Foreign Policy magazine interviews Nouriel Roubini and Ian Bremmer:
Foreign Policy: What do you think of the Occupy Wall Street protests? Have you been down to see them?
Nouriel Roubini: I stopped by. My view of it is that it is a symptom of the economic malaise that we’re facing not just in the United States, but all over the world. It started with the Arab Spring, and of course, poverty, unemployment, corruption, inequality eventually leads to people becoming restless. But now, you have middle-class people in Israel saying we cannot afford homes; you have middle-class students in Chile saying we don’t have education; you have riots in London; people smashing Mercedes and BMWs of fat cats in Berlin and Frankfurt; you have an anti-corruption movement in India. It takes a lot of different manifestations, but we live in a world with a lot of economic insecurity, of worries about the future, of inequality, poverty, of concerns about jobs. And [Occupy Wall Street] is the manifestation in the U.S.
In 2009, [President Barack] Obama told the bankers, “I’m the only one who’s standing between you and the pitchforks.” The bankers got the bailouts; they were supposed to extend credit, extend mortgages. They did pretty much nothing, and they went back to the same actions as before: making money through trading. At this point, I think people are fed up with it. Rightly or wrongly, there’s a huge amount of anger.
FP: Ian, do you think the so-called 1 percent feels any pressure to change its practices?
Ian Bremmer: Less than you think. It’s very clear that there is rising animosity toward the financial sector. It’s true in the United States and in Europe, as well. And I do think these economic protests have legs, even though they’re very poorly organized and it’s not entirely clear what they are or what the agenda is. And I say that because we’re in an election year and there are a lot of wealthy, vested interests that are both on the Democratic and the Republican side that will try to throw money at these guys and tap into some of that anger. We’ll see where it goes.
Having said that, the United States is not Egypt. It’s not as if you have unemployment in the U.S. and as a consequence people starve. You still have a lot of political apathy in the United States. You also have a country — frankly, much like Saudi Arabia — where a lot of immigrants come in and take jobs that the average American, even an unemployed American, wouldn’t necessarily want. 9.1 percent unemployment is very, very high, and it’s an outrage in this country to have that level of sustained unemployment. Yet it appears to be something that Washington is prepared to tolerate. We don’t see an urgency in Washington to truly address the issue, certainly nothing like the urgency you see in Europe today.
So I don’t think the 1 percent is coming under the kind of pressure that would force them to take a different position.
NR: I would make the point that, however, while I agree with what Ian says, that the “official” unemployment rate is 9.1 percent — but the one that includes discouraged workers who have left the labor force or partially unemployment has gone from 16.2 percent to 16.5 percent. And if you add to it the millions of people that you have in jail in the U.S. — which is four times the amount of any civilized country as a share of population — than unemployment is probably closer to 20 percent. And that’s just among the average population. For minorities, the youth, or unskilled people that don’t have a high school degree, the number is closer to 30 percent. It’s a stressful situation.
The U.S. might not be Europe, but the U.S. is not used to having an unemployment rate so high — and staying so high. Usually, when you get a recession the monetary and fiscal stimulus leads to a recovery of jobs in short order. But this is becoming chronic and longer term. Either the United States becomes like Europe — and we’ve already extended unemployment benefits three or four times over — or otherwise you have a much bigger social welfare state and safety net. Or you’ll have people rioting in the streets. We have to do something either way. Either we’ll have a fiscal problem or a social problem.
You can read the entire interview here.
“Rightly or wrongly, there’s a huge amount of anger”
Rightly or wrongly???
Tell it like it like it is. For the most part, these people on the streets are the people that this posturing fraud piece of shit President betrayed.
You’re damned straight there’s anger. What can piss you off more than realizing you’ve been swindled by a con man, and that your vote doesn’t mean jackshit??
They’ve realized that they are powerless to affect change by the use of the ballot box. And its about time we woke up, too. More people need to realize that this two party horseshit has become little more than a tool by which these swindlers pit us citizen against citizen, while they enrich themselves at our expense. Divided we fall, and these criminal sacks of shit in DC are doing everything the can to divide us so we can’t arrive at a popular concensus.
This current batch of traitor trash in DCm left and right, is the WORST, the MOST CRIMINAL, the most SELF SERVING, in our history. Left and right, they’ve brought this nation to its knees, and we’ll be damned lucky if anything resembling a free and democratic society comes out the other side.
This is a good article, too bad there will probably not be many posters because they think another boogeyman is the be all and end all of all our problems. If there is no overarching context for what is transpiring globally, even in the ME, than you have no handle by which to substantively address anything – you become one small group among a hundred others. Better to put everything in its proper place and join hands with more people, pulling up one helps the other.
I’m wondering how much of the OWS phenomenon is the Democrats’ answer to the Tea Party: manufactured dissent. So far, a lot of this ‘protest’ reeks of Establishment –coverage, validation, etc.
but without a coherent strategy and goals the anger does not manifest into action that creates actual change that people want to see
… these protesters are coalescing but they can’t seem to find a voice and a message – it is all about messaging these days – the goal is to broaden the movement- well, what the hell is it about and what does it want
it is so obvious it hurts: “Pay the money back you stole!” that should be the mantra and every American can get behind that sentiment … accountability for the massive bankster/mortgage-lender/credit-agency, et al conspiracy to create a massive real estate bubble and then bill the taxpayers for it when it went bust … the public wants to see indictments, perp walks, trials, and jail time for those who did this to the global economy – not the same crooks in charge and Obama covering for them
The protests are thoroughly American and potentially wonderful. The problem imo is that they are so far largely incoherent and unfocused. Have you heard some of the interviews of the “Occupiers” (strange title)? People are scared and angry and completely unsure where to turn.
I also think contrary to the opinion above the Democrats will in fact be fairly successful in harnessing this in the election, especially if one of the non-Romney scaries gets the GOP nod.
Democrats, especially Obama, are able to wage war and roll back civil liberties at a faster clip than even Bush with nary a peep from the presumed anti-war activist crowd because it will still be George Bush and the Koch brothers’ fault in the mind of a very large percentage of self styled liberals and progressives. The mind is not permitted off the party reservation (for either side).
Ditto financial messes. Black unemployment can break 16% but it will never be the Democrats fault, ever. Because, you know, Democrats, like, care about people, especially minorities.
The people still want their hope and change, will be the ask, look at them taking to the streets! This is America at its best, Obama will praise. Are you really going to turn things back over to those who protect the greedy? will be the question.
Of course, in reality both parties belong to corporations, constituent lobbies and mega-rich/bundlers.