Former Newark Star-Ledger reporter and now evangelical Christian-blogger George Berkin on NJ.com, which is the Star-Ledger website:
At first thought, it seems reasonable that the Palestinians, like other self-proclaimed "people," might want a homeland. But surely, there is plenty of room in Jordan, Syria, or several other Muslim lands where Palestinians may go to reside among their brethren….
In all of this, perhaps not surprisingly, the biblical text agrees with what historical examples illustrate. And while the biblical text is not "binding" on secular political rulers, its perspective is worth considering…
As recorded in Genesis, (or see here) when God called Abraham, God promised the land of Canaan to Abraham, his son Isaac (but not Isaac's brother, Ishmael), his grandson Jacob (but not Jacob's brother, Esau), and Jacob's descendants. Jacob was renamed Israel, the father and namesake of the Jewish people, to whom God has given the land.God gave no similar promise to other peoples….
Unless the Bible is making stuff up, that's a pretty good reason why that piece of property, from a biblical perspective, belongs to the Jewish people. (And frankly, the allotted territory includes much more than just the West Bank.)But there's an often overlooked part of that promise. In the text, God promises to bless those who bless Israel, and curse those who "disrespect" his people.
You may disagree, but in my view, it's best not to get on God's bad side.
My tipster writes: But what's most extraordinary is the suggestion that
Palestinians should just go elsewhere. How? Financial inducement?
Threat? Ethnic cleansing? What's clear is that he wants the
Palestinians out. This is explicit racism coming from, apparently, a
regular contributor.
Hardly the first stupid article from the Star-Ledger: Press Self-Censorship about Jews. To think this ridiculous paper survived while my former employer the Daily Journal died. [I will fix the graphics.]
This blogger is a lunatic. God doesn't give anyone the right to claim land.
Thinking like this lead to the Nazi genocide of the Jews. It's inherent in the Judeo-Christian tradition.
And for the vast majority of Islamist columnists who call for a Palestinian state devoid of Jews. Jews should just go elsewhere. How? Financial inducement? Threat? Ethnic cleansing? What's clear is that he wants the Jews out. This is explicit racism coming from, apparently, a regular contributor.
God doesn't give anyone the right to claim land.<i/> How do you know? God certainly does in the Hebrew Bible.
But the Bible, of course, 'is making stuff up' – at least that's been the viewpoint of all serious archaeologists and historians for decades. (Unless the ancient Israelites went to extraordinary lengths to cover up the physical traces of the Biblical claims, while deceptively leaving manufactured evidence of polytheism, etc….)
ETA God doesn't give anyone the right to claim land. How do you know? God certainly does in the Hebrew Bible. Mind you, I'm not advocating for the land-claiming thing – just pointing out that the lunatic op-ed guy's interpretation of the text is hardly a crazy one. There's some bad shit in the Bible.
Berkin seems to be assuming that the Palestinians are not descended from Jacob. That strikes me as an extremely implausible claim.
America is breaking down as follows: On the Right are the Judeo-Christian Zionists, the quasi-fascist Statist Corporatists, "conservative" Jewish Zionists (pursuing a long game of Jewish supremacism) and the atheistic money-worshippers. On the Left are Communists, Socialists and Statist secular-extremist left-liberals, left-liberal Jewish Zionists (pursuing a subversive long game of Jewish supremacism) and atheistic, materialist, lifestyle liberals. In the middle are traditional Christians, conservatives, paleocons, classical liberals, and libertarians in the tradition of the Founders. They're the most moderate and sane of the three, but ironically, are currently without a party, nor significant political representation at the highest levels of government. No wonder America is going to hell in a hand basket.
RE: …'unless the Bible is making stuff up,' … FROM THE '"GUARDIAN" (U.K.): " Moses was stoned when he set Ten Commandments, researcher claims", by Elizabeth Stewart and agencies, 03/05/08 (EXCERPT) We all know that Moses was high on Mount Sinai when God spoke to him, but were the Ten Commandments a result of divine inspiration alone? An Israeli researcher is claiming in a study published this week the prophet may have been stoned when he set the Ten Commandments in stone. According to Benny Shanon, a professor of cognitive psychology at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, psychedelic drugs formed an integral part of the religious rites of Israelites in biblical times. Writing in the Time and Mind journal of philosophy, he says concoctions based on the bark of the acacia tree, frequently mentioned in the Old Testament, contain the same molecules as those found in plants from which the powerful Amazonian hallucinogenic brew ayahuasca is prepared…. ENTIRE ARTICLE – http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/mar/05/relig...
There is no possible title from God, as title requires consent. But, there is also no possible title from politics. Title is relative.
Palestine had already been ethnically cleansed of Jews between 48 and 67. Just to clarify the less than fair usage of the phrase.
The actual phrase, "unless the Bible is making stuff up," shows a certain deliberate childishness that I think is revealing. The author is regressing to a certain childish stage in his own development, and appealing to his readers to do the same. This suggests to me that in the light of adulthood, such weighting of the question might not stand up to scrutiny, and, perhaps only semi-consciously, the author knows this.
The Bible isn't making anything up, nothing at all. You just ought to, like any book read to the end of the goddam thing!!! I think, that if you read to the end of the book, the deal with God went sour. We couldn't follow the commandments, and evinced a particular fondness for "whoring after false Gods" and adultery. Before long God fired the Priests, wouldn't take burnt offerings, allowed the Temple to be destroyed and the Jewish Community dispersed. Of course He could have not done or prevented all those things, but we did not warrant His protection and favor. And things went downhill after that, they tell me. You got another explanation? God suddenly get tired of us? God got iron-poor blood, and couldn't do what He used to? I doubt it. But if I read my Old Testament right, we seem to have gotten on His bad side.
Exactly – that God doesn't exist. (Not to worry, neither do any of the others.)
What I mean is, this guy is a religious nutter. There are plenty of them in the US, indeed way too many. These crackpots actually believe god came down, lit a bush on fire, and told his self-defined chosen folks to expel the natives from a foreign land. That's god? This guy is a christian? If so, please, bring paganism back!
Does that mean that the Germans were justified in expelling Jews? You don't really think that, do you? (I hope not.)
Unfortunately, the Old Testament can be read as one long story of God removing his face from the Jewish people. If I recall, in the beginning, God interacted with individuals, and as time went on, the failure of the Jews to keep His commandments caused Him to receded further and further from interaction with us. If God isn't taking our calls, and willing to do little favors like hold up the sun and shit, I would ix-nay on the Jewish State until we get the go-go from the Head Guy. Like I say, I'm always looking for the little red cow. If anybody else, Witty, maybe? has heard different from the Boss, please let us know.
"Palestine had already been ethnically cleansed of Jews between 48 and 67" Nonsense. At most, after the crackdown, some elite families were forced to leave. There is no evidence supporting a Roman "ethnic cleasing" of Jews at that time.
Sorry to harsh that ziocaine high you're working up, but the column wants to expel the Palestinians, not the Jews. The Jews, he is saying, have a Divine rent-control agreement, a SuperPrime Mortgage and a Heavenly HELOC on the property, and the assesor is our brother-in-law. But if you want to get your glands going by obssesing on hurts not done you, be my guest. Here, have another hit. But see what they mean about all those brain-on-drugs ads? This is your brain on ziocaine: You don't even fucking know who's on your side!
I often accuse priests of writing theology for the purpose of their own aggrandizement, but perhaps realtors wrote the Old Testament.
And here we all are, Ed, as the song says, "Stuck in the middle, with you!" Oh, wait, only we can't be stuck in the middle, can we. We're Jews, see, condemned by, well, Ed, what, exactly, our genes, or our religion, or maybe it's the food, to gravitate towards extremity, conspiracy and violence? Notice that, folks, Jews to the right of us, Jews to the left of us, but no Jews in the moderate middle. Ed, are you locked in a basement with nothing but old John Birch Society tracts? Cause that's considered torture in any civilized nation, and we'll get the bastards that did that to you!
The Litvaks, my all Jewish sport-bike posse, follows the Eleventh Commandment, "Leave no turn un-stoned" Now it turns out we may be following more than just one! Now, I try to do at least a few good things everyday. I set a minimum. I call it my Par Mitzvah! What? A Jewish-Golfing joke. What could be more natural?
"It's a wonderful neighborhood! Everybody's dieing to get in!"
Dershowitz says that since Haj Amin was a supporter of the Germans during WWII, then the Palestinians should agree to their own transfer because Palestinains can be legally and morally held responsible for the Holocaust. I kid you not -read it in his book "The Case for Israel". Amazing how many different ways one can rationalize crimes against humanity.
It's funny, Zionists are always and simultaneously bewailing the dispossessed and persecuted history of the Jews, at the same time they extol the Biblical promises of inheritance and Jewish Empire. But they never seem to account for the present. What the hell happened? We, the Jews, had everything going our way, most powerful God, in fact, the One God, jealous and defensive of His Choosen People. So what happened? We were thrashing everybody, slaughtering 'em, and if time ran out, God held up the sun for us. So did new man-made kingdoms more powerful than God appear? Did God lose his powers? Did he (may I be forgiven for saying it) die? Whatever happened, it wasn't good for the Jews. So did we fail God, or did He fail the Jews? I'm very reluctant to blame God, but Zionists can do what they want.
Of course, I only won that prize at school for Sripture Knowledge by inscribing a list of the Kings of Judah on my shirt-cuffs, but still, the thing is pretty plain, if you ask me.
Are there no conservative Jews who believe in and are willing to respect the Western construct of separation of religion and state that emerged from the crucible of the Christian West? No classical liberal Jews? No libertarian Jews? The political Jews of Right and Left already HAVE a State upon which to impose political Judaism: it’s called Israel. They should either go there, or stay and respect Western culture and legal tradition. They can’t continue to have it both ways.
Were would Phil belong? For instance? He defines himself as left, is a post/anti-Zionist. Would you be so kind and point out for us the category on the left that would fit his political profile.
And the LORD was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron. -Judges 1:19
I notice God actually talks to Moses, but the later prophets only claim to speak for God (although I haven't read the book from start to end, that seems to be the case with Malachi).
LOL. You are so corny sometimes. But still funny. Ok, so i couldn't sleep and I'm back on mondoweiss. God, i need a life.
I haven't read the Quran in a LONG time, (God forgive me), but I seem to remember that God makes a promise that He will make the righteous inherit the earth, and any that commit "zulm" (injustice, cruelty, violation, transgression) God will bring another people to replace them. By replacing here, I don't mean ethnically cleanse, but, ummm…like God will take away political power, power of governing. Also, Zulm, as best as i understand it, cannot be translated into English and explained in one word, and so all those words apply to try to render it's meaning in the English language. I can't wait for the day when the Muslim world will be free of tyrants, dictators, kingships, and banana republics.
hahaha…I never cheated in my Sunday school classes. But I dropped out cuz my dad was a teacher in the Sunday school and he taught one class that I was in and he would always pick on me and then give me hell for geting something wrong. It was embarassing. We were so confused back then. Some people objected to having classes on a Sunday cuz that was a Christian day to learn. Then we switched to Saturday, but some people objected cuz that was a Jewish day to learn. Then we switched to Friday evenings, but everyone hated that cuz they were too tired after work to drop off the kids. So we then got two days of school, Saturday and Sunday!
No, Hitler and the Nazis did not care for Christianity at all. They justified their ethnic cleansing/mass murders on strictly materialistic racial science. Mass murder and the obliteration of competing peoples has existed throughout history, and has been justified by nationalism, resources, religion, science, progress, etc.
Even if you switch to theological arguments, God revoked the Jewish people's possession of the promised land. Only the Neuteri Karta point that out today, but it was the standard orthodox reading of the Bible before Zionism took over Jewish theology.
You would like this, Ed. Paul Gottfried discusses neocons and describes multicultural leftism as a "very decadent form of Christianity" and hopes for a restoration of the values of the Christian West in the US. You would really like Prof. Gottfried's books. http://takimag.com/podcasts/mp3s/Gottfried-anti-s...
I would love to be in a Torah-study class with you Mooser! I remember when my father (who's Episcopalian) took a class on the Old Testament; he was very impressed: "It's amazing. I always thought it was just a collection of unrelated stories, but it really has a plot, and God has a real personality. It's basically the story of how the Jews slowly made God crazy."
"And there has not arisen a prophet since in Israel like Moses, whom the LORD knew face to face, none like him for all the signs and the wonders which the LORD sent him to do in the land of Egypt, to Pharaoh and to all his servants and to all his land, and for all the mighty power and all the great and terrible deeds which Moses wrought in the sight of all Israel." Deut. 34:10-12 Moses is definitely the most awesome prophet.
What you say really is news to me. Where's the biblical or other support for that idea? Seems like a gem worth knowing.
He's not a Zionist. He's not trying to impose political Judaism on anyone. The Israel lobby is.
You are forgiven, Moses.
"…it's best not to get on God's bad side. Bad side? God? The writer is anthropomorphizing God here, He doesn't actually have a "bad side". He is the giver of life, for goodness sake. It's a good thing he is merciful. :-)