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Thought experiment. Dateline Ukraine

Israel/Palestine
on 82 Comments
Independence Square, Kiev, Ukraine

Independence Square, Kiev, Ukraine

“It was not immediately clear what, if any, direct role Russia played in engineering the tumult in Crimea, but the situation here matches in some ways a situation that previously played out in areas like Abkhazia and South Ossetia, where largely pro-Russia populations broke away from Georgia, a former Soviet republic like Ukraine, to effectively become Russian protectorates.”

“It was not immediately clear what, if any, direct role the U.S. played in engineering the tumult in Ukraine, but the situation here matches in some ways situations that have previously played out in countries like Libya and Syria, where Arabist rebels began to express largely pro-Western sympathies and revolted against the government, precipitating civil war and, in the case of Libya, replacement of the government by a U.S. client regime.”

One of the above paragraphs appeared in the New York Times, and one did not.

David Bromwich
About David Bromwich

David Bromwich teaches literature at Yale. He is a frequent contributor to the Huffington Post and has written on politics and culture for The New Republic, The Nation, The New York Review of Books, and other magazines. He is editor of Edmund Burke's selected writings On Empire, Liberty, and Reform and co-editor of the Yale University Press edition of On Liberty.

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82 Responses

  1. Daniel Rich
    Daniel Rich
    February 28, 2014, 12:58 pm

    One can break the bread [oh, lord, did he just do that?], but one cannot break the basket.

    The eagle can soar, but only the bear can roar. The west will end up with the desolate, bankrupt end of the We-crane Ukraine debacle and its citizens folded into the pages of the IMF’s tentacles of ‘love, freedom and understanding.’

    The yeast beast east will retain its port @ the Block Black Sea.

  2. annie
    annie
    February 28, 2014, 1:38 pm

    http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/02/anne-applebaums-dull-conspiracy-existence.html

    The neocon demagogue Anne Applebaum asks:

    No one has yet explained, for example, why Ukrainian President Viktor Yanu­kovych not only left Kiev last week after signing a treaty brokered by the European Union but also ordered security guards to abandon all government buildings as well. Was that an unsubtle invitation for the opposition to ransack the offices so that he could claim he had been chased out by a violent coup?

    No, Mrs. Applebaum, it wasn’t. The removal of the guards was a condition in the agreement (not “treaty”) brokered by the European Union.

    • Justpassingby
      Justpassingby
      February 28, 2014, 1:47 pm

      Typical ignorant journalist. So tired of this.

      • annie
        annie
        February 28, 2014, 2:35 pm

        make sure to read the whole article jpb. and here’s another w/a killer graphic…Libya, Syria And Now Ukraine – Color Revolution By Force http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/01/libya-syria-and-now-ukraine-color-revolution-by-force.html

      • Walid
        Walid
        February 28, 2014, 4:00 pm

        “Libya, Syria And Now Ukraine – Color Revolution By Force ”

        Somebody forgot to include Venezuela; it’s right there on the same hit list, nonetheless, very refreshing to see something else being discussed here other than evil Zionists, so far but it’s still early in the discussion.

      • Bandolero
        Bandolero
        February 28, 2014, 5:25 pm

        Walid
        “… very refreshing to see something else being discussed here other than evil Zionists, so far but it’s still early in the discussion …”

        I think it would be good to discuss “evil Zionists” here – especially in the context of these coloured and violent regime changes. So let’s start with this Ukrainian one.

        Quote Press TV:

        Israeli ex-officer leads Ukraine protests: Reports

        According to reports, the unnamed Israeli commands a group of 20 Ukrainian militants.

        Four other Israelis, who had previously served in the army, were recently reported to have taken part in opposition rallies in Ukraine’s capital, Kiev. … Meanwhile, Ukrainian media said that an Israeli tycoon provides financial support to the opposition in Ukraine, adding that Israel’s Mossad intelligence agency is one of the instigators of the unrest in the country.

        It couldn’t be, couldn’t it? Isn’t a leading protest party made up of Nazis? See here, Oleh Pankevych, the vice president of leading Ukrainian protest party Svoboda, speaking on a funeral in honor of the SS, in front of ppl dressed up completely in SS uniforms:

        http://youtu.be/ZyNxNffaCs8

        Sounds too crazy that Israelis cooperate with Nazis for regime change in Ukraine to be true?

        Quote JTA:

        In Kiev, an Israeli army vet led a street-fighting unit

        … Delta, a Ukraine-born former soldier in the Israel Defense Forces, spoke to JTA Thursday on condition of anonymity. He explained how he came to use combat skills he acquired in the Shu’alei Shimshon reconnaissance battalion of the Givati infantry brigade to rise through the ranks of Kiev’s street fighters.

        He has headed a force of 40 men and women — including several fellow IDF veterans — in violent clashes with government forces.

        … As platoon leader, Delta says he takes orders from activists connected to Svoboda, an ultra-nationalist party that has been frequently accused of anti-Semitism and whose members have been said to have had key positions in organizing the opposition protests. …

        But why in all hell should Israel orchestrte regime change in Ukraine, when the Yanukovich government in fact had good relations with Israel?

        Quote Clifford A. Kiracofe in Global Times:

        … The media refrained from reporting that Nuland is the wife of Robert Kagan who is a key leader of the pro-Zionist neoconservative policy network. … Using the Ukraine crisis to subvert major power relations between the US and Russia and their constructive joint action in the Middle East serves Israeli interests. It helps Israel and its neoconservative allies in the US and in Europe push for unilateral US military action against Syria and Iran. …

        I think discussing Israeli or Zionist orchestrated regime changes – hand in hand with Takfiris and even Nazis – in foreign countries around the world would be very appropriate here. Maybe even in an extra article.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        February 28, 2014, 5:32 pm

        Oh wow. Yeah I do remember reading a random mention that an Israeli commando was leading the “protestors'” armed assault. How odd is that for a protest movement with a sizable minority of strong nationalists / mild racists? (See Blumenthal’s article)

        Explanation please.

  3. Justpassingby
    Justpassingby
    February 28, 2014, 1:47 pm

    This hypocrisy is so sickening.

  4. marc b.
    marc b.
    February 28, 2014, 1:51 pm

    Regrettably Timothy Snyder was on NPR recently cooking up similarly runny pablum about the Ukraine. I don’t remember a single detailed fact, or counterfactual, just platitudes and smug condescension about conspiracy theory.

  5. calm
    calm
    February 28, 2014, 2:02 pm

    I constantly view this crisis and compare it to how the protesters during the Occupy Movement were portrayed.

    Never once did I ever hear the U.S. media describe the Occupy Protesters as being “Brave”.

    Earlier this week I contacted Media Lens and IPS and suggested a story which compared media coverage of protesters during the British riots or with Occupy Wall Street.

    As of this date, I have on viewed one commentary which sort of makes the comparison.

    What if Americans Demanded the Ouster of This Government?
    Criticizing repression of protest abroad, practicing it at home
    By Dave Lindorff
    February 26, 2014
    http://www.thiscantbehappening.net/print/2165

    Calm

  6. hophmi
    hophmi
    February 28, 2014, 2:28 pm

    I don’t get it. You think the roles played by the United States and Russia in Ukraine are equivalent?

    • Justpassingby
      Justpassingby
      February 28, 2014, 3:19 pm

      hophmi aka aka mini dershowithz lawyer

      Yep you dont get it. The media dont neither as presented in the post.

    • annie
      annie
      February 28, 2014, 3:27 pm

      hops, please link to the leaked tape w/the russian operative talking about placing their guy in power.

      “Fuck the EU,” Victoria “REGIME CHANGE” Nuland exposed

      no, the roles played by the United States and Russia in Ukraine are not equivalent but the roles the US plays in the Ukraine, Syria and Libya are.

    • Dan Crowther
      Dan Crowther
      February 28, 2014, 3:50 pm

      Hophmi doesnt seem to mind the US supported neo-nazi’s. Hmm. Well neither does Vickie Nuland apparently, she was caught handing out cookies to Svoboda thugs. I won’t say anymore because we aren’t allowed to discuss joint zionist – fascist projects here. Although there’d be plenty to talk about!!

      • Marco
        Marco
        February 28, 2014, 4:11 pm

        I think it is worth discussing the U.S. government’s support for Svoboda.

        I don’t believe that Nuland or Kerry and the rest of the administration is unaware of the anti-Semites in Svoboda and in the Maidan protests. They knew the type of people they were funneling money and support to during the lead-up to this coup.

        So how could it be that arch-Zionists and supporters of Israel in the U.S. are nevertheless supporting anti-Semites in Ukraine?

        But the reverse is also true to an extent – why would anti-Semites not just be accepting funding from Zionist politicians but even taking their marching orders from them?

        It’s an intriguing question. The whole situation is extremely suspicious. I don’t believe for one moment that the version of events we’re currently receiving in the media even remotely approximates the truth.

      • bilal a
        bilal a
        February 28, 2014, 4:52 pm

        NATO -Gulf forces were deeply involved in promoting Anti-Semitic Armed Groups in Azerbaijan, Serbia , Chechnya, and now in Syria. But Israel has far greater access to Ukrainian and Russian speaking humint assets for running arms and organizing armed groups inside Central Asia, e.g.

        Israeli-Ukrainian soldier admits on TV she killed Palestinian Children
        http://abirkopty.wordpress.com/2013/11/22/israeli-ukrainian-soldier-admits-she-killed-palestinians-on-tv/

      • RudyM
        RudyM
        March 1, 2014, 12:06 am

        It wouldn’t be the first time Zionists cooperated with Nazis, as we all know.

        More broadly, Zionists constantly draw attention to the threat of anti-Semitism to promote their cause. Supporting (possibly) real life anti-Semites to achieve other ends they may have could actually have the side benefit of promoting anti-Semitism to which they can later offer their solution.

    • piotr
      piotr
      February 28, 2014, 9:53 pm

      Can you explain the difference, other than Russia offered many billions in aid, and the West nothing close to it?

      Ukraine’s problem is that the name means “Borderland” and it remains a borderland. Thus you have two rather stable coalitions, “west” and “east+south” with more than 40% of votes, but no stable center. Moreover, the “western” coalition tends to splits into parts with leaders hating each other.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        March 1, 2014, 4:53 am

        Piotr,
        August 2013- SS Gailitzien buries war dead in Lviv region after Ukrainian Catholic service with full uniformed SS honors and gun salute.
        The news commentary says they killed tens of thousands of Poles.

  7. kalithea
    kalithea
    February 28, 2014, 2:45 pm

    I hope the U.S. doesn’t dream of setting up some kind of missile defense system on Russia’s doorstep, and is inciting instability in Ukraine to achieve this goal. It would naturally be ludicrous since Russia could merely pull the plug on its gas supply to Ukraine and there are a host of ways Russia could make the U.S. pay for such a foreign policy blunder and act of war. Speaking of blunders. I hope the U.S. doesn’t expect the EU to take on another welfare state when it’s barely inching its way out of a recession. Europeans will march on Brussels in droves to stop that from happening. The EU would be stupid to become the U.S.’s lackey on Ukraine. Alas, Ukraine is headed for disaster but that’s what you get when you make your bed with Americans.

    Hey America, you broke it, you own it! Russia should call in some of those billion dollar loans Ukraine has outstanding, and since the U.S. is so enamoured with Ukraine maybe Americans can foot the bill. So Detroit is going under and we’re expected to believe that Americans are all Ukrainians now. Americans don’t have enough welfare states; they want to adopt another one all in the name of hegemonous war games.

    Crimeans can make it if they secede from this Ukrainian madness.

    Oh and the Israeli angle, ’cause you know when it comes to U.S. foreign policy, there’s always a benefit in there for Zionists: Send us your Ukrainian Jews cause we’ve got lots more Palestinian land to steal and settle!

    • Shingo
      Shingo
      February 28, 2014, 6:47 pm

      I hope the U.S. doesn’t dream of setting up some kind of missile defense system on Russia’s doorstep, and is inciting instability in Ukraine to achieve this goal.

      Not going to happen. That would be nothing short of a declaration of war, especially seeing as the US does not have a missile defense system that even works, so clearly the missiles would be there for a first strike capability.

  8. Chu
    Chu
    February 28, 2014, 3:13 pm

    US Media are the mouthpiece of pro US rhetoric, and Israel needs to maintain that it’s on the side of uncle Sam to ensure it survives. Although from what I’ve seen over the past decade, it steals and connives from the very power center it claims to be of and represent.

    It’s like Washington’s corrupted beltway politics, only on a global scale.

  9. Keith
    Keith
    February 28, 2014, 5:01 pm

    Well, finally. I am surprised it took this long to cover this critically important situation which Max Blumenthal wrote about and which I linked yesterday. For those who missed it, I repeat the link:
    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article37752.htm

    In addition to its strategic importance, this situation relates DIRECTLY to the conflict in the Middle East, particularly Syria. I offer a quote and a link from Pepe Escobar discussing an aspect of this not readily apparent nor highlighted in the media.

    “NATO’s wet dream is one thing; it is quite another to pull it off — as in ending the Russian fleet routinely leaving Sevastopol across the Black Sea through the Bosphorus and then reaching Tartus, Syria’s Mediterranean port. So yes, this is as much about Syria as about Crimea.” (Pepe Escobar)
    http://dissidentvoice.org/2014/02/carnival-in-crimea/#more-53152

  10. W.Jones
    W.Jones
    February 28, 2014, 5:26 pm

    Thank you for posting this short article on Ukraine.
    Max Blumenthal has an article about it: http://www.alternet.org/tea-party-and-right/us-backing-neo-nazis-ukraine

    I do suppose it is confusing that Bandera (mildly Neo-Nazi) groups play a minor role in ousting a government that is actually extremely globalist and intent on enacting IMF “reforms” to ruin the country that are recognized by the reforms’ promoters as being unpopular (Forbes Magazine has an online article about the reforms’ unpopularity, noting that the president doing them now is unelected). Svoboda leader Tyahnibok appeared on stage with McCain and in a photo with Nuland. There are also pravy sektor and the UNA-UNSO, not to mention the fact that Yuschenko himself endorsed Bandera before leaving office. Why therefore are outlets that are usually strongly pro-Israeli also turning out to support a movement with a sizable mildly neo-Nazi component?

    • lysias
      lysias
      February 28, 2014, 6:32 pm

      Why? The whole purpose of the exercise is to weaken Putin and Russia. In comparison, neo-Nazis are small potatoes, or even helpful to achieving what the West now wants.

      • kalithea
        kalithea
        February 28, 2014, 9:58 pm

        That’s right. The U.S. and Nato had no problem letting their Public Enemy No. 1, Al-Qaeda, loose in Libya and especially Syria to get the job done, so why should they hold back on these neo-Nazi thugs running the riots and carrying out a coup in Ukraine. The U.S. is cheek to cheek with murderers and thugs, remember the fascist Pinochet? Tip of the iceberg.

  11. W.Jones
    W.Jones
    February 28, 2014, 5:46 pm

    Important question: Who was responsible for the snipers who killed the protestors and some soldiers? Veterans Today says it was the covert anti-government group UNA-UNSO. An official from UDAR, the opposition group, said that one sniper had been caught and that the snipers were not with the government. The general story you find on the web is that they were government snipers because they were positioned in government buildings…. But why would Yanukovych use snipers when his guys are already far outnumbered and he agreed to give up police violence?

    • Bandolero
      Bandolero
      February 28, 2014, 7:02 pm

      W.Jones
      Do you have a link to the source claiming an UDAR guy saying an UNA-UNSO guy was caught as sniper? I looked at Veterans Today, but couldn’t find that.

      The best video I found on that topic so far is this one:

      http://youtu.be/Qe9zlM1l9qA

      Unfortunately it’s in Russian, and I have no English translation. So let me give you a short summary. The speaker argues, that besides protesters and policemen each having batons and shields, there were at least two factions operating with real guns on Feb 20 in Kiev:

      – “protesters” encouraged to use guns and supplied by the opposition with guns
      – a Ukrainian anti-terror-force trying to take out the terrorists shooting with guns on people

      The video gives ample video evidence of – what looks like protesters – having and using real guns. But some of these armed terrorists seemed really professional, so for example they managed to escape the hotel as an Ukrainian anti-terror-unit tracked them there. So it’s quite likely that kind of militarily trained commando soldiers were shooting at Maidan – and likely on both – protesters and police.

      The head of UNA-UNSO escaped from Ukraine to Britain some weeks ago, which says something on which state backs this extremist organisation. But I find it likely that real soldiers were involved in the sniper provocations and arming ordinary protesters with guns was just a method of preparing the environment for these specialized soldiers. As Israeli army veterans now come out in the open to say they led a “protester” brigade on Maidan, it would be a real possibility that there is a connection.

      • Bandolero
        Bandolero
        February 28, 2014, 7:36 pm

        Oops, one correction. It’s not the UNA-UNSO leader who fled to Britain, but the leader of Spilna sprava, another fringe Ukrainian right wing extremist group.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        February 28, 2014, 9:39 pm

        Bandolero:

        The article where they said they caught a sniper is here:
        http://www.segodnya.ua/politics/society/zaderzhan-snayper-strelyavshiy-po-lyudyam-iz-zdaniya-otelya-ukraina-udar-497643.html

        You must use Google Translate.

        You suggested an interesting version: that there were snipers and guys shooting at the bad snipers.

      • Bandolero
        Bandolero
        March 1, 2014, 12:07 am

        W.Jones

        Thank you for that link, very interesting. And no, I don’t need google translator, I’m quite fluent in Russian, and understand a bit of Ukrainian, too. I googled a bit and found a video which may be related to the statement of UDAR lawmaker Victor Chumak in parliament regarding a caught sniper:

        http://korrespondent.net/ukraine/politics/3311633-opublykovano-vydeo-zaderzhanyia-neyzvestnoho-kotoroho-udar-nazyvaet-snaiperom

        In the video title it’s said that the guy is linked to organized crime. In the video there is no weapon shown, and the guy says it’s stupid to allege that he shot from his car on people, but one woman insists, that that guy just has shot on her and some of the other people seem quite convinced that he shot on people, too. But as their is not shown any weapon, that video doesn’t clear much.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        March 1, 2014, 4:26 am

        Wow dude you must get Russian far better than me. It just sounded like a crowd mumbling. Glad I’m not in Kiev. I mean Yanukovych was with the oligarchs, but what is going down now? Oligarchs + IMF.

        “Yatsenyuk was saying that what the Greeks did to themselves we are going to do ourselves,” said Signorelli. “He wants to follow the Greek economic model. Who the hell wants to follow that?”
        Also today, Yatsenyuk promised to implement “very unpopular measures” to stabilize the country’s finances.

        http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2014/02/27/washingtons-man-yatsenyuk-setting-ukraine-up-for-ruin/

        You do realize that in Greece the Neo-Nazi Golden Dawn is linked to Greece’s rightwing elements of the state. How ironic is that, seeing they are anti-globalist. Same thing here. The mob is upset about control being put on them, a right sector official said they don’t want the EU, and what do they get? An unelected president decided to impose the IMF.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        March 1, 2014, 9:32 pm

        Bandolero,

        If you read Russian you may find this interview with the Crimean representative interesting:
        http://lenta.ru/articles/2014/02/28/kolesnichenko/

        He says that the first two victims on Maidan were shot at very close range, suggesting it was not by snipers nor by police. He also points out that they were expecting a Syria situation with snipers for two months and then it occurred. He mentions that the units from Crimea came unarmed for heavy fighting and asked to be removed for that reason, and that they were never given orders to shoot people.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        March 1, 2014, 4:55 am

        Your first movie is hard to understand but it ends: “Don’t believe the mass media. Try to think independently. Good luck.”

      • Bandolero
        Bandolero
        March 3, 2014, 7:04 pm

        W.Jones

        Thank you for that link. Yes, Kolesnichenko is also the PoR representative, who comments on the situation in the video I posted above. It is very obvious to me, too, that what happened in Kiev on Feb 20 was a preplanned armed provocation. The more interesting question is: who are the criminals, who did this? Kolesnichenko suggests Yatsenuyuk and Klitschko and their US/EU backers are the ones to blame primarily.

        However, I see, see my post above, a strong Zionist angle in the coup, that Kolesnichenko does not speak about.

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        March 3, 2014, 9:43 pm

        It has been occasionally suggested that a “third group” did the killings without much specification. It is hard to imagine that the protestors or their close allies would kill themselves in such high numbers (65+ casualties) while leaving the police forces far less harmed (15-16?).

        The police were being harsh in using physical, albeit nondeadly force. But besides the snipers, they often lacked lethal weapons. The major casualties began on Feb. 20, hours after a Coalition agreement was reached. Presumably, since both sides had just agreed and the police were outnumbered, they would not be especially interested in killing protestors at that point. Claims have been made that snipers fired at both sides. The deaths weren’t coming from the regular police so much as the snipers.

        What building was it from?
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrIrZPbviaI&feature=youtu.be

        So if protestors were unlikely to shoot their own, and it would not make sense for the government, which just agreed on a coalition with the opposition to shoot the opposition, then who?

      • W.Jones
        W.Jones
        March 3, 2014, 10:04 pm

        The Russian blogosphere has alot of such videos. A Russian news channel had this interview:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIvM_u5xfjo
        It pointed out that troops in black were wearing yellow bands to identify themselves and wearing occasionally mismatched equipment and regular leather dress shoes, which police would not.

  12. lysias
    lysias
    February 28, 2014, 6:31 pm

    Victoria Nuland’s intercepted phone call proves that the U.S. was interfering in Ukraine’s domestic affairs.

    • ToivoS
      ToivoS
      February 28, 2014, 7:37 pm

      That intercepted phone call was one smoking gun but there is so much more. Nuland gave that speech last December bragging about the $5 billion that State has given to the “prodemocracy” forces in the Ukraine. She was directly involved in handing out biscuits to demonstrators in the Kiev maidan this winter. During the Orange revolution, our ambassador to the Ukraine was openly supporting the street demonstrations against the first time Yanukovich was elected president.

  13. ToivoS
    ToivoS
    February 28, 2014, 6:52 pm

    The big story here is that the Ukraine is beginning to unravel. When it is over it will not just involve the Crimea but will extend over many provinces in Eastern and Southern Ukraine. This is a story that is bigger than anything going on in the ME right now. This process was set off by a successful ultra right coup that toppled the democratically elected Ukrainian government.

    What should be front and center on this story is that it was the US State Department that supported and encouraged the rightest forces on the streets of Kiev. Victoria — f** the EU — Nuland was the key player at State that pushed this policy. We should all know that she was a neocon holdover from the Bush admin that Hillary promoted to be Assistant Secretary of State for European and Eurasian Affairs. That is one high position and she has made the most of it. I am sure that the current crisis is something that the neocon wing of the American power structure has desired and they have won big time. I doubt very much that Kerry and Obama have sought this result and must be appalled at recent developments.

    This is indirectly the result of our policies in the ME. Kerry and Obama have spent almost the entire year working on trying to clear up the mess in Afghanistan, Iran and Palestine without giving any thought to what is going on in parts of the world that are really important. Instead, they turned over the Eurasian portfolio to a neocon. It is absolutely amazing. The neocons create an absolute mess in the ME during the Bush years that Obama has spent 5 years working on and while his attention is there, they come in and help create what might very turn out to be a bigger mess in Eastern Europe.

    • kalithea
      kalithea
      February 28, 2014, 10:03 pm

      Obama is in it up to his eyeballs.

      • Castellio
        Castellio
        March 1, 2014, 1:14 pm

        I agree. Obama is the neo-cons errand boy. Or perhaps ‘eloquent’ messenger.

        What’s to note is that there is no “positive vision” guiding the US. There is simply the desire to f*ck the enemies, where the enemies are pretty well everyone…

        Seriously, f*ck Russia, f*ck China, f*ck European Union, f*ck all countries in the Middle East except Israel and whoever supports them, f*ck Central America, f*ck South America…

        Quite the foreign policy we’re seeing.

    • Rusty Pipes
      Rusty Pipes
      February 28, 2014, 10:18 pm

      I had hoped that Nuland’s reassignment from State Spox to Europe was an indication that Kerry would be shifting direction from the NeoCon/NeoLib policies of the Bush/Clinton eras. Over the past few decades, the Pentagon, State and intelligence agencies have been stacked with neocons and neolibs, while realists and arabists have been phased out. Certainly, with her presidential ambitions (backing Israel 110%), HRC was not going to make drastic changes to Bush’s neocon staffing or foreign policy direction — even if she favored leaning on color coups rather than direct military intervention. However, no matter how distracted Kerry has been by events in the Middle East, it’s hard to imagine that Nuland could sink $5 billion into a color coup against Kerry’s wishes.

      • ToivoS
        ToivoS
        March 1, 2014, 4:45 am

        That $5 billion dollars was spent over the Clinton, Bush and Obama admins.

      • Shingo
        Shingo
        March 1, 2014, 4:53 am

        It’s still a shit load of money to fund an overthrow.

        And what’s more, that 5 billion is the money we know about. There is probably more that we don’t know about.

    • RudyM
      RudyM
      March 1, 2014, 12:21 am

      I doubt very much that Kerry and Obama have sought this result and must be appalled at recent developments.

      Based on what? Obama is clearly waging a not very subtle cold war on Russia. This is not just, and maybe not primarily, a Zionist neocon thing. This is also a Brzezinski style “encircle Russia” sort of thing. Or a plain old neoliberal attempt to create a “healthy” investment climate in Ukraine.

  14. Stephen Shenfield
    Stephen Shenfield
    February 28, 2014, 8:13 pm

    In the leaked phone call between Nuland and the US ambassador in Kiev, she demanded that Tiahnybok be kept out of the new government. But however many cookies she may have handed out, neither she nor any other foreign official can control what happens in Ukraine. They may have helped sow the wind, but they will also reap the whirlwind. Why be surprised though? After all, it’s not the first time the Zionists have allied themselves with fascists (i.e., fascists of the Gentile variety). And the Svoboda party ease any qualms the Zionists may have by tactically avoiding anti-Semitism (though this is not true of Yarosh, leader of Right Sector, who is also in the government). And there are still people who believe that Zionism has something to do with protecting Jews against anti-Semites?

    • Stephen Shenfield
      Stephen Shenfield
      March 1, 2014, 11:11 am

      The Israelis who helped the Ukrainian fascists turn the peaceful protests in Kiev into an armed coup (the mystery snipers may well have also been Israelis) were probably mercenaries in the employ of a private security firm(s), though no doubt with good connections in the IDF.

      Israeli ruling circles are divided on the question of whether Israel should continue relying overwhelmingly on the US or diversify its foreign policy in light of the long-term decline in American power. The diversifiers think that Israel should stay out of conflicts in the post-Soviet region in order to sustain good relations with Russia. In 2008 the Israeli foreign ministry managed to rein in Israeli security entrepreneurs who wanted to fight with Georgia against the Russian incursion; officially Israel took no position on the Georgian-Russian conflict (they said there was no need for Israel to concern itself with every international issue outside its own region). Under Netanyahu the diversifiers may be weaker and the mercenaries stronger: current Israeli policy on Ukraine requires special study.

      Regarding the role being played by the Orange oligarchs. Israel Shamir claims that the three chief oligarchs on the Orange side (Kolomoysky, Pinchuk, Poroshenko) are all of Jewish origin (certainly true of the first, I haven’t looked into the other two) and have been funding the fascists. I don’t trust Shamir as a source (he is basically a pro-Russian propagandist), but what he says is not inconceivable. The fascists playing down their anti-Semitism may be part of the deal. What interest do these people have in backing the fascists? I suspect that the fascists are their insurance policy against the left. It is always possible that a popular uprising will acquire a leftist or at least anti-oligarchic orientation, and the fascists block this possibility by effectively intimidating the left. They have beaten up and badly injured even trade union activists (for them all varieties of leftist are “communists”).

      • Stephen Shenfield
        Stephen Shenfield
        March 1, 2014, 11:44 am

        Finally, it strikes me that perhaps it was Jewish-Ukrainian oligarchs who used their connections in Israel to hire the Israeli mercenaries! Who else is likely to have paid them?

      • MHughes976
        MHughes976
        March 1, 2014, 11:53 am

        This is a terrible business, now looking as if it will turn Crimea into a major trouble spot.
        It was pretty clear that Yanukovich was unpopular and probably for very good reason. His supporters seem to have been divided and even the Crimean pro-Russians seem disinclined to rally around him. On the other hand, all governments go through ‘mid-term’ unpopularity and if that is treated as a reason for violent overthrow we shall have very dangerous consequences. The pouring of massive resources into the ‘protests’ was startlingly obvious – mind you, I’d be doubtful if oligarchs, Jewish or other, would invest too much of their own money when there must have been a flock of carrier pigeons flying from Washington and London with large cheques clipped to their claws. The EU must be involved to some extent but they have released a Nazi virus that will surely infect them.

      • Bandolero
        Bandolero
        March 1, 2014, 3:12 pm

        Stephen Shenfield

        As there are currently very many brand new dollar bills floating in Kiev it seems to be quite clear that the US government had a huge role of paying the “protests” with lot’s of brand new Dollars, but definitive proof is still missing.

        Regarding to who paid out the money, pay special attention to the fatherland MP Stepan Kubiv, who was also – besides Svoboda founder turned fatheland MP Parubi and right wing extremist Yarosh – named as one of the leaders of the right sector:

        About 50 companies contribute every day, according to Stepan Kubiv, who manages the finances and supplies at the camp. (Source)

        “It’s a provocation,” said Stepan Kubiv, the protesters’ chief of security, on Monday. (Source)

        One of the three overseers of the Maidan, known as commandants, is Stepan Kubiv, a lawmaker in the national parliament for the pro-Western Fatherland party. On Tuesday, as the government troops surrounded the Maidan and tire fires raged along its perimeter, he got on the stage in the center of the square to explain what was at stake. “Stand up, Ukraine!” Kubiv shouted into the microphone. “Today the fate of our children and grandchildren is decided. The fate of all of us!” Then, in a hint at the bloodshed likely to ensue by morning, he told the armed men guarding what was left of the barricades, “Death to the enemies!” (Source)

        Stepan Kubiv, a commander from the Right Sector, says that they are collecting around $30,000 to $40,000 daily, but that is still not sufficient to finance operations. (Quelle)

        Stepan Kubiv, the former Kredobank head and a current member of parliament with the Batkivshchyna Party faction who worked as one of the commandants for the EuroMaidan demonstrations, was selected as governor of the National Bank of Ukraine. (Source)

        I find it interesting. Stepan Kubiv, a commander of the extremist “right sector” just became governor of the National Bank of Ukraine.

      • Sibiriak
        Sibiriak
        March 3, 2014, 9:19 am

        The newly-appointed Dnepropetrovsk governor is Igor Kolomoysky, Ukraine’s third-wealthiest man, with an estimated fortune of $2.4 billion. He co-owns the informal commercial group Privat, which includes Ukraine’s largest bank Privatbank, which Kolomoysky heads, as well as assets in the oil, ferroalloys and food industries, agriculture and transport.

        A former ally of Yulia Tymoshenko, Kolomoysky reportedly had a falling out with her and refused to finance her election campaign in 2010, which the ex-prime minister subsequently lost to Yanukovich. Kolomoysky was reported to be a principal sponsor of the UDAR party, which is one of the three fueling the street campaign to oust Yanukovich.

        Kolomoysky has a dual Ukrainian-Israeli citizenship and controls his business empire from Switzerland.

        http://rt.com/news/ukraine-oligarch-rule-governors-512/

  15. mcohen
    mcohen
    February 28, 2014, 9:43 pm

    its a gas gas gas …..the great gas war competition for european gas markets

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93Ukraine_gas_disputes

    versus

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/micah-d-halpern/israel-now-a-gas-exporter_b_4873383.html

    In January 2009, this disagreement resulted in supply disruptions in many European nations, with eighteen European countries reporting major drops in or complete cut-offs of their gas supplies transported through Ukraine from Russia…………and now this

    Israel is now an energy exporter. Israel is now exporting natural gas and will soon become one of the largest natural gas suppliers in the world. This new reality is likely to change the entire economy of the Middle East. In fact, it just might reshape the entire world supply and demand graph of natural gas.

    thats sums up the russian support of syria ,the russian arms supply to israels neighbours,but most important of all eu countries will now have access to cheaper gas and break the russian monopoly of the european market
    one definite loser will be iran wanting to supply the european markets who will have to compete with israel and russia.

    http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/iran-plans-to-build-a-pipeline-to-carry-gas.aspx?pageID=238&nID=59481&NewsCatID=344

    possible events to watch for

    syria….sunni led,kurdish,alawite regions with local government,assad to remain leader of alawites,kurds northeast,jordanian palestinians south west
    turkey ….political strife increasing to oust present anti israel leadership
    lebanon ….increased pressure on hezbollah and iran to make peace or risk all out war from sunni and israeli military
    palestinians…..to accept framework with political compromises but increased economic benefits from jordan -israeli gas deal
    israel…increased pressure to maintain regional stability in the form of political compromises that come with access to gas markets and to continue to encourage seperation of church from state.
    the parable of jesus and the money changers is a warning from the past……….. rabbi pinto and company a good example

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleansing_of_the_Temple

    • kalithea
      kalithea
      February 28, 2014, 10:27 pm

      Leviathan which is the larger of Israel’s gas fields would only be able to supply Europe for ONE YEAR. So you’re getting way ahead of yourself on this one. Israel is only starting to supply its close neighbor Jordan.

      http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/02/19/nobleenergy-supplies-idUKL3N0LO3QU20140219

      Russia and Iran have no competition in Israel.

      • mcohen
        mcohen
        March 1, 2014, 6:45 am

        kalithea says:
        February 28, 2014 at 10:2

        year one….iranian eartquake

      • kalithea
        kalithea
        March 1, 2014, 9:23 am

        Iran’s natural gas reserves are about 1,046 TRILLION cubic feet (29.6 trillion cubic metres) slightly second to Russia’s in the world. Iran dwarfs Israel’s new-found reserves.

      • mcohen
        mcohen
        March 1, 2014, 5:02 pm

        Itzik says that the deal is done and the reseves are kept a secret but evidently there is 1165 trillion cubic feet which is almost 3 fingers in dilation per compressed volume,take that as a base multiplier and you have over 50 years supply at the present consumption rate

    • Shingo
      Shingo
      February 28, 2014, 11:11 pm

      Israel is now exporting natural gas and will soon become one of the largest natural gas suppliers in the world.

      Rubbish. If Leviathan can only supply Europe for one year, that’s not all that big. In contrast, the Ukraine has reserved estimated to be 42 trillion cubic feet.
      http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-02-18/guest-post-europe-next-shale-natural-gas-boom

      • mcohen
        mcohen
        March 1, 2014, 5:10 pm

        Shingo

        you are so aggressive with the detailed point by point block quote lightly coloured background that i will throw the towel on the gas issue
        Rest assured when the gas arrives at your house you will boycott it and use only home grown organic naturally produced gas
        none of this vile israeli gas for you.my advice sir,eat more beans.

    • kalithea
      kalithea
      February 28, 2014, 11:17 pm

      The only way that some of Europe’s gas needs (up to 40%) could be met by the ME region is if Cyprus, Lebanon and Israel pool their gas resources and Lebanon will never accept. Building a pipeline through Cyprus also presents political problems between the Turkish and Greek parts of Cyprus. Lebanon is contesting Israel’s gas finds so it is doubtful it would pool its own resources with Israel’s to supply Europe. Egypt is also contesting Israel’s finds and Israel is suspected by the Palestinians of stealing gas from Gaza’s territorial periphery.

      While Gaza lives in overwhelming poverty because of the blockade imposed by Israel, the latter has also prevented Gaza from developing the gas field off its shores which is clearly within Palestinian territory.

      Building pipelines to supply Europe would be extremely problematic for many reasons. So as you can see Russia which supplies 70% of Europe’s needs shouldn’t feel threatened by Israel’s gas finds.

  16. RudyM
    RudyM
    February 28, 2014, 11:30 pm

    The Omidyar connection to Ukraine:

    http://pando.com/2014/02/28/pierre-omidyar-co-funded-ukraine-revolution-groups-with-us-government-documents-show/

    Progressives need to stop underestimating the extent to which. . . I don’t I even know what to call it any more. Is it enough to say the extent to which intelligence agencies/security services manipulate things? Obviously these agencies are at least partly an arm of corporations and I’m not sure any more where they end and corporations or organized crime, or even secret societies and cults, begin. Speaking of which, more Victoria Nuland, this time speaking about Ukraine with her corporate partners:

    via http://willyloman.wordpress.com/page/2/

    (I have to admit, I know next to nothing about Ukraine. I am embarrassed to say I was even shocked to find out how populous it was.)

    • RudyM
      RudyM
      February 28, 2014, 11:41 pm

      “We thank you for your partnership all these years. . .”

  17. RudyM
    RudyM
    March 1, 2014, 12:34 am

    This seems pretty obvious but I will say it. Under Obama, it seems that if anything, covert warfare, the use of proxy armies, and some small-scale partly conventional military interventions are increasing. The Obama administration, especially in his second term, is taking more of a Reagan, G.H.W. Bush*, or Clinton approach to projecting force. It’s also forwarding Rumsfeld’s vision of an automated military and Cheney’s emphasis on special operations.

    Big wars tend to evoke more public pushback, but the show must go on in some form, so it’s easier to keep it small-scale and (wink wink) covert.

    *True, there was the first Gulf War, but we bought it at a discount price, as Obama gushed:

    By the way, I would reach out to the first George Bush. You know, one of the things that I think George H.W. Bush doesn’t get enough credit for was his foreign policy team and the way that he helped negotiate the end of the Cold War and prosecuted the Gulf War. That cost us 20 billion dollars. That’s all it cost. It was extremely successful.

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0803/23/lkl.01.html

    That was March 23, 2008, by the way.

  18. joer
    joer
    March 1, 2014, 5:08 am

    I think something like this happened in the 1850s with the Crimean War. Europe saw the Ukraine as a vulnarable part of the Russian Empire and the Russians disagreed. I don’t really understand that war, except as a clash of empires under the pretext of religious rights and other noble causes.

    • lysias
      lysias
      March 1, 2014, 3:50 pm

      The Crimean War was basically a war fought by the Western powers to preserve the Ottoman Empire by eliminating the Russian threat to it.

      • joer
        joer
        March 1, 2014, 7:18 pm

        But to what end, sir or madam, to what end? Those types of historical explanations never make sense to me. I call it the “no soap, radio” school of history because everyone pretends to understand but no one does. Were the Western powers sympathetic to the Ottoman Sultan or was it more of a scenario like one hyena(Russia) trying to keep a mortally wounded wilderbeast(Ottoman Empire) from other hyenas(European Alliance) so he could have a big meal all for himself? And of course, the other hyenas were not interested in the well being of the wilderbeast, but wanted a dinner for themselves. And lo and behold, even as we speak, hyenas are still fighting over the leftovers.

    • Citizen
      Citizen
      March 3, 2014, 6:10 am

      @ joer
      Here, this analysis will help you understand if history is essentially repeating itself in the Crimea: http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article37820.htm
      Note the historical Palestine connection, and present Israel connection.

  19. mcohen
    mcohen
    March 1, 2014, 6:27 am

    more fuel for the fire-or should i say gas………….

    http://www.dailystar.com.lb/Business/International/2014/Mar-01/248911-gazprom-warns-ukraine-over-huge-debt-of-155-bn.ashx#axzz2uhoIP8gQ

    MOSCOW: Ukraine owes Russian gas giant Gazprom a “huge” debt of $1.55 bn for unpaid gas and may not be able to keep the discount it currently enjoys for Russian gas imports, the firm said on Saturday.

  20. just
    just
    March 1, 2014, 7:42 am

    holy schmidt!

    Calls re Victoria Nuland and PNAC and Kagan– total 3 so far on CSPAN! The goofball answering the phone has nothing to say to them, but the calls are coming thru!

  21. American
    American
    March 1, 2014, 12:54 pm

    To expand on RudyM’s link to pando.
    Good luck figuring out where Ukraine is going cause everyone and their brother appears to be in on this coup—-US NGOs slush funds going to the revolters (former Orange Revolution), also funded by Soros, also funded by ebay Persian billionaire Pierre Omidyar, Greenwalds new boss and Snowden papers partner, and then some Israelis on the ground in Ukraine.
    This will be completely FUBAR.
    The mixture of the funders and actors in this coup are interesting–the US meddler, Soros, the ideologue…….then we have to consider why Omidyar the billionaire Persian Iran exile and the Israelis are in this. Any connection there to weakening Russia and thereby weakening its underpinning for Syria and Iran?
    The only thing anyone knows for certain about Omidyar is he true believer in US and global Capitalism with a capital C and said his dream is to see Iran become a western style capitalist country like the US.
    10 to 1 though, some or all these revolution backers with whatever their various motives are, will lose control of the actors they let loose in Ukraine….it could be like Egypt and keep flipping and flipping.

    http://pando.com/2014/02/28/pierre-omidyar-co-funded-ukraine-revolution-groups-with-us-government-documents-show/

    Pierre Omidyar co-funded Ukraine revolution groups with US government, documents show
    By Mark Ames
    On February 28, 2014

    ”Just hours after last weekend’s ouster of Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych, one of Pierre Omidyar’s newest hires at national security blog “The Intercept,” was already digging for the truth.

    Marcy Wheeler, who is the new site’s “senior policy analyst,” speculated that the Ukraine revolution was likely a “coup” engineered by “deep” forces on behalf of “Pax Americana”:

    “There’s quite a bit of evidence of coup-ness. Q is how many levels deep interference from both sides is.”

    These are serious claims. So serious that I decided to investigate them. And what I found was shocking.

    Wheeler is partly correct. Pando has confirmed that the American government – in the form of the US Agency for International Development (USAID) – played a major role in funding opposition groups prior to the revolution. Moreover, a large percentage of the rest of the funding to those same groups came from a US billionaire who has previously worked closely with US government agencies to further his own business interests. This was by no means a US-backed “coup,” but clear evidence shows that US investment was a force multiplier for many of the groups involved in overthrowing Yanukovych.

    But that’s not the shocking part.

    What’s shocking is the name of the billionaire who co-invested with the US government (or as Wheeler put it: the “dark deep force” acting on behalf of “Pax Americana”).

    Step out of the shadows…. Wheeler’s boss, Pierre Omidyar.

    Yes, in the annals of independent media, this might be the strangest twist ever: According to financial disclosures and reports seen by Pando, the founder and publisher of Glenn Greenwald’s government-bashing blog,“The Intercept,” co-invested with the US government to help fund regime change in Ukraine.

    [Update: Wheeler has responded on Twitter to say that her Tweets were taken out of context, but would not give specifics. Adam Colligan, with whom Wheeler was debating, commented on Pando that “while Wheeler did raise the issue of external interference in relation to a discussion about a coup, it was not really at all in the manner that you have portrayed.” Further “[Pax Americana] appeared after the conversation had shifted from the idea of whether a coup had been staged by the Ukrainian Parliament to a question about the larger powers’ willingness to weaken underlying economic conditions in a state.” Neither Wheeler or Colligan has commented on the main subject of the story: Pierre Omidyar’s co-investment in Ukrainian opposition groups with the US government.]

    * * * *

    When the revolution came to Ukraine, neo-fascists played a front-center role in overthrowing the country’s president. But the real political power rests with Ukraine’s pro-western neoliberals. Political figures like Oleh Rybachuk, long a favorite of the State Department, DC neocons, EU, and NATO—and the right-hand man to Orange Revolution leader Viktor Yushchenko.

    Last December, the Financial Times wrote that Rybachuk’s “New Citizen” NGO campaign “played a big role in getting the protest up and running.”

    continued…read it all…

    • marc b.
      marc b.
      March 1, 2014, 5:42 pm

      One of the interesting parts of this is the greenwald-omidyar connection. Omidyar, with greenwald as (willing?) bait has now tied up NSA materials and what I thought were some of the best journalists, wheeler, taibi, etc. greenwald is smelling more and more like a fake.

      • American
        American
        March 1, 2014, 7:53 pm

        @marc b

        Well if Greenwald & Co. didnt knowingly sell out then chances are they have been had by Omidyar and whatever his agenda is for his new media.

      • RudyM
        RudyM
        March 1, 2014, 10:14 pm

        I recommend taking a look at what Sibel Edmonds has had to say about Greenwald and Omidyar, with the caveat that (a) I wish she had some editorial help with her English and (b) I wish she wouldn’t lower herself to some of the mildly homophobic taunts here. All in all, I wish she were more professional, since much of what she has to say seems quite important. (She comes across better in interviews and conversations, I think.)

        http://www.boilingfrogspost.com/2014/01/03/part-i-the-doomsday-insurance-cache-that-was-and-then-never-was/
        http://www.boilingfrogspost.com/2014/01/06/part-ii-david-mirandas-detainment-the-calico-kitten-in-wag-the-dog/

        There are links to related material at the bottom of those articles.

        (Hey Democracy Now watching American liberals and leftists! Do you remember Sibel Edmonds?)

        Also some of the speculation re: Omidyar on Willy Loman’s American Everyman blog has been thought-provoking.

        I also was reading a random anarchist blogger who was going into quite a bit of detail on this subject, but I somehow lost track of the url and haven’t been able to find it again.

  22. Keith
    Keith
    March 1, 2014, 6:33 pm

    A few additional comments on the geostrategic implications of the Ukrainian destabilization are in order. First, a hugely influential strategist in the Obama administration is none other than cold warior Zbigniew Brzezinski. In “The Grand Chessboard” he discusses the importance of the Ukraine in limiting Russia’s future potential.

    “Ukraine…is a geopolitical pivot because its very existence as an independent country helps to transform Russia. Without Ukraine, Russia ceases to be a Eurasian empire…..However, if Moscow regains control over Ukraine…Russia automatically again regains the wherewithal to become a powerful imperial state, spanning Europe and Asia. (p46)

    The US geostrategic goal, therefore, is to prevent that from happening, and is the underlying reason for this destabilization which was initiated after the Ukraine turned down the EU and IMF in favor of closer ties with Russia. I might add that the ongoing expansion of NATO is crucial to US imperial strategy.

    Brzezinski recommends: “In the short run, it is in America’s interest to consolidate and perpetuate the prevailing geopolitical pluralism on the map of Eurasia. That puts a premium on maneuver and manipulation in order to prevent the emergence of a hostile coalition that could eventually seek to challenge America’s primacy, not to mention the remote possibility of any one state seeking to do so.” (p198)

    In a nutshell: destroy any potential competition. I think that is what is going on now. The empire is transforming itself during a brief window of opportunity and anything and everything which potentially stands in the way is/will be attacked and destroyed if possible. Iraq, Libya, Syria, etc. have effectively been destroyed. It is too expensive to occupy and control, so destruction is the preferred alternative. I think that is what is happening in the Ukraine as well, and, so far, it seems to have succeeded. I might add that neoliberal globalization is the cause of much planetary social unrest and upheaval. The empire is on a rampage and the global 99% are going to suffer increasingly dark times.

    • RoHa
      RoHa
      March 1, 2014, 9:22 pm

      The ongoing expansion of NATO is going to get a bit of a setback if Putin turns off the gas. Nearly all the main gas lines run through Ukraine, and big hitters like Germany and Italy suck up a lot of that gas. So while the US might decide to get tough with the Russians, the Europeans are going to want to try to handle the business in a way that keeps them warm in winter.

    • Antidote
      Antidote
      March 2, 2014, 7:51 am

      Thanks for bringing up Brz for clarification of the geopolitcal strategies at play here. Culturally (including religion) and historically, Ukraine quite clearly belongs to Russia, and that’s a thorn in the side of geostrategists like B who, next to advancing US imperialism, does have another ax to grind: Promoting Poland as the next European leader (displacing Germany). As is the case with Germany and Russia, Poland has a long history of conflict with Ukraine. WW I, Versailles, and WW II are just particularly ‘hot phases’ of that age-old conflict, fueled by hyper-nationalism on all sides, not just the German one. In fact, Polish nationalism has been as fierce as any other in Eastern and Central Europe, and those who call Ukrainian nationalists “Nazis” conveniently forget that Roman Dmowski, often dubbed “Poland’s Hitler” is revered in Poland, statue and all, as the founding father of the resurrected nation at Versailles. As wrt Germany and Russia, Polish historical memory is severely influenced by myth rather than historical realities. Here’s a recent Ukrainian perspective that also addresses the plain economic and national interest of Poland in getting Ukraine into the Western (EU) camp:

      http://ukrainianweek.com/Politics/26298

      Anne Applebaum, btw, cited above as a “neocon” is married to Poland’s foreign minister (who is playing a prominent role in the present Ukraine-EU scenario/agreement)

      One should also keep in mind that Poland has a history of falling prey to foreign imperial designs while pursuing its own national interests – from Napoleon to Versailles and WW II. The more recent “special relationship” with the US is no exception. The tragedy of Poland (and its neighbors) has always been to seek support from foreign superpowers rather than get along and compromise with its direct neighbors. That’s also true for Israel.

      As to commenters here expressing bewilderment about Israel collaborating with (Ukrainian) “Nazis”: What else is new? And I don’t just mean Israel. The Americans collaborated with the Nazis before and after WW II, as did Stalin (does anyone remember the Hitler-Stalin Pact?). Stalin also collaborated with any Eastern European (and Chinese) nationalists (=Nazis, according to MW commenters) , despite ideological differences. How do you explain his major ethnic cleansing campaigns, and reorganization of Eastern Europe along national lines? Divide and conquer is an old (Western) imperial strategy, and Stalin used it as consistently as did Hitler, and any American president under the flag of ‘self-determination’ and ‘democratic peace’

    • marc b.
      marc b.
      March 2, 2014, 1:10 pm

      I’d add Keith:

      1. This strategy long predates B. Kennan put it succinctly, partly in the context of US control over ME energy, that it was his job to ensure that the great material disparity enjoyed by the US over the rest of the world (including our ‘rival’ in the ME, the UK, who expressed their historical control of that region as their Monroe Doctrine) was protected.
      2. So, the EU, and single states such as Poland, Lithuania, Sweden, can be as much our rival in the Ukraine as Russia. Hence, F the EU. The last thing we need is the Europeans exerting control over Russian energy supplies after we spent so much capital managing their access to ME energy supplies.
      3. What’s occurring in the Muslim ‘borderlands’ in China is part and parcel of the offensive. Under reported terrorist attacks by various separatist types.
      4. Now that Iraq/Afghanistan is winding down a bit, nothing like a new Cold War for warrior types.

  23. RudyM
    RudyM
    March 2, 2014, 5:30 pm

    Really good stuff here (via http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/ ):

    http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/03/the-crimean-anti-coup-move.html

    The alleged Turkish involvement fits in well with what Sibel Edmonds has said about Turkey’s role in Gladio B.

    Interesting that in this case, if the reports cited in Moon of Alabama are correct, both Muslim separatist jihadists and Nazis or at least some sort of Ukrainian fascists were utilized in this coup.

  24. Keith
    Keith
    March 2, 2014, 5:30 pm

    I wasn’t planning to comment again on this thread, however, I received a couple of e-mails regarding new developments which are important. It would appear that we are about to witness a major confrontation in the Ukraine and Crimea as part of a terrifyingly aggressive imperial strategy. I suspect that there will be an escalation in Syria as well. Cheers. Two quotes, first Francis Boyle followed by Bruce Gagnon.

    “I suspect this entire Ukraine Crisis had been war gamed and war planned quite some time ago at the highest levels of USG/NATO. Notice DOD slipped 2 US warships into the Black Sea just before the Olympics under a patently absurd pretext. In other words, what we are seeing unfold here is a USG/NATO War Plan. They instigated the fascist coup against Yanukovich. They anticipated that Putin would then respond by taking over Crimea. I suspect the US/NATO/EU response will be to introduce military forces into Western Ukraine and Kiev and thus make Ukraine a de facto member of NATO, which has been their objective all along. They have already anticipated what Putin’s next move after that will be. Notice also the massive anti-Russian campaign by the Western News Media working in lock-step with each other. Another sign that all this has been planned well in advance. I suspect that USG/NATO/EU figure that Putin knows they have this offensive, first-strike strategic nuclear capability with a rudimentary ABM/BMD capability so that at the end of the day he will be forced to stand down-or else. Compellence as opposed to Deterrence.Just like during the Cuban Missile Crisis. That is where this USG/NATO/EU War Plan is heading on the assumptions that they can keep their deliberate Escalation Dominance under their control and that at the end day Putin will be forced to stand down just like Khrushchev did and for the same reasons. That would leave USG/NATO/EU in control of at least half of Ukraine as a de facto NATO member state.” (Francis A. Boyle) (e-mail, no link)

    “Already the war drums are sounding after Russia moved more troops into Crimea to protect its Navy base and the large pro-Russian population in the region.”

    “Writing yesterday in Foreign Policy Admiral James Stavridis (Ret) called for NATO to immediately increase “all intelligence-gathering functions through satellite, Predator unmanned vehicles, and especially cyber” and to sail “NATO maritime forces into the Black Sea and setting up contingency plans for their use.” This is full-blown war talk – with Russia. Admiral Stavridis was Supreme Allied Commander at NATO from 2009 to 2013. He is currently dean of the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy at Tufts University.”

    “If Stavridis is saying these things you can just imagine what plans are underway inside the Pentagon and at NATO HQ in Europe.”

    “The Russians know that they are being set up. Reporting for Asia Times, Pepe Escobar wrote, “Even before neo-con Victoria ‘fuck the EU’ Nuland’s intercept, [Russian intelligence] had already identified the wider mechanics of the CIA-style coup – including Turkish intelligence financing Tatars in Crimea… And what will the Tatars in Crimea do? Stage a jihad? Wait: the ‘West’ will surely try to FINANCE THIS JIHAD.”

    “It’s Syria all over again, this time right on the Russian border.” (Bruce Gagnon)
    http://space4peace.blogspot.com/2014/03/preparing-for-war-with-russia.html

  25. Bumblebye
    Bumblebye
    March 2, 2014, 7:47 pm

    All those policy-wonk committed zio-neocons/libs have been working overtime to set this up as a mix of punishment and path-clearing re Syria and Iran. Hence support for the demonstrators, fanning it up and bringing about the ‘coup’ – it’s supposed to bog Putin down in his own backyard in the hope that he (and his personnel) won’t have the time or energy left to prevent the next attempts to go after their wish list. Were it not for Russia, would our electorates have had the time to go at our politicians and make our distaste for more wars abundantly clear? Enough that they had to take heed – and thus thwart the zioneo-whichevers dreams?

    • just
      just
      March 2, 2014, 8:02 pm

      Everyone I saw on MSM teevee this morning was ‘crying’ for freedom, and to kick Russia out of the G8…….no freedom for the Palestinians, though. Not one peep.

      Hypocrites, thru and thru. There are definitely bad actors and good folks in Ukraine and Crimea, but I can’t see clearly through all the fog and BS. From what I saw and see, it’s Cold War redux.

      I prefer to watch the various news outlets available on MHz and on the internet.

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