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Survival of the fittest has become survival of the fascists

Middle East
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A week ago, Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu told Likud officials that “occupation is nonsense”. This is a continuation of a right-wing spinning of history that says that Israel is not an occupying power.

Then Netanyahu went further, to speak with clear fascist eliminationist undertones:

“Occupation is nonsense. Empires have conquered and replaced entire populations and no one is talking about it”.

This line was reported by the Israeli Yediot Aharonot, yet didn’t make too many headlines otherwise. One might have thought that Israel apologists would ignore this line as too overtly fascist, but here is the Israel apologia site United with Israel openly quoting it.

Middle East Monitor rightly observed that “[t]he comments appear to support the claim made repeatedly by Israel’s critics who insist that Israel’s policies in Palestine have more in common with the past when settler colonialism and empire building was the norm and racist attitudes towards native population was used to justify the denial of their basic human rights.” 

MEMO also reminded us of another chilling statement by Netanyahu from 2-1/2 months ago, which echoed Hitler:

“The weak crumble, are slaughtered and are erased from history while the strong, for good or for ill, survive. The strong are respected, and alliances are made with the strong, and in the end, peace is made with the strong.” 

While those Hitleresque statements were made in the context of his September visit to Dimona and the nuclear center, the recent ones were made in the general context of relations with Arab countries:

 “Power is key. Power changes everything in our policy with Arab countries,” he said. “Aligning [Arab] interests with Israel, based on Israel being a technological superpower must lead the way”.

This view of power politics is consistent with Israel’s intensifying campaign to create a strong alliance with Arab countries aligned with Saudi Arabia. Last week Netanyahu spoke openly about how the Saudi Prince should get a pass for the murder of Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi, in order that Saudi Arabia relations remain strong:

“What happened in the Istanbul consulate was horrendous and it should be duly dealt with. Yet at the same time I say it, it is very important for the stability of the world, for the region and for the world, that Saudi Arabia remain stable”.

Netanyahu is basically mainstreaming a fascistic rhetoric, the maintenance of a supposed ‘necessary evil’ against the supposed ultimate evil, Iran.

But it is important to note that this kind of fascist thinking is actually quite compatible with Zionism to begin with. And this pertains not only to Netanyahu, or Justice Minister Ayelet Shaked, it comes also from the left when it is being honest about its intentions. Thus the self-declared ‘leftist’ Israeli historian Benny Morris, who says that “there are circumstances in history that justify ethnic cleansing”, also celebrates the American genocide (which supposedly made America great):

“Even the great American democracy could not have been created without the annihilation of the Indians.”

It is important to cite these supposed ‘liberals’ so to avoid being lured to think that this is just Netanyahu, that this is just the extreme Israeli right etc. Zionism did indeed grow from a colonialist anachronism, carrying it into our age at a time when colonialism was in global decline. But just because you oppose someone who is considered evil and racist doesn’t mean you aren’t such a person yourself.   

One stark example of this is Winston Churchill, who somehow managed to write himself into history as a great liberal. “For my part, I consider that it will be found much better by all Parties to leave the past to history, especially as I propose to write that history”, he said. And he did so, when he told the Palestine Royal Commission in 1937:

“I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly-wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place.”

These words very similar to those of Netanyahu and Morris. It is not considered very politically correct these days to utter such overtly racist, colonialist, fascist words. They tend to shock the liberals – and they should.

“I know that this stuns the Arabs and the liberals and the politically correct types”,

Benny Morris said to Ari Shavit, just after saying that

“If [Ben-Gurion] was already engaged in expulsion, maybe he should have done a complete job”.

(That interview in Haaretz, from 2004, is titled ‘Survival of the Fittest’).

But with the increasing rise of right-wing and fascist leaders in what is generally considered the West and beyond, these expressions seem to survive with little condemnation, and the fascists even rejoice in their rejection of ‘political correctness’, and in the belief that now one may be more honest about one’s racism and genocidal policies.

This explains very well the bromance between Netanyahu and ultra-nationalists such as Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban (who has engaged in Jew-baiting and praise of Nazi collaborators), Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte (who compared himself to Hitler), or the newly elected Brasilian President Jair Bolsonaro. Bolsonaro has his own indigenous people, about whom he says:

“Minorities have to bend down to the majority … The minorities [should] either adapt or simply vanish”. 

All of this is a kind of Darwinist-racist “survival of the fittest”, which is more precisely “survival of the fascists”. Opposition to such ideologies is always discouraged and dismissed by these people; they see themselves as “respected” because they are “strong”, as Netanyahu says; and anyone who opposes their chauvinism is destined to “crumble, [be] slaughtered and [be] erased from history.” Because the “strong” are the only ones worthy of survival.

This, together with Netanyahu’s “forever live by the sword“, is the Spartan nature of Zionism. “Leftist” Ehud Barak calls the country a “villa in the jungle”. But who cares how they choose to characterize colonialism? If they want to channel Churchill and write up their history as a “light unto the nations” and “survival of the higher-grade race”, let them do so. I’m not buying. I’ve already seen the Zionist light, with all its darkness.

H/t Mick Napier

About Jonathan Ofir

Israeli musician, conductor and blogger / writer based in Denmark.

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44 Responses

  1. Bumblebye
    Bumblebye
    November 12, 2018, 2:29 pm

    Bombing continues in Gaza. Tonight the al-Aqsa tv station builďing has just been bombed.

  2. Mooser
    Mooser
    November 12, 2018, 4:27 pm

    ” Empires have conquered and replaced entire populations and no one is talking about it”.”

    Yup, “empires” have gotten away with a lot. A tiny Zionist remittance colony in Palestine, on the other hand, doesn’t quite have the same options.

  3. gamal
    gamal
    November 12, 2018, 11:13 pm

    “All of this is a kind of Darwinist-racist “survival of the fittest”, which is more precisely “survival of the fascists” ”

    this lecture in Denmark by Isa Blumi, many thanks Mr. T, is really excellent in that it approaches the vocabulary of ‘conflict’ in the west in respect of the Yemen genocide and how this is all normalized just as it has been for a hundred years in Palestine and even longer elsewhere, it does appear that everything one knows is wrong, well worth an hour.

    https://youtu.be/01NVz5MAOIg

  4. Misterioso
    Misterioso
    November 13, 2018, 11:35 am

    ATTENTION Philip Weiss, et al. The author of this article, Professor Bruce Robbins, makes two complimentary comments regarding Mondoweiss.

    https://www.thenation.com/article/on-boycotts-academic-freedom-and-the-struggle-for-justice-in-israel-palestine/

    “On Boycotts, Academic Freedom, and the Struggle for Justice in Israel-Palestine,” The Nation,
    Nov.1/18 by Bruce Robbins
    Bruce Robbins is Old Dominion Foundation Professor in the Humanities at Columbia University.

    “The big story in the United States is the growing support for the Palestinian cause, and for a just and viable Israel that gives equal rights to all its citizens.”

    “When the young Palestinian-American Lara Alqasem was finally allowed to enter Israel after being detained at the airport and threatened with deportation, who won? Liberal Zionists, many of whom had championed her case, felt they had cause to celebrate. You see, they could now tell the world, Israel is not (yet) the bastion of build-the-wall intolerance that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, like his buddy in the White House, has wanted to make of his country. On October 16, two days before the Israeli Supreme Court’s decision, Jeremy Ben-Ami, president and founder of J Street, had an op-ed in Haaretz under the title ‘The Ban on Lara Alqasem Is a Gift for BDS, and a Disaster for Israel.’ J Street, which opposes the movement for Boycott, Divestment, and Sanctions (BDS), was naturally pleased that Alqasem had distanced herself from her earlier activities on behalf of BDS. It took the court’s decision to let her in as ‘a strong sign of the continued vitality of pro-democratic forces in Israel.’

    “How much vitality there is or isn’t among pro-democratic forces in Israel is, indeed, a crucial question. When I interviewed the Israeli historian Shlomo Sand, of Tel Aviv University, he said that he himself had initially opposed BDS, and had written an op-ed in Haaretz to say so. He had changed his mind, he told me, when he realized how very weak the Israeli left is, and is likely to remain for the foreseeable future. If the Israeli left was not getting its act together, if there was no prospect of its persuading Israel even to end the occupation of the West Bank, this was not just a sad judgment on the left. It meant something much more important: It meant that the Palestinians had no chance of receiving justice from any pro-democratic swing inside Israel. It was that realization, Sand said, that pushed him over into the pro-BDS camp. Only international pressure, he concluded, can possibly move Israel to change. Domestic pressure is effectively nonexistent. No doubt that was why Palestinian civil society had decided in the first place to launch BDS, a direct appeal to international opinion.

    “My interview with Sand was conducted before Israel passed its infamous nation-state law this past summer, which enshrines Jewish identity at the expense of 20 percent of Israel’s citizens and, of course, at the expense of democracy. Sand’s argument has only gotten stronger.

    “The extreme mutedness of Israeli voices demanding justice for Palestinians is also a specific argument for the academic boycott of Israel. Many progressives in the United States tend to imagine that Israeli universities are embattled islands of enlightenment and dissidence in a sea of thuggish Israeli xenophobia à la Donald Trump, and that boycotting the Israeli universities is therefore unfair and counterproductive. Nothing could be further from the truth. Aside from the routine discrimination against Palestinian students in 1948 Israel, not to speak of the harassment of anyone with an Arabic-sounding name who seeks affiliation with a Palestinian university in the occupied territories as a teacher or researcher, active academic complicity in the occupation and Israel’s military attacks on Gaza is broken only by lethargic silence. Where are the protests? Where are the signs of dissidence? How different is study at an Israeli university from the weaponized Zionist propaganda tours of Birthright Israel? While there are principled, progressive, and even radical professors scattered throughout Israeli higher education, neither the collective voice of the professoriate nor the universities as institutions have spoken out against the occupation.

    “On Philip Weiss’s indispensable Mondoweiss website, Nada Elia took the opportunity of the Alqasem case to wonder what her liberal Zionist supporters would have said if Alqasem had applied to study or teach at a Palestinian university like Birzeit or Al Quds, which Israel routinely bars faculty from doing. As a smaller but telling index of Israel’s indifference to elementary rights, it also seems worth mentioning, as Molly Minta has in these pages, that the Israeli border officials who stopped Alqasem at the airport did so by consulting Canary Mission, an online Zionist blacklist that is privately run and does not screen those who supply their denunciations. Anyone with a grudge can enter your name and get you denied entry for your year of study abroad.

    “Under the circumstances, what morally responsible faculty member would volunteer to write an enthusiastic letter of recommendation (as all letter-writers know, to say yes is to commit yourself to ginning up some enthusiasm) for a student who wanted to spend a year in Israel? It’s not hard to understand why John Cheney-Lippold, a tenured faculty member at the University of Michigan who also supports BDS, refused to write such a letter. What’s more puzzling is that the University of Michigan decided to punish him for not doing something that he was absolutely free not to do. This is a clear case of freedom of conscience as well as academic freedom. Where Israel is concerned, university administrations tend to forget the principles of academic freedom that they would otherwise claim they uphold. If the University of Michigan truly cares about non-discrimination, it will see that Cheney-Lippold is politely asking Israel to stop discriminating.

    “So who won? Yes, Israel successfully bullied Lara Alqasem into backing away from her undergraduate role as president of a local chapter of Students for Justice in Palestine. Governments can always get recantations from the weak and vulnerable who have had a taste of imprisonment, whether they stand to lose a planned year of studying Hebrew and human rights or a great deal more than that. And yes again, even very progressive Democratic candidates in the midterms have backed off earlier statements about justice in the Middle East, fearful of being tagged as anti-Semitic or anti-Israel. But the big story in the United States is the growing support for the Palestinian cause, including support by those same candidates and by groups like Students for Justice in Palestine, most of which is also support for a just and viable Israel—not as a ‘Jewish state,’ but as a democracy with equal rights for all its citizens.

    “When the Israeli Supreme Court decided to let Lara Alqasem in, democracy was not the winner. The court did not question Israel’s right to deny entry to supporters of BDS, and it probably could not have done so. Along with no recognized borders, Israel has no constitution that the law might violate. Except for refugees, international law does not guarantee anyone’s right to enter another country. Where anti-BDS legislation is almost certainly unconstitutional is in the United States (see, for example, this 2016 article in the Harvard Law Review). That’s where the real war for justice in Israel-Palestine is being waged.

    “And in that war, BDS has had more than its share of high-profile successes lately. Just this month, Sarah Schulman and Jewish Voice for Peace talked Transparent creator Jill Soloway into deciding not to shoot, as planned, in East Jerusalem. And on October 23 Mondoweiss reported that more than 30 student groups at NYU had pledged non-cooperation with NYU’s study-abroad program in Tel Aviv. The reason they give for their stand is simple: In discriminating against Palestinian and Muslim students, among others, Israel has failed to respect the principles of academic freedom, principles to which NYU ought also to be committed. As the ever more corporate-style administrations of both NYU and the University of Michigan know well, study-abroad programs are money makers, popular with their student clients. As more pledges of non-cooperation with study-abroad programs accumulate, we will see whether BDS is really, in Jeremy Ben-Ami’s words, a ‘pesky but largely toothless challenge.'”

    ______________________________________________________________________________

    “Correction: The text has been updated to reflect the fact that it was Nada Elia, not Philip Weiss, who wrote the article for Mondoweiss speculating about what would have happened if Lara Alqasem had wanted to attend a Palestinian university.”

  5. Misterioso
    Misterioso
    November 13, 2018, 11:46 am

    If the six million Jews exterminated by the Nazis could rise from the dead, they would know how to deal with Netanyahu and his fellow murderous Zionist thugs.

    https://www.counterpunch.org/2018/11/08/with-brazils-bolsonaro-israel-finds-another-natural-partner-on-the-far-right/

    “With Brazil’s Bolsonaro, Israel Finds Another Natural Partner on the Far-Right” by Jonathan Cook, Counterpunch, Nov. 8/18

    “The victory of Jair Bolsonaro in Brazil’s presidential election last week has won Israel a passionate new friend on the international stage. The world’s fifth-most populous nation will now be “coloured in blue and white”, an Israeli official said, referring to the colours of Israel’s flag.

    “The Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu immediately called to congratulate Bolsonaro, a former army officer with a pronounced nostalgia for his country’s 20-year military dictatorship. Critics describe him as a neo-fascist.

    “According to Israeli media reports, it is “highly probable” that Netanyahu will attend Bolsonaro’s inauguration on January 1.

    “The Brazilian president-elect has already promised that his country will be the third to relocate its embassy to Jerusalem, after the United States and Guatemala. That will further undermine Palestinian hopes for an eventual state with East Jerusalem as its capital. Bolsonaro has told Israel that it can count on Brazil’s vote at the United Nations, and has threatened to close the Palestinian embassy in Brasilia.

    “One might imagine that Netanyahu is simply being pragmatic in cozying up to Bolsonaro, given Brazil’s importance. But that would be to ignore an unmistakable trend: Israel has relished the recent emergence of far-right leaders across the Americas and Europe, often to the horror of local Jewish communities Bolsonaro has divided Brazil’s 100,000 Jews. Some have been impressed by the frequent appearance of Israeli flags at his rallies and his anti-Palestinian stance. But others point out that he regularly expresses hostility to minorities. They suspect that Bolsonaro covets Israel’s military expertise and the votes of tens of millions of fundamentalist Christians in Brazil, who see Israel as central to their apocalyptic, and in many cases anti-Semitic, beliefs.

    “Not that this worries Netanyahu. He has been engaged in a similar bromance with Viktor Orban, the ultra-nationalist prime minister of Hungary, who barely veils his Jew-baiting and has eulogised Miklos Horthy, a Hungarian leader who collaborated with the Nazis.

    “Netanyahu has also courted Poland’s far-right prime minister Mateusz Morawiecki, even as the latter has fuelled Holocaust revisionism with legislation to outlaw criticism of Poland for its involvement in the Nazi death camps. Millions of Jews were exterminated in such camps.

    “Israel is cultivating alliances with other ultra-nationalists – in and out of power – in the Czech Republic, Italy, Switzerland, Germany and Austria.

    “The conclusion drawn by Jewish communities abroad is that their wellbeing – even their safety – is now a much lower priority than bolstering Israel’s diplomatic influence. That was illustrated starkly last week in the immediate aftermath of a massacre at a Pittsburgh synagogue on October 27. Robert Bowers gunned down 11 worshippers in the worst anti-Semitic attack in US history.

    “Jewish communities have linked the awakening of the white-nationalist movement to which Bowers belonged to the Trump administration’s hostile rhetoric towards immigrants and ethnic minorities.

    “In Pittsburgh, huge crowds protested as Trump paid a condolence visit to the Tree of Life synagogue, holding banners aloft with slogans such as: ‘President Hate, leave our state.’

    “Equally hard to ignore is that Israeli leaders, while they regularly denounce US and European left-wingers as anti-Semites for criticizing Israel over its abuse of Palestinians, have remained studiously silent on Trump’s inflammatory statements.

    “Chemi Shalev, a commentator for the Israeli newspaper Haaretz, noted the disturbing impression created by Ron Dermer, Israel’s ambassador to the US, escorting Trump through Pittsburgh. Dermer looked like a ‘bodyguard’, shielding the president from local Jewish protesters, Shalev observed.

    “Meanwhile, tone-deaf diaspora affairs minister Naftali Bennett, leader of largest Israeli settler party, the Jewish Home, milked the local community’s pain over the Pittsburgh massacre to Israel’s advantage. At an official commemoration service, he compared Bowers’ bullets to rockets fired by Palestinians, describing both as examples of antisemitism

    “In an online post before the attack, Bowers singled out the synagogue for its prominent role helping refugees gain asylum in the US

    “Trump has rapidly turned immigration into a ‘national security’ priority. Last week, he sent thousands of US troops to the border with Mexico to stop what he termed an ‘invasion’ by refugees from Central America.

    “Drawing on the histories of their own families having fled persecution, liberal Jews such as those at the Pittsburgh synagogue believe it is a moral imperative to assist refugees escaping oppression and conflict. That message is strenuously rejected not only by Trump, but by the Israeli government.

    “In a move Trump hopes to replicate on the Mexico border, Israel has built a 250km wall along the border with Egypt to block the path of asylum-seekers from war-torn Africa.

    “Netanyahu’s government has also circumvented international law and Israeli court rulings to jail and then deport existing refugees back to Africa, despite evidence that they will be placed in grave danger. Bennett has termed the refugees “a plague of illegal infiltrators”, while the culture minister Miri Regev has labelled them a ‘cancer.’ Polls suggest that more than half of Israeli Jews agree.

    “Separately, Israel’s nation-state law, passed in the summer, gives constitutional weight to the notion that Israel belongs exclusively to Jews, stripping the fifth of the population who are Palestinian citizens of the most basic rights.

    “More generally, Israel views Palestinians through a single prism: as a demographic threat to the Jewishness of the Greater Israel project that Netanyahu has been advancing. In short, Israel’s leaders are not simply placating a new wave of white-nationalist and neo-fascist leaders. They have a deep-rooted ideological sympathy with them.

    “For the first time, overseas Jewish communities are being faced with a troubling dilemma. Do they really wish to subscribe to a Jewish nationalism in Israel that so strongly echoes the ugly rhetoric and policies threatening them at home?”

  6. Eva Smagacz
    Eva Smagacz
    November 13, 2018, 3:16 pm

    “write up their history as a “light unto the nations” and “survival of the higher-grade race”.”

    Supremacism is such an alluring ideology – you can luxuriate in the idea that your “race” evolved from apes with longer tails and eyelashes and with most luxuriant, softest, furriest coat of all the inferior unterapes around you.
    168/183

    • Maximus Decimus Meridius
      Maximus Decimus Meridius
      November 14, 2018, 12:11 pm

      Can I ask what those numbers at the end of your posts refer to, Eva?

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 14, 2018, 2:08 pm

        ” those numbers”

        Represent the posts ‘printed’ (168) and number submitted overall (183), giving a 92% ‘print’ rate. “Eva” has been keeping track for a long while, too.

      • Eva Smagacz
        Eva Smagacz
        November 14, 2018, 3:57 pm

        There are topics I was consistently moderated on, and they bear no relation to moderation policy.

        They are tangentially related to the fact that I am Polish and have Polish take on Polish-Jewish relationships in the last thousand of years in Eastern Europe. Usually, any post that then refers to topic being moderated is also moderated.

        So moderation was (is) a form of un-acknowledged censorship that readers of Mondoweiss were completely oblivious to. This made me feel too much like living under communism. In Poland, on occasion, when communist censor pulled the story, defiant editors published blank pages. My numbering system is a bit like those blank pages. 171/186

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 14, 2018, 7:10 pm

        “So moderation was (is) a form of un-acknowledged censorship that readers of Mondoweiss were completely oblivious to.”

        You don’t think the yellow hi-lite on submitted comments sort of gives the game away? It says: “Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

      • RoHa
        RoHa
        November 14, 2018, 9:43 pm

        “So moderation was (is) a form of un-acknowledged censorship that readers of Mondoweiss were completely oblivious to.”

        I am well aware of the sort of comments that the moderators will not let through. I keep trying, though.

      • Eva Smagacz
        Eva Smagacz
        November 15, 2018, 10:27 am

        Mooser, you said:

        ““So moderation was (is) a form of un-acknowledged censorship that readers of Mondoweiss were completely oblivious to.

        You don’t think the yellow hi-lite on submitted comments sort of gives the game away? It says: “Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

        There were posts in Mondoweiss that appeared to have virtually no discussion in comments.
        In reality, may people tried to get discussion going, but they were moderated out.
        Don’t get me wrong, Mooser – I agree and honour the moderation policy of Mondoweiss.

        I respect Phil, and it is his blog, and his comments policy.

        What I do not respect, do not like and consider unethical is that (some) moderators are putting their own comments policy in place, and then policing the system so that this deviation from stated goals of the blog is deliberately hidden.

        172/187

      • Keith
        Keith
        November 15, 2018, 11:16 am

        EVA SMAGACZ- “What I do not respect, do not like and consider unethical is that (some) moderators are putting their own comments policy in place, and then policing the system so that this deviation from stated goals of the blog is deliberately hidden.”

        I doubt that the current moderation is a deviation from Mondoweiss policy. On 10/24/12, Phil and Adam announced a change to the comments policy a part of which I quote below. This change is not explicitly acknowledged in the written comments policy one can link to. Perhaps it should be. Follow the link to read the whole statement.

        “Several times in the life of this site, we’ve revised the comments policy so as to limit offensive speech. We’re about to do so again—and this time move the goal line. Whereas in the past we have published comments on the basis of whether they abide by certain ground rules, our new policy will involve editorial discretion about the content of comments. Yes that is a subjective test, but we have no other choice.” https://mondoweiss.net/2012/10/changes-to-the-mondoweiss-comment-policy/

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 15, 2018, 4:48 pm

        “I am well aware of the sort of comments that the moderators will not let through.”

        Yes, but noting the number submitted / the number printed provides numerological evidence of censorship.

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 15, 2018, 6:59 pm

        “(some) moderators are putting their own comments policy in place, and then policing the system so that this deviation from stated goals of the blog is deliberately hidden.” “Eva”

        Okay, maybe that is happening, but I feel very sure if Phil or Adam knew about it, they would put an immediate stop to it.

      • RoHa
        RoHa
        November 15, 2018, 8:40 pm

        Numerology is preferable to haruspicy (less messy), but I’ll stick to the 易經.

      • annie
        annie
        November 16, 2018, 1:28 am

        So moderation was (is) a form of un-acknowledged censorship that readers of Mondoweiss were completely oblivious to. This made me feel too much like living under communism. In Poland, on occasion, when communist censor pulled the story, defiant editors published blank pages. My numbering system is a bit like those blank pages. 171/186

        yes, we know. your silent scream out to the world reminding us every time you post you’ve been censored. it never occurred to me it was for your own records.

        Okay, maybe that is happening,

        mooser, a moderator policing the system putting their own comments policy in place deviating from stated goals of MW and keeping it deliberately hidden? hmm. i dunno. it’s fairly simple for anyone on staff just too click on the trash file and review the censored comments. one could even put someones name in search and read all of one poster’s censored comments for the whole year.

        Supremacism is such an alluring ideology –….They are tangentially related to the fact that I … take on Polish-Jewish relationships in the last thousand of years in Eastern Europe. ….There were posts in Mondoweiss that appeared to have virtually no discussion in comments.
        In reality, may people tried to get discussion going, but they were moderated out.

        eva, yeah, back in the days we used to host comment sections about pre ww2/holocaust and sometimes they would run into the 1000 of comments. there are a lot of people who really like talking about the holocaust and pre holocaust and the dynamics of relations between the jewish community and the countries in which they lived. we often don’t host those discussions. you being polish would not be grounds to make an exception to that. even if you really think it’s important or relevant. this is not a hidden agenda, it was announced on the front page and there was a banning of a number of people at that time, including jeffrey blankfort.

        there are a lot of people that got angry about that, many remain angry. there are also a lot of people angry at the blog for a lot of reasons. i so wish there was a place on the internet where people could go and write all the things they want to say here. ie i really wish gilad atzmon had a comment section on his blog so all the people who wanted to talk endlessly in 1000 comment long threads about jewish identity would have a place to express themselves.

        people write comments such as ‘yeah, i wanted to write about this so&so guy (jewish) involved w/such &such at world trade center right before 9/11 but they wouldn’t let me’. well, MW doesn’t host discussions of 9/11 either. they tend to get long and laborious and speculative and aren’t there other sites for people who want to discuss 9/11 to go to?

        often times MW doesn’t host discussions about what MW doesn’t host discussions about. but hey, if you think there are moderators here with their own agendas, not sure what to say about that. you could write adam and send him a copy of a comment (or a series of comments)that got rejected and see if he is interested in tracking down what moderator moderated it (not being a techie i don’t know if that’s possible but it probably is) but i can’t really imagine a situation that would act in your favor.

        good luck.

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 16, 2018, 12:32 pm

        “mooser, a moderator policing the system putting…/…whole year.”

        Sorry, “Annie”. You’ve explained that several times, even searched the file when asked. I was just hoping a sort of “If the Tsar knew…” approach might be reassuring. But then I realized, ‘uh, no, probably not.’

        I’ll go back to my entrails. Just got in a chicken that’s gonna tell me all about the Mondo Mods when I clean it for dinner.

      • Keith
        Keith
        November 16, 2018, 4:06 pm

        ANNIE- “eva, yeah, back in the days we used to host comment sections about pre ww2/holocaust and sometimes they would run into the 1000 of comments.”

        I fail to see why what happened 6 years ago is relevant towards the trashing of Eva’s comments now? From her comments which passed moderation, I get the impression that she is not initiating the discussion on Polish history, but rather replying to others who are, in her view, distorting Polish history. Furthermore, from those comments which I have observed, Eva is one of the better informed and articulate commenters. Since you seem to have access to trashed comments (I don’t) you could review some of them to see if you agree that they violate some sort of guideline. You might also compare the content and quality of Eva’s comments to some of the current Zionist garbage which has passed moderation and is polluting the Mondoweiss comments section.

        ANNIE- “mooser, a moderator policing the system putting their own comments policy in place deviating from stated goals of MW and keeping it deliberately hidden? hmm. i dunno.

        I would put it even stronger. I am confident that current Mondoweiss comments policy represents the wishes of those running the website. It is almost inconceivable to me that this situation is the result of some rogue moderator. I would, of course, be happy to be proved wrong.

      • echinococcus
        echinococcus
        November 16, 2018, 6:17 pm

        Keith,

        I would put it even stronger. I am confident that current Mondoweiss comments policy represents the wishes of those running the website. It is almost inconceivable to me that this situation is the result of some rogue moderator. I would, of course, be happy to be proved wrong.

        A rogue censor wouldn’t be a valid defense of management; it’s a defense more damning than the indictment –it would mean owning up to being irresponsible.

        Also, we all know, from watching the hands rather than the statements, that there is no such thing here as a comment policy: it’s their own site, they have a right to censor whatever they want, and they censor what they don’t like to hear (i.e. most anything that disturbs liberaloid and Jewish-nationalist sensitivities.)

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 17, 2018, 12:24 pm

        “I would put it even stronger. I am confident that current Mondoweiss comments policy represents the wishes of those running the website.” “Keith”

        I hope you have some solid evidence for that, “Keith”. That is a very serious charge you are making.

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 17, 2018, 12:36 pm

        “censor…censor…censor”

        Censorship? But that is ‘inconceivable!’

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 17, 2018, 1:00 pm

        “I am well aware of the sort of comments that the moderators will not let through. I keep trying, though.” “RoHa”

        And your courage and persistence do you credit, sir. A worthy avocation, indeed.

      • gamal
        gamal
        November 17, 2018, 9:08 pm

        “I am well aware of the sort of comments that the moderators will not let through”

        every dog has his day

        When Sonallah Ibrahim had the Arab Novel Award bestowed on him by the Egyptian Ministry of Culture in 2003 people were baffled that he attended the ceremony at which he made a now legendary speech saying, inter alia

        “We no longer have any theatre, cinema, scientific research or education. Instead we have festivals and the lies of television. Corruption and robbery are everywhere but whoever speaks out is interrogated, beaten and tortured. In view of this catastrophe I must decline this award as the government bestowing it in my opinion has no credibility”

        When you get the chance seize it.

      • echinococcus
        echinococcus
        November 18, 2018, 2:40 pm

        Keith,

        [quoting]

        Yes that is a subjective test, but we have no other choice

        I was totally unaware of that ridiculous statement by Phil and Adam.
        It’s beyond arrogance and beyond irresponsible. May they enjoy their Jewish-nationalist lovefest.

      • Keith
        Keith
        November 18, 2018, 4:37 pm

        ECHINOCOCCUS- “I was totally unaware of that ridiculous statement by Phil and Adam.”

        I don’t think it is ridiculous, rather, I think it fairly accurately reflects the hostile environment Mondoweiss operates in. In capitalism, co-option is the rule, not the exception. In addition to their personal bias, Mondoweiss is subject to retaliation by extremely powerful forces along with the need to appeal to its funding base. The moderators are in a somewhat difficult position. My complaint was that in spite of this the moderators were being excessively restrictive to me personally, a subjective judgment on my part. Things seem to have improved somewhat and I am going to try to avoid discussing what I perceive to be sensitive issues. It is not that important to me and I don’t want to drag this discussion out. I would hope that these guidelines become written in the Mondoweiss comments policy so folks will know what is going on.

        ECHINOCOCCUS- “May they enjoy their Jewish-nationalist lovefest.”

        I don’t perceive any “Jewish-nationalist” lovefest. Rather, I perceive a strong commitment to Jewish kinship and all that entails.

        While I felt the need to respond to you, I am reluctant to continue discussing Mondoweiss comment policy. Hopefully, this will be my last comment on this subject.

      • echinococcus
        echinococcus
        November 18, 2018, 10:28 pm

        Keith,

        I suppose I’m closing, too. Just two points to straighten out:

        I don’t think it is ridiculous, rather, I think it fairly accurately reflects the hostile environment Mondoweiss operates in. In capitalism, co-option is the rule, not the exception.

        It “accurately” obeys to the enemy’s demands, you mean. A co-opted site can work (relatively) honestly, stating its policy and spelling out its rules, or it can be working to itself co-opt the opposition, by using undefined, subjective criteria while continuing to lure some valid resistance contributions.
        I share your “hope that these guidelines become written in the Mondoweiss comments policy so folks will know what is going on”.
        What, in your opinion, is keeping this site from doing that, when it well knows it makes all the difference between owning up to obedience and working under a false front?

        I don’t perceive any “Jewish-nationalist” lovefest. Rather, I perceive a strong commitment to Jewish kinship and all that entails.

        The two sentences describe exactly the same thing. The commitment here is not as the quaint cultural interest of the Knights of Columbus, The Daughters of Athena or the Montenegrin Mutual Help. It’s a pan-Jewish, cross-cultural mytho-nationalism that only differs from Zionism in not advocating a Jewish state.

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 19, 2018, 6:26 pm

        “it’s a pan-Jewish, cross-cultural mytho-nationalism that only differs from Zionism in not advocating a Jewish state.”

        Not in one particular place, anyway.

      • echinococcus
        echinococcus
        November 19, 2018, 11:19 pm

        Mooser,

        You mean they would have patched over the Schism if it were in Uganda or Patagonia? Creepy feeling.

  7. Eva Smagacz
    Eva Smagacz
    November 16, 2018, 7:45 am

    Annie, you said:

    “yes, we know. your silent scream out to the world reminding us every time you post you’ve been censored.”

    Annie,
    “your silent scream” – you are reacting very strongly to what I am doing, the sarcasm is unmistakable. I am not screaming. I just dislike moderators decisions. And hate free speech restrictions (which is not the same as allowing trolls to flood the blog).
    Quite a few people left Mondoweiss comment section after being repeatedly and consistently moderated. I don’t want to do that, and I learned that some areas are out of bounds since Mondoweiss became more mainstream. Can you please let me be?

    Mooser, you said:
    “Okay, maybe that is happening, but I feel very sure if Phil or Adam knew about it, they would put an immediate stop to it.”

    They know about it, and it is entirely at their remit to do or not do anything about it. They equally know that I disagree with some moderating decisions. I know that my numbers annoy you – you comment about it every time the issue its raised.

    I can only assume that Phil and Adam made a decision to cater for sensibilities of certain political subpopulation of Jews who, they were worried, would otherwise be put off by comment section. This, in my mind, stems from the desire to bring them into discussion.

    I can also surmise that Phil and Adam believe that the best way to bring peace in Palestine is to convince (some) Jewish political fractions in USA to support the oppressed against oppressor. But there is a cost – and that cost is loosing valuable (at least to me) members of commenting community, and making comments inane.

    • Mooser
      Mooser
      November 16, 2018, 1:13 pm

      “I can only assume… I can also surmise… making comments inane”

      Exactly. So why take a chance? Double down on the insistence of corruption, skulduggery and intrigue at Mondo with the facts.

      Get a frozen chicken, extract the little bag in the body cavity, defrost carefully, examine with your hepatoscope, and know

    • annie
      annie
      November 16, 2018, 2:05 pm

      defiant editors published blank pages. My numbering system is a bit like those blank pages. 171/186

      “your silent scream” – I am not screaming.

      Can you please let me be?

      I know that my numbers annoy you

      i wasn’t being sarcastic. a big black white page is a silent scream. seriously, that’s how i see it (wapo left Khashoggi’s page blank recently, same effect). you post your numbers with every single comment with a “desire to bring them into discussion”. we get it. as for “let you be”, go for it. you’ve got the floor.

      p.s. the last time i entered into one of these discussions regarding your numbers, about a year ago, i asked you about the several instances in your archives w/double numbers (two posts w/the same numbers) and you didn’t respond. i didn’t press it and don’t recall addressing it since. i don’t know how i can better facilitate letting you be but i will no longer be commenting on your repetitive complaints about being censored. and comments about “global Jewish conspiracy controlling politicians and governments” will jack your numbers, but you probably figured that out already. ciao.

      • Eva Smagacz
        Eva Smagacz
        November 18, 2018, 6:13 pm

        Annie, you said:
        [about my trashed] comments about “global Jewish conspiracy controlling politicians and governments” will jack your numbers

        Just to be clear: that sentence, as written by me, in it’s entirety, reads:

        Please remember:

        It is an anti-semitic canard/trope that there is global Jewish conspiracy controlling politicians and governments

        174/189

      • annie
        annie
        November 19, 2018, 4:32 am

        “just to be clear”, the segment i quoted was from your original (1st rejected) comment on that thread, not this revised one. nothing is “in it’s[sic] entirety” when you strip it from its context (ie the sentence, comment, origin, that precedes it). you added *2 points* to your ratio over that phrase, not 1, remember? it’s not a big deal to discuss “paying off of politicians” if you want to go there, at all (please do by all means). there’s nothing particularly “bold” about that conversation at MW (we feature it routinely). implying (“I can feel the air vibrating with accusations of anti-Semitism. Let’s see:”), and not too subtly at that, there’s a *global* jewish anything — implies jews think and act in one voice. and they don’t. that’s likely why those comments were trashed (my hunch anyway as it wasn’t me who trashed them). there’s likely not some conspiracy surrounding your trashed comments, they just didn’t cut the grade.

        good luck.

      • Keith
        Keith
        November 19, 2018, 2:35 pm

        ANNIE- ” implying (“I can feel the air vibrating with accusations of anti-Semitism. Let’s see:”), and not too subtly at that, there’s a *global* jewish anything — implies jews think and act in one voice. and they don’t.”

        No it doesn’t. It implies that Eva feels that charges of anti-Semitism fly fast and loose, as they surely did/do with Jeremy Corbyn. Also, you seem to be ignoring ideology as a core element in organizational control. Zionist ideology includes a myth history involving eternal Gentile anti-Semitism which forms the basis of how true believers interpret reality. Then there are the shared group goals and objectives achieved through group solidarity. All of these factors tend to harmonize the perceptions and actions of group members. One hardly needs to be a conspiracy theorist to perceive the real world manifestations of this. And Eva’s phraseology based upon her actual experience doesn’t strike me as remotely anti-Semitic. On the other hand, claiming that anti-Zionist Jews will get their throats cut in a parking lot by you-know-who could be construed as anti-Gentile. Anti-Zionist Jews do get death threats, but they come from Zionist Jews. Even the woman head of JVP for gosh sakes. And, although Jews (or any other group) don’t speak/act in one voice, Jews in general, and Zionist Jews in particular, seem to share certain common perceptions which influence their behavior, the notion of eternal anti-Semitism a common belief.

        “I believe we should be frank: The world hates the Jews. The world has always and will continue to do so.” (David Mamet) https://www.jewishbookcouncil.org/book/the-wicked-son-anti-semitism-self-hatred-and-the-jews

      • annie
        annie
        November 19, 2018, 8:33 pm

        hi keith, i addressed why i thought the comment was trashed with the added advice (or warning depending if she wants her ratio improved): ““global Jewish conspiracy controlling politicians and governments” will jack your numbers”.

        the publication of that throat slitting comment was gross. i’d ban jack or whoever said it if i have my druthers. plus, i called it out at the time.

        here’s what i don’t understand. if you don’t think, or eva doesn’t think, you can have a “bold” conversation about accusations of anti semitism in the comment section, why did your comment just get published.

        in an article about the scoreboard how senators and congresspeople rate on Israel compiled by If Americans Knew, there was no discussion of anti semitism going on. it’s certainly easy enough, in an article about all the money being shoveled at congress members and all the legislature they pass to bring up the topic, as is done here. (i’ve written more than an article or two on the topic myself) it’s also easy enough to accuse politicians of being “in the pockets of AIPAC ” as another poster mentioned in that very thread.

        so, in this context, what would be the purpose of reminding readers it’s anti semitic to mention a *global jewish conspiracy* controls politicians and governments? who here needs reminding of that? you perhaps? me? kay, echi, mooser, just, bumblebye?

        Also, you seem to be ignoring ideology as a core element in organizational control.

        should i thank you for reminding me? or maybe you’re just wrong. i don’t forget. do i really need a lesson from anyone regarding accusations lobbed at jeremy corbyn? read “‘Constructed crisis for political ends’: anti-Semitism claims are prime weapon for UK Israel lobby,” https://mondoweiss.net/2017/01/accusations-semitism-primary/ (i wrote it)

        i surmised, under the circumstances and after the fact (i didn’t see the comment until i went searching for it), that reminding readers that it’s anti semitic to mention a global jewish conspiracy controlling politicians and governments (twice) , and then expressing a “bolder” discussion on that topic should be allowed, was a suggestion that If Americans Knew’s scoreboard implied there was a global jewish conspiracy controlling politicians and governments. i could be wrong, but i doubt it.

        speaking of anti semitism, i was reading an article at the forward this morning — another one about linda sarsour (lots of people are obsessed w/her) and the author made the argument that since 90% of american jews agreed w/the ADL when you criticize the ADL you are essentially criticizing american jews. !!!! and therefore… lol.

        we could spend every comment section discussing trashed comments and what a colossal waste of time that would be. or not. i’m sure everyone has a story. generally tho, in skimming through them, they are mostly inane.

      • echinococcus
        echinococcus
        November 19, 2018, 10:49 pm

        Annie,

        Well yes, when one supports the principle of censorship (which seems to be very fashionable and ‘progressive’, of late), as different from simply spam protection, then all those convoluted discussions on invoking or reminding about worldwide Armenian conspiracies, or the sex of angels, etc. might make any sense.

        For people who respect free speech, it’s all repressive, stinking shit.
        The more one tries to defend any flavor of it, the more it sticks and stinks.

      • Mooser
        Mooser
        November 20, 2018, 1:04 pm

        “Well yes, when one supports the principle of censorship…”

        Calling it “censorship” is a little bit ridiculous. It’s a website making choices about what will appear on it. A choice you would certainly want on your own website, I would think.

      • Keith
        Keith
        November 21, 2018, 12:18 am

        MOOSER- ” It’s a website making choices about what will appear on it.”

        Bingo! And the choices it makes has implications and ramifications.

    • MHughes976
      MHughes976
      November 18, 2018, 3:49 pm

      I speak as one who very much values your Polish-related point of view, Eva, just as I value Antidote’s German-related position. But I think that we must understand that Mondoweiss is surrounded by dangerous enemies – the last time I said that Mooser reminded me that there are also dangerous friends – and that their dearest wish is to be able to present us as just another expression of anti-Semitism when we are in reality and essence anti-racists. That is what makes moderation essential and why moderation has to stand in the way not only of what is bad but might look bad. In all the circumstances it is necessary to err on the side of caution – I know that that is a cliche but cliches are sometimes apt.

  8. lysias
    lysias
    November 18, 2018, 10:22 am

    Hitler, in urging his generals to behave ruthlessly in the invasion of Poland that was about to take place, told them that nobody remembered the genocide of the Armenians.

  9. edthespark
    edthespark
    November 19, 2018, 4:12 am

    I think that Israel and B.Netanyahu along with D.Trump and V.Putin have come to the time of reaching a final settlement to finding an end to the i/p conflict.There is always the possibility of treachery but if a fair deal is agreed then none need suffer the consequences of God’s wrath.It is that simple.No amount of weapons will save those nations.Let Prime minister netanyahu stay the course.Let the cards be dealt.

  10. Eva Smagacz
    Eva Smagacz
    November 19, 2018, 2:14 pm

    Unrelated, but very welcome news:
    In Guardian:

    Airbnb to take rentals in Israeli West Bank settlements off website

    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/nov/19/airbnb-removes-rentals-in-israeli-west-bank-settlements

    175/190

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