both what Israel did in 48, only complaining that it wasn’t thorough enough, and he also endorsed what white Americans did to the Native Americans, on the grounds that it was necessary for the establishment of America. Why are you denying this?

          Here is a link to his interview. I think this has come up before with you hophmi and if you keep denying that Morris in fact endorsed ethnic cleansing, you’re crossing the line into deliberate dishonesty.

          link

        • eljay
          June 16, 2011, 8:16 am

          >> He has merely made the point that Israel’s crimes are nothing special in the history of humanity …

          Well, there you have it. The “there’s nothing special about our crimes” defense and justification. (Was that Hitler’s mistake? Making his genocide “the bestest damned genocide ever” rather than just a run-of-the-mill, “nothing special” genocide?)

          “Your Honour, I did rape all those women, but there was nothing special about the rapes, so I don’t understand why I’m being persecuted for them. I mean, seriously, people have been raping women throughout the history of humanity…and sometimes really viciously! Anyway, I do intend to continue raping – heck, I’ve even got a few planned for later tonight – but I promise that none of my rapes will be anything special, ever. Scout’s honour!”

        • Erasmus
          June 16, 2011, 9:24 am

          Donald, thanks for this link.
          Could you possibly also let us have the date of the interview,
          resp. the date of its appearance in Haaretz?
          Thanks.

        • Citizen
          June 16, 2011, 10:07 am

          Palestinian tactics are often attacked or defended on dubious grounds. Whether these tactics are terrorist is irrelevant; some terrorism is defensible, some not. The same applies to whether the acts are murders. Whether others are bigger terrorists or murderers is also irrelevant; two wrongs don’t make a right. Whether Israelis have committed crimes is not directly relevant either; that they have committed crimes is not sufficient to justify killing people, civilians, who have not committed them.
          The problem, as anyone will tell you, is that Palestinians deliberately kill civilians. You would think, then, that we would never do such a thing. Maybe not. Those who conducted strategic bombing raids against Nazi Germany, or for that matter those who set speed limits on our highways, did not. These actions, it seems, were fine. Bombs would definitely stray into civilian areas; lower speed limits would definitely mean fewer children killed and maimed in accidents. We knew this with certainty, but we didn’t *intend* these consequences. Apparently this makes us far better than the Palestinians. The scholastically fine distinction between deliberately killing civilians and knowingly killing civilians has become, it seems, a moral chasm.
          Sometimes, though, we treat the deliberate killing of civilians with reverence, or at least feel a special moral pride in our refusal to condemn it. The best examples are from American history. We have not forgotten that American Indians deliberately killed civilians, including children, and sometimes as a policy. But no one demands an apology from contemporary American Indian leaders; quite the reverse. Nor is this simply a matter of the silly business of apologies or other manifestations of political correctness. (If political correctness is involved, it comes from focusing on the warfare of 1850-1890, when the whites were the worst killers, not on the earlier periods when things were more even.) Why then, do we keep silent about these presumably awful crimes? Why don’t we rub them in the faces of our children, so that they will never forget that such presumed evils presumably tainted our land?
          It is necessary to put the question more sharply to exclude weasely answers. The Indians sometimes murdered innocent civilians, including children. These acts were right, wrong, or morally indifferent. Which were they?
          I can’t see that they were morally indifferent, can you? Were they wrong? If so, they must have been awfully wrong, because they involved murdering children. Is that what we want to say?
          I suggest not. I suggest the acts were terrible, cruel, and ultimately justified. My reasons are familiar to everyone. The Indians’ very existence as a people was threatened. More than threatened; their society was doomed without resistance. They had no alternative. Moreover, every single white person, down to the children, was an enemy, a being which, allowed to live, would contribute to the destruction of the Indians’ collective existence.
          The Indians had no chance of defeating the whites by conventional military means. So their only resort was to hit soft targets and do the maximum damage. That wasn’t just the right thing to do from their point of view. It was the right thing to do, period, because the whites had no business whatever coming thousands of miles to destroy the Indian people.
          The comparisons with the situation of the Palestinians are beyond obvious. To start, what I have written sneaks in some misconceptions. There were no people called “the Indians”. They were diverse, as cultures and as individuals, some peaceful, some warlike, some responsible for the massacres, some not. It was, of course, the whites who lumped them together and demonized them (just as this sentence does to the whites). The Israelis kind of do that when they destroy the houses of old women and blockade cities to the point of starvation and medical catastrophe. And when anyone supports the Israelis, they are responsible for this sort of collective ‘punishment’, even if they don’t – as they often do – indulge in the same coarse generalizations.
          As for the other points of resemblance, not only Israeli, but much non-Israeli Jewish propaganda does its best to conceal them. But concealment is impossible. Guess what? The Palestinians didn’t travel thousands of miles to dispossess the Jews. It was the other way around. Often the Jews had very pressing reasons to leave Europe. So did the whites who settled in North America. And both groups of settlers couldn’t quite take in what they saw: that gee, there were other people already there, and the land was theirs. When possible, both engaged in sleazy land deals to get their foothold; when not, force was used. But always there was no question: the whole land would be theirs, and the state to be constructed would be their state.
          Both groups of settlers somehow contrived, despite these goals, to believe that they wanted nothing but to live in peace with their ‘neighbors’- neighbors, of course, because they had already taken some of their land. And sure, they did want peace, just as Hitler wanted peace: on his terms. The most casual survey of Israeli politics indicates that mainstream, official, respectable Jewish opinion asserts an absolute right to Israel’s present boundaries, and at the very least would never abandon the continually expanding settlements. What is considered extreme Jewish opinion, which asserts rights over the entire area occupied by Palestine, is not the Israeli extreme. The far right in Israel claims a territory that stretches as far as Kuwait and southern Turkey. This matters, because, given Israel’s fragmented politics, the extreme right wields a power out of proportion to its numbers. The conclusion must be that Israel, as a collective entity, wants peace with all the sincerity of, say, General Custer.
          Like the Indians, the Palestinians have nowhere to go. All the Arab states either hate them, or hate having them there. And, like Indians, Arabs and Palestinians are not all alike: do we scratch our heads and wonder why, when the Cherokee were kicked off their land, they didn’t just join the Apache or Navaho? Like the Indians, the Palestinians have not the slightest chance of injuring, let alone defeating Israel through conventional military tactics. Like the whites, every single Israeli Jew, down to and including the children, are instruments wielded against the Palestinian people.
          Of course the two situations aren’t quite analogous. Things are clearer in the case of Israel, where virtually every able-bodied adult civilian is at least an army reservist, and every Jewish child will grow up to be one. And the American settlers never spent years proclaiming how happy they would be with the land they had before embarking on a campaign to take the rest of it. One might add that the current situation of the Palestinians is more like that of the Indians in 1880-1890 than earlier, because the Palestinians have lost much more than half of their original land.
          The Palestinians don’t set out to massacre children, that is, they don’t target daycare centers. (Nor do they scalp children, but according to the BBC, that’s what Israel’s clients did in Sabra and Shatila.) They merely hit soft targets, and this sometimes involves the death of children. But, like anyone, they will kill children to prevent the destruction of their society. If peoples have any right of self-preservation, this is justified. Just as Americans love to do, the Palestinians are “sending a message”: you really don’t want to keep screwing with us. We will do anything to stop you. And if the only effective way of stopping their mortal enemies involved targeting daycare centers, that would be justified too. No people would do anything less to see they did not vanish from the face of the earth.
          Michael Neumann is a professor of philosophy at Trent University in Ontario, Canada. He can be reached at: [email protected]

          link to counterpunch.org

        • Donald
          June 16, 2011, 1:44 pm

          Erasmus–

          I think the interview was in early 2004, probably on or before mid January. Looking online I found a Counterpunch article from January 16, 2004 about it. If I recall correctly it’s not accessible on Ha’aretz anymore, but I might be wrong.

          counterpunch link

        • Erasmus
          June 16, 2011, 3:21 pm

          Thanks. I trust Jan. 2004 is a safe guess.
          I did check with the Haaretz Archive Retrieval tool.
          Nada – Nothing there anymore.

        • Danaa
          June 16, 2011, 4:53 pm

          Please peoples – pay attention to hophmi says since what he says is shared by the vast majority of Israelis. That is how they talk, among themselves – if not to the world. That is what they think. Hophmi merely gives them voice, and Morris articulates their not-so-secret desires. Nice liberal zionist types from the US don’t hear this kind of talk. People like Bernard Avishai and Gershom Gorenberg choose to ignore it. Never would they admit the the fact that his precious coastal globalized ‘elite” are very few in numbers and even fewer in influence when it come to politics.

          The real truth is reflected in the fact that Haaretz is only the 4th in readership in Israel. I don’t know too many people who read it there, but then, the ones I know are not really intellectual “elite” and/or are not properly “globalized”. OTOH, as soon as Israelis move abroad, Haaretz becomes their paper of choice – strangely enough, or just as part of putting on the rose colored glasses.

          What Israelis want, what they wanted all along – by vast majorities is to get rid of any vestige of Palestinians. Hophmi engages in wishful thinking when he says this:

          “No one has the courage to address his major point, which is that had all of the Palestinians left or been made to leave, Israel would have no problem in the international community. That’s because, deep down, you know it’s true.”

          Morris indeed resonates with israelis and sympathizers – the problem was all along that the crimes were not sufficient in magnitude. The solution was not “final”. If only it was – there’d be no problem now. Hophmi doesn’t really have problem with final solutions to pesky ethnic “problems”. He has only a problem with the fact that Israel is not allowed to get away with it.

          Thus says hophmi backing his hommies:

          “Morris never “endorsed” crimes against humanity. He has merely made the point that Israel’s crimes are nothing special in the history of humanity, and in fact, Israel founding was a good deal less bloody than the creation of those states that would purport to criticize it.”

          I think we should come to terms with the fact that he/it not only thinks so, but wouldn’t bat an eyelash if a way was found to “transfer” the Palestinians now – or “help” them leave. Everyday his settler friends are trying. Everyday “nice” people sit and sip their latte in Tel Aviv and ignore what the settlers are doing, avoiding saying what they know to be true – they actually don’t really mind…..as long as it’s not them that do the “dirty work”. But brave hophmi does speak for the latte sippers and their friends in NYC.

          I do worry greatly for the Palestinian over the next decade. Here’s why:

          link to consortiumnews.com

          Read and hope. Or read and worry. Or both.

    • American
      June 15, 2011, 1:16 pm

      What you have to understand WJ, is people are out of patience.

      We have watched the zionist use fear and intimidation (and lies) to destroy the lives and reputation of anyone who speaks out against the occupation and cruelty of zionism and Israel.
      So I am all for personal and public confrontation or attacks on Morris and those who promote the lies of zionism and Israel. The zionist have been slashing and hacking and threatening and slandering and censoring their way thru US criticism of Israel for too long…..time to fight fire with fire and go after them the same way they go after others.

      • hophmi
        June 15, 2011, 4:42 pm

        “We have watched the zionist use fear and intimidation (and lies) to destroy the lives and reputation of anyone who speaks out against the occupation and cruelty of zionism and Israel.”

        Like who?

        • Chu
          June 15, 2011, 5:32 pm

          um, maybe like um, AIPAC, silly man. Where you been, man?

          Bad news about Wiener do you think he should resign, or pull
          his party down deeper in the mud? It must be embarrassing to
          watch a leftist Zionist fall so hard; you’re political attitudes
          remind me of him (except marrying a muslim, but we see that
          was for political ambition based on his tawdry sexting to the
          Jewish blackjack dealer).
          You ziopal Bill Maher has a great skit on this:
          link to articles.baltimoresun.com

        • American
          June 15, 2011, 7:29 pm

          Are you seriously asking that?
          Do you live on some other planet?

        • Kris
          June 15, 2011, 7:35 pm

          Norman Finkelstein.

  8. gazacalling
    June 15, 2011, 11:49 am

    I can’t watch it — it says the video is “private.”

  9. Richard Witty
    June 15, 2011, 12:14 pm

    What does “this video is private” mean?

    You guys, including Phil, are taking low-blow cheap shots at Morris, only relative to a political correct position.

    Surviving genocide, turning the corner to an actual life, means something. It deserves appreciation, even if it occurred through struggle, maybe especially because it occurred through struggle.

    • James North
      June 15, 2011, 12:18 pm

      Richard Witty said, ‘I’m BACK!! I’ll jump in and defend Morris right away. But I still have absolutely nothing to say about Lucas Koerner, who was beaten and arrested for speaking out peacefully for Palestinian rights on the streets of Jerusalem. My guilty conscience requires me to ignore all evidence that threatens my dream castle view of Israel.’

      • Donald
        June 15, 2011, 1:15 pm

        James, you forgot to translate this part–” It deserves appreciation, even if it occurred through struggle, maybe especially because it occurred through struggle.”

        Richard seems to mean that he won’t make the mistake of coming right out and defending ethnic cleansing again, so instead he will call it “struggle”. He will even glorify the “struggle” and say that the results of the ethnic cleansing deserve appreciation, but he won’t use the phrase.

        And to you Richard–make the better argument. Try to defend whatever good there is about Israel without trivializing the crimes committed in its name. Be honest for once. You’re really not doing a good job of humanizing when you act this way. Not that you will change. Evidently you don’t think you can make a good case for your brand of liberal Zionism without using euphemisms.

        • lysias
          June 15, 2011, 3:40 pm

          The German word for “struggle” is “Kampf” (as in “Mein Kampf”).

        • Chaos4700
          June 15, 2011, 9:24 pm

          Funny, that, right? Surely it MUST be a coincidence.

    • Leper Colonialist
      June 15, 2011, 1:15 pm

      Morris was born in 1948, so he did not “survive genocide” in any commonsense meaning of the phrase. [I suspect that you are thinking in a more figurative sense.] Unless, of course, he’s selfishly keeping to himself the secret of time travel.

      But, parphrasing Erich Segal, does surviving genocide mean you get to advocate aggression, war crimes and ethnic cleansing with impunity?

      link to en.wikipedia.org

    • Bumblebye
      June 15, 2011, 1:46 pm

      RW
      “…taking low-blow cheap shots at Morris, only relative to a political correct position.”
      Well Richard, thru’ his “teaching” (indoctrination, or grooming future neo-fascists), he encourages continued race-hatred, oppression, dispossession, etc. If you want to applaud that, because it was a struggle for him (when? born 1948 after his Brit parents had moved there), fine, stand up and shout your approval of Israeli evils.

    • Mooser
      June 15, 2011, 1:51 pm

      “You guys, including Phil, are taking low-blow cheap shots at Morris”

      I know, Oy, it’s awful! We’ve improsoned him in an occupied area, wrecked his house, forbidden him to rebuild, and those cheap shots hurt worse than rubber or even steel bullets.

    • Mooser
      June 15, 2011, 2:37 pm

      “Surviving genocide”

      Only Jews can do that. Genocide usually kills lesser peoples.

      • Egbert
        June 15, 2011, 3:06 pm

        Teh Mooser wrote: Only Jews can do that. Genocide usually kills lesser peoples.

        Genius! Chapeau!

      • hophmi
        June 15, 2011, 4:44 pm

        Mooser, there were lots of things I didn’t know Jews were capable of until I met you.

        You set a low bar for everyone else here to slide under, my friend.

        • seafoid
          June 15, 2011, 5:00 pm

          Mooser is a Mentsch , Hophmi. Get back under your rock.

        • Mooser
          June 15, 2011, 6:10 pm

          “Mooser, there were lots of things I didn’t know Jews were capable of until I met you. “

          First of all, you are, as usual, a goddam liar, and a punk. You have never met me, so don’t lie. I’ve been accused of a lot, (and guilty of much more,) but being indicted with actually knowing you I will not tolerate.
          So tell me, asshole, what is it I’ve done? Violated the dictum that any goddam punk-ass Zionist owns every Jew he comes in contact with? Whatsamatter, macher you found a guy you can’t intimidate with your’ “Jewier-than-thou” schtick?

          Let me tell you something Hophmi: there’s nobody more Jewish than me! Yesterday, I had to go up on top of the house to adjust the TV antenna, and all the neighbors put chairs on our front lawn and watched me, they thought it was a Broadway revival! And why was I up there, risking life and limb? Because, frankly, I’m way too cheap to buy cable.
          And you have the unmitigated gall to accuse me of apostasy, if that’s the word I want!

          But please, let us all know what it is I’ve done that’s “bad for the Jews”

        • Mooser
          June 15, 2011, 6:12 pm

          Oh, never mind, Hophmi. I scrolled a little to reach the “Submit” button, and I see commenter Egbert was kind enough to indicate he enjoyed a comment of mine. No wonder you’re so pissed off.

          Gosh, I wish Phil would untie you and let you leave. It’s just horrible that he makes you read and comment on a website you dislike!

        • Mooser
          June 15, 2011, 6:21 pm

          “Mooser, there were lots of things I didn’t know Jews were capable of until I met you.”

          Oy Gevalt why do I pop off without thinking? And then I go and write all kinds of harsh things to Hophmi. Just a few moment’s reflection served to tell me he is so right. Hophmi, I’m sorry! Considering the company you keep, you probably didn’t know a Jew was capable of considering themselves just another human being, no less, but no more. You probably didn’t know Jews were capable of looking around and realising they are not the only oppressed or persecuted people. You probably didn’t even know there were Jews who didn’t spend their time trying to take their situation so mellodramatically seriously. You probably don’t know there are Jews who can drink the cheap stuff, and don’t need vintage whines. And of course, you probably don’t know any Jews who aren’t badly addicted to Ziocaine.
          So, yeah, I guess you are right, Hophmi, there probably a lot you didn’t know Jews were capable of, including standing on their own two goddam feet as individuals, until you were forced to read Mondoweiss.
          My apologies. If you survive the genocide, give me a call.

        • tree
          June 15, 2011, 6:45 pm

          Mooser, there were lots of things I didn’t know Jews were capable of until I met you.

          Ah, what a sweetheart. You manage to illustrate and maintain your overweening sense of ethnic superiority ever when dissing another Jew. How quaint.

        • Chaos4700
          June 15, 2011, 9:22 pm

          What do expect, tree? The most vicious assailant any Jew can expect to face down is a rabid Zionist.

        • Citizen
          June 15, 2011, 10:02 pm

          Mooser, you’re a credit to the human race. Hophmi is a debit, and none of Witty’s creative accounting can fix that. Hophmi doesn’t even have enough individualism in him to change the color of socks he was given as a child. His every response is ant-like.

        • Donald
          June 16, 2011, 7:43 am

          “Mooser, there were lots of things I didn’t know Jews were capable of until I met you.”

          “Ah, what a sweetheart. You manage to illustrate and maintain your overweening sense of ethnic superiority ever when dissing another Jew. How quaint.”

          Yeah, that remark did kind of jump out. Hophmi, take a break from this site which you obviously hate and examine some of your own thinking.

        • Danaa
          June 16, 2011, 4:59 pm

          citizen – “Hophmi is a debit, and none of Witty’s creative accounting can fix that. ”

          Well said!

    • eljay
      June 15, 2011, 2:55 pm

      >> You guys, including Phil, are taking low-blow cheap shots at Morris, only relative to a political correct position.

      Like you, Morris deserves to be vilified for supporting, justifying and excusing ethnic cleansing.

      Denouncing and condemning ethnic cleansing and those who promote, support, execute, justify or excuse it – even if they’re only “holding their noses” while their more robust co-collectivists are doing the dirty work – is not a “political[ly] correct position”, it’s a just and moral position.

      If you were an actual humanist – rather than an immoral hypocrite – you might understand that.

    • Koshiro
      June 15, 2011, 4:43 pm

      Morris is a public figure and he openly and passionately voices his inhumane positions. He’s got no cause for complaints if he causes an echo.
      Compared to the vicious, racist, dehumanizing slurs he heaps upon Palestinians, he is getting off lightly.

  10. Chu
    June 15, 2011, 12:53 pm

    Poor Benny and his revisionism.
    Israel’s Gov’t had better realize they need
    to the negotiate before the whole corrupt
    enterprise falls like a house of cards.

    No one will tell them, because they only listen
    to what they want to hear. It’s Jonestown style
    delusions and a bubble culture that hasn’t popped
    just yet.

  11. Leper Colonialist
    June 15, 2011, 12:54 pm

    Boy, this echoes in an interesting and ironic manner:

    “…Morris now criticizes Israel’s first prime minister and defense minister, David Ben-Gurion, for failing to do “a complete job” because “this place would be quieter and know less suffering if the matter had been resolved once and for all. If Ben-Gurion had carried out a large expulsion and cleansed the whole country”. ”

    Gee, i never ralized that the problem is not Israeli ethnic cleansing; good old David B-G was content to settle for incomplete measures. “Ethnic tidying-up” I’ll call it.

  12. Les
    June 15, 2011, 2:26 pm

    Sad to say there is also this from the EU currently being pushed by AP news in the US media:

    Palestinian State Vote Could Be ‘Dangerous’: EU
    06/14/11 12:40 PM ET AP

    RAMALLAH, West Bank — A unilateral Palestinian move toward statehood could be “dangerous,” the president of the EU parliament said Tuesday during a visit to the West Bank.

    Frustrated by a long-standing impasse in peace talks with Israel, the Palestinians have mounted a campaign for international recognition at the U.N. General Assembly in September.

    European support would be critical, but EU parliament chief Jerzy Buzek sounded cool to the idea.

    Speaking in Ramallah, Buzek said he “understood” the Palestinian position but added it could complicate peace efforts.

    Achieving peace through negotiations would be “excellent,” he said, “but unilateral declaration could be sometimes even dangerous.”

    Israel has denounced the move and has urged the Palestinians to return to peace negotiations instead.

    Concerned about the possibility of Palestinian riots in September, Israeli police conducted a drill Tuesday simulating large-scale disturbances. Hundreds of police in riot gear took part.

    Bentzi Sau, commander of the police Central District, told reporters that police were aware that a unilateral declaration of statehood by the Palestinians “could cause disturbances of the kind we’ve seen in neighboring Arab countries.”

    link to huffingtonpost.com

    • Woody Tanaka
      June 15, 2011, 4:46 pm

      You know what, if I was Abbas, my response would be to say to Israel(literally): “I asked you to stop unilaterally building settlements and you refused. So you ask me to not ‘unilaterally’ declare my State? Go fuck yourself.”

  13. Schmok
    June 15, 2011, 2:42 pm

    Still: This video is private.
    it means that you must be invited to watch. So I cannot watch it.
    Please change it.

  14. seafoid
    June 15, 2011, 5:23 pm

    I couldn’t find Morris at the LSE online and the video linked is private but I did find this vintage Finkelstein job on Morris from RT. It features Morris hasbara on Cast Lead.

    link to youtube.com

    Note Morris apart from filibustering falls repeatedly back on the argument that the “West doesn’t want” what Israel won’t discuss. And now it looks as if that plank of Israeli policy is breaking down.

    • Mndwss
      June 15, 2011, 6:29 pm

      Finkelstein on Valium :-)

      I wish i could see a video of Morris and Pappé at a thanksgiving dinner…

  15. American
    June 15, 2011, 7:22 pm

    Morris is no Said…..

    The words of Edward Said:

    ‘Nothing in my view is more reprehensible than those habits of mind in the intellectual that induce avoidance, that characteristic turning away from a difficult and principled position which you know to be the right one, but which you decide not to take.

    For an intellectual these habits of mind are corrupting par excellence. If anything can denature, neutralize, and finally kill a passionate intellectual life it is the internalization of such habits. Personally I have encountered them in one of the toughest of all contemporary issues, Palestine, where fear of speaking out about one of the greatest injustices in modern history has hobbled, blinkered, muzzled many who know the truth and are in a position to serve it. For despite the abuse and vilification that any outspoken supporter of Palestinian rights and self-determination earns for him or herself, the truth deserves to be spoken, represented by an unafraid and compassionate intellectual. ‘

    • ToivoS
      June 15, 2011, 9:36 pm

      American I think you miss the significance of Morris. Said was talking about western intellectuals that backed and probably believed in Israeli deceptions. Morris has stripped away the deceptions and openly embraces the ethnic cleansings that Ben Gurian encouraged and is indirectly telling Israelis that further ethnic cleansing will be needed to achieve the Zionist dream.

      During Said’s day he was arguing against Zionists lies. Morris is laying the whole story out there in its ugly truth. This must be accepted as progress. Morris allows us to decide very explicitly between ethnic cleansing or a nation of all of its citizens. Poor Said had to spend his whole life trying to deconstruct Zionist obfuscations.

      • American
        June 15, 2011, 10:36 pm

        Well you are correct…but I was thinking more of how any human, much less a so called intellectual, could not condemn a crime that he discovered and sees. I guess the answer is as always zionist have no
        morals, shame or sense of justice.

      • Shingo
        June 16, 2011, 12:26 am

        Morris has stripped away the deceptions and openly embraces the ethnic cleansings that Ben Gurian encouraged and is indirectly telling Israelis that further ethnic cleansing will be needed to achieve the Zionist dream.

        And yet, Morris stil maintains that Ben Gurian never planned or intended to carry out that ethnic cleansing.

        Talk about cognitive dissonance!

    • Miura
      June 16, 2011, 12:22 am

      Here is Edward Said’s impression of Benny Morris before he started spewing racist bile by the bucket. Said was prescient in recognizing the demons that were haunting Morris and which would eventually (actually a few weeks after Said’s death) overcome Morris’s better instincts:

      One of the most remarkable things about the Israelis, again except for Pappe, is the profound contradiction, bordering on schizophrenia, that informs their work. Benni Morris, for example, ten years ago wrote the most important Israeli work on the birth of the Palestinian refugee problem. Using Haganah and Zionist archives he established beyond any reasonable doubt that there had been a forced exodus of Palestinians as a result of a specific policy of “transfer” which had been adopted and approved by Be-Gurion. Morris’s meticulous work showed that in district after district commanders had been ordered to drive out Palestinians, burn villages, systematically take over their homes and property. Yet strangely enough, by the end of the book Morris seems reluctant to draw the inevitable conclusions from his own evidence. Instead of saying outright that the Palestinians were, in fact, driven out he says that they were partially driven out by Zionist forces, and partially “left” as a result of war. It is as if he was still enough of a Zionist to believe the ideological version–that Palestinians left on their own without Israeli eviction–rather than completely to accept his own evidence, which is that Zionist policy dictated Palestinian exodus.

  16. Brewer
    June 15, 2011, 8:15 pm

    Ahhh Benny Morris.

    “I don’t think that the expulsions of 1948 were war crimes. You can’t make an omelet without breaking eggs. You have to dirty your hands……That was the situation. That is what Zionism faced. A Jewish state would not have come into being without the uprooting of 700,000 Palestinians. Therefore it was necessary to uproot them.”

    Logic see!

    “Are you saying that Ben-Gurion erred in expelling too few Arabs?”

    Morris:
    “If he was already engaged in expulsion, maybe he should have done a complete job. I know that this stuns the Arabs and the liberals and the politically correct types. But my feeling is that this place would be quieter and know less suffering if the matter had been resolved once and for all. If Ben-Gurion had carried out a large expulsion and cleansed the whole country – the whole Land of Israel, as far as the Jordan River. It may yet turn out that this was his fatal mistake. If he had carried out a full expulsion – rather than a partial one – he would have stabilized the State of Israel for generations.”

    link to logosjournal.com

  17. brucel
    June 15, 2011, 8:58 pm

    Here’s our report about the Benny Morris lecture at the LSE on Tuesday: link to goo.gl

  18. Chaos4700
    June 15, 2011, 9:20 pm

    So where were all the Zionists hiding when this article and that one got posted? I’ll bet you guys are going to scurry for cover from this one too, right?

    Small wonder you guys are rushing to the defense of the man who’s abhorrent political position on ethnic cleansing against Palestinians seeks to justify crimes like the ones you can’t bother yourselves to even read about.

    Zionism isn’t just racism. Apparently, it’s rampant moral cowardice too.

    • Mooser
      June 17, 2011, 11:22 am

      “Zionism isn’t just racism. Apparently, it’s rampant moral cowardice too.”

      If every last vestige of racism was eliminated from Zionism (impossible, of course) the most salient quality remaining would be moral cowardice.

  19. thankgodimatheist
    June 15, 2011, 9:26 pm

    Unable to watch it. “This video is private”, it says..

    • Citizen
      June 15, 2011, 10:09 pm

      Ditto here. Phil, Adam, MW tekkies, what gives? Why post a video clip we cannot open?

      • Philip Munger
        June 15, 2011, 10:25 pm

        Citizen,

        It is obvious from some of the comments above that the video was viewable when it was posted, and now it is not.

      • brucel
        June 15, 2011, 11:20 pm

        I can empathise with your fustration in not being able to view the video.

        The reason why the decision was taken is that apparently someone at the LSE made a complaint to the authorities.

        In the video, there are a few activists who are identifiable and we just don’t want to take any chances in case it rebounds on us.

        Thanks all for your understanding.

        • Citizen
          June 16, 2011, 3:49 am

          Thanks for the info, brucel.

        • NorthOfFortyNine
          June 16, 2011, 11:45 am

          >> there are a few activists who are identifiable and we just don’t want to take any chances in case it rebounds on us.

          Well, it will rebound on you anyway. I respect your decision, but hell hath no fury like an embarassed Zionist. And, frankly, taking it down smacks of a guilty conscious.

          Let the witchhunt begin!

        • brucel
          June 16, 2011, 12:45 pm

          Not one guilty conscience amongst us, though being arrested, a court appearance, a possible fine and a criminal record is a hassle that many of us can live without. Not least for this!

          We didn’t go to confront Morris on the street. We went to show that people of conscience here can – and will – challenge the charlatan academic on his own ground and expose Morris for the racist that he is.

          However all’s not lost. Here’s a description of the incident, part of a report posted on http://www.londonbds.org:

          Earlier that evening, Palestinian rights campaigners sitting in a coffee shop near the LSE, spotted Benny Morris walking down Kingsway, a busy street near Holborn Tube Station. This was too good an opportunity to miss; in a flash, campaigners gathered around him and took turns to put questions directly to Morris about his writings and statements on the necessity of ethnic cleansing, his call for the caging of Palestinians, and the racist overtones of his descriptions of Arabs.

          Morris ignored the questions and instead marched on. If he was hoping to get away with that he was mistaken. Campaigners simply followed him and continued to put questions to him loudly and asked for him to reply. This carried on for about 200 yards and created a spectacle for the public. Morris then bolted into the LSE building along with his rather confused and bewildered minders. Morris had muttered ‘right’ a couple of times and that was the sum total of his engagement; his demeanour throughout had been more like a criminal trying to hide from the spotlight rather than an academic confident of his ground and willing to take up the invite of open debate.

        • NorthOfFortyNine
          June 16, 2011, 3:25 pm

          Not one guilty conscience amongst us, though being arrested, a court appearance, a possible fine and a criminal record is a hassle that many of us can live without. Not least for this!

          Sorry, the intention was not to impugn. I just can imagine the cross now: “If you did nothing wrong, then why did you take it down?”

          And: criminal record? For what? I know the liable laws over yonder are stiff, but surely you jest!

          Anyway, well done. I saw Morris on Goodman (re-run someone posted last night) w/ Finklestein and the dude who has published op/eds for the LA Times. For me, the cringe moment was when the LA Times dude suggested a one-state sol’n. Morris snapped. “We are different peoples. It would never work. Impossible.” I thought wow: there is an enlightened soul.

        • Richard Witty
          June 17, 2011, 2:19 pm

          How do you expect readers to form their own opinions if you remove a video to protect yourselves?

        • James North
          June 17, 2011, 2:26 pm

          Richard Witty said, ‘The chilling video showing Lucas Koerner being beaten and arrested in Jerusalem for “making the better argument” has not been removed. Still, I’m afraid to comment on it. I’m even afraid to admit I didn’t look at it.’

  20. pjdude
    June 15, 2011, 11:01 pm

    to answer the question posed in the post by phill. the answer for all decent people is you can’t.

  21. jayn0t
    June 17, 2011, 9:23 pm

    For once, I agree with Hophmi. I don’t believe in ‘confronting’ and ‘badgering’ controversial academics. Not Benny Morris. Not Ward Churchill. Not David Irving.

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